@@zReNAgAdE504 umm kyrie is one of the great offensive threats in nba history and the greatest ball handler ever you trippin? or you jus mad dumb folk?
Don’t make excuses for Labron, He stacking the deck and taking credit for it. Don’t tell me he could not get a ring the first time he was in Cleveland , You got to work very hard and grind hard like Kobe and MJ did to me that’s a true champ.
They riding hard for their paycheck , they always said to greats jumping teams “they are chasing rings , doesn’t count … Lebron Does it “he’s a genius “
Man, shut up. Things that countless other greats have done, y’all praise. As soon as LeBron does anything relatively similar to them, y’all criticize him. All LeBron Haters are hypocritical, delusional cherry-pickers that need to grow up and maybe go back to school.
@@saadk8905 right... And when random lesser teams win like this year or like the raptors and pistons won or the mavericks .. you know the one and done teams that only won due to injury to super teams.. it's irritating becuse it's just luck!
What people usually don't factor into the superteam conversation is WHEN the superstar players came together. People's argument against Jordan is that he had Pippen. The argument against Kareem is that he had Magic. They forget that Pippen wasn't superstar when he joined the Bulls. Magic wasn't a superstar when he joined the Lakers. Teams were stacked back then but most often the superstars on the team met at different stages in their careers. Some were superstars, some were on their way to being superstars, some were about to retire. LeBron actively picks superstars in their prime. I heard an argument which stated LeBron develops his teammates and that should count towards his leadership. What people need to understand is that it's easy to pair up with great players. It's easy to say "I want to play with KD", and play with him. It's easy to develop people who've already shown their potential. The moves LeBron makes are easy to replicate. Literally any player can decide to pair up with another player. And that's why it would go against him. Do you want to know what's hard? Winning with people you came up with. Building back up after every loss and going hard the next season. Defeating the teams that tormented you for years. Going to the finals six times and winning all six. Winning the title three years in a row. Twice. These moves are tremendously difficult to replicate. That's what makes a player great. Not looking around the court and choosing already made players.
Amen. But bron fans will never understand that. Also bron proclaiming himself goat. Jordan said he's not goat, bird and magic are the ones who crowned him goats
You know what’s really hard losing over and over again and dealing with incompetent management and just continuously losing every year. That’s where Dame is right now giving his all every year just to know his team isn’t good enough to win. Y’all love this loyalty nonsense in sports. Jordan had a great gm that consistently added more and more talent every year he was there. He had management that put him with the right coaches and supporting cast to contend for championships. Y’all just don’t like the idea that a player who is surrounded by incompetence for years said enough is enough and went and formed a team that could contend. Not every player will just be put into the greatest situation with the best GMs and management that wants to win.
You can debate that, I love Hakeem he's my 2nd favorite player of all time. But Jordan was elite of elite on both ends of the Court. Jordan had a complete game in a way I have yet to see duplicated. He was an efficient shooter from the outside, he was a dominant finisher around the basket, he was an excellent passer (go check his highlights), he and excellent perimeter defender (steals) could contribute blocks down low. He was fundamentally sound (footwork etc like a Duncan ) yet spectacular to watch (other players wanted to play like him because his game was appealing to watch). All the while being the unquestioned leader of his team. He dominated both the east and west interms of wins but also in terms of how he was regarded.
@@bussheadboss1681 I respect your opinion but I have to disagree. Jordan and Pippen rank third and seventh all time in steals while Hakeem is tenth as a center. Olajuwon is ranked number one in blocks which means not only did he also allotted his team additional possession with steal but He also protected the basket, so overall he was more dominate as a defender for his team than both Jordan and Pippen.
@@dnice4145 I agree with your sentiments but Olajuwon was dominated on both ends of the court as well. He footwork was superior to Jordan and he was fundamentally sound as well. He was center that could defend guards, remember the block on John Stack in the 94 finals. Olajuwon had no weaknesses. Remember Hakeem was doing the turn around jump shot before Jordan. They both were superior ball players but Hakeem had a great impact on a defensively than Jordan and the stats support it.
This entire concept of "super teams" is stupid. Past players wasted their careers waiting on incompetent management to build a team around them. Lebron realised after 7yrs that Cavs management were useless and forced the issue. Why should a star player suffer and have their reputation and legacy tarnished because of poor management?
Exactly. LeBron put 7 years in with the Cavaliers his first go-around and never recruited anyone or tried to team up with anyone and then watched the Celtics load up with 4 future hall-of-famers while David Griffin couldn't do any better than 400 lb Shaq and over-the-hill Antawn Jamison. So he did what he had to do. More power to him.
@@cruztheworld8326 I'm old enough to remember Lebron NOT actively recruiting fellow Ohio native Michael Redd. Dude was actually being criticised for NOT helping the Cavs recruit. Now it's "LeGM' jokes, forgetting he was actually proven right about not wanting to play with Andrew Wiggins, and winning rings with players he asked for.
So because you don't like the players your team have you, go create a tv show and super team? Why not just create a good team? It was completely unnecessary and uncalled for. How can you hate kd what he did but love what lbj? Makes no since
Ring chased? He left the cavs because they didn’t give him what he needed to win the nba finals. So he joined the heat. Why would he join another terrible team? Stat padded… stat padding is when you inflate your stats and don’t care about winning. Lebron went to the finals 8 times in a row so I dont think bro cares about his stats.
We're really talking about Player Development. LBJ tends to skip over younger Players who still need Development i.e. Kuzma, Andrew Wiggins, etc. He skips that essential part of the grind to pick Veterans who have already proven themselves. So when you compare LBJ to Jordan, it doesn't work. Jordan had to lean on Players including Pippen through the Development process, which means you're not going to the Finals in the first or second year. However, once the Players are Developed, there's no need to jump from team to team. The foundation is set, which turned into a 3-peat for Jordan. After all of LBJ's recruiting efforts, 10 Finals appearances, 18 years in the League, he has not 3-peated once and was lucky to get a Back-to-Back. Someone needed to tell him to stop trying to skip the Player Development process on his teams.
Jordan literally lost every year until teams got old and they put the requisite pieces around him in order to win. He didn’t have to face a Boston team with 4 hofers. He didn’t have to go up against the pre kd Warriors without his second and third option. He didn’t have to face the SA Spurs with multiple hofers and young studs in Danny green and kawhi Leonard. He didn’t have to go up against the juggernaut kd warriors. The kawhi and pg clippers who everyone thought was title bound. The Brooklyn Nets with kd kyrie and harden. Teams are built different nowadays and in order to compete at the highest level you need a great supporting cast around you. 2 or 3 all star level players are needed to win
MJ Bulls played weak teams in the playoffs and in the finals... Name 1 team MJ played in the playoffs or finals that had more than 2 superstars... We all know when the Bucks,Boston, Pistons were in their prime MJ took those L
MJ played on a Superteams. The second 3-peat team had 4 Hall of Famers. The Bulls were a Superteam. The Pistons were a Superteam. The Lakers were a Superteam. The Celtics were a Superteam. Superteams are framed as a negative when people attempt to frame them against a historical context, "MJ did it all himself!". In reality, no matter the Era, Superteams have ALWAYS been apart of the NBA. Bill Russell won 11 out of the first 13 championships. are con
Rick Bucher, thank you! What were the expectations when Stephen Curry was drafted? Klay Thompson? You can’t call it a superteam if they were drafted and homegrown. Or start counting hof’s after the fact. They were named to the hall of fame after winning a championship, not the day they were drafted
I feel like Lebron always wanted to stay in Cleveland but once he saw how the Boston big 3 was formed he knew if Cleveland didn’t get him another valuable player they weren’t gonna succeed. Cavs failed him year after year, you can’t expect your franchise players to stick around if you aren’t putting a real roster around them
I don’t think people would knock Lebron for leaving Cleveland. We all know he did what he could. But he went IF teaming up with Wade AND Bosh…and so in after that
@@alxfonso4924 let’s not forget Kobe asked for a trade when the Lakers were struggling those years Shaq left. Lakers went out and made roster changes so that they can compete. If you going bring Kobe make sure you bring up everything else
@@newagestudios408 dont forget the last 2-3years in cleveland they could have got a big free agent but lebron wouldnt tell those players he was staying or not.
I think MJ is the GOAT but to be fair to LBJ lost 2 titles as a superteam (in Miami). You can't say he lost 3 or 4 titles as a superteam in Cleveland because one year Kyrie and Kevin Love got hurt and the 4th one it was only him and Kevin Love (2018)
Not 10 straight. And not 2 all-stars. 2007, Lebron was alone. 2015, no KLove after the 1st round. 2018, Kyrie played in Boston. 2020, AD was the only other all-star. Get your facts straight. Don't read the headlines. Read the articles.
@@sibutotheworld my mistake 8 straight finals. and i said in the east so dont know why mentioning AD, even when kryie was in boston he still had wade, rose, love and IT until the trade. my point is the east was weak and he had more talent than all the other teams in the east to make it to the finals. even with a hurt love one year and no kryie another year he still had it easy in the east.
