@@Ray_Koren To be clear, I sold mine fully revised and in perfect working condition! When you buy a vintage piece of gear you have to deal this components that might not be available for ever and cost of potential repair. I could compare that to a car.
It's so cool that people can rediscover an instrument and even a genre. For a few dollars more you can get even closer to the original. Clones are for people who want to make music most definitely.
In 1989 I bought a 303 off newspaper classifieds for $150. Thought it was broken cause it sounded really crappy. 2 weeks later sold it for $200 thinking I scored $50 !
the crazy thing with comparisons between TB-303 and clones is that even two authentic TB-303s will sound slightly different. I have two clones, a Behringer TD-3 and a Cyclone-Analogic TT-303v2. They sound different from each other, but I think they a close to the wide range of actual TB-303s.
The cyclone analogic was so good Roland successfully sued and it had to be withdrawn from sale. The look and the internal circuits were exact replicas not clones of the Roland 303.
With advanced age, the difference can definitely be way more than "slightly". Some components deteriorate over time and change their electrical properties, which for analog instruments directly translates to changed sound.
Yep I got two xoxboxes and they’re both completely different sounding from each other. One is far more bassy Nd the other one suits lead more. Kinda worked out perfectly actually 😊
I’ve had Red SH101 when I was too young to know what it was, I thought it was some cool maschine, I felt the power of the machine as a kid when I’ve passed near by, it’s was faulty and my parents thought it is some toy organ on batteries so they put it on the sidewalk outside the house.. That’s hurt 😢 every-time again and again…
my 2 TB303's will be mine forever - next to my TD3-AM and my hopefully soon arriving TD3-AM-MO 🤩🥰💖 Love them all and cant live without them. one time there will be a fault at one of them what i couldnt repair but the they will gatting a warm place where i could look at them and just smile remembering the good old times 😇🥰💋
@5:53 on is the X Traxx Keep Your Love by Dj Misjah. I remember, I played that track in 1997 in San Francisco as my first track and people were new to it and went crazy. I had two 303’s sold both. Biggest mistake of my life. Now I have Tinnitus and Hyperacusis! Don’t play your music too loud.
Nice you show my cute mod thank you very much... I now have 2 RE-303 and a newly built TB-303, the mod is hardly distinguishable in sound I think it reaches 99.9 per cent if you turn down the VCF of the TD-3 a little.
You had your reasons and they worked for you. That's perfectly fine :-) I still have my TB, bought it in 1994 as a young teenager, just because I adored the acid sound. In fact, it was the first machine I had and back then it was already expensive. Especially for a poor teenager. I played it solo (without any drums or other sound sources) through a guitar combo amp, which I borrowed from a friend. Only a solo 303 with the EQ and spring reverb from that amp. I was in acid heaven
I could not possibly disagree with you more. I've owned original Roland 101,202,303,505,626,707,808, and a 106 or three...none of them are worth the prices they fetch these days. The TD-3 is not the best clone available but with a few mods you won't know the difference in a mix.
@@btrain2385 That's perfectly fine and the reason why I was able to obtain the original machines. When all original owners would have liked them as much as I do, they would not have sold them. Worth is very subjective. Is a Gibson Les Paul from the 50ies WORTH up to 400.000 USD? How about a Stradivari violin for up to 16.000.000 USD? And then just leave the music instrument sector and look at cars or watches or sneakers. Yes, used shoes from the 80ies. 😀 As I said, I don't even think about what it's worth when I have fun using these machines. Reminds me of that guy who got his Ferrari F40 (the blue one) when they where much cheaper and now since those went up like crazy, he tries to ignore the fact that he actually rides around town in a one-million-car. Why? Because he enjoys it and THAT should not be measured in $$$. Regarding that "mix" argument. Depends on where you actually place the TB. In my case I use it as the lead instrument and surely I can distinguish from it's flanking TD-3.
@@wackerburg I'm glad there are people like you. Denying logic and common sense. People who MUST HAVE the REAL thing...I've made a lot of money selling old gear to you guys LOL. I promise you couldn't tell my X0XB0X from an original TB-303 in a blind test...I sold my 303 after I built it...that extra $2500 bought a bunch of fun new gear and I still don't miss my 303.
@@btrain2385 If it makes you happy, fine. As I wrote - I guess you read that before answering - I am not making music for money. I enjoy it. You talk money, I talk emotions - we couldn't be more different. I do not HAVE to have the originals, the RE-303 is great in regards of 303-sounds. I like both the SR-909 and RE-909 and the RE-808 will probably be awesome as well. So, enjoy your money! Bye.
@@wackerburg I'm not in it for the money either...it's the music and the sounds...and If I can get the same sound for less money, I have more money for more gear! Basic logic. I recently sold my Sequential Pro-One and reinvested the money in the Behringer Model D, Pro-1, RD-8, Cat, MS-2, and Wasp, and still had money left over....wanna buy a MC-202?
