im so glad that ive and nmixx are finally out of single album jail😭 they can finally build an actual discography instead of one-off songs with an extra b-side
@@glowingghost8542it was only 2 days ago, but I’ve announced a full-length album to be released April 10th! I saw people on twitter saying it’s going to have 12 songs, but I don’t know how true that part is, but the official accounts did announce the full length album, and it’s called I’VE IVE I think
This is exactly the reason why K-pop doesn't create long term careers for most artists (at least not 4th Gen onwards). They are focused on visuals & fast sales as opposed to creating a musical legacy with albums. I feel most of these recent groups are going to be forgotten in about 6 months of their last activity. It is almost sad that the industry has such enormous talent, but chooses to waste it on creating temporary popularity.
I've been a kpop fan from 2019 so not for long, but I've seen how 4th gen groups that used to be big at that time are literally forgotten now and are mostly made fun of, especially girl groups
@@_arlinda So true. I think it is mostly due to overexposure. They have back to back comeback for singles, do a bunch of promos and tiktoks, rinse and repeat all over. Artists need time to create quality music. But instead, companies just hire a bunch of songwriters to make something that'll top charts for 1 week then disappear. nobody lasts more than 2-3 yrs max. Kinda same with the Western artists too.
@@_arlinda I am a k-pop fan since SNSD and few groups manage to keep going after 7 to 10 years. That groups are the ones that manage to success conaistently and evolve with age. BigBang, Super Junior, SNSD, 2PM... But most of them after the 10 years mark start to have scarce promotions and keep individual promotions as their main job. New groups are given their international fanbase in a silver plate because K-Pop in some ways is becoming mainstream. There are more agency stans than before so if you follow Twice then you follow ITZY or NMIXX and so on so of course they debut with huge amounts of fans, not because that fans think they are good but because if they belong to such agency they "should" be as good as my favs. And then there is this narrative that the agencies are imprinting on the groups, I do not dey there are layers of sincerity in idols but excuseme if I belive some of the "personalities" of the new wave of idols is fake till some point. I understand the need of a persona but one thing is a persona made for the artist with some of his/her personal traits and other thing is when that persona was 100% given by the company. Finallythere is the fact that there are groups smashing old records whit hordes of teens followers, teens are not dumb but we all used to be a little entitled. This new groups celebrate USA fast promotions as if K-Pop were not mainstream now and America was not consuming K-Pop and celebrate and berate old groups because they are not promoted in USA. Excuse me but Wonder Girls was invited to promote in USA when no one in the west even knew what an idol was. Coachella invites seems huge now when F(x) was the first K-Pop group asked to perform in a summer music festival in USA when RUclips was not yet mainstream. This new fans laugh of groups like SuJu when they manage to make small tours in America filling their avenues with 15 years of career on them when some of them can not do the same out of Korea or can not even sing their own songs in a music show encore. This new groups seems a little to much agresive to me, they blend into each other, their music sounds more or less the same and their fans laugh of groups trying different things for not following trends ir a little older that did not debute with the huge investments their favs have. But it is not only them, it is something you can notice in actual society that wants to shame and cancel whoever that wants or dare to think different to them. I miss the camaredy of 2nd generation groups among them, I miss the fact that girls and boys could be friends and joke among them without rumours of dating exploding. I want them dating and people supporting them. I still do not know how much this new groups are going to manage to keep their relevance for the next generation.
@@belaytriks I'm more of a Bts fan than a kpop fan, but I do keep with kpop music if I like the song i listen if I dont I just don't. But yeah as you said if you keep with twice then you keep up with every other group under Jyp or with other companies which is why once a new group is debuting the "old" one Its getting kind forgotten I don't knkw about 2d get, but 3d gen music is good and 4th gen music is tiktok music.. now we can't blame them because that's what west are doing as well most of the new songs are tiktok music which sucks but it's a trend for now As for dating i don't know what to say other then I was shocked that people either ship idols with each other or send hate to the people idols are dating..
@@nezukochan86 yes there are a lot of artists whò are just one hit wonders or their career kind of ends once it's been 6+ years.I think labels are more obsessed with trying to make a "hit" rather then focus on trying to build a fandom for their artists because in the end casual fans will always leave and fans will always stay.. which is the reason i think these kpop groups are getting forgotten in spam of 3 years 😩
Kpop stopped being about music since the pandemic and the new audience that were brought with it. I know this will hurt some people to know, but we can't deny the truth. As a long time OG kpop fan it hurts me to see how people no longer care for music in this new gen. Please don't treat music like an afterthought and please know that forcing artists to come back 24/7 is hurting the quality of everything. People will get bored of groups fast etc. We really need to savor things more and be more patient, so they can come back stronger every time.
The people always saying “stream blah blah blahs” “let’s get them to blah blah number” It’s not a bad thing to have milestones you want your faves song to achieve. But when that becomes the whole objective rather than appreciating the album, that’s when I feel like we’ve really strayed away from what kpop was initially
@@Ireneisbae Yeah and it's just kind of weird to only stream the title track only in general and massively neglect all the others. It is giving a lot of entertainments a sign that b-sides aren't really necessary. Which is sad 😥
@@soomino frr ✋😫✨✨✨ Like G-idles I never die album Everyone went crazy for Tomboy, but their b-sides were ✨ Red Velvets Perfect Velvet full album ✨ Seulgi’s 28 reasons 💿 🎉 There’s just so many albums where b-sides carry B-sides are just so amazing because there’s always one for the mood you’re feeling.
As a Stray Kids stan, I agree with you about their songs and albums. I’m someone who really enjoys long albums and I love b-sides, but I vividly remember going into half of Stray Kids albums to listen to their b-sides but finding them strangely lacking. There are some really good ones in there, in my opinion, but most of them just feel empty, it’s hard to explain it. Most of the b-sides leading up to the chorus sound like it’s going to be very explosive and epic, but most of them tend to have lackluster choruses with the repetition of the same word or it’s just the instrumental, and they just sound like they were randomly thrown in there. Still love stray kids but I feel like a lot of their music is lacking in some areas.
i actually like mini albums when they're not like 13 minutes long. a good example of this is seventeen's your choice album (yk i always gotta promote svt). even though the album only has 6 songs, none of them are less than 2 and a half minutes long and the songs all fit together well to make a cohesive album.
TXT has many bsides that are well loved in the fandom. Fairy of Shampoo, Anti Romantic, Opening Sequence, Dear Sputnik, Lonely Boy, Tinnitus, Eternally, Blue Orangeade, No Rules, 20cm, Ghosting, etc. Bighit has continually done a great job of putting albums together for the guys. I particularly love their albums focused on narrative (minisode2, Temptation) and concept (minisode1). Ironically those are all mini albums.
Absolutely agree with you, TXT create a masterpiece no matter the length of the album. combining the parts of each era does make it a full album technically once the other part(s) are released. It is also very cohesive with their storyline and you can see tand listen to heir growth and the stories they have to tell. BUT as a Moa, I do wish they would release a full length album sometime in their career. Not because it’s absolutely necessary, but I feel like they could really put a lot more into it, I just know they have so many things to say and they want to try a lot of stuff. TXT are also getting more comfortable and confident involving themselves directly by producing and writing, I think a full-length album could really be one of, if not their greatest work.
@@adisajakupovic6184 when you say full length album, what do you mean? Both Dream Chapter: Magic and Chaos Chapter: Fight or Escape are classified as albums.
This is a very good take. I’ve noticed too that albums are a rarity these days in Kpop, especially as of late. I swear most of these groups release an “album” or it’s labeled as an album on Spotify but it’s only around 6-8 songs long, which I guess is technically a mini but most of the time it’s said to be a “full length album”. Or half of said album is just full of already released songs on there, like Yugyeom, for example, I was looking through his new album and most of the songs were already released and I was really disappointed. Or the whole deal with Orange Blood with ENHYPEN, it was listed as an album but there’s only 5(?) actual tracks on there, the rest were just an English version and one featuring Bella Porch, and I’ve noticed that that tends to happen a lot as well. My friend was going off about it the other day and she said something “it’s a joke nowadays to have music, imagine being an artist and actually having music”, and i feel like it’s kind of true, especially right now. Anyways, that’s just my ramblings, loved the video and agreed with a lot of points you made.
Totally agree, and Beyonce made a similar comment. I am older and grew up with full length albums which I prefer. Sometimes I may not always enjoy all songs, but in time after listening it could change. Music for me has to simmer and resonate not recycle every few months. Music has become drive thru fast food.
i feel like people no longer want to grow to appreciate songs, for some songs you really WONT get it until the 5th listen but once you do, it’s now your favourite song off the album! people judge entire albums upon first listen and i think we’ve forgotten how to REALLY listen to music and appreciate the little things in songs.
I think a lot of people dont bother checking out albums. (unless its a group they stan) They’ll listen to the TT and watch the MV and maybe check the main Bside. And as a company it wouldnt make much sense to invest in making a 10-12 song album if i can just turn that 1 comeback into 3 or 4 comebacks where the songs actually get more exposure and allows the group to feel much more present in the industry. (and not lose their popularitys momentum which happens when a group takes too long between comebacks). Also! i think very few groups are known for actually having great music on their albums that isnt their promoted songs so it could be a cycle of companies not investing in a good full album and fans not checking it out because full length albums dont tend to be that good.
Agree but it is a shame. Once I listen something I really like I start to look for full albums but it is a shane when there is only four or five "main" songs.
Blackpink can't relate..Even their bside Forever young,Dkwtd,pretty savage gets more views than Some of Famous groups MV. Forever young lyric video is 100M+ views😅
As a musician, its super sad for me when groups that I like and have good songs don't release full albums. That's why I have mostly 3rd gen group song on my playlists and don't get too into much 4th gen groups except skz and txt ( and I'd say stayc, because their young luv album was too exquisite). I do hope kpop companies start to release more albums because there are groups i love sm and would love to hear more music from them.
Yes but it took years in the making and J-Hope is a workholic and had been working and experimenting with music and albums creation for years. It helps too he is an amazing performer and musician.
@RedLoonatic kind of. What i understood from his interviews is that hope (what's his name) was the only thing left in the Pandora Box, so yeah. The album represents he coming out of the box as hope. Correct me if i am wrong.
@@belaytriks to be fair, it takes years in the making to make a lot of good full-length albums. that's why most musical artists in the west usually have like 2-3 years between albums. they do take breaks, obviously, but they're also working on their music during that time.
I think twice still puts out quality full length albums, most of their best songs are actually random tracks that go largely unnoticed outside the fandom
i agree. formula of love, eyes wide open, and even their most recent japanese albums are wonderfully made. i also feel that twice's eps tend to follow a particular concept and even if theyre shorter, each song goes with that concept to make something cohesive (a good example is taste of love w bright summery love songs)
I think YG has had a big impact on how the K-Pop scene has embraced the small releases. The concept of the YG Dungeon is very well known; not letting your artists release music too often, to create a scarcity market for it. With Blackpink, I think they really went overboard with it. You have a group with some of the best trained Idols, and instead of showcasing their abilities in music, they are brand ambassadors and models, who also occasionally have a side-gig in music. And it worked. Since their debut in 2016, they have released just over 30 original songs, yet their brand value is the highest in the competition. To put that into perspective, Twice debuted roughly a year earlier, and they have over 170 individual songs released. I think there is a sweet spot somewhere in the middle, for your average group. When other companies are looking at how to promote their artists, what strategies to utilize, what will give the most profit per invested money, it's hard to argue against the YG method. They are getting tremendous returns for relatively little effort, by promoting musical artists in anything and everything, besides music. Can't remember the group in question, but when asked about when they would be having their first concert, one of the members replied to the fans, that they just don't have the discography, they don't have enough songs to do that yet. This isn't uncommon. Companies will get their money back through various promotions, ad deals and merch, but for the Artists themselves to get paid, they usually actually need to be able to go on a stage and put on a show. If you don't have enough songs to do that, you are effectively denied the opportunity to earn your own money, which in turn forces you to be dependent on the company for longer. I suspect this might be partly why this is such a common practice. It doesn't help, that they are recruiting kids, who don't understand contract law, just that they wanna sing and dance and be famous. TLDR: smaller releases offer more returns per investment to the company and shareholders, than larger ones; create a false scarcity; and force the artists to depend on the company, as they are denied the opportunity to become financially independent.
@@DoubleMonoLR well it was technically a showcase tour, so I see what you’re saying. It wasn’t just song after song, they had game segments and stuff to fill out the time. But my point was that it really depends how much the company is willing to invest in their groups and how much money the company has to spend on stuff like concerts/tours
Honestly YG dungeon Formula only works for Blackpink,no other groups in YG are popular. And Blackpink success is Mostly Becz of hardworking Blinks the amount of Edits they create to keep Blackpink In trend,Twitter,YT,Insta, Pinterest etc No wonder they are most dedicated Fandom in kpop.
Someone who hasn’t fallen to this curse is billlie! They debuted a little bit over a year ago and have had 3 main EPS and two special seasonal singles , and they will have another EP on march 28th!
Omg finally someone who mentions billlie! After gingamingayo, I checked out all their music and I especially loved the chapter two EP, it was so good. I’m definitely looking forward to more music from them, they seem really promising.
the main thing that bothers me is that the songs themselves are becoming so short. I feel like it’s kinda rare now to find a song that’s 3:15 - 3:30 minutes long, a lot of songs I hear now fall under 3 minutes. I don’t mind mini albums as long as the album isn’t 14 minutes in total and the production quality is good. and I also agree that concept albums are basically nonexistent now, I wish albums now sounded more cohesive.
Maybe that has something to do with the fact that there is also a limit in music shows. It is extremely rare that a 4 minute song is performed uncut. On the other hand, a very good but short song is better than one that is artificially drawn out. Butterfly by LOONA has a rather long instrumental part but in shows it had to be shortened a lot to fit into the "stage time". The same happened with Ponzona by Purple Kiss. Sometimes it's just the song structure though. STAYC's Beautiful Monster is also only about 3 minutes long but is still a bit longer than Teddy Bear and yet BM felt shorter. Quality > Quantity ;)
as someone who collects cds and actually played them often, it is honestly a shame how quickly i have to switch them out just bc of how few track or how short the songs are in the mini album. i like these artists and i’d like to play a cd and indulge in the music for even just a bit loner
I agree with this and that is what honestly holding me back from saying I like an artist after a year or longer. Ive and NMIXX have not enough discography for me to decide yet. I think an artist needs around 10 songs to decide if you actually like the artists music style or just one or 2 songs out of their discography. If you want a good directed album or longer eps I recommend (G)I-DLES I never die which was released in 2022. Also their eps usually have 6 songs which is nowadays huge. They are masters in creating concepts and follow it in their ep/album. They also have so many gem bsides like villain dies, dhalia, change and maze.
"have not enough discography for me to decide yet" This!!!!! thank you for saying that out loud. I've also been struggling to determine whether I stan a group or not, because I'm waiting for 3 consistent comebacks with enough material, but they constantly keep dropping single songs. It's sadly not enough :(
@@soomi for Ive's case it's just a starship does to groups to see if people like them, then after some single albums at debut they start releasing albums, now Ive is gonna drop a full album with 12 songs on april
I think that ever since BTS has stopped doing like their well known trilogy conceptual albums the whole industry also shifted. Because before like during HYYH or the Love Yourself series and even during Map of the Soul these groups pumped albums they did trilogies not like extremely well but they tried to bring things out in a way. But then Covid arrived and BTS decided to take things a little differently and just did a single Dynamite which was literally the most successful song ever and so the industry saw that and they just decided that this is best for now. Idk what will happen in the future but I feel like when BTS comeback all together and release an album album and maybe even start a new trilogy I think that the industry will change as well specifically for groups!
