I agree with every point in this video. Very well put. Most importantly, they need to give me a reason to experience more of the content they have worked so hard to make because mere curiosity or pride in doing something tough ain't gonna do it for me past a certain point. I want to spend more time exploring this world, but if I am going to risk losing real time spent and in-game resources I worked to acquire, then I need a suitable payoff for that risk, otherwise I will take the easiest option every time. I don't mind a challenge for a good reward that will help me progress further in the game, but if the only reward is to say that I did something risky and survived, then I won't bother. I don't get satisfaction from that sort of thing. I need to feel like I am working toward an in-game goal or I lose interest. I know not everyone needs that from a game like this, but as you stated in the video, they have an opportunity to set this game apart from other extraction shooters and I feel like this is one area where they could do that. I am not saying the devs 'have to' or 'should do' anything. I am just saying that if I am going to play any more than the 36+ hours I've already spent, this is what I would need.
Yeah after getting a good stash of meds, ammo, and junk. Me playing around with weapon mods. And i dont even think i want more than the equipment runner rig, dont really see much of a point in the pack mule or the rack. Yeah i can grind quests for specific weapons but meh.
It's a trap of the "not that guy" approach imo. Doing more than the bare minimum goes against the game design. You are punished for doing anything interesting.
On water, you could get rid of credits and make water the resource. So instead of a timer you have to use it to buy and maintain the base, while also having it naturally decay everytime you do a mission, instead of a always on timer. The decay will incease as your grow, forcing you in tougher scenarios to match your equipment.
One thing that might well help with that is toggleable water bots. As far as I'm aware, once I buy that first upgrade, I have changed how the game will play from then on short of a wipe. It leads my naturally cautious style to wait until I have all the defenses ready before pulling the trigger on that, since it can't be undone. (Ala raiding the Alien base in XCOM.)
Thanks for the video man! Maybe the gameplay improvements in Frozen Swamp will lead to some interesting reworks to the older maps. Exciting stuff ahead I'm sure!
I don't think the games ever going to not have "modern guns" as there doesn't seem to be anything in the lore that says they're restricted to WWII era tech or something like that. Just because it features a lot of heavily modified 20th century guns doesn't mean that's the baseline, it's just showing that in this world they prioritize repurposing what already works.
I think you're right in that its going to still use modern guns as baselines, but the visual overhaul of the MG34 for example in game is kind of where I want the game to go personally. Some of the guns are basically already there for me too like the WLT MPL. For the most part the guns are just an example of things still heavily work in progress, that they kind of rushed out (in this case by using an asset pack, though no shame in that).
Free look and the ability to swap over the shoulder camera position are my biggest desires mechanically, save for further polish and the obvious, but i'm just delving into the game proper and despite my pc struggling, i'm having a blast. your points here are incredibly accurate to exactly what needs to happen, especially in terms of endgame and the water system(being as new as i am it's not the worst mechanic, but it feels mundane, even with the water thieves, though, again, i'm only 4 days into the game) in terms of art, i don't think an IP has ever caught my attention faster than TFW, save for maybe Trench Crusade(and who can blame anyone for breaking their neck to peep those designs? clean.) shout out to the phenomenal soundtrack too! excellent video my guy.
I agree with your take on the water system. Connecting it to real world time, just flat out doesn't work. The whole point of it, was the fact that water in a post-apocalypse, and the war that caused it, still raging on with no end, is supposed to scarce and valuable. If they're going to make water as abundant as it is right now, then they should make certain high value items, cost water instead of credits. If Metro can make bullets currency, why can't Forever Winter make water currency? As to the maps, I see your points on the older maps looking great, but having not enough to interact with, other than take the same paths every time to either avoid the spawning enemies, or kick off a firefight with them. In game/raid events would be cool. Or additional variants of the maps. Like maybe a version of Elephant Mausoleum, where Europa has repaired one of the giant mech piloted guns, and it shoots down the Eurasian Bombers that normally fly over the map. Areas once accessible are now blocked off for that round, and the factions respond accordingly. Or hell, make it so that for certain maps that are obviously connected, can be accessed from another map. Like on EM, we could if we do certain things, open the door at the back of the hanger, and go directly into Mech Trenches, instead of extracting. And same with Mech Trenches. Doing something in there that maybe opens up the door to the Scrapyard Nexus. Things I'd like to see, main one being where we can choose if we want the night shift variant of a map when we go out. I've had this game from about 3 weeks after its EA launch, to current, and have never once experienced Elephant Mausoleum on night shift. RNGesus is not my friend in that regard. I'd also like to see more Toothy. His concept, makes my sphincter pucker tight enough to crush coal into diamond, and yet we only see him on Enclave, if you have the "Kill the Eruskan Commander" or very rarely have him drop in right in front of the pipe extraction point for no obvious reason. The idea of him chasing yo, and bagging you, is scary as hell. This kind of segues into my next thing, which is proper voice lines for the NPCs. I want to hear Europan NCOs barking orders at the soldiers, with Eurasian cyborgs speaking binary, and Eruskans speaking some kind of garbled Russian or whatever. If Toothy is on the field, and he's about to bag someone, I want to hear them screaming for help, or begging for their comrades to shoot them, before Toothy can put them in the bag. Maybe even put in a wounded state for soldiers, so you can hear them groaning in pain, or coughing up blood, maybe struggling to call for a medic through their radios or something. Lastly, they need to change up the looks of the Eurasian cyborgs. I'm sorry they just look too much like Temu Terminators, and I hope that its just a placeholder model, but they don't seem to be moving away from it anytime soon. There was a post on the subreddit, that someone poached from a 40k page, of this horrible emaciated thing (probably a rotting servitor) and that struck me as much more fitting for Eurasian cyborgs. The lore is that Eurasia is constantly trying to recycle the cyborgs as much as possible, and they should look like they're barely holding together, horrible scraps of flesh hanging off of a skeleton of bone and metal. leaking hydraulic fluid from poorly repaired seals, because it got rushed into battle again. Shit like that is what I think could put this game over the top, in time.
Thanks for the well thought out comment! I'd love more voice lines also, would kind of help ground the enemies as humans / once humans (in the case of cyborgs).
The Game looks absolutely fantastic. I get a bit nostalgic Feeling from one of the many, MANY Levels of one of the first *"Doom Games"* when everything was just Pixels moving in Levels that were like the first 3D-Levels ever, especially the Sky-Boxes. But this of Course, looks Worlds apart better. I get this "Apocalyptic Wasteland"-Feeling.