@@TRILLTALKTV So now you're changing the narrative. You initially said "with 2 all-stars" when in fact there was just one. 2018 Cavs, Wade was an old man, Rose was contemplating retirement, he took a leave from the game for some time, and don't even start talking about IT. KLove was also no longer an all-star. And how can you say it was "easy to win a chip" when they were not even favored in the finals? Did you know that of the 10 finals, Lebron's teams were only favored 3 times (including the Lakers' one). 7 times, Lebron's teams were the underdogs. And to win 4 times when up against much superior opponents was actually a great achievement.
@@sibutotheworld you are changing my point. I'm talking about making it to the finals in the east the 8 straight times. 7 of those 8 times he had 2 all-stars. The last one with Love did make the all-star team as the lone all-star on his team. And he struggled making to the finals. If you have lack on competition because you have a stacked team in your conference once you are in the finals you have a 50/50 chance of winning is what I'm saying in "easy to win a chip"
@@TRILLTALKTV In 2018, the Cavs had this starting lineup: James, Love, JR Smith, G Hill, T Thompson and you call that "stacked"? They were 4th in the East. They swept the #1 Toronto Raptors in the 2nd round and fought the 2nd-ranked Boston to a 7-game thriller. The Celtics had 4 players averaging in double figures in pts led by Brown and Taytum and all-star Al Horford. It was not a "struggle" as you have said, the Cavs simply are not supposed to win. Kevin Love did not even play in game 7 due to a concussion. And Lebron's 2nd best player was Jeff Green. And you call that "stacked"? Ows c'mon. Get your facts straight!
@@Goldenboy48 It’s not I asked a simple question. I purposely didn’t mention superstars because whether or not you have two superstars or three or one, a great team will always win, the BETTER will almost always win. No player has won without a great team, people just like to use the superstar argument to discredit Lebron.
Youre never going to make me believe that 3 HoFers in their prime along with all of them being top 10 defensive players in NBA history, isnt a Superteam.
@@ivanirizarry9421 bottom line tell lebron to set it down cause jordan crashed alot nba greats careers and still to this day mike name come up as much as any body elses....lebron should bw worried about steff!!!
@@ivanirizarry9421 that's a lie the 73-9 team wasn't champions ..they went n got KD when LeBron beat them ...so let's stop that lie the 73-9 team was not champions
So what was the excuse for 2009 when he had to play against Dwight Howard and the Orlando Magic? Did he had to go through the B3 Celtics there? You can go ahead and miss me with that right there.
@@zacheryseymour7297 ain't no excuse,he couldn't get IT done,his legacy will be his legacy.He ain't done yet accumulating accolades and numbers.I never knocked his HUSTLE,he'll finish ranked wherever in the top 10 all time FOREVER,that's BIG however you look at him!
Not debating that he’s not a top 10 player and it sounded like an excuse when you said, “he had to go through the Big3 Celtics”, so sorry for misinterpreting what you said. Also not saying that the Magic wasn’t a good team but Lebron did win the MVP and that Magic wasn’t better than Lebron Cavs team. Also you can’t blame it on the lack help either because Lebron had a very good supporting cast.
@@zacheryseymour7297 lebron choking against the magic was one of the better things that happened to his career. I was SO hyped to see kobe v lebron. Puppet commercials and all That kobe led lakers team would've demolished that cavs team in 5
@@suntansuperman26 I hate when y’all say that because you guys don’t even hold Jordan to the “GOAT Criteria.” You all created a special one for LeBron and always modify the qualifications whenever he achieves something. I’m NEVER accepting rules and guidelines from a Jordan stan because it always sets players up to fail and places the bar high enough to where it gives MJ an eternal advantage. In any world where Jordan fans aren’t some fake gatekeepers in the NBA Community, LeBron passes him with flying colors after his 3rd championship.
Winning on a team full of hall of famers and all stars is not as impressive as doing it with less help. Of course playing on super teams should be held against Lebron.
so durant joining the warriors isn’t a knock on his career? same with lebron.. in 50 years they’ll talk about lebrons super teams the same way people hold it against bill russell for playing with all the best players in the league .. that’s why most people have wilt over russell
Not the same thing. Lebron wade Bosh never met in the playoffs let alone the ECF so even joining a team that he blew a 3-1 lead to is off the table. Not to mention they all are friends and was talking about playing together for *years.. why are u acting like if lebron would've joined celtics in 2011 you wouldn't have "crucified" him
No most people have wilt over Russell because Wilt was over there dropping 50ppg and 25rbg in a season. Russell wasn't statistically dominant. However, that is not the issue with LBJ. LeBron will arguably go down as number 1 in points top 5 in assists and top 10 in rebounds.
His chips aren't equal to superstars of old with the exception of his 3-1 comeback chip. That one I hold in high regard. But the others are pretty wack, stacked the deck every time. Still no 3 peat
@@manz7860 Homie get out of your delusional world. MJ played against 9 HOFers throughout his finals and LeBron James played against 29 HOFers. MJ didn't even see shadows of the teams that exist in todays NBA. Thats the reality of the situation. MJ is old news. LeBron James is the greatest basketball player to have played this game. RIP.
@@adityasrinivasan7784 by that NARRATIVE, lebron doesn't even come near kobe bryant. Who's probably gone against the most 50win teams in playoff history Tim duncan deserves a mention as well. He went through the 00s western conference grind as well. The only knock I have on him is they never defended a championship
5:30 Marcellus really counted never All-Star Toni Kukoc and 43 year old Robert Parish as 2 of the 5 Bulls HOFers and one time All-Stars Horace Grant and BJ Armstrong as 2 of the 4 Bulls All-Stars even though Grant and Armstrong never made the All-Star team during any of the title years and Rodman never was an All-Star as a Bull...
Uhh Kevin Garrett won dpoy in Boston. Ray Allen was still literally the best shooter in the nba without question rajon rondo was literally in his prime. And Paul was still averaging 22+ a night
Marcellus shows you that he has no business speaking basketball. Every team playing for the title was not a superteam. He just has to protect his man crush Lebron.
@@jmar5127 do really think that if Jordan left the bulls and joined the Pistons after they beat him in 90 wouldn't be different than him staying in Chicago? What if a young MJ and Karl Malone decided to leave their respective teams and join Hakeems Rockets? There is a difference pretending that there isn't is won't change that.
@@jmar5127 not true homie, the 94/95 Rockets wasn't a superteam, Spurs not Superteam, Warriors not Superteam except KD year. I agree that the Bulls without Jordan wasn't that good of a team either. Bron should've never left D Wade and the Heat
The fact that MJ played in an expansion league is never talked about, and how he didn’t beat Bird and Magic till they were out of their prime. They ignore that MJ himself had a superteam and went golfing with guys like Charles Barkley before games yet is claimed to have a “killers mentality” his shooting percentages dropped in the playoffs as well
@@ronpalacios15 Put his career in context, 10 finals appearances and only had the better team in 4 of those finals. Who did he lose to in the finals? Superteams besides the one year against the mavs. I used to be a manipulated Mj stan just like you until i educated myself
How much older where they to him. I believe more than 5 so when mj was entering his prime they were coming out of it also the bulls team compared to those 2 are trash.
of course it's a knock on his legacy. he moved and created super teams to chase titles. he didn't need to do it. that's an insane argument. the warriors didn't do it. the bucks didn't do it. lebron is the GROAT. greatest recruiter of all time. he is not the GOAT. he has a long great career. he has longevity. he's never been dominant. he has never been great on defense (takes plays off all the time). he has great total numbers bc he's played forever. he's done less than MJ with less time.
Exactly the haters say, “oh, Russ has no 3 point shooting the spacing will be terrible. Carmelo is old af he won’t be useful. The team is too old.” But then they say, “lmao Lebum cant do anything without stacking his team.” Like I’m so confused
If LeBron is so complete, why does he needs sooo much help EVERY year on EVERY team?!?!?! LeBron played with most All-star help in NBA history 🤣🤣🤣🤣. It was also trades tooo. He only goes to team that have young talent to trade to get premier All-stars 🤣🤣🤣🤣 That’s weak 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@eaglesfan1999 name a gm that ever said nah we got enough to win!! We don’t need another superstar even though we can afford it?😂😂😂😂. The sad part is LeGoat is so rent free in y’all brainwashed heads that y’all don’t realize how dumb y’all sound 😂😂😂. Why didn’t Jordan want to develop Kwame?😂😂.
Julius Randle, Brook Lopez, D'Angelo Russell, Kyle, Josh Hart, Ball, Caldwell, Harrell, all of them gone in order to ensure Lebron's legacy. You know, listening to his description of what Lebron did to four different teams kind of reminds me of The Harvesters alien race from Independence Day. "They are like locusts, they go to a planet, consume every natural resource and then move on."
