Yup.This might in part due to the fact that most people arent history buffs and dont want actual epic historical tellings. They just want drama and "Yas Queens" and all that bull
@@GabaGhoul10 Oh I completely understand. But I’d rather them attempt to try to give us a glimpse of some of the battles rather than just cut episodes for the sake of cutting them.
Yea we're not gonna see the hour of the wolf. There's gonna be two more seasons and probably 8 ep seasons at that. There's so much to cover that they aren't gonna spend a whole lot of time with Aegon III and the aftermath of the war.
Too do any sense of justice, either stretch seasons 3 and 4 to 10 episodes, or do three more eight episode seasons with the logical conclusion being the hour of the wolf.
HBO pay this innovator 😤 but on a serious note, if this is how the series ends with the Hour of the Wolf, I will cry happy tears to see Cregan be the protagonist
@@J_ads2000 they won’t be able to resist giving a stark the spotlight considering all the masses love them. It’s the perfect template for a final few episodes.
The worst part is because casual fans have been screaming for more battles (when Season 2's real problem is poor pacing, excessive filler and repetitive scenes especially for Team Black), HBO may mandate for there to be even more battles, but likely keep cutting budgets, giving us even less character work and worse battles.
I don't see them including Honeywine, Red Fork or the Red Kraken in any kind of big scale. The Fishfeed and Butcher's ball will also likely be something smaller in scale, while First & Second Tumbleton will both get major coverage. So the big events of Season 3 will be Gullet and both Tumbletons. Season 4's big setpieces will be God's Eye and Dragonpit.
Spot on, exactly what I was thinking. After seeing the second season. My fears were affirmed.. none of the battle and events will be portrayed to anywhere even close how they should.
@@Halterin11 yes I fear a lot will be time skipped off screen like the burning mill this season. We’re getting a boring adaptation of a war story that made draw to it was the war itself.
This is very concerning. After reading the books it seems like there are countless moments that I couldn’t wait to see play out on the show and they are almost all either changed for the worse, merged with something else, or just cut all together. It’s quite sad that we aren’t getting the same story told in fire and blood. It’s a good show still but just disappointing as an avid book fan.
Warner Bros (who own HBO) have serious finance problems, a net quarterly loss of $9 billion. They might genuinely not be able to afford to give HotD the budget it needs.
MONEY. All the gold in Casterly Rock won't be enough to pay down the debt David Zaslav & Co. incurred in the WB/Disc. merger. Burying already finished movies, stripping content from websites (Cartoon Network archives), and, yes, nickel-and- diming the budget of their biggest hit to service that debt.
I always thought Rhaenyra's death would be a season 3 ender but a lot of fans pointed out that HBO was never going to do a whole season without Daemon, Rhaenyra, and Aemond. Daeron being introduced and killed off in one season doesn't make much sense either so all of that is going to be season 4 and there will likely only be 3-4 episodes after Rhaenyra dies. I wasn't a fan of this because a lot of interesting things happened after her death and she is still quite impactful. The remaining events of the war and how that character's legacy is explored could've been a whole season in my opinion. They seemed to have called it right.
I think it would be smart to tweak the timeline for the show to help with pacing and narrative impact. In this version, the Fall of King's Landing happens in Episode 1. It’s a straightforward victory for the Blacks, giving their fans something to celebrate right out of the gate. This would start the season off strong, showing them on top. Then, Episode 2 shifts to the Battle of the Gullet. This is where things get serious. The Blacks face a harsh reality check, and the death of Jace would be a gut punch for everyone, making this episode unforgettable. This approach lets the show start with a bang and then quickly raise the stakes, keeping things intense and unpredictable.
It could be that the Fall of Kings Landing and the Battle of the Gullet might happen similtaneously in the hotd chronology and expanded over 2 episodes, explaining why only Daemon and Rhaenyra arrive at Kings Landing. Jace's final episode could also be used as a keypoint of several major revelations that could explain later events (Jace admits to Baela that during his time with Cregan he slept with Sara Snow, and having been exposed to the Dragonseeds feels even more of a fraud of an heir than before - hence why he goes to the Gullet to rescue Aegon the Younger to rescue in his eyes the true heir and to remove himself from the equation to prevent a disasterous political scandal that could affect his mothers reign). The battle of the Gullet could also be reframed as a diversionary tactic for the Blacks to devastate the Triarchy fleet while Rhaenyra (with Driftmark as the bait - Corlys has already stated that the place holds no real value to him anymore after Rooks Rest) that becomes a tragic battle when Jace unexpectedly arrives (he might have been commanded by his mother to not intervene in the Gullet Battle and remain on Dragonstone, which would be a clear cause of conflict) and dies/sacrifices himself in the ensuring bloodbath to save the other dragonseeds and his brother Viserys, revaluing him from an expendable victim into a valuable hostage by the Free Cities and ensure his safety. His learning of Aegon the Conqueror's Dream by Rhaenyra also ties into when he visited the Wall with Cregan Stark in Season 2 and putting two and two together, and thus he instructs Baela to send a raven to Winterfell that details the SOIAF prophecy, so as to warn the North that the civil war might provide the oppurtunity for the white walkers to make a serious sortie against the Wall, and why the North is unable to provide serious aid to Rhaenyra after the Riots at KL until Aegon the 3rd is seated on the Iron Throne and Cregan comes down from the north in force - his calls for justice against Aegon II's murder during the Hour of the Wolf are only a cover to convey the prophecy information over to the boy king as per Jaecerys' Last Will and Testament.
Here's a sort of breakdown of the battles remaining and how they might be handled. Battle of the Gullet (Major Battle, no comparison) Fall of King's Landing (Merge with Gullet?) Battle of the Honeywine (Aftermath a la Burning Mill) Battle of the Red Fork (Mention or merge with Fishfeed) Siege of Longtable (Mention, no battle) Sack of Bitterbridge (Aftermath, a la Duskendale) The Fishfeed (Major Battle, BotB type) The Red Kraken (Mention, isolates Lannisters) Butcher's Ball (Rout, death of Criston Cole) First Tumbleton (Major Battle, a la Rook's Rest) God's Eye (Major Battle, a la Rook's Rest) Second Tumbleton (Major Battle, Rook's Rest) Dragonpit (Major Battle, Red Sowing) Moon of Three Kings (Intrigue) Battle of the Kingsroad (Aftermath, Burning Mill) Depending on budget the big shown events could be: S3: Gullet-Kings Landing Fishfeed First Tumbleton S4: God's Eye Second Tumbleton Dragonpit That makes for 3 big battles per season? With the rest mainly being shown as short skirmishes and aftermath types of shots. It's not ideal, but could be the best available option.
Yeah, toward the end, GOT had 3 big battles per seasons. The Greyjoy battle, the loot train and beyond on the wall was in the 7 episode Season 7. Season 5 had a similar thing at the end. It's really hard because this story was not written to be adapted to TV at all. They smash so much big stuff into one small area of time.
Butchers Ball I think will be big not too big but like still big because they really made Cole a big character and almost everyone hates him we don't need the Cerei treatment I want his death to be satisfying not a whole episode dedicated to it but give me 15 minutes of him slowly walking into an obvious trap and 5 minutes of battle then an ONSCREEN jumping I want to watch the life leave his eyes
Hugh hammer is going to fall out with the queen , be approached by Larys, and then be like “we the people deserve better” then crown himself because these factions are what the problem is in Westeros.
Right lets try this again... if people watching in 1080p and 4k let me know if this looks like a potato would be grateful. i have no idea what's been going on with the processing last week, ether been very slow, or awful quality.
You know it’s not a bad idea to give us two 8 episode season it would make a lot sense. If HBO would take note from other networks like starz with power and amc did with breaking bad and better call Saul it would work.
