The Miroku guns are amazing quality. I have their 1873 saddle ring carbine in .38spl/.357mag. It’s excellent. The original pre-64 Winchesters are real treasures. I love the ones I have the pleasure of owning.
Thank you for your side by side video. With your organization in the background I can tell you have a true passion and respect for the sport. I have no issues with a Japanese made replica, they have honoured the original design with very impressive build and finish.I have seen no video or post where owners are not in agreement.
The older I get the more respect I have for Winchester and it original creater Browning. Lately I have been collecting 94 post 30-30 and I recall a time 80's the shelves were full of them $149 brand new at a Kmart in my home town! Now 94 beaters and shooters are bringing $600!
Anything that is done in Japan, or anywhere else, can be, or was done here in the USA at one time. The moving of manufacturing to foreign countries is the result of turning Winchester, or any company, into an investment vehicle for investors instead of being an actual business. Wall Street, stock value and investor returns over focusing on the business itself, quality, customers, workers, or the USA. It's a wonder they still manufacture in Japan instead of some other cheaper country. People are people the world over, a person doesn't have to have a college degree to be good at working with their hands. Some of the most talented craftsmen in the world don't have advanced educations. I'm sure the rifles made in Japan are wonderful, but they could be just as wonderful, if not better, if there was a desire to make them here in the USA again. Pathetically, lowering the cost to manufacture while increasing the ROI (return on investment) wins out over doing what is right for US workers or the USA. Welcome to the financial economy that has ravaged the USA and now the world for the last 40 plus years.The big corporations and stock markets are all that matter.
@@ricpel9975 That's the way it really is. Couldn’t say it better. I must honestly say that I prefer an American or European Winchester clone, made by professionals who stand for their product and custumors, and not primarily for the shareholders. Let the steel maybe a little less of quality, it was or is not bad at all. My Chiappa 1892 has more character to me than a Japanese Winchester. It's sad that Winchester sold their pride and craftsmanship a few years ago. Winchester should have stayed in the States, at least out of respect for tradition and craftsmen. I am from Austria...by the way.
Yes Jeff, the Japanese are meticulous. The Japanese vehicles are far better than the Detroit junk. I used to be a real Honda fan, but now since the Civic is the only Honda available without a stupidmatic transmission I will stick with the concept that it is best to buy something good and take good care of it. My 1990 Honda Accord EX looks great and still has the original clutch in it. I wouldn't part with it for anything in the world.
Jeff, the Japanese became meticulous with the help of an American. After Japan learned that they could not conquer the world with war, they had to find another way. The United States sent an economist by the name of Dr. David Deming and he taught them "statistical economics." Now they are out to conquer the world by marketing superior products. I love a peaceful solution.
@@arrlmember Marketing superior .... ? Well, as if it is just that. Conquer the world? The Japanese Winchester may be technically a bit higher quality, but for me there is more to it. You can see and feel that when you compare both guns. Everyone experiences it differently. The Miroku may be more perfect, as it were, it lacks the character of the original 1892 Winchester as far as I'm concerned. Small details also play a role in this. That’s one of the reasons I choose the Chiappa rather than the Miroku.
Honestly, given the state of quality from many larger “USA made” gun makers (glares at kimber), being made in Japan is probably the best thing for these rifles right now
wow . the boys in japan sure showed the american's how to build a firearm..fit and finish a hands down winner better steel than the old ones too can take much higher pressure !!
You're thinking too much John. I don't think such cometary can apply to a rifle made in 1894. Winchester was powered by steam back then. Now, you'd be closer to compare a 94 made in 2003 to these new Miroku guns, although the Miroku rifles are 2x the price. I'm somewhat surprised a machine shop hasn't tooled up to build classic 92's and 94s how they were meant to be built. Yes, could very easily compete with Miroku on these models.
Very nice 👍. The classic was awesome. The new one is also very nice but I wish they offered a full octagon. I like a Tang sight so I have been looking at cimarron made by pedersoli. I hear a lot of good things about them and I don't hear anything bad they seem to build a really nice classic reproduction. Thanks for sharing both of your rifles are very nice 👍
G. my 1873 clone was made in Italy. The only difference between it and a real one is the metric threads on the screws. The longer grip frame on the Italian made 1860 Army fit perfectly and give you something to hold on to.
I have a similar story. It involves an 1894 made in 1895, early 30-30. It belonged to my great uncle, who sold it to my father when he was fourteen for twenty five bucks. Shot my first and only White Tail with it. Still in my gun safe. I have two of the Japanese Miroku's. An 1866 Deluxe model and an 1873 rifle. Very well made rifles. And no external saveties. They do some great work
In the late '50's & early 60's there was a very popular trend to convert '92 Winchester .32-20's to .357 Magnum & then pair it with a good Colt SA or a Great Western also in .357 & I was guilty of that on 3 different occasions. (Gun Parts Corporation even sold a complete kit including the barrel to make such a conversion.) Often the same up-calibering went on with the old .32-20 SAA's but it was often cheaper to just buy a Second Generation Colt (not to mention that it saved the collectors some hair!) However the handy carbine paired with a good .357 was quite a treasure to shooters, abundantly accurate & a pure joy to plink with! So many were converted that a visit to the Mountain Oyster Restaurant which was connected to the Cattle Men's Association (in Southern Arizona) & had a rack so that one could check the Various Single Actions & Carbines (they served Beer & Wine so you had to check your firearms at the door;) the .357's paired with similarly chambered Carbines were the rule not the exception (that was back in the heyday of the T.V. Westerns.) Although they had very stiff competition by the many fine Colt .44 & .45 SA's & '94 Winchester .30-30's that the Cattle men had collected & carried regularly! I'd go with Gus Ashcraft (Rancho Gustavo in Sasabe) & spent more time looking at the guns than eating... Unfortunately I traded all of the .357 parings off & now I ride a Quad' with a hot loaded Smith & Wesson 4" .44 Special Model of 1950 jammed in the back pocket of my Levi's & a Winchester '94 Legendary Lawman (Trapper) .30-30 in a nylon scabbard across the front handlebar. I keep thinking I should put together another similarly chambered SAA & '92 or '94 or a Marlin along with some good leather, but the .32-20's are so rare & expensive now, seems so many were converted they have gotten quite rare!