Lmao I promise you they didn’t do it to ensure his legacy. Any team would trade all those guys for bron and AD. They were never gon win a chip w those cats
This might be the first time I agree with Rick. People try to say the warriors have 4 HOFs but I don't think Draymond Green would be a hall of Fame player or all star without the championships. I don't think Ginobli would be an all star without all the winning he did with the Spurs. Same with some of those 04 Pistons. They played great together but other than Sheed with Portland, none of them were great individually. To me a super team is literally just 3 franchise caliber players (when they played together) coming together. Wade, Bosh, LeBron. Kyrie, LeBron, K Love. Westbrook, AD, LeBron. KG, Pierce, Ray Allen. All those guys were franchise players just before coming together so they were already great individually
People don't think about how he mostly takes stars from his own conference. So he's diluting the competition and being praised for beating the teams that were depleted
Agree with Acho. Superteams are the result of trade and free agency. Drafting and developing young talent is totally different (Steph, Draymond& Klay).
@Lee Scott Wanting to win is obvious, that's not the issue. The discussion is how we judge building a team. Homegrown talent seems to get more respect than a team with multple free agent superstars & trades.
Wiley is right, everyone in the all time top 10 played on a super team or the most stacked team in the league when they won their championships. I'm no Lebron fan but he did what he needed to do to secure his legacy.
Lies. Most of those players grew into who they were as their careers went on. We gotta stop this narrative. MJ never played on a super team!!!!! Pippen averaged 7 points his rookie season then 14 the next. Kareem was traded but Worthy and Magic were drafted. Not anyone's fault they turned out to b great. Lebron literally rips teams apart to build them up to his liking then leaves and leaves the teams to rebuild and pick up the pieces.
@@blackdynamite5016 so how many points did Pippen average wen the Bulls started winning? And that the point. If players on a team consistently produce and play at a high level game after game year after year he is considered great , so by extinction if three or more of them is on the same team its a super team.
@@justcall10 IT WAS JUST HIM AND PIPPEN!!!!!!!!!! Why are we changing the narrative on what a super team is?! It was a great team that had a bulldog in Jordan for a leader!!!!! Period! Super teams in my definition are teams put together through trades with players who are already all stars!!!!!!! What is everyone talking about?! Just because Wiley said it don't make it true.
@@Mercil7 The Bulls were a lottery team when they drafted Jordan 3rd. Pippen was a nobody at first and Rodman was the bruiser and rebounder. Jordan DID NOT play on a super team. I don't care if everyone all of a sudden changes the narrative. Jordan went to war with whoever he had. Please look up Jordans team rosters cause jesus christ🤦🏿♂️
We all know regular season don’t matter, playoffs and the chip does. People throwing way too much weight behind regular season record is exactly what happened to Giannis, kept winning ok the regular season but lost in playoffs. It’s really low IQ to keep saying “but but but 73-9”
2016 Warriors weren't a super team. Nobody had them making the finals that year even though they had just won a championship. Retroactively changing the narrative doesn't count.
@@cp3190 they played like the utah jazz 2021, and bucks 2019 2020, great regular season teams that put up great regular season record, but that doesn't mean they are championship caliber teams. this 73-9 super team narrative needs to die
Players typically don't leave teams with competent management. Duncan didn't have to leave the Spurs, MJ left once management started acting dumb, Kobe wanted a trade once Shaq left and management made dumb moves. Giannis didn't ask to leave cuz management made moves year in and year out to better the team. Dame has stayed loyal all this while and is only now started to get restless because management can't put a good team around him. Player loyalty wouldn't be an issue if management did their jobs.
What is a super team? What is a Big 3? What is a dynamic duo? What if you form a Big 3 to beat another big 3? And should forming the later be the same as joining a dynasty that just beat you last season?
These players today are driven by what the media thinks. I stopped watching the NBA, I am not impressed when you go to the team after team, he still lost at each stop! Dallas and San Antonio bodied him along with Phoenix this year.
@The Progressive Brit You do know injuries are part of sports right? I don't like the team jumping, he's a good basketball player for sure, but I noticed in the past when he feels they will lose, he quits.
There are no “super teams”. There’s just teams. Some have a lot of talent but that doesn’t guarantee anything. Most of the time it’s about opportunity anyway. Lots of these guys can play. IT was a bench guy until he got in the right spot. TMac thought he was making a super team going to Orlando. The games aren’t played on paper.
Yea but in lebron case he formed stacked teams in a weak conference. Which is more of the nba understanding that they can’t advertise that the nba finals are being played in the west. And when talking about all time greats that should matter
@@kevben706 Lol. The lakers are not waiting on young talent to grow. Lakers are about winning. Those guys are not that good. Ball Ingram and Hart Russell randle
Thank you bro! At least someone is thinking critically. And the team is 100% built around him so once he leaves it will take them time to play together.
So it’s his fault that his greatness demanded that a team went all in, in order to win? That’s what all organizations should do when they have a player of that caliber, the Bucks gave Giannis what Cleveland never gave LeBron on his first stint there, the Bulls did the same with MJ, the Lakers did the same with Kobe. If you wanna be a successful organization you have to recognize when to go all in, they got their championships and success because they invested in him. I’m not gonna pound on him or any player because the organization did what they should’ve done.
LeBron took the "Worst Finals Team Ever" to the Finals in 07. In 08 The Big 3 Celtics were formed and LeBron didn't make The Finals again until he created his own Big 3
It’s not that Lebron is doing “managerial duties”. If you were to tell Kanye just to produce and not rap or design his own shoes an clothes what you think he would say. Super team is simply players taking less to be on a team knowing they value more. Even if they were drafted by said team
Bulls in the 90s 5 HOFs??? MJ, Pippen, & Rodman HOF. All stars, bj, & Horace made it year MJ retired & was only on 3 teams, Rodman was an All star maybe 7 years before he played on the bulls. & scottie never would’ve been a HOF if bulls didn’t win chips. Bring some context to it. Especially 1st 3peat bulls who were similar to 11 mavs, maybe not even that. 2nd 3peat was a better team but not a super team
Super Teams as some calls it is Not that Easily formed....First...a Great player has to want to play alongside another Great player or players...some even take Less money to do so....2...In Real Estate the saying is...Location....Location..that why you see the Super Teams in larger markets....You're Not going to get a Great FA to go to a small market unless he's traded there...That's why Giannis was making all that Noise about Super Teams because he Knows No Great FA is coming to Milwaukee unless it's a trade...
They're not a knock on anybody's legacy. What superteams do is make you have to evaluate them slightly differently than players who ain't on stacked teams where we have to examine both results and player contribution instead of just results (Michael Jordan) or just player contribution (Chris Paul)
The only difference between now & then is that in the old days GMs did there job. In today’s NBA players have taken their careers into their own hands. So everybody’s mad because he out smarted everyone including the owners & GMs. Look at this way. Players have taken less money to play with him. 🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️
Wiley hit it on the head. If the organization's front office is competent, you are not dinged for being on a super team. But if management has a 40 year history of incompetence, and you, as a player are better at constructing a team than the people whose job it is to do so, then you are dinged for creating a super team. It doesn't make sense.
The more these presstitutes do puff pieces for LBJ, the more unauthentic he looks. One of many diff's between him and MJ - MJ's legacy was authentic and organic. He Became.
@@kevinjackson9573 I mean Jordan did help his teammates become better players. He wasn’t gifted established all star players. I think that’s the knock on LeBron.
The okc reference is bad because they did have a super team but for some reason they traded James harden 😂😂 remember they went to the finals with him coming off the bench smh
@S S but still as an organization you’re drafting guys you think will become stars, you’re taking a risk there just like you’re taking a risk trading for someone who could possibly do bad with other stats or in your system. You don’t draft guys you think are gonna be horrible
Remember when the nba was about competing. Lebron every year tries to make it as least competitive for his team as possible. It's definitely a knock on his legacy. And he's still loses more times than not lol. Yall tryna crown him GOAT for 2nd place 😂 even steph curry stole his shine that's how weak lebrons hold on the nba was.
What make made that franchise what it is what super team did the bulls ever have the most gifted player to with mike was scottie,kukoc and Rodman and harper maybe at that time in his career....ker wasnt the best three point shooter at all dont even think he adveraged over 20...bj neither...harvey and horas were regular big men who had to go up against legend big men what are talking about.....mike led the league in basacially everything his whole time on the bulls.
0 points in game 7 of the 2013 NBA Finals Bosh and averaged under 10 pts in the 2016 finals Kevin Love are "superteams" now? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 LeBron lives rent free in a million haters heads
If LeBron was playing in 1990's, he would had recruited Charles Barkley, Hakeem Olajuwon, David Robinson, Clyde Drexler, Karl Malone, John Stockton, Reggie Miller, Chriss Mullin, Tim Hardaway, Alonzo Mourning, Shaquille O'Neal, and Tim Duncan as the 12th man. ... LeBron would still be trying to chase ghost of MJ da GOAT ... Nick Wrong, Shannon and Kendrick would still be justifying LeFlop
If Lebron played in the 90s, he wouldn't even be popular. He flops and cries in even today's games. Imagine how he would have given up in the hand-check era. None of those guys would've joined an average player like Lebron - he just wouldn't have the pull.
