as a BLACK person who attended an international school in europe, i can confirm that american history is not taught, if it was, it was veeery briefly touched upon but i literally have no recollection of it. i don't think i knew the gravity of the N-word until I was, like 16, and that didn't come from school, i think i learned it from my parents.
its so ridiculous for americans to assume that it is too bc i'm an american and they don't go deep into other countries' history in our schools- only the parts that are relevant to america. i imagine that's how most places in the world are.
This reminds me of one time when I asked a question regarding Giselles situation. All I asked was, " Not defending Giselle or anything but do they really teach American history or the racial slurs in international schools?" And then someone got mad at me and told me that I was defending her which I already said that I wasnt. But it really was a genuine question.
Same, I'm a fluent English speaker myself (my third language), I've been watching a lot of English shows since young, I've been getting As for every English exam I've sat for, yet I didn't know the N-word existed until I was 17, and I only knew it through a random meme about how a Chinese word in a song “那一个” (read as nayige) sounded like the N-word lol. This is because I live in Southeast Asia, and there are no Africans here other than a few African exchange students. I literally do not know it since I don't live with black people. And why does a country that has barely any correlation to another country have to teach history that isn't relevant to their country? Kids are already complaining about the long and boring history of their own country, would they even bother to read history about other countries in depth just to not offend anyone?? People were mad and many chose to not forgive idols like Jaehyun and Giselle for just *mouthing* the N-word in a song that's not directed to anyone, they were just vibing. Their reason was because they should've known better?? At this point they're just hating to hate, not to educate. Yes, Jaehyun was in America for 4 years, when he was YOUNG, very YOUNG. Young enough to not get exposed to or even know that the N-word exists. Giselle attended an international school in JAPAN. And no, they won't be teaching history of America because it's a JAPANESE international school. H3ll, even my classmate who has A+ in English didn't know the meaning of the N-word, he told me he thought it meant "bro" since it's commonly used in songs. Therefore, being fluent in English definitely doesn't make you know any better about Western countries or culture. So no, they wouldn't have known better, stop hating...
@@jlizard8500 i don’t think giselle was right for mouthing the n word, but it really pisses me off when people say things like “she knows english, she should’ve known better” “she went to an international school, she knew the n word” when it’s not true at all. as someone who had lived in japan before (currently living in hong kong), black history is almost NEVER taught in schools, and even if it is, it’s only touched on very briefly. it’s impossible for every english speaker to have full knowledge of slurs and for giselle, it is high unlikely for her to have known because asia is very uneducated. america doesn’t even teach black history properly yet you expect japana of all places to teach black history extensively? that doesn’t make sense at all. i literally had someone argue with me about the ignorance of asia when they lived in america. i was close to a breakdown (/j) talking with them because they haven’t even been to asia before and i LIVE there. i know better than to say every english speaker knows the n word because trust me, it doesn’t. not all people in america know the n word, much less japanese people.
@@0304-s1h aaahh someone actually understood the reference. truth be told i'm not a bea STAN but i've heard at least all the songs that have mvs and i am not disappointed. that song she did for arcane??🤯i need more epic music like that
I agree on everything. It's so difficult to even say anything on the internet without people yelling at you. It just makes you think that black people's only source of validation is calling others racist. Racism is an ideology and a strong word, but now is thrown around like it's nothing. And demanding other countries to know everything about black history (and American history) is just another form of colonialism. The world doesn't revolve around you. And respect is earned, it's not just given because of the color of your skin. I also want to add that it's difficult for non black people to even understand who is saying what, because black people aren't always united on the problem, which is totally fine (everyone has their own opinion), but then they go and say "listen to black people". Like, it's just a way to say "just listen to ME", because as soon as you listen to another black person that has a different opinion, then boom racist. For example black people from Africa often have different opinions about CA compared to black Americans, but non black people can't agree with them (even if their arguments are better on a particular issue) because otherwise Americans will call them anti-black, even if they are exactly listening to black people. It's the need to have ONLY the American perspective be heard. It's crazy.
I go by listening to the majority rather than the minority when it comes to these things. I know it's easier to listen to to someone who has the same opinion as you to feel validation in your thoughts but to expand your range of thinking listen to why the people are mad are mad and then use your own thoughts from there.
@@chrissycupcakes2448 That's right, but what if the majority doesn't care or isn't angry? And how to tell which "side" is in the majority? A bunch of people screaming on Twitter is not the majority. I just won't take sides at all or I'll form an opinion on my own and see if someone else agrees with me. I always look at the arguments of both sides, but I won't be convinced by one just because they are the ones being "mad". I'll still use my brain. That doesn't mean that I'm speaking over anyone or that then everyone must agree with me. It's just an opinion in an ocean of other opinions.
@@lavistelle6031 there is no way to determine who is the majority. I don't have a Twitter because I just think it's a toxic website in general, but behind the computer screen there are still people. Even if they say their opinions in an uncouth way it doesn't mean their opinions are invalid. Also basic research can be used on certain topics too. That's how I learned a lot about my Muslim friends and found that I was saying and thinking a lot of horrible things. There are people who are given a platform on t.v whom say that being Muslim for a woman is terrible. But after doing my own research on forums and making friends I formed a different opinion. Though I still don't agree with a lot I didn't choose to listen to the opinion that just validated my own.
I feel like the cultural appropriation debate has inadvertently created a reality awful environment. I totally understand why a black person would be offended by someone saying the N word, wearing cornrows, doing blackface, or something like that. I also understand that it’s extremely rude to misappropriate religious symbols. However I feel like we’ve created an environment where we can’t have healthy cultural exchange without someone getting offended for woke points. Isn’t division EXACTLY what racists want? Also some cultures are generally more offended by appropriation then others, which is a natural variation, but no one wants to acknowledge that.
Agree! The concept of cultural appropriation (which is an American concept btw) has been brought to such an extreme that people are scared to share their culture, even when they are invited to do so. There are many locals all over the world that live by selling pieces of their culture and this whole CA thing has made people scared to even listen to them. Like in Europe is pretty common that black people offer to do their braids on whoever wants them (while getting paid of course) and no one really questions this until they discover what Americans are saying. Or American getting pissed because foreigners wear kimonos even tho Japanese people love that. I think everyone is entitled to feel offended by whatever they want, but at the same time it doesn't always mean the world must agree with that. The definition of racism doesn't include CA, so putting them together on the same level is just wrong. This is exactly why so many cultures and ancient practices are dying: there are fewer and fewer locals who do them and foreigners are often too scared to try to get into them. Gatekeeping cultures will never solve racism and it just brings problems in places where cultures lived together in harmony (or at least a better harmony than whatever is happening in the US).
Yes 99% of every RUclips video or about racism or ca even if the video has nothing to do with it. Most comment sections these days are just toxic, no wonder why people are scared to ask questions.
@@lavistelle6031 the problem with the "CA is an American thing" is that in the beginning of the conversation it was about cultures that had their own problem because they were mistreated already by their country and then suddenly big luxury brands wanted to treadmark their things. Like the LV boomerang, the bordados mexicanos by some European/yt woman and Disney wanting to trademark a literal Mexican celebration for a movie. In those cases I feel like it was completely reasonable, being Mexican myself and understanding the fact that wanting to trademark an artesanía made by indigenous women that had already a problem on selling them without the police fighting them was a lot; I'm not sure if it was the colors, the process, the patterns or the general idea the one that was going to get the trademark but was pretty fckup because it was going to stop the ones who made a living out of a tradition to keep doing it and not completely the fact that it was going to get sell by a yt woman or it was made by one
@@lavistelle6031 I'm not sure if I explained myself but in those cases it went further than a person outside this culture is doing it, it was the literal appropriation of the labor that went with it In the case of the Disney trademark is a lot more clear
@@grachi0matilda Yes, in that case I think we can talk about "cultural exploitation" which is way worse. In that case a company or someone uses a culture just for profit without giving anything to the people of said culture. I totally agree on that, it's wrong. It's the same when they make movies about something. I'm Italian so I'll use this example. Pixar made "Luca" which was set in Italy and it was a very good representation of the country and culture, together with a good story. Then there are movies like House of Gucci that totally disrespect the country and are clearly made just to make money. Of course, in this case it's nothing TOO serious, but it's an example that I personally could make. In general I think it's very different when normal people want to use other cultures. 99% of cases if they use them it's because they like it. No one is brading their hair with a style they hate or find ugly. And yes there is always the argument "people of that culture get kicked out of jobs", which is totally valid, but again, are foreigners the ones kicking black Americans out of their jobs? I'll never understand how an idol wearing anything from other cultures hurts anyone, unless they are mocking the culture (like doing the desi dance while making weird faces, that's disrespect). They aren't in any way responsible for what happens in the US, so why should they be punished and talked down when they are not the problem? I don't get it, I'll never get it. How are they hurting black people? By wearing a style they clearly like? Also, many black people in Africa are fine with that, so who should we listen to? Sharing cultures is what made societies grow and it's sad to see the state of our world now. The internet is so centered around the US that any different opinion gets shut down. Not to mention that they preach about how to fight racism and about how educated they are when their country is more racist than literally 2/3 of Europe.
the only thing that annoys me but this is the hypocrisy and this isnt just in black kpop stans but also in western stans i noticed. yall talk the most but do not follow through or do not care about your activism once its about something not popular
People are hypocrites. Like you see a lot of people talking about aninal rights but still eat more need than necessary every day and buy the cheapest one. Or the environmental activists. At my school they were such hypocrites, who joined Friday's for future and drove by car to school every day because it didn't took so much time, had new phones every year, bought a lot of fast fashion and ate a lot of meat, when the meat production is one of the worst factors for the environment and is full of people working like slaves. Most people only call for something and don't want to minimize their own comfort by restricting themselves for the cause because they are egotistical hypocrites and want to be praised for doing an Instagram post about it or donating some money and forget about it
People in general are just huge hypocrites. They get mad a Idols for saying racial slurs, but then turn around and call people of their own community even worse slurs, when they don't agree with them.
Can we also talk about how a lot of toxic black kpop stan’s dictating who black stan’s should stan or not stan. once you stan a group that they don’t support they start calling black stan’s in that fandom c00ns when most of them actually hold idols accountable, this is why me as a black kpop fan is so scared to express who i actually like or listen too on tiktok because toxic black kpop stans generalize black stans in those fandoms who their idols offended their culture always gets attacked or being called the weakest links. don’t get me started on how these toxic black kpop stans enable non black people to call them racial slurs for liking a problematic group (i constantly see this when people attack black stays or black giselle stans, who don’t defend their actions but hold them accountable)
Fr , like let me Stan Blackpink, BTS , NCT and Straykids, if it doesn't hurt you physically or mentally, you shouldn't be out here calling your fellow BLACK PERSON slurs 🙄 what's embarrassing is that those people calling out people for stanning problematic groups, probably Stan one too
@@eem8736 honestly i had to argue with a toxic black stan because of that and the toxic ones refuse to take accountability for their words but if someone calls them out for it that person is anti black or racist
Not to mention they blame us for the idols problematic behavior when it’s not our fault to begin with. I can’t control what another person does. The only thing I can do as a fan is inform them why what they did was wrong.
@@eem8736 ikr like I don't support the wrong things they did but I Stan for the music(I'm an nctzen,stay,army and casual blackpink listener and many more)
"You expect people to know everything about your one country, but for some crazy reason you're allowed to not know what's going on in their country?" YES. Someone needed to say it, there is way too much entitlement and little understanding in the community. I love this way of explaining it, because at the end of the day people from completely different cultures will not have full knowledge on the entire world's history. There will always be mistakes and misunderstandings
@@tortillahehe Do you not know how to read? Not everyone knows about everyone else's culture, especially when it comes to American culture because it's a mix of MULTIPLE cultures, and if you haven't been to said country, how are you going to understand their culture & meaning deeply? If you see a majority of a country acting a certain way, dressing a certain way, and using certain words, you're going to assume that's what said country is interested in & stereotype them based off that (which isn't good but everyone stereotypes unfortunately). Also, global to most Koreans means global in ASIA, not just the west. You people are way too entitled in thinking everyone knows everything about you & your culture, especially when it comes to homogeneous countries such as Korea, Japan, etc. It's clear you're uncultured in general, work on that.
I would like to thank you for creating a platform where rational discussion is allowed. It was really needed, and not only in kpop. I hope you serve as an inspiration to many others.
I'm french, and I'm mixed. My mother is tunisian, my father is a white european. Until 2017, I didn't know what a "blackface" was, yet I'm educated and stuff, I was 16 at the time. I learned what it was because a famous footballer did a blackface and black french people explained what it was. But me, an educated teenager of african descent with access to internet, didn't know what a blackface was. I learned what "cultural appropriation" was at 17, I learned who Jim Crow was at 20. It may sounds obvious to American people but it's really not to us Europeans.
if your father is french youre not caucasian, youre european. caucasian refers to the ethnic people of the caucasus region please dont use our word the word caucasian for white people has long been abandoned by science
@@ezra5420 the term by science has been abandoned in the 20th century because the individuality of ethnic groups was more important than 3 racial groups that was too broad. and caucasian also included west central and south asia and north africa so it didnt make sense to keep on using it
@@sunmiswashingmachine Caucasian is still used in North America and it means European origin or possessing light skin (middle easterners and North Africans are lumped into Caucasian on the US census for example). It’s a long debunked biological race concept, but the meaning of the word has changed like so many others. It’s still may controversial to some, but responding to your comment, it is still a valid word to use, especially in America
Yes and yes. I don't know for some reason black Kpop stans feel like we are above criticism, we are above reproach, everything is all high-and-mighty. I'm glad that you have the courage to step out and say the criticisms that needed to be said. I especially agree with the part where not everyone knows black culture, but I would like to add that it's specifically American black culture. Because when people are complaining on TikTok and Twitter, they're not talking about African black culture, they're not talking about Caribbean black culture, they're not talking about French black culture, they're talking about AMERICAN black culture. Because frankly they don't even know what those other countries cultures are, they're just offended about their own. For example if an idol decided to try and imitate a Bahamian accent and I found it offensive, the black community is not going to rally behind me and fight the issue because it's a "black culture" problem.
They don’t have to defend you they are from a different culture. It would be the same the other way around Bahamians aren’t defending black Americans, they don’t have to fight for you if they don’t want to. I’m Haitian I would not expect a black American to defend me
@@jasmineestime3949 But that's not the case now is it, especially online. As long as you're black you're supposed to have a problem with the same issues that African Americans have. I always use this example, I have no problems with other races wearing cornrows and braids. In my country it is quite fine for people of any race to wear cornrows, we braid it for them, that's how we make money. But if I say that then there are going to be a bunch of people attacking me for for how my culture operates and all of a sudden I'm not black. Last time I checked I have melanin pigment within my skin.
@@zemmym.9437 I don’t blame how people in your country make money but in America it’s just a different attitude because the history of black Americans having their cultures taken from them and renamed and looked as new that’s probably why black Americans have such a huge problem with people participating in their culture and are very sensitive about it, they just want their credit
@@jasmineestime3949 Of course, I know all of this, I've heard it a thousand times, and I don't blame Americans when they're upset about these things. My problem is when they revoke my blackness just because I have a different opinion or a different perspective or upbringing. Like I don't stop being profiled because because I'm ok with cornrows. I don't stop having a target on my back being black just because I'm chill about certain situations.
@@jasmineestime3949 Also your reply here proves my previous point. When I gave an example of something that would be offensive to my culture you said that Americans didn't have to defend us. But then in this reply you sent you defended American culture towards cornrows and braids saying that there's a history behind it.There is also a history behind the carecaterization of Caribbean people. So what's the difference between my offense and theirs?
One thing I’ve never publicly gotten into is the cultural appropriation debate. I have a masters degree in visual culture and the over-simplification/over-complication and policing of cultural appropriation is super annoying. The truth is I have never heard a single person give a truly full definition of what it actually is. Rather people look at it from only one angle and then think they know the full meaning of it. It’s something that requires a TON of nuance, research, and thoughtful discourse that folks just aren’t ready to have. It would require a full on thesis to explain.
This cultural appropriation thing will never end because not everyone is on the same page with it. For example, I don't care if a kpop idol wears braids, in fact I feel proud that they do. Other people care. So who should the idols and Companies listen too. Whose voice matters more.so I came to the conclusion that as long as they are not talking badly about it then let them. Anothing thing Is that we black people partake in "cultural appropriation" too when we use their term of it. Let's take dreadlocks for instance. My culture has no connection to dreadlocks, so if I wear them I am doing cultural appropriation, I don't get a pass just because my skin tone is dark. Just because one culture attached a certain level of importance on one thi g does not mean it should be important to everyone also. Should we call out people for shaving their head just because one culture holds it at high value. I once saw a story where people were saying a woman was doing cultural appropriation by writing a noodles cookbook. This is where we will go with this, where u can't do anything unless it's within the confines of ur skin tone.
I traveled to South Korea to meet a pen pal years ago and she showed me around and took me to so many amazing places including a historical site where we gained free access in we dressed in traditional garmets being Hanboks everyone complimented me on how pretty I looked and seemed enamored with the fact that I wanted to wear it with my pen pal. It wasn't until years later that someone dug up my old photos and I was bullied in school and online for cultural appropriation. It's an interesting topic that I've looked into extensively and I agree that there is a lot to it, it requires more than a surface level understanding.
@Sierra M. Please tell me you're not being serious when there are videos about cultural appropriation giving definitions and examples. Either you were late when they were out or you just didn't look for them. This comment is not an attack.
@@alanaatkinson551 I would love to elaborate more on it, but again, time constraints. It’s also a matter of the issue being so hot that any quote could be taken and used as ammo incorrectly. It would be a great conversation to dive into some day.
Honest and Truthful video on the Toxicity of K-pop Stans especially on social media sites like Twitter and Tiktok are the most problematic Internet Sites
I gave up Twitter last year because the toxicity started to effect me in a bad way. I also took a break from TikTok because some creators post content to purposely cause conflict within the Kpop community to get more views. They do this particularly with black Kpop Stans because these creators know it will strike a nerve, hence more views for them. It's really sad because the manipulation is so clear. When content creators stoop to this kind of behavior it gives the toxic crowd a safe place to say what they want without accountability.
A little story from what I experienced , there was this person who was complimenting chan about being one of the best leaders in 4th gen in the comment section of a video but there was this person who came and said something along lines like "ah..yes , the king of cultural appropriation is the best leader" and I was confused because this was the first time I ever heard someone calling out chan for cultural appropriation because I thought he never did that and when I tried to ask that person about it then they started asking me if I was black and if I am not I don't get to talk about it and I asked "why don't I get to do so ?" I mean , wasn't it a normal human right to ask question ? And after a whole arguement....They still didn't tell me anything and kept on speaking this and that about black culture..That I shouldn't say this blah blah blah. Turns out that person wasnt even black and kept blabbering the whole time telling me what I should do and what I shouldn't 💀. I mean , the audacity- that person was an indian and I am too and let me tell you , there are barely any schools in india who teach us about the black culture and there were very high chances that what that person was telling is just what the internet told them. The audacity killed me- ( Also sorry if my english is bad )
and most of those fans don't know the growth from these idols when they addressed this issues, it is better if idols grow from these issues and be more knowledgeable from their "innocence/ignorance"
its not just toxic black kpop stans its woke people in general you see white woke people getting all kinds of stupid and offended for other races like we need their help lmfao. But your video was spot on and thank you for talking about something real. Most people too scared.
I think we need to create boundaries in terms of discrimination. Korea as a whole prefer fair skin which can be colorist by tradition. Us foreigners would feel anxious when we go to an Asian country. However, if we notice what's going in Korea, well. We as foreigners feel bad for some of them. All we have to do is notice what to do and how to do it in order to successfully include.
SAY IT LOUDER!!! I’m so sick of people being fake woke and trying to virtue signal when it’s either A. Not needed or B. Not as bad as they’re trying to make a situation out to be.