I should add that my son carries a Mossberg 500 12 Gauge pump on his quad along with a Springfield .45 ACP 1911A1 on his side (Marine) & that my grandson carries a Glock 40 S&W with an AR15, but that seems all too common now days! I'm too old to learn new tricks...
Very good. The reason behind the Winchester Model 1892 was the Marlin Model 1889. The Marlin was much more advanced than the Winchester Model 1873. Winchester needed a new rifle to compete against the Marlin.
nice video. very nice original!! I know you are proud to have that passed down and all. I have a Miroku Winchester Trapper/Takedown in 357 mag that i am proud of. Would like to have an original 1892 someday!!
Wow, I would definitely get one in 357.....but for now I had purchased a Rossi r92 38/357 , 16 barrel ,.....the triple black ......it cycles smoothly out of the box........but I would really like a traditional copy like that. Thank-you for the video.
@@easttexan2933 No, better metal , better machining, modern technology made a better rifle, Miroku has been making rifles for a long time and the Japanese are meticulous, it's where all the other 1892's get their parts
@@Tempusverum I can't comment on the newer guns as I've never actually cycled one or even held one but I have owned many pre64 Mod 94 and 64's and currently still have my Mod 70 with a 1948 serial number. Now you talk about a smooth buttery action. Very accurate.
I've heard that, and I'd say could be true. Now, I've handled quite a few 94's and some of the vintage rifles are very well crafted. Seems to vary over time.
I have one many of the original winchesters, one is an extra fancy special order. The blueing, wood, fit and finish are second to none and the new ones stamped “japan” are a fair replica but not in the same class. Let’s be honest. I have many old Winchesters and colts and I’m not afraid shoot them all, I just don’t drag them thru the woods.
It is interesting that the Browning/Japanese Moroku Model 92s do not have safety's installed. Must have something to do with lawsuits and legal departments. Same with the 1886's, my high end light weight Winchester has the tang safety but my two Browning 1886's do not, even though they were similar vintages.
I do not speculate in the gun market. I own a modern 1894 Winchester in .45 LC. It is a defensive weapon that fires everytime I pull the trigger. It is also reasonably accurate to about 100 yrs. If I shot anyone at that range I would have some explaining to do.
Decent guns the new Miroku rifles, Browning used to sell a 1892 that was a Miroku without the safetys but it was discontinued. They still were slightly out of spec and not identical as an original. Miroku rifles tend to be very stiff when new and slightly proud when it comes to wood fitment. The one and ONLY Company that make an 1892 that is absolutely 100% identical to an original 1892 Winchester is Chiappa of Italy imported through Cimarron and Taylor's (although lately they are always either discontinued, out of stock, or on back order). Importation of guns and gun parts under this current administration has grinded to a halt. The quality of the finishes and fitment of Chiappa is top notch especially in recent years and clearly better than any budget offerings. They are pricey though for a replica. Around $1200-1400. The quality is worth it though. Plus at least Italy is a true Constitutional Republic, almost exactly like us, instead of a Constitutional Monarchy that doesn't even give their people a direct vote for Prime Minister. I just can't bring myself to purchase a gun from a Country that is so freedomless. Winchester name or not, I just won't do it especially since these rifles are a good chunk of Change. Yeah the Chiappa rifles aren't American, but at least they are made in a real Republic even if they still don't have fair election representation.
Nice pair of Winchester's you have there. I have a couple Miroku/Winchester Model 1892 Short Rifles also. One's chambered in .357mag/.38 special, the other in .44 mag/special. I love the Model 1892, it's strong, compact, and light weight. I agree with you that Miroku Winchester's will never have a collector value anywhere near what original Winchester's do, but I don't buy firearms to collect, I buy them to shoot!!! (I do keep all of my firearms maintained and spotless after every use). What brand of leather lever wrap is that on your late model 92? I like the look and the way it fits the lever loop. Thank you for the video. I own many modern firearms, but IMO nothing compares to a lever action rifle.
@@younglava762, no it's not. I kind of wish it was, but it's not a make or break deal for me. The only feature a Miroku Winchester 1892 has that I don't like is the rebounding hammer, but I eliminated this feature in mine a couple months ago. The tang safety still operates and functions exactly as it did before the modification, but the trigger is much better and it cycles so much easier/smoother than it did with the factory rebounding hammer/stiffer hammer spring. A Miroku Winchester is a great rifle. It's hard for me to envision where, or how, an original 1892 could have been of any higher quality. The Browning B92 version Miroku built in the 1980's (I think) is probably the ultimate Winchester 1892 because it didn't vary from the original design.