Having the same dilemma lately. Having the tb feels like I have a piece of history but it’s wrapped in blankets under my bed for the last few years. I have 2 td3 a cyclone bass bot and the tr03. Bass bot is good but the td’s are my current favourites especially with the distortion. For now I can’t beat to sell the tb. But every now and again I think about it
@@zyxbotcba There's a local guy that used to work for Yamaha servicing that will take on occasional repairs. He's a bit wary of the TT because it is quite fragile. I've given him a TD-3 with it so he can see if he can scavenge parts from that and beef up the TT. I'm not expecting it back for a while.. :P
Great video. Remember these used going here in london uk for £100 back in the mid 80’s. Then suddenly up to £500 plus in 1995 due to the 303 style techno & breakbeat music. I got rebirth’s 338 software in 1996 which was awesome and sounded great with 2 tb303’s a 808 & 909 built it.
Sold 101, 303 , 808 en 909. I don't understand the collector bullshit. I payed pennies in 1990 for these (909 a few years later btw) because no one wanted them. Few track further and they are expensive as paintings from rembrandt. Sorry but electronics are electronics. Get a ossiloscope and measure, those are facts. The ear does lie to you.
A very nice video! Good to see something a bit different in regards to the 303... May I have the link for the modification which makes it more like the 303? I am interested in the basic one and don't want to follow the wrong guide. Thanks! Edit: After commenting I noticed you already have a video about the mods - thanks for the information!
Great clip, thanks for making this. I'm planning on modding my TD-3 so was wanting to know what are the essential mods you performed on your second TD-3 to get it to sound closer to an original TB-303. Secondly does the TD-3 MO already have the mods to make it sound more like an original or does it just replicate the Devilfish changes ? Many thanks in advance.
I wonder what it was that caused the 303 to get out of tune and if someone could mod the TD-3 to replicate this, maybe some resistor was throttling or leaking ( i.e not working at the exact spec ), could this be recreated safely ? Maybe it is just how the oscillator or filter goes, maybe the glide itself ? , who knows but it would be cool if someone could prematurely age the TD-3 preferably without murdering it completely :)
New to modding ..I have just bought 2 Td3,s. I had a tb303 in the nineties..You mentioned the basic mods to soundlike the tb303.Which are they .Thanks in advance
I know you mentioned them in the video but do you happen to have a link or more info on the mods you applied to your TD-3? I'd love to get mine dialed in the same way you have yours! I'm not looking to add extra knobs or buttons, just get the sound closer to the TB-303
The fact that a long time user of a TB-303 can say that a modded TD3 is that close that they're happy selling their TB-303 speaks volumes. I appreciate if I've already asked this in another video, but for the most authentic sound, what mods do you specifically recommend?
Then you have other long time users like myself who would never sign that statement. I own both, the TB since 1994. I always wanted a second machine, but kinda missed the time when prices where still okay. I got a TD-3 last year, because it is dead cheap and I could have returned it when I did not have liked it. It actually fits its role perfectly; I use it for complementary lines while the TB remains the lead singer. And for THAT it is pretty much perfect imho, because it does not sound like a TB. To my ears the TD-3 sounds thin and has less life/groove. But that makes mixing both much easier. Of course one could thin out a TB using EQ, but the TD-3 works well out of the box. That being said, when running both, I am so glad that I have the original machine. Whenever I play the TD-3 on its own, after some minutes, I need to get the TB back in the mix :)
@@wackerburg to play devils advocate though, your TB may sound different to a number of other TBs because of hardware going out of spec over time. It seems that no two machines sound alike.
@@cromulence Yes, I am aware of that "issue". Its not only the often mentioned aging of components or maybe swaps during service - while in production, Roland used quite a lot of different components over the span of production. There were 4 major revisions, according to the PCBs - A, B, C and D. And then there were those minor changes I already mentioned. Someone created a spreadsheet, very interesting for the 303-aficinado imho. See 23.235.199.139/~re303c5/forum/topic/406-tb-303-and-its-last-mysteries/?tab=comments#comment-6572
Now you can return it))) Currently Roland has a three consoles, they added a third one! In addition to the original TB-303 and the unsuccessful TB-3 attempt, a successful clone from Roland appeared: TB-03. Don't confuse zeros and names when you google it: new in a metal case! And by the way, it is better to use hot melt adhesive instead of duct tape, because the tape will dry out over time.
some people are so rude in the comment ! I wrapped my head 15 minutes around your 303 problem, I just have no explanation. At the begining of the pattern, it does play G Gup Gslide but after the first time it seems to replace the first G with a C (5semitone up from the G). This makes absolutely no sens. At first I thought you made a programming mistake but you didn't. your unit was faulty and it's mindblowing, I see no reasons for her to slide up when she was suposed to hold a G into the same G (like the TD3 did). In the mean time, I'm really happy for you since you have a working 303 now (yes I consider all 303 clones as 303s, including the TD3 of course) ! If you want to make a small experiment, enter this pattern in your TD3 and compare it to the recording of the OG TB303 : C (hi) | G up | G slide
Good question, the answer is no. I am satisfied enough with the modded TD3 being close from the OG. However, today I would buy a "new" re-303 over a 40 year old TB-303.
I just bought a TD-3 and RD-6. I wanted a TB-303 and TR-909 so bad in the mid-late 90s as a teenager getting into electronic music but they were stupid expensive by then. I made a gabber track called "TR-909s for $1800" even. 😂 I known for my music photographer locally, but I've not played any music in 20 years. Then I randomly learned about the TD-3. As soon as I realized I could get that TB-303 I always wanted for next to nothing and now I guess I'm reliving my youth. Just wish I'd never sold my Juno-60!