@@Nameless_mixes Racist isn't the first word I would describe Korea. Colorist and sexist are the words that resonate more with Koreans. There is also colorism with Americans too. Drake gets pegged as a soft simp here and Canada too...
It's hard because, I've found that if you are not actively involved in the discussion you're not a good "ally" so it's been hard finding the line between being conscious and coming across as "woke" in a broad sense.
@@Amanda-ik1wv just try your best to use critical thinking, and don't ever trust anyone who wants you to believe something but refuses to explain their reasoning or have a conversation about it, they don't know what they're talking about. people will try to bully you for being your own person but most of them are nobodies and can be ignored.
I feel like toxic black kpop Stans (mostly from tiktok) have made the word "racist" lose its meaning , yes people have said and done things that are very anti black but labeling everything as Racism is way too much , most people who do or say something offense to our culture are simply ignorant🙂 , let's be honest calling someone an ignorant culture appropriator feels worse than calling them a racist 🙂, instead of educating people, they prefer to yell and it becomes embarrassing. As you said , expecting people to know everything about our culture is unfair, especially when we don't bother to learn about the other person's culture.
it's not black kpop stans jobs to educate anyone when these anti black actions have been done time and time again in the industry. maybe idols should learn feom their peers mistakes
@@thek-nerd3143 the problem with the way we "educate" them is that we don't actually educate them , we Just hate on them and their fans for stanning someone "racist", we can do a better job at teaching idols that what they do is wrong , for example confronting them at fan signs rather than yelling in the comment section of a post like they will see it
@@eem8736 I have a question. Are you willing to be corrected on everything you do wrong according to someone? Like on the street someone tells you to dress in a different way coz it disrespects their religion or if sbdy tells you not to eat beef coz it sacred and so on. Will you? Keep in mind that the things mentioned above can be a life/death matters in some cultures. What makes your matter more important than others?
the most frustrating to me... is people acting like all racism ever looks like is someone saying the n word. people have created such a weird vibe around this word, like the word passing through your lips flips a switch that turns you into a racist permanently, like a magic racism spell, and people are SOOOO convinced that everyone in the world must understand that it's a racial slur and if they say they don't they must be lying, but doesn't it seem so obvious that if you grew up in a country that doesn't teach american history, and especially if you don't speak any english, you would just know it as a common hiphop word? and sure if they researched they could find out the history, but how would they even know there was something they were meant to research until the first time someone tells them they shouldn't be using that word? do you google every new word before you use it to understand the historical context? maybe you do, but i'm guessing you've used a word you heard in another language without knowing all the important cultural context behind it before. but when you say that people literally say stuff like "you know racism exists outside of america right?" like, yes, where did i say it didn't?? racism and use of the n word are not one and the same.
I said something similar in which it's ridiculous to think that everyone search up all the words they don't understand and then they replied with "if you don't understand then don't use it and the google is so accesible". I mean,they're not wrong but do you really do that?Really?Do I have to search for lyrics and look up everything unfamiliar everytime I listen to a song with foreign language from now on?In the first place,I wouldn't assume there are words that I shouldn't say in such an accesible song on a global platform.It's just unthinkable and natural to think that way..well that my opinion at least
@@cheerupbaby7792 did you even read one word of the comment explaining how it’s ridiculous to expect them to know things these things just because they’re an adult, or just because they’re this, that or whatever??
@@Elladoll121 ??? They are not saying the word is not racist. They are saying how would a non english speaking person know the word is racist, without being told its racist. How would they know the culture or history behind the word, especially when they hear it being used CONSTANTLY in music nowadays.
Your point about black kpop fans really just wanting their anger to be validated is spot on. I thought the same but I didn't know exactly what I was thinking until you said.
I would like to mention that non American black stans are constantly being disrespected because we don't get offended by the same things. Especially Africans. I saw two girls from Kenya being invalidated and straight up bullied because they weren't offended by the Braids situation.
This is upsetting. First it's "if you're not black then you have no day" then when you are black, it's "You don't speak for all black people" or "You're not black or you're anti black" It's really just a bunch of bull and I'm tired of it
Last year when I was on tik tock ( not any more I left ) I saw videos people saying idols wearing braids and mocking black culture. I said I’m black and I’m ok with idols wearing black hairstyles it’s not meant for their hair but there’s nothing wrong with them doing that however it’s a problem when they only wear black hair styles for hip hop aesthetic only. I gotten tons of shit on my comment…and people were saying “ don’t speak for all of us “ “ you’re not really black if you are saying that “ “ if black people are still getting mocked by wearing braids then nobody who isn’t black shouldn’t wear them “ “ the fuck is wrong with you “ I only spoke for myself :(
@@JaxBox1 They really always miss the part where you say "I don't" and swear you're saying "WE". And also forget that because they themselves are offended doesn't mean that they speak for all black people. And they're literally the ones said "black people" and "We"
How do I tell you I love you? this conversation is so so needed. It's us black stans that need to keep the toxic ones in check because even people that don't agree with all the toxic stuff just keep quiet.
It kinda sucks that it’s up to black people to try and talk sense into other black people simply because the toxic ones won’t take the opinions of other people seriously if their skin colour is different. Doesn’t that count as racism?
@@LaurenPebble not rlly since most ppl take information on certain if someone who looks like them is giving it, idk it had something to psychology but I’m not 100% sure
@@bougie_pink oh, I know that’s true. But completely disregarding someone’s opinion because of race, isn’t quite the same as being more likely to agree with someone that is the same race/similar appearance to you, I think.
THIS!!!! ✨ another thing i hate is that they use the “google is free” argument (which has to be one the most ignorant argument i’ve ever seen concerning social issues in kpop), to justify saying an idol “should’ve known” about something whenever they’re in a scandal concerning racial ignorance. this further lets you know that these fans are very self centered and think the world revolves around them. because if they didn’t have this way of thinking, they would realize that in korea, they don’t use google, but naver. edit: you people bullying cheryl in these comments are really something. this video was literally made for people like you and you’re literally proving her points. this weird sense of entitlement that black people “made” kpop so there’s automatically a free pass for bullying and other bad behavior is beyond me. y’all say that black people are the only ones allowed to speak on topics like this, correct? okay, cheryl is black, so what’s with all the name calling? i don’t think i’ve ever seen one racist comment in this section, it’s mainly people agreeing with what she said in the video, which is correct. y’all need to do better and just because someone calls y’all out on your behavior doesn’t make that person racist. they simply don’t agree with your behavior. cheryl is not “allowing” people to be racist by making this video, y’all just can’t handle finally being called out by another black fan and having to take accountability for your actions. grow up 4 year olds.
Let's be honslest. Most of these idols don't care. I don't blame them also. I watch kdrama's and cdrama's but I don't give two shits about the history between these two countries. Hack, I don't even know my own history that well. So honestly, if idols say they did not know I can see how it's possible. Imagine them having to Google bout every single culture because kpop is widely know. Imagine having to tip toe around because u don't wanna offend anyone.
Not to mention google’s search engine changes based on your location and prior searches. If you live in a racist or ignorant area, the search results are going to mirror that because it assumes that’s what your looking for. You can’t just trust someone to look for information on Google and expect them to learn something new. If anything it will just reinforce the views they already have. If people wonder why peoples ideologies have become so toxic and are so against different opinions, it’s because everything they find on google agrees with them. I don’t know how it is on Naver, but it’s probably similar.
I remember having a normal and mature discussion with someone regarding sm zoo performance with a Giselle's fan. We were both debating back and for about how well she did and didn't do respectfully and without one of us cursing at each other. And then a random third party came into the picture and told the Giselle's fan that her bias was racist and that she was supporting racism by even talking about Giselle. The poor person was so confuse and angry that she went into defensive mode and had to explain her point of view on the situation. And the random person start calling racist for justifying racism. Mind you it had nothing to do with our initial conversation. And since i was watching everything unfold, i had to remind both of them that we were talking about the zoo performance. But the same random person start telling me to shut up and let them finish like she was the one who was here all along. So i got mad and start explaining the difference betwen racism, racial ignorance and anti black hate while precising that i was indeed black. Yet she still called me a fake black and a fool. By now the person i was having a civil conversation with was already gone and we never finished debating our point of view. I felt so angry because it been so long since i have such a good conversation with someone that share a different opinion as mine without us insulting the other person.. Unfortunatly for us, that random person came and fuck it up.
That's exactly how I feel. Giselle has been my bias since I've known for Aespa. I'm nowhere supporting her action and what she did was wrong but now I feel like I can't leave positive comment about Giselle (or her skills) without being called "racist" "disgusting person" or seeing those "jokes" about her.
@@AB-yk2pq honestly, i feel you. I tend to give a second chance to foreigner that do racially insensitive thing, but i still understand and respect other black people that dont do the same. That being said, when it come to Giselle case, i felt so bad for her that i couldnt even get behind those who were actually offended. It hard to sympathise with people that want somebody to suffer over one mistake. And the hate giselle got stopped being constructif a long time ago.
@@tnlkb6115 Those people be like: "take me seriously" when the things they have brought to the table are yelling, slurs and attacks towards you and others. Then they have the audacity to be suprised when you don't want to be mates with them... I'm sorry but between having respect towards those toxic commenters versus an idol who said the n word, at this point it's obvious which one I would choose. I'm sure they don't stop to think for a second whether or not the comment will get them the reaction they want, if the wanted reaction isn't dislike towards them that is
There’s been a few instances where I’ve interacted with someone that was more interested in insulting me than having a genuine conversation, and when it happens I report their comments and get them removed.
Black kpop stans have a horrible reputation even within the black community. A lot of us really don’t understand why you’d support a genre when you feel disrespected all the time and crying on sm 24/7 about racist idols. I simply stopped listening to the genre cuz every time I got into a group I found out about some insensitive shit they said or did and it turned me off completely. Also I just don’t like the new sound of the genre. I love your videos though, keep being the voice of reason.
I definitely agree with this. Especially in the videos that praise Giselle they are so many haters and their comments almost have the same amount of likes with people who defend Giselle. Like okay, don't love this girl or hate this girl if you want. But why are you spending your time in a random ktubers channel saying that we shouldnt love someone 🤔. This people really want someone to get canceled and they will fight until end lol.
I think it's totally understandable to walk away with those types of frustrations. The thing that's really sad yet oddly helpful is the fact that these racist sentiments came from the US. As an American, I just think about all the problematic stuff white American celebs have said or done and the history of how we have been represented in the media and it makes a lot of sense.
tbh i’m just there for the music, if you go into kpop while realizing that no one is going to care abt black people nor our opinions, then it’s a lot easier to detach and just vibe with the music. just don’t fund them and do whatever you want on your terms.
Something that always made me mad was how easily the fanbases let racism slip with the whole “black people can’t be racist” thing. I have to break it to some people but yes, you can be racist regardless of what race you are! I’ve seen some toxic ones (not dropping names) disrespect the sewol incident, and make me feel really uncomfortable with what they project towards Asians (especially Koreans). I think cultral appropriation is one of the worst things to come out of the industry, and I’m against so many artists because of it. That doesn’t mean you can send death threats and swear them off! Sometimes, being respectful makes you look like more of a queen than being rude, and some stans need to learn that. I agree with this whole vid 10/10 btw
Once i saw a post saying something like "black ppl can't be racis...." with a pic of a bunch of black dudes pulling their eyes with a asian man in the middle, i mean......
Ok but I'm having a VERY hard time learning history here (there's alot to learn), why tf am I expected to know about other people's culture on top of it aswell 😭
told my stance on this last chan situation (i’m a black stan and accepted his apology) and had another black person try to tell me i was against my kind and then i saw they made a tweet calling chan racist but used a slur against asian people in the same thread like ????? i also think people think just cause an idol knows english means they know what goes on in america? like with giselle everyone’s argument is “she speaks english she should know better” like she knows basic english from what she learned in japan… yeah her apology wasn’t the greatest but they should stop that argument but that’s my opinion
I was thinking the same thing. I remember reading a comment a few months ago where the person was "Giselle studied in an international school, she should've known." Yes, she went to an international school but it was still in Japan and judging from some pre-debut pictures of her at school, her school was still predominantly Asian. Yes, her saying the word was still very wrong & the apology was necessary but at the same, it sounds very entitled that just because someone went to an international school or they lived in an English-speaking country for a few years, then they should automatically know every single thing about American history. Idk maybe i'm also doing too much. . .
@@goldenlion5826 yeah no i agree… i asked my sister a couple questions like “do you know about the jim crow laws?” and she was like “i know a little but not enough to have a full conversation about them” and like we live in america so if we don’t know that much information and didn’t learn it in school how are we gonna expect people from overseas to know??
@@goldenlion5826 Yes, I've learned English years ago in a not English speaking country and teachers only told me not to said "black" when referring to one's skin color cause it was rude. I just learned about the n-word because black kpop stans last year.
We NEEDED to have this conversation, validating the opinions of people who are angry over those who are not makes no sense at all and this had to be said. Being angry doesn't mean you're right but you can't even have a conversation with these people because they think their emotions are above reason. I've had people shut me up because "i'm not all black people" but then THEY do get to speak for all black people?? Make it make sense.
Putting emotions above reason is such a problem. Like, if someone was angry about the Jupiter being the biggest planet in the solar system rather than earth, it wouldn’t change that Jupiter is the biggest planet. But apparently being outwardly emotional means you’re opinion is more important than someone that stays calm.
Thank you so much for this. As a black kpop stan, everything you said was 100℅ right. A lot of Black kpop stans constantly think that just because you have a different opinion, you're automatically white (I have also experienced this myself online) and it's so annoying. Like just cuz I don't agree with you doesn't mean that I'm white or any other race. Another thing, about wanting their anger to be validated, it's not just in kpop, but also in the black community in general. If a black person were to get angry for whatever reason, the FIRST ppl to come to their defense is OTHER black ppl.
I feel like I’ve been trying to explain everything in this video to people for ages. It’s nice to know that I’m not just screaming nonsense into a void, that there’s people that agree with me on this.
Just wanted to say that I'm a 52 year old black male who lives in the States that's been a K-pop fan ever since GG dropped Gee Gee. an never looked back. I loved your video here. I was going to say a much more stuff but I'm not lol but I agree with what was said in your video.
honestly. im so happy to see someone talk about this. its really pisses me off when i see everything gets labeled as racist or they think everything is intentional when a kpop stan does 'cultural appropriation' like.. the same way you dont get educated about literally anyone else's culture and history, same for them. eg: the hair style issue. they may be seeing the hairstyles as a style because it's popular. now it you see a trend and you think it looks good, ur gna try it. not go and look up the history of it, who was the first person to wear it and how they came up with it are you? like instead educate ppl before going at them. sure be mad at the ones who dont apologize even after being educated. and the not being satisfied at apologies im- girl... anyways. i hate when they get aggressive first. it only makes us look like bad ppl. it'll only make us get hated more. yall want that?? And calling other blacks who disagree with them "anti-black/white/whitewashed/brainwashed".. just because somebody don't agree with. lol maybe take a self-check. honestly that's rly immature behavior like grow tf up. thank you for reading my little rant. ahh. have a cookie 🍪
honestly, its not only black kpop stans that do this i feel like its americans in general. Americans somehow feel so entitled to the point where everyone HAS to know their history, even if they aren't american, and if you don't know then youre racist.
I have traveled a great deal over my lifetime, and I can tell you that I know a great deal about the world around me as do many other Americans. There is no doubt that some Americans can be a pill to swallow, but I believe they are in the minority. People like me initially started traveling during stints in the U.S. military then continued traveling after discharging. I carry myself today in the exact same manner I did when I was on active duty . . . I represent myself as a positive example of Americans abroad. Btw, I have been to over 35 countries, and I research each because it is important to know about a place you are going to if for no other reason than ensure you conduct yourself appropriately. My two cents worth.
@@monstafloppa871 im also american, im not saying all americans are like this. im saying that its common culture for americans to see america as the center of the world or smth. so ye most americans, im not exempt from this entirely
@@catmerchant8699 Even the dumbest person I know knows for a fact Australia is a country and Australia is mostly acknowledged as a beachy type place so I’m not sure which Americans you have talked to but ME as a person who ACTUALLY lives in America and is surrounded by other Americans can tell you that most Americans do in fact know you’re country does exist.
Another thing is toxic black kpop stans bullying other black people into feeling offended by something. Like you can't bully someone into feeling a certain way. Also black kpop stans need to realize that just because you feel offended by something doesn't mean everyone else needs to bend to your will. Like the amount of black kpop stans that attack Giselle stans, and expect everyone to not stan her just because they're offended is absurd. You aren't entitled to control who people do and don't stan just because you're offended. Also nobody needs to explain why they do and don't stan someone. It's their own business.
Thank you for posting another video about this; it really gets on my nerves whenever a toxic black kpop stan throws the word around without even bothering to explain how it's harmful in the first place
You are absolutely right! We should start new labels for ‘offensive conducts/speech/appropriation’ vs. just outright saying something is “racist”. For example, when people (adults mostly) cuss, some people are okay with hearing cuss words, while others are offended by those words; both opinions are valid! In Kpop e.g. when Giselle said the ‘n’ word while singing, I didn’t mind it because it was a part of a song she was singing. Some people got offended, and that was okay too. Had she called a POC the ‘n’ word, I would have been livid. But, she didn’t, so when she apologized to the offended parties, she should be forgiven and folks should move on. It was part of a song, she was just singing without any malicious intention, and I, as a Nigerian-American, didn’t mind it one bit. Everything does not have to be racism! Labels such as cultural appropriation, cultural appreciation, offensive conduct, and discrimination, among others, should be used instead. As your channel focuses on these issues, when you have time, would you make a video on clarity. Clarifying what is cultural misinformation, appreciation, appropriation, offensive, and racist? I think that if we have a list of these, then moving forward, everyone can just refer to your video as a guild to labeling things appropriately. Thank you.
I'm black and older than you and never heard of a Jim Crow pose. I know about Jim Crow laws of course but I had to look up what the pose was as well. If I didn't know how is a young guy living in S. Korea suppose to have knowledge of this? A person can't look up every single thing they do in life to check if it might be offensive. Evidently he saw it some where and did it without any ill intent.
I’m Australian and I went my whole high school education without learning American black history. Most of our time was spent learning about indigenous Australians (Aboriginals and Torres Strait islanders) which is something America can’t do- teach others about their native peoples.
Point 2 is spot on. The best example I can think of is some parts of the black community still using the word "gook" and "chink". Denzel Curry released a song called "Gook". Gook is apparently a slang for Odd in Miami. Footballer Devin Fuchness said a reporters eyes looked "chinky" when he smiled. Both could have easily been labeled as "racist". But the term "ignorance" is more appropriate here for me. If these two men who live in America where no one would bat an eye if you see an Asian walking down the street, still don't understand the impact of those words to the Asian community. I don't know how much you're expecting from Koreans where the entire foreign population (people of all colors) is less than 5%? I would not be surprised if there are some K-Pop idols who still haven't met or even talked to a black person in real life. And everyone says "Google is free". Let's play a game, come to China with only knowledge of our culture being everything you read on Google. I guarantee you, you'll offend someone.
I hate when people say "Google is free" Come on...If I use Google it's because I already know what to search But if I don't even know something exist to begin with how do people expect me to search it? For example I'm 22, italian, and I've only known this "cultural appropriation" though kpop like 2/3 years ago I didn't know it was a thing
I found it funny when people use the "google is free" arguments when Korean and Chinese idols themselves use Naver and Baidu, completely different search engines
There's one thing I'm pissed off, they be calling anyone uneducated when we know nothing about their history but do you know anything about asian history or any certain race other than yours.
Nope. Asked someone this and they ignored it. Also asked them do the praise or show any type of appreciation when they use phones, internet, wear non black people fashion ect since it's the attention they seeks and once again, my question was ignored. Then I was called a troll Humans are starting to want what they can't or don't plan to give
I do think that idols should stop saying the n-word and appropriating other cultures but the thing is that the k-pop stans also say Korean words just for fun, and the idols who have said n-word mostly said it while singing a song by a black artist and so many idols say that certain black artists were their role model to become a rapper so they do respect black people but they don't know that it is an offensive word with a painful history. If we take the example of snowdrop the Korean public is bashing the drama but international fans of Blackpink dismiss their feelings by saying that it's just a drama they are overreacting and all that and are not even trying to understand why the public sentiment is so harsh for this topic like it's their history we don't have a say in it.