@@dogbone1358, from all I've read, yes. Chiappa 1892's are supposedly built to exact (original) Winchester spec's. Miroku Winchester 1892's have a rebounding hammer, multi-piece firing pin, and tang safety, none of which are on an original Winchester Model 1892. I eliminated the rebounding hammer, but I also eliminated a dangerous situation this modification can lead to if only the "tang" on the rebounding hammer strut is removed. There is a half-cock notch cut into the hammer of a Miroku Winchester 1892, but the Miroku sear used for their rebounding hammer design will not properly engage the half cock notch in the hammer. The hammer can still be pulled back to the half-cock notch, but pulling the trigger will allow the hammer to drop, striking the firing pin (there's not a great deal of force generated from dropping a hammer from the half-cock notch, but enough that I can't trust it won't ignite the primer and certainly not enough to consider the half-cock notch as a safety....as original 1892 half-cock notches are designed to be). My fix; I purchased a second (exact) hammer from Numerich and completely filed away the half-cock notch so the sear releases from full cock position and will fall until it hits the firing pin. I use only the sliding tang safety on my Miroku 1892 as the "safety"(just as it was intended to be from the factory as designed by Miroku). So now my Miroku Winchester 1892 Short Rifle does not have the rebounding hammer, and as an added benefit this allowed me to use a lighter weight hammer spring and still have 100% ignition reliability. A lighter weight hammer spring also makes cycling the lever and bolt both lighter and smoother because it takes significantly less pressure/effort to cock the hammer. It's now light enough to consistantly cycle the lever/bolt to feed and eject rounds with the use of one finger. The lever can easily be cycled from the fired position without moving the butt plate from it's position on my shoulder. I can keep my head and eyes in a position to continuously align the front and rear sights for a follow up shot. Doug Turnbull will recut the sear and/or hammer so that they work as a traditional half-cock safety, weld in the tang area after removing the tang safety, and color case harden the receiver and lever (he might also include color case hardening the butt plate and forearm nose cap or barrel band, but I'm not sure about these items). Doug Turnbell charges (or at least did last January 2020) $1200.00 to do this work. For this price they do nothing to address the rebounding hammer, heavy trigger pull, or and heavy cycling effort that Miroku Winchester 1892's are famous (infamous?) for. Doug Turnbull has a reputation for producing excellent work worldwide. I love his work and firearms. The price his business quotes is quite reasonable considering the color case hardening they do is a "real" or "true" color case hardening process which is produced in a furnace in conjunction with crushed bone. Most manufacturers use an acid bath they dip the part in, but this process only changes the color and has no hardening properties. Sorry for my long winded answer.
I have several Winchesters that are pre WWI… I believe WWI to be the end of the cowboy era… Winchester still made some decent rifles afterwards… I’ve seen many of the Japanese built rifles and they are nice, but I would never own one. I would rather have a Uberti, as they are much closer to the original design, yet not quite the quality of the Japanese rifles… thanks for the side by side comparison, nice video. 👍
@@billbarber3253 try taylor firearms they are the importer check their website for a dealer in your area I live in Massachusetts and had to order it from a dealer in new Hampshire I speicial ordered it with a octagon barrel and the large loop
@@billbarber3253 Some online retailers will list Chiappa as Taylor and Co, which is the importer. I got one a few months ago from ClassicFirearms.com who listed it that way.
Well now that all of the Old World fine gun smithing and production has been stripped away from Hartford Conn, the Japanese production 1892 remains as the most sensible source for these fine rifles. The lack of a American Winchester production rifle presents a golden opportunity for another American boutique firearms firm to ret-create such a firearms once again!
Though I have a number of Miroku rifles and they are high quality, I just can’t get over that ugly safety. Fortunately they didn’t do that to their 66 and 73 rifles, but their 86 and 92… just a shame imho.
Hello Very nice vidéo ! I' m sorry but i' m french and i speak american very a little. Your modern winchester miroku it is 45 colt or 44 mag ? Thank you
Elle est calibrée en 45 colt, il le dit dans la vidéo. Personnellement j’ai une Chiappa take down 92 en 20 inches et une ranger 94 big loop Winchester d’origine en 18 inches. Les deux sont en 44 mag et sont très précises à 50 et 100 m. Les produits Miroku sont d’excellentes qualité.
Jeramy Whitwell Have a friend at the range with one of those, its a beautiful rifle, really pretty, but he has had some issues with it. Plus I’ve read of alot of issues with them unfortunately. I was dead set on that rifle but after all the bad press I read I backed off.
@@theeasternfront6436 Thanks for the heads up. A pistol caliber lever action is kinda far down the ever growing wish list anyway. Maybe Henry can make an All weather side loader eventually.
Eastern Front - The newer Winchesters and Marlins have a useless crossbolt safety that is difficult to determine if it is on or not. The tang safety is a better idea. Henry uses a transfer bar (like in revolvers.) The only problem I can see in the transfer bar is that one will wonder why the half cock safety is not there. It's like putting someone that knows how to drive in a car with an automatic transmission "How do you control this thing?"
Sir, excellent video and very professionally made. I appreciate the level of detail and the shots of the various areas of the rifle. I have a question, you have a beautiful leather wrap around the bottom of the lever, where do you get that or did you do that yourself? I agree Miroku quality is high. Thank you for your expertise and time.
Hi Nelson. don't know if anyone has answered your question, so here goes. Even though i live in Australia, the best lever wrap kit is from Diamond Leather in Alaska. Much closer to you than me. The kit comes complete for $20.00 bucks or so. hope the link helps. Cheers Link: www.diamonddcustomleather.com/products/leather-lever-wrap
Thanks, after reviewing the options, I purchased that exact wrap (Diamond). I have yet to install. I never found a Winchester to purchase, so after months of searching, I purchased a Rossi R92 (closest I could get to a Winchester). I like it (stainless steel and Brazilian hardwood). Not a Winchester, but half the price.