The water system i get why people don't really like but, it is far less annoying than it was before and killing the Water Thieves that raid your Innards (made easier with the 20mm Sentry Guns) net you rare guns like the Vepr-12 and RPD which are super hard to get. As long as you have all the Innards Turret Upgrades and and Water Bot Upgrades you don't have to worry about water anymore. I do want to see Fun Dog Studio do more with the Water System though like make it so you can trade water for Special Weapons and RIG Equipment you can't get any other way (my personal Stash has over 800 days worth of Water Barrels)
The water system will never work while it has a game vs player mechanic by punishing you for not playing the game. That kind of stuff is associated with mobile games and TFW isn't going to change that. It's very naive to think it can work. Players would accept MUCH heavier in game character ability penalties over this.
I totally agree to the overarching goals bit! This game has great bones already but it needs that connection to keep the player in it long-time instead of just farming.
Something to add, I don't know how complicated it is, since I say it from my ignorance, but it would be interesting to implement a much more advanced movement system like Helldivers 2 or MGSV, they are very similar in themselves, because it works and is very complete and satisfactory when trying it, but applying here that in The Forever Winter it proposes different things, this movement system could be applied differently, while in the others they will feel in combat since in the 2 games we are part of a special unit combat, while In The Forever Winter it could be applied differently in the sense that it is functional, but not so much at the same level as an elite soldier, we are scavengers, some civilians who barely know about weapons, others deserters from the super nations, I don't know, it's What came to mind would be interesting, but I don't know how it could be implemented. Anyways, you made a good video dude.
W video. I absolutely love the art of this game man. I love the game. Bugs aside, it's just hard to keep playing it everyday. Same quests over and over. I do feel progression in the characters, just feel like the chore of doing the same thing kinda gets boring.
Well said, I must agree with the maps part. Swamp is a beautiful location with a lot of things to see and do, while some others have a few short falls. Scorched Enclave, while limited has its scope justified by its status as a beginner friendly, starting map. And does a very good job at it. On the other hand, while I really like Scrapyard Nexus, I must admit that it is a very limited map with not much to do there. One way to go, one way to leave and predictable path to take. It does have a variety of spawn situations which you can encounter but otherwise would benefit from an expansion. Perhaps clearance of some rubble to reveal new paths.
I have no idea if it would even be able to be implemented, but could the use of water be linked to saving game progress? Kinda like ink ribbons in Resident Evil. Just a thought.
i was thinking like a resource to specifically expand the innards or fund expeditions, or something, but save file is very interesting, though i struggle to imagine the implementation. maybe tying water directly to the hired help and varying levels of efficacy based on the amount invested, but always a risk for failure. the water mechanic hasn't irritated me wholly yet, but i'm only 4 days into the game, so i'm sure it's coming. still, the game's really neat. i really like that TFW and witchfire are making extraction based games viable for single player.
went back to mausoleum, there is actually some sounds ambiance but its super low, they should improve on it and add visuals like the aa gun firing, stuff in the skybox etc to make the places more lively like when we get the city maps, if we can get on rooftop, we see a carrier and big green fighting each other far away off map, even if its just preset animation or something. Additionally: more interior places in those large maps. we see it with frozen swamp thief base etc, it adds a lot. and more verticality in map, places you can only reach with certain equipment like the pneumatic jump
I highlight this in a feedback section on the discord, which I'll provide a link at the bottom of this comment for people who want to take a look (though its in a section where you need to verify ownership of the game). In essence, the first thing that needs to be done is it needs to take time out of the equation as I mention in the video, then you can balance how scarce water is by making it more about survival, optimization or the choices you make in game. Personally, I'd have water consumption be quite low in the early game, but as you progress through the game, unlock new traders, new gear and upgrades your Innards consume more water, but these ugprades also help you in pursuit of it. If you're familiar with city builders this is actually a pretty common gameplay loop, with progression driving the needs for resources, and acquiring these resources more optimally require more progression, they essentially feed into each other and always make you feel like you're teetering on the edge. discord.com/channels/1204839019502903407/1321888619744591964/1321888619744591964
@@killpo_1 Sounds like a good way to keep the "essence" of the water being a necessary resource for survival. I don't play the game (because I am poor) and I did not know that the progress had you upgrade the Innards. Is each player in their own "universe", or do all the players kinda share a virtual commons accross the game (let's say like HellDivers) ?
I myself enjoy the Game a lot. Love the Style, the Wasteland (Cyberpunkish) Setting and even the Music adds to the experience in a good way. I do not really have a set feeling about the Water system... it's... okayish?.. But my only critic is that after a few runs and a few good hauls of loot .. the 'You are not the Guy' feeling gets dulled by the fact that you can mow down tons of enemys (Specialy Bag-Man and his HvyMG). I like a good firefight like the next Bruce Willis don't get me wrong but even the most hardend badass of the Forever Winter should at some point simply be overwhelmed by enemys (And i don't mean the unkillable ones ^^). Anyways... i look forward to see this gem of a game evolve further into what we all hope to be a great experience for many kinds of players! ^^
Honestly the only ones that WILL be a threat to you are the larger units, such as Tanks, Orgamechs, Exos, medium mechs, helicopters and the good ol GRABBER. We only end up feeling like we are "THE GUY" is because 90% of our kills are infantry.
Great video as always, you're shaping up to be one of my favourite creators/thinkers. Videogames are multimedial creatures and as such demand either universal men to make them (and make them good) or a team of dudes (and dudettes) with different speciality but a somewhat unified mindset (or a perceptive and charismatic lead dev but that is not the case here it seems). TFW lacks some areas of its brain, so to speak, as of now and I don't think those that are there can compensate for those that are not, the team should look for that quid they lack.
Retitle to Why I Love Frozen Swamp please. Understandably though, it's easily my favorite now. Can't wait for Stairgate. EM offers that player journey as well but not near FS. Having more interactable traversal mechanics on the swamp is helping a lot. Whats nice about the "old maps" is the variants that get thrown in the mix. Had two nights back to back. Too many mothers for this scav
Yeah, that water system has had me on the fence for this game for a while, the prospect of losing progress from an offline timer for a pve game was an immediate turn off. I don't want a Nintendog, i wanna struggle for survival and get supplies where I can.
Great rundown on the current state of the game! Your thoughts on the water system not only really succinctly point out why it is frustrating but also make constructive recommendations on how to actually convey the themes they want. It's so strange because the devs spend a lot of time talking about how the game is unique and different. It is! But then they throw in a mechanic which feels more like something from a mobile game to build FOMO. I don't think it's malicious, I think they just had an awkward idea going in and for some reason refuse to go back to the drawing board with it based on feedback. Hopefully they will listen to well-thought out content creators like you.