@The Progressive Brit He has a giant body, but a tiny mind. Haven't you seen him cry and flop at the slightest touch? One match with bad boy Pistons and he would take retirement from the game forever and open a candy shop in Akon. Be real, bruh. LeBron would be a nobody in the 90s
First time I agree with Wiley. People have been tricked into doing the same thing with politics. The people at the top crushing you convinced you that it’s the guy in front of you that’s the problem so you punch sideways instead of up. When they’re also being crushed.
Listen to the People’s Sports Podcast featuring Mark Titus & Charlotte Wilder! foxs.pt/peoplessports
what about kyrie an kevin love makes a team super??
@@zReNAgAdE504 umm kyrie is one of the great offensive threats in nba history and the greatest ball handler ever you trippin? or you jus mad dumb folk?
Don’t make excuses for Labron, He stacking the deck and taking credit for it. Don’t tell me he could not get a ring the first time he was in Cleveland , You got to work very hard and grind hard like Kobe and MJ did to me that’s a true champ.
@@60scrip87 he was gettin first roun picks befoe LeTrain an da baby clovers did bettah befoe an aftuh him guy
@@60scrip87 kyrie an klo wit no LeTrain dont make da 2nd roun
If I had Cleveland's management for the 7 years I would become my own gm too
😂😂😂
Biiiiiiiiiiiiiigggggg facts.
They riding hard for their paycheck , they always said to greats jumping teams “they are chasing rings , doesn’t count … Lebron Does it “he’s a genius “
Exactly
Lol they literally be killing him for having help.
The media is filled with Bronsexuals posturing as “analysts”
Never heard that about shaq ever. Y'all keep spreading lies
Man, shut up. Things that countless other greats have done, y’all praise. As soon as LeBron does anything relatively similar to them, y’all criticize him. All LeBron Haters are hypocritical, delusional cherry-pickers that need to grow up and maybe go back to school.
I think acho says a lot about everything without saying anything which makes him sound smart about anything but not everything
You are allowed to think that
When someone doesn't agree with your logic or when your IQ can't understand what someone is saying, this is what you say. Lmao 🤣🤣🤣🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️
We live in a lazy society that just likes to read the headlines and not the article. # FACTS 🤔🤷🏾♂️
Indeed.
And who makes this headlines? The media. 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️ Dude was just shooting himself/themselves in the leg(s).
@@ITISKONY the point was seeing the bigger picture of it all
A super teams is a team once assembled is expected to win a chip hands down
Which lebron and co. Did
@@saadk8905 and along with several others in the present and in history
@@moneygonecrazy101 brooklyn did not. 73-9 golden state did not. Clippers failed.
@@saadk8905 right... And when random lesser teams win like this year or like the raptors and pistons won or the mavericks .. you know the one and done teams that only won due to injury to super teams.. it's irritating becuse it's just luck!
@@richardalfaro4933 you might wanna check the Pistons of the early 2000s and their accomplishments 🙄
What people usually don't factor into the superteam conversation is WHEN the superstar players came together.
People's argument against Jordan is that he had Pippen. The argument against Kareem is that he had Magic.
They forget that Pippen wasn't superstar when he joined the Bulls. Magic wasn't a superstar when he joined the Lakers.
Teams were stacked back then but most often the superstars on the team met at different stages in their careers. Some were superstars, some were on their way to being superstars, some were about to retire.
LeBron actively picks superstars in their prime. I heard an argument which stated LeBron develops his teammates and that should count towards his leadership.
What people need to understand is that it's easy to pair up with great players. It's easy to say "I want to play with KD", and play with him. It's easy to develop people who've already shown their potential. The moves LeBron makes are easy to replicate. Literally any player can decide to pair up with another player. And that's why it would go against him.
Do you want to know what's hard?
Winning with people you came up with. Building back up after every loss and going hard the next season.
Defeating the teams that tormented you for years.
Going to the finals six times and winning all six.
Winning the title three years in a row. Twice.
These moves are tremendously difficult to replicate.
That's what makes a player great. Not looking around the court and choosing already made players.
You actually get it
@Corporal Feel no way I'll give you that. But who could have known he'll drop 40 points in a finals?? No one.
exactly, i don't understand why it's so hard for people to understand that.
Amen. But bron fans will never understand that. Also bron proclaiming himself goat. Jordan said he's not goat, bird and magic are the ones who crowned him goats
You know what’s really hard losing over and over again and dealing with incompetent management and just continuously losing every year. That’s where Dame is right now giving his all every year just to know his team isn’t good enough to win. Y’all love this loyalty nonsense in sports. Jordan had a great gm that consistently added more and more talent every year he was there. He had management that put him with the right coaches and supporting cast to contend for championships. Y’all just don’t like the idea that a player who is surrounded by incompetence for years said enough is enough and went and formed a team that could contend. Not every player will just be put into the greatest situation with the best GMs and management that wants to win.
Rick Bucher, I have to disagree with you Hakeem Olajuwon was the best defensive player during Jordan’s era.
Hands down and I love mj... honestly he had 2 ppl on his 2nd 3peat team who could have a good argument as well especially pip
Jordan and pippen was the best defender during thier era
You can debate that, I love Hakeem he's my 2nd favorite player of all time. But Jordan was elite of elite on both ends of the Court. Jordan had a complete game in a way I have yet to see duplicated. He was an efficient shooter from the outside, he was a dominant finisher around the basket, he was an excellent passer (go check his highlights), he and excellent perimeter defender (steals) could contribute blocks down low. He was fundamentally sound (footwork etc like a Duncan ) yet spectacular to watch (other players wanted to play like him because his game was appealing to watch). All the while being the unquestioned leader of his team. He dominated both the east and west interms of wins but also in terms of how he was regarded.
@@bussheadboss1681 I respect your opinion but I have to disagree. Jordan and Pippen rank third and seventh all time in steals while Hakeem is tenth as a center. Olajuwon is ranked number one in blocks which means not only did he also allotted his team additional possession with steal but He also protected the basket, so overall he was more dominate as a defender for his team than both Jordan and Pippen.
@@dnice4145 I agree with your sentiments but Olajuwon was dominated on both ends of the court as well. He footwork was superior to Jordan and he was fundamentally sound as well. He was center that could defend guards, remember the block on John Stack in the 94 finals. Olajuwon had no weaknesses. Remember Hakeem was doing the turn around jump shot before Jordan. They both were superior ball players but Hakeem had a great impact on a defensively than Jordan and the stats support it.
Super teams are those that bring in perennial all-stars or an MVP caliber player(s) to a team that already possesses MVP type player(s)
I like this definition too I’ve always said this
This entire concept of "super teams" is stupid. Past players wasted their careers waiting on incompetent management to build a team around them. Lebron realised after 7yrs that Cavs management were useless and forced the issue. Why should a star player suffer and have their reputation and legacy tarnished because of poor management?
Exactly. LeBron put 7 years in with the Cavaliers his first go-around and never recruited anyone or tried to team up with anyone and then watched the Celtics load up with 4 future hall-of-famers while David Griffin couldn't do any better than 400 lb Shaq and over-the-hill Antawn Jamison. So he did what he had to do. More power to him.
@@cruztheworld8326 I'm old enough to remember Lebron NOT actively recruiting fellow Ohio native Michael Redd. Dude was actually being criticised for NOT helping the Cavs recruit. Now it's "LeGM' jokes, forgetting he was actually proven right about not wanting to play with Andrew Wiggins, and winning rings with players he asked for.
Exactly 💯
Not to mention the same people who hate on super teams want Dame to leave Portland because they have essentially wasted his career
So because you don't like the players your team have you, go create a tv show and super team? Why not just create a good team? It was completely unnecessary and uncalled for. How can you hate kd what he did but love what lbj? Makes no since
Lebron made superteams for players in there prime. All other superteams were older ageing players.
Great observation.
So-called "super-teams" only exist in comic books.
The Lakers and Celtics during the 80's had literal All-Star teams.
@@criticalthought4910 the lakers are an allstar team this year also. They almost like an Olympic dreamteam
Idc what nobody say. LeBron ring chased, stat padded, and built super teams so naturally, yes, it's a knock
What do u consider stat padding?
Ring chased? He left the cavs because they didn’t give him what he needed to win the nba finals. So he joined the heat. Why would he join another terrible team? Stat padded… stat padding is when you inflate your stats and don’t care about winning. Lebron went to the finals 8 times in a row so I dont think bro cares about his stats.