I totally agree with you, also think, They are going to change Aegon 111 Flying back to Dragon Stone on Storm Cloud. He is still so young and his Dragon is only a Baby🐉
I think it's gonna be Rhaena on Sheep Stealer that swoops in and saves him or Joffrey escaping with them on Tyraxes but Stormcloud still dies and Viserys falls off and gets recaptured or something
It’s absolutely insane that a billion dollar company like HBO can cut a season down by 2 episodes and skip out on such key events and then act like “budget issues” was the cause. That doesn’t make any sense and anyone who believes it is stupid. It’s just corporate greed. Top to bottom.
HBO was forced to cut the budget because WB who owns HBO decides it was a good idea to merge with Discovery and take on 9 Billion Dollars in debt, and instead of cutting the trash and funding the good told everybody we taking an eighth of your entire budget
Nah. After I watched episode 7, I knew the season would end in an unsatisfying manner. It didn’t feel like a payoff could come in one episode in this type of show. Aemond did burn a whole town like Danearys though but that was not shown nor was it made a big deal like Dany’s was.
Last year, Ryan Condal gave an interview where he said that season 2 was being truncated to 8 episodes because “it was story-driven”. Now that I’ve had a chance to see the ‘story’, well, I’m more confused as to what the story actually was. That said, I’ve had a chance to rewatch the “highly praised” season 1 again, and I now believe that’s where the original sin lies that has brought about all these pacing issues with the plot lines, that are about to get worse. The use of scene-to-scene screenwriting and multiple time jumps was strange, but palatable at my first viewing. However, what that did was create a disjointed plot arc for the entire series moving forward, as they deviated from the source text whilst also adding more confusing filler plots for some of their characters. And this I suspect was deliberate for a reason. See, GOT and HOTD are a gold mine for HBO, and they know that. And from that perspective, they honestly don’t care as long as they get the ratings, and thus will juice this puppy financially for what they see it to be. Reason why truncated seasons, and deviations from the source text will be the order of the day moving forward. They own the TV rights to this, and so there will be NO MORE 10-episode seasons no matter what fans or GRRM say, since it will still be a ratings bonanza regardless. Just like season 8 of Game of Thrones was. So just brace yourselves.
They were forced to cut by WB because WB merged with Discovery and took on 9B in debt so WB cut the budget forcing HBO to cut episodes and since it was in the middle of the strikes no one was able to rewrite season 2 to fit into 8 episodes this was never the og plan for season 2 and for GoT HBO was willing to throw money episodes anything that Dumb and Dumber wanted because it was making money Dumb and Dumber just didn't care and wanted to rush to their new Star Wars TV show which ended up getting scrapped because GoT last few seasons were terrible
@@pandajaeger3079 So how do you explain season 3 and season 4 reportedly being truncated to 8 episodes each? Is it “Story” driven?…Writers strike?…What?
@@146348 Where tf did you find that s3 and s4 should have only 8 episodes? the only thing i found is: When asked whether Season 3 will also be eight episodes, as its second season was, Condal said: “I haven’t had discussions with HBO about it."
Probably. Why do climactic battle scenes that change the entire outlook for every character, when you can also have scenes of Mysaria telling Rhaenyra yet again that she is the most wonderful person who ever lived?
Or if they did an animation from the beginning. Arcane is a high budget animation that’s 10 mill per episode. HOTD is 15-20 mill. We could’ve had Arcane level animation, the full scope of the story, and more episodes. But some idiots out there are allergic to animation.
I assumed season 2 was cut down for budgeting reasons. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw only a third of the battles on that list. The only ones I think that are going to be there for sure is the Gullet, at least one Tumbleton battle, the Gods Eye, and the Dragonpit. I'd honestly expect those to be cut down too if it's as costly as it sounds
Imagine if Avengers Infinity War ended with Cap, Black Widow and thw Wakandans standing on the field and Iron Man, Strange and the Guardians coming up with a plan and the big battles of Titan and Wakanda were pushed into Endgame.
They already cut the battle of the burning mill, and from the looks of it they are cutting out the battle of honeywine. Which means that they will most likely only show the aftermath of most battles in this war due to budget reasons, especially the battles of the reach an maybe some riverlands battles as well. 😤
@@DevadathanM Yes that's the battle to his introduction, and the battle where he gets his moniker Daeron the daring. But unfortunately it looks like they will cut it out the show since they show the Hightower's army marching with Daeron flying on his dragon in the sky. And we see that after hearing reports from ironrod that Hightower army are being confronted on two fronts by the house's in the reach in the prior episode.
@@timothypolanco8622 No they mentioned the problems with beesburries already in the show and we saw otto in prison kinda setup.So I don't think they will cut it.They may merge the Lannisters and coles army to one and fight those of daemon while he takes kings landing
Mock my words! EVERY battle will be off screen and we will get Rhaenyra, Mysaria, Alicent and Sharako Lohar scissoring in Essos the entire season in season 3. 🤣💁♂️
Worst Thing of all for me is that the series is ending with season four, because i would love it to see the aftermath of de dance. What do i mean? I would love to see the Hour of the Wolf. I think it would be a great thing to end the series with it. If i would write it, i would end it with the execution of a specific charakter, like in the book in the hour of the wolf. Imagine Gregan Stark say something like Jon in the first episode of GoT like "you have to watch". The Readers will know how i mean it but sadly i am sure we won´t get the hour of the wolf.
Not showing the gullet in whole would be disappointing when kings landing would be so much easier to scale down since they dont really meet any battle there
Trash shows are cheap. Look at how pretty much every cable channel has fallen to “reality” shows. They’re cheap af so don’t need much of an audience to turn a profit.
Knowing how much still has to happen I can’t see how they get through all that in 2 seasons, not without that crazy “time isn’t real” pacing that GoT had at the end There’s gonna be a ton of cuts. I’m about ready to call it a wash and just pray that AKotSK works out
My thoughts on how it could work somehow. For season 3: Honeywine is largely offscreen and Daeron is introduced in it's aftermath. Red Fork either the same or merged with Fishfeed. Gullet and Fall of KL happen simultaneously which could work quite well I think. Having fewer dragons in Gullet also makes more sense. In the book it is so weird that it's an even battle despite the Blacks having FIVE grown dragons. The Red Kraken will not be shown only mentioned which is fine by me cause it is really detached from the rest of the war. Butchers Ball isn't really a big action piece but rather a small skirmish so that wouldn't be so costly. Then First Tumbleton maybe scaled down a little and ending with Gods Eye. Season 4 beginning with riots and Dragonpit, the Moon of Madness(which is less battles more politics inside KL), then Second Tumpleton and ending with Kingsroad and it's aftermath.
That would explain all of the filler in season 2. They could've easily made season 2 10 episodes, and crammed the season 2 we got and the season 3 to come together for 10 episodes instead of 16. HBO is probably trying to milk this show and the harm that did is evident.
WB(who owns HBO) merged with Discovery and gained 9B in debt and since they didn't want to jeopardize their precious DCU they went to HBO and took money from their budget instead to try and pay some of it off
For the Lord commander & the watch!! Brother Bittersteel!! I had a feeling they were gonna push back the Battle of the Gullet which I do understand why, The report from WB explains why some of the CGi was really crappy in some areas
Cutting budget of your most successful show is insane. Is beyond dumb Disney knows that The Mandalorian is their major hit and now is even doing a movie. Zaslav is gonna damage this universe
I don’t understand how you can get the money to make it how it deserves. Cut less important shows or movies. GOT & HOTD has to be one of the major reasons Max stays relevant. Ask for donations if you have to.
I think they’re going to change the events regarding the dragonpit… Aegons kids don’t have their dragons. During the blood and cheese event we can see they still have their eggs under their beds. This means Shrykos and Morghul aren’t alive. It’ll only be Dreamfyre and Tyraxes in the dragonpit. They could add Syrax into the pit but even then, it won’t be much of a “massacre”. Will they add Sheepstealer? Moondancer? My fear is they keep Silverwing and Vermithor in the dragonpit and have Seasmoke go 1v1 against Tessarion. Idk I just feel like they might say screw second Tumbleton and kill a whole bunch of the dragons in the dragonpit to save money. Especially since they’re short on dragons.
which do y’all think they’ll do first the fall or the gullet ?? cause they stated aemond leaves to the riverlands in 2 days whereas the triarchy will arrive at the gullet on the morrow (2 weeks) unless they’re not going on at the same time
If they had to choose between the fall of kings landing, the battle of the gullet, and the red sowing, why would they choose the red sowing?! Feels like the least important one.