I would love to see more of an emphasis on the "you're not that guy, so trying to be that guy will get you killed" approach, with the caveat that killing people may bring the pain much sooner but there are better rewards for doing so. I love being a sneaky l'il shit and taking my time, but I definitely don't feel pressured if I wipe several squads out to get what I want. I love the feeling of panic trying to escape detection from roaming patrols murdering each other. And I think Frozen Swamp encapsulates that feeling /really well/ (except when the enemies could "see" you through the floor last patch, lol) Also, would love to see water be a resource than a countdown, or both at once if we're going to be able to have a steady source. It's really easy to get now, so might as well use it for something and have that be a balance to watch out for (base upgrades, advanced weapons purchases costing water, but now have to go scavenge some more to balance the cost) Would love to see a bit more verticality and pathways added to the other maps (like tunnels underneath the bunkers in Scorched Enclave that may or may not have patrols while you're hiding from tanks or choppers above) to encourage alternate routes (I have my set routes through the old maps already, and except for different patrols now and then I've been able to keep safe and extract when I want, not when I'm forced to by the battles)
I get the whole theme is you're not the main character, but I think the concept actually hurts the game more than it helps. The lack of any impact on the world makes it very repetitive. Reputation is a practically a useless gameplay feature compared to how hard it is to raise it. And invincible enemies, while cool to look at, prevents any actual interaction. I don't really see any way under the current system for them to add any gameplay mechanics beyond what we already have. All they can really add are more enemies, which unless they're troops you'll just avoid. More maps, where you play them like every other map. Or more weapons, which can't be meaningfully better than what we already have.
Why is the backpack so big? I mean is there a purpose? I've just recently started watching gameplay and I haven't gotten info on their purpose. Every video I've seen so far the player has on this giant half empty backpack looking thing like the death stranding backpack without all the packages. Do you attach things to it that help your character or am I missing something and all the videos I've seen so far the players just haven't upgraded their packs?
Their called rigs and the scavengers use them to transport high amounts of loot in a given run wich they need to do because those runs are dangerous and take time to plan according to the lore so they need to be able to take as much stuff as possible
Aside from the poor optimization, the biggest thing holding Forever Winter back for me personally is the predictability of it all. The ability to “master” a map is something that I feel shouldn’t be possible in a game that wants to prevent you from being “The Guy”, as knowledge over game systems is what allows for mastery over the game. When I spawn Cemetery on Scorched Enclave I can immediately guess there’s gonna be a Cyborg Spawn when I round the corner and most of the time I’ll be right. I feel like that should never happen. There should never be a time where you can anticipate and/or exploit what’s going to happen in this game. The more unpredictable it is, the better I think it will be. Part of this also has to do with the AI needing to be better and more autonomous. While they do naturally fight one another, they’ll usually just end up patrolling the same route endlessly and never go off to any other part of the map except for some rare cases, with additional enemies spawning only once you reach certain areas in the level. The game should feel like it exists independent of you like the original STALKER games but at the moment it really doesn’t. The problem is, I don’t know if this is because of UE5 or what, but I feel like the scope that the devs and I want this game to have might be too much to sufficiently optimize well.
I dont like invincible units like the grabber and with the AI being janky as of now it just adds to the frustration Theres good reason why I barely ever went into the nexus map and I literally never went to the under ground cemetary, ever.
Would be nice if you could keep some talent as you level prestige, like, when you past prestige 10 you regain your rank 1 talents, past 20 rank 2+1 and so on, with of course possibility to wipe them if you decide to change build.
as a dev I understand the water system, especially in EA. as you don't want someone to come back after 4 months and do a quest that was removed or borked due to missing updates in between. so I assume the water system will change after EA.
I think water should be changed to a currency instead of a time, every time you begin a mission it will cost you & you need to pay it back like a gamble or it’s game over, similar your troops in Xcom. Harder maps can have more loot but cost more to reach. The guns are a low point for the game, aside from being badly balanced they are half baked in general. Most of them make no sense, why is there an Mpl? Didn’t they stop making those in the 80s? Unless it’s supposed to be in the middle of the Cold War, I don’t think they give a date but it’s unlikely. And all of them are very clean and bland in design when they should be taped together and battered. As well as lacking anything particularly unique or special over just normal bullet shooters. Attachments like sights should be rare and prone to breaking due to the grit of the environment & have more of an emphasis on hand crafted designs like kitchen knife bayonets & the stuff seen in metro33, bicycle frames, pipe grenade launchers & junk, with quality only found from braving high class enemies. There can be a lot of fun added with endlessly stat climbing loot even if minimal in function. One thing they got right was how aggressive they sound and flash, blinding you with each shot being a expression of discontent at the world.
The forever winter is really a one of a kind game with its beautiful art and interesting world but it has a good amount of gameplay and technical problems I hope these will be mostly ironed out near the end of the early access period because dying to a merkava tank that spawns inside of you near the land ship on ashen messa very quickly sucks out the fun of the game
I bought the game based on a few streamers like yourself and the art style. And I gonna be honest. I kinda hate it The gameplay loop with water and random HKs is just stupid. As someone who can only play games on the weekend I find this gameplay loop to be pretty toxic
I will say, both of your current hates are echoe'd very much by the rest of the community also and I hope the devs would take notice. It might take a bit to get them in a better spot but I think its coming.