We need to go back to the point that the world doesn't revolve around black culture when it comes to cornrows. I want to say beside the meaning that the holds for the AA community, "cornrows" is simply just a hairstyle. Cornrows ≠ braids. Idols and people should stop being called "culture appropriators" for doing their own hair in cornrows. As a non AA I want to understand how braids are being exploited and not just something that can be apart of cultural exchange. Outside the instances where it's obvious that "black culture" is being exploited
Also wanted to say that this idea that the idol should know better makes no sense to me. "Jaehyun lived in America he should know" jaehyun also left America when he was 9 years old. People in America are simply not taught about black culture in depth as much as the people there themselves. I've learnt "American history" from going to an international school and not once was I taught about n word and such. I only learnt about it from reading books like to kill a mockingbird and roll of thunder hear my cry. Even tho them singing the n word through songs doesn't make it less Offensive, they should not be easily labelled as racist. Like Giselle and Jaehyun
You have the right attitude, which I appreciate, but you’re missing the point. Cultural appropriation is much more complicated and rare than the average kpop twitter user makes it out to be. I have a degree in cultures and can assure all the ca I’ve seen in kpop was absolutely not cultural appropriation to begin with. This is the real issue with the community. Cultures are meant to be shared and they’ve always been. For example, almost all braids belong to almost all cultures! We have cultural braids even here in Italy, there are some in Austria as well, in Scandinavia too! It’s so deminishing to say braids belong to black people when they just don’t! And this is just an example. What people are creating with cultural appropriation is at all effects the END of all cultures. How are cultures supposed to evolve if they can’t be shared? It’s truly scary to think about.
@@pennymikk thank you for saying this! And I’ve always been confused by why black hairstyles are referred to as braids when the first thing the word braid makes me think of is a French braid.
There's also a fine line between holding an idol accountable and bullying them. Before Giselle's scandal people were calling her underrated and just as talented as the rest of the members, but after her scandal people started bashing her dancing, calling her the visual hole, and saying they always hated her. Like excuse me? You don't have to like or support Giselle but her ignorance doesn't give you the right to bully her and shame her. Also, I saw a ktuber say that Wendy should just fall of the stage again. Um... That's just a horrible thing to say, no matter what that person did. I would only call Giselle or Fu Yaning racist if they were caught repeating the n word, because they've apologized and they realized and learned why their actions were wrong, so if now they were to repeat their actions they would be racist, but as of now they aren't because I believe they genuinely had no idea of the word's meaning. It's also so toxic how some (notice how I said some not all) black stans say that they'll listen to your perspective and then turn around and call you fake and against your own community if you didn't get offended. Like I literally saw someone say the unoffended fans weren't true black people. No matter your race it is not ok to police blackness. But on the flip side, the unoffended fans will tell the offended stans that their feelings are invalid and to shut up, which is also hurtful. The entire black KPOP stan community has become so toxic, and I wish people would take a closer look at it.
To add a little bit: They're also saying she's debuted because she's rich while before people praised her for passing the hardest SME's audition. I literally saw comment saying "I don't see how Giselle got in SM entertainment just needed an English speaker" with over 100 likes while they're ignoring the facts that Giselle has really good vocals or that she's already writing her lyrics.
Someone's health, visual and talents have nothing to do with it. If you bully a person about those instead of keeping it on the topic, you shouldn't be on social media losing sleep and preaching about this since it's quite clear you can't actually preach about the thing you think you are preaching about (and obviously you shouldn't have a platform, like youtube channel, to do so)
Y'all I was so happy as a poc that we were holding her accountable nad then I saw the rape threats and the death threats and body shaming thing. Some people were literally calling her a fat cow on daily basis.
I have already spoken about how kpop stans don't understand half of the words they're using,and "racism" Is one of them. This is a personal opinion of mine, but I feel half of the people only care about black ca because it is relevant and makes you sound "woke", as is right now the trend to do so, because the black community is the forefront of racism faced by pocs. Black people's issues and struggles with racism are not cared for at all,if I be honest.Most Stans ,who cannot find a legitimate reason to drag and idol or provoke fanwars, use this technique of Weaponising issues like racism ,because hey ,bodyshmaing is bad,but if the idol did something offensive,then you absolutely have every right to harass ,cyberbully and threaten them constantly on social media. They care about racism as long as it's convenient for them to do so. They pick whom they have to lash out all their anger on and ignore the rest. Unrelated, but I once saw a miracle sharing a photograph of a member of omg in a highly revealing dress, and the post's main issue was her sexual harrasment. What disgusted me, is that, the creator basically just said "I know she did ca but-(help us and other stuff".I was disgusted in the kpop fandom and yes,I'm an Indian. The fact that there are people, many of them,that won't care Or justify such horrific harrasment of idols on social media because of their issues with their past leaves me awed and horrified. Kpop stans do not understand where to draw the line, and by silently watching it, and not speaking against it, you are yourself promoting such behavior.
This girl deserves an award, for speaking up on things that other people are to afraid to say and calling out the toxic black people for what they are.
@@young_won5904 they are just scared cuz they know the truth and that your speaking facts, sorry that you had to go through that though, when people dont know what else to say they use insults and dt to backup their claims instead of talking about the issue at hand.
I actively enjoy the debates you encourage and discuss. Thank you for creating a space for people from diverse backgrounds to ask questions, seek clarification and share experiences. I don't engage in much debate on social media any more because of the tone of language used by kpop stans from all Cultural backgrounds. I have also been made to feel that, as an an older kpop fan, my opinions are not valid or I am somehow not supposed to enjoy kpop music because of my age (what a bizarre thing to be told!). I do keep an eye on lots of the arguments simply because I used to teach sociology, psychology, and about how personal, cultural and structural values and assumptions contribute towards discrimination and oppression. I find it interesting how language and labelling can cause something as serious as Racism (but also Sexism, Homophobia, Ageism, Disablism, for example) to begin to slide into anger without unpacking the wider reasons for that anger and hurt. In the UK, this appears to be fuelled by media outlets and social media echo chambers - and any attempt to discuss Britain being built on the colonisation of countless countries over the years is just shouted down. Any attempt critical thinking seems to have disappeared - that includes within wider education too. Sorry to have a ramble. Keep doing what you are doing. There will always be people that can't or won't appreciate your discussions. I, for one, do appreciate it. So, thank you - from a white, LGBTQ mum in the UK.
To this day, I still don’t know what Stray Kids or Chan did to be permanently labeled a racist. As a black Caribbean fan, I haven’t felt offended by anything they’ve done in past. I personally don’t care if someone from a different race wear braids because firstly it is quite a dated hairstyle that is hard to pinpoint where it originated from (Vikings, French braids….) and secondly I don’t think they are mocking anyone when wearing that style. That was the only part in the video I completely disagree with. I believe most of the issues stem from African Americans because of what they have been through which is a totally different experience from Africans and black Caribbean people. I understand where they are coming from but they need to mentally free themselves from that mindset that everyone and everything is against them and hate them. It’s honestly really sad and I hope we can all reach a point of understanding.
I can't agree with this more. Victimhood and self oppression is mental plague. It's result of single motherhood culture where they were raised this way where they don't get proper love. Tbh, black people get preference in everything such as jobs, universities ahead of everyone else.
@@incognitoparty In America I’m not confident that they are getting preferential treatment because I live here now and my eyes have been open to how they have been treated as a minority group over the years. With that said, they cannot expect everyone to know and understand their struggles. Heck I never heard about Jim Crow until I moved here and I still don’t fully understand what it was about and I don’t care to know because it is in the past and I need to focus on the future and what I can do to help others.
@@kymberlimorgan3905 how can you say you don’t care about Jim Crow than say you want to focus on the future to help others when Jim Crow is actively affecting black people today. Even you.
@@camileeduck1454 I do not know the full extent of what the Jim Crow is and how exactly it is affecting black people in America (myself included) and I will explain why I do not care to find out. We can both acknowledge that whatever was put in place in the past is still affecting how black people live in this country. My concern is that we acknowledge there is a systemic problem but what has been the active solution to fix it? Who has the power to course-correct these laws if not black people themselves? The major difference between the Black Americans and a high percentage of blacks from the Caribbean is who they grew up with. In my country, blacks were the majority after slavery so even though their society faced other problems (), the laws were made for our own interest. That is not the case in North America where blacks are a minority group and most if not all of those outdated laws were made by who? You guessed it. White men who only looked out for their own and found ways to deceive minority groups and keep them under. Sorry, I don't want to write an epistle, but my main point is that I don't want to focus on the past when I understand what can be done to make things right for the future. Diversity from every culture and ethnicity needs representation in high decision-making places because people are inherently biased towards their own or looks physically closest to them (even black people do this). There needs to be a balance with who is making and reviewing these laws so that everyone can benefit and not be left behind.
"The only thing they care about is people validating their anger" - Finally someone said it. This is why I do not get angry when kpop idols say the n-word because most of the time it is again cultural ignorance they don't know what that word mean or they like to say that word because they heard a black person said it in a song. Also it is up to us to control our anger and understand that lashing out does not get us respect, but makes us look immature.
as a Blasian, black kpop stans just love calling everything racist for some little brownie points, also counts for white stans too. any race really. and cultural appropriation is now just a buzzword for "i dont like what you said, so imma just throw a random word.'
This video was very much needed. I also notice on stan twt (which I'm actively a part of), the unfortunate normalization of toxic black kpop stans, even non black stans throw around the word racism/racist when the topic of discussion has nothing to do with it, which I always found so weird. Stans nowadays care more about "being in the right/ah ha I got you" (I apologize for lack of vocabulary here😭) more so than actually having healthy discussions no matter the topic & it's just so sad to see since stan culture should be fun & just a hobby since that's how it started out as for so many people, I included. Everything always has to be a fight/competition as if our lives are on the line nowadays🙄
These woke kpop stans and toxic black kpop stans complain about why these Korean idols are unaware of black or other culture and then when knetz had problem with the drama snowdrop , these same people were defending the drama because it was all fiction when the timeline or the era in the drama was a part of Korea history which actually happened...smh
But in the case of snowdrop the ifans were right to defend it. Imagine of the drama was cancelled and was not able to clear its name. In the end, it is a fictional story, even though it was set during a hard time, that fact does not change.
@@bm5701 I have parents who went through something very similar. It wasn’t just a “hard time”. It is a part of their life that sadly they can’t forget. Most ifans supported the show because they wanted to see Jisoo debut as an actor. They didn’t give a shit if the show was problematic. They didn’t try to be less ignorant or more culturally sensitive about a piece history they knew nothing about. You are calling these Ifans right? What happened to morals? Wether the show tried to distort history can be discussed. But that doesn’t excuse the behavior of ifans. Nor does it invalidate the concerns of kfans .
@@hellenwen154 so if we all agreed and the show was canceled because of misinformation would that be OK. Feelings are valid, that's what u have a choice not to watch. I had a problem with wanting it to be cancelled, that would bring a whole lot of other issues. Imagine cancelling a show a show because it has a lpt of murder and people who went through that pain demanded the show be canceled because the show brought back past trauma. Simply do t watch it. Yes their feelings mattered bet in this case they were wrong, and the show itself has proved them wrong.
@@iscream336 I said " woke "kpop stans too not only black. And I specifically said the toxic ones not normal black kpop fans. I am not generalizing the whole black kpop fans
A note to people you don't have to agree with her you can have a healthy debate with her with mature stance on the subject but please do not send her hate to her at the end of the day she is a human being with feelings and you all bullying her to have an effect on her mental health is wrong . Not everybody in a single community will have the same reaction or same feelings
I need to say this I am not black, I am white but this has opened my eyes. i have seen these toxic kpop stans before but I felt I could never approach the subject bc of who I am. I completely agree with the ‘racist’ meaning, I feel people have lost the true meaning and understanding of it. not relating to kpop but at my school if you disagree with someone who is either black, latino, and even asian sometimes will call that ‘racially motivated’ which in a lot of cases we aren’t even talking about race. people think it’s just a joke to throw around. those people who say it also want respect yet they say that this person is racist, when that person could be supporting but you just called them racist. (little side note my school prides itself for being diverse but they don’t teach anything on black history or even much slavery, everything I’ve learned about race has been online on my own time).
i'm honestly still afraid to share my point of view about multiple things just because i'm white and the subject has something to do with race. i even deleted my comment on this video like 5 times because i'm just so afraid i'll say something wrong and get labeled even though i'm freaking sure Cheryl won't do that
I hate that the kpop fandom has perpetuated the idea that if you lived in an english-speaking country or speak english, you by default know everything about African American history and black culture.
can you make a video on how it’s a bit insane how stans are moving these days? like they guilt trip whoever is in kpop as a hobby or wtv like let’s say it’s voting season and you’re not voting you’ll be dragged and whatever and be told to NOT celebrate if they win💀 an atiny (the fandom I’m in) on twitter fr shaded when ppl said “don’t force us to stream or vote for them when we’re here for the music” and that atiny said “don’t celebrate the wins ateez gets” 💀 and I kid you not someone said “we have school… we have work” as an excuse the op went “the majority who voted also have school and work, some even a housewife but still manage to vote everyday cos they want what’s best for ateez… you don’t have to do it all day but at least show some effort…” 💀
It has happened within my fandom too(nctzen). When sticker came out the fandom was highly divided because of how unusual it sounded but it did go on to become the most awarded 127 song and broke our own records. Then twitter stans were all like, anyone who didnt like the song since 1st listen dont deserve to celebrate its success and were being passive aggressive to everyone. Even when (for 127) concerts got announced everyone was literally like, if you weren't there during this era, you dont deserve a ticket you're wasting space. 'If you didnt live through this song you dont get a ticket and are taking away from us , the og stans' the kpop scene has become so toxic..
@@ars4696 wow, I don’t remember nctzens being that toxic when I was really into NCT a couple of years ago. I’ve always found nctzens to be pretty chill, that’s crazy. Glad I still listen to nct’s music without focusing on the fandom so much.
engenes as well. they will literally guilt trip you into voting and it made me lose motivation like i get it you want your faves to win or pay back their efforts but damn do not force me to do things when my hands are already full with other stuff. i have priorities. all of us do.
For those who didn't get the point, it's not that an Idol should not be held accountable when they mess up or that black stans should not get offended when this happens, they have all the right to be and not to forgive if they feel uncomfortable, but the problem is that the toxic ones give for granted that everybody is properly educated about their situation using the excuse that "they should've known better" as if it made sense. I'm mexican, we're literally neighbors with the united states and I didn't know that ca, blackface, using aave or even saying the n-word was considered offensive until 2020 and who jim crow was until 2021, not becuase I didn't wanted to, but because the demographic conditions of my country allows me not to need this kind of information. Almost 90% of the mexican population are mestizos (mix between indigenous people and white people) and barely 2% are afro-mexicans or zambos (mix between black people and indigenous people) besides, with a different history than african-americans. Like, why would you expect us to learn someone else's culture from head to toe when we barely know our own? This should not be considered as an excuse to be racist at all but to have a better understanding on why there's so much ignorance. We are not taught about this, most of us know because of the internet or don't know at all and in the case we get to see topics such as slavery at school, its very superfical because education in here rather focuses on our own history. Absoultely NO ONE should be obligated to know everybody's cultural background and history.
The problem is young black Americans on the internet. I used to live in Korea and the lack of education on other cultures is very lacking, but they are learning. It feels so awful to see (especially the black kpop community on tiktok and Twitter) be so toxic and just rude for the smallest things. AND THE WORST THING is that they NEVER hold their faves accountable. Or they always say “they already apologized so it doesn’t matter” like ???? The idol you’re bashing also apologized so what’s the problem lmfao
being a black stay in the kpop community is hard 😭 i agree w most of the stuff you said in the video, however i dislike it when non-black people tell us that we're sensitive whenever we dislike something an idol has done, if that makes sense
You ignore the fact that some black people call others black people sensitive. Maybe if you used your critical thinking instead of throwing the word racist as a candy you would not hear these stuff
@@angela8737 all im saying is that black people are allowed to be offended without non-black people telling them they're snowflakes ?? plus i wouldn't like it even if another black person did, invalidating others' feelings is wrong
@@rihze most people in the comments section are pretty respectful and nobody said that idols saying slurs and hurting the feelings of black people should be shut down. But calling idols racist because of hairstyles and expecting everyone to know about black history is too much. I think it would be be great if fans respectfully mass emails kpop industries to teach their idols being racially and culturally educated. being offended for insignificant matters like hairstyles is ridiculous because black Americans are imposing their history to the rest of the world. Most comments are respectful they are simply debating and sharing their opinions. Some Americans have a huge main character complex. Can you elaborate on "invalidating" because this word is used when people cannot stand different POVs
@@rihze I thought you were talking about hairstyles. I apologise for the misunderstanding. If you're talking about the nword and blackface then you're right. Calling black people snowflakes because they are offended due to slurs and blackface is disgusting and invalidating their feelings
Since it got brought up, let’s discuss the over-usage of the word “racist”. I’ve seen paper towel dispensers, crossing signs, trees, math, exercising, etc anything you can think of being called “racist”. Heck, I even once saw someone calling breathing as “racist”. That word has become so diluted that it’s lost nearly all of its weight. So, I just ask that people be a little more careful with when they throw it around. Ask yourself first, is the PERSON racist or is their ACTION racist? Take things like wearing Black hair styles and saying the N-word. I’ve said this before either in one or my own videos or in a comment under one of EGU’s vids (probably both). International Hip-Hop culture is heavily influenced by Black American Hip-Hop culture. And when countries like South Korea (that are so far removed from Black culture) consume art derived from this Black American Hip-Hop culture (mainly through rap music), they don’t realize how much importance so of these aspects are and their connection to Black history. They just see “That hair style looks cool! I wanna try it!” Or “I want to make a cover/sing along to that English song! Let me learn the lyrics!” and they usually don’t bother learning what they mean as is the case with many English speakers who cover KPop songs. They put that out for the public to see, the court of public opinion condemns them, it’s a mess. In that confusion, some people are actually trying to salvage what’s left of the meaning of these intense words (racist, sexist, homophobic, etc.) by explaining to the idols why what they did is viewed as wrong. But that get drowned under hundreds of thousands of hate comments about the idol’s appearance, talent, style, etc. Look at Jessi and how many times the conversation has gone from her putting on a “black-cent” (sorry if I spelled that wrong) to people not liking her bluntness or her cosmetic surgery. Also, playing Devil’s advocate a bit, I know plenty of non-Black people from New Jersey who speak like she does. I don’t know if it was derived from how Black Americans speak or not. So, in my opinion, that topic is up for debate and I’d love to hear everyone else’s thought on it! 😊 But like how EGU explained in her video about winning an argument, attack the action and not the person. If it’s a case of a repeat offender *cough cough* Jay Park *cough*, then it’s more fair to accuse the person of being racist than something like Giselle mouthing the N-word in a SZA song (which again brings us to the confusion of the overuse of the N-word in music, writing, art in general, etc., who can use it, why can only they use it, and that whole mess that has yet to be properly explained worldwide). So yeah, be careful with who and what you consider to be “racist”. Words like “r*pist” and “sexist” have already seen a huge decline in weight/value and “homophobic”/“transphobic” never held much value in the first place since the LGBTQ+ community has always been pushed to the side. And now for being so good and reading my entire essay, you guys get a little anecdote: It was 2018, and I was working at a gym. This gym had a partnership with a nearby hotel where the hotel would pay for the gym’s utilities and the hotel guests could use the pool at the gym. One evening, I was closing up alone. One of the elderly gym members complained that a lot of kids were roughhousing in the pool (despite signs saying not to...) and that she didn’t feel save because they were all over the place. I go to the pool area and see three boys (probably about 8-10 years old) jumping on each other, playing chicken, splashing each other, etc (ya know, the true meaning of “boys will be boys”). So, I go up to them and just ask them if they could please calm down and remember that there are other people in the pool. They all apologized “Sorry, mister” and went along playing. I went up to the group of parents that were monitoring the kids and just apologized for having to ask them to calm down and explained that a member complained about the rough housing and that there were no lifeguards on duty (plus, I was the only employee in the building). So, there wasn’t much supervision for them. They all thanked me for handling the situation like a grown up and I went back to my desk. About 15 minutes later, this white woman comes up to me. I ask if I can help her with anything and she screams at me “WHAT YOU DID IN THE POOL AREA WAS RACIST!!! THERE WERE WHITE KIDS THERE AND YOU ONLY SCOLDED THE KIDS OF COLOR!!!” I tried explaining that I only asked the kids who were roughhousing when I got down there to please be careful and I made sure to tell all of the parents in case. She did care and threatened to report me and have me fired for this. I spent the rest of my shift panicking and crying because I didn’t intend to do anything racist, nor did I think that I was. Fortunately, nothing happened and she was all talk. But still, that made me start to lose some of the value in that word. Here I was, conducting my job as I’m supposed to, and I’m suddenly being called a racist? So yeah, please be careful when randomly throwing that or any other serious term around. Condemn the action first and then the person if you have sufficient evidence to back up that you believe them to be one. Anyways, I’ve ranted on for long enough. Wow, two essays in one video. Y’all know the drill. Drink plenty of water and let me know your thoughts in the replies. I’m always open to having discussions about what other people think and if I should be corrected or provide further elaborations on anything. Love you all! 💕
as for jessi the reason why ppl believe she uses a blaccent is bc in alot of old videos she never had that accent (if u wanna watch a voice comparison I suggest watching Adeola Ash's K-Pop ripping off Black artists? Blackpink Lisa vs Cierra Nichols, Rain JYP Bobby Brown, Jessi Dainá and skip around the 8:20 mark) I'm not joking when I saw the voice comparison my jaw actually dropped b/c i always thought her accent was natural. Had no idea she faked it! Also before ppl say she grew up around black ppl thats why she sounds like that....she's from the white parts of new jersey
@@seokiology You know, I never knew that her accent had changed over time. I just assumed that she had always spoken in the way that she currently does. I’ll def check out that other vid! Thanks for letting me know! Also, hi friend! I hope you’re having an amazing week! Love you! 💜
@@seokiology I mean her old company does control what idols do so I wouldn’t be surprised if they told her to act “like a sweet quiet girl” who talked all cutesy. Her voice to me just sounds like any deep raspy on a girl
@@brennathecatlover4360 jessi was under ymc enterainment from 2014 to 2018. The old video that was used in adeola ash video to show Jessi old voice was when she was on ASC in 2014. In fact in that ASC video she talks about being in YMC enterainment. Jessi started using a blaccent around 2015 ish when she was on Unpretty Rapstar (2015), so long before she was in Pnation. So the whole "oh her old company forced her to act cute" isn't true when she was using a blacccent while under that old company.