I disagree. "They did trilogies not like extremely well" did you forget "Map of the soul: 7" was 2nd most selling album in 2020 (in the WHOLE WORLD) with 4 Million sales on its first week, before Dynamite was released on the same year? It's a full-length album with 20 tracks in it. It's supposed to be a trilogy album following the Jungian concept of map of the soul but they combined "Shadow" and "Ego" concept in one album for their 7th anniversary and called it "Map of the soul: 7". Did Kpop groups/labels pick up on this psychological concept of human development or made a full legnth album this long? No. After the single Dynamite, BTS released their third studio album "BE". It has 7 tracks excluding a skit. The album was not really in their plan to do that year but did so out of the frustrating pandemic situation and it's lead single "Life goes on" debuted at no.1 at BB hot 100, the first Korean song to reach the top. DId the Kpop industry pick up on this achievement and made their own sentimental song/album about the pandemic? After BE, BTS released two songs made to cheer up ARMY : "Permission to dance" and "Butter" both are singles, NOT AN ALBUM, that reach BB hot 100 no. 1. Butter being performed at the Grammys, the first Korean group to perform at the Grammys! It's important to note that in within the timeframe in which these three succesful English songs were released, BTS released Korean and Japanese albums that has over 10 songs which no one from Kpop (except ARMY) have cared about and Kpoppers mock BTS for being "westernized" due these 3 English songs and blame them for the degression of music quality in Kpop (lol) or even in what you're trying to say "influenced" the whole industry on how many songs they put out in an album which I think, if the whole Kpop industry were really REALLY influenced by BTS's musical moves, they would have released MORE music because that's what BTS is doing constantly even now in their solo careers. Last year, BTS released their anthology album "PROOF" a very long album. Were the the kpop labels influenced to do the same? NO. If anything, I guess the whole Kpop industry was influenced by YG's moves towards releasing few songs in an album, starving the fans for the next comeback and they got away with it because they were able to make BP the most popular GG with just 30+ songs in their whole idol career. And I think most gg in the 4th gen follows the footsteps of Blackpink and bg would want to follow the path of BTS but they could barely keep up with the constant release of songs from BTS members. Sorry for the long reply.
It's true. Stray kids, BTS, and nct are truly the only artists I stream just because of the size of their music discographies so there is enough that I do not get bored and have variety when streaming their new albums. Also, thank you for the opinion on maxident, I also thought it was messy, especially compared to the much more cohesive oddinary which had a much more clear artistic vision and sound compared to maxident and especially the recent replay album. I dont want an album of solos from a group, I want to listen to the group, I'd listen to a solo artist instead for a solo song. If you want to do solo music, release a full subunit or solo album instead of padding out the group album with subunit releases. No matter how good a song, if you have a discography of less than even ten songs it's going to get boring very quickly and you will want more songs to pad out your listening time, which means listening to other artists. Especially since on the mini albums they still have intros and outros that people do not stream, maybe one good secondary song and two not so thought out b sides. And then only one or two music videos where the whole budget clearly got put into the title track. It's predictable to a fault and I want full length albums. But in my opinion kpop (specifically idol music) is designed to be singles release artists, and discourage conceptual or album focused artists.
For me, I’m primarily a STAY and a (trying to be non-toxic) BLINK. For me, yes, MAXIDENT was a bit of a disappointment, I think it was to the majority of the fanbase, simply because ODDINARY is amazing and MAXIDENT is honestly mid (“not good, not bad”). As for SKZ’s longer albums like GO LIVE/IN LIFE, they were ok, but let’s say they consisted of songs I love and listen to as much or more than the title track (like Easy, Any or TA. Even the NOEASY unit songs) ans the songs I don’t ever pay attention to (like Blueprint). And for BLACKPINK, let’s say absolutely everyone has things to say about the size of their discography. Their discography consisting of 2 2-song single albums, As If It’s Your Last, 2 4-song mini albums, Kiss and Make Up, Sour Candy, and 2 8-song “full albums”, and a bunch of covers/remakes is just, not enough for a graph approaching their contract renewal. BLINKs are literally at the point where they’ll count iconic covers like “So Hot” a song just because, they don’t have enough actual songs. I do find all of their songs at the minimum good (except Typa Girl, Typa Girl is bad/horrible and you can not convince me otherwise) but please 8 songs do not qualify for a full album. At least there’s finally news that YG will shorten hiatuses, but… BLINKs have no faith in YG now.
I feel like this happened because of YG’s strategy with Blackpink. You’d think that not having many songs would put a lot of people off because listening to the same few songs over and over again gets boring. But blinks showed it’s possible to get insane numbers with limited songs, so other companies want to minimise budget while still getting a good payoff. Except, they know they don’t have the clout that YG does, to create diehard fans before a group even has a single song under their belt. So it’s a slightly altered less is more strategy. More comebacks, with less songs each comeback. Give people a taste, keep them interested, without spending extra money on a longer album. Because, I swear, debuting with singles was practically unheard of until Blackpink. And now basically every group debuts with a single instead of mini album.
How can these new groups tour w/ absolutely no songs in their discography? I dunno how BP made it work, but they are the biggest joke where their idols need to do cover songs in order to pad their concerts. It’s one thing where a huge gg can get away w/ it but if the entire generation starts doing it how does anyone expect kpop to be taken seriously let alone grow? It’s all about a quick cash grab today over long term future growth & forget about artistic growth
I personally, won't mind if it took 3-4 years for a group to release an album. Infact, i'm a fan of mini albums rather than a full ones. Some of artists' full albums that i found it skippable, some of them are worth to listen to each and every track. Because, releasing a full album almost felt like a double edged swords.
Definitely agree with you on this. Sometimes with mini albums or eps there is always a few tracks in there that I see as “filler” and not really a “different” song, I would much rather wait for a comeback that is with a full length album rather than a constant stream of mini albums, but that’s just my opinion
As a stan who's been in the community since 2015. Thanks for talking about this cause especially on twitter, theses kind of opinions are just classed as "4th gen hate". But it's simply the truth, there's no single group who need 3-4 music videos per album when said album only has 4 tracks.
Lol your take on Skz and albums is vastly different from mine. I legit love their recent stuff. And 3Racha is one of my favorites of their discography. Something about it is just a VIBE for me. We've got a difference of opinion and that's fine.
Speaking of an Albums in 2023 I think it's changing for the better there's groups that are coming back with full albums like I've is FINALLY comeback with thier full album and Aespa next month is making a full album with solos and nmixx is coming back with thier first mini album so I think this album problem will be solved
I'm excited that newer groups are finally getting more music, but there in lies the issue, IVE is FINALLY getting an actual album, NMIXX is FINALLY getting an album, when most 3rd gen artists debuted with 8 song long albums.
@@Taejiu tbh tho it isnt a generational issue. for example, sistar (from starship, same company as ive) also had 3 single albums released after debut before a subunit which was followed by a full album and they are a 2nd generation group. also blackpink from 3rd gen also had 3 single albums before their first mini. so i wouldnt say its a trend, its just really dependent on the company the artist is under
@@ives_galaxy Again I think this has been going on for a while, and I wouldn't use BP as an example because BP doesn't get music PERIOD. Starship just doesn't love giving their female artists albums I guess, seeing as Monsta X gets them all the time.
To be completely and brutally honest here, BTS and its members individually are the only artists in kpop who care about the song sequencing, album length cohesive lyrics, consistency of theme in an album, new and different genres of sound and Music Videos that are in line with the concept of the songs and album. J-hope's Jack in the box was the most consistent album of 2022 sound wise. RM had a consistent theme of art and its effects on people's with his lyrics on Indigo. SUGA has given 2 coherent rap albums with actually good rap. And we all know how BTS as a group is very notorious on their albums, always having good storytelling and a consistent sound throughout the LP or EP. They have only released one 'single album' in their 10 years of career. That's how I know they're here only for the arts. It's their artistry that takes them to the charts.
absolutely, they’re not only involved but basically in charge of their work, especially with their solo releases you can just see that music is what’s always gonna come first for them. jack in the box & indigo were so refreshing sound wise & lyrically impressive, I’m excited to see what direction the rest of the members go
BTS and its constituent solo members are definitely the most prominent artists to do so, but it's hardly fair to say they are the only artists in kpop who care to carefully and comprehensively create their albums. There are lots of soloists with cohesive, well-executed albums (even if only minis). And though my knowledge of all kpop groups and their discographies is by no means encyclopedic, I can think of about 4 groups with good, cohesive albums/minis off the top of my head. I know BTS is the most successful group in the Kpop arena, and that reflects well on their skill and love for the craft, but I also appreciate the care and effort of others.
@@deepshah5332 i’m not the person that commented but i can definitely recommend for you to check shinee and their solo stuff out, specially jonghyun’s.
Another issue with smaller track lists is potential concerts... in that they won't have a large enough discography to warrant a having them. THAT hurts artists if they can't perform live. Unless you're an except to the rule like Blackpink who can get away with touring with 15 songs, that's money those idols aren't getting. Keep in mind, concerts make a bunch of money, not just in ticket sells but in merch, and idols need to be doing more of those... not only to interact with the fans but to get a proper payday that wouldn't be getting in other avenues. So yeah, lack of songs hurts streaming, it hurts albums sells, and it hinders concert opportunities. Short EPs only satisfy the immediate... the now, but it doesn't look out for the long term.
i’m a stay and i’m glad to hear more people also felt the same about maxident!! personally, i do like songs individually, chill, give me your tmi and taste are my favourite bsides here. but when put together the track list just feels so disjointed with no clear narrative or sound going on. oddinary was much more put together but still left me missing something. it’s strange bcs they can and have made cohesive bodies of work, their clé trilogy eps back in 2019 are a stand out in my opinion. they are a great bodies of work by themselves as well as fitting into the wider narrative
I can't stop coming back to this video, literally no one is talking abt how big of an issue this is, I'm tired of 270 mini albums and no full album in sight
Definitely agree especially because I’m someone who LOVES albums. I love listening to them all the way through, finding my favorite songs and looking into the lyrics. It’s such an enjoyable experience. Maybe I’m wrong but I feel like even the songs have gotten so much shorter, like a whole minute is cut off nowadays.
The most interesting thing while listening to an artist is the artistic growth thay have! And just as you said, it's something that could be achived only by making enough music to put out a full-length album every comback, or atleast every year. I want artists to experiment different types of genres, and as they keep making albums, they will find their own uniqe voice in the industry. K-pop nowdays making music for the sole of making new trends, only some of them making music for the sole of making music, making art.
I just wanna share this: There's this Filipino podcast that I listened to, and the two hosts and the guest (a famous Filipino musician) talks about his experiences before in making an album. He said that nowadays, a lot of artists (in general) release single albums, but it was a lot of fun making a full album. He compares it to a theater play/production, wherein each act/part must have cohesion. Songs should be continuous, or else, the concept of the album will be all over the place, which is why it's fun, cause it's like telling stories. In relation to this video, I 100% believe what he said. Yes it's understood, especially for rookies to release singles, since releasing a whole album is too costly as a rookie. However, for the more famous artists, it's kinda sad that they still choose to release single after single, when their companies have the means to produce an entire album. That's why I really liked BTS' HYYH, EXO's Winter albums, Exodus, XOXO, and many other full length albums that tell stories and give concepts. Also, there's a lot of "easter eggs" in albums compared to just singles. Having concepts, although better, is not the main point imo. I just wish that companies would not be lazy and put out 10, 12, even 5 or 7-track albums, cause I feel like this is like becoming a "fast-fashion" in the K-pop music industry 😕😕
I have been increasingly worried with the rise of EP and single releases. I am going to bring another reason. I feel that we can't justify purchasing phydical albums for 2-4 songs. It's great that you're getting photocards and more. However, I just do not see why I should pay for so little. Back in the days, we were getting 8 to 15 songs. In the west, it would not fly releasing physical albums with only 2-4 songs. And, I also feel that it's one of the reasons (albeit smaller) why K-Pop acts will have a hard time getting a footing in the west. You need a decently length discography to showcase.
also, i feel like having full length albums helps the albums concept to fully reach it’s potential. or even try putting a song that’s outside of the albums concept. like weekend in INVU.
Seventeen is the best. So many b-sides/deep cuts, so many years of self-written-and-produced music. 'Face the Sun' had a clear, realized concept, and (with Sector 17) we got 13 songs (plus all the random solos and covers the members did throughout the year and the Japanese release, Dream.). Can't wait to see what they come back with in April.
I've noticed this too and even smaller groups like 9muses, dia, and other 3rd-2nd gen groups were always making mini and full album's showcasing their talent, versatility, and cohesiveness at once.
and even the mini's wstill had 6-7 songs compared to nowadays mini's only consist for 4 songs or they'll make a group release a random single with a terrible bside
Mini albums are part of the reason it's so hard for us younger kpop fans to convince our parents to let us buy albums. My parents have always been all for CDs and keeping that "old" music culture alive, but when they see that the CD I want has FIVE SONGS on it, they wonder why the heck I would pay so much money for a five-song CD. Obviously, the albums come with photobooks, photocards, and tons of other extras that I love and enjoy, but I do have laptops with CD players at home and I like to listen to my kpop CDs, so I think longer albums would help lots of younger fans with stricter parents have more access to physical albums because the albums would be more easily accepted by older generations.
At first, I wasn't sure if I completely agreed with you, but once you brought up the point of how a lack of albums kills an artist's longevity, I began to understand your point. I am a hardcore MOA, TXT is my ult but recently, I've began to notice that I'm listening to them less. At first, I though it was a personal thing, like "oh, maybe I'm just not into them like I used to be", but after hearing your point, I think that's part of the issue. The Dream Chapter: Magic is one of my favourite albums of all time, I was listening to it for months afterwards with phases of falling in love with each and every song. For their latest two mini-albums, which were unfortunately the only music they dropped during their respective years due to touring, there were five songs on each, with their lastest having very short, less than three minute songs, often repeating the chorus and lacking a bridge. I probably listened to Temptation for a month before moving onto something else. I still love them so much, but I can tell that there's been a choice to make easy, quick catchy music that will trend on tiktok which has the consequence of growing stale quickly. It's disheartening to say the least.
One group I really want to mention is NCT 127. They came out with amazing minis/EPs before releasing a full length album two years after debuting. They really took the time to build their image and establish themselves rather than rushing into popularity. I still listen to their first mini album because the songs are so good. They were managed pretty well early on. It also doesn’t help that it seems like everyone just wants a tiktok challenge out of everything, only to be forgotten like a couple months later on. It sucks. Edit: How can I forget Monsta X. I used to be obsessed with the clan pt.1 and pt.2. The concept was so cool and they stayed with it consistently for those eras. I definitely recommend listening to those two minis. I haven’t listened to them in so long but they were my favorite and they have put out so many amazing music.
Yeah and NCT maintains their experimental sound and has bsides and smstations that are from other genres like ballad, rnb, exploring really well the talents vocal line and rapline! I love this SM characteristic of always putting a cohesive mini, ep or full, maintaining the group or soloist brand. Of course in 2nd and 3rd gen there used to be more "albuns" and live albuns like EXO for instance has almost 200 or more songs.
I sometimes prefer mini albums rather than full albums. More songs just seems like more space for error, so I'd rather that kpop artists release minis than albums if the albums are filled with half-baked songs in favor to pad up the run length. That being said, some minis suffer from the same problem with filler tracks so it's really an issue of companies not caring to produce and sell higher quality music in high qualities (which isn't easy obvi) in favor of releasing quicker, less high-quality releases which we as kpop fans a lot of the times eat up until the next release.