Even owning an original (and having owned multiple 303's) They even sounded different to one another because of temperature, usage, wear and tear and off course being analog in the first place.... The characteristics en signature 303 sound was what tied them close together. And while I won't part with the only original I have been keeping, while using the Aira series, Boutique version and multiple software emu's and two differen Cyclone-clones.... The Behringer TD3 and recently also the TD3 MO-version (which totally blew me away even when I did not own the TD3 for a very long period of time..... The characteristics do not differ in ay other level to my hearing than any of he true 303's compared to one another. It is just the final clone which has enough of that convincing hommage to the original, while adding just subtle enough things propell it into the 21th century and creating endless new possibilities to connect and use them in so many ways and integrating with other stuff in live situations, studio sessions, just jamming or combined alltogether... endless.... And the modded Out editions even ramps it up even more by adding stuff which totally innovates and making it even more versatile and better sounding. In my personal opinion this MO version could easy be Roland's re-imagining for Behringer just nailed that thing. Brilliant... If you are about to buy one... Check the modded version. It's .... Well... Sweet sweeeeeeeet Acid.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I now have 2 modded TD3s and I would no say they are really different but maybe there are subbtle variations. I guess the difference of sound between 2 303s is due to the fact that their components have aged differently over the years. Still waiting for my TD3 MO that I ordered on day one at Thomann :(
you shouldn't..i bought a tb303 because i had the opportunity, but also because of the td-3, i was very disappointed with the results, something was strange to my ears, and in the end, when you play the same patterns side by side without silence, our ears can distinguish easily, the sound is clearly not the same, just different : the td-3 has no grit, very harsh, lacks body. I decided to expose my thoughts & made a video on my youtube channel with comparaisons tb303vs the stock td-3 & i also a td-3 with the maffez mods which sounds quite far from the original! the titel of my video is "why you shouldn't sell your tb303" . With respect, kind regards Mr Egowaves
TB303 stil hass the most potent low end oscilator that insdutry can offer, i owned every classic analog mono synth (exept of minimoog and moods in general) and its the punchiest bass sound of all. That only is worth its price. Engneers at Roland ar that time were at their peak, thats why 808 is still used today as the mainstream standart, and 909 kick is the oroginator of all hard kicks. Work speaks for itself.
Friend has 2 and rarely used them per mostly in the shop waiting for parts literally for months or a year+ at a time. Get one serviced and then boom another issue. And as you noted the character changes organically and mechanically once serviced.
@@egowaves Have you had any experience with the the newer TD-3 MO? I'm interested in whether that would provide the same upgrades without the need to modify oneself. (I completely forgot I had already watched this video and shocked myself to find my own comment here haha!)
It's pretty great that behringer made TD-3 the machine 303 used to be. Cheap, cheerful, accessible. Instead of worrying about its value, you just use it like the original was meant to be used. Of course the elitists will tell you only their original machine has any real value but what's the value of an instrument that's only used to store dust on it.
aahah!!! i ust sold mine few days ago! I bought an Aira TB3, cause of the interface. I like that crap touch screen. The sound is similar...Anyway, me, like many have used Rebirth, or other software emulations during the years, so, one of these new clones are quite similar to the original. I saw many A/B comparison video of the original and the others....If you want the original you have to spend, but if you just want the sound, go with a clone. Thanks for your video!
'Maybe she became jealous' I lost it at that point :) . I'm thinking about selling my Novation Bass station, but I'm finding it hard to let her go !! Will deffo be investing in a Behringer-td3 tho.
@@egowaves I'm undecided what to do. I have changed out the red LEDs for green 1s and might need a new 'frequency' potentiometer, I will re-solder it in to see if it is just a bad connection as it is only at a small range that it resets /jumps to zero. Just playing with it after 20+ years again and it is capable of some amazing sounds that you just cant replicate with a digital synth or VST etc.
The difference was HUGE! 😀. In a matter of sound… through a phone and even more so through high end headphones. The behringer is flat, lacks depth and misses the key nuances that gives it character. From a sound perspective it’s a huge difference. To my ear it wasn’t even close.
Its not just a piece of electronic, because it created a new style of music and yes, today you can make it with a TD-3, but nothing smells like an original 303!
@@egowaves I read I can put a 100nf condensator near to c52 or c51 and that's all to get rid of the click? Why does this work I have no clue... And it would be interesting if the new td3 mo still clicks as hell...
Thank you for the video! my td3 dont convinced me soundwise, i modded something.... bu still had "plastic" touch.... so i went to re303, some mods and booom :) only my opinion...
Just heard the guy on Andertons say he sold his 303 this year for £1600 or ~2200$. Reverb asking 2900-5000+. If I had one, I’d sell it or have sold it based on the clone market and lack of interested parties with the means to buy one. Even Hawtin hasn’t used one in years .
Yeah for sure, the problem is they are severely limited so the sound can get tired . It would be different if it was a vintage polysynth or something with anwider sound pallete.