@@Nameless_mixes hi np! I had no idea too until i saw Adeola's video. She put all of her sources in the description and pinned comment in case you want to see the evidence more closely btw. Aww tysm ily2!!! This week been ok but battling thru. Hope you're having an amazing week too 💜
i remember this one post by a black girl using mehendi (henna) on her hands and she got mad at the henna for not being as bright on her skin as opposed to lighter skin , proceeded to call it racist, she called the HENNA , RACIST
@@Sanjiscumslut istg it wasn’t even that bad , the henna was showing pretty well but she wasn’t happy cuz it looked better on her reference picture which had white hands
for me there's a huge misconception between racist ignorance and racism. for me racism is ALWAYS intensional. you did it and you mean it. and racial ignorance is when you're uneducated/misinformed and when you do something offensive you're sorry or you want to educate yourself. racist people are never sorry because they know exactly what they are doing and they don't want to educate at all. also we should hold idols accountable but they are humans as well... wishing them death treats is unacceptable. hating on them won't change anything
I really like the part about you talking about how not everyone know black history. I live in France and ignorance is a thing (not with everyone for sure). I’ve been called the n-word and I didn’t know what it meant before so I thought it wasn’t a big deal until I told it to my cousin and when I heard the word when they talked about slavery in school when I was 10. And even though they talk to us about slavery it’s only this (not saying that it is not important, it’s just that they don’t talk much about black people except this). All those things like blackface, blackfishing, I learned it from the medias or my parents. Not everyone are going to know about the history and we have to deal with wether you are happy or not.
exactly i live in turkey and i was probably 12 when i learned that the nword is an ACTUAL slur even though i had the access to go search it up and the necessary english level for it. i literally remember my old social studies teacher saying the nword and he was like "yeah if you say this in america youll probably get shot" hello?
Your honesty on racism especially in kpop and how we as black kpop stans should really take a look at ourselves helped me alot. Everyone's hate for kpops cultural appropriation really made me ignore the artists but when I finally started thinking for myself I realized a few things, one being no matter how many times we cry on social media this is social media, artists will apologize and continue their behaviour or they will just ignore it. Instead of continual internet tears I silently remove my support for issues concerning racism, SA, cultural appropriation and other behaviour I just do not agree with, silence speaks more volume in this industry than noise. They need noise doesn't matter if it's good or bad, this could (in my opinion should) be applied in western entertainment as well.
oh my god the thing about "if u got a basic middle school education i shouldn't have to explain CA to you" oh really? reeeally? your middle school taught you what CA was, genuinely? girl u better tell me what school that is cuz i don't believe u, esp when u seem to be incapable of defining it
Can I say as a fan of kpop since late 2009 you are a refreshing voice. You give me inspiration to want to start a ktube but that anxiety got me like ha no
Something that annoys me a lot is when people say stuff like "you know what they did" or "y'all know what happened" & that doesn't make sense to me because how are you gonna tell someone else what they do and don't know?! Not everybody knows the same amount of information as you
When Lisa posted a picture of her from KTL era wearing braids, all the angry black kpop stans started raging in her comment section. I commented saying, that i was black and that i didn't feel offended by it. But for the one's who do, should just tell her and educate her. Two people replied back saying "you aren't the entire black community" as if i was trying to be. Literally was only speaking for myself. Not the entire community. And they keep coming at me because i wasn't mad like they were. They need to get their acts together
i think the same way you do. i’ve dealt with that a lot and honestly with fans like that, i just look the other way and ignore at this point. they say “you don’t speak for everyone” but that at the same time forget that they don’t speak for everyone either. they act like they’re raising awareness for black voices to be heard, but in reality, they’re just mad because you’re not on their side. it’s so embarrassing, it’s sad.
I’m SO HAPPY she wore braids. Just think about it! Blackpink is an INTERNATIONALLY successful group, showcasing braids worn nicely and not in a mocking form. How nice to wear if confidently, to convey its positive image to everywhere in Asia and the west, and make braids more normalised? They should be thanking K-pop. All their complaining about being discriminated while a frikin Asian pop group is making it less stigmatised
there is nothing wrong with not forgiving idols, expressing your discomfort, etc, but why are some toxic stans spending so much time actually personally attacking them about unrelated things and straight up bullying them and their stans? that is not the same as holding someone accountable, that's just something people do when they are bored and want fanwars. also americans may not believe this, but it's true that most people in other countries learn about this problematic things from the internet, if someone doesn't spend a lot of time on the english-speaking internet they likely not know it.
Thankyou for this , I’ve always wanted to say the same thing but im not black and i was always afraid that if i ever talk back to black stans’ problematic comments I’d be attacked for being racist
When you said culture ignorance isn't just in black culture I was so happy because when ever I say that everyone disagrees without looking thinking hard about it
its true some stans not just black kpop stans give lables to idols and attack them without knowing the damage it can cause to the idols career,life etc.
I agree. It’s irritating being called a coon or assumed I’m “white” because I don’t agree with an opinion 🙄 at this point no one will care if they’re called racist because every little thing is considered racist now. It’s starting to lose its meaning.
I hate how ppl expect everyone non north american to know about the n word, and i found so ridiculous when ppl hate so bad a idol WHO DON'T EVEN SPEAK ENGLISH say the n word like that Enhypen member that i forgot and Han, like??????? And even the ones who know english like Giselle, knowing english means that you learned the language, not the culture, i just learned about the n word some years ago. And ppl used the argument "what if the idol is from america or something" and with that i say, i never saw Somi, both Mark's, Johnny, Vernon and Josh, Kevin, Jacob or both Eric's, and even Jessi saying the n word so.....
I still remember how I asked this person what's the history behind the"N-word" because she has black friends and I wanted to educated myself on their history she screamed at me and told me I was ignorant while I was just tryna learn
Girrrrrl you are speaking the truth and I really hope that people will understand cultural appreciation, appropriation, racism, colourism, ignorance etc I see terms like these thrown there all the time, abuse depression etc as well and this makes these terms less and less meaningful and impactful etc It is important to educate ourselves but despite having resources it is difficult as sources usually have bias and I am saying this as someone studying politics and IR... It is okay to not like things, to be annoyed or offended by something but people need to measure their words and have more definitions anyyyyywaysss please keep doing videos, your voice is lovely and your thinking is GREAT
Thank you for summarizing this so well! I would like to add: - I feel like it's mainly a problem with young stans from the US, who think they know everything while not knowing anything about the history of other countries. - If you mention being from Europe (or anywhere but the US), you get attacked immediately because you are assumed to be white and as you also aren't Asian, you cannot have any opinion on the topic. - Many claim anything and everything as "black culture", especially braids. I get it with cornrows, they are a part of black history (not just from slaves in the US, some of the styles originated in Africa way earlier, if my history textbook is correct). But when someone attacks an idol for wearing any braids at all, it's just stupid. There have been braided hairstyles way earlier than US slavery, among vikings, romans, suebians, ancient Chinese people and native americans, to name a few. To quote my professor: "Not everything that looks like a duck, actually is a duck.", meaning: "If you think you are right, you should triple check before telling someone else they are wrong.", or applied to the topic "Not everything that seems racist to you, actually is. Better check a textbook before you claim that only your ancestors did that." - Everything is labeled "racism" or "cultural appropriation", even if it's just an issue of someone not knowing everything about a particular minority or if it was actually meant to be cultural appreciation. - Anything with racism or CA is only applied to black people (usually from the US). There rarely are conversations about it when it comes to other Asian cultures, for example. And if there are, it's usually dumb stuff, like people hating on Lisa for wearing a traditional Thai outfit when she literally is from Thailand. - Sometimes (as with Lisa, for example) people use "Racism" as an excuse to bully idols online, even if they didn't do anything (or had no control over it, like with some outfits). - Sometimes it sadly is an issue of people being ignorant about other languages. I have seen idols being accused of saying the N-word, when they really said "내가", which is usually romanized as "naega" and translates to "I". Not everyone is fluent in English and only a minority speaks no other languages besides English. It's a tiring topic that is not really worth arguing about, as the people that (usually) are the issue will not listen (or change) anyway.
@@Ash.e__Mayy yeah, Wendy is kinda 😑 especially since she lived in Canada but I'm mostly talking about the ones that don't speak english and have lived in South Korea or sum
How? Why is it that whenever people are allowed to speak their truth, they're "racist"? Same with women calling anyone that calls out their ignorance, "misogynistic". Or because people don't add gay characters to a book or show, "homophobic". It's not racist to say what someone does that bothers you. It's not racist to say when someone is being toxic. It's not racist to ask others to respect as they want to be respected People really let their feelings blind them to any truths and act like because of their feelings, they can't be criticized
Ahh finally someone has spoken about this!!! I respect everyone and all cultures but the things you mentioned had been bothering me and I always felt I had to be quiet or get attacked even tho I’m not saying anything disrespectful or rude Thank you for this video!
Let’s be real a lot of black people from America try and make it out like we’re better than our white counterparts but that’s not true. Americans choose to be ignorant and intolerant about so much but expect respect. No one is saying to accept racism or not call out when an idol does something wrong. People need to understand that we are not the same and don’t get taught the same. Why would a humongous country like South Korea know so much about American slavery? So many people have decided to attack others when they ask a simple question. Someone saying “I don’t understand why this is racist.” Isn’t them being hateful. Normalize explaining yourself instead of canceling others.
Don’t know when explaining ourselves became not normal, but it’s really shitty that it did. If you can’t put into words why you think a certain way then maybe you need to consider why you think it before fighting with people that disagree with you.
I know a lot of people will hate me for saying this but the biggest racists in the world today are some black people. The definition of racism is having prejudged prejudices against another group of people based on skincolor alone. I have never seen anyone throw unearned hated at others like some black people do. I just want to tell these types of people. Before you throw racism at me for being white and bringing up slavery. a that happened over 300 years ago and nobody alive today took part and b muslims continued owning slaves well up to the 1990s how come you have nothing to say to them. My point is i don't understand why we have normalised racism as long as its a black person doing it. Its Wrong to do that to anybody
@@tabithadickson36 The reasons why people think that way is all of the racism and hatred and attacks that happened after slavery and even now today. That's why black people, especially from the south find it hard to accept different cultures and in general accept white people. When I was younger, and went to my first more diverse school, more like 45/45 blacks and whites, I was so concerned and weirded out because of all of what the school system has taught us: white people did this blah blah blah. I even had this mindset of thinking europeans were bad because of our native american unit. As well as going into a society to where I'm looked at different, we are kind of raised to be more careful of what we say about our culture, and how we act, our slang, etc. And a lot of the "racism" is really just preceptions. Some black people are generally racist though and that's an entire different conversation. So I get what you mean, but the whole black people being racist thing is too complicated to just have one statement on it.
Everyone needs to watch this Edit: Even if this particular video emphasizes the black kpop stan community, I think any race or country-based communities can still grasp on to some of the points made in here as they are the usual commonalities. An example in this video is the reality that everyone does not necessarily know everything due to the self-centered point of view of history in local educational environments.
thank you for voicing out, whenever there's an issues like this, they always blame people because not known about the history of it... and it's make me kinda afraid of them. but when it's come to other country rules, they usually never care and insert their own culture in other country something like that... and when we tried to explaining.. they never listen at all.. quick to jump and bring their race card..
Finally smne saying it. Ofc we need to hold idols accountable and hopefully idols learn more from their mistakes, but honestly I never knew about the n- word or the cultural appropriation and all that until i actually saw a kpop idol scandal. I had to search it up and understand why it was offensive. Not everyone knows about it.. lol the fact that our country doesent even teach our own history how are we supposed to know the others? We can all learn slowly..
Same with some desi stans and i am speaking this as a desi myself some desi stans are like so over the top like they be labelling even minute bopping to indian songs as racist like girl bye 😭😭😭😭 also not these same people throwing around the nword like anything and saying really racist stuffs about other culture lmao not only that even i get said weird stuffs often for appreciating my culture here in India like their is so much of regionalism like 😢
I also hate the fact that some just use it to cancel who they hate. Like just why? Why would you use your own culture to cancel or degrade someone? I think that's disprespecting the culture
As an Indian K-Pop stan, I have seen cultural appropriation happening for our culture as well. But then, you cannot keep complaining just because they did not apologize THE WAY YOU WANT IT TO BE. Also, people need to stop blaming the idols because 90% of the times they themselves have no idea that they offended your culture. Thank you for speaking out loud about this!
It's hard having these kinds of discussions online bc anyone can really access it. It's something we need to fix between eachother but if we open convo like this it opens the door for people to use it to be racist and used against. Its like that one Obama joke.
There is a group of young black kpop stans in the fandom I'm a part of, who like to constantly stir up trouble by antagonising other stans and playing the racism card in order to guilt the rest of the fandom into cancelling the people they don't like. Recently, they bullied an og fan in our community simply because she got into multiple fan signs, throwing out buzzwords like classist and even racist? My fandom is very small so when these accusations get thrown around, everyone goes along with it because they are scared of being cancelled. A lot people have left the fandom due to these immature teens on a powertrip who have made the community atmosphere so toxic, and because the fandom is sooooo small, this is negatively affecting the group we support too. Old fans, people who ran fanbases, organised events and translators have left the fandom due to these few bad actors. I dread being active in the fandom now, it's becoming such a miserable place.
@9:53 to be completely honest I was taught about Jim Crow but never went into it we just learned a little of what happened and then moved on (I live in the us and I’m black) I always thought that the pose was just something childish gambino did cuz I never looked into it
Another one that I can think of is that if you have different opinion, they will assume that you are white.
where is the lie????
Right😭😭?? That's disrespectful and anti-black /s
Ikr
I was called white by one of Ajanae's subscriber by not agreeing with her
OOP
HONESTLY THO
as a BLACK person who attended an international school in europe, i can confirm that american history is not taught, if it was, it was veeery briefly touched upon but i literally have no recollection of it. i don't think i knew the gravity of the N-word until I was, like 16, and that didn't come from school, i think i learned it from my parents.
its so ridiculous for americans to assume that it is too bc i'm an american and they don't go deep into other countries' history in our schools- only the parts that are relevant to america. i imagine that's how most places in the world are.
This reminds me of one time when I asked a question regarding Giselles situation. All I asked was, " Not defending Giselle or anything but do they really teach American history or the racial slurs in international schools?" And then someone got mad at me and told me that I was defending her which I already said that I wasnt. But it really was a genuine question.
@@jlizard8500 yeah true I myself didn't even knew what the n word means
I swear to god I really didn't
Same, I'm a fluent English speaker myself (my third language), I've been watching a lot of English shows since young, I've been getting As for every English exam I've sat for, yet I didn't know the N-word existed until I was 17, and I only knew it through a random meme about how a Chinese word in a song “那一个” (read as nayige) sounded like the N-word lol. This is because I live in Southeast Asia, and there are no Africans here other than a few African exchange students. I literally do not know it since I don't live with black people. And why does a country that has barely any correlation to another country have to teach history that isn't relevant to their country? Kids are already complaining about the long and boring history of their own country, would they even bother to read history about other countries in depth just to not offend anyone??
People were mad and many chose to not forgive idols like Jaehyun and Giselle for just *mouthing* the N-word in a song that's not directed to anyone, they were just vibing. Their reason was because they should've known better?? At this point they're just hating to hate, not to educate.
Yes, Jaehyun was in America for 4 years, when he was YOUNG, very YOUNG. Young enough to not get exposed to or even know that the N-word exists.
Giselle attended an international school in JAPAN. And no, they won't be teaching history of America because it's a JAPANESE international school.
H3ll, even my classmate who has A+ in English didn't know the meaning of the N-word, he told me he thought it meant "bro" since it's commonly used in songs.
Therefore, being fluent in English definitely doesn't make you know any better about Western countries or culture. So no, they wouldn't have known better, stop hating...
@@jlizard8500 i don’t think giselle was right for mouthing the n word, but it really pisses me off when people say things like “she knows english, she should’ve known better” “she went to an international school, she knew the n word” when it’s not true at all. as someone who had lived in japan before (currently living in hong kong), black history is almost NEVER taught in schools, and even if it is, it’s only touched on very briefly. it’s impossible for every english speaker to have full knowledge of slurs and for giselle, it is high unlikely for her to have known because asia is very uneducated. america doesn’t even teach black history properly yet you expect japana of all places to teach black history extensively? that doesn’t make sense at all.
i literally had someone argue with me about the ignorance of asia when they lived in america. i was close to a breakdown (/j) talking with them because they haven’t even been to asia before and i LIVE there. i know better than to say every english speaker knows the n word because trust me, it doesn’t. not all people in america know the n word, much less japanese people.
in the paraphrased words of bea miller: "everyone wants to hear a strong opinion as long as it's the same as theirs"
oh my god that song is my anthem... I was a huge bea miller stan in 2017 lol i wish she released more albums
@@0304-s1h aaahh someone actually understood the reference. truth be told i'm not a bea STAN but i've heard at least all the songs that have mvs and i am not disappointed. that song she did for arcane??🤯i need more epic music like that
@@0304-s1h same
bro u have taste for liking bea
Slayyyyy
I agree on everything. It's so difficult to even say anything on the internet without people yelling at you. It just makes you think that black people's only source of validation is calling others racist.