Well careful what you ask because it seems like this year is gonna be the battle of the full albums, IVE, Aespa, Le Sserafim are just 3 of the groups that we know will release full albums in the next 2 months. However, I think IVE will probably also include the previous 3 title tracks on it so... yeah, but still, as long as we get 6-9 new songs, we good. I think LeSse and Aespa will have only new songs because Aespa already did that with their previous comeback and LeSse never released just single albums.
i think this year is actually going to be a good year for rookie ggs -nmixx are about to release their first mini album -le sserafim is releasing their first full length album -kep1er is rumored to be releasing their first full length album in april -idk whether it's a mini or full album but ive is finally releasing one of those most likely a mini which is always better than a single imo i'm pretty optimistic for this year honestly i don't see full albums dying out i just think companies want to release them as often but honestly i can't complain if we get minis it's single albums i have a problem with
The main issue with albums getting shorter is that it makes casual listeners out weight the actual fans and maybe groups like Ive and NewJeans are doing verygood for now but as most of their listeners are non fans it can hurt the groups longevity bcuz if they don't have comebacks enough general public will move on to another group and after that the lack of a solid fanbase will hurt the group hard and force them to disband... (sorry for awfull writting and grammar I'm not fluent)
But both groups have comebacks 4 months apart from each one, IVE is also releasing a full 12 song album on April 10th, it will probably have the 3 previous title tracks on it but it will still have 9 new songs my guess. It’s really not as bad as people make it seem. These groups are new, some are not even 1 year old and they have regular comebacks.
@@2FullMoons well... I was talking about RIGHT NOW and how the lack of proper b-side can hurt them in a long run and it's as serious as its look like but if they are gonna come back with a proper album good for them I might even bocome a fan
Billlie's mini albums feel more like "real" albums to me. The only real k-pop albums that I can recall from recent years, that I listened to, are from Twice. The full albums are relatively long, high number of songs, and even the mini albums have quite a lot songs. Bibi's album was also great. I would love to see more longer albums in k-pop. Any recommendation for long k-pop albums?
You just get bored easily and it is harder to create a connection through the music this way. I may forget about NewJean's songs when I get sick of it, but with BTS and songs like Whalien 52, I'm always going to get back to them because of how much their music mean to me
Great points AND it's becoming even more frustrating when songs are only 2:40 mins long or so on an already short album. Like it's so uninspiring and feels like the song is just made for tiktok like you mentioned. No bridge, outro or intro, like just chorus and vibes. I don't see this changing either because the people who care about this are in the minority. Most fans are happy with the shallow experience of hit songs without artistic substance imo.
I really relate to that feeling of wanting more from an album, artists . And thanks for pointing out about maxident . I too was sensing the unnatural flow in that . I mean life is missing in that album. I just felt bored or just forget I was listening to it . I also agree about Le Sserafim's album. It's not enough , it just felt incomplete . Even though I like them , it's making me unsatisfied as a fan because I bought those albums with a certain amount of cash ok . The abundance of emotions and flow when you listening to an album is lacking . I guess that's what you get when the artists are not good enough to produce good sounds , it's not enough just knowing how to write a song, that's just a basic skill for a musician, you have to be good at it. You have to have a distinct identity for that . For that , we have to wait a little longer I guess. Until then , they won't be my go-to albums . And I have to say this , most of BTS's outro are * chef kiss
I agree w this sm. there’s certain groups I feel like that have a cohesive sound like ateez, skz, and idle. I’ll use atz bc they’re my ults and ik the most about them. but they have 2 (I think) full length albums and they’re constantly doing different sounds and experimenting with genres. when you listen to their music its like you can tell what era the song is from. like their most recent world ep 1 movement album is so well made. all of the songs have the same feel that guerrilla did and flow so well together and it doesn’t feel rushed.
To me, b-sides and non-title tracks were where idols could have more creative control and express themselves more, since title tracks usually have to be constructed to appeal to as many people as possible. Seeing them being taken away feels like idols are getting even less control and aren't being allowed to express themselves musically. It's honestly sad how Kpop idols are going from music artists to influencers.
I'm actually a fan on minialbums, but they only work if groups continue to put them out. I love lesserafims minialbums so far because they are cohesive (intro, banger tt, my least fav bside, my fav bside with rock elements, a slower pop song). It's divers, shows different sides. like I've, StayC, New Jeans, nmixx are groups with a lack of songs. StayCs first mini album is amazing and I'm exited for I've first full album. Blackpink for example to me don't have a full album. 8 songs is not what a full album should have. 8 songs is a mini album. For the amount of time they are active they don't have enough songs that have longlifity. For Straykids they have an over exaggeration of songs. They put out songs so frequently that they kind of forget about quality. I love the Noeasy album, it's amazing but after that album, there was no Straykids song that wowed me like their songs before and music keeps on coming and I kind of can't catch up with all their releases. I think they need to take some rest and reflect more on their music.
I also wanted to mention the prices for the physical albums. I don’t understand why these physical albums are like from $20-$50 for a 4-7 song Ep or mini album like I’d rather buy an album for like $15 bucks with more than 10 songs at least I’d want to get my moneys worth.
You’re paying primarily for the photo book and the packaging. A $10-$15 dollar CD comes in a cheap plastic case and a tiny slip of paper with writing and production credits in it, and maybe lyrics if you’re lucky. Meanwhile a $20-$50 kpop cd comes with a massive photo book, artfully designed lyric pages, and beautiful, unique packaging. You’re paying for the aesthetic essentially. Honestly, I absolutely hate that recent album releases have come in a jewel case version.
I didn't even realize Kpop even does Interludes and Skits, Intros themselves feel rare. I do like the idea of adding them in to EP/ Mini albums. Like give us a cute Convo or something
I highly recommend Billlie! No full albums yet but consistently 6 tracks and they also have OST versions of 2 of their albums! Also their creative director puts so much work into the music and lore. And they've done 4 (with the new album incoming) different styles of music already! I have a feeling they may eventide eventually do a full album too!
Yeahhh i love discovering rare songs in groups/soloists I stan or casually follow. Like even if the artist arent self produced, when their discography is cohesive, creative or really interesting, it way more everlasting in making me stream it than just enjoying their beauty and hype on kpop circles
As much as I agree with you, there's also the problem that audiences just skim through full length albums, place the songs that immediately grab their attention on playlists and ignore the rest. Companies are seeing this behavior and probably thinking "why the hell should we waste our money if only a small percentage of people are going to listen to all the songs?"
For sure, I mean there are points to be had for both sides. I get why companies wouldn't want to, but I feel like more music is better than less, even if the more music isn't as great.
Most fans will listen to the whole album, while casual listeners will skim through. And having more songs to get an idea of a group’s sound is more likely to make more people fans.
Thats because the majority of kpop albums hace tons of filler ballads or badly produced mediocre pop songs that have 0 replayability. If you want people to actually replay the songs on the albums you have to make an effort, people still to this day listen to pink tape and Max & match.
I agree with most everything you said. To me when it comes to KPOP or pretty much any type of music, visuals and everything else are secondary. It's all about the music for me. 90% of the time I'm just listening to the song, not watching a video. Album length is just terrible and I agree it's mostly a 4th Gen problem but I think Blackpink really kick started this trend. The amount of songs they have is pathetic compared to most groups who have been around a few years. I think Dreamcatcher has almost 3 times as many songs as Blackpink.
Nobody expected Bp to become this big even Teddy himself said it. Today Blackpink is at the top all thanks to hardcore blinks.. They will do Everything To keep Blackpink in trend..Blackpink fan Edits are flooded everywhere YT, insta,Twitter,facebook. It's not Becz YG Kept them in dungeon(Treasure,winner,Ikon didn't make it like Blackpink). 70% of blackpink success is from blink.20% Their Visual,5% songs,5% Jenlisa.
I understand your disappointment with the industry not releasing full bodies of work that have cohesive themes, but K-Pop has always been like this. Its not actually a new thing. K-Pop has never been built around the album rollout system that you see in the Western music system. SISTAR only has 2 full length albums, so does 2NE1. WG has 3. RV has 2. Its an exception to have full length albums only really reserved for groups/soloists with a very profitable turnover. It costs a lot of money to produce a full-length album and companies are not interested in that. The vast majority of groups are lucky to even get ONE full length album. If they're not making the money, its simply not happening. Companies are interested in quick turnover: single albums and EPs are low risk and high reward. Not sure what you're saying about the 2nd generation having lots of albums because they simply did not. Most of them only ever had 1 - 3 albums. SNSD are an exception as they're still somewhat active after fifteen years and sold as many physical albums - if not more - than boy groups. Which meant that investing in the production of those albums was worth it. In a sense, full length albums are indicative of how successful a group is -- particularly how powerful their fandom is. Because the general public rarely buys physical albums. The more successful a group the higher chance that they'll have a full length album. In rare cases it depends on the vision of the group's creative director, for example f(x) has four full length albums despite their short career and inconsistent fandom. As a SONE, I have to admit that most of their albums were garbage. Random crap that wasn't even cohesive save for a few good songs. Only the Wonder Girls, BEG, SHINee, and IU are famous for releasing full, thematic, bodies of work from second generation. You need to do more research.
I was a little said when TXTs comeback had the same amount of songs as the minisode especially since that was the only release last year but they have had chapters with 5 songs before so I hope for atleast 7 songs next time.
They should let txt have more time to breath while they are touring but ofc bighit doesn't do that for them .TXT reminds me a lot of blackpink for some reasons .Idk whether the members themselves wanted that or not but surely I think they dont want to miss an opportunity to record more songs .
this is so true and i have been realizing that myself. Before i used to stan like 2 main groups and most of the time listen to them more than anything but now i cant even say i stan a group bc my playlist is full of one or two songs from 20 groups and this not only makes me not want to get that invested to the groups but also i dont even feel like buying their albums bc i dont feel attached enough. Having to wait almost a year for a 4 songs track album is not worth it to even become a fan of. I went from a hardcore kpop fan to a casual fan bc of the state that kpop is rn.
I understood why Dreamcatcher, for instance, waited so long to have a full length album. They needed to get money and an audience before putting one out. But for groups from big companies who don’t have those problems it doesn’t make sense not to do at least 1 full length album every so often. I do agree with the other commentor that not many people check out b-sides so it could feel like a waste. But ultimately that could also hinder them. I just really hope we don’t get another Blackpink type (not the girls but the group in general) group for awhile or ever again. I love these girls and I do like their music. But the amount of songs and the way they were promoted and the breaks in between made me really disinterested. Everyone wanted full length albums from them and it was like pulling teeth to even get a comeback. I just hope we don’t get that again from other groups. I hope more groups start releasing albums again. But that doesn’t seem to be where to wind is blowing.
Instant gratification has trapped us all. Companies want the max results with minimum effort. The next big hit is more important than the long term career. Groups get viral fame but cultivate only bandwagon stans. And as soon as the song starts to stale they gotta throw out the next hit before everyone moves on. I am so tired of hearing a group has a new release, going to Spotify to check the album out, and only finding two or three songs. And note this is all a problem with big companies and larger mid sized companies. Smaller companies I am not gonna fault them for struggling to release music, they don’t all have the resources to hire the producers or even the studio time for full albums. For those groups, every day they avoid disbandment is a win.
As a Midzy I agree that it was sad Cheshire was so short (although they had JUST had a Japanese comeback as well so it wasn't as if I felt starved) however I appreciate the fact that apart from that Itzy mini-albums will be 6-7 songs long with no 1minute intro songs and their Album was 10 songs (not including the 6 extra instrumental tracks). I listen to a lot of other groups albums and so often when they have more songs it feels like less thought has been put into each one and for me a lot are "filler" songs. (Then again, INVU was immaculate)
i hate to say this but some of the more recent releases from 3rd and 4th gen groups (once again i wanna emphasize that i said SOME) give me the same feeling that abcdefu song gave me. like nothing about them is good, they use a sample from another song but don't give credit nor do they use it in a fun and interesting way (eg: Pink Venom using 3 different songs but making nothing original or fun), and they're all 2.5 minutes or shorter. it's been said time and time again but wtf happened to songs that have 2 verses, 3 choruses, and a bridge? what genuinely made people enjoy those songs more? it's can't be because it's the more successful format because people like Taylor Swift, BTS, and others who make generally longer songs still rule the charts over these groups that are trying to just get more streams by making the song shorter (and effectively lower quality IMO). it's disappointing to see how much k-pop has changed over recent years in order to fit in with the new age of social media when in reality... you can't just make a song go viral by making it easy to sing along to/repetitive. just look at fifty fifty and Cupid, i bet they weren't aiming for a viral song when they released it yet it's probably the most popular and viral song to come out of k-pop in the past few months. also if these companies think i'm actually gonna spend anything over $10 for 4 mid songs and a PC, they're so wrong.
My favorite album from last year was I Never Die, Not onky did it have a great title track but all the besides had a vision and fit the albums concept of rock. You had songs like never stop me, my bag and liar which were more upbeat and in between you had already or Polaroid. Also their second album of the year I Love. From the last to the first song it tells a story of starting to love yourself instead of needing love from others. That’s what I love about idle, they choose a concept for a comeback and run with it in every way, the songs, the mv, the styling, it just feels very authentic
i feel like we also need to aknowledge that this is an issue that heavily impacts female idols more for different reasons along with the rise of tiktok and stuff. 1. kpop companies never really put as much effort and budget into developing their gg's identity and music. most of the budget goes to bgs while companies focus on only giving their female idols public friendly visually apealing title tracks. they don't even expect the ggs to sell much. lets remember that one of the first groups this "short album" phanomenon happened to were BP. compare their outputs to their label mates. ggs from smaller companies with only 1 group tend to be better off when it comes to this (ex: Dreamcatcher, loona, billie,...). 2. you made a point about how self producing groups tend to get longer albums, well most ggs aren't allowed to self produce so there's that. if they are even evaluated the trainee system with self producing in mind. 3. companies give their groups longer albums when they expect them to have concerts where the unpromoted B-sides can be sung. again, ggs barely get any concert opportunities even after being successful, while even the most nugu boygroups get concerts.
Strongly agree with this video. The only 4th gen group who's albums I've really wanted to buy is OnlyOneOf's. Up until their most recent comeback, they've kept a very cohesive theme in their releases. Especially Instinct pt 1 and pt 2.
I 100% agree with you, is also a problem when you want to stan a new group, some people will tell you that they love x group music and they have like FIVE SONGS, what music? 5 songs it's not enough, bc imagine if they have 5 songs and I only like 3... that's even worse, how can I support a group when I only like 3 of their songs? I know myself, and when I comes to music I'm very serious, I'm not going to eat everything my fav put out. I'm going to support them? yes, but I'm not going to listen to a song that I don't like, that is not me. Another thing that I notice is why these kind of albums are so expensive when they have less than 8 tracks? I'm sorry but am not a millionaire, I have bills to pay, if I'm going to pay for something, make it worth. Just like you said I love long albums, you have so many options, everything is new and since is long you don't get bored easily, I love when an artist has something to say and is reflected in his music, it makes me feel that my time is valued but with 4th groups is like their companys don't care about the listeners, they only care about money, and i get it, is an industry but you are making music, you are selling me an artist... I don't care if you are pretty or if your fashion i'ts good, I listen to music not faces. My priority is music, that's the point. This industry has brainwashed a lot of people... And i'm not one of those, the same example is with concepts, I feel they just search for something new, they try to make it look like they have something important and then they throw it away like it's nothing, If your concept is about being in love, tell me a story, say something that has meaning, or at least that it makes sense. I love Jack in the box, it was also my fav album, J-hope did an amazing job making that album. It's been on repeat since it came out, what are you thoughts on indigo from rm? I'm very curious, another album that I really like was pentagon's invite u, that project was so good. It's a shame that my boys are under that shitty company, cube I swear, give my boys some respect. Love the video, I really like it, we need to pay attention to this topics, it matters. If we as listeners don't care about it, then who is going to? company's don't care and it shows.