So anyone else have one of the older TD-3s where it's starting to already starting to lose the paint around the cutoff knob, like with my silver TD-3? It makes it look more authentic. lol
i had a really amazing sounding xoxbox with an broken accent. i send it to repair and it came back with the sould sucked out of the mashine, accent still broken and the amazing sound dead : (
Nobody can argue that the emulations are getting close. But the emulations also lack historical significance. They will be forgotten relics of the past, constantly losing value. The originals will be cherished for being genre defining masterpieces. You can get a perfect copy of a Picasso. But it’ll always be a copy.
@@egowaves No but I will. I'll still keep the 303. Through-hole components are generally easier to repair, granted some replacement parts are not available anymore. The TD-3 curcuit board doesn't look like it will stand the test of time. Buttons and knobs are on the cheap side. Sure you can buy multiple TD-3s and replace if one fails... Or of course get the RE-303 or Avalon Bassline to a higher cost.
i had a mint in box TB303, with silver plastic case which i sent to someone in America (from Australia) in the early 90s, it never reached its destination, someone in Customs or postal system grabbed it.. dogs,,
Really cool story! I am getting my TD3 very soon as they just became available in my country, I have legit dreamed of owning a acid machine and its finally came true! ACID ON.
amazing how good speech synthesis is getting these days....like the TD3 its 95% there hehe
hehe :)
@@Ray_Koren To be clear, I sold mine fully revised and in perfect working condition! When you buy a vintage piece of gear you have to deal this components that might not be available for ever and cost of potential repair. I could compare that to a car.
Some stuff now is indistinguishable
95% is close enough for me
It's so cool that people can rediscover an instrument and even a genre. For a few dollars more you can get even closer to the original. Clones are for people who want to make music most definitely.
In 1989 I bought a 303 off newspaper classifieds for $150. Thought it was broken cause it sounded really crappy.
2 weeks later sold it for $200 thinking I scored $50 !
Bought one pretty cheap In 1999. Waited for month to receive a CV to midi. converter. Got bored. Sold it as cheap. Brillant capitalistic operation 🤦😆
if you only serviced it
the crazy thing with comparisons between TB-303 and clones is that even two authentic TB-303s will sound slightly different. I have two clones, a Behringer TD-3 and a Cyclone-Analogic TT-303v2. They sound different from each other, but I think they a close to the wide range of actual TB-303s.
The sequencer on the TT is fantastic.
The cyclone analogic was so good Roland successfully sued and it had to be withdrawn from sale. The look and the internal circuits were exact replicas not clones of the Roland 303.
With advanced age, the difference can definitely be way more than "slightly". Some components deteriorate over time and change their electrical properties, which for analog instruments directly translates to changed sound.
Yep I got two xoxboxes and they’re both completely different sounding from each other. One is far more bassy Nd the other one suits lead more. Kinda worked out perfectly actually 😊
I wonder how close your mods are from the new factory modded TD-3-MO. Thanks for taking the time to make this video.
Heart wrenching story. Emotions swinging in all directions. Gear ❤️!
Well done, Egowaves! I am also getting a second TD-3 which I will only mod with the basic TB-303 mods, been modding my first TD-3 a whole lot already!
I sold my TB-303 13 years ago and it still feels weird, kinda hurts for a second. I guess everyone who did this feels the same.
Yes you can hear the jalousie in your old 303 and rightly so! you betrayed her for a younger model.
i never sold a single piece of my gear ... always thought what i have i have and maybe i need it someday ^^
Sold mine, about the same time... Bought an avalon, never looked back 😁
So did I. Sold two 303's, one 909 and my 808 20 years ago. But I embraced the new technology at one point. Still feels awkward from time to time...
I’ve had Red SH101 when I was too young to know what it was, I thought it was some cool maschine,
I felt the power of the machine as a kid when I’ve passed near by, it’s was faulty and my parents thought it is some toy organ on batteries so they put it on the sidewalk outside the house..
That’s hurt 😢 every-time again and again…
just got excited seeing a pic of that Alesis MMT8.
Cool story. Now we want to hear your new tracks !
Thank you for your story, it was great
my 2 TB303's will be mine forever - next to my TD3-AM and my hopefully soon arriving TD3-AM-MO 🤩🥰💖
Love them all and cant live without them.
one time there will be a fault at one of them what i couldnt repair but the they will gatting a warm place where i could look at them and just smile remembering the good old times 😇🥰💋
Where can I find detailed instructions on how to make such a modification?
maffez.com/
@5:53 on is the X Traxx Keep Your Love by Dj Misjah. I remember, I played that track in 1997 in San Francisco as my first track and people were new to it and went crazy. I had two 303’s sold both. Biggest mistake of my life. Now I have Tinnitus and Hyperacusis! Don’t play your music too loud.
Keep your love is in my top ten (maybe top 5) best acid/303 track ever! 1997 was the time ;)
Yes misjah tracks are Amazing ! Access is very good too.
where can I read about and learn how to apply the two essential mods you were talking about to get the original 303 sound
maffez.com/?page_id=70
Nice you show my cute mod thank you very much...
I now have 2 RE-303 and a newly built TB-303, the mod is hardly distinguishable in sound I think it reaches 99.9 per cent if you turn down the VCF of the TD-3 a little.