Racism is an ideology and a strong word, but now is thrown around like it's nothing. And demanding other countries to know everything about black history (and American history) is just another form of colonialism. The world doesn't revolve around you. And respect is earned, it's not just given because of the color of your skin.
I also want to add that it's difficult for non black people to even understand who is saying what, because black people aren't always united on the problem, which is totally fine (everyone has their own opinion), but then they go and say "listen to black people".
Like, it's just a way to say "just listen to ME", because as soon as you listen to another black person that has a different opinion, then boom racist.
For example black people from Africa often have different opinions about CA compared to black Americans, but non black people can't agree with them (even if their arguments are better on a particular issue) because otherwise Americans will call them anti-black, even if they are exactly listening to black people. It's the need to have ONLY the American perspective be heard. It's crazy.
I go by listening to the majority rather than the minority when it comes to these things. I know it's easier to listen to to someone who has the same opinion as you to feel validation in your thoughts but to expand your range of thinking listen to why the people are mad are mad and then use your own thoughts from there.
@@chrissycupcakes2448
That's right, but what if the majority doesn't care or isn't angry? And how to tell which "side" is in the majority? A bunch of people screaming on Twitter is not the majority. I just won't take sides at all or I'll form an opinion on my own and see if someone else agrees with me. I always look at the arguments of both sides, but I won't be convinced by one just because they are the ones being "mad". I'll still use my brain.
That doesn't mean that I'm speaking over anyone or that then everyone must agree with me. It's just an opinion in an ocean of other opinions.
Yesssssssssss
Ok
@@lavistelle6031 there is no way to determine who is the majority. I don't have a Twitter because I just think it's a toxic website in general, but behind the computer screen there are still people. Even if they say their opinions in an uncouth way it doesn't mean their opinions are invalid. Also basic research can be used on certain topics too. That's how I learned a lot about my Muslim friends and found that I was saying and thinking a lot of horrible things. There are people who are given a platform on t.v whom say that being Muslim for a woman is terrible. But after doing my own research on forums and making friends I formed a different opinion. Though I still don't agree with a lot I didn't choose to listen to the opinion that just validated my own.
I feel like the cultural appropriation debate has inadvertently created a reality awful environment. I totally understand why a black person would be offended by someone saying the N word, wearing cornrows, doing blackface, or something like that. I also understand that it’s extremely rude to misappropriate religious symbols. However I feel like we’ve created an environment where we can’t have healthy cultural exchange without someone getting offended for woke points. Isn’t division EXACTLY what racists want? Also some cultures are generally more offended by appropriation then others, which is a natural variation, but no one wants to acknowledge that.
Agree! The concept of cultural appropriation (which is an American concept btw) has been brought to such an extreme that people are scared to share their culture, even when they are invited to do so.
There are many locals all over the world that live by selling pieces of their culture and this whole CA thing has made people scared to even listen to them. Like in Europe is pretty common that black people offer to do their braids on whoever wants them (while getting paid of course) and no one really questions this until they discover what Americans are saying. Or American getting pissed because foreigners wear kimonos even tho Japanese people love that.
I think everyone is entitled to feel offended by whatever they want, but at the same time it doesn't always mean the world must agree with that. The definition of racism doesn't include CA, so putting them together on the same level is just wrong.
This is exactly why so many cultures and ancient practices are dying: there are fewer and fewer locals who do them and foreigners are often too scared to try to get into them. Gatekeeping cultures will never solve racism and it just brings problems in places where cultures lived together in harmony (or at least a better harmony than whatever is happening in the US).
Yes 99% of every RUclips video or about racism or ca even if the video has nothing to do with it. Most comment sections these days are just toxic, no wonder why people are scared to ask questions.
@@lavistelle6031 the problem with the "CA is an American thing" is that in the beginning of the conversation it was about cultures that had their own problem because they were mistreated already by their country and then suddenly big luxury brands wanted to treadmark their things. Like the LV boomerang, the bordados mexicanos by some European/yt woman and Disney wanting to trademark a literal Mexican celebration for a movie. In those cases I feel like it was completely reasonable, being Mexican myself and understanding the fact that wanting to trademark an artesanía made by indigenous women that had already a problem on selling them without the police fighting them was a lot; I'm not sure if it was the colors, the process, the patterns or the general idea the one that was going to get the trademark but was pretty fckup because it was going to stop the ones who made a living out of a tradition to keep doing it and not completely the fact that it was going to get sell by a yt woman or it was made by one
@@lavistelle6031 I'm not sure if I explained myself but in those cases it went further than a person outside this culture is doing it, it was the literal appropriation of the labor that went with it
In the case of the Disney trademark is a lot more clear
@@grachi0matilda
Yes, in that case I think we can talk about "cultural exploitation" which is way worse. In that case a company or someone uses a culture just for profit without giving anything to the people of said culture. I totally agree on that, it's wrong.
It's the same when they make movies about something. I'm Italian so I'll use this example. Pixar made "Luca" which was set in Italy and it was a very good representation of the country and culture, together with a good story. Then there are movies like House of Gucci that totally disrespect the country and are clearly made just to make money. Of course, in this case it's nothing TOO serious, but it's an example that I personally could make.
In general I think it's very different when normal people want to use other cultures. 99% of cases if they use them it's because they like it. No one is brading their hair with a style they hate or find ugly. And yes there is always the argument "people of that culture get kicked out of jobs", which is totally valid, but again, are foreigners the ones kicking black Americans out of their jobs?
I'll never understand how an idol wearing anything from other cultures hurts anyone, unless they are mocking the culture (like doing the desi dance while making weird faces, that's disrespect). They aren't in any way responsible for what happens in the US, so why should they be punished and talked down when they are not the problem? I don't get it, I'll never get it. How are they hurting black people? By wearing a style they clearly like? Also, many black people in Africa are fine with that, so who should we listen to?
Sharing cultures is what made societies grow and it's sad to see the state of our world now. The internet is so centered around the US that any different opinion gets shut down. Not to mention that they preach about how to fight racism and about how educated they are when their country is more racist than literally 2/3 of Europe.
the only thing that annoys me but this is the hypocrisy and this isnt just in black kpop stans but also in western stans i noticed. yall talk the most but do not follow through or do not care about your activism once its about something not popular
People are hypocrites. Like you see a lot of people talking about aninal rights but still eat more need than necessary every day and buy the cheapest one. Or the environmental activists. At my school they were such hypocrites, who joined Friday's for future and drove by car to school every day because it didn't took so much time, had new phones every year, bought a lot of fast fashion and ate a lot of meat, when the meat production is one of the worst factors for the environment and is full of people working like slaves.
Most people only call for something and don't want to minimize their own comfort by restricting themselves for the cause because they are egotistical hypocrites and want to be praised for doing an Instagram post about it or donating some money and forget about it
this is true. a toxic stan would call out an idol and say he/she is racist but when it comes to BLM they all shut up.
People in general are just huge hypocrites. They get mad a Idols for saying racial slurs, but then turn around and call people of their own community even worse slurs, when they don't agree with them.
And that's on, performative activism
Can we also talk about how a lot of toxic black kpop stan’s dictating who black stan’s should stan or not stan. once you stan a group that they don’t support they start calling black stan’s in that fandom c00ns when most of them actually hold idols accountable, this is why me as a black kpop fan is so scared to express who i actually like or listen too on tiktok because toxic black kpop stans generalize black stans in those fandoms who their idols offended their culture always gets attacked or being called the weakest links. don’t get me started on how these toxic black kpop stans enable non black people to call them racial slurs for liking a problematic group (i constantly see this when people attack black stays or black giselle stans, who don’t defend their actions but hold them accountable)
Fr , like let me Stan Blackpink, BTS , NCT and Straykids, if it doesn't hurt you physically or mentally, you shouldn't be out here calling your fellow BLACK PERSON slurs 🙄 what's embarrassing is that those people calling out people for stanning problematic groups, probably Stan one too
@@eem8736 honestly i had to argue with a toxic black stan because of that and the toxic ones refuse to take accountability for their words but if someone calls them out for it that person is anti black or racist
Not to mention they blame us for the idols problematic behavior when it’s not our fault to begin with. I can’t control what another person does. The only thing I can do as a fan is inform them why what they did was wrong.
@@eem8736 I’ll never understand people that complain about being called slurs, and then go call other people slurs.
@@eem8736 ikr like I don't support the wrong things they did but I Stan for the music(I'm an nctzen,stay,army and casual blackpink listener and many more)
"You expect people to know everything about your one country, but for some crazy reason you're allowed to not know what's going on in their country?" YES. Someone needed to say it, there is way too much entitlement and little understanding in the community. I love this way of explaining it, because at the end of the day people from completely different cultures will not have full knowledge on the entire world's history. There will always be mistakes and misunderstandings
i mean their using my culture, promoting themselves as global artists, idk seems reasonable to know that but maybe that’s just me.
@@tortillahehe Do you not know how to read? Not everyone knows about everyone else's culture, especially when it comes to American culture because it's a mix of MULTIPLE cultures, and if you haven't been to said country, how are you going to understand their culture & meaning deeply? If you see a majority of a country acting a certain way, dressing a certain way, and using certain words, you're going to assume that's what said country is interested in & stereotype them based off that (which isn't good but everyone stereotypes unfortunately). Also, global to most Koreans means global in ASIA, not just the west. You people are way too entitled in thinking everyone knows everything about you & your culture, especially when it comes to homogeneous countries such as Korea, Japan, etc. It's clear you're uncultured in general, work on that.
@annayu why'd u get so mad 💀
I would like to thank you for creating a platform where rational discussion is allowed. It was really needed, and not only in kpop. I hope you serve as an inspiration to many others.
you know damn well why ur watching this daniel
I'm french, and I'm mixed. My mother is tunisian, my father is a white european. Until 2017, I didn't know what a "blackface" was, yet I'm educated and stuff, I was 16 at the time. I learned what it was because a famous footballer did a blackface and black french people explained what it was. But me, an educated teenager of african descent with access to internet, didn't know what a blackface was. I learned what "cultural appropriation" was at 17, I learned who Jim Crow was at 20. It may sounds obvious to American people but it's really not to us Europeans.
if your father is french youre not caucasian, youre european. caucasian refers to the ethnic people of the caucasus region please dont use our word the word caucasian for white people has long been abandoned by science
@@sunmiswashingmachine Oooh thanks for telling me, in France "caucasien" means white person that's why I said this
@@ezra5420 the term by science has been abandoned in the 20th century because the individuality of ethnic groups was more important than 3 racial groups that was too broad. and caucasian also included west central and south asia and north africa so it didnt make sense to keep on using it
It’s really not obvious to any other country tbh
@@sunmiswashingmachine Caucasian is still used in North America and it means European origin or possessing light skin (middle easterners and North Africans are lumped into Caucasian on the US census for example). It’s a long debunked biological race concept, but the meaning of the word has changed like so many others. It’s still may controversial to some, but responding to your comment, it is still a valid word to use, especially in America
Yes and yes. I don't know for some reason black Kpop stans feel like we are above criticism, we are above reproach, everything is all high-and-mighty. I'm glad that you have the courage to step out and say the criticisms that needed to be said.
I especially agree with the part where not everyone knows black culture, but I would like to add that it's specifically American black culture. Because when people are complaining on TikTok and Twitter, they're not talking about African black culture, they're not talking about Caribbean black culture, they're not talking about French black culture, they're talking about AMERICAN black culture. Because frankly they don't even know what those other countries cultures are, they're just offended about their own.
For example if an idol decided to try and imitate a Bahamian accent and I found it offensive, the black community is not going to rally behind me and fight the issue because it's a "black culture" problem.
They don’t have to defend you they are from a different culture. It would be the same the other way around Bahamians aren’t defending black Americans, they don’t have to fight for you if they don’t want to. I’m Haitian I would not expect a black American to defend me
@@jasmineestime3949 But that's not the case now is it, especially online. As long as you're black you're supposed to have a problem with the same issues that African Americans have.
I always use this example, I have no problems with other races wearing cornrows and braids. In my country it is quite fine for people of any race to wear cornrows, we braid it for them, that's how we make money. But if I say that then there are going to be a bunch of people attacking me for for how my culture operates and all of a sudden I'm not black. Last time I checked I have melanin pigment within my skin.
@@zemmym.9437 I don’t blame how people in your country make money but in America it’s just a different attitude because the history of black Americans having their cultures taken from them and renamed and looked as new that’s probably why black Americans have such a huge problem with people participating in their culture and are very sensitive about it, they just want their credit
@@jasmineestime3949 Of course, I know all of this, I've heard it a thousand times, and I don't blame Americans when they're upset about these things. My problem is when they revoke my blackness just because I have a different opinion or a different perspective or upbringing.
Like I don't stop being profiled because because I'm ok with cornrows. I don't stop having a target on my back being black just because I'm chill about certain situations.
@@jasmineestime3949 Also your reply here proves my previous point. When I gave an example of something that would be offensive to my culture you said that Americans didn't have to defend us. But then in this reply you sent you defended American culture towards cornrows and braids saying that there's a history behind it.There is also a history behind the carecaterization of Caribbean people. So what's the difference between my offense and theirs?
One thing I’ve never publicly gotten into is the cultural appropriation debate. I have a masters degree in visual culture and the over-simplification/over-complication and policing of cultural appropriation is super annoying. The truth is I have never heard a single person give a truly full definition of what it actually is. Rather people look at it from only one angle and then think they know the full meaning of it. It’s something that requires a TON of nuance, research, and thoughtful discourse that folks just aren’t ready to have. It would require a full on thesis to explain.
This cultural appropriation thing will never end because not everyone is on the same page with it. For example, I don't care if a kpop idol wears braids, in fact I feel proud that they do. Other people care. So who should the idols and Companies listen too. Whose voice matters more.so I came to the conclusion that as long as they are not talking badly about it then let them.
Anothing thing Is that we black people partake in "cultural appropriation" too when we use their term of it. Let's take dreadlocks for instance. My culture has no connection to dreadlocks, so if I wear them I am doing cultural appropriation, I don't get a pass just because my skin tone is dark. Just because one culture attached a certain level of importance on one thi g does not mean it should be important to everyone also. Should we call out people for shaving their head just because one culture holds it at high value.
I once saw a story where people were saying a woman was doing cultural appropriation by writing a noodles cookbook. This is where we will go with this, where u can't do anything unless it's within the confines of ur skin tone.
I traveled to South Korea to meet a pen pal years ago and she showed me around and took me to so many amazing places including a historical site where we gained free access in we dressed in traditional garmets being Hanboks everyone complimented me on how pretty I looked and seemed enamored with the fact that I wanted to wear it with my pen pal. It wasn't until years later that someone dug up my old photos and I was bullied in school and online for cultural appropriation. It's an interesting topic that I've looked into extensively and I agree that there is a lot to it, it requires more than a surface level understanding.
@Sierra M. Please tell me you're not being serious when there are videos about cultural appropriation giving definitions and examples. Either you were late when they were out or you just didn't look for them.
This comment is not an attack.
@@alanaatkinson551 I’ve seen plenty, and my comment still stands.
@@alanaatkinson551 I would love to elaborate more on it, but again, time constraints. It’s also a matter of the issue being so hot that any quote could be taken and used as ammo incorrectly. It would be a great conversation to dive into some day.
Honest and Truthful video on the Toxicity of K-pop Stans especially on social media sites like Twitter and Tiktok are the most problematic Internet Sites
I hate Twitter with a BURNING passion
@@tokkigifs same Here the majority of the Toxicity comes from Twitter
@@tokkigifs I’ve never had Twitter in my entire life. You don’t know how happy I am after seeing many videos of how stupid and toxic it is
Edit: typo
I gave up Twitter last year because the toxicity started to effect me in a bad way. I also took a break from TikTok because some creators post content to purposely cause conflict within the Kpop community to get more views. They do this particularly with black Kpop Stans because these creators know it will strike a nerve, hence more views for them. It's really sad because the manipulation is so clear. When content creators stoop to this kind of behavior it gives the toxic crowd a safe place to say what they want without accountability.
Agree
A little story from what I experienced , there was this person who was complimenting chan about being one of the best leaders in 4th gen in the comment section of a video but there was this person who came and said something along lines like "ah..yes , the king of cultural appropriation is the best leader" and I was confused because this was the first time I ever heard someone calling out chan for cultural appropriation because I thought he never did that and when I tried to ask that person about it then they started asking me if I was black and if I am not I don't get to talk about it and I asked "why don't I get to do so ?" I mean , wasn't it a normal human right to ask question ? And after a whole arguement....They still didn't tell me anything and kept on speaking this and that about black culture..That I shouldn't say this blah blah blah. Turns out that person wasnt even black and kept blabbering the whole time telling me what I should do and what I shouldn't 💀. I mean , the audacity- that person was an indian and I am too and let me tell you , there are barely any schools in india who teach us about the black culture and there were very high chances that what that person was telling is just what the internet told them. The audacity killed me-
( Also sorry if my english is bad )
I'm sorry but that person was just stupid...
@@ha._.bbangbby ikr
@@ha._.bbangbby like , if I don't have the right to speak then you don't get to do so too
and most of those fans don't know the growth from these idols when they addressed this issues, it is better if idols grow from these issues and be more knowledgeable from their "innocence/ignorance"
It is similar to the video on tiktok that praise Giselle about rapping and the comments were like "Yes, praise skrt skrt queen."
its not just toxic black kpop stans its woke people in general you see white woke people getting all kinds of stupid and offended for other races like we need their help lmfao. But your video was spot on and thank you for talking about something real. Most people too scared.
I think we need to create boundaries in terms of discrimination. Korea as a whole prefer fair skin which can be colorist by tradition. Us foreigners would feel anxious when we go to an Asian country.
However, if we notice what's going in Korea, well. We as foreigners feel bad for some of them. All we have to do is notice what to do and how to do it in order to successfully include.
SAY IT LOUDER!!! I’m so sick of people being fake woke and trying to virtue signal when it’s either A. Not needed or B. Not as bad as they’re trying to make a situation out to be.
@@Nameless_mixes Racist isn't the first word I would describe Korea. Colorist and sexist are the words that resonate more with Koreans.
There is also colorism with Americans too. Drake gets pegged as a soft simp here and Canada too...
It's hard because, I've found that if you are not actively involved in the discussion you're not a good "ally" so it's been hard finding the line between being conscious and coming across as "woke" in a broad sense.
@@Amanda-ik1wv just try your best to use critical thinking, and don't ever trust anyone who wants you to believe something but refuses to explain their reasoning or have a conversation about it, they don't know what they're talking about. people will try to bully you for being your own person but most of them are nobodies and can be ignored.
I feel like toxic black kpop Stans (mostly from tiktok) have made the word "racist" lose its meaning , yes people have said and done things that are very anti black but labeling everything as Racism is way too much , most people who do or say something offense to our culture are simply ignorant🙂 , let's be honest calling someone an ignorant culture appropriator feels worse than calling them a racist 🙂, instead of educating people, they prefer to yell and it becomes embarrassing. As you said , expecting people to know everything about our culture is unfair, especially when we don't bother to learn about the other person's culture.
it's not black kpop stans jobs to educate anyone when these anti black actions have been done time and time again in the industry. maybe idols should learn feom their peers mistakes
Black kpop Stan’s have had to educate idols so many times before, they are in the right to not want to do it anymore
That's not only a kpop thing. It's a problem of US-centric internet in general. As a eastern european I find this fascinating... but in a bad way.