"Like: The Art" Well the game was Inspired by a series of Images and they translated them into this universe. I too love the games Casual Nature, Its simple to get into, hard to master. TECHNICLLY their is a in raid timer, IE the Hunter Killers spawning, But unless its something you Can't KILL is it really an issue? Plus dispite the tag line "your are not that guy", well you can "be that guy" if your smart about what your doing (and ideally have friends). Each map is unique, some more interesting then others. The larger maps certainly take a few runs to fully explore and "map" out in your brain. The "Water Mechanic" is certainly a strange mechanic, as well as one that is SO misunderstood, actively hurting the games playerbase by turning people off from joining the fun. Cus playing the game myself, Water is JOKE. If anything the REAL Grind in this game is the 100,000s of Credits you need to upgrade your base. Again the Scorched Enclave bunker always tends to have a ton of water in it, or the cargo area behind the Infirmary in the Mech Trenches. Combine natural Water Collection with EASY REPEATABLE QUESTS, you can easily have more water then you know what to do with. The Water Bots are arguably Overkill as it stands, you don't need them less your THAT LAZY. Id argue the biggest issue with The Forever Winter at the moment is "active" player retention, After all with the Water Mechanic being little more then a AFK timer, you can drop the game for 3 months and still not run out of water. So while the playerbase may be alot bigger then what Steam Charts indicate, their are NOT that many people actually playing at any one time, let alone playing with random people. (although that might just be the Servers not loading the Squads tab? Not sure) Cus iv only had people randomly join me like twice now. And well, More Guns = More Fun. I do agree the Forever Winter can become king of PVE Extraction Shooters (I only know of 4 and this is one of them), and genra that is left high and dry in favor of PVP.... Much to the Fatigue and Frustration of Gamers as a whole. What was that game a while ago.... Arc Raiders, you have no idea how DEFLATED everyone got when they heard it went PVP, that's how Stale PVP extraction has gotten (or people are just fed up at BAD Extraction Shooters). I suppose the logical next step would be just More Content? Maps, Enemies, Weapons, Extera. Maybe finally make that message in the corner of the loading screen make sense "If you want to get by, you need to pick a side. Just be smart about it, cus the more 1 faction controls an area the more powerful units they will deploy", Cus right now THAT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING! It also kinda implies currying favor with one faction would have some benefits. So maybe the Faction system is something they could expand upon as well.
I would agree with most of the points you made. I personally really liked the water system, but now that it's been nerfed to the point of having 150+ days of water without ever picking up water, it feels pointless.
I wasn't a big fan of water beforehand, but water is so trivial now Im even less of a fan of it. But I think it hopefully makes it fairly apparent that the both going foward has to detatch consumption from an IRL timer so that it can be balanced to actually feel impactful.
@ I personally did not think there was anything wrong with it's original set up. Yes subjectively, I understand why people didn't like it. However due to quests providing tons of water and being repeatable, even pre-water buff it was not hard to stack up days worth of water with minutes worth of time/effort. I don't personally think it's the dev's fault if someone buys their game and then doesn't actively play it. I play WoW which requires a monthly subscription to play. If I don't play an entire month without cancelling my sub and they bill me $15, I don't blame them and ask for my money back due to my lack of play. I view the water system very much the same. I personally do not buy games I don't sink hours into. And it's not hard to check the innards once a week to see your time to get into a 5 minute game and walk away with days worth of water (100's of times for your water timer over your time investment). I think the water system needs a tune-up now AFTER the buff and was fine before. And I personally think the water system was completely blown out of proportion.
the water system is my biggest grip i have dozens of games competing for my attention, and while i'm no stranger for a daily grind, knowing its mandatory or i loose all my stuff is a massive turn off for me, and i hope they remove it entierly
You dont have to deal with water at all with basic turrets. Was that so difficult to figure out? Sry but you are now officially 'that guy.' Maybe free to play mobile games might be more your jam?
@@operator9858 turrets were not a thing when i first heard about the game. Also i'd wager they are neither free nor cheap and i refuse to play 'free mobile games' for the same reason. They try to force me into playing daily. I may feel the need to take a month off to do something else, If i come back and find my game is wiped for having the audacity to take a break, its not going to motivate me to start grinding again, its gonna motivate me to uninstall
I think ammo is way too common and way too weak, I liked the part where they mentioned "just some men and women running in the dark with half empty magazines" I find myself roleplaying as a scavenger when I can semi easily mow down a squad of infantry because im a hobo with a modded ar and 300 rounds of ammo. The only combat i enjoyed was against unarmored enemies like zombie cyborgs and water thieves which take like 3 to 5 shots to take down, most other killable units feel way too tanky.
That's a fair point, since I generally play solo I tend get mostly Europa EODs which are fairly trivial. I can't imagine the super weird quirky nature of picking up a few pictures or data caches causing hell to rain down on you is here to stay.
@@killpo_1 Reminds me of my first HK in ashen Mesa i got a medium mech hunter and that bastard was tall enough to just fire at me when ever it wanted it was brutal.
I also think water is to easy to come buy...... it should be rare and if you have something in your pack and you see a water barrel the game should make you think twice about what is important..... water should be as rare as the loot boxes...... my opinion.
A mechanic that punished people for not playing regularly by wiping their progress sounds insane and unbelievably stupid. It's dumb enough make me not want to play the game. Ever.
for the art point, the thing that bother me the most are the character faces. The whole game has hyper realistic graphics and high detail models for everything. Yet the character are in a charicatural drawn style that feels out of place and missmatched with the rest of the game graphics. Furthermore i think they are really disgusting looking, like the noodle beard, overexagerated facial traits and everything. They should go for a realistic style of character, that would enhance the human suffering and inhumanity of the war and match with the current aesthetic of the game.
I never got that, I think maybe they wanted everyone to look like plastic figurines kids use to play war but only the player is unmasked and looks uncanny while the rest are normal looking grunts when it should be the opposite
i dont see any update they make as set in stone, these devs are learning with each new release and the community is vocal as hell and intereactive with the development, finding bugs feedback etc. I think even early access we are playing a concept more than a game. and sure it could be coping with an unifinished product but I have no problem with them taking as much time as they need to make the game feel just as loved and close to their art as they seek. if they remake an entire map go for it. water system whatever. as soon as they get the gameplay and ai down we will be laughing we just gotta give them the time they need and not pressure too hard and alot of the regufees from shooters are the ones being pissed a the state of the game because they didnt taper their expectations, or did no research into the game. and I will always stay constructive because I took the ride i made the choice hell I bought it after it was on sale because i waited to long and zero regrets, its something new its something special and it takes time to be polished.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
I agree with every point in this video. Very well put.
Most importantly, they need to give me a reason to experience more of the content they have worked so hard to make because mere curiosity or pride in doing something tough ain't gonna do it for me past a certain point. I want to spend more time exploring this world, but if I am going to risk losing real time spent and in-game resources I worked to acquire, then I need a suitable payoff for that risk, otherwise I will take the easiest option every time. I don't mind a challenge for a good reward that will help me progress further in the game, but if the only reward is to say that I did something risky and survived, then I won't bother. I don't get satisfaction from that sort of thing. I need to feel like I am working toward an in-game goal or I lose interest. I know not everyone needs that from a game like this, but as you stated in the video, they have an opportunity to set this game apart from other extraction shooters and I feel like this is one area where they could do that. I am not saying the devs 'have to' or 'should do' anything. I am just saying that if I am going to play any more than the 36+ hours I've already spent, this is what I would need.