Good point of view.. in the end is fulfill our passion, and its all about music. Dont let gears fools you
You had your reasons and they worked for you. That's perfectly fine :-)
I still have my TB, bought it in 1994 as a young teenager, just because I adored the acid sound. In fact, it was the first machine I had and back then it was already expensive. Especially for a poor teenager. I played it solo (without any drums or other sound sources) through a guitar combo amp, which I borrowed from a friend. Only a solo 303 with the EQ and spring reverb from that amp. I was in acid heaven
I could not possibly disagree with you more. I've owned original Roland 101,202,303,505,626,707,808, and a 106 or three...none of them are worth the prices they fetch these days. The TD-3 is not the best clone available but with a few mods you won't know the difference in a mix.
@@btrain2385 That's perfectly fine and the reason why I was able to obtain the original machines. When all original owners would have liked them as much as I do, they would not have sold them.
Worth is very subjective. Is a Gibson Les Paul from the 50ies WORTH up to 400.000 USD? How about a Stradivari violin for up to 16.000.000 USD? And then just leave the music instrument sector and look at cars or watches or sneakers. Yes, used shoes from the 80ies. 😀
As I said, I don't even think about what it's worth when I have fun using these machines. Reminds me of that guy who got his Ferrari F40 (the blue one) when they where much cheaper and now since those went up like crazy, he tries to ignore the fact that he actually rides around town in a one-million-car. Why? Because he enjoys it and THAT should not be measured in $$$.
Regarding that "mix" argument. Depends on where you actually place the TB. In my case I use it as the lead instrument and surely I can distinguish from it's flanking TD-3.
@@wackerburg I'm glad there are people like you. Denying logic and common sense. People who MUST HAVE the REAL thing...I've made a lot of money selling old gear to you guys LOL. I promise you couldn't tell my X0XB0X from an original TB-303 in a blind test...I sold my 303 after I built it...that extra $2500 bought a bunch of fun new gear and I still don't miss my 303.
@@btrain2385 If it makes you happy, fine. As I wrote - I guess you read that before answering - I am not making music for money. I enjoy it. You talk money, I talk emotions - we couldn't be more different. I do not HAVE to have the originals, the RE-303 is great in regards of 303-sounds. I like both the SR-909 and RE-909 and the RE-808 will probably be awesome as well.
So, enjoy your money! Bye.
@@wackerburg I'm not in it for the money either...it's the music and the sounds...and If I can get the same sound for less money, I have more money for more gear! Basic logic. I recently sold my Sequential Pro-One and reinvested the money in the Behringer Model D, Pro-1, RD-8, Cat, MS-2, and Wasp, and still had money left over....wanna buy a MC-202?
Having the same dilemma lately. Having the tb feels like I have a piece of history but it’s wrapped in blankets under my bed for the last few years. I have 2 td3 a cyclone bass bot and the tr03. Bass bot is good but the td’s are my current favourites especially with the distortion. For now I can’t beat to sell the tb. But every now and again I think about it
V1 or V2 bassbot?
I really like the V1 but it's awaiting repairs because the tuning has gone to shit.
@@Gainn yeah the v1 here too Actually I need mine repaired tried to take the knobs off and pulled it off the board. Where do you get them repaired?
@@zyxbotcba There's a local guy that used to work for Yamaha servicing that will take on occasional repairs. He's a bit wary of the TT because it is quite fragile. I've given him a TD-3 with it so he can see if he can scavenge parts from that and beef up the TT. I'm not expecting it back for a while.. :P
Great video. Remember these used going here in london uk for £100 back in the mid 80’s. Then suddenly up to £500 plus in 1995 due to the 303 style techno & breakbeat music. I got rebirth’s 338 software in 1996 which was awesome and sounded great with 2 tb303’s a 808 & 909 built it.
Sold 101, 303 , 808 en 909. I don't understand the collector bullshit. I payed pennies in 1990 for these (909 a few years later btw) because no one wanted them. Few track further and they are expensive as paintings from rembrandt. Sorry but electronics are electronics. Get a ossiloscope and measure, those are facts. The ear does lie to you.
A very nice video! Good to see something a bit different in regards to the 303... May I have the link for the modification which makes it more like the 303? I am interested in the basic one and don't want to follow the wrong guide. Thanks!
Edit: After commenting I noticed you already have a video about the mods - thanks for the information!
Damn good video, Humble and great perspective, Love cheers
The new Td 3 is now availabe with devil fish mod. For 199€..top.
what is the serie number of that one??
@@googoo5922 behringer TD3-MO.
Sold here in Germany by Www.thomann.de
Great clip, thanks for making this. I'm planning on modding my TD-3 so was wanting to know what are the essential mods you performed on your second TD-3 to get it to sound closer to an original TB-303. Secondly does the TD-3 MO already have the mods to make it sound more like an original or does it just replicate the Devilfish changes ? Many thanks in advance.
I wonder what it was that caused the 303 to get out of tune and if someone could mod the TD-3 to replicate this, maybe some resistor was throttling or leaking ( i.e not working at the exact spec ), could this be recreated safely ? Maybe it is just how the oscillator or filter goes, maybe the glide itself ? , who knows but it would be cool if someone could prematurely age the TD-3 preferably without murdering it completely :)
Yes that would be great if someone could reproduce this with a mod!!!!