Companies are way too focused on making a quick buck, I feel, than actually spending the time to make a good album. It's sad, I really hope it changes, but like u said I don't really see it changing.
i feel like using newjeans wasn’t smart just because they literally just started their career 😭 if their next cb isn’t a mini album AT LEAST, then it makes sense to feel this way. i feel blackpink is a great example because theyre a 6 year old group with less then 30 songs in their discography. and their “full albums” are barely 8 songs long. it’s just very bare minimum. but i completely understand what you’re saying and i fully agree.
I think his assessment of 4th Gen is wrong purely because of this. Ive is from a mid-tier company, they didn't think that Eleven would be so well liked and that Love Dive would continue on with that success. New Jeans, Le-Sserafim, aespa are doing the right things to build hype. I don't expect a full album from the first 2 years, maybe a couple of minis after the singles albums but their 3rd year is probably album year. It's always been this way. I thought he'd talk about blackpink like you, or even Red Velvet who hasn't had a full album since Bad Boy, even (g) - idle's longest album is 8 tracks(the eighth being an explicit version so 7 tracks) txt has 2 albums but short as well their repackage is their longest with 11 songs(again 1 of them is a remix so 10 songs on a repackaged album??) It should be third Gen artists releasing full albums at the beginning of 4th Gen, you cannot expect new artists to throw everything and the kitchen sink when they're not sure if they have a fanbase or not.
Blackpink this blackpink that..western artist gives U full album in 2-3 yrs and they will disappear and come back for collab.. Atleast Blackpink all the 30+tracks are worth it and their Bsides are better than some of TT of other groups like pretty savage,dkwtd,forever young.unlike other Groups whose Only TT gets popular. Twice has 180+ original songs but Monthly listeners?? Y'all always Dragged BP for not having many Awards let's be honest Do they make music for awards or pple to listen. Listeners are most important not Payola Rigged awards..
I love me a good full album ❤ Mini albums are sometimes disappointing to me especially when there’s absolute bangers but there’s like 5 songs total including the title track 💔😀 My opinion: I hate when they put intros and outros in mini albums😭😭 they feel like fillers and I don’t like it. I feel robbed of good music because it’s usually just members talking dramatically with even more dramatic instrumental in the background
I also like full albums more then these mini ones. But that is because I listen to an album till I can hear it anymore. I think some of my favourite bands have full albums that go nearly an hour and I think I listen to them a month straight (in the car, cleaning, getting ready,etc.) And with this lenght if you are not fully concentrated it does not feel repetitive. And with kpop albums it is not the same. I like stray kids, but I have to admit that I started mixing their albums on spotify together, because it gets boring fast.
I know people dont always listen to intros and outros, but I have literally repalyed Lesserafims The world is my oyster for 4 hours and THe Hydra for an extra 2 hours doing study for my HSC maths exam and Enhypens Foreshadow for my English exam. That being said I'm all for the music in Kpop, thats how I got into BTS 4 years into loving kpop, but idk why some just very futuristic vauge noises with some elusive talking makes for really good study inducing background noise 10/10
well yes and no. it's not that all of these kpop ents don't care about the quality of music. sm has always been very serious about music since gen 1 of kpop. a&r and song camps in korea basically started with sm. hybe's labels are paying much more attention to music and a&r nowadays too. so it's not about 1:06 visuals but more money problem. it costs so much more money to make a full length album vs mini album / EP. but fans still buy albums regardless of their lengths. so ents are maximizing profit by just releasing EP vs full album. but you are right about short gaps between comebacks. turnaround time is speeding up in kpop. and groups will soon be forgotten if they don't come back or show up somewhere in 3-4 months. so it is more convenient, especially for rookie groups who require much more exposure, to release 2-3 EPs first before releasing full lengths.
I've only started watching your videos last night, but after the really great overview you gave about the non-existent 4th-gen "Holy Trinity," I started watching several more. This one on albums was one of them, and this is a great video that I have not stopped thinking about for hours. It's a rare instance where I do agree with your points, evenif they also bump up with certain personal circumstances I have as a music listener. Sort of like, "yes, there is an album issue," but then again, it may not be an issue, at least from another perspective. Keep up the good work, and thanks for all your efforts!
this has also been on my mind and it irks me bc when i got into kpop back in 2014, i had a good handful of artists i'd support and stream their material but now im jumping from artist and artist because theres only 4 songs under their belt despite being a year old,
I am fine with cohesive mini albums of 5 to 6 songs a little more close in time that at the end give you a full album by year than a bunch of single releases each 2 or 3 months. And a full cohesive and carefull made album each 2 or 3 years like American artist. I feel too that there is not the need of one narrative across the album as long as the music is good and mantain some kind of cohesive tread (it can be the sound, the theme of the music, the feeling it evoques or the structure of the music, even if it is an experimentation music style as long as it is consistent on that I am fine). Actually I think Viviz in a little more of one year has almost the same amount of music or half of BlackPink with 6 years in the industry.
I think market for GGs after 2022 is really tough, all companies or groups are nervous about is retaining initial fans and adding more afterwards slowly,so initially bangers tts even if singles are done to keep the listener hooked(case in point IVE banger tts and has people hooked for months until they find enough album sell threshold to put out a bigger album which they reached as after like sold over 1.5million). Le Sserafim has more songs and I think it's also because they have direct support from Bang PD and I don't money matters, and they also broke the million threshold on first comeback itself. I talked about these two cause I follow them and I have no complaints from IVE, let their company take slow, Wonyoung just bought them the money printer so now they will upgrade IVE more both musically and content wise. I will keep my patience with other 4th gen too cause I can feel their desperation to hold on audience in fierce competition.
What a great video! One of my biggest gripes with k-pop albums is the layout. The layout of an album should tell some sort of story, or take you through different emotions in a planned way and I think can raise an album from good to great. But most k-pop albums don't do that, and it just shows the lack of effort and passion going into the full length albums. And yeah full length albums tend to have not fillers but that just shows the lack of passion again. If these companies wanted their artists to last and leave an impression they would create fully fledged studio albums for them but they care more about money and getting attention at the moment.
I thought the same when I saw most of last year releases, with many single albums from new groups, and older ones. Like, how can you know if you like a group or not if they have only 2-4 songs to listen to? Also, another problem, but I think it applies only to small compagnies, is that they obviously have to pay for musics, and music are expensive. So, a small company (not all of them of course) is more likely to release only single albums until the group get a bit of recognition. It happened to a group I liked, BugAboo, which only lasted one year and had only 4 songs...
People here clearly are not in the kpop scene long enough. Their senior group sistar literally had the same release strategy as them, having 3 singles as comebacks before releasing a full album. It's not a new thing people!!!!!
Yeah, single albums were very common during the second gen from what I know, I got recently into second gen girl groups and I’ve seen that quite a bit.
Sistar is quite literally the only group I've seen mentioned with this same strategy, and they are coincidentally from starship, if you guys bring up different groups, than maybe we can have a convo.
@@Taejiu Red velvet only had singles until 3rd comeback. F(x) had their first mini the year after debut. Dreamcatcher only juggle singles and EPs until Dystopia series. 4minute also juggled single and EPs for 2 years after their debut and Girls' Day for 3 years. Mamamoo and Gfriend only had EPs until 2016.
Right? I just made that point in another thread. In general I do agree that full albums are better. But just being a full album doesn’t automatically make it better. I’d that makes sense😂
for me personally, quality comes before quantity. it isn't that i do not want more music from artists whose potential and musical direction are undeniable, but i've seen somewhere someone expressing the opinion that most of the recent kpop full length albums lack quality and integrity and have a ton of filler tracks, which i totally agree with. so as of right now, i much prefer shorter but cohesive and well-produced albums, although it pains me that it seems that's the trajectory kpop is going. ps: stream taeyeon's invu album, such a masterpiece
honestly, im scared for ive's album, like, what if they do a "full album" like somi did, like, with all their singles and 2 or 3 new songs😭😭😭 (no hate to somi, but is the first example that came to my mind-)
Honestly, the "Single, Single, Single" strategy feels slimier from bigger companies/groups. When smaller companies do it, it makes sense because if it doesn't work out - "hey, at least we didn't lose that much." I'm 90% sure that's why Dreamcatcher had two singles before transitioning to EPs. But for nmixx???? JYP saw the hype that people had for them (people were really pre-ordering BEFORE THERE WAS ANY CONTENT). and for IVE???? STARSHIP YOU HAVE THE CURRENT IT GIRL. Like they really saw Blinks go rabid with every release after getting starved by YG like trainees and said "actually, that is very profitable lmao let's try that." Are they really being so money hungry that they'll go for techniques like this?
You really hit that point on people quickly moving to another artist's discography once they've exhaused an artist's short list of song to offer. It does get old easily listening to the same songs over and over, no matter how good they are. I also feel like the music itself isn't really hitting it anymore for me, whether they come from a full album or a single; it just feels more like they're optimizing any new releases for the sales and views. I know music is subjective to people's tastes but it's just weird that I've been liking less and less KPOP releases than before (or maybe because it's been 10 years for me and I'm finally getting sick of it???). Anyways I didn't realize the way I consumed music for the past year or two until I watched this video. Right now I'm finding myself jumping over not only different artists, but also a completely different music industry altogether. It's not the most famous thing in the world, but you can tell that they put a lot of love and care into their music, and they usually bring out full albums!! I still find myself staying in KPOP though, for the few groups that do release consistent bangers and albums that are obviously made out of love and passion. But yeah, this album problem saddens me and it may cause me to leave KPOP entirely, cancelling the opportunity to discover potentially promising rookies, just because the overall system is like screwing everyone's music over or sumn.
I blame YG and specifically blackpink (not the girls themselves, just YG's management of them) for this trend of shorter albums and less music overall. Once companies saw how they could make easy money by employing the "blackpink method" of starving fans for content and then releasing maybe a couple songs before disappearing again for who knows how long, 4th gen k-pop groups were goners. Why put in actual time and effort when it's been proven to be more profitable to milk consumers of everything they have for the bare minimum in quantity (and occasionally even quality)
If anyone is looking for a long and exquisite discography to explore I would highly recommend the music of Monsta X! Just my playlist of favorites by them has over 100 songs. What did you call them…deep cuts? There are deep cuts galore to discover! Start with their most recent album and work you way back! 🤩
there are still some bsides from very very old albums from like 2008 onward that i still listen to, get stuck in my head randomly, and have withstood the test of time. i just don't see that happening with a lot of songs in the new gen. people tolerate songs that "age like milk" more often because they know that a new group is going to come out eventually and they will have fresh eyes on them. i think a lot of it has to do with social media though. the proliferation of kpop internationally in the west means that more eyes will be on the final product. they have more people to please. but these are also people who probably are unfamiliar with older generations of kpop. i really feel like it didn't help that kpop has lost its connection to the general public in korea. people for example don't like ballads cuz they're "boring" but honestly ballads kind of helped make kpop, kpop. especially the albums. for me, they bring out the raw talent from groups which I love. having a bad album a few times in your career is fine, but when the sales and clicks and views matter more than the actual music, then you know that kpop has not only lost its charm, but also its longevity. but of course, its a capitalistic industry, so....guess we could've predicted this happening. its just sad though. social media overplays songs until i get sick of them after like 1 week and i have nothing to listen to for months on end. as a fan since 2011, this is not how it was for years and years.
I've been a Kpop fan for over 10 years now. I've seen all of the waves and all of the new trends. After almost 8 years, some of my top ults remain as 2nd gen and 3rd groups (EXO, SHINee, VIXX). I still stan these groups for not only the members and the content and the childhood ties I have with them, but also because in my opinion, they have a fully-fleshed out discography. I can listen to SHINee's 200+ songs and never get sick of them... even the ones from 2009. And I still enjoy VIXX's music because their main rapper (Wonshik) wrote/composed many of the songs. On top of this, there's SHINee's music, which was also mainly created by Jonghyun. The only 4th gen groups I stan are SF9, TBZ and SKZ. SF9 and TBZ are more casual, but I do enjoy a lot of their music when I'm feeling like fun, lighthearted songs. Now SKZ, on the other hand, is the 4th gen group that I've stanned the longest (3+ years). I love them not only for the members that are very relatable to me, but also for their friendship/group dynamics, and also they're entire discography. I literally love every single one of their songs, and I think some of their BEST work comes from their old stuff between 2017-2019. All of that being said, I totally agree with you about Maxident. Oddinary was such an amazing album for me and a lot of the fandom, and then Maxident just kind of seemed like a... let down. Really, the only 2 tracks that I love are Chill and Taste (it ended up being my top song of 2022 because I listened to it so much after its release). Their Replay album was good, but since it wasn't an offical cb it didn't have the same feeling to it, and The Sound is the same thing, since it's a Japanese release. Overall, I'm looking forward to their new album that's set to release in a few months. It's theorized that it's going to be an outer space/mystical sci-fi theme, so I'm hoping it's something similar to Oddinary era!! Either way, I DO truly love everything they create, but I totally get how some might not be enjoying their recent releases. Everyone has their own musical preferences, and that's okay! 💕
im so glad that ive and nmixx are finally out of single album jail😭 they can finally build an actual discography instead of one-off songs with an extra b-side
@@glowingghost8542it was only 2 days ago, but I’ve announced a full-length album to be released April 10th! I saw people on twitter saying it’s going to have 12 songs, but I don’t know how true that part is, but the official accounts did announce the full length album, and it’s called I’VE IVE I think
@glowing ghost yeah but I think they're making something down there, hopefully a 10+ album give them some time
@glowing ghost aren't they having a comeback in April with an full length album?
@@ahlamsdiary yesss 12 songs
@glowing ghost they are releasing a 12 songs album. The previous title tracks will probably be on it but that still leaves room for 9 new songs...
This is exactly the reason why K-pop doesn't create long term careers for most artists (at least not 4th Gen onwards). They are focused on visuals & fast sales as opposed to creating a musical legacy with albums. I feel most of these recent groups are going to be forgotten in about 6 months of their last activity. It is almost sad that the industry has such enormous talent, but chooses to waste it on creating temporary popularity.
I've been a kpop fan from 2019 so not for long, but I've seen how 4th gen groups that used to be big at that time are literally forgotten now and are mostly made fun of, especially girl groups
@@_arlinda So true. I think it is mostly due to overexposure. They have back to back comeback for singles, do a bunch of promos and tiktoks, rinse and repeat all over. Artists need time to create quality music. But instead, companies just hire a bunch of songwriters to make something that'll top charts for 1 week then disappear. nobody lasts more than 2-3 yrs max. Kinda same with the Western artists too.
@@_arlinda I am a k-pop fan since SNSD and few groups manage to keep going after 7 to 10 years. That groups are the ones that manage to success conaistently and evolve with age.
BigBang, Super Junior, SNSD, 2PM... But most of them after the 10 years mark start to have scarce promotions and keep individual promotions as their main job.
New groups are given their international fanbase in a silver plate because K-Pop in some ways is becoming mainstream. There are more agency stans than before so if you follow Twice then you follow ITZY or NMIXX and so on so of course they debut with huge amounts of fans, not because that fans think they are good but because if they belong to such agency they "should" be as good as my favs.
And then there is this narrative that the agencies are imprinting on the groups, I do not dey there are layers of sincerity in idols but excuseme if I belive some of the "personalities" of the new wave of idols is fake till some point. I understand the need of a persona but one thing is a persona made for the artist with some of his/her personal traits and other thing is when that persona was 100% given by the company.