From Winchester. www.winchesterguns.com/content/dam/winchester-repeating-arms/support/faq/serial-number-reference/Winchester-Manufacture-Dates-by-Year-2012-Scanned-Documents.pdf
They're your guns...but seriously, gloves, white gloves at that. I do know some guitar players who swear their hands secret more corrosive chemicals than what might be considered normal.
If you like them to have a barrel band, then you would be looking to get the saddle ring carbine. Winchester still produces them. www.winchesterguns.com/products/rifles/model-1892/model-1892-current-products.html
After sighting in at 60 feet, I could easily cover 5 shots with a nickel ruclips.net/user/postUgkxQt2uORDRfFOVSrO4idv4B90ThT6EOnEL ! Truly a pleasure to shoot! Scope was easy to adjust for eye relief. Only problem the varmints must have seen it delivered lol!Update: So impressed with shot groups at 30 yards I purchased a Hammers 3×9 with adjustable Objective scope! Now a true nail driver!
Handled one of the new Winchesters and putting aside the obvious, that it will never EVER live up to an original pre 64 Winchester, they are decent as long as the tang safety doesn't bother you. It will most of the time though because the safety is in such A bad location. I'd honestly prefer a cheap Rossi and their safety switch mounted on top than a Miroku with a switch that is directly in the same exact spot where the palm of your hand is supposed to go. Very ugly solution and poor place for a safety. The Stock finish on the new Winchester is also always dull.
Always makes me sad when I hear people talking about shooting foxes, bobcats and coyotes. Beautiful animals that are no threat to humans. If you take precautions, they won't harm stock either. Knowing this reinforces my opinion that our species has nothing to offer the universe. We are a trash species. All we do is consume and destroy.
Unfortunately these older Winchester do not possess the metallurgy of 21st century steels nor are these chambered in then powerful modern cartridges such as .44 and .357 magnum!
Japanese Winchester? Why do you badmouth Henry whose motto is "Made in America or not made at all." I go agree that the tang safety is easier to see what position it is in than the useless crossbolt safety, but the half cock safety is tried and true. Henry uses a transfer bar in their centerfire lever guns, which does work for the incompetents that can't get around without an automatic transmission. Cars or guns, we need to LEARN how to use them before pretending that we know how to safely handle them.
The Henry is a fine rifle, but it is the original design of the Henry rifle that makes it technically and operationally inferior to all other succeeding American lever-action rifles.
Why are the japanese versions so much money considering they are licensed copies of Winchesters and are modified to add the safety features? Just seems like they are pretty far from an actual modern day Winchester. That 1914 however, is beautiful.
The Miroku guns are amazing quality. I have their 1873 saddle ring carbine in .38spl/.357mag. It’s excellent. The original pre-64 Winchesters are real treasures. I love the ones I have the pleasure of owning.
may i ask if you still have them? does the mag fall out line on rossi pumas?
Thank you for your side by side video. With your organization in the background I can tell you have a true passion and respect for the sport. I have no issues with a Japanese made replica, they have honoured the original design with very impressive build and finish.I have seen no video or post where owners are not in agreement.
The older I get the more respect I have for Winchester and it original creater Browning. Lately I have been collecting 94 post 30-30 and I recall a time 80's the shelves were full of them $149 brand new at a Kmart in my home town! Now 94 beaters and shooters are bringing $600!
I picked up a Chiappa /Taylor n co. Alaskan take down chambered in .357mag 16” carbine. It’s a true 1892 design, very nice shooter.
I just bought a new Winchester 1892 in .357 Magnum with a large loop. The quality is amazing, fantastic rifle!
CaliPatriot88 nice. What price ?
@@u.p.woodtick3296 I get stuff at cost through my work so what I paid is not what you will pay.
Japanese are meticulous and the metal is higher quality than it used to be, it's better than an old rifle
Anything that is done in Japan, or anywhere else, can be, or was done here in the USA at one time. The moving of manufacturing to foreign countries is the result of turning Winchester, or any company, into an investment vehicle for investors instead of being an actual business. Wall Street, stock value and investor returns over focusing on the business itself, quality, customers, workers, or the USA. It's a wonder they still manufacture in Japan instead of some other cheaper country. People are people the world over, a person doesn't have to have a college degree to be good at working with their hands. Some of the most talented craftsmen in the world don't have advanced educations. I'm sure the rifles made in Japan are wonderful, but they could be just as wonderful, if not better, if there was a desire to make them here in the USA again. Pathetically, lowering the cost to manufacture while increasing the ROI (return on investment) wins out over doing what is right for US workers or the USA. Welcome to the financial economy that has ravaged the USA and now the world for the last 40 plus years.The big corporations and stock markets are all that matter.
@@ricpel9975 That's the way it really is. Couldn’t say it better. I must honestly say that I prefer an American or European Winchester clone, made by professionals who stand for their product and custumors, and not primarily for the shareholders. Let the steel maybe a little less of quality, it was or is not bad at all. My Chiappa 1892 has more character to me than a Japanese Winchester. It's sad that Winchester sold their pride and craftsmanship a few years ago. Winchester should have stayed in the States, at least out of respect for tradition and craftsmen. I am from Austria...by the way.