My theory, we will only get 5 battles spread out between season 3 and 4 due to budget constraints. If HBO gives us 8 episodes for season 3, and the season does very well ratings wise, the least the network is can give us an order for 10 episodes for season 4 to end the series. Let’s hope for the best.
In game of thrones many battles in the war of five kings was omitted because of budget. But in this show important characters died in each battle. I think fishfeed and Butchers ball will be merged.
The last two seasons are going to be rough from the sound of it. They'll probably do 3-6 big battles/big CGI episodes and combine/cut the rest. Hopefully, they find a way to wrap it up satisfactorily, but I have my doubts with how things are going and their track record with GoT
They foolishly undercut themselves by making loads of stupid changes that make the story/characters worse. What they've done to Alicent in particular is GOT Season 8 level character assassination.
I think the way to do all these battles is to front-load A LOT of the budget on the Battle of The Gullet, as that's the one the fans are most excited about. And then find ways to combine or work around the other battles. Don't forget the Siege of Meereen and The Battle of the Bastards was in the same episode. Hardhome, Daznak’s Pit and The Battle of Winterfell (3 significant battles) were done in the last 3 episodes of Season 5. Hardhome was the one given the most love and while the Stannis story ended poorly and the battle was worked around, they did show a battle there. They can find a way to work around all these battles. I'd extend the seasons to 10 episodes again but we will see.
With the way they paced season 2 and trimmed it down to 8 episodes, and with budget concerns in mind, I think they'd benefit from havin 5 seasons total, especially if these are going to be 8 episodes. They could maybe pull it off in 20 more episodes, but it's going to be really difficult. 3 more 10 episode seasons would give them the breathing room to fully cover what's left of the Dance and a little of its aftermath.
HBO is going to have to do what they did at the end of GOT and give out a Season 5 with 6 or 7 episodes. Which, if you’re looking to keep subscriptions isn’t the worst idea.
100% there will be a lot of merging knowing there will be a total of 4 seasons. So maybe S3- 1.Gullet and aftermath of Honeywine. 2. Fishfeed and Fall of Kings Landing/ Red Kraken happening at the same time. 3. Butchers Ball and First Tumbleton where we only see a short specific part of Butchers Ball where Crispin dies and when the horns are blown it switches scenes. For the rest i`m not sure but i feel like the season will end with the 2nd Tumbleton and leave the rest for season 4
I would expect Fishfeed and the Red Fork to be merged as well. The Honeywine could be scaled down as well as First Tumbleton. Butcher's Ball could be adapted as a small skirmish or merged with one of the Tumbletons. And as the King's Road battle takes place after some very important deaths, that could happen offscreen. At least that's how I see the remaining events be adapted on the remaining episode count.
The Gullet is supposed to happen before the Fall of King's Landing and honestly it would ramp up the tension better to keep it that way. With the tragedy that occurs, it would make Rhaenyra far more vengeful and hostile towards the Greens, and could turn things sour between her and Alicent very quickly. In all likelihood we should get the Gullet in Ep 1 & Fall of KL in Ep 2, but we'll have to see. Wouldn't surprise me if they change it around but that would be a real shame I think.
I’d rather have 10 episodes with smaller budgets and fewer special effects. Look at the stories Star Trek gave us with a TV budget and 20 episodes a season.
As much as I want to see all tge battles, I also want to see how these battles deplete the dragons, how the Greens and Blacks destroy the source if their power. We need to the see the child who witnessed his mother being burned alive become the King who presided over the death of the dragons.
Battle of gulet will happen of screen. Instead you'll get more scene of rheanyra and alicent having the lowest q conversation humanly possible for 20 minutes
Sounds like the show will be more “based” on the book rather than the book playing out on screen. This is a great example of your recent points about the challenges of adapting books to film
I think it will be fine. Because season 1 was introducing us to characters and character development, season 2 was introducing us to all the politics that was going on on both sides, and so season 3 will be about the war itself with season 4 about the aftermath
If HBO can’t fund the show for what they need THEN WHY AGREE TO MAKE THE FUCKING SHOW HBO. Like I obviously don’t understand how it works, they presented HBO with the show and the plans, they devise a budget with HBO, THAT BUDGET should be enough for the major events in the stow DUHHHHHHH how is that so hard??!! If HBO agreed to an amount and then took it away then that is beyond fucked up and they should be sued if that’s the case .
To clarify: the writers' strike affected the production of Season 2 because unlike the cast, the writers for HotD are all American and members of the WGA, so they were expressly forbidden from performing writer's duties; therefore, they couldn't sit down and rework the scripts to adjust for the shift from 10 episodes to 8. Merges? I definitely think they'll merge the two Tumbletons into a single battle. I'm not quite, but still reasonably sure that they'll also merge the Butcher's Ball with the Fishfeed, and maybe even the Gods Eye. As for cuts, I think the most likely is the Red Kraken. GoT butchered the Euron plot from the books, and I doubt Condal and co. are interested in introducing what will end up being a hanging plot thread. And while I don't expect them to cut the Red Fork, I think it's likely they'll treat it like the Burning Mill, or Oxcross from GoT - a single cold open scene precipitating the battle, and then a cutaway shot to the aftermath; though as I write this, I'm becoming increasingly convinced they will cut it just to have Jason Lannister at the Butcher's Ball/Fishfeed, so that we can get some Stark vs Lannister action on HotD. And keeping Jason alive and have him as part of the riverlands campaign will give Jefferson Hall more to do, since Tyland is likely going to be spending 90% of S3 either rotting in the black cells like Ned in "The Pointy End" or tortured like Theon during Season 3.
HBO better go up stairs to the big wigs and find the money to do the show properly HOTD is basically the only good show on HBO and needs to be prioritized over other shows if they want it to be a hit show like the original GOT. The company finds millions to do other trash content for HBO max go reallocate those funds into HOTD
I have a feeling HBO won't do this but if they did cut season 3 down to eight episodes, they could allow for an extension of runtime for each episode. I do think some of these battles will get the "aftermath" treatment of opening an episode with the aftermath of what happened and the main characters discussing the occurrence with their respective consequences.
I think we'll get the fall of Kings Landing and the battle of the Gullet in episode 1 happening at the same time. As Rhaenyra sits the throne it'll cut to Jace being dragged underwater. Episode 2 will then introduce Daeron and we'll see the battle of the honeywine. Episode 3 probably wont have a battle. Episode 4 the fish feed. Episode 5 butchers ball. Episode 6 no battle. Episode 7 first battle of Tumbleton. Episode 8 may have the gods eye for the finale. Season 4 will have the second battle of tumbleton early on, the dragonpit and muddy mess as the story concludes.
Factor into account that you’ll have to include time to see spooky Daemon side quests and and Theynayra making out with Mysaria and you’ll figure out a lot more stuff is going to get cut..
Thanks for this video. Its been my biggest gripe for not showing the gullet in season 2.. Also, why are they working on so many prequel shows when they barely have the budget to produce this one.
Dragons are dead by this era of house Targaryen. Honestly the story is cute but not really riveting. The main character is pretty much Westeros version of Forrest Gump and the other character is I guess a really young mackauley kulkin
Don’t get me wrong, the ground army battles do take a chunk of the budget but not nearly as much as the dragon scenes. Ryan said they have enough budget for 2 big cinematic CGI heavy scenes per season. This would include battle of the gullet, fall of kingslanding, battle above the godseye, second Tumbleton, dragonpit massacre and Moondancer vs Sunfyre. Thats 6. How do they plan to do this in 2 more seasons. Perhaps if they had enough for 3 each season then they could do this but they don’t… and that’s without listening the ground battles.