Yeah after getting a good stash of meds, ammo, and junk. Me playing around with weapon mods. And i dont even think i want more than the equipment runner rig, dont really see much of a point in the pack mule or the rack. Yeah i can grind quests for specific weapons but meh.
It's a trap of the "not that guy" approach imo. Doing more than the bare minimum goes against the game design. You are punished for doing anything interesting.
On water, you could get rid of credits and make water the resource. So instead of a timer you have to use it to buy and maintain the base, while also having it naturally decay everytime you do a mission, instead of a always on timer.
The decay will incease as your grow, forcing you in tougher scenarios to match your equipment.
One thing that might well help with that is toggleable water bots. As far as I'm aware, once I buy that first upgrade, I have changed how the game will play from then on short of a wipe. It leads my naturally cautious style to wait until I have all the defenses ready before pulling the trigger on that, since it can't be undone. (Ala raiding the Alien base in XCOM.)
My buddy and I are looking forward to watching this game spread its wings.
Thanks for the video man! Maybe the gameplay improvements in Frozen Swamp will lead to some interesting reworks to the older maps. Exciting stuff ahead I'm sure!
Now I want new gun parts and old guns that can be upgraded because there are too few of them.
Old guns would be great especially an M1 garrand cuz the happy brain chemical TING sound
There are borderline too many guns, given the inconsequentiality of many of them. Make them more meaningful instead of just more.
I don't think the games ever going to not have "modern guns" as there doesn't seem to be anything in the lore that says they're restricted to WWII era tech or something like that.
Just because it features a lot of heavily modified 20th century guns doesn't mean that's the baseline, it's just showing that in this world they prioritize repurposing what already works.
I think you're right in that its going to still use modern guns as baselines, but the visual overhaul of the MG34 for example in game is kind of where I want the game to go personally.
Some of the guns are basically already there for me too like the WLT MPL.
For the most part the guns are just an example of things still heavily work in progress, that they kind of rushed out (in this case by using an asset pack, though no shame in that).
Free look and the ability to swap over the shoulder camera position are my biggest desires mechanically, save for further polish and the obvious, but i'm just delving into the game proper and despite my pc struggling, i'm having a blast. your points here are incredibly accurate to exactly what needs to happen, especially in terms of endgame and the water system(being as new as i am it's not the worst mechanic, but it feels mundane, even with the water thieves, though, again, i'm only 4 days into the game)
in terms of art, i don't think an IP has ever caught my attention faster than TFW, save for maybe Trench Crusade(and who can blame anyone for breaking their neck to peep those designs? clean.)
shout out to the phenomenal soundtrack too!
excellent video my guy.
I agree with your take on the water system. Connecting it to real world time, just flat out doesn't work. The whole point of it, was the fact that water in a post-apocalypse, and the war that caused it, still raging on with no end, is supposed to scarce and valuable. If they're going to make water as abundant as it is right now, then they should make certain high value items, cost water instead of credits. If Metro can make bullets currency, why can't Forever Winter make water currency?
As to the maps, I see your points on the older maps looking great, but having not enough to interact with, other than take the same paths every time to either avoid the spawning enemies, or kick off a firefight with them. In game/raid events would be cool. Or additional variants of the maps. Like maybe a version of Elephant Mausoleum, where Europa has repaired one of the giant mech piloted guns, and it shoots down the Eurasian Bombers that normally fly over the map. Areas once accessible are now blocked off for that round, and the factions respond accordingly. Or hell, make it so that for certain maps that are obviously connected, can be accessed from another map. Like on EM, we could if we do certain things, open the door at the back of the hanger, and go directly into Mech Trenches, instead of extracting. And same with Mech Trenches. Doing something in there that maybe opens up the door to the Scrapyard Nexus.
Things I'd like to see, main one being where we can choose if we want the night shift variant of a map when we go out. I've had this game from about 3 weeks after its EA launch, to current, and have never once experienced Elephant Mausoleum on night shift. RNGesus is not my friend in that regard. I'd also like to see more Toothy. His concept, makes my sphincter pucker tight enough to crush coal into diamond, and yet we only see him on Enclave, if you have the "Kill the Eruskan Commander" or very rarely have him drop in right in front of the pipe extraction point for no obvious reason. The idea of him chasing yo, and bagging you, is scary as hell.
This kind of segues into my next thing, which is proper voice lines for the NPCs. I want to hear Europan NCOs barking orders at the soldiers, with Eurasian cyborgs speaking binary, and Eruskans speaking some kind of garbled Russian or whatever. If Toothy is on the field, and he's about to bag someone, I want to hear them screaming for help, or begging for their comrades to shoot them, before Toothy can put them in the bag. Maybe even put in a wounded state for soldiers, so you can hear them groaning in pain, or coughing up blood, maybe struggling to call for a medic through their radios or something.
Lastly, they need to change up the looks of the Eurasian cyborgs. I'm sorry they just look too much like Temu Terminators, and I hope that its just a placeholder model, but they don't seem to be moving away from it anytime soon. There was a post on the subreddit, that someone poached from a 40k page, of this horrible emaciated thing (probably a rotting servitor) and that struck me as much more fitting for Eurasian cyborgs. The lore is that Eurasia is constantly trying to recycle the cyborgs as much as possible, and they should look like they're barely holding together, horrible scraps of flesh hanging off of a skeleton of bone and metal. leaking hydraulic fluid from poorly repaired seals, because it got rushed into battle again. Shit like that is what I think could put this game over the top, in time.
Thanks for the well thought out comment! I'd love more voice lines also, would kind of help ground the enemies as humans / once humans (in the case of cyborgs).
The Game looks absolutely fantastic. I get a bit nostalgic Feeling from one of the many, MANY Levels of one of the first *"Doom Games"* when everything was just Pixels moving in Levels that were like the first 3D-Levels ever,
especially the Sky-Boxes. But this of Course, looks Worlds apart better. I get this "Apocalyptic Wasteland"-Feeling.
The water system i get why people don't really like but, it is far less annoying than it was before and killing the Water Thieves that raid your Innards (made easier with the 20mm Sentry Guns) net you rare guns like the Vepr-12 and RPD which are super hard to get. As long as you have all the Innards Turret Upgrades and and Water Bot Upgrades you don't have to worry about water anymore. I do want to see Fun Dog Studio do more with the Water System though like make it so you can trade water for Special Weapons and RIG Equipment you can't get any other way (my personal Stash has over 800 days worth of Water Barrels)
The water system will never work while it has a game vs player mechanic by punishing you for not playing the game. That kind of stuff is associated with mobile games and TFW isn't going to change that. It's very naive to think it can work. Players would accept MUCH heavier in game character ability penalties over this.