Yes Jeff, the Japanese are meticulous. The Japanese vehicles are far better than the Detroit junk. I used to be a real Honda fan, but now since the Civic is the only Honda available without a stupidmatic transmission I will stick with the concept that it is best to buy something good and take good care of it. My 1990 Honda Accord EX looks great and still has the original clutch in it. I wouldn't part with it for anything in the world.
Jeff, the Japanese became meticulous with the help of an American. After Japan learned that they could not conquer the world with war, they had to find another way. The United States sent an economist by the name of Dr. David Deming and he taught them "statistical economics." Now they are out to conquer the world by marketing superior products. I love a peaceful solution.
@@arrlmember Marketing superior .... ? Well, as if it is just that. Conquer the world? The Japanese Winchester may be technically a bit higher quality, but for me there is more to it. You can see and feel that when you compare both guns. Everyone experiences it differently. The Miroku may be more perfect, as it were, it lacks the character of the original 1892 Winchester as far as I'm concerned. Small details also play a role in this. That’s one of the reasons I choose the Chiappa rather than the Miroku.
Honestly, given the state of quality from many larger “USA made” gun makers (glares at kimber), being made in Japan is probably the best thing for these rifles right now
wow . the boys in japan sure showed the american's how to build a firearm..fit and finish a hands down winner better steel than the old ones too can take much higher pressure !!
You're thinking too much John.
I don't think such cometary can apply to a rifle made in 1894. Winchester was powered by steam back then.
Now, you'd be closer to compare a 94 made in 2003 to these new Miroku guns, although the Miroku rifles are 2x the price. I'm somewhat surprised a machine shop hasn't tooled up to build classic 92's and 94s how they were meant to be built. Yes, could very easily compete with Miroku on these models.
Very nice 👍. The classic was awesome. The new one is also very nice but I wish they offered a full octagon. I like a Tang sight so I have been looking at cimarron made by pedersoli. I hear a lot of good things about them and I don't hear anything bad they seem to build a really nice classic reproduction. Thanks for sharing both of your rifles are very nice 👍
I had the 1873 in 357 from Japan and it was beautiful like the 1892 you have there.
G. my 1873 clone was made in Italy. The only difference between it and a real one is the metric threads on the screws. The longer grip frame on the Italian made 1860 Army fit perfectly and give you something to hold on to.
My 1892 rifle was also made in 1914, but round barrel and in 38-40. Very pleasant to shoot.
I have a similar story. It involves an 1894 made in 1895, early 30-30. It belonged to my great uncle, who sold it to my father when he was fourteen for twenty five bucks. Shot my first and only White Tail with it. Still in my gun safe. I have two of the Japanese Miroku's. An 1866 Deluxe model and an 1873 rifle. Very well made rifles. And no external saveties. They do some great work
My 1892 was made in 1894 and looks to be the same as yours, caliber, octagon barrel, etc. Mine also has been in the family since new.
I have the Browning version from the 80's, a B-92. Also a Miroku, excellent workmanship.
In the late '50's & early 60's there was a very popular trend to convert '92 Winchester .32-20's to .357 Magnum & then pair it with a good Colt SA or a Great Western also in .357 & I was guilty of that on 3 different occasions. (Gun Parts Corporation even sold a complete kit including the barrel to make such a conversion.) Often the same up-calibering went on with the old .32-20 SAA's but it was often cheaper to just buy a Second Generation Colt (not to mention that it saved the collectors some hair!) However the handy carbine paired with a good .357 was quite a treasure to shooters, abundantly accurate & a pure joy to plink with! So many were converted that a visit to the Mountain Oyster Restaurant which was connected to the Cattle Men's Association (in Southern Arizona) & had a rack so that one could check the Various Single Actions & Carbines (they served Beer & Wine so you had to check your firearms at the door;) the .357's paired with similarly chambered Carbines were the rule not the exception (that was back in the heyday of the T.V. Westerns.) Although they had very stiff competition by the many fine Colt .44 & .45 SA's & '94 Winchester .30-30's that the Cattle men had collected & carried regularly! I'd go with Gus Ashcraft (Rancho Gustavo in Sasabe) & spent more time looking at the guns than eating... Unfortunately I traded all of the .357 parings off & now I ride a Quad' with a hot loaded Smith & Wesson 4" .44 Special Model of 1950 jammed in the back pocket of my Levi's & a Winchester '94 Legendary Lawman (Trapper) .30-30 in a nylon scabbard across the front handlebar. I keep thinking I should put together another similarly chambered SAA & '92 or '94 or a Marlin along with some good leather, but the .32-20's are so rare & expensive now, seems so many were converted they have gotten quite rare!
I should add that my son carries a Mossberg 500 12 Gauge pump on his quad along with a Springfield .45 ACP 1911A1 on his side (Marine) & that my grandson carries a Glock 40 S&W with an AR15, but that seems all too common now days! I'm too old to learn new tricks...
Very good. The reason behind the Winchester Model 1892 was the Marlin Model 1889. The Marlin was much more advanced than the Winchester Model 1873. Winchester needed a new rifle to compete against the Marlin.
Marlin was ahead on some models. For example when browning made the 1886 big bore. marlin already had the 1881 in 45-70.
nice video. very nice original!! I know you are proud to have that passed down and all. I have a Miroku Winchester Trapper/Takedown in 357 mag that i am proud of. Would like to have an original 1892 someday!!
Wow, I would definitely get one in 357.....but for now I had purchased a Rossi r92 38/357 , 16 barrel ,.....the triple black ......it cycles smoothly out of the box........but I would really like a traditional copy like that. Thank-you for the video.