Y’all don’t be surprised - corporations learned nothing from the demise of cable TV. We now have too many streams, with companies all throwing money at ideas, then keeping things that hit the sweet spot of “popular enough and cheap enough” while ditching better, usually more expensive) shows. Plus nobody competent has run Warner Bros or HBO in over a decade.
Other big HBO shows went for 12-22 episodes. Ie The Sopranos, The Wire etc. Shit even Showtime shows have 12+ episodes now days, ie Billions, Ray Donovan etc..How we go from that being the normal to 10 episodes being the normal?
Compare what happens in those shows, set in the modern day, with what happens in period shows like HotD or GoT, where you have CGI dragons, fantasy locations and knights and horses, all if which cost money. Sopranos had no such issues when they could just film in Jersey. An episode like Rook's Rest alone ate up around half the budget for a season of Sopranos.
@@mihaiionita5648 yeah youre right GoT and HoTD does waaay bigger shit but why is 10 episodes even shows like Power and all spinoffs, Mayor of Kingstown, Spartacus etc ..all 10 episodes when did 10 become the norm?
@mihaiionita5648 it's pretty simple then init! If hbo doesn't have the budget then why make a half arsed attempt at the dance.... pure greed plain and simple
"I think 4 seasons" Condal said so not even he is 100 % sure how many seasons. They dont have the money for more than 2 big events per season so I think they will have to go for 5 seasons.
S6 of GoT was running without source material, but it was 10 episodes and was great. You can't make an ASOIAF show less than 10.episodes, apart from maybe Dunk and Egg
I imagine we’re going to get a combined Gullet/Assault on King’s Landing in the first episode where Rhaenyra will find Aegon not there. Politics will happen and word of the Gullet will reach them and that battle will take place at the end of the episode or the beginning of the second. I imagine they’ll move right into Honeywine, Tumbleton, etc in a consolidated manner. I believe God’s Eye has to happen as it’s already been brought up. Honestly expecting 2-4 more big battles over the course of the series, and that be it. While I’d like to see everything played out like in the book, but it unfortunately won’t so I hope what action they do believe is necessary for their plot is the biggest actions scene within the work. I wouldn’t mind a battle every episode to be completely honest though. It’s not like they’ll have to spend money on dragons for Knight of the Seven Kingdoms.
If they're going to have the Gullet happen pretty much simultaneously with the Fall, what does that mean for Tyland, who is now on his way to the former when he's supposed to be at the latter? Even if they had these events happening in two separate episodes it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense for him to be at both. I suppose there is one obvious way to affect a similar 'outcome' for him despite this, but making that change will rob Rhaenyra's camp of considerable agency and moral ambiguity. Not that they really have any in the show, at present; they are clearly who everyone is supposed to be rooting for.
Warner Bros Discovery and by extension, its CEO, David Zaslav, did "House Of The Dragon"'s showrunners no favours when they slashed $40 - 50 million out of the second season's production budget. HOTD is one of HBO's flagship shows. It had excellent ratings from critics, was popular with viewers as well as having increased subscriptions to HBOmax and in the process, brought back what was for all intents and purposes, a dead TV franchise (after Benioff and Weiss definitively shit the bed with "GOT'"s final season). What's the old saying about being penny wise and pound foolish, again? Right!... .
1st to take the Black for House Blackfyre 🗡 I hope they do the battle Justice, but I'm worried there will be a budget cut everything will be rushed or something else
If the battles cost too much why make show where the battles and dragons are the main course. There’s no way they started production without a review of what the costs would have a show of this magnitude. This show aired when eggs were about 15 bucks lol so it’s not lock they aired before inflation
I can understand pushing the fall of kings landing but not the gullet. The first half of season 2 was build up for rooks rest and the second half was build up for the gullet only we never got the gullet.
HBO cutting down to 8 episodes and budgets is the most ridiculous thing bout this man love your content!!
Well if you clowns didn't expect mindless action every episode they wouldn't have to cut the episodes
@@DatBoiChris420 The writing is garbage, The battles is the best things we got
@@aidenrogers1468 nah
Writing in season 2 is such trash that it is irelevant if they had 8 or 10+ episodes
Budget is the last thing the house of dragon need to worry ...
Very upsetting that a company like HBO/MAX or Discovery can't seem to produce a show like this in as grand as it deserves to be.
Yup.This might in part due to the fact that most people arent history buffs and dont want actual epic historical tellings. They just want drama and "Yas Queens" and all that bull
I thought s2 was good. If we were watching the show ten years from now, we’d forgive s2 for being boring.
I mean do you know anybody that could? 5 dragons and a large battle at sea?
We don’t even get stuff like that in movies.
@@GabaGhoul10 Oh I completely understand. But I’d rather them attempt to try to give us a glimpse of some of the battles rather than just cut episodes for the sake of cutting them.
You’ll be surprised by the number of fans that don’t care how faithful the show is to the books.
If they cut the Hour of the Wolf, fans are going to be mad. Not enough Cregan in s2.
That is an understatement
They’ll make it into a seperate show, genius right? 😂😂😂
Same with Dalton Grey joy.
I can see it happening. Black Alys and her girl Sabitha Frey seem to have been cut or extremely aged up in Sabitha’s case……
Yea we're not gonna see the hour of the wolf. There's gonna be two more seasons and probably 8 ep seasons at that. There's so much to cover that they aren't gonna spend a whole lot of time with Aegon III and the aftermath of the war.
You gotta have the gullet, tumbleton battles, God's eye, butcher's ball, and the dragonpit
And fall of dragonstone
Don’t forget Sunfyre vs Moondancer. Basically battle above the gods eye on a slightly smaller scale.
They won’t do Gods eye or the dragon pit.
@@J_ads2000 that probably won't happen
@Jacaerys1 they've already set up the God's eye and the dragon pit is one the most important events that is kind of the whole point of the dance
They didnt need a big budget for Blood and cheese and they still managed to screw that scene up.
Too do any sense of justice, either stretch seasons 3 and 4 to 10 episodes, or do three more eight episode seasons with the logical conclusion being the hour of the wolf.
HBO pay this innovator 😤 but on a serious note, if this is how the series ends with the Hour of the Wolf, I will cry happy tears to see Cregan be the protagonist
@@JonathanSanchez-es1ssit honestly would make too much sense to not do it. Even for lukewarm IQ HBO producers.
Would they care if the show is over though??
@@J_ads2000 they won’t be able to resist giving a stark the spotlight considering all the masses love them. It’s the perfect template for a final few episodes.
@@J_ads2000 as long as they continue to unload good quality this could go for at least 4 seasons, 5 if we’re lucky
The worst part is because casual fans have been screaming for more battles (when Season 2's real problem is poor pacing, excessive filler and repetitive scenes especially for Team Black), HBO may mandate for there to be even more battles, but likely keep cutting budgets, giving us even less character work and worse battles.
Fs in chat for Nettles 😔
We got this instead
🏃♀️ 🏃♀️🏃♀️ 👁️👄👁️
We don’t know nettles is cut for certain
@@isaacupton615unless Baela is hopping on Cannibal, but it looks a lot like sheep stealer.
@@Nozem13nobody can tame the Cannibal 😂
@@z_6077 the Cannibal was reincarnated into Shaggydog, Rickon Stark's direwolf. Rickon will claim the Cannibal, just not the Dragon-version.
I don't see them including Honeywine, Red Fork or the Red Kraken in any kind of big scale. The Fishfeed and Butcher's ball will also likely be something smaller in scale, while First & Second Tumbleton will both get major coverage. So the big events of Season 3 will be Gullet and both Tumbletons. Season 4's big setpieces will be God's Eye and Dragonpit.
Spot on, exactly what I was thinking. After seeing the second season. My fears were affirmed.. none of the battle and events will be portrayed to anywhere even close how they should.
@christopherfreitas6510 War of the Five Kings all over again...