@@thek-nerd3143 the problem with the way we "educate" them is that we don't actually educate them , we Just hate on them and their fans for stanning someone "racist", we can do a better job at teaching idols that what they do is wrong , for example confronting them at fan signs rather than yelling in the comment section of a post like they will see it
@@eem8736 I have a question. Are you willing to be corrected on everything you do wrong according to someone? Like on the street someone tells you to dress in a different way coz it disrespects their religion or if sbdy tells you not to eat beef coz it sacred and so on. Will you? Keep in mind that the things mentioned above can be a life/death matters in some cultures. What makes your matter more important than others?
the most frustrating to me... is people acting like all racism ever looks like is someone saying the n word. people have created such a weird vibe around this word, like the word passing through your lips flips a switch that turns you into a racist permanently, like a magic racism spell, and people are SOOOO convinced that everyone in the world must understand that it's a racial slur and if they say they don't they must be lying, but doesn't it seem so obvious that if you grew up in a country that doesn't teach american history, and especially if you don't speak any english, you would just know it as a common hiphop word? and sure if they researched they could find out the history, but how would they even know there was something they were meant to research until the first time someone tells them they shouldn't be using that word? do you google every new word before you use it to understand the historical context? maybe you do, but i'm guessing you've used a word you heard in another language without knowing all the important cultural context behind it before. but when you say that people literally say stuff like "you know racism exists outside of america right?" like, yes, where did i say it didn't?? racism and use of the n word are not one and the same.
I said something similar in which it's ridiculous to think that everyone search up all the words they don't understand and then they replied with "if you don't understand then don't use it and the google is so accesible". I mean,they're not wrong but do you really do that?Really?Do I have to search for lyrics and look up everything unfamiliar everytime I listen to a song with foreign language from now on?In the first place,I wouldn't assume there are words that I shouldn't say in such an accesible song on a global platform.It's just unthinkable and natural to think that way..well that my opinion at least
These are fully grown adults tho? Some of these are globally famous, they should know by then.
@@cheerupbaby7792 did you even read one word of the comment explaining how it’s ridiculous to expect them to know things these things just because they’re an adult, or just because they’re this, that or whatever??
if you are NOT black then the use of the N SLUR IS racist…
@@Elladoll121 ??? They are not saying the word is not racist. They are saying how would a non english speaking person know the word is racist, without being told its racist. How would they know the culture or history behind the word, especially when they hear it being used CONSTANTLY in music nowadays.
Your point about black kpop fans really just wanting their anger to be validated is spot on. I thought the same but I didn't know exactly what I was thinking until you said.
I feel like this also applies to the kpop fandom as a whole. They only want ppl to agree with their anger even if it’s misplaced
I would like to mention that non American black stans are constantly being disrespected because we don't get offended by the same things. Especially Africans. I saw two girls from Kenya being invalidated and straight up bullied because they weren't offended by the Braids situation.
This is upsetting. First it's "if you're not black then you have no day" then when you are black, it's "You don't speak for all black people" or "You're not black or you're anti black"
It's really just a bunch of bull and I'm tired of it
Last year when I was on tik tock ( not any more I left ) I saw videos people saying idols wearing braids and mocking black culture. I said I’m black and I’m ok with idols wearing black hairstyles it’s not meant for their hair but there’s nothing wrong with them doing that however it’s a problem when they only wear black hair styles for hip hop aesthetic only. I gotten tons of shit on my comment…and people were saying
“ don’t speak for all of us “
“ you’re not really black if you are saying that “
“ if black people are still getting mocked by wearing braids then nobody who isn’t black shouldn’t wear them “
“ the fuck is wrong with you “
I only spoke for myself :(
@@JaxBox1 They really always miss the part where you say "I don't" and swear you're saying "WE". And also forget that because they themselves are offended doesn't mean that they speak for all black people. And they're literally the ones said "black people" and "We"
@@LovelyKissess it was a weird situation for me, like if you disagree you aren’t black.
@@JaxBox1 The mindset of idiots 😔
How do I tell you I love you? this conversation is so so needed. It's us black stans that need to keep the toxic ones in check because even people that don't agree with all the toxic stuff just keep quiet.
It kinda sucks that it’s up to black people to try and talk sense into other black people simply because the toxic ones won’t take the opinions of other people seriously if their skin colour is different. Doesn’t that count as racism?
@@LaurenPebble not rlly since most ppl take information on certain if someone who looks like them is giving it, idk it had something to psychology but I’m not 100% sure
@@bougie_pink oh, I know that’s true. But completely disregarding someone’s opinion because of race, isn’t quite the same as being more likely to agree with someone that is the same race/similar appearance to you, I think.
THIS!!!! ✨ another thing i hate is that they use the “google is free” argument (which has to be one the most ignorant argument i’ve ever seen concerning social issues in kpop), to justify saying an idol “should’ve known” about something whenever they’re in a scandal concerning racial ignorance. this further lets you know that these fans are very self centered and think the world revolves around them. because if they didn’t have this way of thinking, they would realize that in korea, they don’t use google, but naver.
edit: you people bullying cheryl in these comments are really something. this video was literally made for people like you and you’re literally proving her points. this weird sense of entitlement that black people “made” kpop so there’s automatically a free pass for bullying and other bad behavior is beyond me. y’all say that black people are the only ones allowed to speak on topics like this, correct? okay, cheryl is black, so what’s with all the name calling? i don’t think i’ve ever seen one racist comment in this section, it’s mainly people agreeing with what she said in the video, which is correct. y’all need to do better and just because someone calls y’all out on your behavior doesn’t make that person racist. they simply don’t agree with your behavior. cheryl is not “allowing” people to be racist by making this video, y’all just can’t handle finally being called out by another black fan and having to take accountability for your actions. grow up 4 year olds.
Let's be honslest. Most of these idols don't care. I don't blame them also. I watch kdrama's and cdrama's but I don't give two shits about the history between these two countries. Hack, I don't even know my own history that well. So honestly, if idols say they did not know I can see how it's possible. Imagine them having to Google bout every single culture because kpop is widely know. Imagine having to tip toe around because u don't wanna offend anyone.
My only problem with "google is free" is how much we tend to forget misinformation & actual racists axist on the same platform
And also, yes I can do my own research. But If I don't come to the same conclusion as you, what then?
Not to mention google’s search engine changes based on your location and prior searches. If you live in a racist or ignorant area, the search results are going to mirror that because it assumes that’s what your looking for. You can’t just trust someone to look for information on Google and expect them to learn something new. If anything it will just reinforce the views they already have. If people wonder why peoples ideologies have become so toxic and are so against different opinions, it’s because everything they find on google agrees with them. I don’t know how it is on Naver, but it’s probably similar.
Fr
I remember having a normal and mature discussion with someone regarding sm zoo performance with a Giselle's fan. We were both debating back and for about how well she did and didn't do respectfully and without one of us cursing at each other. And then a random third party came into the picture and told the Giselle's fan that her bias was racist and that she was supporting racism by even talking about Giselle. The poor person was so confuse and angry that she went into defensive mode and had to explain her point of view on the situation. And the random person start calling racist for justifying racism. Mind you it had nothing to do with our initial conversation. And since i was watching everything unfold, i had to remind both of them that we were talking about the zoo performance. But the same random person start telling me to shut up and let them finish like she was the one who was here all along. So i got mad and start explaining the difference betwen racism, racial ignorance and anti black hate while precising that i was indeed black. Yet she still called me a fake black and a fool. By now the person i was having a civil conversation with was already gone and we never finished debating our point of view. I felt so angry because it been so long since i have such a good conversation with someone that share a different opinion as mine without us insulting the other person.. Unfortunatly for us, that random person came and fuck it up.
That's exactly how I feel. Giselle has been my bias since I've known for Aespa. I'm nowhere supporting her action and what she did was wrong but now I feel like I can't leave positive comment about Giselle (or her skills) without being called "racist" "disgusting person" or seeing those "jokes" about her.
@@AB-yk2pq honestly, i feel you. I tend to give a second chance to foreigner that do racially insensitive thing, but i still understand and respect other black people that dont do the same. That being said, when it come to Giselle case, i felt so bad for her that i couldnt even get behind those who were actually offended. It hard to sympathise with people that want somebody to suffer over one mistake. And the hate giselle got stopped being constructif a long time ago.
@@tnlkb6115 Those people be like: "take me seriously" when the things they have brought to the table are yelling, slurs and attacks towards you and others. Then they have the audacity to be suprised when you don't want to be mates with them... I'm sorry but between having respect towards those toxic commenters versus an idol who said the n word, at this point it's obvious which one I would choose. I'm sure they don't stop to think for a second whether or not the comment will get them the reaction they want, if the wanted reaction isn't dislike towards them that is
There’s been a few instances where I’ve interacted with someone that was more interested in insulting me than having a genuine conversation, and when it happens I report their comments and get them removed.
giselle ate her parts though!
Black kpop stans have a horrible reputation even within the black community. A lot of us really don’t understand why you’d support a genre when you feel disrespected all the time and crying on sm 24/7 about racist idols. I simply stopped listening to the genre cuz every time I got into a group I found out about some insensitive shit they said or did and it turned me off completely. Also I just don’t like the new sound of the genre. I love your videos though, keep being the voice of reason.
I definitely agree with this. Especially in the videos that praise Giselle they are so many haters and their comments almost have the same amount of likes with people who defend Giselle. Like okay, don't love this girl or hate this girl if you want. But why are you spending your time in a random ktubers channel saying that we shouldnt love someone 🤔. This people really want someone to get canceled and they will fight until end lol.
@-sochii- lol wha-🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
True but the kpop community itself is very toxic and is genuinely disliked by almost anyone
I think it's totally understandable to walk away with those types of frustrations. The thing that's really sad yet oddly helpful is the fact that these racist sentiments came from the US. As an American, I just think about all the problematic stuff white American celebs have said or done and the history of how we have been represented in the media and it makes a lot of sense.
tbh i’m just there for the music, if you go into kpop while realizing that no one is going to care abt black people nor our opinions, then it’s a lot easier to detach and just vibe with the music. just don’t fund them and do whatever you want on your terms.
Something that always made me mad was how easily the fanbases let racism slip with the whole “black people can’t be racist” thing. I have to break it to some people but yes, you can be racist regardless of what race you are! I’ve seen some toxic ones (not dropping names) disrespect the sewol incident, and make me feel really uncomfortable with what they project towards Asians (especially Koreans). I think cultral appropriation is one of the worst things to come out of the industry, and I’m against so many artists because of it. That doesn’t mean you can send death threats and swear them off! Sometimes, being respectful makes you look like more of a queen than being rude, and some stans need to learn that. I agree with this whole vid 10/10 btw
Once i saw a post saying something like "black ppl can't be racis...." with a pic of a bunch of black dudes pulling their eyes with a asian man in the middle, i mean......
@@dgls127 could that just have been satire?
i remember a black-only space on twt (months ago) full of people being racist towards asians, they said disgusting things
@@dgls127 I think it's meant to be a joke. Like "No , X doesn't happen-" over a picture of X happening.
i’m sick of the narrative that black people can’t be racist, bc they very much can and i’ve seen it! and a lot!
Ok but I'm having a VERY hard time learning history here (there's alot to learn), why tf am I expected to know about other people's culture on top of it aswell 😭
I feel you
You still make oppar jokes, nobody cares
@cosmicaeri they deleted their comment lol
told my stance on this last chan situation (i’m a black stan and accepted his apology) and had another black person try to tell me i was against my kind and then i saw they made a tweet calling chan racist but used a slur against asian people in the same thread like ?????
i also think people think just cause an idol knows english means they know what goes on in america? like with giselle everyone’s argument is “she speaks english she should know better” like she knows basic english from what she learned in japan… yeah her apology wasn’t the greatest but they should stop that argument but that’s my opinion
Even people in English speaking countries aren’t gonna automatically know either
I was thinking the same thing. I remember reading a comment a few months ago where the person was "Giselle studied in an international school, she should've known." Yes, she went to an international school but it was still in Japan and judging from some pre-debut pictures of her at school, her school was still predominantly Asian. Yes, her saying the word was still very wrong & the apology was necessary but at the same, it sounds very entitled that just because someone went to an international school or they lived in an English-speaking country for a few years, then they should automatically know every single thing about American history. Idk maybe i'm also doing too much. . .
@@goldenlion5826 yeah no i agree… i asked my sister a couple questions like “do you know about the jim crow laws?” and she was like “i know a little but not enough to have a full conversation about them” and like we live in america so if we don’t know that much information and didn’t learn it in school how are we gonna expect people from overseas to know??
@@goldenlion5826 Yes, I've learned English years ago in a not English speaking country and teachers only told me not to said "black" when referring to one's skin color cause it was rude. I just learned about the n-word because black kpop stans last year.
“Everglow-Up uploaded:” = Day is already made 👑💕
"Toxic black kpop stans"
Hmmm: AJANAEVIS WE ARE CALLING YOU
We NEEDED to have this conversation, validating the opinions of people who are angry over those who are not makes no sense at all and this had to be said. Being angry doesn't mean you're right but you can't even have a conversation with these people because they think their emotions are above reason.
I've had people shut me up because "i'm not all black people" but then THEY do get to speak for all black people?? Make it make sense.
Putting emotions above reason is such a problem. Like, if someone was angry about the Jupiter being the biggest planet in the solar system rather than earth, it wouldn’t change that Jupiter is the biggest planet. But apparently being outwardly emotional means you’re opinion is more important than someone that stays calm.
Thank you so much for this. As a black kpop stan, everything you said was 100℅ right. A lot of Black kpop stans constantly think that just because you have a different opinion, you're automatically white (I have also experienced this myself online) and it's so annoying. Like just cuz I don't agree with you doesn't mean that I'm white or any other race. Another thing, about wanting their anger to be validated, it's not just in kpop, but also in the black community in general. If a black person were to get angry for whatever reason, the FIRST ppl to come to their defense is OTHER black ppl.
I feel like I’ve been trying to explain everything in this video to people for ages. It’s nice to know that I’m not just screaming nonsense into a void, that there’s people that agree with me on this.
Just wanted to say that I'm a 52 year old black male who lives in the States that's been a K-pop fan ever since GG dropped Gee Gee. an never looked back. I loved your video here. I was going to say a much more stuff but I'm not lol but I agree with what was said in your video.
honestly. im so happy to see someone talk about this. its really pisses me off when i see everything gets labeled as racist or they think everything is intentional when a kpop stan does 'cultural appropriation' like.. the same way you dont get educated about literally anyone else's culture and history, same for them. eg: the hair style issue. they may be seeing the hairstyles as a style because it's popular. now it you see a trend and you think it looks good, ur gna try it. not go and look up the history of it, who was the first person to wear it and how they came up with it are you? like instead educate ppl before going at them. sure be mad at the ones who dont apologize even after being educated. and the not being satisfied at apologies im- girl... anyways. i hate when they get aggressive first. it only makes us look like bad ppl. it'll only make us get hated more. yall want that??
And calling other blacks who disagree with them "anti-black/white/whitewashed/brainwashed".. just because somebody don't agree with. lol maybe take a self-check. honestly that's rly immature behavior like grow tf up.
thank you for reading my little rant. ahh. have a cookie 🍪
honestly, its not only black kpop stans that do this i feel like its americans in general. Americans somehow feel so entitled to the point where everyone HAS to know their history, even if they aren't american, and if you don't know then youre racist.
And yet they barely know about any countries outside of States...
I have traveled a great deal over my lifetime, and I can tell you that I know a great deal about the world around me as do many other Americans. There is no doubt that some Americans can be a pill to swallow, but I believe they are in the minority. People like me initially started traveling during stints in the U.S. military then continued traveling after discharging. I carry myself today in the exact same manner I did when I was on active duty . . . I represent myself as a positive example of Americans abroad. Btw, I have been to over 35 countries, and I research each because it is important to know about a place you are going to if for no other reason than ensure you conduct yourself appropriately. My two cents worth.
@@monstafloppa871 im also american, im not saying all americans are like this. im saying that its common culture for americans to see america as the center of the world or smth. so ye most americans, im not exempt from this entirely
Yet they still think my country Australia is ‘dinosaur island (or worse they think it doesn’t exist) and continue to make terrible stereotypes.
@@catmerchant8699 Even the dumbest person I know knows for a fact Australia is a country and Australia is mostly acknowledged as a beachy type place so I’m not sure which Americans you have talked to but ME as a person who ACTUALLY lives in America and is surrounded by other Americans can tell you that most Americans do in fact know you’re country does exist.
Another thing is toxic black kpop stans bullying other black people into feeling offended by something. Like you can't bully someone into feeling a certain way. Also black kpop stans need to realize that just because you feel offended by something doesn't mean everyone else needs to bend to your will. Like the amount of black kpop stans that attack Giselle stans, and expect everyone to not stan her just because they're offended is absurd. You aren't entitled to control who people do and don't stan just because you're offended. Also nobody needs to explain why they do and don't stan someone. It's their own business.
Thank you for posting another video about this; it really gets on my nerves whenever a toxic black kpop stan throws the word around without even bothering to explain how it's harmful in the first place
You are absolutely right!
We should start new labels for ‘offensive conducts/speech/appropriation’ vs. just outright saying something is “racist”.
For example, when people (adults mostly) cuss, some people are okay with hearing cuss words, while others are offended by those words; both opinions are valid!
In Kpop e.g. when Giselle said the ‘n’ word while singing, I didn’t mind it because it was a part of a song she was singing. Some people got offended, and that was okay too.
Had she called a POC the ‘n’ word, I would have been livid. But, she didn’t, so when she apologized to the offended parties, she should be forgiven and folks should move on. It was part of a song, she was just singing without any malicious intention, and I, as a Nigerian-American, didn’t mind it one bit.
Everything does not have to be racism!
Labels such as cultural appropriation, cultural appreciation, offensive conduct, and discrimination, among others, should be used instead.
As your channel focuses on these issues, when you have time, would you make a video on clarity. Clarifying what is cultural misinformation, appreciation, appropriation, offensive, and racist?
I think that if we have a list of these, then moving forward, everyone can just refer to your video as a guild to labeling things appropriately. Thank you.
I am black & 19 years old and I had to google about Jim Crow after seeing Chan get dragged for that pose
I'm black and older than you and never heard of a Jim Crow pose. I know about Jim Crow laws of course but I had to look up what the pose was as well. If I didn't know how is a young guy living in S. Korea suppose to have knowledge of this? A person can't look up every single thing they do in life to check if it might be offensive. Evidently he saw it some where and did it without any ill intent.
I’m Australian and I went my whole high school education without learning American black history. Most of our time was spent learning about indigenous Australians (Aboriginals and Torres Strait islanders) which is something America can’t do- teach others about their native peoples.
Point 2 is spot on.
The best example I can think of is some parts of the black community still using the word "gook" and "chink".
Denzel Curry released a song called "Gook".
Gook is apparently a slang for Odd in Miami.
Footballer Devin Fuchness said a reporters eyes looked "chinky" when he smiled.
Both could have easily been labeled as "racist".
But the term "ignorance" is more appropriate here for me.
If these two men who live in America where no one would bat an eye if you see an Asian walking down the street, still don't understand the impact of those words to the Asian community.
I don't know how much you're expecting from Koreans where the entire foreign population (people of all colors) is less than 5%?
I would not be surprised if there are some K-Pop idols who still haven't met or even talked to a black person in real life.
And everyone says "Google is free".
Let's play a game, come to China with only knowledge of our culture being everything you read on Google.
I guarantee you, you'll offend someone.
I hate when people say "Google is free"
Come on...If I use Google it's because I already know what to search
But if I don't even know something exist to begin with how do people expect me to search it?
For example I'm 22, italian, and I've only known this "cultural appropriation" though kpop like 2/3 years ago
I didn't know it was a thing
@@seungmins_blue_hoodie6651 yes yes yes! How can you fill a gap in your knowledge if you don’t know the gap exists in the first place
I found it funny when people use the "google is free" arguments when Korean and Chinese idols themselves use Naver and Baidu, completely different search engines
There's one thing I'm pissed off, they be calling anyone uneducated when we know nothing about their history but do you know anything about asian history or any certain race other than yours.
Nope. Asked someone this and they ignored it. Also asked them do the praise or show any type of appreciation when they use phones, internet, wear non black people fashion ect since it's the attention they seeks and once again, my question was ignored. Then I was called a troll
Humans are starting to want what they can't or don't plan to give
I thought twitter would be the worst platform of kpop stans but then tiktok came along....