@@legoatjagoat4691 bruh look at your name...I can't even take your commentary seriously. Clearly you have a formed bias
Y’all just be spouting pure nonsense
We're really talking about Player Development. LBJ tends to skip over younger Players who still need Development i.e. Kuzma, Andrew Wiggins, etc. He skips that essential part of the grind to pick Veterans who have already proven themselves. So when you compare LBJ to Jordan, it doesn't work. Jordan had to lean on Players including Pippen through the Development process, which means you're not going to the Finals in the first or second year. However, once the Players are Developed, there's no need to jump from team to team. The foundation is set, which turned into a 3-peat for Jordan. After all of LBJ's recruiting efforts, 10 Finals appearances, 18 years in the League, he has not 3-peated once and was lucky to get a Back-to-Back. Someone needed to tell him to stop trying to skip the Player Development process on his teams.
Jordan literally lost every year until teams got old and they put the requisite pieces around him in order to win. He didn’t have to face a Boston team with 4 hofers. He didn’t have to go up against the pre kd Warriors without his second and third option. He didn’t have to face the SA Spurs with multiple hofers and young studs in Danny green and kawhi Leonard. He didn’t have to go up against the juggernaut kd warriors. The kawhi and pg clippers who everyone thought was title bound. The Brooklyn Nets with kd kyrie and harden. Teams are built different nowadays and in order to compete at the highest level you need a great supporting cast around you. 2 or 3 all star level players are needed to win
@@kjb200814 exactly they act like Lebron averaging 50 10 and 10 is enough to win but it isn’t in today’s game
@@kjb200814 facts
MJ Bulls played weak teams in the playoffs and in the finals... Name 1 team MJ played in the playoffs or finals that had more than 2 superstars... We all know when the Bucks,Boston, Pistons were in their prime MJ took those L
MJ played on a Superteams. The second 3-peat team had 4 Hall of Famers.
The Bulls were a Superteam.
The Pistons were a Superteam.
The Lakers were a Superteam.
The Celtics were a Superteam.
Superteams are framed as a negative when people attempt to frame them against a historical context, "MJ did it all himself!".
In reality, no matter the Era, Superteams have ALWAYS been apart of the NBA. Bill Russell won 11 out of the first 13 championships.
are con
Super Teams won't "damage" LeBron's legacy.
Super Teams are LeBron's legacy.
Rick Bucher, thank you! What were the expectations when Stephen Curry was drafted? Klay Thompson? You can’t call it a superteam if they were drafted and homegrown. Or start counting hof’s after the fact. They were named to the hall of fame after winning a championship, not the day they were drafted
So it can’t be a super team because they were drafted by that team…. Kd russ harden
💯☑️🎯
@@madtitan6084 not my opinion, how could you possibly know what type of player they’re going to become? Perfect example Ben Simmons.
Remind me how many did they win before KD ?
@@madtitan6084 exactly
So basically your saying lebron is the best gm in the history of the nba. Its a reason wiley made into a ivy league school
Cause he could ball and was smart. Took to many hits to the head. Wiley is a hater. He wants to be Skip.
Just look up Lebron's "superteams'" records when he sat...they lost all the time.
@@diatribeeverything how can you have a superteam with a salary cap
If he had won, yes. But he lost more than we won, so now he's just a scared kid from Akon who wanted to stack his teams because he couldn't compete
@@liberalhedonist6196 you cant stack a team with a SALARY CAP guy
I feel like Lebron always wanted to stay in Cleveland but once he saw how the Boston big 3 was formed he knew if Cleveland didn’t get him another valuable player they weren’t gonna succeed. Cavs failed him year after year, you can’t expect your franchise players to stick around if you aren’t putting a real roster around them
nah he anticipated winning 8 rings LOl you didnt see Kobe run to some easy situation did you?
I don’t think people would knock Lebron for leaving Cleveland. We all know he did what he could. But he went IF teaming up with Wade AND Bosh…and so in after that
@@alxfonso4924 let’s not forget Kobe asked for a trade when the Lakers were struggling those years Shaq left. Lakers went out and made roster changes so that they can compete. If you going bring Kobe make sure you bring up everything else
@@mmbeas didn’t the Celtics have a big 3 with a rising PG in Rondo? What’s wrong with Lebron wanting his own big 3 to complete against Boston with ?
@@newagestudios408 dont forget the last 2-3years in cleveland they could have got a big free agent but lebron wouldnt tell those players he was staying or not.
I see Barkley has dropped another gem and all the narcisists are going bananas. 🤣
barkley would have done the same. He's got a loser mentality
Barkley never won anything so what makes what he says valid
@@raferalstonisgoat4457 So basically you are saying Lebuy is a loser. Thanks. I knew a narcisist would be triggered by this. :-D
It’s a knock because he built a super team snd still lost 6 in the finals and 3 of his 4 rings were fugazi.
Your titles are looking outstanding.....clown
I think MJ is the GOAT but to be fair to LBJ lost 2 titles as a superteam (in Miami). You can't say he lost 3 or 4 titles as a superteam in Cleveland because one year Kyrie and Kevin Love got hurt and the 4th one it was only him and Kevin Love (2018)
making it to the finals 10 straight times with 2 all-stars on your team while the rest of the east have one or 1.5 makes it pretty easy to win a chip
Not 10 straight. And not 2 all-stars. 2007, Lebron was alone. 2015, no KLove after the 1st round. 2018, Kyrie played in Boston. 2020, AD was the only other all-star. Get your facts straight. Don't read the headlines. Read the articles.
@@sibutotheworld my mistake 8 straight finals. and i said in the east so dont know why mentioning AD, even when kryie was in boston he still had wade, rose, love and IT until the trade. my point is the east was weak and he had more talent than all the other teams in the east to make it to the finals. even with a hurt love one year and no kryie another year he still had it easy in the east.
@@TRILLTALKTV So now you're changing the narrative. You initially said "with 2 all-stars" when in fact there was just one. 2018 Cavs, Wade was an old man, Rose was contemplating retirement, he took a leave from the game for some time, and don't even start talking about IT. KLove was also no longer an all-star. And how can you say it was "easy to win a chip" when they were not even favored in the finals? Did you know that of the 10 finals, Lebron's teams were only favored 3 times (including the Lakers' one). 7 times, Lebron's teams were the underdogs. And to win 4 times when up against much superior opponents was actually a great achievement.
@@sibutotheworld you are changing my point. I'm talking about making it to the finals in the east the 8 straight times. 7 of those 8 times he had 2 all-stars. The last one with Love did make the all-star team as the lone all-star on his team. And he struggled making to the finals. If you have lack on competition because you have a stacked team in your conference once you are in the finals you have a 50/50 chance of winning is what I'm saying in "easy to win a chip"
@@TRILLTALKTV In 2018, the Cavs had this starting lineup: James, Love, JR Smith, G Hill, T Thompson and you call that "stacked"? They were 4th in the East. They swept the #1 Toronto Raptors in the 2nd round and fought the 2nd-ranked Boston to a 7-game thriller. The Celtics had 4 players averaging in double figures in pts led by Brown and Taytum and all-star Al Horford. It was not a "struggle" as you have said, the Cavs simply are not supposed to win. Kevin Love did not even play in game 7 due to a concussion. And Lebron's 2nd best player was Jeff Green. And you call that "stacked"? Ows c'mon. Get your facts straight!
Super teams are fine just not when your in the best of all time conversations which lebron shouldn't be in anyway
Why shouldn’t he?
@@tylergathers7174 because he needs superteams to win and the greats of the past didn't have the luxury of hand-picking all star/superstar teammates.
@@Goldenboy48 So which all time great won titles and had major success without a great team around him?
@@tylergathers7174 great teams and Superteams are not the same thing. That's a disingenuous question.
@@Goldenboy48 It’s not I asked a simple question. I purposely didn’t mention superstars because whether or not you have two superstars or three or one, a great team will always win, the BETTER will almost always win. No player has won without a great team, people just like to use the superstar argument to discredit Lebron.
Youre never going to make me believe that 3 HoFers in their prime along with all of them being top 10 defensive players in NBA history, isnt a Superteam.
Brody isn’t a top 10 defensive player. He’s not even a top 100 defensive player probably haha
@@MrBezl wasnt talking about that team. I mean technically theyre not even a superteam. Westbrook wasnt an all star last year
Talking bout the Bulls with Jordan, Pippen, and Rodman.
@@iwishyouwould6937 ....they were definitely not a superteam
@@iwishyouwould6937 bingo
Those other teams were built within or made, LeBron recruited stars, there's a difference
Tell'em again Dave!!!
So if the team recruits and the front office builds up a good team then it's ok but if lebron recruits players to join him then that's a bad thing?
KD joined a 73-9 championship team, what else does he need to recruit 🤔
@@ivanirizarry9421 bottom line tell lebron to set it down cause jordan crashed alot nba greats careers and still to this day mike name come up as much as any body elses....lebron should bw worried about steff!!!
@@ivanirizarry9421 that's a lie the 73-9 team wasn't champions ..they went n got KD when LeBron beat them ...so let's stop that lie the 73-9 team was not champions
He had to get through the Big3 Celtics so I can't knock him,he tried to get through them boys DOLO,i'll give him that!