@@Halterin11 yes I fear a lot will be time skipped off screen like the burning mill this season. We’re getting a boring adaptation of a war story that made draw to it was the war itself.
Butchers ball will basically just be Cole’s death
@@userofyoutube2626 Exactly. A few scenes is pretty much enough.
This is very concerning. After reading the books it seems like there are countless moments that I couldn’t wait to see play out on the show and they are almost all either changed for the worse, merged with something else, or just cut all together. It’s quite sad that we aren’t getting the same story told in fire and blood. It’s a good show still but just disappointing as an avid book fan.
I don't understand how you cut episodes of the biggest show in the world rn.
It’s Warner bros/Discovery there in a hot mess.
They writers strike wouldn’t allow them to rewrite and condense the original 10 episodes down to 8. The writer’s strike is to blame.
Warner Bros (who own HBO) have serious finance problems, a net quarterly loss of $9 billion. They might genuinely not be able to afford to give HotD the budget it needs.
HBO and Discovery are probably getting a boat-load of hate mail. Good.
MONEY. All the gold in Casterly Rock won't be enough to pay down the debt David Zaslav & Co. incurred in the WB/Disc. merger. Burying already finished movies, stripping content from websites (Cartoon Network archives), and, yes, nickel-and- diming the budget of their biggest hit to service that debt.
I always thought Rhaenyra's death would be a season 3 ender but a lot of fans pointed out that HBO was never going to do a whole season without Daemon, Rhaenyra, and Aemond. Daeron being introduced and killed off in one season doesn't make much sense either so all of that is going to be season 4 and there will likely only be 3-4 episodes after Rhaenyra dies. I wasn't a fan of this because a lot of interesting things happened after her death and she is still quite impactful. The remaining events of the war and how that character's legacy is explored could've been a whole season in my opinion. They seemed to have called it right.
I don't think you could have a whole season just for "the legacy" of the characters. That sounds like Boruto.
I think it would be smart to tweak the timeline for the show to help with pacing and narrative impact.
In this version, the Fall of King's Landing happens in Episode 1. It’s a straightforward victory for the Blacks, giving their fans something to celebrate right out of the gate. This would start the season off strong, showing them on top.
Then, Episode 2 shifts to the Battle of the Gullet. This is where things get serious. The Blacks face a harsh reality check, and the death of Jace would be a gut punch for everyone, making this episode unforgettable.
This approach lets the show start with a bang and then quickly raise the stakes, keeping things intense and unpredictable.
It could be that the Fall of Kings Landing and the Battle of the Gullet might happen similtaneously in the hotd chronology and expanded over 2 episodes, explaining why only Daemon and Rhaenyra arrive at Kings Landing.
Jace's final episode could also be used as a keypoint of several major revelations that could explain later events (Jace admits to Baela that during his time with Cregan he slept with Sara Snow, and having been exposed to the Dragonseeds feels even more of a fraud of an heir than before - hence why he goes to the Gullet to rescue Aegon the Younger to rescue in his eyes the true heir and to remove himself from the equation to prevent a disasterous political scandal that could affect his mothers reign). The battle of the Gullet could also be reframed as a diversionary tactic for the Blacks to devastate the Triarchy fleet while Rhaenyra (with Driftmark as the bait - Corlys has already stated that the place holds no real value to him anymore after Rooks Rest) that becomes a tragic battle when Jace unexpectedly arrives (he might have been commanded by his mother to not intervene in the Gullet Battle and remain on Dragonstone, which would be a clear cause of conflict) and dies/sacrifices himself in the ensuring bloodbath to save the other dragonseeds and his brother Viserys, revaluing him from an expendable victim into a valuable hostage by the Free Cities and ensure his safety.
His learning of Aegon the Conqueror's Dream by Rhaenyra also ties into when he visited the Wall with Cregan Stark in Season 2 and putting two and two together, and thus he instructs Baela to send a raven to Winterfell that details the SOIAF prophecy, so as to warn the North that the civil war might provide the oppurtunity for the white walkers to make a serious sortie against the Wall, and why the North is unable to provide serious aid to Rhaenyra after the Riots at KL until Aegon the 3rd is seated on the Iron Throne and Cregan comes down from the north in force - his calls for justice against Aegon II's murder during the Hour of the Wolf are only a cover to convey the prophecy information over to the boy king as per Jaecerys' Last Will and Testament.
You know reading the book again this week I couldn’t help but think 16 episode to finish this show won’t do it justice.
They have to be 1.5hrs or more
Basically every episode would need to be feature length
@@DatBoiChris420 exactly
Even 20 won't, had they done King's Landing and Gullet in Season 2, how it should've been, then it possibly might've worked out in 20 episodes.
Here's a sort of breakdown of the battles remaining and how they might be handled.
Battle of the Gullet (Major Battle, no comparison)
Fall of King's Landing (Merge with Gullet?)
Battle of the Honeywine (Aftermath a la Burning Mill)
Battle of the Red Fork (Mention or merge with Fishfeed)
Siege of Longtable (Mention, no battle)
Sack of Bitterbridge (Aftermath, a la Duskendale)
The Fishfeed (Major Battle, BotB type)
The Red Kraken (Mention, isolates Lannisters)
Butcher's Ball (Rout, death of Criston Cole)
First Tumbleton (Major Battle, a la Rook's Rest)
God's Eye (Major Battle, a la Rook's Rest)
Second Tumbleton (Major Battle, Rook's Rest)
Dragonpit (Major Battle, Red Sowing)
Moon of Three Kings (Intrigue)
Battle of the Kingsroad (Aftermath, Burning Mill)
Depending on budget the big shown events could be:
S3:
Gullet-Kings Landing
Fishfeed
First Tumbleton
S4:
God's Eye
Second Tumbleton
Dragonpit
That makes for 3 big battles per season? With the rest mainly being shown as short skirmishes and aftermath types of shots. It's not ideal, but could be the best available option.
Yeah, toward the end, GOT had 3 big battles per seasons. The Greyjoy battle, the loot train and beyond on the wall was in the 7 episode Season 7. Season 5 had a similar thing at the end. It's really hard because this story was not written to be adapted to TV at all. They smash so much big stuff into one small area of time.
I agree, but it seems like it would be quite disappointing not to have the battle of the kings road as a major one
@@spartanworrior4519 sure but I can imagine with the limited timeframe, Aegon II's reaction to it will likely be the main source of drama there.
Butchers Ball I think will be big not too big but like still big because they really made Cole a big character and almost everyone hates him we don't need the Cerei treatment I want his death to be satisfying not a whole episode dedicated to it but give me 15 minutes of him slowly walking into an obvious trap and 5 minutes of battle then an ONSCREEN jumping I want to watch the life leave his eyes
@@TheRoyalFinoso our goal is to emulate GoT after it got bad? We won’t get all those battles and we don’t need them all.
Hugh hammer is going to fall out with the queen , be approached by Larys, and then be like “we the people deserve better” then crown himself because these factions are what the problem is in Westeros.
Right lets try this again... if people watching in 1080p and 4k let me know if this looks like a potato would be grateful. i have no idea what's been going on with the processing last week, ether been very slow, or awful quality.
4K, looks fantastic and sharp
On my phone but looks great 👍
You know it’s not a bad idea to give us two 8 episode season it would make a lot sense. If HBO would take note from other networks like starz with power and amc did with breaking bad and better call Saul it would work.
@@WorldOfWesteros 🏰🖤
I totally agree with you, also think, They are going to change Aegon 111 Flying back to Dragon Stone on Storm Cloud. He is still so young and his Dragon is only a Baby🐉
I think it's gonna be Rhaena on Sheep Stealer that swoops in and saves him or Joffrey escaping with them on Tyraxes but Stormcloud still dies and Viserys falls off and gets recaptured or something
It’s absolutely insane that a billion dollar company like HBO can cut a season down by 2 episodes and skip out on such key events and then act like “budget issues” was the cause. That doesn’t make any sense and anyone who believes it is stupid. It’s just corporate greed. Top to bottom.