I do think that idols should stop saying the n-word and appropriating other cultures but the thing is that the k-pop stans also say Korean words just for fun, and the idols who have said n-word mostly said it while singing a song by a black artist and so many idols say that certain black artists were their role model to become a rapper so they do respect black people but they don't know that it is an offensive word with a painful history. If we take the example of snowdrop the Korean public is bashing the drama but international fans of Blackpink dismiss their feelings by saying that it's just a drama they are overreacting and all that and are not even trying to understand why the public sentiment is so harsh for this topic like it's their history we don't have a say in it.
We need to go back to the point that the world doesn't revolve around black culture when it comes to cornrows. I want to say beside the meaning that the holds for the AA community, "cornrows" is simply just a hairstyle. Cornrows ≠ braids. Idols and people should stop being called "culture appropriators" for doing their own hair in cornrows. As a non AA I want to understand how braids are being exploited and not just something that can be apart of cultural exchange. Outside the instances where it's obvious that "black culture" is being exploited
Also wanted to say that this idea that the idol should know better makes no sense to me. "Jaehyun lived in America he should know" jaehyun also left America when he was 9 years old. People in America are simply not taught about black culture in depth as much as the people there themselves. I've learnt "American history" from going to an international school and not once was I taught about n word and such. I only learnt about it from reading books like to kill a mockingbird and roll of thunder hear my cry. Even tho them singing the n word through songs doesn't make it less Offensive, they should not be easily labelled as racist. Like Giselle and Jaehyun
You have the right attitude, which I appreciate, but you’re missing the point. Cultural appropriation is much more complicated and rare than the average kpop twitter user makes it out to be. I have a degree in cultures and can assure all the ca I’ve seen in kpop was absolutely not cultural appropriation to begin with. This is the real issue with the community. Cultures are meant to be shared and they’ve always been. For example, almost all braids belong to almost all cultures! We have cultural braids even here in Italy, there are some in Austria as well, in Scandinavia too! It’s so deminishing to say braids belong to black people when they just don’t! And this is just an example. What people are creating with cultural appropriation is at all effects the END of all cultures. How are cultures supposed to evolve if they can’t be shared? It’s truly scary to think about.
@@pennymikk thank you for saying this!
And I’ve always been confused by why black hairstyles are referred to as braids when the first thing the word braid makes me think of is a French braid.
In regards to that first sentence, I don't think it's fair at all to compare a slur to Korean words
There's also a fine line between holding an idol accountable and bullying them. Before Giselle's scandal people were calling her underrated and just as talented as the rest of the members, but after her scandal people started bashing her dancing, calling her the visual hole, and saying they always hated her. Like excuse me? You don't have to like or support Giselle but her ignorance doesn't give you the right to bully her and shame her. Also, I saw a ktuber say that Wendy should just fall of the stage again. Um... That's just a horrible thing to say, no matter what that person did. I would only call Giselle or Fu Yaning racist if they were caught repeating the n word, because they've apologized and they realized and learned why their actions were wrong, so if now they were to repeat their actions they would be racist, but as of now they aren't because I believe they genuinely had no idea of the word's meaning. It's also so toxic how some (notice how I said some not all) black stans say that they'll listen to your perspective and then turn around and call you fake and against your own community if you didn't get offended. Like I literally saw someone say the unoffended fans weren't true black people. No matter your race it is not ok to police blackness. But on the flip side, the unoffended fans will tell the offended stans that their feelings are invalid and to shut up, which is also hurtful. The entire black KPOP stan community has become so toxic, and I wish people would take a closer look at it.
To add a little bit:
They're also saying she's debuted because she's rich while before people praised her for passing the hardest SME's audition. I literally saw comment saying
"I don't see how Giselle got in SM entertainment just needed an English speaker" with over 100 likes while they're ignoring the facts that Giselle has really good vocals or that she's already writing her lyrics.
Someone's health, visual and talents have nothing to do with it. If you bully a person about those instead of keeping it on the topic, you shouldn't be on social media losing sleep and preaching about this since it's quite clear you can't actually preach about the thing you think you are preaching about (and obviously you shouldn't have a platform, like youtube channel, to do so)
Your def talking about ajanaevis
You are right
Y'all I was so happy as a poc that we were holding her accountable nad then I saw the rape threats and the death threats and body shaming thing.
Some people were literally calling her a fat cow on daily basis.
I have already spoken about how kpop stans don't understand half of the words they're using,and "racism" Is one of them. This is a personal opinion of mine, but I feel half of the people only care about black ca because it is relevant and makes you sound "woke", as is right now the trend to do so, because the black community is the forefront of racism faced by pocs. Black people's issues and struggles with racism are not cared for at all,if I be honest.Most Stans ,who cannot find a legitimate reason to drag and idol or provoke fanwars, use this technique of Weaponising issues like racism ,because hey ,bodyshmaing is bad,but if the idol did something offensive,then you absolutely have every right to harass ,cyberbully and threaten them constantly on social media. They care about racism as long as it's convenient for them to do so. They pick whom they have to lash out all their anger on and ignore the rest.
Unrelated, but I once saw a miracle sharing a photograph of a member of omg in a highly revealing dress, and the post's main issue was her sexual harrasment. What disgusted me, is that, the creator basically just said "I know she did ca but-(help us and other stuff".I was disgusted in the kpop fandom and yes,I'm an Indian. The fact that there are people, many of them,that won't care Or justify such horrific harrasment of idols on social media because of their issues with their past leaves me awed and horrified. Kpop stans do not understand where to draw the line, and by silently watching it, and not speaking against it, you are yourself promoting such behavior.
This girl deserves an award, for speaking up on things that other people are to afraid to say and calling out the toxic black people for what they are.
I said this on TikTok.Biggest mistake I had to delete all my socials and got multiple dt
@@young_won5904 they are just scared cuz they know the truth and that your speaking facts, sorry that you had to go through that though, when people dont know what else to say they use insults and dt to backup their claims instead of talking about the issue at hand.
@@Sharonsworld2003 Yeah whenever I tried explaining my reasoning they just insulted me rather than giving their points as to how I “was wrong”
Yes, she does.
I actively enjoy the debates you encourage and discuss. Thank you for creating a space for people from diverse backgrounds to ask questions, seek clarification and share experiences. I don't engage in much debate on social media any more because of the tone of language used by kpop stans from all Cultural backgrounds. I have also been made to feel that, as an an older kpop fan, my opinions are not valid or I am somehow not supposed to enjoy kpop music because of my age (what a bizarre thing to be told!). I do keep an eye on lots of the arguments simply because I used to teach sociology, psychology, and about how personal, cultural and structural values and assumptions contribute towards discrimination and oppression. I find it interesting how language and labelling can cause something as serious as Racism (but also Sexism, Homophobia, Ageism, Disablism, for example) to begin to slide into anger without unpacking the wider reasons for that anger and hurt. In the UK, this appears to be fuelled by media outlets and social media echo chambers - and any attempt to discuss Britain being built on the colonisation of countless countries over the years is just shouted down. Any attempt critical thinking seems to have disappeared - that includes within wider education too. Sorry to have a ramble. Keep doing what you are doing. There will always be people that can't or won't appreciate your discussions. I, for one, do appreciate it. So, thank you - from a white, LGBTQ mum in the UK.
To this day, I still don’t know what Stray Kids or Chan did to be permanently labeled a racist. As a black Caribbean fan, I haven’t felt offended by anything they’ve done in past. I personally don’t care if someone from a different race wear braids because firstly it is quite a dated hairstyle that is hard to pinpoint where it originated from (Vikings, French braids….) and secondly I don’t think they are mocking anyone when wearing that style. That was the only part in the video I completely disagree with. I believe most of the issues stem from African Americans because of what they have been through which is a totally different experience from Africans and black Caribbean people. I understand where they are coming from but they need to mentally free themselves from that mindset that everyone and everything is against them and hate them. It’s honestly really sad and I hope we can all reach a point of understanding.
I can't agree with this more. Victimhood and self oppression is mental plague. It's result of single motherhood culture where they were raised this way where they don't get proper love. Tbh, black people get preference in everything such as jobs, universities ahead of everyone else.
THIS!!!!! ✨✨✨
@@incognitoparty In America I’m not confident that they are getting preferential treatment because I live here now and my eyes have been open to how they have been treated as a minority group over the years. With that said, they cannot expect everyone to know and understand their struggles. Heck I never heard about Jim Crow until I moved here and I still don’t fully understand what it was about and I don’t care to know because it is in the past and I need to focus on the future and what I can do to help others.
@@kymberlimorgan3905 how can you say you don’t care about Jim Crow than say you want to focus on the future to help others when Jim Crow is actively affecting black people today. Even you.
@@camileeduck1454 I do not know the full extent of what the Jim Crow is and how exactly it is affecting black people in America (myself included) and I will explain why I do not care to find out. We can both acknowledge that whatever was put in place in the past is still affecting how black people live in this country. My concern is that we acknowledge there is a systemic problem but what has been the active solution to fix it? Who has the power to course-correct these laws if not black people themselves? The major difference between the Black Americans and a high percentage of blacks from the Caribbean is who they grew up with. In my country, blacks were the majority after slavery so even though their society faced other problems (), the laws were made for our own interest. That is not the case in North America where blacks are a minority group and most if not all of those outdated laws were made by who? You guessed it. White men who only looked out for their own and found ways to deceive minority groups and keep them under. Sorry, I don't want to write an epistle, but my main point is that I don't want to focus on the past when I understand what can be done to make things right for the future. Diversity from every culture and ethnicity needs representation in high decision-making places because people are inherently biased towards their own or looks physically closest to them (even black people do this). There needs to be a balance with who is making and reviewing these laws so that everyone can benefit and not be left behind.
"The only thing they care about is people validating their anger" - Finally someone said it. This is why I do not get angry when kpop idols say the n-word because most of the time it is again cultural ignorance they don't know what that word mean or they like to say that word because they heard a black person said it in a song. Also it is up to us to control our anger and understand that lashing out does not get us respect, but makes us look immature.
as a Blasian, black kpop stans just love calling everything racist for some little brownie points, also counts for white stans too. any race really. and cultural appropriation is now just a buzzword for "i dont like what you said, so imma just throw a random word.'
This video was very much needed. I also notice on stan twt (which I'm actively a part of), the unfortunate normalization of toxic black kpop stans, even non black stans throw around the word racism/racist when the topic of discussion has nothing to do with it, which I always found so weird. Stans nowadays care more about "being in the right/ah ha I got you" (I apologize for lack of vocabulary here😭) more so than actually having healthy discussions no matter the topic & it's just so sad to see since stan culture should be fun & just a hobby since that's how it started out as for so many people, I included. Everything always has to be a fight/competition as if our lives are on the line nowadays🙄
all these languages out here to speak and you decided to speak absolute facts
These woke kpop stans and toxic black kpop stans complain about why these Korean idols are unaware of black or other culture and then when knetz had problem with the drama snowdrop , these same people were defending the drama because it was all fiction when the timeline or the era in the drama was a part of Korea history which actually happened...smh
But in the case of snowdrop the ifans were right to defend it. Imagine of the drama was cancelled and was not able to clear its name. In the end, it is a fictional story, even though it was set during a hard time, that fact does not change.
If someone made a show painting the protesters in the civil rights movement as bad. Would you still be okay with it cuz it was fictional?
@@bm5701 I have parents who went through something very similar. It wasn’t just a “hard time”. It is a part of their life that sadly they can’t forget. Most ifans supported the show because they wanted to see Jisoo debut as an actor. They didn’t give a shit if the show was problematic. They didn’t try to be less ignorant or more culturally sensitive about a piece history they knew nothing about. You are calling these Ifans right? What happened to morals?
Wether the show tried to distort history can be discussed. But that doesn’t excuse the behavior of ifans. Nor does it invalidate the concerns of kfans .
@@hellenwen154 so if we all agreed and the show was canceled because of misinformation would that be OK. Feelings are valid, that's what u have a choice not to watch. I had a problem with wanting it to be cancelled, that would bring a whole lot of other issues. Imagine cancelling a show a show because it has a lpt of murder and people who went through that pain demanded the show be canceled because the show brought back past trauma. Simply do t watch it. Yes their feelings mattered bet in this case they were wrong, and the show itself has proved them wrong.
@@iscream336 I said " woke "kpop stans too not only black. And I specifically said the toxic ones not normal black kpop fans. I am not generalizing the whole black kpop fans
A note to people you don't have to agree with her you can have a healthy debate with her with mature stance on the subject but please do not send her hate to her at the end of the day she is a human being with feelings and you all bullying her to have an effect on her mental health is wrong . Not everybody in a single community will have the same reaction or same feelings
I need to say this I am not black, I am white but this has opened my eyes. i have seen these toxic kpop stans before but I felt I could never approach the subject bc of who I am. I completely agree with the ‘racist’ meaning, I feel people have lost the true meaning and understanding of it.
not relating to kpop but at my school if you disagree with someone who is either black, latino, and even asian sometimes will call that ‘racially motivated’ which in a lot of cases we aren’t even talking about race. people think it’s just a joke to throw around. those people who say it also want respect yet they say that this person is racist, when that person could be supporting but you just called them racist. (little side note my school
prides itself for being diverse but they don’t teach anything on black history or even much slavery, everything I’ve learned about race has been online on my own time).
i'm honestly still afraid to share my point of view about multiple things just because i'm white and the subject has something to do with race. i even deleted my comment on this video like 5 times because i'm just so afraid i'll say something wrong and get labeled even though i'm freaking sure Cheryl won't do that
I hate that the kpop fandom has perpetuated the idea that if you lived in an english-speaking country or speak english, you by default know everything about African American history and black culture.
can you make a video on how it’s a bit insane how stans are moving these days? like they guilt trip whoever is in kpop as a hobby or wtv like let’s say it’s voting season and you’re not voting you’ll be dragged and whatever and be told to NOT celebrate if they win💀
an atiny (the fandom I’m in) on twitter fr shaded when ppl said “don’t force us to stream or vote for them when we’re here for the music” and that atiny said “don’t celebrate the wins ateez gets” 💀
and I kid you not someone said “we have school… we have work” as an excuse the op went “the majority who voted also have school and work, some even a housewife but still manage to vote everyday cos they want what’s best for ateez… you don’t have to do it all day but at least show some effort…” 💀
like even IU herself said to treat it like a HOBBY
It has happened within my fandom too(nctzen). When sticker came out the fandom was highly divided because of how unusual it sounded but it did go on to become the most awarded 127 song and broke our own records. Then twitter stans were all like, anyone who didnt like the song since 1st listen dont deserve to celebrate its success and were being passive aggressive to everyone. Even when (for 127) concerts got announced everyone was literally like, if you weren't there during this era, you dont deserve a ticket you're wasting space. 'If you didnt live through this song you dont get a ticket and are taking away from us , the og stans' the kpop scene has become so toxic..
This happens since years, but I won't waste my life for voting on awards, which are in the end actually meaningless
@@ars4696 wow, I don’t remember nctzens being that toxic when I was really into NCT a couple of years ago. I’ve always found nctzens to be pretty chill, that’s crazy. Glad I still listen to nct’s music without focusing on the fandom so much.
engenes as well. they will literally guilt trip you into voting and it made me lose motivation like i get it you want your faves to win or pay back their efforts but damn do not force me to do things when my hands are already full with other stuff. i have priorities. all of us do.
For those who didn't get the point, it's not that an Idol should not be held accountable when they mess up or that black stans should not get offended when this happens, they have all the right to be and not to forgive if they feel uncomfortable, but the problem is that the toxic ones give for granted that everybody is properly educated about their situation using the excuse that "they should've known better" as if it made sense.
I'm mexican, we're literally neighbors with the united states and I didn't know that ca, blackface, using aave or even saying the n-word was considered offensive until 2020 and who jim crow was until 2021, not becuase I didn't wanted to, but because the demographic conditions of my country allows me not to need this kind of information. Almost 90% of the mexican population are mestizos (mix between indigenous people and white people) and barely 2% are afro-mexicans or zambos (mix between black people and indigenous people) besides, with a different history than african-americans. Like, why would you expect us to learn someone else's culture from head to toe when we barely know our own?
This should not be considered as an excuse to be racist at all but to have a better understanding on why there's so much ignorance. We are not taught about this, most of us know because of the internet or don't know at all and in the case we get to see topics such as slavery at school, its very superfical because education in here rather focuses on our own history. Absoultely NO ONE should be obligated to know everybody's cultural background and history.
The problem is young black Americans on the internet. I used to live in Korea and the lack of education on other cultures is very lacking, but they are learning. It feels so awful to see (especially the black kpop community on tiktok and Twitter) be so toxic and just rude for the smallest things. AND THE WORST THING is that they NEVER hold their faves accountable. Or they always say “they already apologized so it doesn’t matter” like ???? The idol you’re bashing also apologized so what’s the problem lmfao
being a black stay in the kpop community is hard 😭 i agree w most of the stuff you said in the video, however i dislike it when non-black people tell us that we're sensitive whenever we dislike something an idol has done, if that makes sense
You ignore the fact that some black people call others black people sensitive.
Maybe if you used your critical thinking instead of throwing the word racist as a candy you would not hear these stuff
@@angela8737 all im saying is that black people are allowed to be offended without non-black people telling them they're snowflakes ?? plus i wouldn't like it even if another black person did, invalidating others' feelings is wrong
@@rihze most people in the comments section are pretty respectful and nobody said that idols saying slurs and hurting the feelings of black people should be shut down.
But calling idols racist because of hairstyles and expecting everyone to know about black history is too much.
I think it would be be great if fans respectfully mass emails kpop industries to teach their idols being racially and culturally educated.
being offended for insignificant matters like hairstyles is ridiculous because black Americans are imposing their history to the rest of the world. Most comments are respectful they are simply debating and sharing their opinions.
Some Americans have a huge main character complex. Can you elaborate on "invalidating" because this word is used when people cannot stand different POVs
@@angela8737 I'm not talking about hairstyles, I'm saying in general. you're completely taking this the wrong way
@@rihze I thought you were talking about hairstyles. I apologise for the misunderstanding.
If you're talking about the nword and blackface then you're right. Calling black people snowflakes because they are offended due to slurs and blackface is disgusting and invalidating their feelings
Since it got brought up, let’s discuss the over-usage of the word “racist”. I’ve seen paper towel dispensers, crossing signs, trees, math, exercising, etc anything you can think of being called “racist”. Heck, I even once saw someone calling breathing as “racist”. That word has become so diluted that it’s lost nearly all of its weight. So, I just ask that people be a little more careful with when they throw it around. Ask yourself first, is the PERSON racist or is their ACTION racist? Take things like wearing Black hair styles and saying the N-word. I’ve said this before either in one or my own videos or in a comment under one of EGU’s vids (probably both). International Hip-Hop culture is heavily influenced by Black American Hip-Hop culture. And when countries like South Korea (that are so far removed from Black culture) consume art derived from this Black American Hip-Hop culture (mainly through rap music), they don’t realize how much importance so of these aspects are and their connection to Black history. They just see “That hair style looks cool! I wanna try it!” Or “I want to make a cover/sing along to that English song! Let me learn the lyrics!” and they usually don’t bother learning what they mean as is the case with many English speakers who cover KPop songs. They put that out for the public to see, the court of public opinion condemns them, it’s a mess. In that confusion, some people are actually trying to salvage what’s left of the meaning of these intense words (racist, sexist, homophobic, etc.) by explaining to the idols why what they did is viewed as wrong. But that get drowned under hundreds of thousands of hate comments about the idol’s appearance, talent, style, etc. Look at Jessi and how many times the conversation has gone from her putting on a “black-cent” (sorry if I spelled that wrong) to people not liking her bluntness or her cosmetic surgery. Also, playing Devil’s advocate a bit, I know plenty of non-Black people from New Jersey who speak like she does. I don’t know if it was derived from how Black Americans speak or not. So, in my opinion, that topic is up for debate and I’d love to hear everyone else’s thought on it! 😊 But like how EGU explained in her video about winning an argument, attack the action and not the person. If it’s a case of a repeat offender *cough cough* Jay Park *cough*, then it’s more fair to accuse the person of being racist than something like Giselle mouthing the N-word in a SZA song (which again brings us to the confusion of the overuse of the N-word in music, writing, art in general, etc., who can use it, why can only they use it, and that whole mess that has yet to be properly explained worldwide).