So what was the excuse for 2009 when he had to play against Dwight Howard and the Orlando Magic? Did he had to go through the B3 Celtics there? You can go ahead and miss me with that right there.
@@zacheryseymour7297 ain't no excuse,he couldn't get IT done,his legacy will be his legacy.He ain't done yet accumulating accolades and numbers.I never knocked his HUSTLE,he'll finish ranked wherever in the top 10 all time FOREVER,that's BIG however you look at him!
@@zacheryseymour7297 that Magic squad was good to,alot of coaching ERRORS by Van Gundy made that series ah bit easier for the Lakers!
Not debating that he’s not a top 10 player and it sounded like an excuse when you said, “he had to go through the Big3 Celtics”, so sorry for misinterpreting what you said. Also not saying that the Magic wasn’t a good team but Lebron did win the MVP and that Magic wasn’t better than Lebron Cavs team. Also you can’t blame it on the lack help either because Lebron had a very good supporting cast.
@@zacheryseymour7297 lebron choking against the magic was one of the better things that happened to his career. I was SO hyped to see kobe v lebron. Puppet commercials and all
That kobe led lakers team would've demolished that cavs team in 5
Charles Barkley is guilty of it but you missed the part where Charles wasn't ranking himself among the greats. He was just comparing MJ and Lebron.
Exactly, Barkley isn’t in the GOAT conversation.
@@suntansuperman26 I hate when y’all say that because you guys don’t even hold Jordan to the “GOAT Criteria.” You all created a special one for LeBron and always modify the qualifications whenever he achieves something. I’m NEVER accepting rules and guidelines from a Jordan stan because it always sets players up to fail and places the bar high enough to where it gives MJ an eternal advantage. In any world where Jordan fans aren’t some fake gatekeepers in the NBA Community, LeBron passes him with flying colors after his 3rd championship.
@@NotebookLives That’s because Jordan created the GOAT criteria and it’s the measurement others will be held to
@@suntansuperman26 Jordan is not God and I hope you actually realize that.
Winning on a team full of hall of famers and all stars is not as impressive as doing it with less help. Of course playing on super teams should be held against Lebron.
FACTS
What player won with less help?????
@@Ðཞའo Almost all of them.
@@omez23 lol
Is it held against magic, bird, Kareem?
so durant joining the warriors isn’t a knock on his career? same with lebron.. in 50 years they’ll talk about lebrons super teams the same way people hold it against bill russell for playing with all the best players in the league .. that’s why most people have wilt over russell
Not the same thing. Lebron wade Bosh never met in the playoffs let alone the ECF so even joining a team that he blew a 3-1 lead to is off the table. Not to mention they all are friends and was talking about playing together for *years.. why are u acting like if lebron would've joined celtics in 2011 you wouldn't have "crucified" him
No most people have wilt over Russell because Wilt was over there dropping 50ppg and 25rbg in a season.
Russell wasn't statistically dominant. However, that is not the issue with LBJ. LeBron will arguably go down as number 1 in points top 5 in assists and top 10 in rebounds.
Bottom line people hate lebron so much and they can’t stand it when he wins chips they want to discredit it
Spot on.
His chips aren't equal to superstars of old with the exception of his 3-1 comeback chip. That one I hold in high regard. But the others are pretty wack, stacked the deck every time. Still no 3 peat
@@manz7860 Homie get out of your delusional world. MJ played against 9 HOFers throughout his finals and LeBron James played against 29 HOFers. MJ didn't even see shadows of the teams that exist in todays NBA. Thats the reality of the situation.
MJ is old news. LeBron James is the greatest basketball player to have played this game. RIP.
Lebum Fans logic : dont discredit lebron for forming superteams bt lets discredit every other superstar that form one and beat him at his own game🤦...
@@adityasrinivasan7784 by that NARRATIVE, lebron doesn't even come near kobe bryant. Who's probably gone against the most 50win teams in playoff history
Tim duncan deserves a mention as well. He went through the 00s western conference grind as well. The only knock I have on him is they never defended a championship
5:30 Marcellus really counted never All-Star Toni Kukoc and 43 year old Robert Parish as 2 of the 5 Bulls HOFers and one time All-Stars Horace Grant and BJ Armstrong as 2 of the 4 Bulls All-Stars even though Grant and Armstrong never made the All-Star team during any of the title years and Rodman never was an All-Star as a Bull...
he loss credibility with me on that BS about the bulls.
Y’all Jordan fans will say that then turn right around and say Lebron had shaq
@@kjb200814 shaq was basically garbage when he played with bron. that old shaq was ten times better than pippen first 2-3 years in the league
@@kjb200814 lol not real ones. its clear dude jordan won the most with less. then Kobe. Lebron watered down his legacy
@@alxfonso4924 You don’t understand how eras work. I don’t talk basketball with casuals have a nice day
Boston's big 3 had no one in their prime.
But was they still all star caliber is all that matters
Uhh Kevin Garrett won dpoy in Boston. Ray Allen was still literally the best shooter in the nba without question rajon rondo was literally in his prime. And Paul was still averaging 22+ a night
They had a two year window of actually being a good team, KG had and Allen fell off, Paul was the only consistent one.
Marcellus shows you that he has no business speaking basketball. Every team playing for the title was not a superteam. He just has to protect his man crush Lebron.
You're right .. Not every team is a
super team ...
99% of them were since the 60s. name me 5 teams that wouldn't classify as superteams?
@@jmar5127 do really think that if Jordan left the bulls and joined the Pistons after they beat him in 90 wouldn't be different than him staying in Chicago? What if a young MJ and Karl Malone decided to leave their respective teams and join Hakeems Rockets? There is a difference pretending that there isn't is won't change that.
@@jmar5127 not true homie, the 94/95 Rockets wasn't a superteam, Spurs not Superteam, Warriors not Superteam except KD year. I agree that the Bulls without Jordan wasn't that good of a team either. Bron should've never left D Wade and the Heat
@@JamesJohnson-vk9en
He left the heat so he can fulfill a ring to his hometown Cleveland, and that was sweet. I am glad he left the heat tbh.
The fact that MJ played in an expansion league is never talked about, and how he didn’t beat Bird and Magic till they were out of their prime. They ignore that MJ himself had a superteam and went golfing with guys like Charles Barkley before games yet is claimed to have a “killers mentality” his shooting percentages dropped in the playoffs as well
4-6
@@ronpalacios15 Put his career in context, 10 finals appearances and only had the better team in 4 of those finals. Who did he lose to in the finals? Superteams besides the one year against the mavs. I used to be a manipulated Mj stan just like you until i educated myself
@@ronpalacios15 1-9 without pippen
How much older where they to him. I believe more than 5 so when mj was entering his prime they were coming out of it also the bulls team compared to those 2 are trash.
0:45 all I ever hear is excuses for y'all goat!! 🤦🏿♂️💯💯
What super teams lebron played on ? I wanna see what you say
If the player has to do the GMs job to win who cares. Either you draft good players or sign them.
Same people screaming KD’s rings don’t count are the same ones screaming superteams won’t hurt Lebron’s legacy
Facts and vice versa🤣
Man this Marcelius guy its becoming more and more nervous every single day … Acho you tha MAN , and im watching this show for 3 years .
Did I hear him say that every team that won a title was a superteam?
Acho used to have crazy takes and now they either swapped or our man Acho is all growns up and making Wiley look silly!!
In the East at the time those pistons were a super defensive team
Those "superteams" were sub .500 after LBJ left...quite the superteams huh? 🤔
Three reasons, age, injury, free agency
Honestly 🤣 some of these dudes wouldn’t have a job if it wasn’t for Lebron James 🤣
MOST* lol
Achos last point is right. Warriors and young OKC wasn’t a super team. They were a talented young core in the beginning.
Nah they were a superteam.
of course it's a knock on his legacy. he moved and created super teams to chase titles. he didn't need to do it. that's an insane argument. the warriors didn't do it. the bucks didn't do it. lebron is the GROAT. greatest recruiter of all time. he is not the GOAT. he has a long great career. he has longevity. he's never been dominant. he has never been great on defense (takes plays off all the time). he has great total numbers bc he's played forever. he's done less than MJ with less time.
The hate is real.
The fact you are comparing Lebron to teams ( warriors and bucks ) lmao haters gon hate
@@rjtherenegade7743 the warriors became a super team when kd got there Boston big three was past their prime
Mj without Scottie puppet = mediocre 1st round exit
Kobe is the goat
How can y’all say LeGoat builds teams but give the GM all the credit when they win.
Lebron is the most complete player ever created.
Exactly the haters say, “oh, Russ has no 3 point shooting the spacing will be terrible. Carmelo is old af he won’t be useful. The team is too old.” But then they say, “lmao Lebum cant do anything without stacking his team.” Like I’m so confused
If LeBron is so complete, why does he needs sooo much help EVERY year on EVERY team?!?!?!