New to modding ..I have just bought 2 Td3,s. I had a tb303 in the nineties..You mentioned the basic mods to soundlike the tb303.Which are they .Thanks in advance
maffez.com/?page_id=70
facebook.com/photo/?fbid=264112318566368&set=a.264102438567356
I know you mentioned them in the video but do you happen to have a link or more info on the mods you applied to your TD-3? I'd love to get mine dialed in the same way you have yours! I'm not looking to add extra knobs or buttons, just get the sound closer to the TB-303
maffez.com/?page_id=70
Can you tell us what basic mods do you use? 🙏🙏🙏
- VCF OFFSET
- VCA DECLICK
- RUBBER MOD
- Hollow Square
- Pre Filter Over Drive
The fact that a long time user of a TB-303 can say that a modded TD3 is that close that they're happy selling their TB-303 speaks volumes.
I appreciate if I've already asked this in another video, but for the most authentic sound, what mods do you specifically recommend?
These ones:
- VCF OFFSET (not a mod a setting)
- VCA DECLICK
- RUBBER MOD
Then you have other long time users like myself who would never sign that statement. I own both, the TB since 1994. I always wanted a second machine, but kinda missed the time when prices where still okay. I got a TD-3 last year, because it is dead cheap and I could have returned it when I did not have liked it.
It actually fits its role perfectly; I use it for complementary lines while the TB remains the lead singer. And for THAT it is pretty much perfect imho, because it does not sound like a TB. To my ears the TD-3 sounds thin and has less life/groove. But that makes mixing both much easier. Of course one could thin out a TB using EQ, but the TD-3 works well out of the box.
That being said, when running both, I am so glad that I have the original machine. Whenever I play the TD-3 on its own, after some minutes, I need to get the TB back in the mix :)
@@wackerburg to play devils advocate though, your TB may sound different to a number of other TBs because of hardware going out of spec over time. It seems that no two machines sound alike.
@@cromulence Yes, I am aware of that "issue". Its not only the often mentioned aging of components or maybe swaps during service - while in production, Roland used quite a lot of different components over the span of production.
There were 4 major revisions, according to the PCBs - A, B, C and D.
And then there were those minor changes I already mentioned. Someone created a spreadsheet, very interesting for the 303-aficinado imho. See
23.235.199.139/~re303c5/forum/topic/406-tb-303-and-its-last-mysteries/?tab=comments#comment-6572
Biggest and smartest promo for Behringer. Well done. ;)
Please note that I am not paid for that ;)
Deep feelings running through this. What a special time and feeling back when acid music was in its prime.
Now you can return it))) Currently Roland has a three consoles, they added a third one! In addition to the original TB-303 and the unsuccessful TB-3 attempt, a successful clone from Roland appeared: TB-03. Don't confuse zeros and names when you google it: new in a metal case! And by the way, it is better to use hot melt adhesive instead of duct tape, because the tape will dry out over time.
What's the closing track? Do you have it on soundcloud or somewhere?
It's just a quick impro I did. TD3 + TR8
@@egowaves Well, it's banging! :) Could you please share it?
some people are so rude in the comment !
I wrapped my head 15 minutes around your 303 problem, I just have no explanation. At the begining of the pattern, it does play G Gup Gslide
but after the first time it seems to replace the first G with a C (5semitone up from the G). This makes absolutely no sens.
At first I thought you made a programming mistake but you didn't. your unit was faulty and it's mindblowing, I see no reasons for her to slide up when she was suposed to hold a G into the same G (like the TD3 did).
In the mean time, I'm really happy for you since you have a working 303 now (yes I consider all 303 clones as 303s, including the TD3 of course) !
If you want to make a small experiment, enter this pattern in your TD3 and compare it to the recording of the OG TB303 :
C (hi) | G up | G slide
And now there's the MO version...
(Still have both my TB's.. They'l go to the grave with me)
We will really enjoy the next Prodigy pattern tutorials with your TD-3 for sure!!!
just in time for the td3-mo... lol
Sort of interested in those mods now... pulse width adjustment!? Any recommended sources for these?
google for maffez td3
Prior to selling it have you considered purchasing the re-303 or having one built for you rather? it’s a great time to be alive 😅
Good question, the answer is no. I am satisfied enough with the modded TD3 being close from the OG. However, today I would buy a "new" re-303 over a 40 year old TB-303.
4:00 I want an orange one now! 🍊
I just bought a TD-3 and RD-6. I wanted a TB-303 and TR-909 so bad in the mid-late 90s as a teenager getting into electronic music but they were stupid expensive by then. I made a gabber track called "TR-909s for $1800" even. 😂 I known for my music photographer locally, but I've not played any music in 20 years. Then I randomly learned about the TD-3. As soon as I realized I could get that TB-303 I always wanted for next to nothing and now I guess I'm reliving my youth. Just wish I'd never sold my Juno-60!
I hear you there. very similar experience. sold both my 106 and mc-202 mid ninties. have a td-3 now
Do you have the tracks played in this video uploaded anywhere to listen to. ?
Even owning an original (and having owned multiple 303's) They even sounded different to one another because of temperature, usage, wear and tear and off course being analog in the first place.... The characteristics en signature 303 sound was what tied them close together.