Finallythere is the fact that there are groups smashing old records whit hordes of teens followers, teens are not dumb but we all used to be a little entitled. This new groups celebrate USA fast promotions as if K-Pop were not mainstream now and America was not consuming K-Pop and celebrate and berate old groups because they are not promoted in USA. Excuse me but Wonder Girls was invited to promote in USA when no one in the west even knew what an idol was. Coachella invites seems huge now when F(x) was the first K-Pop group asked to perform in a summer music festival in USA when RUclips was not yet mainstream.
This new fans laugh of groups like SuJu when they manage to make small tours in America filling their avenues with 15 years of career on them when some of them can not do the same out of Korea or can not even sing their own songs in a music show encore.
This new groups seems a little to much agresive to me, they blend into each other, their music sounds more or less the same and their fans laugh of groups trying different things for not following trends ir a little older that did not debute with the huge investments their favs have. But it is not only them, it is something you can notice in actual society that wants to shame and cancel whoever that wants or dare to think different to them.
I miss the camaredy of 2nd generation groups among them, I miss the fact that girls and boys could be friends and joke among them without rumours of dating exploding. I want them dating and people supporting them.
I still do not know how much this new groups are going to manage to keep their relevance for the next generation.
@@belaytriks I'm more of a Bts fan than a kpop fan, but I do keep with kpop music if I like the song i listen if I dont I just don't. But yeah as you said if you keep with twice then you keep up with every other group under Jyp or with other companies which is why once a new group is debuting the "old" one Its getting kind forgotten
I don't knkw about 2d get, but 3d gen music is good and 4th gen music is tiktok music.. now we can't blame them because that's what west are doing as well most of the new songs are tiktok music which sucks but it's a trend for now
As for dating i don't know what to say other then I was shocked that people either ship idols with each other or send hate to the people idols are dating..
@@nezukochan86 yes there are a lot of artists whò are just one hit wonders or their career kind of ends once it's been 6+ years.I think labels are more obsessed with trying to make a "hit" rather then focus on trying to build a fandom for their artists because in the end casual fans will always leave and fans will always stay.. which is the reason i think these kpop groups are getting forgotten in spam of 3 years 😩
Kpop stopped being about music since the pandemic and the new audience that were brought with it. I know this will hurt some people to know, but we can't deny the truth. As a long time OG kpop fan it hurts me to see how people no longer care for music in this new gen. Please don't treat music like an afterthought and please know that forcing artists to come back 24/7 is hurting the quality of everything. People will get bored of groups fast etc. We really need to savor things more and be more patient, so they can come back stronger every time.
The people always saying “stream blah blah blahs” “let’s get them to blah blah number”
It’s not a bad thing to have milestones you want your faves song to achieve. But when that becomes the whole objective rather than appreciating the album, that’s when I feel like we’ve really strayed away from what kpop was initially
@@Ireneisbae Yeah and it's just kind of weird to only stream the title track only in general and massively neglect all the others. It is giving a lot of entertainments a sign that b-sides aren't really necessary. Which is sad 😥
@@soomi yes!! Some people don’t even listen to the b-sides just the title track. That’s so crazy to me😭😭
@@Ireneisbae Right???? meanwhile 70% of my fave songs are b-sides. They're missing out on gems
@@soomino frr ✋😫✨✨✨
Like G-idles I never die album
Everyone went crazy for Tomboy, but their b-sides were ✨
Red Velvets Perfect Velvet full album ✨
Seulgi’s 28 reasons 💿 🎉
There’s just so many albums where b-sides carry
B-sides are just so amazing because there’s always one for the mood you’re feeling.
As a Stray Kids stan, I agree with you about their songs and albums. I’m someone who really enjoys long albums and I love b-sides, but I vividly remember going into half of Stray Kids albums to listen to their b-sides but finding them strangely lacking. There are some really good ones in there, in my opinion, but most of them just feel empty, it’s hard to explain it. Most of the b-sides leading up to the chorus sound like it’s going to be very explosive and epic, but most of them tend to have lackluster choruses with the repetition of the same word or it’s just the instrumental, and they just sound like they were randomly thrown in there. Still love stray kids but I feel like a lot of their music is lacking in some areas.
i actually like mini albums when they're not like 13 minutes long. a good example of this is seventeen's your choice album (yk i always gotta promote svt). even though the album only has 6 songs, none of them are less than 2 and a half minutes long and the songs all fit together well to make a cohesive album.
Bruh i love that album lmao. Every single songs are bops 😌
TXT has many bsides that are well loved in the fandom. Fairy of Shampoo, Anti Romantic, Opening Sequence, Dear Sputnik, Lonely Boy, Tinnitus, Eternally, Blue Orangeade, No Rules, 20cm, Ghosting, etc.
Bighit has continually done a great job of putting albums together for the guys. I particularly love their albums focused on narrative (minisode2, Temptation) and concept (minisode1). Ironically those are all mini albums.
i definetly agree!
TXT albums are the gems of kpop. They lack full length albums. We need TXT9
Absolutely agree with you, TXT create a masterpiece no matter the length of the album. combining the parts of each era does make it a full album technically once the other part(s) are released. It is also very cohesive with their storyline and you can see tand listen to heir growth and the stories they have to tell.
BUT as a Moa, I do wish they would release a full length album sometime in their career. Not because it’s absolutely necessary, but I feel like they could really put a lot more into it, I just know they have so many things to say and they want to try a lot of stuff. TXT are also getting more comfortable and confident involving themselves directly by producing and writing, I think a full-length album could really be one of, if not their greatest work.
@@adisajakupovic6184 when you say full length album, what do you mean? Both Dream Chapter: Magic and Chaos Chapter: Fight or Escape are classified as albums.
@@adisajakupovic6184 they have 2 albums though
This is a very good take. I’ve noticed too that albums are a rarity these days in Kpop, especially as of late. I swear most of these groups release an “album” or it’s labeled as an album on Spotify but it’s only around 6-8 songs long, which I guess is technically a mini but most of the time it’s said to be a “full length album”. Or half of said album is just full of already released songs on there, like Yugyeom, for example, I was looking through his new album and most of the songs were already released and I was really disappointed. Or the whole deal with Orange Blood with ENHYPEN, it was listed as an album but there’s only 5(?) actual tracks on there, the rest were just an English version and one featuring Bella Porch, and I’ve noticed that that tends to happen a lot as well. My friend was going off about it the other day and she said something “it’s a joke nowadays to have music, imagine being an artist and actually having music”, and i feel like it’s kind of true, especially right now. Anyways, that’s just my ramblings, loved the video and agreed with a lot of points you made.
Totally agree, and Beyonce made a similar comment. I am older and grew up with full length albums which I prefer. Sometimes I may not always enjoy all songs, but in time after listening it could change. Music for me has to simmer and resonate not recycle every few months. Music has become drive thru fast food.
i feel like people no longer want to grow to appreciate songs, for some songs you really WONT get it until the 5th listen but once you do, it’s now your favourite song off the album! people judge entire albums upon first listen and i think we’ve forgotten how to REALLY listen to music and appreciate the little things in songs.
@@imani7979 this is a good point
I think a lot of people dont bother checking out albums. (unless its a group they stan) They’ll listen to the TT and watch the MV and maybe check the main Bside. And as a company it wouldnt make much sense to invest in making a 10-12 song album if i can just turn that 1 comeback into 3 or 4 comebacks where the songs actually get more exposure and allows the group to feel much more present in the industry. (and not lose their popularitys momentum which happens when a group takes too long between comebacks).
Also! i think very few groups are known for actually having great music on their albums that isnt their promoted songs so it could be a cycle of companies not investing in a good full album and fans not checking it out because full length albums dont tend to be that good.
This, exactly! And it's an issue that goes way beyond kpop as well.
Agree but it is a shame. Once I listen something I really like I start to look for full albums but it is a shane when there is only four or five "main" songs.
Blackpink can't relate..Even their bside Forever young,Dkwtd,pretty savage gets more views than Some of Famous groups MV.
Forever young lyric video is 100M+ views😅
As a musician, its super sad for me when groups that I like and have good songs don't release full albums. That's why I have mostly 3rd gen group song on my playlists and don't get too into much 4th gen groups except skz and txt ( and I'd say stayc, because their young luv album was too exquisite). I do hope kpop companies start to release more albums because there are groups i love sm and would love to hear more music from them.
I just tried to envision a real full STAYC or TXT album with like 15 songs. The dream!
@@soomi my stayc girls would absolutely eat
Pls check out billlie! They are a girl rookie group that is putting out very good music
Jack in the box concept came together tooo well. Even from his name it made sense. Jhope did soo well
Yes but it took years in the making and J-Hope is a workholic and had been working and experimenting with music and albums creation for years. It helps too he is an amazing performer and musician.
even from his name?
is it cuz both start with J?
@RedLoonatic kind of. What i understood from his interviews is that hope (what's his name) was the only thing left in the Pandora Box, so yeah. The album represents he coming out of the box as hope.
Correct me if i am wrong.
@@belaytriks to be fair, it takes years in the making to make a lot of good full-length albums. that's why most musical artists in the west usually have like 2-3 years between albums. they do take breaks, obviously, but they're also working on their music during that time.
I think twice still puts out quality full length albums, most of their best songs are actually random tracks that go largely unnoticed outside the fandom
I’m not a once, but Formula of Love is easily one of my fav albums. Every song deserves to be a hit. Absolutely fantastic album.
Formula of love is their best album they have ever made. I haven’t stopped listening to it since it came out. such an amazing and well produced album.
i agree. formula of love, eyes wide open, and even their most recent japanese albums are wonderfully made. i also feel that twice's eps tend to follow a particular concept and even if theyre shorter, each song goes with that concept to make something cohesive (a good example is taste of love w bright summery love songs)
Yes! Especially their last two full albums, Formula of Love & Eyes Wide Open!
Eyes wide open is a banger of an album ✨✨✨✨
I think YG has had a big impact on how the K-Pop scene has embraced the small releases. The concept of the YG Dungeon is very well known; not letting your artists release music too often, to create a scarcity market for it. With Blackpink, I think they really went overboard with it. You have a group with some of the best trained Idols, and instead of showcasing their abilities in music, they are brand ambassadors and models, who also occasionally have a side-gig in music. And it worked. Since their debut in 2016, they have released just over 30 original songs, yet their brand value is the highest in the competition. To put that into perspective, Twice debuted roughly a year earlier, and they have over 170 individual songs released. I think there is a sweet spot somewhere in the middle, for your average group.
When other companies are looking at how to promote their artists, what strategies to utilize, what will give the most profit per invested money, it's hard to argue against the YG method. They are getting tremendous returns for relatively little effort, by promoting musical artists in anything and everything, besides music.
Can't remember the group in question, but when asked about when they would be having their first concert, one of the members replied to the fans, that they just don't have the discography, they don't have enough songs to do that yet. This isn't uncommon. Companies will get their money back through various promotions, ad deals and merch, but for the Artists themselves to get paid, they usually actually need to be able to go on a stage and put on a show. If you don't have enough songs to do that, you are effectively denied the opportunity to earn your own money, which in turn forces you to be dependent on the company for longer. I suspect this might be partly why this is such a common practice. It doesn't help, that they are recruiting kids, who don't understand contract law, just that they wanna sing and dance and be famous.
TLDR: smaller releases offer more returns per investment to the company and shareholders, than larger ones; create a false scarcity; and force the artists to depend on the company, as they are denied the opportunity to become financially independent.
About the tour thing. Itzy managed to go on a world tour with only 5 songs. So I think it partly depends what company you're under as well
@@DoubleMonoLR well it was technically a showcase tour, so I see what you’re saying. It wasn’t just song after song, they had game segments and stuff to fill out the time.
But my point was that it really depends how much the company is willing to invest in their groups and how much money the company has to spend on stuff like concerts/tours
@@rjaw_itzy itzy has been in industry for so long yet seem like just debut kpop group.
Honestly YG dungeon Formula only works for Blackpink,no other groups in YG are popular.
And Blackpink success is Mostly Becz of hardworking Blinks the amount of Edits they create to keep Blackpink In trend,Twitter,YT,Insta, Pinterest etc
No wonder they are most dedicated Fandom in kpop.
@@hmmmk7630 fr
Someone who hasn’t fallen to this curse is billlie! They debuted a little bit over a year ago and have had 3 main EPS and two special seasonal singles , and they will have another EP on march 28th!
Billlie is just built diff
Omg finally someone who mentions billlie! After gingamingayo, I checked out all their music and I especially loved the chapter two EP, it was so good. I’m definitely looking forward to more music from them, they seem really promising.
The OST versions are also *chefs kiss* perfection
the main thing that bothers me is that the songs themselves are becoming so short. I feel like it’s kinda rare now to find a song that’s 3:15 - 3:30 minutes long, a lot of songs I hear now fall under 3 minutes. I don’t mind mini albums as long as the album isn’t 14 minutes in total and the production quality is good. and I also agree that concept albums are basically nonexistent now, I wish albums now sounded more cohesive.
Maybe that has something to do with the fact that there is also a limit in music shows. It is extremely rare that a 4 minute song is performed uncut. On the other hand, a very good but short song is better than one that is artificially drawn out. Butterfly by LOONA has a rather long instrumental part but in shows it had to be shortened a lot to fit into the "stage time". The same happened with Ponzona by Purple Kiss. Sometimes it's just the song structure though. STAYC's Beautiful Monster is also only about 3 minutes long but is still a bit longer than Teddy Bear and yet BM felt shorter. Quality > Quantity ;)
as someone who collects cds and actually played them often, it is honestly a shame how quickly i have to switch them out just bc of how few track or how short the songs are in the mini album. i like these artists and i’d like to play a cd and indulge in the music for even just a bit loner
I agree with this and that is what honestly holding me back from saying I like an artist after a year or longer. Ive and NMIXX have not enough discography for me to decide yet. I think an artist needs around 10 songs to decide if you actually like the artists music style or just one or 2 songs out of their discography.
If you want a good directed album or longer eps I recommend (G)I-DLES I never die which was released in 2022. Also their eps usually have 6 songs which is nowadays huge. They are masters in creating concepts and follow it in their ep/album. They also have so many gem bsides like villain dies, dhalia, change and maze.
"have not enough discography for me to decide yet" This!!!!! thank you for saying that out loud. I've also been struggling to determine whether I stan a group or not, because I'm waiting for 3 consistent comebacks with enough material, but they constantly keep dropping single songs. It's sadly not enough :(
@@soomi for Ive's case it's just a starship does to groups to see if people like them, then after some single albums at debut they start releasing albums, now Ive is gonna drop a full album with 12 songs on april
I think that ever since BTS has stopped doing like their well known trilogy conceptual albums the whole industry also shifted. Because before like during HYYH or the Love Yourself series and even during Map of the Soul these groups pumped albums they did trilogies not like extremely well but they tried to bring things out in a way. But then Covid arrived and BTS decided to take things a little differently and just did a single Dynamite which was literally the most successful song ever and so the industry saw that and they just decided that this is best for now. Idk what will happen in the future but I feel like when BTS comeback all together and release an album album and maybe even start a new trilogy I think that the industry will change as well specifically for groups!
Yep! BTS have an extremely huge influence on the way kpop music moves!
I disagree. "They did trilogies not like extremely well" did you forget "Map of the soul: 7" was 2nd most selling album in 2020 (in the WHOLE WORLD) with 4 Million sales on its first week, before Dynamite was released on the same year? It's a full-length album with 20 tracks in it. It's supposed to be a trilogy album following the Jungian concept of map of the soul but they combined "Shadow" and "Ego" concept in one album for their 7th anniversary and called it "Map of the soul: 7". Did Kpop groups/labels pick up on this psychological concept of human development or made a full legnth album this long? No.
After the single Dynamite, BTS released their third studio album "BE". It has 7 tracks excluding a skit. The album was not really in their plan to do that year but did so out of the frustrating pandemic situation and it's lead single "Life goes on" debuted at no.1 at BB hot 100, the first Korean song to reach the top. DId the Kpop industry pick up on this achievement and made their own sentimental song/album about the pandemic?