HBO was forced to cut the budget because WB who owns HBO decides it was a good idea to merge with Discovery and take on 9 Billion Dollars in debt, and instead of cutting the trash and funding the good told everybody we taking an eighth of your entire budget
The way the show runners are storytelling, season 3 might start off with Rhaenyra already in Kings Landing 🤦🏽♂️
Lol, sad that this feels like a real possibility.
I myself legit thought it would be the fall of Kings Landing. Finale definitely was underwhelming!
I thought so a swell. At least one more episode would have made the season far better.
@@status_quo_postYup!! 💯
Nah. After I watched episode 7, I knew the season would end in an unsatisfying manner. It didn’t feel like a payoff could come in one episode in this type of show.
Aemond did burn a whole town like Danearys though but that was not shown nor was it made a big deal like Dany’s was.
Last year, Ryan Condal gave an interview where he said that season 2 was being truncated to 8 episodes because “it was story-driven”. Now that I’ve had a chance to see the ‘story’, well, I’m more confused as to what the story actually was. That said, I’ve had a chance to rewatch the “highly praised” season 1 again, and I now believe that’s where the original sin lies that has brought about all these pacing issues with the plot lines, that are about to get worse. The use of scene-to-scene screenwriting and multiple time jumps was strange, but palatable at my first viewing. However, what that did was create a disjointed plot arc for the entire series moving forward, as they deviated from the source text whilst also adding more confusing filler plots for some of their characters. And this I suspect was deliberate for a reason. See, GOT and HOTD are a gold mine for HBO, and they know that. And from that perspective, they honestly don’t care as long as they get the ratings, and thus will juice this puppy financially for what they see it to be. Reason why truncated seasons, and deviations from the source text will be the order of the day moving forward. They own the TV rights to this, and so there will be NO MORE 10-episode seasons no matter what fans or GRRM say, since it will still be a ratings bonanza regardless. Just like season 8 of Game of Thrones was. So just brace yourselves.
They were forced to cut by WB because WB merged with Discovery and took on 9B in debt so WB cut the budget forcing HBO to cut episodes and since it was in the middle of the strikes no one was able to rewrite season 2 to fit into 8 episodes this was never the og plan for season 2 and for GoT HBO was willing to throw money episodes anything that Dumb and Dumber wanted because it was making money Dumb and Dumber just didn't care and wanted to rush to their new Star Wars TV show which ended up getting scrapped because GoT last few seasons were terrible
@@pandajaeger3079 So how do you explain season 3 and season 4 reportedly being truncated to 8 episodes each? Is it “Story” driven?…Writers strike?…What?
@@146348 Where tf did you find that s3 and s4 should have only 8 episodes? the only thing i found is: When asked whether Season 3 will also be eight episodes, as its second season was, Condal said: “I haven’t had discussions with HBO about it."
At least half of your list won’t be covered I’m guessing.
Probably. Why do climactic battle scenes that change the entire outlook for every character, when you can also have scenes of Mysaria telling Rhaenyra yet again that she is the most wonderful person who ever lived?
@@frankvandorp2059 haha more mud wrestling is critical to the dance as well!
The thing is if HBO would just focus on one GOT show at a time they would have the budget to do it properly
Or if they did an animation from the beginning. Arcane is a high budget animation that’s 10 mill per episode. HOTD is 15-20 mill. We could’ve had Arcane level animation, the full scope of the story, and more episodes. But some idiots out there are allergic to animation.
It was WB that cut the budget, not HBOs decision
I assumed season 2 was cut down for budgeting reasons. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw only a third of the battles on that list. The only ones I think that are going to be there for sure is the Gullet, at least one Tumbleton battle, the Gods Eye, and the Dragonpit. I'd honestly expect those to be cut down too if it's as costly as it sounds
Imagine if Avengers Infinity War ended with Cap, Black Widow and thw Wakandans standing on the field and Iron Man, Strange and the Guardians coming up with a plan and the big battles of Titan and Wakanda were pushed into Endgame.
They already cut the battle of the burning mill, and from the looks of it they are cutting out the battle of honeywine. Which means that they will most likely only show the aftermath of most battles in this war due to budget reasons, especially the battles of the reach an maybe some riverlands battles as well. 😤
Isn't honeywine the introduction of Daeron?So I hope it won't be like Burning mill
@@DevadathanM Yes that's the battle to his introduction, and the battle where he gets his moniker Daeron the daring. But unfortunately it looks like they will cut it out the show since they show the Hightower's army marching with Daeron flying on his dragon in the sky. And we see that after hearing reports from ironrod that Hightower army are being confronted on two fronts by the house's in the reach in the prior episode.
@@timothypolanco8622 No they mentioned the problems with beesburries already in the show and we saw otto in prison kinda setup.So I don't think they will cut it.They may merge the Lannisters and coles army to one and fight those of daemon while he takes kings landing
Mock my words! EVERY battle will be off screen and we will get Rhaenyra, Mysaria, Alicent and Sharako Lohar scissoring in Essos the entire season in season 3. 🤣💁♂️
I agree except Sharako Lohar will be wearing a strap 🍆
😂
Worst Thing of all for me is that the series is ending with season four, because i would love it to see the aftermath of de dance. What do i mean? I would love to see the Hour of the Wolf. I think it would be a great thing to end the series with it. If i would write it, i would end it with the execution of a specific charakter, like in the book in the hour of the wolf. Imagine Gregan Stark say something like Jon in the first episode of GoT like "you have to watch". The Readers will know how i mean it but sadly i am sure we won´t get the hour of the wolf.
Not showing the gullet in whole would be disappointing when kings landing would be so much easier to scale down since they dont really meet any battle there
As with any streaming company they allow trash shows to exist with multiple seasons but somehow only cut budgets on really good shows 😒🙄
They're starving for money but renewed velma
Trash shows are cheap. Look at how pretty much every cable channel has fallen to “reality” shows. They’re cheap af so don’t need much of an audience to turn a profit.
I suspect we’ll get the fall of Kingslanding and the Gullet and maybe one other thing, I don’t expect more than that.
Knowing how much still has to happen I can’t see how they get through all that in 2 seasons, not without that crazy “time isn’t real” pacing that GoT had at the end
There’s gonna be a ton of cuts. I’m about ready to call it a wash and just pray that AKotSK works out
My thoughts on how it could work somehow. For season 3: Honeywine is largely offscreen and Daeron is introduced in it's aftermath. Red Fork either the same or merged with Fishfeed. Gullet and Fall of KL happen simultaneously which could work quite well I think. Having fewer dragons in Gullet also makes more sense. In the book it is so weird that it's an even battle despite the Blacks having FIVE grown dragons. The Red Kraken will not be shown only mentioned which is fine by me cause it is really detached from the rest of the war. Butchers Ball isn't really a big action piece but rather a small skirmish so that wouldn't be so costly. Then First Tumbleton maybe scaled down a little and ending with Gods Eye. Season 4 beginning with riots and Dragonpit, the Moon of Madness(which is less battles more politics inside KL), then Second Tumpleton and ending with Kingsroad and it's aftermath.
‘Come with me’ lol
ok fine
I wanna see the Fishfeed!
Yeah since we didn’t really get the burning mill i really wanna see the fish feed early season 3
That would explain all of the filler in season 2.
They could've easily made season 2 10 episodes, and crammed the season 2 we got and the season 3 to come together for 10 episodes instead of 16.
HBO is probably trying to milk this show and the harm that did is evident.
WB(who owns HBO) merged with Discovery and gained 9B in debt and since they didn't want to jeopardize their precious DCU they went to HBO and took money from their budget instead to try and pay some of it off
I adore your channel and analysis ❤
For the Lord commander & the watch!!
Brother Bittersteel!!