LeBron played with most All-star help in NBA history 🤣🤣🤣🤣.
It was also trades tooo. He only goes to team that have young talent to trade to get premier All-stars 🤣🤣🤣🤣
That’s weak 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@eaglesfan1999 name a gm that ever said nah we got enough to win!! We don’t need another superstar even though we can afford it?😂😂😂😂. The sad part is LeGoat is so rent free in y’all brainwashed heads that y’all don’t realize how dumb y’all sound 😂😂😂. Why didn’t Jordan want to develop Kwame?😂😂.
How is it a players fault if the front office doesn't draft or trade properly?
Julius Randle, Brook Lopez, D'Angelo Russell, Kyle, Josh Hart, Ball, Caldwell, Harrell, all of them gone in order to ensure Lebron's legacy. You know, listening to his description of what Lebron did to four different teams kind of reminds me of The Harvesters alien race from Independence Day. "They are like locusts, they go to a planet, consume every natural resource and then move on."
Facts!!!!! Then he leaves teams to try to pick up the pieces after he's gone
Lmao I promise you they didn’t do it to ensure his legacy. Any team would trade all those guys for bron and AD. They were never gon win a chip w those cats
@@erikescobar6616 and being a magician, and all-knowing entity you would know this for an absolute fact?
This might be the first time I agree with Rick. People try to say the warriors have 4 HOFs but I don't think Draymond Green would be a hall of Fame player or all star without the championships. I don't think Ginobli would be an all star without all the winning he did with the Spurs. Same with some of those 04 Pistons. They played great together but other than Sheed with Portland, none of them were great individually.
To me a super team is literally just 3 franchise caliber players (when they played together) coming together. Wade, Bosh, LeBron. Kyrie, LeBron, K Love. Westbrook, AD, LeBron. KG, Pierce, Ray Allen.
All those guys were franchise players just before coming together so they were already great individually
People don't think about how he mostly takes stars from his own conference. So he's diluting the competition and being praised for beating the teams that were depleted
Agree with Acho. Superteams are the result of trade and free agency. Drafting and developing young talent is totally different (Steph, Draymond& Klay).
@Lee Scott Wanting to win is obvious, that's not the issue. The discussion is how we judge building a team. Homegrown talent seems to get more respect than a team with multple free agent superstars & trades.
Tim Duncan did it in 2003/2005 without a super team
@@MapleGlazedDonuts You did not watch the Spurs during that time.
Wiley is right, everyone in the all time top 10 played on a super team or the most stacked team in the league when they won their championships.
I'm no Lebron fan but he did what he needed to do to secure his legacy.
Lies. Most of those players grew into who they were as their careers went on. We gotta stop this narrative. MJ never played on a super team!!!!! Pippen averaged 7 points his rookie season then 14 the next. Kareem was traded but Worthy and Magic were drafted. Not anyone's fault they turned out to b great. Lebron literally rips teams apart to build them up to his liking then leaves and leaves the teams to rebuild and pick up the pieces.
@@blackdynamite5016 everytime LeBron joined a team they were dysfunctional, what are you smoking. Jordans bulls were a superteam, stop the excuses
@@blackdynamite5016 so how many points did Pippen average wen the Bulls started winning? And that the point. If players on a team consistently produce and play at a high level game after game year after year he is considered great , so by extinction if three or more of them is on the same team its a super team.
@@justcall10 IT WAS JUST HIM AND PIPPEN!!!!!!!!!! Why are we changing the narrative on what a super team is?! It was a great team that had a bulldog in Jordan for a leader!!!!! Period! Super teams in my definition are teams put together through trades with players who are already all stars!!!!!!! What is everyone talking about?! Just because Wiley said it don't make it true.
@@Mercil7 The Bulls were a lottery team when they drafted Jordan 3rd. Pippen was a nobody at first and Rodman was the bruiser and rebounder. Jordan DID NOT play on a super team. I don't care if everyone all of a sudden changes the narrative. Jordan went to war with whoever he had. Please look up Jordans team rosters cause jesus christ🤦🏿♂️
Dude in the pink coat, is intelligent asf!!!
Using Acho’s logic 73-9 wasn’t a super team cuz Steph n Klay “are homegrown” 😭 cmon man that’s the best record of all time
We all know regular season don’t matter, playoffs and the chip does. People throwing way too much weight behind regular season record is exactly what happened to Giannis, kept winning ok the regular season but lost in playoffs. It’s really low IQ to keep saying “but but but 73-9”
2016 Warriors weren't a super team.
Nobody had them making the finals that year even though they had just won a championship.
Retroactively changing the narrative doesn't count.
@@cp3190 they played like the utah jazz 2021, and bucks 2019 2020, great regular season teams that put up great regular season record, but that doesn't mean they are championship caliber teams. this 73-9 super team narrative needs to die
That wasn’t a superteam till Kevin Durant came there
@@darionjackson2599 If they weren't a superteam, than neither were the Cavs
Then kd’s joining the warriors shouldn’t be held against him either
🎯but we all knw lebron fan logic will say otherwise
Bruh it’s no comparison. Lebron didn’t join an already great team. He made bad teams great. Big difference.
Players typically don't leave teams with competent management. Duncan didn't have to leave the Spurs, MJ left once management started acting dumb, Kobe wanted a trade once Shaq left and management made dumb moves. Giannis didn't ask to leave cuz management made moves year in and year out to better the team. Dame has stayed loyal all this while and is only now started to get restless because management can't put a good team around him.
Player loyalty wouldn't be an issue if management did their jobs.
Preach!!!!!
What is a super team?
What is a Big 3?
What is a dynamic duo?
What if you form a Big 3 to beat another big 3? And should forming the later be the same as joining a dynasty that just beat you last season?
Building a super team and a team becoming a super team is 2 different things. LEBRON hasnt earned a ring from the muscle YET smh. No grind
Sources: crackpipe
So true
These players today are driven by what the media thinks. I stopped watching the NBA, I am not impressed when you go to the team after team, he still lost at each stop! Dallas and San Antonio bodied him along with Phoenix this year.
@The Progressive Brit You do know injuries are part of sports right? I don't like the team jumping, he's a good basketball player for sure, but I noticed in the past when he feels they will lose, he quits.
@@wikedvibez Quits? Filling out a contract is not quiting. Demanding a trade is.
Raise your hand if you think this show is way better without Whitlock
There are no “super teams”. There’s just teams. Some have a lot of talent but that doesn’t guarantee anything. Most of the time it’s about opportunity anyway. Lots of these guys can play. IT was a bench guy until he got in the right spot. TMac thought he was making a super team going to Orlando. The games aren’t played on paper.
Absolutely right, It's just easier. Not EASY...easiER...
And that's what separates him
Mad Astute opinion!!!!
Super teams DO exist ...
This is not a real profile who cares
Yea but in lebron case he formed stacked teams in a weak conference. Which is more of the nba understanding that they can’t advertise that the nba finals are being played in the west. And when talking about all time greats that should matter
Right ! Basically legacy woukd then be based on front office and coaching if players had no say
Wiley been on the lebron defense lately. What’s he plotting on 🤔🤔
😆
Good point
No, just stating facts
@@CriusXI yeah but usually he chooses to ignore them lol
@@jeffreyabbey9592 he up to something lol
He got that paycheck rolling.
DIDN'T MJ LEAVE THE BULLS ONCE KRAUSE SAID PHIL AIN'T COMING BACK. TALK ABOUT DOUBLE STANDARDS
Exactly
The laker players before him Kuzma, ingram, Ball, hart, KCP, Caruso - after 2 seasons since joining the Lakers, Lebron has traded all of them.
And what have they done since? Any playoff games?
@@dparks2856 that's a lot of young talent the Lakers won't have when lebron is gone the Lakers are gonna be in trouble.
@@kevben706 Who cares, the point is too win and they did that successfully.
@@kevben706
Lol. The lakers are not waiting on young talent to grow. Lakers are about winning. Those guys are not that good. Ball Ingram and Hart Russell randle
@@mannyfarfan9984 I know but look at the long picture they gonna struggle for a while before they can do something again.
Don't blame lbj for being smarter than everyone else 💯🤷🤷
For sure! Just don't blame Bezoz, Musk or even Trump for not paying taxes! They're being smart while everyone else is dumb.
Then don't blame KD for being even smarter.🤷
He destroyed teams SALARY CAPS that's exactly why they failed after he left
Thank you bro! At least someone is thinking critically. And the team is 100% built around him so once he leaves it will take them time to play together.
So it’s his fault that his greatness demanded that a team went all in, in order to win? That’s what all organizations should do when they have a player of that caliber, the Bucks gave Giannis what Cleveland never gave LeBron on his first stint there, the Bulls did the same with MJ, the Lakers did the same with Kobe. If you wanna be a successful organization you have to recognize when to go all in, they got their championships and success because they invested in him. I’m not gonna pound on him or any player because the organization did what they should’ve done.