After BE, BTS released two songs made to cheer up ARMY : "Permission to dance" and "Butter" both are singles, NOT AN ALBUM, that reach BB hot 100 no. 1. Butter being performed at the Grammys, the first Korean group to perform at the Grammys!
It's important to note that in within the timeframe in which these three succesful English songs were released, BTS released Korean and Japanese albums that has over 10 songs which no one from Kpop (except ARMY) have cared about and Kpoppers mock BTS for being "westernized" due these 3 English songs and blame them for the degression of music quality in Kpop (lol) or even in what you're trying to say "influenced" the whole industry on how many songs they put out in an album which I think, if the whole Kpop industry were really REALLY influenced by BTS's musical moves, they would have released MORE music because that's what BTS is doing constantly even now in their solo careers. Last year, BTS released their anthology album "PROOF" a very long album. Were the the kpop labels influenced to do the same? NO.
If anything, I guess the whole Kpop industry was influenced by YG's moves towards releasing few songs in an album, starving the fans for the next comeback and they got away with it because they were able to make BP the most popular GG with just 30+ songs in their whole idol career. And I think most gg in the 4th gen follows the footsteps of Blackpink and bg would want to follow the path of BTS but they could barely keep up with the constant release of songs from BTS members.
Sorry for the long reply.
It's true. Stray kids, BTS, and nct are truly the only artists I stream just because of the size of their music discographies so there is enough that I do not get bored and have variety when streaming their new albums. Also, thank you for the opinion on maxident, I also thought it was messy, especially compared to the much more cohesive oddinary which had a much more clear artistic vision and sound compared to maxident and especially the recent replay album. I dont want an album of solos from a group, I want to listen to the group, I'd listen to a solo artist instead for a solo song. If you want to do solo music, release a full subunit or solo album instead of padding out the group album with subunit releases. No matter how good a song, if you have a discography of less than even ten songs it's going to get boring very quickly and you will want more songs to pad out your listening time, which means listening to other artists. Especially since on the mini albums they still have intros and outros that people do not stream, maybe one good secondary song and two not so thought out b sides. And then only one or two music videos where the whole budget clearly got put into the title track. It's predictable to a fault and I want full length albums. But in my opinion kpop (specifically idol music) is designed to be singles release artists, and discourage conceptual or album focused artists.
For me, I’m primarily a STAY and a (trying to be non-toxic) BLINK. For me, yes, MAXIDENT was a bit of a disappointment, I think it was to the majority of the fanbase, simply because ODDINARY is amazing and MAXIDENT is honestly mid (“not good, not bad”). As for SKZ’s longer albums like GO LIVE/IN LIFE, they were ok, but let’s say they consisted of songs I love and listen to as much or more than the title track (like Easy, Any or TA. Even the NOEASY unit songs) ans the songs I don’t ever pay attention to (like Blueprint). And for BLACKPINK, let’s say absolutely everyone has things to say about the size of their discography. Their discography consisting of 2 2-song single albums, As If It’s Your Last, 2 4-song mini albums, Kiss and Make Up, Sour Candy, and 2 8-song “full albums”, and a bunch of covers/remakes is just, not enough for a graph approaching their contract renewal. BLINKs are literally at the point where they’ll count iconic covers like “So Hot” a song just because, they don’t have enough actual songs. I do find all of their songs at the minimum good (except Typa Girl, Typa Girl is bad/horrible and you can not convince me otherwise) but please 8 songs do not qualify for a full album. At least there’s finally news that YG will shorten hiatuses, but… BLINKs have no faith in YG now.
I feel like this happened because of YG’s strategy with Blackpink.
You’d think that not having many songs would put a lot of people off because listening to the same few songs over and over again gets boring. But blinks showed it’s possible to get insane numbers with limited songs, so other companies want to minimise budget while still getting a good payoff. Except, they know they don’t have the clout that YG does, to create diehard fans before a group even has a single song under their belt. So it’s a slightly altered less is more strategy. More comebacks, with less songs each comeback. Give people a taste, keep them interested, without spending extra money on a longer album.
Because, I swear, debuting with singles was practically unheard of until Blackpink. And now basically every group debuts with a single instead of mini album.
@@LaurenPebble Agree. You can notice how some girls groups of the big 3 and Hybe are following BP steps.
I recently found Nct since BTS’ hiatus and it’s been so refreshing. I like when an album is no-skip and actually tells a story/takes you on a journey.
How can these new groups tour w/ absolutely no songs in their discography? I dunno how BP made it work, but they are the biggest joke where their idols need to do cover songs in order to pad their concerts. It’s one thing where a huge gg can get away w/ it but if the entire generation starts doing it how does anyone expect kpop to be taken seriously let alone grow? It’s all about a quick cash grab today over long term future growth & forget about artistic growth
le ssera just announced at fearnada (their fanmeeting) that their cb in may would be a full album !!
I personally, won't mind if it took 3-4 years for a group to release an album. Infact, i'm a fan of mini albums rather than a full ones. Some of artists' full albums that i found it skippable, some of them are worth to listen to each and every track. Because, releasing a full album almost felt like a double edged swords.
I agree with that, the problem is that even mini albums are disappearing. Now you only see singles with an extra song
Definitely agree with you on this. Sometimes with mini albums or eps there is always a few tracks in there that I see as “filler” and not really a “different” song, I would much rather wait for a comeback that is with a full length album rather than a constant stream of mini albums, but that’s just my opinion
As a stan who's been in the community since 2015. Thanks for talking about this cause especially on twitter, theses kind of opinions are just classed as "4th gen hate". But it's simply the truth, there's no single group who need 3-4 music videos per album when said album only has 4 tracks.
In general I agree but isn’t it better to have a mini with 4 great songs than an 8 song album with one good TT and the rest mid songs?
Lol your take on Skz and albums is vastly different from mine. I legit love their recent stuff. And 3Racha is one of my favorites of their discography. Something about it is just a VIBE for me.
We've got a difference of opinion and that's fine.
Speaking of an Albums in 2023 I think it's changing for the better there's groups that are coming back with full albums like I've is FINALLY comeback with thier full album and Aespa next month is making a full album with solos and nmixx is coming back with thier first mini album so I think this album problem will be solved
I'm excited that newer groups are finally getting more music, but there in lies the issue, IVE is FINALLY getting an actual album, NMIXX is FINALLY getting an album, when most 3rd gen artists debuted with 8 song long albums.
@@Taejiu tbh tho it isnt a generational issue. for example, sistar (from starship, same company as ive) also had 3 single albums released after debut before a subunit which was followed by a full album and they are a 2nd generation group. also blackpink from 3rd gen also had 3 single albums before their first mini. so i wouldnt say its a trend, its just really dependent on the company the artist is under
@@ives_galaxy Again I think this has been going on for a while, and I wouldn't use BP as an example because BP doesn't get music PERIOD. Starship just doesn't love giving their female artists albums I guess, seeing as Monsta X gets them all the time.
@@Taejiu wjsn had an ep as their debut as i wouldnt say that lol and mamamoo also had their first release as a single (one song)
@@ives_galaxy wouldn’t that just bolster my point then? I’m just confused lol
To be completely and brutally honest here, BTS and its members individually are the only artists in kpop who care about the song sequencing, album length cohesive lyrics, consistency of theme in an album, new and different genres of sound and Music Videos that are in line with the concept of the songs and album. J-hope's Jack in the box was the most consistent album of 2022 sound wise. RM had a consistent theme of art and its effects on people's with his lyrics on Indigo. SUGA has given 2 coherent rap albums with actually good rap. And we all know how BTS as a group is very notorious on their albums, always having good storytelling and a consistent sound throughout the LP or EP. They have only released one 'single album' in their 10 years of career. That's how I know they're here only for the arts. It's their artistry that takes them to the charts.
you SPILLED
absolutely, they’re not only involved but basically in charge of their work, especially with their solo releases you can just see that music is what’s always gonna come first for them. jack in the box & indigo were so refreshing sound wise & lyrically impressive, I’m excited to see what direction the rest of the members go
BTS and its constituent solo members are definitely the most prominent artists to do so, but it's hardly fair to say they are the only artists in kpop who care to carefully and comprehensively create their albums. There are lots of soloists with cohesive, well-executed albums (even if only minis). And though my knowledge of all kpop groups and their discographies is by no means encyclopedic, I can think of about 4 groups with good, cohesive albums/minis off the top of my head.
I know BTS is the most successful group in the Kpop arena, and that reflects well on their skill and love for the craft, but I also appreciate the care and effort of others.
@Maria 49 tell me those 4 artists and their best album, and I'll check it out and get back to you. Let's have a discussion
@@deepshah5332 i’m not the person that commented but i can definitely recommend for you to check shinee and their solo stuff out, specially jonghyun’s.
Another issue with smaller track lists is potential concerts... in that they won't have a large enough discography to warrant a having them. THAT hurts artists if they can't perform live. Unless you're an except to the rule like Blackpink who can get away with touring with 15 songs, that's money those idols aren't getting. Keep in mind, concerts make a bunch of money, not just in ticket sells but in merch, and idols need to be doing more of those... not only to interact with the fans but to get a proper payday that wouldn't be getting in other avenues. So yeah, lack of songs hurts streaming, it hurts albums sells, and it hinders concert opportunities. Short EPs only satisfy the immediate... the now, but it doesn't look out for the long term.
i’m a stay and i’m glad to hear more people also felt the same about maxident!! personally, i do like songs individually, chill, give me your tmi and taste are my favourite bsides here. but when put together the track list just feels so disjointed with no clear narrative or sound going on. oddinary was much more put together but still left me missing something.
it’s strange bcs they can and have made cohesive bodies of work, their clé trilogy eps back in 2019 are a stand out in my opinion. they are a great bodies of work by themselves as well as fitting into the wider narrative
I can't stop coming back to this video, literally no one is talking abt how big of an issue this is, I'm tired of 270 mini albums and no full album in sight
Definitely agree especially because I’m someone who LOVES albums. I love listening to them all the way through, finding my favorite songs and looking into the lyrics. It’s such an enjoyable experience. Maybe I’m wrong but I feel like even the songs have gotten so much shorter, like a whole minute is cut off nowadays.
i blame tiktok fr
@@silque575Literally coz every song gotta have that catchy line that everyone be going crazy
The most interesting thing while listening to an artist is the artistic growth thay have! And just as you said, it's something that could be achived only by making enough music to put out a full-length album every comback, or atleast every year. I want artists to experiment different types of genres, and as they keep making albums, they will find their own uniqe voice in the industry. K-pop nowdays making music for the sole of making new trends, only some of them making music for the sole of making music, making art.
I just wanna share this:
There's this Filipino podcast that I listened to, and the two hosts and the guest (a famous Filipino musician) talks about his experiences before in making an album. He said that nowadays, a lot of artists (in general) release single albums, but it was a lot of fun making a full album. He compares it to a theater play/production, wherein each act/part must have cohesion. Songs should be continuous, or else, the concept of the album will be all over the place, which is why it's fun, cause it's like telling stories.
In relation to this video, I 100% believe what he said. Yes it's understood, especially for rookies to release singles, since releasing a whole album is too costly as a rookie. However, for the more famous artists, it's kinda sad that they still choose to release single after single, when their companies have the means to produce an entire album. That's why I really liked BTS' HYYH, EXO's Winter albums, Exodus, XOXO, and many other full length albums that tell stories and give concepts. Also, there's a lot of "easter eggs" in albums compared to just singles. Having concepts, although better, is not the main point imo. I just wish that companies would not be lazy and put out 10, 12, even 5 or 7-track albums, cause I feel like this is like becoming a "fast-fashion" in the K-pop music industry 😕😕
I have been increasingly worried with the rise of EP and single releases. I am going to bring another reason. I feel that we can't justify purchasing phydical albums for 2-4 songs. It's great that you're getting photocards and more. However, I just do not see why I should pay for so little. Back in the days, we were getting 8 to 15 songs. In the west, it would not fly releasing physical albums with only 2-4 songs. And, I also feel that it's one of the reasons (albeit smaller) why K-Pop acts will have a hard time getting a footing in the west. You need a decently length discography to showcase.
also, i feel like having full length albums helps the albums concept to fully reach it’s potential. or even try putting a song that’s outside of the albums concept. like weekend in INVU.
Mostly I listen to NCT, Shinee, Exo, Red velvet, and SNSD since they have long discography. Also, I like the discography of billlie.
Seventeen is the best. So many b-sides/deep cuts, so many years of self-written-and-produced music. 'Face the Sun' had a clear, realized concept, and (with Sector 17) we got 13 songs (plus all the random solos and covers the members did throughout the year and the Japanese release, Dream.). Can't wait to see what they come back with in April.
I've noticed this too and even smaller groups like 9muses, dia, and other 3rd-2nd gen groups were always making mini and full album's showcasing their talent, versatility, and cohesiveness at once.
and even the mini's wstill had 6-7 songs compared to nowadays mini's only consist for 4 songs or they'll make a group release a random single with a terrible bside
Mini albums are part of the reason it's so hard for us younger kpop fans to convince our parents to let us buy albums. My parents have always been all for CDs and keeping that "old" music culture alive, but when they see that the CD I want has FIVE SONGS on it, they wonder why the heck I would pay so much money for a five-song CD. Obviously, the albums come with photobooks, photocards, and tons of other extras that I love and enjoy, but I do have laptops with CD players at home and I like to listen to my kpop CDs, so I think longer albums would help lots of younger fans with stricter parents have more access to physical albums because the albums would be more easily accepted by older generations.
At first, I wasn't sure if I completely agreed with you, but once you brought up the point of how a lack of albums kills an artist's longevity, I began to understand your point. I am a hardcore MOA, TXT is my ult but recently, I've began to notice that I'm listening to them less. At first, I though it was a personal thing, like "oh, maybe I'm just not into them like I used to be", but after hearing your point, I think that's part of the issue. The Dream Chapter: Magic is one of my favourite albums of all time, I was listening to it for months afterwards with phases of falling in love with each and every song. For their latest two mini-albums, which were unfortunately the only music they dropped during their respective years due to touring, there were five songs on each, with their lastest having very short, less than three minute songs, often repeating the chorus and lacking a bridge. I probably listened to Temptation for a month before moving onto something else. I still love them so much, but I can tell that there's been a choice to make easy, quick catchy music that will trend on tiktok which has the consequence of growing stale quickly. It's disheartening to say the least.
One group I really want to mention is NCT 127. They came out with amazing minis/EPs before releasing a full length album two years after debuting. They really took the time to build their image and establish themselves rather than rushing into popularity. I still listen to their first mini album because the songs are so good. They were managed pretty well early on. It also doesn’t help that it seems like everyone just wants a tiktok challenge out of everything, only to be forgotten like a couple months later on. It sucks.
Edit: How can I forget Monsta X. I used to be obsessed with the clan pt.1 and pt.2. The concept was so cool and they stayed with it consistently for those eras. I definitely recommend listening to those two minis. I haven’t listened to them in so long but they were my favorite and they have put out so many amazing music.
Yeah and NCT maintains their experimental sound and has bsides and smstations that are from other genres like ballad, rnb, exploring really well the talents vocal line and rapline! I love this SM characteristic of always putting a cohesive mini, ep or full, maintaining the group or soloist brand.
Of course in 2nd and 3rd gen there used to be more "albuns" and live albuns like EXO for instance has almost 200 or more songs.