Mine is the Browning B-92 from the mid 80's. Also built by Miroku. Exceptional quality.
And, my B-92 has no safety except the half cock, like the original.
I have a Miruku Winchester m 52 sporter. I love it. Could never afford an original one.
I’m no expert, but it has been my experience that anything made in Japan is of very high quality.
I like the leather lever cover 👍
Anything Winchester built after 1964 will never have a collector's value. Your original 92 is a real treasure.
but the newer rifle is higher quality
@@jeffdunlap2754 you're kidding right?
@@easttexan2933 No, better metal , better machining, modern technology made a better rifle, Miroku has been making rifles for a long time and the Japanese are meticulous, it's where all the other 1892's get their parts
Jeff Dunlap The Japanese version is smooth as butter. But having a vintage Winchester is to have a piece of history, so would be worth more on market.
@@Tempusverum I can't comment on the newer guns as I've never actually cycled one or even held one but I have owned many pre64 Mod 94 and 64's and currently still have my Mod 70 with a 1948 serial number. Now you talk about a smooth buttery action. Very accurate.
Got two 1894's 2535. Made 1905. And a 30 30. Made 1907. Great condition .both 26"octagon barrels.
These are actually suppose to be better tolerance than originals
They are. I have a Browning B92 which was also made by Miroku but minus the lawyer shit. The guns are very high quality.
@@MrSloika Yes I also have a b92 made in 1978 in 44 mag, super super accurate too.
I've heard that, and I'd say could be true. Now, I've handled quite a few 94's and some of the vintage rifles are very well crafted. Seems to vary over time.
Love those old Winchesters. Thanks.
I have one many of the original winchesters, one is an extra fancy special order. The blueing, wood, fit and finish are second to none and the new ones stamped “japan” are a fair replica but not in the same class. Let’s be honest. I have many old Winchesters and colts and I’m not afraid shoot them all, I just don’t drag them thru the woods.
no better long gun. even the new mod.are excellent. it urkes me to see them made overseas, but they are made well
I hear you, but at least it's made in Japan!
It is interesting that the Browning/Japanese Moroku Model 92s do not have safety's installed. Must have something to do with lawsuits and legal departments. Same with the 1886's, my high end light weight Winchester has the tang safety but my two Browning 1886's do not, even though they were similar vintages.
I do not speculate in the gun market. I own a modern 1894 Winchester in .45 LC. It is a defensive weapon that fires everytime I pull the trigger. It is also reasonably accurate to about 100 yrs. If I shot anyone at that range I would have some explaining to do.
Decent guns the new Miroku rifles, Browning used to sell a 1892 that was a Miroku without the safetys but it was discontinued. They still were slightly out of spec and not identical as an original. Miroku rifles tend to be very stiff when new and slightly proud when it comes to wood fitment.
The one and ONLY Company that make an 1892 that is absolutely 100% identical to an original 1892 Winchester is Chiappa of Italy imported through Cimarron and Taylor's (although lately they are always either discontinued, out of stock, or on back order). Importation of guns and gun parts under this current administration has grinded to a halt. The quality of the finishes and fitment of Chiappa is top notch especially in recent years and clearly better than any budget offerings. They are pricey though for a replica. Around $1200-1400. The quality is worth it though.
Plus at least Italy is a true Constitutional Republic, almost exactly like us, instead of a Constitutional Monarchy that doesn't even give their people a direct vote for Prime Minister. I just can't bring myself to purchase a gun from a Country that is so freedomless. Winchester name or not, I just won't do it especially since these rifles are a good chunk of Change. Yeah the Chiappa rifles aren't American, but at least they are made in a real Republic even if they still don't have fair election representation.
No saddle rings on either weapon. Were the rings only the carbines?
Yes, the rings were only on the carbines.
My Browning-92 does not have a tang or crossbolt safety. I paid 1300usd for it. Serial number PY says made in 82.
Nice pair of Winchester's you have there.
I have a couple Miroku/Winchester Model 1892 Short Rifles also. One's chambered in .357mag/.38 special, the other in .44 mag/special.
I love the Model 1892, it's strong, compact, and light weight.
I agree with you that Miroku Winchester's will never have a collector value anywhere near what original Winchester's do, but I don't buy firearms to collect, I buy them to shoot!!! (I do keep all of my firearms maintained and spotless after every use).
What brand of leather lever wrap is that on your late model 92?
I like the look and the way it fits the lever loop.
Thank you for the video.
I own many modern firearms, but IMO nothing compares to a lever action rifle.
That miroku is still an heirloom that you pass down to your kids.
Would that happen to be the take down model you have in .44?
@@younglava762, no it's not. I kind of wish it was, but it's not a make or break deal for me.
The only feature a Miroku Winchester 1892 has that I don't like is the rebounding hammer, but I eliminated this feature in mine a couple months ago.
The tang safety still operates and functions exactly as it did before the modification, but the trigger is much better and it cycles so much easier/smoother than it did with the factory rebounding hammer/stiffer hammer spring.
A Miroku Winchester is a great rifle.
It's hard for me to envision where, or how, an original 1892 could have been of any higher quality.
The Browning B92 version Miroku built in the 1980's (I think) is probably the ultimate Winchester 1892 because it didn't vary from the original design.
@@DPMConnacht Someone here said the Chiappa was more original than the Miroku. Who’s right?
@@dogbone1358, from all I've read, yes. Chiappa 1892's are supposedly built to exact (original) Winchester spec's.
Miroku Winchester 1892's have a rebounding hammer, multi-piece firing pin, and tang safety, none of which are on an original Winchester Model 1892.