I totally agree to the overarching goals bit! This game has great bones already but it needs that connection to keep the player in it long-time instead of just farming.
Something to add, I don't know how complicated it is, since I say it from my ignorance, but it would be interesting to implement a much more advanced movement system like Helldivers 2 or MGSV, they are very similar in themselves, because it works and is very complete and satisfactory when trying it, but applying here that in The Forever Winter it proposes different things, this movement system could be applied differently, while in the others they will feel in combat since in the 2 games we are part of a special unit combat, while In The Forever Winter it could be applied differently in the sense that it is functional, but not so much at the same level as an elite soldier, we are scavengers, some civilians who barely know about weapons, others deserters from the super nations, I don't know, it's What came to mind would be interesting, but I don't know how it could be implemented. Anyways, you made a good video dude.
W video. I absolutely love the art of this game man. I love the game. Bugs aside, it's just hard to keep playing it everyday. Same quests over and over. I do feel progression in the characters, just feel like the chore of doing the same thing kinda gets boring.
Well said,
I must agree with the maps part. Swamp is a beautiful location with a lot of things to see and do, while some others have a few short falls.
Scorched Enclave, while limited has its scope justified by its status as a beginner friendly, starting map. And does a very good job at it. On the other hand, while I really like Scrapyard Nexus, I must admit that it is a very limited map with not much to do there. One way to go, one way to leave and predictable path to take. It does have a variety of spawn situations which you can encounter but otherwise would benefit from an expansion. Perhaps clearance of some rubble to reveal new paths.
I have no idea if it would even be able to be implemented, but could the use of water be linked to saving game progress? Kinda like ink ribbons in Resident Evil. Just a thought.
Possibly, its a problem with many solutions
i was thinking like a resource to specifically expand the innards or fund expeditions, or something, but save file is very interesting, though i struggle to imagine the implementation. maybe tying water directly to the hired help and varying levels of efficacy based on the amount invested, but always a risk for failure. the water mechanic hasn't irritated me wholly yet, but i'm only 4 days into the game, so i'm sure it's coming. still, the game's really neat. i really like that TFW and witchfire are making extraction based games viable for single player.
90% of the attachements don't do anything to the guns? They change stability or accuracy by 0.1?
went back to mausoleum, there is actually some sounds ambiance but its super low, they should improve on it and add visuals like the aa gun firing, stuff in the skybox etc to make the places more lively like when we get the city maps, if we can get on rooftop, we see a carrier and big green fighting each other far away off map, even if its just preset animation or something. Additionally: more interior places in those large maps. we see it with frozen swamp thief base etc, it adds a lot. and more verticality in map, places you can only reach with certain equipment like the pneumatic jump
What, according to you, would be a good solution to use the water token to have that "life is hard" feeling?
I highlight this in a feedback section on the discord, which I'll provide a link at the bottom of this comment for people who want to take a look (though its in a section where you need to verify ownership of the game).
In essence, the first thing that needs to be done is it needs to take time out of the equation as I mention in the video, then you can balance how scarce water is by making it more about survival, optimization or the choices you make in game.
Personally, I'd have water consumption be quite low in the early game, but as you progress through the game, unlock new traders, new gear and upgrades your Innards consume more water, but these ugprades also help you in pursuit of it.
If you're familiar with city builders this is actually a pretty common gameplay loop, with progression driving the needs for resources, and acquiring these resources more optimally require more progression, they essentially feed into each other and always make you feel like you're teetering on the edge.
discord.com/channels/1204839019502903407/1321888619744591964/1321888619744591964
@@killpo_1 that would actually be a great change
@@killpo_1 Sounds like a good way to keep the "essence" of the water being a necessary resource for survival. I don't play the game (because I am poor) and I did not know that the progress had you upgrade the Innards.
Is each player in their own "universe", or do all the players kinda share a virtual commons accross the game (let's say like HellDivers) ?
I myself enjoy the Game a lot. Love the Style, the Wasteland (Cyberpunkish) Setting and even the Music adds to the experience in a good way.
I do not really have a set feeling about the Water system... it's... okayish?..
But my only critic is that after a few runs and a few good hauls of loot .. the 'You are not the Guy' feeling gets dulled by the fact that you can mow down tons of enemys (Specialy Bag-Man and his HvyMG). I like a good firefight like the next Bruce Willis don't get me wrong but even the most hardend badass of the Forever Winter should at some point simply be overwhelmed by enemys (And i don't mean the unkillable ones ^^).
Anyways... i look forward to see this gem of a game evolve further into what we all hope to be a great experience for many kinds of players! ^^
Honestly the only ones that WILL be a threat to you are the larger units, such as Tanks, Orgamechs, Exos, medium mechs, helicopters and the good ol GRABBER.
We only end up feeling like we are "THE GUY" is because 90% of our kills are infantry.
Great video as always, you're shaping up to be one of my favourite creators/thinkers. Videogames are multimedial creatures and as such demand either universal men to make them (and make them good) or a team of dudes (and dudettes) with different speciality but a somewhat unified mindset (or a perceptive and charismatic lead dev but that is not the case here it seems). TFW lacks some areas of its brain, so to speak, as of now and I don't think those that are there can compensate for those that are not, the team should look for that quid they lack.
Retitle to Why I Love Frozen Swamp please. Understandably though, it's easily my favorite now. Can't wait for Stairgate.
EM offers that player journey as well but not near FS. Having more interactable traversal mechanics on the swamp is helping a lot.
Whats nice about the "old maps" is the variants that get thrown in the mix. Had two nights back to back. Too many mothers for this scav
Yeah, that water system has had me on the fence for this game for a while, the prospect of losing progress from an offline timer for a pve game was an immediate turn off.
I don't want a Nintendog, i wanna struggle for survival and get supplies where I can.
Great rundown on the current state of the game! Your thoughts on the water system not only really succinctly point out why it is frustrating but also make constructive recommendations on how to actually convey the themes they want. It's so strange because the devs spend a lot of time talking about how the game is unique and different. It is! But then they throw in a mechanic which feels more like something from a mobile game to build FOMO. I don't think it's malicious, I think they just had an awkward idea going in and for some reason refuse to go back to the drawing board with it based on feedback. Hopefully they will listen to well-thought out content creators like you.