I sometimes prefer mini albums rather than full albums. More songs just seems like more space for error, so I'd rather that kpop artists release minis than albums if the albums are filled with half-baked songs in favor to pad up the run length. That being said, some minis suffer from the same problem with filler tracks so it's really an issue of companies not caring to produce and sell higher quality music in high qualities (which isn't easy obvi) in favor of releasing quicker, less high-quality releases which we as kpop fans a lot of the times eat up until the next release.
Well careful what you ask because it seems like this year is gonna be the battle of the full albums, IVE, Aespa, Le Sserafim are just 3 of the groups that we know will release full albums in the next 2 months. However, I think IVE will probably also include the previous 3 title tracks on it so... yeah, but still, as long as we get 6-9 new songs, we good. I think LeSse and Aespa will have only new songs because Aespa already did that with their previous comeback and LeSse never released just single albums.
Same thing happened last year too, I would rather there be a full year of albums than this past year.
i think this year is actually going to be a good year for rookie ggs
-nmixx are about to release their first mini album
-le sserafim is releasing their first full length album
-kep1er is rumored to be releasing their first full length album in april
-idk whether it's a mini or full album but ive is finally releasing one of those most likely a mini which is always better than a single imo
i'm pretty optimistic for this year honestly i don't see full albums dying out i just think companies want to release them as often but honestly i can't complain if we get minis it's single albums i have a problem with
ive is actually releasing a full album with 12 songs!
and i need izone back with a full album
The main issue with albums getting shorter is that it makes casual listeners out weight the actual fans and maybe groups like Ive and NewJeans are doing verygood for now but as most of their listeners are non fans it can hurt the groups longevity bcuz if they don't have comebacks enough general public will move on to another group and after that the lack of a solid fanbase will hurt the group hard and force them to disband...
(sorry for awfull writting and grammar I'm not fluent)
But both groups have comebacks 4 months apart from each one, IVE is also releasing a full 12 song album on April 10th, it will probably have the 3 previous title tracks on it but it will still have 9 new songs my guess. It’s really not as bad as people make it seem. These groups are new, some are not even 1 year old and they have regular comebacks.
@@2FullMoons well... I was talking about RIGHT NOW and how the lack of proper b-side can hurt them in a long run and it's as serious as its look like but if they are gonna come back with a proper album good for them I might even bocome a fan
Billlie's mini albums feel more like "real" albums to me. The only real k-pop albums that I can recall from recent years, that I listened to, are from Twice. The full albums are relatively long, high number of songs, and even the mini albums have quite a lot songs. Bibi's album was also great. I would love to see more longer albums in k-pop. Any recommendation for long k-pop albums?
You just get bored easily and it is harder to create a connection through the music this way. I may forget about NewJean's songs when I get sick of it, but with BTS and songs like Whalien 52, I'm always going to get back to them because of how much their music mean to me
Great points AND it's becoming even more frustrating when songs are only 2:40 mins long or so on an already short album. Like it's so uninspiring and feels like the song is just made for tiktok like you mentioned. No bridge, outro or intro, like just chorus and vibes. I don't see this changing either because the people who care about this are in the minority. Most fans are happy with the shallow experience of hit songs without artistic substance imo.
I really relate to that feeling of wanting more from an album, artists . And thanks for pointing out about maxident . I too was sensing the unnatural flow in that . I mean life is missing in that album. I just felt bored or just forget I was listening to it . I also agree about Le Sserafim's album. It's not enough , it just felt incomplete . Even though I like them , it's making me unsatisfied as a fan because I bought those albums with a certain amount of cash ok . The abundance of emotions and flow when you listening to an album is lacking . I guess that's what you get when the artists are not good enough to produce good sounds , it's not enough just knowing how to write a song, that's just a basic skill for a musician, you have to be good at it. You have to have a distinct identity for that . For that , we have to wait a little longer I guess. Until then , they won't be my go-to albums .
And I have to say this , most of BTS's outro are * chef kiss
so glad to stan billlie who literally debuted with experimental title track AND SIX SONGS OVERALL
I agree w this sm. there’s certain groups I feel like that have a cohesive sound like ateez, skz, and idle. I’ll use atz bc they’re my ults and ik the most about them. but they have 2 (I think) full length albums and they’re constantly doing different sounds and experimenting with genres. when you listen to their music its like you can tell what era the song is from. like their most recent world ep 1 movement album is so well made. all of the songs have the same feel that guerrilla did and flow so well together and it doesn’t feel rushed.
To me, b-sides and non-title tracks were where idols could have more creative control and express themselves more, since title tracks usually have to be constructed to appeal to as many people as possible. Seeing them being taken away feels like idols are getting even less control and aren't being allowed to express themselves musically. It's honestly sad how Kpop idols are going from music artists to influencers.
IVE are coming back on the 10th April with a FULL album with TWELVE, I REPEAT 12 songs!!! YAY we cheered !!
12?? 😱 so excited!
im scared its gonna have all their previous songs on it and like 3 new songs🙁
JUST IMAGINE ALL THE TIME THEY SLAYED AND WE ARE GONNA GET 12 NEW STUFF I HOPE IT WOULD BE AS GOOD AS THEIR OTHER SONGS
I hope it’s 12 new songs and not remixes of older songs
@@sofietheworld even if it does they only got 6 songs, so that's at least 6 new songs
Honestly this is not just a kpop problem cause even some pop artists are making song for tiktok now
I'm actually a fan on minialbums, but they only work if groups continue to put them out. I love lesserafims minialbums so far because they are cohesive (intro, banger tt, my least fav bside, my fav bside with rock elements, a slower pop song). It's divers, shows different sides.
like I've, StayC, New Jeans, nmixx are groups with a lack of songs. StayCs first mini album is amazing and I'm exited for I've first full album.
Blackpink for example to me don't have a full album. 8 songs is not what a full album should have. 8 songs is a mini album. For the amount of time they are active they don't have enough songs that have longlifity. For Straykids they have an over exaggeration of songs. They put out songs so frequently that they kind of forget about quality. I love the Noeasy album, it's amazing but after that album, there was no Straykids song that wowed me like their songs before and music keeps on coming and I kind of can't catch up with all their releases. I think they need to take some rest and reflect more on their music.
I also wanted to mention the prices for the physical albums. I don’t understand why these physical albums are like from $20-$50 for a 4-7 song Ep or mini album like I’d rather buy an album for like $15 bucks with more than 10 songs at least I’d want to get my moneys worth.
You’re paying primarily for the photo book and the packaging. A $10-$15 dollar CD comes in a cheap plastic case and a tiny slip of paper with writing and production credits in it, and maybe lyrics if you’re lucky. Meanwhile a $20-$50 kpop cd comes with a massive photo book, artfully designed lyric pages, and beautiful, unique packaging. You’re paying for the aesthetic essentially. Honestly, I absolutely hate that recent album releases have come in a jewel case version.
I didn't even realize Kpop even does Interludes and Skits, Intros themselves feel rare. I do like the idea of adding them in to EP/ Mini albums.
Like give us a cute Convo or something
I highly recommend Billlie! No full albums yet but consistently 6 tracks and they also have OST versions of 2 of their albums! Also their creative director puts so much work into the music and lore. And they've done 4 (with the new album incoming) different styles of music already! I have a feeling they may eventide eventually do a full album too!
Yeahhh i love discovering rare songs in groups/soloists I stan or casually follow. Like even if the artist arent self produced, when their discography is cohesive, creative or really interesting, it way more everlasting in making me stream it than just enjoying their beauty and hype on kpop circles
As much as I agree with you, there's also the problem that audiences just skim through full length albums, place the songs that immediately grab their attention on playlists and ignore the rest. Companies are seeing this behavior and probably thinking "why the hell should we waste our money if only a small percentage of people are going to listen to all the songs?"
For sure, I mean there are points to be had for both sides. I get why companies wouldn't want to, but I feel like more music is better than less, even if the more music isn't as great.
Most fans will listen to the whole album, while casual listeners will skim through. And having more songs to get an idea of a group’s sound is more likely to make more people fans.
Thats because the majority of kpop albums hace tons of filler ballads or badly produced mediocre pop songs that have 0 replayability. If you want people to actually replay the songs on the albums you have to make an effort, people still to this day listen to pink tape and Max & match.
I like what you said about finding a deep cut. It’s my favourite thing about listening to a full album.
I agree with most everything you said. To me when it comes to KPOP or pretty much any type of music, visuals and everything else are secondary. It's all about the music for me. 90% of the time I'm just listening to the song, not watching a video.
Album length is just terrible and I agree it's mostly a 4th Gen problem but I think Blackpink really kick started this trend. The amount of songs they have is pathetic compared to most groups who have been around a few years. I think Dreamcatcher has almost 3 times as many songs as Blackpink.
Nobody expected Bp to become this big even Teddy himself said it.
Today Blackpink is at the top all thanks to hardcore blinks..
They will do Everything To keep Blackpink in trend..Blackpink fan Edits are flooded everywhere YT, insta,Twitter,facebook.
It's not Becz YG Kept them in dungeon(Treasure,winner,Ikon didn't make it like Blackpink).
70% of blackpink success is from blink.20% Their Visual,5% songs,5% Jenlisa.
lesserafim just announced full album comeback! jimin is having a debut ive is having a full album! hope we get good music!
I agree with this. I definitely agree with you on this.
I understand your disappointment with the industry not releasing full bodies of work that have cohesive themes, but K-Pop has always been like this. Its not actually a new thing. K-Pop has never been built around the album rollout system that you see in the Western music system. SISTAR only has 2 full length albums, so does 2NE1. WG has 3. RV has 2. Its an exception to have full length albums only really reserved for groups/soloists with a very profitable turnover. It costs a lot of money to produce a full-length album and companies are not interested in that. The vast majority of groups are lucky to even get ONE full length album. If they're not making the money, its simply not happening.
Companies are interested in quick turnover: single albums and EPs are low risk and high reward. Not sure what you're saying about the 2nd generation having lots of albums because they simply did not. Most of them only ever had 1 - 3 albums. SNSD are an exception as they're still somewhat active after fifteen years and sold as many physical albums - if not more - than boy groups. Which meant that investing in the production of those albums was worth it. In a sense, full length albums are indicative of how successful a group is -- particularly how powerful their fandom is. Because the general public rarely buys physical albums. The more successful a group the higher chance that they'll have a full length album. In rare cases it depends on the vision of the group's creative director, for example f(x) has four full length albums despite their short career and inconsistent fandom.
As a SONE, I have to admit that most of their albums were garbage. Random crap that wasn't even cohesive save for a few good songs.
Only the Wonder Girls, BEG, SHINee, and IU are famous for releasing full, thematic, bodies of work from second generation. You need to do more research.
I was a little said when TXTs comeback had the same amount of songs as the minisode especially since that was the only release last year but they have had chapters with 5 songs before so I hope for atleast 7 songs next time.
They should let txt have more time to breath while they are touring but ofc bighit doesn't do that for them .TXT reminds me a lot of blackpink for some reasons .Idk whether the members themselves wanted that or not but surely I think they dont want to miss an opportunity to record more songs .
this is so true and i have been realizing that myself. Before i used to stan like 2 main groups and most of the time listen to them more than anything but now i cant even say i stan a group bc my playlist is full of one or two songs from 20 groups and this not only makes me not want to get that invested to the groups but also i dont even feel like buying their albums bc i dont feel attached enough. Having to wait almost a year for a 4 songs track album is not worth it to even become a fan of. I went from a hardcore kpop fan to a casual fan bc of the state that kpop is rn.
I understood why Dreamcatcher, for instance, waited so long to have a full length album. They needed to get money and an audience before putting one out. But for groups from big companies who don’t have those problems it doesn’t make sense not to do at least 1 full length album every so often.
I do agree with the other commentor that not many people check out b-sides so it could feel like a waste. But ultimately that could also hinder them. I just really hope we don’t get another Blackpink type (not the girls but the group in general) group for awhile or ever again. I love these girls and I do like their music. But the amount of songs and the way they were promoted and the breaks in between made me really disinterested. Everyone wanted full length albums from them and it was like pulling teeth to even get a comeback. I just hope we don’t get that again from other groups.
I hope more groups start releasing albums again. But that doesn’t seem to be where to wind is blowing.
Instant gratification has trapped us all. Companies want the max results with minimum effort. The next big hit is more important than the long term career. Groups get viral fame but cultivate only bandwagon stans. And as soon as the song starts to stale they gotta throw out the next hit before everyone moves on. I am so tired of hearing a group has a new release, going to Spotify to check the album out, and only finding two or three songs. And note this is all a problem with big companies and larger mid sized companies. Smaller companies I am not gonna fault them for struggling to release music, they don’t all have the resources to hire the producers or even the studio time for full albums. For those groups, every day they avoid disbandment is a win.
As a Midzy I agree that it was sad Cheshire was so short (although they had JUST had a Japanese comeback as well so it wasn't as if I felt starved) however I appreciate the fact that apart from that Itzy mini-albums will be 6-7 songs long with no 1minute intro songs and their Album was 10 songs (not including the 6 extra instrumental tracks).
I listen to a lot of other groups albums and so often when they have more songs it feels like less thought has been put into each one and for me a lot are "filler" songs. (Then again, INVU was immaculate)
i hate to say this but some of the more recent releases from 3rd and 4th gen groups (once again i wanna emphasize that i said SOME) give me the same feeling that abcdefu song gave me. like nothing about them is good, they use a sample from another song but don't give credit nor do they use it in a fun and interesting way (eg: Pink Venom using 3 different songs but making nothing original or fun), and they're all 2.5 minutes or shorter. it's been said time and time again but wtf happened to songs that have 2 verses, 3 choruses, and a bridge? what genuinely made people enjoy those songs more? it's can't be because it's the more successful format because people like Taylor Swift, BTS, and others who make generally longer songs still rule the charts over these groups that are trying to just get more streams by making the song shorter (and effectively lower quality IMO). it's disappointing to see how much k-pop has changed over recent years in order to fit in with the new age of social media when in reality... you can't just make a song go viral by making it easy to sing along to/repetitive. just look at fifty fifty and Cupid, i bet they weren't aiming for a viral song when they released it yet it's probably the most popular and viral song to come out of k-pop in the past few months. also if these companies think i'm actually gonna spend anything over $10 for 4 mid songs and a PC, they're so wrong.
That’s why I love bts as a group and as solo artists
My favorite album from last year was I Never Die, Not onky did it have a great title track but all the besides had a vision and fit the albums concept of rock. You had songs like never stop me, my bag and liar which were more upbeat and in between you had already or Polaroid. Also their second album of the year I Love. From the last to the first song it tells a story of starting to love yourself instead of needing love from others. That’s what I love about idle, they choose a concept for a comeback and run with it in every way, the songs, the mv, the styling, it just feels very authentic
i feel like we also need to aknowledge that this is an issue that heavily impacts female idols more for different reasons along with the rise of tiktok and stuff.
1. kpop companies never really put as much effort and budget into developing their gg's identity and music. most of the budget goes to bgs while companies focus on only giving their female idols public friendly visually apealing title tracks. they don't even expect the ggs to sell much. lets remember that one of the first groups this "short album" phanomenon happened to were BP. compare their outputs to their label mates. ggs from smaller companies with only 1 group tend to be better off when it comes to this (ex: Dreamcatcher, loona, billie,...).
2. you made a point about how self producing groups tend to get longer albums, well most ggs aren't allowed to self produce so there's that. if they are even evaluated the trainee system with self producing in mind.
3. companies give their groups longer albums when they expect them to have concerts where the unpromoted B-sides can be sung. again, ggs barely get any concert opportunities even after being successful, while even the most nugu boygroups get concerts.
Strongly agree with this video. The only 4th gen group who's albums I've really wanted to buy is OnlyOneOf's. Up until their most recent comeback, they've kept a very cohesive theme in their releases. Especially Instinct pt 1 and pt 2.