So yeah, be careful with who and what you consider to be “racist”. Words like “r*pist” and “sexist” have already seen a huge decline in weight/value and “homophobic”/“transphobic” never held much value in the first place since the LGBTQ+ community has always been pushed to the side.
And now for being so good and reading my entire essay, you guys get a little anecdote:
It was 2018, and I was working at a gym. This gym had a partnership with a nearby hotel where the hotel would pay for the gym’s utilities and the hotel guests could use the pool at the gym. One evening, I was closing up alone. One of the elderly gym members complained that a lot of kids were roughhousing in the pool (despite signs saying not to...) and that she didn’t feel save because they were all over the place. I go to the pool area and see three boys (probably about 8-10 years old) jumping on each other, playing chicken, splashing each other, etc (ya know, the true meaning of “boys will be boys”). So, I go up to them and just ask them if they could please calm down and remember that there are other people in the pool. They all apologized “Sorry, mister” and went along playing. I went up to the group of parents that were monitoring the kids and just apologized for having to ask them to calm down and explained that a member complained about the rough housing and that there were no lifeguards on duty (plus, I was the only employee in the building). So, there wasn’t much supervision for them. They all thanked me for handling the situation like a grown up and I went back to my desk. About 15 minutes later, this white woman comes up to me. I ask if I can help her with anything and she screams at me “WHAT YOU DID IN THE POOL AREA WAS RACIST!!! THERE WERE WHITE KIDS THERE AND YOU ONLY SCOLDED THE KIDS OF COLOR!!!” I tried explaining that I only asked the kids who were roughhousing when I got down there to please be careful and I made sure to tell all of the parents in case. She did care and threatened to report me and have me fired for this. I spent the rest of my shift panicking and crying because I didn’t intend to do anything racist, nor did I think that I was. Fortunately, nothing happened and she was all talk. But still, that made me start to lose some of the value in that word. Here I was, conducting my job as I’m supposed to, and I’m suddenly being called a racist? So yeah, please be careful when randomly throwing that or any other serious term around. Condemn the action first and then the person if you have sufficient evidence to back up that you believe them to be one.
Anyways, I’ve ranted on for long enough. Wow, two essays in one video. Y’all know the drill. Drink plenty of water and let me know your thoughts in the replies. I’m always open to having discussions about what other people think and if I should be corrected or provide further elaborations on anything. Love you all! 💕
as for jessi the reason why ppl believe she uses a blaccent is bc in alot of old videos she never had that accent (if u wanna watch a voice comparison I suggest watching Adeola Ash's K-Pop ripping off Black artists? Blackpink Lisa vs Cierra Nichols, Rain JYP Bobby Brown, Jessi Dainá and skip around the 8:20 mark) I'm not joking when I saw the voice comparison my jaw actually dropped b/c i always thought her accent was natural. Had no idea she faked it!
Also before ppl say she grew up around black ppl thats why she sounds like that....she's from the white parts of new jersey
@@seokiology You know, I never knew that her accent had changed over time. I just assumed that she had always spoken in the way that she currently does. I’ll def check out that other vid! Thanks for letting me know!
Also, hi friend! I hope you’re having an amazing week! Love you! 💜
@@seokiology I mean her old company does control what idols do so I wouldn’t be surprised if they told her to act “like a sweet quiet girl” who talked all cutesy. Her voice to me just sounds like any deep raspy on a girl
@@brennathecatlover4360 jessi was under ymc enterainment from 2014 to 2018. The old video that was used in adeola ash video to show Jessi old voice was when she was on ASC in 2014. In fact in that ASC video she talks about being in YMC enterainment. Jessi started using a blaccent around 2015 ish when she was on Unpretty Rapstar (2015), so long before she was in Pnation. So the whole "oh her old company forced her to act cute" isn't true when she was using a blacccent while under that old company.
@@Nameless_mixes hi np! I had no idea too until i saw Adeola's video. She put all of her sources in the description and pinned comment in case you want to see the evidence more closely btw.
Aww tysm ily2!!! This week been ok but battling thru. Hope you're having an amazing week too 💜
i remember this one post by a black girl using mehendi (henna) on her hands and she got mad at the henna for not being as bright on her skin as opposed to lighter skin , proceeded to call it racist, she called the HENNA , RACIST
HELP???
I saw it too it was on TikTok and when an Indian called her out she stated that Hinduism was created by black people
GOOD BYE-
@@Sanjiscumslut istg it wasn’t even that bad , the henna was showing pretty well but she wasn’t happy cuz it looked better on her reference picture which had white hands
@@wanjiru3402 well henna is in African cultures as well
for me there's a huge misconception between racist ignorance and racism. for me racism is ALWAYS intensional. you did it and you mean it. and racial ignorance is when you're uneducated/misinformed and when you do something offensive you're sorry or you want to educate yourself. racist people are never sorry because they know exactly what they are doing and they don't want to educate at all. also we should hold idols accountable but they are humans as well... wishing them death treats is unacceptable. hating on them won't change anything
I really like the part about you talking about how not everyone know black history. I live in France and ignorance is a thing (not with everyone for sure). I’ve been called the n-word and I didn’t know what it meant before so I thought it wasn’t a big deal until I told it to my cousin and when I heard the word when they talked about slavery in school when I was 10. And even though they talk to us about slavery it’s only this (not saying that it is not important, it’s just that they don’t talk much about black people except this). All those things like blackface, blackfishing, I learned it from the medias or my parents. Not everyone are going to know about the history and we have to deal with wether you are happy or not.
Pareil, je suis noire et française et j'ignorais beaucoup de ces choses ...
exactly i live in turkey and i was probably 12 when i learned that the nword is an ACTUAL slur even though i had the access to go search it up and the necessary english level for it. i literally remember my old social studies teacher saying the nword and he was like "yeah if you say this in america youll probably get shot" hello?
One thing that really gets me is if we have a different opinion, we’re automatically a coon or “white” 🙄🙄
That part
They be using “your white” as an offense like… 💀
Your honesty on racism especially in kpop and how we as black kpop stans should really take a look at ourselves helped me alot. Everyone's hate for kpops cultural appropriation really made me ignore the artists but when I finally started thinking for myself I realized a few things, one being no matter how many times we cry on social media this is social media, artists will apologize and continue their behaviour or they will just ignore it. Instead of continual internet tears I silently remove my support for issues concerning racism, SA, cultural appropriation and other behaviour I just do not agree with, silence speaks more volume in this industry than noise. They need noise doesn't matter if it's good or bad, this could (in my opinion should) be applied in western entertainment as well.
It’s the age old any publicity is good publicity.
oh my god the thing about "if u got a basic middle school education i shouldn't have to explain CA to you" oh really? reeeally? your middle school taught you what CA was, genuinely? girl u better tell me what school that is cuz i don't believe u, esp when u seem to be incapable of defining it
Can I say as a fan of kpop since late 2009 you are a refreshing voice. You give me inspiration to want to start a ktube but that anxiety got me like ha no
DO IT !
if you really wanna do it then do it.
I'll subscribe and watch 🤗
Something that annoys me a lot is when people say stuff like "you know what they did" or "y'all know what happened" & that doesn't make sense to me because how are you gonna tell someone else what they do and don't know?! Not everybody knows the same amount of information as you
Yup that's correct
When Lisa posted a picture of her from KTL era wearing braids, all the angry black kpop stans started raging in her comment section. I commented saying, that i was black and that i didn't feel offended by it. But for the one's who do, should just tell her and educate her. Two people replied back saying "you aren't the entire black community" as if i was trying to be. Literally was only speaking for myself. Not the entire community. And they keep coming at me because i wasn't mad like they were. They need to get their acts together
its like saying you have an opinion but only if it is similar to mine. its so weird
i think the same way you do. i’ve dealt with that a lot and honestly with fans like that, i just look the other way and ignore at this point. they say “you don’t speak for everyone” but that at the same time forget that they don’t speak for everyone either. they act like they’re raising awareness for black voices to be heard, but in reality, they’re just mad because you’re not on their side. it’s so embarrassing, it’s sad.
I honestly think Lisa hair in KTL was amazing? I never found it offensive at all, and I didn't know people had a problem with it?
I’m SO HAPPY she wore braids. Just think about it! Blackpink is an INTERNATIONALLY successful group, showcasing braids worn nicely and not in a mocking form. How nice to wear if confidently, to convey its positive image to everywhere in Asia and the west, and make braids more normalised? They should be thanking K-pop. All their complaining about being discriminated while a frikin Asian pop group is making it less stigmatised
The way I watched this from start to finish and agreed to every. single. word.
I really respect you for being honest and not being afraid to speak your mind we really need more brutal honest people like you
there is nothing wrong with not forgiving idols, expressing your discomfort, etc, but why are some toxic stans spending so much time actually personally attacking them about unrelated things and straight up bullying them and their stans? that is not the same as holding someone accountable, that's just something people do when they are bored and want fanwars. also americans may not believe this, but it's true that most people in other countries learn about this problematic things from the internet, if someone doesn't spend a lot of time on the english-speaking internet they likely not know it.
Thankyou for this , I’ve always wanted to say the same thing but im not black and i was always afraid that if i ever talk back to black stans’ problematic comments I’d be attacked for being racist
THIS!!!
The "they label everything racism" was a very much needed call out. I'm glad you talked about this issue.
When you said culture ignorance isn't just in black culture I was so happy because when ever I say that everyone disagrees without looking thinking hard about it
its true some stans not just black kpop stans give lables to idols and attack them without knowing the damage it can cause to the idols career,life etc.
Toxicity has nothing to do with races, it's just there and will always be there
I agree. It’s irritating being called a coon or assumed I’m “white” because I don’t agree with an opinion 🙄 at this point no one will care if they’re called racist because every little thing is considered racist now. It’s starting to lose its meaning.
I hate how ppl expect everyone non north american to know about the n word, and i found so ridiculous when ppl hate so bad a idol WHO DON'T EVEN SPEAK ENGLISH say the n word like that Enhypen member that i forgot and Han, like??????? And even the ones who know english like Giselle, knowing english means that you learned the language, not the culture, i just learned about the n word some years ago. And ppl used the argument "what if the idol is from america or something" and with that i say, i never saw Somi, both Mark's, Johnny, Vernon and Josh, Kevin, Jacob or both Eric's, and even Jessi saying the n word so.....
OMG YES GIRL UR SO RIGHT AT THIS POINT AND PLUS WHAT HAPPENED TO U WHEN U WERE FORCED TO SHARE UR FACE WAS VERY RUDE AND U DIDNT DESERVE THAT
I still remember how I asked this person what's the history behind the"N-word" because she has black friends and I wanted to educated myself on their history she screamed at me and told me I was ignorant while I was just tryna learn
Point being
You should ask a European person about the history of the n-word
Because they created it and used it against African people
That’s concerning
Girrrrrl you are speaking the truth and I really hope that people will understand cultural appreciation, appropriation, racism, colourism, ignorance etc I see terms like these thrown there all the time, abuse depression etc as well and this makes these terms less and less meaningful and impactful etc
It is important to educate ourselves but despite having resources it is difficult as sources usually have bias and I am saying this as someone studying politics and IR... It is okay to not like things, to be annoyed or offended by something but people need to measure their words and have more definitions
anyyyyywaysss please keep doing videos, your voice is lovely and your thinking is GREAT
Thank you for summarizing this so well!
I would like to add:
- I feel like it's mainly a problem with young stans from the US, who think they know everything while not knowing anything about the history of other countries.
- If you mention being from Europe (or anywhere but the US), you get attacked immediately because you are assumed to be white and as you also aren't Asian, you cannot have any opinion on the topic.
- Many claim anything and everything as "black culture", especially braids. I get it with cornrows, they are a part of black history (not just from slaves in the US, some of the styles originated in Africa way earlier, if my history textbook is correct). But when someone attacks an idol for wearing any braids at all, it's just stupid. There have been braided hairstyles way earlier than US slavery, among vikings, romans, suebians, ancient Chinese people and native americans, to name a few. To quote my professor: "Not everything that looks like a duck, actually is a duck.", meaning: "If you think you are right, you should triple check before telling someone else they are wrong.", or applied to the topic "Not everything that seems racist to you, actually is. Better check a textbook before you claim that only your ancestors did that."
- Everything is labeled "racism" or "cultural appropriation", even if it's just an issue of someone not knowing everything about a particular minority or if it was actually meant to be cultural appreciation.
- Anything with racism or CA is only applied to black people (usually from the US). There rarely are conversations about it when it comes to other Asian cultures, for example. And if there are, it's usually dumb stuff, like people hating on Lisa for wearing a traditional Thai outfit when she literally is from Thailand.
- Sometimes (as with Lisa, for example) people use "Racism" as an excuse to bully idols online, even if they didn't do anything (or had no control over it, like with some outfits).
- Sometimes it sadly is an issue of people being ignorant about other languages. I have seen idols being accused of saying the N-word, when they really said "내가", which is usually romanized as "naega" and translates to "I". Not everyone is fluent in English and only a minority speaks no other languages besides English.
It's a tiring topic that is not really worth arguing about, as the people that (usually) are the issue will not listen (or change) anyway.
Can I be honest? A lot of the "racist" kpop idols aren't even racist 💀 they're just ignorant
wendy....
@@Ash.e__Mayy yeah, Wendy is kinda 😑 especially since she lived in Canada but I'm mostly talking about the ones that don't speak english and have lived in South Korea or sum
What!? You were bullied into a face reveal?? I'm so sorry, some people just think they have to have some type of control over every little thing.
It's kinda sad that you were bullied into making your face reveal even when you weren't comfortable with it
you just opened up an entire comment section to be openly racist, this was not the take you thought it was..
How? Why is it that whenever people are allowed to speak their truth, they're "racist"? Same with women calling anyone that calls out their ignorance, "misogynistic". Or because people don't add gay characters to a book or show, "homophobic".
It's not racist to say what someone does that bothers you. It's not racist to say when someone is being toxic. It's not racist to ask others to respect as they want to be respected
People really let their feelings blind them to any truths and act like because of their feelings, they can't be criticized
@@LovelyKissess look at the comment above yours dear 🤣
@@Des_. I can't see the comment above mine. Just my comment, yours and the original comment we're under
@@Soo-Idle what.
@@LovelyKissesssome people are being openly racist towards black people in the comments
Ahh finally someone has spoken about this!!! I respect everyone and all cultures but the things you mentioned had been bothering me and I always felt I had to be quiet or get attacked even tho I’m not saying anything disrespectful or rude
Thank you for this video!
Let’s be real a lot of black people from America try and make it out like we’re better than our white counterparts but that’s not true. Americans choose to be ignorant and intolerant about so much but expect respect. No one is saying to accept racism or not call out when an idol does something wrong. People need to understand that we are not the same and don’t get taught the same. Why would a humongous country like South Korea know so much about American slavery? So many people have decided to attack others when they ask a simple question. Someone saying “I don’t understand why this is racist.” Isn’t them being hateful. Normalize explaining yourself instead of canceling others.
Don’t know when explaining ourselves became not normal, but it’s really shitty that it did. If you can’t put into words why you think a certain way then maybe you need to consider why you think it before fighting with people that disagree with you.
I know a lot of people will hate me for saying this but the biggest racists in the world today are some black people. The definition of racism is having prejudged prejudices against another group of people based on skincolor alone. I have never seen anyone throw unearned hated at others like some black people do. I just want to tell these types of people. Before you throw racism at me for being white and bringing up slavery. a that happened over 300 years ago and nobody alive today took part and b muslims continued owning slaves well up to the 1990s how come you have nothing to say to them. My point is i don't understand why we have normalised racism as long as its a black person doing it. Its Wrong to do that to anybody
@@tabithadickson36 The reasons why people think that way is all of the racism and hatred and attacks that happened after slavery and even now today. That's why black people, especially from the south find it hard to accept different cultures and in general accept white people. When I was younger, and went to my first more diverse school, more like 45/45 blacks and whites, I was so concerned and weirded out because of all of what the school system has taught us: white people did this blah blah blah. I even had this mindset of thinking europeans were bad because of our native american unit. As well as going into a society to where I'm looked at different, we are kind of raised to be more careful of what we say about our culture, and how we act, our slang, etc. And a lot of the "racism" is really just preceptions. Some black people are generally racist though and that's an entire different conversation. So I get what you mean, but the whole black people being racist thing is too complicated to just have one statement on it.
@@tabithadickson36 what?
Most of the idols that say the n-word are from the Americas so they know what it’s means
Everyone needs to watch this
Edit: Even if this particular video emphasizes the black kpop stan community, I think any race or country-based communities can still grasp on to some of the points made in here as they are the usual commonalities. An example in this video is the reality that everyone does not necessarily know everything due to the self-centered point of view of history in local educational environments.
thank you for voicing out, whenever there's an issues like this, they always blame people because not known about the history of it... and it's make me kinda afraid of them.
but when it's come to other country rules, they usually never care and insert their own culture in other country something like that...
and when we tried to explaining.. they never listen at all.. quick to jump and bring their race card..
Finally smne saying it. Ofc we need to hold idols accountable and hopefully idols learn more from their mistakes, but honestly I never knew about the n- word or the cultural appropriation and all that until i actually saw a kpop idol scandal. I had to search it up and understand why it was offensive. Not everyone knows about it.. lol the fact that our country doesent even teach our own history how are we supposed to know the others? We can all learn slowly..
Same with some desi stans and i am speaking this as a desi myself some desi stans are like so over the top like they be labelling even minute bopping to indian songs as racist like girl bye 😭😭😭😭 also not these same people throwing around the nword like anything and saying really racist stuffs about other culture lmao not only that even i get said weird stuffs often for appreciating my culture here in India like their is so much of regionalism like 😢
I also hate the fact that some just use it to cancel who they hate. Like just why? Why would you use your own culture to cancel or degrade someone? I think that's disprespecting the culture
As an Indian K-Pop stan, I have seen cultural appropriation happening for our culture as well. But then, you cannot keep complaining just because they did not apologize THE WAY YOU WANT IT TO BE. Also, people need to stop blaming the idols because 90% of the times they themselves have no idea that they offended your culture. Thank you for speaking out loud about this!
this video deserves millions of views
Yes!
pov ajanaevis fans
Lol and ajanaevis herself
@@jungxi2729 like content created like fandom
"If you don't agree with her you are a racist because she has never been wrong" an aja fan I saw on the internet
@@jungxi2729 i knoww
@@Danna-ek5hq shes so fucking annoying and misandrist and an attention seeker
It's hard having these kinds of discussions online bc anyone can really access it. It's something we need to fix between eachother but if we open convo like this it opens the door for people to use it to be racist and used against. Its like that one Obama joke.
I agree
There is a group of young black kpop stans in the fandom I'm a part of, who like to constantly stir up trouble by antagonising other stans and playing the racism card in order to guilt the rest of the fandom into cancelling the people they don't like. Recently, they bullied an og fan in our community simply because she got into multiple fan signs, throwing out buzzwords like classist and even racist? My fandom is very small so when these accusations get thrown around, everyone goes along with it because they are scared of being cancelled. A lot people have left the fandom due to these immature teens on a powertrip who have made the community atmosphere so toxic, and because the fandom is sooooo small, this is negatively affecting the group we support too.
Old fans, people who ran fanbases, organised events and translators have left the fandom due to these few bad actors. I dread being active in the fandom now, it's becoming such a miserable place.
@9:53 to be completely honest I was taught about Jim Crow but never went into it we just learned a little of what happened and then moved on (I live in the us and I’m black) I always thought that the pose was just something childish gambino did cuz I never looked into it