I hope in the future maps that the spawns are more randomized and a more chaotic battle
I would love to see more of an emphasis on the "you're not that guy, so trying to be that guy will get you killed" approach, with the caveat that killing people may bring the pain much sooner but there are better rewards for doing so. I love being a sneaky l'il shit and taking my time, but I definitely don't feel pressured if I wipe several squads out to get what I want. I love the feeling of panic trying to escape detection from roaming patrols murdering each other. And I think Frozen Swamp encapsulates that feeling /really well/ (except when the enemies could "see" you through the floor last patch, lol)
Also, would love to see water be a resource than a countdown, or both at once if we're going to be able to have a steady source. It's really easy to get now, so might as well use it for something and have that be a balance to watch out for (base upgrades, advanced weapons purchases costing water, but now have to go scavenge some more to balance the cost)
Would love to see a bit more verticality and pathways added to the other maps (like tunnels underneath the bunkers in Scorched Enclave that may or may not have patrols while you're hiding from tanks or choppers above) to encourage alternate routes (I have my set routes through the old maps already, and except for different patrols now and then I've been able to keep safe and extract when I want, not when I'm forced to by the battles)
I get the whole theme is you're not the main character, but I think the concept actually hurts the game more than it helps.
The lack of any impact on the world makes it very repetitive. Reputation is a practically a useless gameplay feature compared to how hard it is to raise it.
And invincible enemies, while cool to look at, prevents any actual interaction.
I don't really see any way under the current system for them to add any gameplay mechanics beyond what we already have. All they can really add are more enemies, which unless they're troops you'll just avoid. More maps, where you play them like every other map. Or more weapons, which can't be meaningfully better than what we already have.
Why is the backpack so big? I mean is there a purpose? I've just recently started watching gameplay and I haven't gotten info on their purpose. Every video I've seen so far the player has on this giant half empty backpack looking thing like the death stranding backpack without all the packages. Do you attach things to it that help your character or am I missing something and all the videos I've seen so far the players just haven't upgraded their packs?
Their called rigs and the scavengers use them to transport high amounts of loot in a given run wich they need to do because those runs are dangerous and take time to plan according to the lore so they need to be able to take as much stuff as possible
Aside from the poor optimization, the biggest thing holding Forever Winter back for me personally is the predictability of it all.
The ability to “master” a map is something that I feel shouldn’t be possible in a game that wants to prevent you from being “The Guy”, as knowledge over game systems is what allows for mastery over the game.
When I spawn Cemetery on Scorched Enclave I can immediately guess there’s gonna be a Cyborg Spawn when I round the corner and most of the time I’ll be right. I feel like that should never happen. There should never be a time where you can anticipate and/or exploit what’s going to happen in this game. The more unpredictable it is, the better I think it will be. Part of this also has to do with the AI needing to be better and more autonomous. While they do naturally fight one another, they’ll usually just end up patrolling the same route endlessly and never go off to any other part of the map except for some rare cases, with additional enemies spawning only once you reach certain areas in the level. The game should feel like it exists independent of you like the original STALKER games but at the moment it really doesn’t.
The problem is, I don’t know if this is because of UE5 or what, but I feel like the scope that the devs and I want this game to have might be too much to sufficiently optimize well.
Have you ever thought about making a setting guide to show how you get your game to run so smooth?
Yeah I hope they add more weird and high-tech weapons that break the mold.
I dont like invincible units like the grabber and with the AI being janky as of now it just adds to the frustration
Theres good reason why I barely ever went into the nexus map and I literally never went to the under ground cemetary, ever.
Anybody know id they are still going to update the game they been quiet for a month.
Easiest way to balance water mechanic. Real time mode and none. Real time double loot/xp. Non real time no double loot/xp. Just an example.
Would be nice if you could keep some talent as you level prestige, like, when you past prestige 10 you regain your rank 1 talents, past 20 rank 2+1 and so on, with of course possibility to wipe them if you decide to change build.
I really would like to see more enemies, and AI to learn open doors and use all of its weapons (and more killpo lore videos)
as a dev I understand the water system, especially in EA.
as you don't want someone to come back after 4 months and do a quest that was removed or borked due to missing updates in between.
so I assume the water system will change after EA.
I think water should be changed to a currency instead of a time, every time you begin a mission it will cost you & you need to pay it back like a gamble or it’s game over, similar your troops in Xcom. Harder maps can have more loot but cost more to reach.
The guns are a low point for the game, aside from being badly balanced they are half baked in general. Most of them make no sense, why is there an Mpl? Didn’t they stop making those in the 80s? Unless it’s supposed to be in the middle of the Cold War, I don’t think they give a date but it’s unlikely. And all of them are very clean and bland in design when they should be taped together and battered. As well as lacking anything particularly unique or special over just normal bullet shooters.
Attachments like sights should be rare and prone to breaking due to the grit of the environment & have more of an emphasis on hand crafted designs like kitchen knife bayonets & the stuff seen in metro33, bicycle frames, pipe grenade launchers & junk, with quality only found from braving high class enemies. There can be a lot of fun added with endlessly stat climbing loot even if minimal in function. One thing they got right was how aggressive they sound and flash, blinding you with each shot being a expression of discontent at the world.
Always wanted a game that had this kind of vibe, I take it there is plenty of content?
The forever winter is really a one of a kind game with its beautiful art and interesting world but it has a good amount of gameplay and technical problems I hope these will be mostly ironed out near the end of the early access period because dying to a merkava tank that spawns inside of you near the land ship on ashen messa very quickly sucks out the fun of the game
I bought the game based on a few streamers like yourself and the art style. And I gonna be honest. I kinda hate it
The gameplay loop with water and random HKs is just stupid. As someone who can only play games on the weekend I find this gameplay loop to be pretty toxic
I will say, both of your current hates are echoe'd very much by the rest of the community also and I hope the devs would take notice. It might take a bit to get them in a better spot but I think its coming.
Can you do a video on the rat king?
They say that they are going to wipe the game? I dont want to loose my prestige😢
"Like: The Art" Well the game was Inspired by a series of Images and they translated them into this universe. I too love the games Casual Nature, Its simple to get into, hard to master. TECHNICLLY their is a in raid timer, IE the Hunter Killers spawning, But unless its something you Can't KILL is it really an issue? Plus dispite the tag line "your are not that guy", well you can "be that guy" if your smart about what your doing (and ideally have friends). Each map is unique, some more interesting then others. The larger maps certainly take a few runs to fully explore and "map" out in your brain.