I had a feeling they were gonna push back the Battle of the Gullet which I do understand why,
The report from WB explains why some of the CGi was really crappy in some areas
@@jeffcordova9633 first ranger whatup!!!! Mi lord
Great to see you as always.I hope you are well
@@lawrencereid2767 break out the ale!! I have returned from The capital with Some ladies from Lys & Dorne
And I DID NOT FORGET THE ALe!!
@@aegorbittersteel2154 brother Bittersteel!!!!
I am splendid I hope the gods are treating you well!!
@@jeffcordova9633 Great to hear and they are treating me pretty well thank you for asking
Cutting budget of your most successful show is insane. Is beyond dumb Disney knows that The Mandalorian is their major hit and now is even doing a movie. Zaslav is gonna damage this universe
Well they're too busy funding their precious DCU and its 20-something announced projects to worry about HotD or anything that ACTUALLY MAKING MINEY RN
I don’t understand how you can get the money to make it how it deserves. Cut less important shows or movies. GOT & HOTD has to be one of the major reasons Max stays relevant. Ask for donations if you have to.
They better not short us 2 episodes in season 3
Then season 4 will have 6 episodes.
None of the battles involve Alicent or Rhaenyra so they will get 30 seconds screen time each
First. For House Blackwood
@@aegorbittersteel2154 lmao you lost the battle of the burning mill😂
I’m sure seeing bloodraven in daemon’s vision made you shit your self😂
@hat7583 Book or show that it was victory and I was booing my TV when he showed up😄
I'm not on the Bracken side but Blackwood's did not win at the mill.
I think they’re going to change the events regarding the dragonpit…
Aegons kids don’t have their dragons. During the blood and cheese event we can see they still have their eggs under their beds. This means Shrykos and Morghul aren’t alive. It’ll only be Dreamfyre and Tyraxes in the dragonpit. They could add Syrax into the pit but even then, it won’t be much of a “massacre”. Will they add Sheepstealer? Moondancer?
My fear is they keep Silverwing and Vermithor in the dragonpit and have Seasmoke go 1v1 against Tessarion. Idk I just feel like they might say screw second Tumbleton and kill a whole bunch of the dragons in the dragonpit to save money. Especially since they’re short on dragons.
which do y’all think they’ll do first the fall or the gullet ?? cause they stated aemond leaves to the riverlands in 2 days whereas the triarchy will arrive at the gullet on the morrow (2 weeks) unless they’re not going on at the same time
If they had to choose between the fall of kings landing, the battle of the gullet, and the red sowing, why would they choose the red sowing?! Feels like the least important one.
My theory, we will only get 5 battles spread out between season 3 and 4 due to budget constraints. If HBO gives us 8 episodes for season 3, and the season does very well ratings wise, the least the network is can give us an order for 10 episodes for season 4 to end the series. Let’s hope for the best.
In game of thrones many battles in the war of five kings was omitted because of budget. But in this show important characters died in each battle. I think fishfeed and Butchers ball will be merged.
The last two seasons are going to be rough from the sound of it. They'll probably do 3-6 big battles/big CGI episodes and combine/cut the rest. Hopefully, they find a way to wrap it up satisfactorily, but I have my doubts with how things are going and their track record with GoT
Doesn’t seem like they really were prepared to adapt this story. I’m not very hopeful for the next seasons.
They foolishly undercut themselves by making loads of stupid changes that make the story/characters worse. What they've done to Alicent in particular is GOT Season 8 level character assassination.
People still blame the show runners on GOT for this same type of nonsense. Look how many times theyve sold the company the past decade plus
I think the way to do all these battles is to front-load A LOT of the budget on the Battle of The Gullet, as that's the one the fans are most excited about. And then find ways to combine or work around the other battles. Don't forget the Siege of Meereen and The Battle of the Bastards was in the same episode. Hardhome, Daznak’s Pit and The Battle of Winterfell (3 significant battles) were done in the last 3 episodes of Season 5. Hardhome was the one given the most love and while the Stannis story ended poorly and the battle was worked around, they did show a battle there. They can find a way to work around all these battles. I'd extend the seasons to 10 episodes again but we will see.
‘Hm let’s stifle the largest series on Earth, yes good idea’.
With the way they paced season 2 and trimmed it down to 8 episodes, and with budget concerns in mind, I think they'd benefit from havin 5 seasons total, especially if these are going to be 8 episodes. They could maybe pull it off in 20 more episodes, but it's going to be really difficult. 3 more 10 episode seasons would give them the breathing room to fully cover what's left of the Dance and a little of its aftermath.
HBO is going to have to do what they did at the end of GOT and give out a Season 5 with 6 or 7 episodes. Which, if you’re looking to keep subscriptions isn’t the worst idea.
Season 8 PTSD is coming
It's already here
I doubt that the red kraken event will make it into the tv series. That plot line kind of belongs to Alyns storyline and i doubt that he will get one.
Haven’t read the books, what’s the red kraken event? I know who it is just not what happens involving the greyjoys
100% there will be a lot of merging knowing there will be a total of 4 seasons. So maybe S3- 1.Gullet and aftermath of Honeywine. 2. Fishfeed and Fall of Kings Landing/ Red Kraken happening at the same time. 3. Butchers Ball and First Tumbleton where we only see a short specific part of Butchers Ball where Crispin dies and when the horns are blown it switches scenes. For the rest i`m not sure but i feel like the season will end with the 2nd Tumbleton and leave the rest for season 4
I would expect Fishfeed and the Red Fork to be merged as well. The Honeywine could be scaled down as well as First Tumbleton. Butcher's Ball could be adapted as a small skirmish or merged with one of the Tumbletons. And as the King's Road battle takes place after some very important deaths, that could happen offscreen. At least that's how I see the remaining events be adapted on the remaining episode count.
Terrified, yep. This season did not bode well for them handling a shortened season/limited budgeting.
They need at least 20 more episodes for all of that.
Anything less than that would be a disaster...
The Gullet is supposed to happen before the Fall of King's Landing and honestly it would ramp up the tension better to keep it that way. With the tragedy that occurs, it would make Rhaenyra far more vengeful and hostile towards the Greens, and could turn things sour between her and Alicent very quickly.
In all likelihood we should get the Gullet in Ep 1 & Fall of KL in Ep 2, but we'll have to see. Wouldn't surprise me if they change it around but that would be a real shame I think.
I’d rather have 10 episodes with smaller budgets and fewer special effects. Look at the stories Star Trek gave us with a TV budget and 20 episodes a season.
As much as I want to see all tge battles, I also want to see how these battles deplete the dragons, how the Greens and Blacks destroy the source if their power. We need to the see the child who witnessed his mother being burned alive become the King who presided over the death of the dragons.
They're probably not even gonna do Bitterbridge.
Battle of gulet will happen of screen. Instead you'll get more scene of rheanyra and alicent having the lowest q conversation humanly possible for 20 minutes
If this season was going to be this inconclusive anyway, they should have spent more time on the Winterfell storyline…
Sounds like the show will be more “based” on the book rather than the book playing out on screen. This is a great example of your recent points about the challenges of adapting books to film
Noo fucking shit bud that's how Adaptations work
@@DatBoiChris420 sir you have sex with your truck
I think it will be fine. Because season 1 was introducing us to characters and character development, season 2 was introducing us to all the politics that was going on on both sides, and so season 3 will be about the war itself with season 4 about the aftermath
If HBO can’t fund the show for what they need THEN WHY AGREE TO MAKE THE FUCKING SHOW HBO. Like I obviously don’t understand how it works, they presented HBO with the show and the plans, they devise a budget with HBO, THAT BUDGET should be enough for the major events in the stow DUHHHHHHH how is that so hard??!! If HBO agreed to an amount and then took it away then that is beyond fucked up and they should be sued if that’s the case .
To clarify: the writers' strike affected the production of Season 2 because unlike the cast, the writers for HotD are all American and members of the WGA, so they were expressly forbidden from performing writer's duties; therefore, they couldn't sit down and rework the scripts to adjust for the shift from 10 episodes to 8.