I eliminated the rebounding hammer, but I also eliminated a dangerous situation this modification can lead to if only the "tang" on the rebounding hammer strut is removed.
There is a half-cock notch cut into the hammer of a Miroku Winchester 1892, but the Miroku sear used for their rebounding hammer design will not properly engage the half cock notch in the hammer.
The hammer can still be pulled back to the half-cock notch, but pulling the trigger will allow the hammer to drop, striking the firing pin (there's not a great deal of force generated from dropping a hammer from the half-cock notch, but enough that I can't trust it won't ignite the primer and certainly not enough to consider the half-cock notch as a safety....as original 1892 half-cock notches are designed to be).
My fix;
I purchased a second (exact) hammer from Numerich and completely filed away the half-cock notch so the sear releases from full cock position and will fall until it hits the firing pin.
I use only the sliding tang safety on my Miroku 1892 as the "safety"(just as it was intended to be from the factory as designed by Miroku).
So now my Miroku Winchester 1892 Short Rifle does not have the rebounding hammer, and as an added benefit this allowed me to use a lighter weight hammer spring and still have 100% ignition reliability.
A lighter weight hammer spring also makes cycling the lever and bolt both lighter and smoother because it takes significantly less pressure/effort to cock the hammer. It's now light enough to consistantly cycle the lever/bolt to feed and eject rounds with the use of one finger.
The lever can easily be cycled from the fired position without moving the butt plate from it's position on my shoulder.
I can keep my head and eyes in a position to continuously align the front and rear sights for a follow up shot.
Doug Turnbull will recut the sear and/or hammer so that they work as a traditional half-cock safety, weld in the tang area after removing the tang safety, and color case harden the receiver and lever (he might also include color case hardening the butt plate and forearm nose cap or barrel band, but I'm not sure about these items).
Doug Turnbell charges (or at least did last January 2020) $1200.00 to do this work.
For this price they do nothing to address the rebounding hammer, heavy trigger pull, or and heavy cycling effort that Miroku Winchester 1892's are famous (infamous?) for.
Doug Turnbull has a reputation for producing excellent work worldwide. I love his work and firearms.
The price his business quotes is quite reasonable considering the color case hardening they do is a "real" or "true" color case hardening process which is produced in a furnace in conjunction with crushed bone.
Most manufacturers use an acid bath they dip the part in, but this process only changes the color and has no hardening properties.
Sorry for my long winded answer.
What are your thoughts on the rebounding hammer? I know some folks can’t abide by it, but I don’t quite understand why. Thanks
You have a new subscriber and I did very much enjoy the video and appreciate the way your shop looks and the way you handle your firearms 👍
I have several Winchesters that are pre WWI… I believe WWI to be the end of the cowboy era… Winchester still made some decent rifles afterwards… I’ve seen many of the Japanese built rifles and they are nice, but I would never own one. I would rather have a Uberti, as they are much closer to the original design, yet not quite the quality of the Japanese rifles… thanks for the side by side comparison, nice video. 👍
I purchased a chiappa 1892 clone it is more original than the Japanese Winchesters
Where can I find one ?
Regards Bill in Florida
@@billbarber3253 try taylor firearms they are the importer check their website for a dealer in your area I live in Massachusetts and had to order it from a dealer in new Hampshire I speicial ordered it with a octagon barrel and the large loop
@@billbarber3253 Some online retailers will list Chiappa as Taylor and Co, which is the importer. I got one a few months ago from ClassicFirearms.com who listed it that way.
I'm a big fan of the Chiappa. Like you say, it's almost completely true to the original and top quality.
Your 92 looks like it has be refinished?
Well now that all of the Old World fine gun smithing and production has been stripped away from Hartford Conn, the Japanese production 1892 remains as the most sensible source for these fine rifles. The lack of a American Winchester production rifle presents a golden opportunity for another American boutique firearms firm to ret-create such a firearms once again!
Sir, can you tell me where to buy it and the price of the gun?
Though I have a number of Miroku rifles and they are high quality, I just can’t get over that ugly safety. Fortunately they didn’t do that to their 66 and 73 rifles, but their 86 and 92… just a shame imho.
Hello
Very nice vidéo !
I' m sorry but i' m french and i speak american very a little.
Your modern winchester miroku it is 45 colt or 44 mag ?
Thank you
Elle est calibrée en 45 colt, il le dit dans la vidéo.
Personnellement j’ai une Chiappa take down 92 en 20 inches et une ranger 94 big loop Winchester d’origine en 18 inches.
Les deux sont en 44 mag et sont très précises à 50 et 100 m.
Les produits Miroku sont d’excellentes qualité.
@@1745fred
Salut Fred
Merci beaucoup pour ce retour.
Bonne continuation à toi.
A+
I love Japanese built firearms
32-20, is my favorite caliber.
Thank you for this video. I’ve been trying to pick a new made model 92. Been looking at the mirokus, the ubertis etc. Not to sure about that safety.
A Chiappa Alaskan takedown 1892 with a 20" barrel is about as good as it gets imo.
Jeramy Whitwell Have a friend at the range with one of those, its a beautiful rifle, really pretty, but he has had some issues with it. Plus I’ve read of alot of issues with them unfortunately. I was dead set on that rifle but after all the bad press I read I backed off.
@@theeasternfront6436 Thanks for the heads up. A pistol caliber lever action is kinda far down the ever growing wish list anyway. Maybe Henry can make an All weather side loader eventually.