And while I won't part with the only original I have been keeping, while using the Aira series, Boutique version and multiple software emu's and two differen Cyclone-clones....
The Behringer TD3 and recently also the TD3 MO-version (which totally blew me away even when I did not own the TD3 for a very long period of time.....
The characteristics do not differ in ay other level to my hearing than any of he true 303's compared to one another.
It is just the final clone which has enough of that convincing hommage to the original, while adding just subtle enough things propell it into the 21th century and creating endless new possibilities to connect and use them in so many ways and integrating with other stuff in live situations, studio sessions, just jamming or combined alltogether... endless.... And the modded Out editions even ramps it up even more by adding stuff which totally innovates and making it even more versatile and better sounding.
In my personal opinion this MO version could easy be Roland's re-imagining for Behringer just nailed that thing.
Brilliant... If you are about to buy one... Check the modded version. It's .... Well... Sweet sweeeeeeeet Acid.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I now have 2 modded TD3s and I would no say they are really different but maybe there are subbtle variations. I guess the difference of sound between 2 303s is due to the fact that their components have aged differently over the years. Still waiting for my TD3 MO that I ordered on day one at Thomann :(
Any thoughts on the TD-3 MO vs your mods?
Still waiting for my TD3 MO ordered since July 21 :(
you shouldn't..i bought a tb303 because i had the opportunity, but also because of the td-3, i was very disappointed with the results, something was strange to my ears, and in the end, when you play the same patterns side by side without silence, our ears can distinguish easily, the sound is clearly not the same, just different : the td-3 has no grit, very harsh, lacks body. I decided to expose my thoughts & made a video on my youtube channel with comparaisons tb303vs the stock td-3 & i also a td-3 with the maffez mods which sounds quite far from the original! the titel of my video is "why you shouldn't sell your tb303" . With respect, kind regards Mr Egowaves
TB303 stil hass the most potent low end oscilator that insdutry can offer, i owned every classic analog mono synth (exept of minimoog and moods in general) and its the punchiest bass sound of all. That only is worth its price. Engneers at Roland ar that time were at their peak, thats why 808 is still used today as the mainstream standart, and 909 kick is the oroginator of all hard kicks. Work speaks for itself.
I sold my TB-303 quite a few years ago...i will always miss it. even though i tried to fill the void with the blue and the yellow : )
Did you mod them?
@@egowaves So what kind of mods are the most important to get the TB sound you would say?
@@messiahshow VCF OFFSET, VCA DECLICK, RUBBER MOD, Hollow Square. In option pre-filter overdrive is nice to add a subtil touch of overdrive.
@@egowavesno I didn’t… I don’t know how to.😭
@@egowaveswould you sell a modded one?
Friend has 2 and rarely used them per mostly in the shop waiting for parts literally for months or a year+ at a time. Get one serviced and then boom another issue. And as you noted the character changes organically and mechanically once serviced.
Can I get somewhere the full track we hear at 3:00 ? Many thanks!!
I'm afraid not...it's just a loop I created a long time ago that never made it to a finished track :(
just got a bass station rack and was wondering if the drum station was as cool as the bass one... is it worth getting?
This sounds great. Would you happen to have a list of those first few mods that added that proper 303 sound?
Check this: ruclips.net/video/uh-pWv2lvUs/видео.html
@@egowaves Have you had any experience with the the newer TD-3 MO? I'm interested in whether that would provide the same upgrades without the need to modify oneself.
(I completely forgot I had already watched this video and shocked myself to find my own comment here haha!)
@@JonasHamill u can find a short video on youtube to make ur td3 mo sound like a tb 303
@@JonasHamill Had one and returned it
It's pretty great that behringer made TD-3 the machine 303 used to be. Cheap, cheerful, accessible. Instead of worrying about its value, you just use it like the original was meant to be used. Of course the elitists will tell you only their original machine has any real value but what's the value of an instrument that's only used to store dust on it.
So true!
Just ordered a td3-mo-am
Can’t wait to get it
aahah!!! i ust sold mine few days ago! I bought an Aira TB3, cause of the interface. I like that crap touch screen. The sound is similar...Anyway, me, like many have used Rebirth, or other software emulations during the years, so, one of these new clones are quite similar to the original. I saw many A/B comparison video of the original and the others....If you want the original you have to spend, but if you just want the sound, go with a clone. Thanks for your video!
the tb 303 sounded more crisp while the td sounded blurry
'Maybe she became jealous' I lost it at that point :) . I'm thinking about selling my Novation Bass station, but I'm finding it hard to let her go !! Will deffo be investing in a Behringer-td3 tho.
Do not sale your Bass Station!
@@egowaves I'm undecided what to do. I have changed out the red LEDs for green 1s and might need a new 'frequency' potentiometer,
I will re-solder it in to see if it is just a bad connection as it is only at a small range that it resets /jumps to zero.
Just playing with it after 20+ years again and it is capable of some amazing sounds that you just cant replicate with a digital synth or VST etc.
The difference was HUGE! 😀. In a matter of sound… through a phone and even more so through high end headphones. The behringer is flat, lacks depth and misses the key nuances that gives it character. From a sound perspective it’s a huge difference. To my ear it wasn’t even close.