Merges? I definitely think they'll merge the two Tumbletons into a single battle. I'm not quite, but still reasonably sure that they'll also merge the Butcher's Ball with the Fishfeed, and maybe even the Gods Eye.
As for cuts, I think the most likely is the Red Kraken. GoT butchered the Euron plot from the books, and I doubt Condal and co. are interested in introducing what will end up being a hanging plot thread. And while I don't expect them to cut the Red Fork, I think it's likely they'll treat it like the Burning Mill, or Oxcross from GoT - a single cold open scene precipitating the battle, and then a cutaway shot to the aftermath; though as I write this, I'm becoming increasingly convinced they will cut it just to have Jason Lannister at the Butcher's Ball/Fishfeed, so that we can get some Stark vs Lannister action on HotD. And keeping Jason alive and have him as part of the riverlands campaign will give Jefferson Hall more to do, since Tyland is likely going to be spending 90% of S3 either rotting in the black cells like Ned in "The Pointy End" or tortured like Theon during Season 3.
Seven Hells, why do I get the feeling season 3 is gonna suffer literally.
HBO better go up stairs to the big wigs and find the money to do the show properly HOTD is basically the only good show on HBO and needs to be prioritized over other shows if they want it to be a hit show like the original GOT. The company finds millions to do other trash content for HBO max go reallocate those funds into HOTD
I have a feeling HBO won't do this but if they did cut season 3 down to eight episodes, they could allow for an extension of runtime for each episode. I do think some of these battles will get the "aftermath" treatment of opening an episode with the aftermath of what happened and the main characters discussing the occurrence with their respective consequences.
I think we'll get the fall of Kings Landing and the battle of the Gullet in episode 1 happening at the same time. As Rhaenyra sits the throne it'll cut to Jace being dragged underwater. Episode 2 will then introduce Daeron and we'll see the battle of the honeywine. Episode 3 probably wont have a battle. Episode 4 the fish feed. Episode 5 butchers ball. Episode 6 no battle. Episode 7 first battle of Tumbleton. Episode 8 may have the gods eye for the finale.
Season 4 will have the second battle of tumbleton early on, the dragonpit and muddy mess as the story concludes.
First to take the Black 🖤
Factor into account that you’ll have to include time to see spooky Daemon side quests and and Theynayra making out with Mysaria and you’ll figure out a lot more stuff is going to get cut..
Thanks for this video. Its been my biggest gripe for not showing the gullet in season 2.. Also, why are they working on so many prequel shows when they barely have the budget to produce this one.
Dragons are dead by this era of house Targaryen. Honestly the story is cute but not really riveting. The main character is pretty much Westeros version of Forrest Gump and the other character is I guess a really young mackauley kulkin
It would have fitted well at the end. End the season with the wind taken out of rhaenyras sails.
Budget restraints are never good. I want to see everything in all its glory. Doesn’t seem plausible now sadly..
Don’t get me wrong, the ground army battles do take a chunk of the budget but not nearly as much as the dragon scenes. Ryan said they have enough budget for 2 big cinematic CGI heavy scenes per season. This would include battle of the gullet, fall of kingslanding, battle above the godseye, second Tumbleton, dragonpit massacre and Moondancer vs Sunfyre. Thats 6. How do they plan to do this in 2 more seasons. Perhaps if they had enough for 3 each season then they could do this but they don’t… and that’s without listening the ground battles.
Y’all don’t be surprised - corporations learned nothing from the demise of cable TV. We now have too many streams, with companies all throwing money at ideas, then keeping things that hit the sweet spot of “popular enough and cheap enough” while ditching better, usually more expensive) shows.
Plus nobody competent has run Warner Bros or HBO in over a decade.
Other big HBO shows went for 12-22 episodes. Ie The Sopranos, The Wire etc. Shit even Showtime shows have 12+ episodes now days, ie Billions, Ray Donovan etc..How we go from that being the normal to 10 episodes being the normal?
Compare what happens in those shows, set in the modern day, with what happens in period shows like HotD or GoT, where you have CGI dragons, fantasy locations and knights and horses, all if which cost money. Sopranos had no such issues when they could just film in Jersey. An episode like Rook's Rest alone ate up around half the budget for a season of Sopranos.
@@mihaiionita5648 yeah youre right GoT and HoTD does waaay bigger shit but why is 10 episodes even shows like Power and all spinoffs, Mayor of Kingstown, Spartacus etc ..all 10 episodes when did 10 become the norm?
@mihaiionita5648 it's pretty simple then init! If hbo doesn't have the budget then why make a half arsed attempt at the dance.... pure greed plain and simple
Do it right or don’t do it at all
They’re going to do Gullet, merge Butchers Ball with God’s Eye, and Cliffhanger on 1st Tumbleton. Reduce everything else.
"I think 4 seasons" Condal said so not even he is 100 % sure how many seasons.
They dont have the money for more than 2 big events per season so I think they will have to go for 5 seasons.
S6 of GoT was running without source material, but it was 10 episodes and was great. You can't make an ASOIAF show less than 10.episodes, apart from maybe Dunk and Egg
I imagine we’re going to get a combined Gullet/Assault on King’s Landing in the first episode where Rhaenyra will find Aegon not there. Politics will happen and word of the Gullet will reach them and that battle will take place at the end of the episode or the beginning of the second. I imagine they’ll move right into Honeywine, Tumbleton, etc in a consolidated manner. I believe God’s Eye has to happen as it’s already been brought up.
Honestly expecting 2-4 more big battles over the course of the series, and that be it. While I’d like to see everything played out like in the book, but it unfortunately won’t so I hope what action they do believe is necessary for their plot is the biggest actions scene within the work. I wouldn’t mind a battle every episode to be completely honest though. It’s not like they’ll have to spend money on dragons for Knight of the Seven Kingdoms.
it may as well be a fanfiction at this point
For real. I strongly suspect that by the end of all of this, the show will have deviated so greatly, that it will be a similar story in name only.
Made it to episode 4 before I just picked up the book maybe watch some Young and the Restless some Bold and the Beautiful. Same thing.
If they're going to have the Gullet happen pretty much simultaneously with the Fall, what does that mean for Tyland, who is now on his way to the former when he's supposed to be at the latter? Even if they had these events happening in two separate episodes it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense for him to be at both. I suppose there is one obvious way to affect a similar 'outcome' for him despite this, but making that change will rob Rhaenyra's camp of considerable agency and moral ambiguity. Not that they really have any in the show, at present; they are clearly who everyone is supposed to be rooting for.
Warner Bros Discovery and by extension, its CEO, David Zaslav, did "House Of The Dragon"'s showrunners no favours when they slashed $40 - 50 million out of the second season's production budget. HOTD is one of HBO's flagship shows. It had excellent ratings from critics, was popular with viewers as well as having increased subscriptions to HBOmax and in the process, brought back what was for all intents and purposes, a dead TV franchise (after Benioff and Weiss definitively shit the bed with "GOT'"s final season). What's the old saying about being penny wise and pound foolish, again? Right!... .
As a fan of Daeron's, we'll never get the Honeywine probably...
If only the decisions for Season 2 had been made with the story in mind. If only HBO had eaten the cost for the sakenof the art.
1st to take the Black for House Blackfyre 🗡 I hope they do the battle Justice, but I'm worried there will be a budget cut everything will be rushed or something else
If the battles cost too much why make show where the battles and dragons are the main course. There’s no way they started production without a review of what the costs would have a show of this magnitude. This show aired when eggs were about 15 bucks lol so it’s not lock they aired before inflation
I think HBO should open a go fund me for people to help them achieve their dream of more episodes millions of fans would contribute I swear to God
I can understand pushing the fall of kings landing but not the gullet. The first half of season 2 was build up for rooks rest and the second half was build up for the gullet only we never got the gullet.
Me realizing Honeywine and the Fishfeed will be completely cut :(
At least it’s not totally the writers fault. But they’re kind drooping the ball too. Fingers crossed.