Jeramy Whitwell They are coming I believe. Nice little rifles. Great triggers.
Think I might end up with an uberti.
Eastern Front - The newer Winchesters and Marlins have a useless crossbolt safety that is difficult to determine if it is on or not. The tang safety is a better idea. Henry uses a transfer bar (like in revolvers.) The only problem I can see in the transfer bar is that one will wonder why the half cock safety is not there. It's like putting someone that knows how to drive in a car with an automatic transmission "How do you control this thing?"
Where did you purchase a Japanese one? I can’t find them anywhere.
Trappers are usually 16”. Isn’t the Miroku a 20”? Or did I hear you wrong… were you saying “tracker”?
Sir, excellent video and very professionally made. I appreciate the level of detail and the shots of the various areas of the rifle. I have a question, you have a beautiful leather wrap around the bottom of the lever, where do you get that or did you do that yourself? I agree Miroku quality is high. Thank you for your expertise and time.
Hi Nelson. don't know if anyone has answered your question, so here goes. Even though i live in Australia, the best lever wrap kit is from Diamond Leather in Alaska. Much closer to you than me. The kit comes complete for $20.00 bucks or so. hope the link helps. Cheers Link: www.diamonddcustomleather.com/products/leather-lever-wrap
Thanks, after reviewing the options, I purchased that exact wrap (Diamond). I have yet to install. I never found a Winchester to purchase, so after months of searching, I purchased a Rossi R92 (closest I could get to a Winchester). I like it (stainless steel and Brazilian hardwood). Not a Winchester, but half the price.
What’s the barrel length?
Where do you get the info for what year your original gun was built? I have an 1892 38-40. Thanks
From Winchester. www.winchesterguns.com/content/dam/winchester-repeating-arms/support/faq/serial-number-reference/Winchester-Manufacture-Dates-by-Year-2012-Scanned-Documents.pdf
Here's another source. www.proofhouse.com/
My choice is the Rossi 92 CBC made
I handled a Rossi and the quality was not great in finish or tolerances!
You said the jap Winchester won’t have the collector value. Tell that to gunbroker. The prices are high for them especially the 92s
Ciao , Quanto costa???
They're your guns...but seriously, gloves, white gloves at that. I do know some guitar players who swear their hands secret more corrosive chemicals than what might be considered normal.
Not a very big fan of the new ones. I prefer to have barrel bands on 20 inch or shorter.
If you like them to have a barrel band, then you would be looking to get the saddle ring carbine. Winchester still produces them. www.winchesterguns.com/products/rifles/model-1892/model-1892-current-products.html
I bought a 1894 deluxe
After sighting in at 60 feet, I could easily cover 5 shots with a nickel ruclips.net/user/postUgkxQt2uORDRfFOVSrO4idv4B90ThT6EOnEL ! Truly a pleasure to shoot! Scope was easy to adjust for eye relief. Only problem the varmints must have seen it delivered lol!Update: So impressed with shot groups at 30 yards I purchased a Hammers 3×9 with adjustable Objective scope! Now a true nail driver!
"....i don`t like touching one of this guns...."😮....well....why collecting??!!🤔 (stupid..)
I don't have problem with Winchesters made in Japan, it ain't like America is making anything worth a shit anyway.
Handled one of the new Winchesters and putting aside the obvious, that it will never EVER live up to an original pre 64 Winchester, they are decent as long as the tang safety doesn't bother you. It will most of the time though because the safety is in such A bad location.
I'd honestly prefer a cheap Rossi and their safety switch mounted on top than a Miroku with a switch that is directly in the same exact spot where the palm of your hand is supposed to go. Very ugly solution and poor place for a safety. The Stock finish on the new Winchester is also always dull.
Always makes me sad when I hear people talking about shooting foxes, bobcats and coyotes. Beautiful animals that are no threat to humans. If you take precautions, they won't harm stock either. Knowing this reinforces my opinion that our species has nothing to offer the universe. We are a trash species. All we do is consume and destroy.
The tange mounted safety keeps me from buying one.
that ruins the look
Gloves, really!
👍
Well, I'd say it a Winchester, as it is a Winchester. Is it an 1894? Not really. It's "based on a true story."
its a winchester!! they where built in europe also and south america, better guns than them old ones!!
Samurai barrel
I'll stick to my 1892s that were built in the 1890s.
Unfortunately these older Winchester do not possess the metallurgy of 21st century steels nor are these chambered in then powerful modern cartridges such as .44 and .357 magnum!
Me gusta mas el Mod Japonès.sin dudas...
Japanese Winchester? Why do you badmouth Henry whose motto is "Made in America or not made at all."
I go agree that the tang safety is easier to see what position it is in than the useless crossbolt safety, but the half cock safety is tried and true. Henry uses a transfer bar in their centerfire lever guns, which does work for the incompetents that can't get around without an automatic transmission. Cars or guns, we need to LEARN how to use them before pretending that we know how to safely handle them.
The Henry is a fine rifle, but it is the original design of the Henry rifle that makes it technically and operationally inferior to all other succeeding American lever-action rifles.
Why are the japanese versions so much money considering they are licensed copies of Winchesters and are modified to add the safety features? Just seems like they are pretty far from an actual modern day Winchester. That 1914 however, is beautiful.
Πολλά λόγια χωρίς ουσία 🤔
.
New Winchester, no thank you. The original design has been bastardized.
Don't care, every gun should be equipped with the most effective safety, a "smart safty" it's called mind your muzzle mind your finger.
gloves? wtf maybe a different hobby ?