That was before the mod. When modded, the TD3 sounds pretty close!
I wish my hands were not so shaky, I would love to do the essential mods to my td3
That took an unexpected turn.
I like your Hardfloor cover. Thx for the vid
Its not just a piece of electronic, because it created a new style of music and yes, today you can make it with a TD-3, but nothing smells like an original 303!
True!
Yup the TD-3 is brilliant, excellent and amazing. I have two.
But I'm fucked if I'm selling my 303.
Wich mods do you recommend first to do with the td3?
- VCF OFFSET
- VCA DECLICK
- RUBBER MOD
- Hollow Square
@@egowaves I read I can put a 100nf condensator near to c52 or c51 and that's all to get rid of the click? Why does this work I have no clue... And it would be interesting if the new td3 mo still clicks as hell...
@@3039-m9o All you need is here: maffez.com/?page_id=70
Iv just been using the Roland t8 but the Behringer tb 3 mo the devil fish clones caught my eye
Thank you for the video! my td3 dont convinced me soundwise, i modded something.... bu still had "plastic" touch.... so i went to re303, some mods and booom :) only my opinion...
Roland TB-03??
I sold my 303 2 years ago and my Devilfish 5 years ago. I saw the market providing clones and got rid of the fish quick. No regrets.
Just heard the guy on Andertons say he sold his 303 this year for £1600 or ~2200$. Reverb asking 2900-5000+. If I had one, I’d sell it or have sold it based on the clone market and lack of interested parties with the means to buy one. Even Hawtin hasn’t used one in years .
Yeah for sure, the problem is they are severely limited so the sound can get tired . It would be different if it was a vintage polysynth or something with anwider sound pallete.
@@darthrex761 I've seen Carl cox, squarepusher, 999999999, and joris virn usr td3s. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me
So anyone else have one of the older TD-3s where it's starting to already starting to lose the paint around the cutoff knob, like with my silver TD-3? It makes it look more authentic. lol
lol
I love those old krk have a pair and sound better than the new ones
I love them too :)
The ultimate testimonial.
Where can I find instructions for the simple mods?
maffez.com/?page_id=70
Loving drunk guy being an "IT"
Fucking legend.
Luv and Peace.
Modded TD-3??? Where can I buy such things from!
Behringer now.. lol
Search for TD-3-MO
do you have a soundcloud/spotify?
If you have one working today, it is worth gold!
So what your saying is you dumped your problem on someone else for top dollar.
The sh101, Tb303, etc we’re just cheap fun toys when they came out. Now they are cheap fun toys again, as they were intended to be.
Very true!
Old good aged parts versus new parts.
i had a really amazing sounding xoxbox with an broken accent. i send it to repair and it came back with the sould sucked out of the mashine, accent still broken and the amazing sound dead : (
:(
this is an advert for behringer
Thats a good move. I did the same with a EDP wasp deluxe
For the behringer wasp?
Yes
@@Anton-du-Fleur whoa!
@@MusicGearNuts I got $5200 for it on ebay
Thanks for this. You did the right thing.
Well, I would keep it as the memorabilia, but I'm even more into buying the one as my first synth to mess up with
Nobody can argue that the emulations are getting close. But the emulations also lack historical significance. They will be forgotten relics of the past, constantly losing value. The originals will be cherished for being genre defining masterpieces. You can get a perfect copy of a Picasso. But it’ll always be a copy.
i prefer the TB-303 only & always classic Synths !!!!
Tadao Kikumoto
The TB-303 was designed by Tadao Kikumoto, who also designed the Roland TR-909 drum machine
Dude left some legacy.. 🤗👍💋✌️🇮🇪
Still have mine and I'm not selling. No hiccups on mine, and it sounds better than my TD-3 and my XoXBox.
Did you mod your TD3? It makes a huge difference.
@@egowaves No but I will. I'll still keep the 303. Through-hole components are generally easier to repair, granted some replacement parts are not available anymore. The TD-3 curcuit board doesn't look like it will stand the test of time. Buttons and knobs are on the cheap side. Sure you can buy multiple TD-3s and replace if one fails... Or of course get the RE-303 or Avalon Bassline to a higher cost.
Your mistaken the 303 sounds good like that ...
Hilarious Austin Powers pics. :-D
i had a mint in box TB303, with silver plastic case which i sent to someone in America (from Australia) in the early 90s, it never reached its destination, someone in Customs or postal system grabbed it.. dogs,,
"I realised someday she would die... So I palmed it off on some other sucker!"
I did not force anyone to buy it. I think I made someone happy. Maybe someone with better electronics and soldering skills than I.
Really cool story! I am getting my TD3 very soon as they just became available in my country, I have legit dreamed of owning a acid machine and its finally came true! ACID ON.
And now behringer is mass producing a modded td-3
Why did you do that?/?
Watch the vid ;)
A documentary of a death of a 303
same story here, I sold my two TB303s and bought three TD3s
Did you mod your TDs?
yes, and then bought another TD3 MO😉
Could never sell mine, I’ve also got a TD-3 and a TB-03 and neither have the character of the 303!
You need to Mod your TD3.
TB-304 is way better! 🤣