I 100% agree with you, is also a problem when you want to stan a new group, some people will tell you that they love x group music and they have like FIVE SONGS, what music? 5 songs it's not enough, bc imagine if they have 5 songs and I only like 3... that's even worse, how can I support a group when I only like 3 of their songs? I know myself, and when I comes to music I'm very serious, I'm not going to eat everything my fav put out. I'm going to support them? yes, but I'm not going to listen to a song that I don't like, that is not me. Another thing that I notice is why these kind of albums are so expensive when they have less than 8 tracks? I'm sorry but am not a millionaire, I have bills to pay, if I'm going to pay for something, make it worth.
Just like you said I love long albums, you have so many options, everything is new and since is long you don't get bored easily, I love when an artist has something to say and is reflected in his music, it makes me feel that my time is valued but with 4th groups is like their companys don't care about the listeners, they only care about money, and i get it, is an industry but you are making music, you are selling me an artist... I don't care if you are pretty or if your fashion i'ts good, I listen to music not faces. My priority is music, that's the point. This industry has brainwashed a lot of people... And i'm not one of those, the same example is with concepts, I feel they just search for something new, they try to make it look like they have something important and then they throw it away like it's nothing, If your concept is about being in love, tell me a story, say something that has meaning, or at least that it makes sense.
I love Jack in the box, it was also my fav album, J-hope did an amazing job making that album. It's been on repeat since it came out, what are you thoughts on indigo from rm? I'm very curious, another album that I really like was pentagon's invite u, that project was so good. It's a shame that my boys are under that shitty company, cube I swear, give my boys some respect. Love the video, I really like it, we need to pay attention to this topics, it matters. If we as listeners don't care about it, then who is going to? company's don't care and it shows.
Companies are way too focused on making a quick buck, I feel, than actually spending the time to make a good album. It's sad, I really hope it changes, but like u said I don't really see it changing.
i feel like using newjeans wasn’t smart just because they literally just started their career 😭 if their next cb isn’t a mini album AT LEAST, then it makes sense to feel this way. i feel blackpink is a great example because theyre a 6 year old group with less then 30 songs in their discography. and their “full albums” are barely 8 songs long. it’s just very bare minimum. but i completely understand what you’re saying and i fully agree.
I think his assessment of 4th Gen is wrong purely because of this.
Ive is from a mid-tier company, they didn't think that Eleven would be so well liked and that Love Dive would continue on with that success. New Jeans, Le-Sserafim, aespa are doing the right things to build hype.
I don't expect a full album from the first 2 years, maybe a couple of minis after the singles albums but their 3rd year is probably album year. It's always been this way.
I thought he'd talk about blackpink like you, or even Red Velvet who hasn't had a full album since Bad Boy, even (g) - idle's longest album is 8 tracks(the eighth being an explicit version so 7 tracks) txt has 2 albums but short as well their repackage is their longest with 11 songs(again 1 of them is a remix so 10 songs on a repackaged album??)
It should be third Gen artists releasing full albums at the beginning of 4th Gen, you cannot expect new artists to throw everything and the kitchen sink when they're not sure if they have a fanbase or not.
Blackpink-fication of kpop albums is worstthing to happen in kpop
Blackpink this blackpink that..western artist gives U full album in 2-3 yrs and they will disappear and come back for collab..
Atleast Blackpink all the 30+tracks are worth it and their Bsides are better than some of TT of other groups like pretty savage,dkwtd,forever young.unlike other Groups whose Only TT gets popular.
Twice has 180+ original songs but Monthly listeners??
Y'all always Dragged BP for not having many Awards let's be honest Do they make music for awards or pple to listen.
Listeners are most important not Payola Rigged awards..
I love me a good full album ❤
Mini albums are sometimes disappointing to me especially when there’s absolute bangers but there’s like 5 songs total including the title track 💔😀
My opinion: I hate when they put intros and outros in mini albums😭😭 they feel like fillers and I don’t like it. I feel robbed of good music because it’s usually just members talking dramatically with even more dramatic instrumental in the background
Don’t even get me started on repackaged albums 😟
I hate SM so much because of their dumb repackages
I agree on intros/outros! I never listen to them! If an album has them, even if it’s my fav group, I don’t download them. Complete skip.
I also like full albums more then these mini ones.
But that is because I listen to an album till I can hear it anymore.
I think some of my favourite bands have full albums that go nearly an hour and I think I listen to them a month straight (in the car, cleaning, getting ready,etc.) And with this lenght if you are not fully concentrated it does not feel repetitive. And with kpop albums it is not the same.
I like stray kids, but I have to admit that I started mixing their albums on spotify together, because it gets boring fast.
I know people dont always listen to intros and outros, but I have literally repalyed Lesserafims The world is my oyster for 4 hours and THe Hydra for an extra 2 hours doing study for my HSC maths exam and Enhypens Foreshadow for my English exam. That being said I'm all for the music in Kpop, thats how I got into BTS 4 years into loving kpop, but idk why some just very futuristic vauge noises with some elusive talking makes for really good study inducing background noise 10/10
Bro ENHYPEN's foreshadow is actually fire bro. Probably one of their best outro/song
well yes and no. it's not that all of these kpop ents don't care about the quality of music. sm has always been very serious about music since gen 1 of kpop. a&r and song camps in korea basically started with sm. hybe's labels are paying much more attention to music and a&r nowadays too. so it's not about 1:06 visuals but more money problem. it costs so much more money to make a full length album vs mini album / EP. but fans still buy albums regardless of their lengths. so ents are maximizing profit by just releasing EP vs full album.
but you are right about short gaps between comebacks. turnaround time is speeding up in kpop. and groups will soon be forgotten if they don't come back or show up somewhere in 3-4 months. so it is more convenient, especially for rookie groups who require much more exposure, to release 2-3 EPs first before releasing full lengths.
I've only started watching your videos last night, but after the really great overview you gave about the non-existent 4th-gen "Holy Trinity," I started watching several more. This one on albums was one of them, and this is a great video that I have not stopped thinking about for hours. It's a rare instance where I do agree with your points, evenif they also bump up with certain personal circumstances I have as a music listener. Sort of like, "yes, there is an album issue," but then again, it may not be an issue, at least from another perspective. Keep up the good work, and thanks for all your efforts!
this has also been on my mind and it irks me bc when i got into kpop back in 2014, i had a good handful of artists i'd support and stream their material but now im jumping from artist and artist because theres only 4 songs under their belt despite being a year old,
I am fine with cohesive mini albums of 5 to 6 songs a little more close in time that at the end give you a full album by year than a bunch of single releases each 2 or 3 months. And a full cohesive and carefull made album each 2 or 3 years like American artist. I feel too that there is not the need of one narrative across the album as long as the music is good and mantain some kind of cohesive tread (it can be the sound, the theme of the music, the feeling it evoques or the structure of the music, even if it is an experimentation music style as long as it is consistent on that I am fine).
Actually I think Viviz in a little more of one year has almost the same amount of music or half of BlackPink with 6 years in the industry.
I think market for GGs after 2022 is really tough, all companies or groups are nervous about is retaining initial fans and adding more afterwards slowly,so initially bangers tts even if singles are done to keep the listener hooked(case in point IVE banger tts and has people hooked for months until they find enough album sell threshold to put out a bigger album which they reached as after like sold over 1.5million).
Le Sserafim has more songs and I think it's also because they have direct support from Bang PD and I don't money matters, and they also broke the million threshold on first comeback itself.
I talked about these two cause I follow them and I have no complaints from IVE, let their company take slow, Wonyoung just bought them the money printer so now they will upgrade IVE more both musically and content wise.
I will keep my patience with other 4th gen too cause I can feel their desperation to hold on audience in fierce competition.
What a great video! One of my biggest gripes with k-pop albums is the layout. The layout of an album should tell some sort of story, or take you through different emotions in a planned way and I think can raise an album from good to great. But most k-pop albums don't do that, and it just shows the lack of effort and passion going into the full length albums. And yeah full length albums tend to have not fillers but that just shows the lack of passion again. If these companies wanted their artists to last and leave an impression they would create fully fledged studio albums for them but they care more about money and getting attention at the moment.
Le sserafim full album in may!! So excited
I thought the same when I saw most of last year releases, with many single albums from new groups, and older ones. Like, how can you know if you like a group or not if they have only 2-4 songs to listen to?
Also, another problem, but I think it applies only to small compagnies, is that they obviously have to pay for musics, and music are expensive. So, a small company (not all of them of course) is more likely to release only single albums until the group get a bit of recognition. It happened to a group I liked, BugAboo, which only lasted one year and had only 4 songs...
I am a stay and the Maxident opinion is so true. This video is well put together, thanks for the effort.
Pd: your narrative so good too.
People here clearly are not in the kpop scene long enough. Their senior group sistar literally had the same release strategy as them, having 3 singles as comebacks before releasing a full album. It's not a new thing people!!!!!
Yeah, single albums were very common during the second gen from what I know, I got recently into second gen girl groups and I’ve seen that quite a bit.
they were a GP only group. we're talking about groups with big core fandoms. be serious.
Sistar is quite literally the only group I've seen mentioned with this same strategy, and they are coincidentally from starship, if you guys bring up different groups, than maybe we can have a convo.
@@Taejiu Red velvet only had singles until 3rd comeback. F(x) had their first mini the year after debut. Dreamcatcher only juggle singles and EPs until Dystopia series. 4minute also juggled single and EPs for 2 years after their debut and Girls' Day for 3 years. Mamamoo and Gfriend only had EPs until 2016.
@@Taejiu and your most loved Blackpink is another story entirely
I would rather see shorter albums with amazing songs than a long album with bad songs.
Right? I just made that point in another thread. In general I do agree that full albums are better. But just being a full album doesn’t automatically make it better. I’d that makes sense😂
listen FOL from twice all songs are bangers
@@richelabucay4184 Yea almost all of Twice is
I guess it’s more so how can you solidify yourself as an artist with only 6 songs? But I see what you’re saying
i think that's what he meant when he reviewed Stray Kids album which was a full album yet not cohesive (according to him ofc)
for me personally, quality comes before quantity. it isn't that i do not want more music from artists whose potential and musical direction are undeniable, but i've seen somewhere someone expressing the opinion that most of the recent kpop full length albums lack quality and integrity and have a ton of filler tracks, which i totally agree with. so as of right now, i much prefer shorter but cohesive and well-produced albums, although it pains me that it seems that's the trajectory kpop is going. ps: stream taeyeon's invu album, such a masterpiece
honestly, im scared for ive's album, like, what if they do a "full album" like somi did, like, with all their singles and 2 or 3 new songs😭😭😭
(no hate to somi, but is the first example that came to my mind-)
Honestly, the "Single, Single, Single" strategy feels slimier from bigger companies/groups. When smaller companies do it, it makes sense because if it doesn't work out - "hey, at least we didn't lose that much." I'm 90% sure that's why Dreamcatcher had two singles before transitioning to EPs.
But for nmixx???? JYP saw the hype that people had for them (people were really pre-ordering BEFORE THERE WAS ANY CONTENT). and for IVE???? STARSHIP YOU HAVE THE CURRENT IT GIRL. Like they really saw Blinks go rabid with every release after getting starved by YG like trainees and said "actually, that is very profitable lmao let's try that." Are they really being so money hungry that they'll go for techniques like this?
You really hit that point on people quickly moving to another artist's discography once they've exhaused an artist's short list of song to offer. It does get old easily listening to the same songs over and over, no matter how good they are. I also feel like the music itself isn't really hitting it anymore for me, whether they come from a full album or a single; it just feels more like they're optimizing any new releases for the sales and views. I know music is subjective to people's tastes but it's just weird that I've been liking less and less KPOP releases than before (or maybe because it's been 10 years for me and I'm finally getting sick of it???).
Anyways I didn't realize the way I consumed music for the past year or two until I watched this video. Right now I'm finding myself jumping over not only different artists, but also a completely different music industry altogether. It's not the most famous thing in the world, but you can tell that they put a lot of love and care into their music, and they usually bring out full albums!!
I still find myself staying in KPOP though, for the few groups that do release consistent bangers and albums that are obviously made out of love and passion. But yeah, this album problem saddens me and it may cause me to leave KPOP entirely, cancelling the opportunity to discover potentially promising rookies, just because the overall system is like screwing everyone's music over or sumn.
I blame YG and specifically blackpink (not the girls themselves, just YG's management of them) for this trend of shorter albums and less music overall. Once companies saw how they could make easy money by employing the "blackpink method" of starving fans for content and then releasing maybe a couple songs before disappearing again for who knows how long, 4th gen k-pop groups were goners. Why put in actual time and effort when it's been proven to be more profitable to milk consumers of everything they have for the bare minimum in quantity (and occasionally even quality)
If anyone is looking for a long and exquisite discography to explore I would highly recommend the music of Monsta X! Just my playlist of favorites by them has over 100 songs. What did you call them…deep cuts? There are deep cuts galore to discover! Start with their most recent album and work you way back! 🤩
there are still some bsides from very very old albums from like 2008 onward that i still listen to, get stuck in my head randomly, and have withstood the test of time. i just don't see that happening with a lot of songs in the new gen. people tolerate songs that "age like milk" more often because they know that a new group is going to come out eventually and they will have fresh eyes on them. i think a lot of it has to do with social media though. the proliferation of kpop internationally in the west means that more eyes will be on the final product. they have more people to please. but these are also people who probably are unfamiliar with older generations of kpop.
i really feel like it didn't help that kpop has lost its connection to the general public in korea. people for example don't like ballads cuz they're "boring" but honestly ballads kind of helped make kpop, kpop. especially the albums. for me, they bring out the raw talent from groups which I love. having a bad album a few times in your career is fine, but when the sales and clicks and views matter more than the actual music, then you know that kpop has not only lost its charm, but also its longevity. but of course, its a capitalistic industry, so....guess we could've predicted this happening. its just sad though. social media overplays songs until i get sick of them after like 1 week and i have nothing to listen to for months on end. as a fan since 2011, this is not how it was for years and years.
I've been a Kpop fan for over 10 years now. I've seen all of the waves and all of the new trends. After almost 8 years, some of my top ults remain as 2nd gen and 3rd groups (EXO, SHINee, VIXX). I still stan these groups for not only the members and the content and the childhood ties I have with them, but also because in my opinion, they have a fully-fleshed out discography. I can listen to SHINee's 200+ songs and never get sick of them... even the ones from 2009. And I still enjoy VIXX's music because their main rapper (Wonshik) wrote/composed many of the songs. On top of this, there's SHINee's music, which was also mainly created by Jonghyun.
The only 4th gen groups I stan are SF9, TBZ and SKZ. SF9 and TBZ are more casual, but I do enjoy a lot of their music when I'm feeling like fun, lighthearted songs. Now SKZ, on the other hand, is the 4th gen group that I've stanned the longest (3+ years). I love them not only for the members that are very relatable to me, but also for their friendship/group dynamics, and also they're entire discography. I literally love every single one of their songs, and I think some of their BEST work comes from their old stuff between 2017-2019.
All of that being said, I totally agree with you about Maxident. Oddinary was such an amazing album for me and a lot of the fandom, and then Maxident just kind of seemed like a... let down. Really, the only 2 tracks that I love are Chill and Taste (it ended up being my top song of 2022 because I listened to it so much after its release). Their Replay album was good, but since it wasn't an offical cb it didn't have the same feeling to it, and The Sound is the same thing, since it's a Japanese release. Overall, I'm looking forward to their new album that's set to release in a few months. It's theorized that it's going to be an outer space/mystical sci-fi theme, so I'm hoping it's something similar to Oddinary era!! Either way, I DO truly love everything they create, but I totally get how some might not be enjoying their recent releases. Everyone has their own musical preferences, and that's okay! 💕