Super teams been around forever, first team was Boston Celtics with bill Russell who had like 7 hall of famers on 1 team.
dont just read the headlines!! it was only 6 teams then
LeBron took the "Worst Finals Team Ever" to the Finals in 07. In 08 The Big 3 Celtics were formed and LeBron didn't make The Finals again until he created his own Big 3
Facts
They never put his career into context
It’s not that Lebron is doing “managerial duties”. If you were to tell Kanye just to produce and not rap or design his own shoes an clothes what you think he would say.
Super team is simply players taking less to be on a team knowing they value more. Even if they were drafted by said team
Bron only wins chips with former number 1 picks and high level all star players and bron played with way more talent then jordan hands down🥵
Bulls in the 90s 5 HOFs??? MJ, Pippen, & Rodman HOF. All stars, bj, & Horace made it year MJ retired & was only on 3 teams, Rodman was an All star maybe 7 years before he played on the bulls. & scottie never would’ve been a HOF if bulls didn’t win chips. Bring some context to it. Especially 1st 3peat bulls who were similar to 11 mavs, maybe not even that. 2nd 3peat was a better team but not a super team
Toxic sports media with fake facts smh
I thought the Celtics were the 1st big 3 of my era I do recall
A big three who was clearly past their prime why do people often leave that out
That wasn’t a superteam
Super Teams as some calls it is Not that Easily formed....First...a Great player has to want to play alongside another Great player or players...some even take Less money to do so....2...In Real Estate the saying is...Location....Location..that why you see the Super Teams in larger markets....You're Not going to get a Great FA to go to a small market unless he's traded there...That's why Giannis was making all that Noise about Super Teams because he Knows No Great FA is coming to Milwaukee unless it's a trade...
They're not a knock on anybody's legacy. What superteams do is make you have to evaluate them slightly differently than players who ain't on stacked teams where we have to examine both results and player contribution instead of just results (Michael Jordan) or just player contribution (Chris Paul)
Gene Guarilia - 4 Years in the league and 4 championships to his name.
The same people against superteams be the same people saying "dame should leave Portland wasting his prime years"
The only difference between now & then is that in the old days GMs did there job. In today’s NBA players have taken their careers into their own hands. So everybody’s mad because he out smarted everyone including the owners & GMs. Look at this way. Players have taken less money to play with him. 🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️
Exactly 💯
Wow Marcellus, might as well call u Shannon Wiley!
Go to the head of the class Ric Bucher!!!
LeBron went to LA alone and the Lakers traded for better players. Nobody called the Celtics a super team they call them the big 3.
A team is tagged Superteam when they are assembled, not when they are groomed by the franchise.
Lebron’s rings comes with an asterisk
. Period
. Paying for rings.
Cap
Wiley hit it on the head. If the organization's front office is competent, you are not dinged for being on a super team. But if management has a 40 year history of incompetence, and you, as a player are better at constructing a team than the people whose job it is to do so, then you are dinged for creating a super team.
It doesn't make sense.
Your take is ridiculous
@@naderomiller8557 that was a stellar analysis. Your reasoning is unimpeachable.
I can wait to see Giannis beat them
Lmao, we’ll find out
Finally is this a super team or a bunch of old players past their prime? These talking heads are only positioning themselves to have it both ways.
I could’ve swore bron was taking bum teams to the finals before Miami.
After*
he did it once in a weak Eastern conference and got swept!!
@@jqualls7901 because he had bums 😭
@@jqualls7901 y'all try to hard. Every team that's ever won "besides 05 pistons" were great teams
The more these presstitutes do puff pieces for LBJ, the more unauthentic he looks. One of many diff's between him and MJ - MJ's legacy was authentic and organic. He Became.
What about Gannis team or suns
Jordan was swept how many times before the 1st chip?!!?
3x in his first 3 years in the league. That means what exactly tho?
@@suntansuperman26 it means he can't win alone what every objective fan knows no one can except dirk in 2011
@@kevinjackson9573 I mean Jordan did help his teammates become better players. He wasn’t gifted established all star players. I think that’s the knock on LeBron.
@Sam McClam 6 and 0 baby these Bronsexuals can't stand that 🤣🤣🤣
@@suntansuperman26 I agree personally for me MJ is the goat cause he had less help but I'm not gonna bother arguing with anyone over it
The okc reference is bad because they did have a super team but for some reason they traded James harden 😂😂 remember they went to the finals with him coming off the bench smh
Pistons were a superteam they literally had 4 all stars
I remember lebron saying it was always in the plans to make a super team with Bosh and Wade they talked about during there draft year lol
Pistons never had MVP caliber superstar(s). That’s why the Cavs beat them in 2007.
@S S but still as an organization you’re drafting guys you think will become stars, you’re taking a risk there just like you’re taking a risk trading for someone who could possibly do bad with other stats or in your system. You don’t draft guys you think are gonna be horrible
That wasn’t a superteam
Am tired of the super team argument. . . Get over it. . Its always been super teams in every aspect of life. . . .
Y'all funny 🤣 with this super team stuff.
Hilarious , when you dont have a story you just make stuff up as you go
It's the reality of the NBA tho
Remember when the nba was about competing.
Lebron every year tries to make it as least competitive for his team as possible. It's definitely a knock on his legacy.
And he's still loses more times than not lol. Yall tryna crown him GOAT for 2nd place 😂 even steph curry stole his shine that's how weak lebrons hold on the nba was.
@@manz7860 when was that, cuz i been watching since 84 and its always been about having the best team
@@manz7860 yes lol I'm 50 years old it's soft now
Stop it the bulls were smart enough at there job to know we have to build a championship team around Michael
What make made that franchise what it is what super team did the bulls ever have the most gifted player to with mike was scottie,kukoc and Rodman and harper maybe at that time in his career....ker wasnt the best three point shooter at all dont even think he adveraged over 20...bj neither...harvey and horas were regular big men who had to go up against legend big men what are talking about.....mike led the league in basacially everything his whole time on the bulls.
2021-2022: when all the lebron haters collectively have their period. stay mad u bums. he's beating Jordan
Delusion is alive well at your house boss…. 😂
Your God should be ashamed
Wheres the 3 peat?
He's not even past kobe 😂😂
@@manz7860 acting like Shaq didnt carry Kobe in tht 3 peat LOL. Shaq got those 3 FMVP just in case you forgot.
Super teams aren’t new. Even Bill Russel’s teams were super teams for the time.
it was only 4 teams then
0 points in game 7 of the 2013 NBA Finals Bosh and averaged under 10 pts in the 2016 finals Kevin Love are "superteams" now? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 LeBron lives rent free in a million haters heads
fr they don’t even watch the games
If LeBron was playing in 1990's, he would had recruited Charles Barkley, Hakeem Olajuwon, David Robinson, Clyde Drexler, Karl Malone, John Stockton, Reggie Miller, Chriss Mullin, Tim Hardaway, Alonzo Mourning, Shaquille O'Neal, and Tim Duncan as the 12th man.
... LeBron would still be trying to chase ghost of MJ da GOAT
... Nick Wrong, Shannon and Kendrick would still be justifying LeFlop
If Lebron played in the 90s, he wouldn't even be popular. He flops and cries in even today's games. Imagine how he would have given up in the hand-check era. None of those guys would've joined an average player like Lebron - he just wouldn't have the pull.
@@liberalhedonist6196 The rule book says handchecking was banned since 1979
@The Progressive Brit He has a giant body, but a tiny mind. Haven't you seen him cry and flop at the slightest touch? One match with bad boy Pistons and he would take retirement from the game forever and open a candy shop in Akon. Be real, bruh. LeBron would be a nobody in the 90s
Yep, remember he was trying to get Kawhi to team up with him and AD on the Lakers.
Ric Bucher talk to these football players they always making excuses for lebron
Yes they will and should!!! Form Superteams to win!!! And there shouldn't ever be a Goat conversation in regards to Lebron.
Lebron is The GOAT put some respect on his name
Billy goat yeah
😂😂😂😂😂…SIKE!
Top 2 for sure but not the GOAT tho.
Who was on the Sun's when Charles went there?
Kevin Johnson, Dan Majerle, Cedric Caballero. A 60+ plus win team.
@@chitweak18 any of them going to the hall of fame? KJ played like trash every offs and Cedric got hurt I think btw
I’ll be a laker fan again after la bron leaves.
You’ve never been a Lakers fan to begin with if you got that mindset 🤡
@@CriusXI you never been
Lakers haven’t been the same since the Robert Sacre showtime days 😔
@@abdullahsulami7996 Ever since I was born and still am, I live in LA you think I’m finna root for the clippers??
Agreed
First time I agree with Wiley. People have been tricked into doing the same thing with politics. The people at the top crushing you convinced you that it’s the guy in front of you that’s the problem so you punch sideways instead of up. When they’re also being crushed.