The "Water Mechanic" is certainly a strange mechanic, as well as one that is SO misunderstood, actively hurting the games playerbase by turning people off from joining the fun. Cus playing the game myself, Water is JOKE. If anything the REAL Grind in this game is the 100,000s of Credits you need to upgrade your base. Again the Scorched Enclave bunker always tends to have a ton of water in it, or the cargo area behind the Infirmary in the Mech Trenches. Combine natural Water Collection with EASY REPEATABLE QUESTS, you can easily have more water then you know what to do with. The Water Bots are arguably Overkill as it stands, you don't need them less your THAT LAZY.
Id argue the biggest issue with The Forever Winter at the moment is "active" player retention, After all with the Water Mechanic being little more then a AFK timer, you can drop the game for 3 months and still not run out of water. So while the playerbase may be alot bigger then what Steam Charts indicate, their are NOT that many people actually playing at any one time, let alone playing with random people. (although that might just be the Servers not loading the Squads tab? Not sure) Cus iv only had people randomly join me like twice now. And well, More Guns = More Fun.
I do agree the Forever Winter can become king of PVE Extraction Shooters (I only know of 4 and this is one of them), and genra that is left high and dry in favor of PVP.... Much to the Fatigue and Frustration of Gamers as a whole. What was that game a while ago.... Arc Raiders, you have no idea how DEFLATED everyone got when they heard it went PVP, that's how Stale PVP extraction has gotten (or people are just fed up at BAD Extraction Shooters).
I suppose the logical next step would be just More Content? Maps, Enemies, Weapons, Extera. Maybe finally make that message in the corner of the loading screen make sense "If you want to get by, you need to pick a side. Just be smart about it, cus the more 1 faction controls an area the more powerful units they will deploy", Cus right now THAT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING! It also kinda implies currying favor with one faction would have some benefits. So maybe the Faction system is something they could expand upon as well.
I would agree with most of the points you made. I personally really liked the water system, but now that it's been nerfed to the point of having 150+ days of water without ever picking up water, it feels pointless.
I wasn't a big fan of water beforehand, but water is so trivial now Im even less of a fan of it. But I think it hopefully makes it fairly apparent that the both going foward has to detatch consumption from an IRL timer so that it can be balanced to actually feel impactful.
@ I personally did not think there was anything wrong with it's original set up. Yes subjectively, I understand why people didn't like it. However due to quests providing tons of water and being repeatable, even pre-water buff it was not hard to stack up days worth of water with minutes worth of time/effort.
I don't personally think it's the dev's fault if someone buys their game and then doesn't actively play it. I play WoW which requires a monthly subscription to play. If I don't play an entire month without cancelling my sub and they bill me $15, I don't blame them and ask for my money back due to my lack of play. I view the water system very much the same. I personally do not buy games I don't sink hours into. And it's not hard to check the innards once a week to see your time to get into a 5 minute game and walk away with days worth of water (100's of times for your water timer over your time investment).
I think the water system needs a tune-up now AFTER the buff and was fine before. And I personally think the water system was completely blown out of proportion.
the water system is my biggest grip
i have dozens of games competing for my attention, and while i'm no stranger for a daily grind, knowing its mandatory or i loose all my stuff is a massive turn off for me, and i hope they remove it entierly
You dont have to deal with water at all with basic turrets. Was that so difficult to figure out? Sry but you are now officially 'that guy.' Maybe free to play mobile games might be more your jam?
@@operator9858 turrets were not a thing when i first heard about the game. Also i'd wager they are neither free nor cheap
and i refuse to play 'free mobile games' for the same reason. They try to force me into playing daily. I may feel the need to take a month off to do something else, If i come back and find my game is wiped for having the audacity to take a break, its not going to motivate me to start grinding again, its gonna motivate me to uninstall
Love this game, grim adult world where all modern slops lools like fortnite and cod is a bless
I think ammo is way too common and way too weak, I liked the part where they mentioned "just some men and women running in the dark with half empty magazines" I find myself roleplaying as a scavenger when I can semi easily mow down a squad of infantry because im a hobo with a modded ar and 300 rounds of ammo. The only combat i enjoyed was against unarmored enemies like zombie cyborgs and water thieves which take like 3 to 5 shots to take down, most other killable units feel way too tanky.
This game is going to have pvp? Can you make a video about this. Thought this was going to be a pire PvE game. Hope the AI is improved to feel alive.
Incorrect, I mention in the video its stricly a PvE game, and that's a good thing.
There are timers it's called Hunter killers
That's a fair point, since I generally play solo I tend get mostly Europa EODs which are fairly trivial. I can't imagine the super weird quirky nature of picking up a few pictures or data caches causing hell to rain down on you is here to stay.
@@killpo_1 Reminds me of my first HK in ashen Mesa i got a medium mech hunter and that bastard was tall enough to just fire at me when ever it wanted it was brutal.
@@killpo_1Europan EODs? You got lucky for some reason if I ever pick up a data cache euruska decides that’s the perfect time to deploy a doggo
I also think water is to easy to come buy...... it should be rare and if you have something in your pack and you see a water barrel the game should make you think twice about what is important..... water should be as rare as the loot boxes...... my opinion.
A mechanic that punished people for not playing regularly by wiping their progress sounds insane and unbelievably stupid. It's dumb enough make me not want to play the game. Ever.
Ok this review seems legit
Anyone know roughly how long until full release or potential console release? This game makes me mad I don't have a pc :(
Dead game. Artists not devs.
They just need to integrate some specialists in the team, one step at a time.
for the art point, the thing that bother me the most are the character faces.
The whole game has hyper realistic graphics and high detail models for everything. Yet the character are in a charicatural drawn style that feels out of place and missmatched with the rest of the game graphics.
Furthermore i think they are really disgusting looking, like the noodle beard, overexagerated facial traits and everything. They should go for a realistic style of character, that would enhance the human suffering and inhumanity of the war and match with the current aesthetic of the game.
I never got that, I think maybe they wanted everyone to look like plastic figurines kids use to play war but only the player is unmasked and looks uncanny while the rest are normal looking grunts when it should be the opposite
i dont see any update they make as set in stone, these devs are learning with each new release and the community is vocal as hell and intereactive with the development, finding bugs feedback etc. I think even early access we are playing a concept more than a game. and sure it could be coping with an unifinished product but I have no problem with them taking as much time as they need to make the game feel just as loved and close to their art as they seek. if they remake an entire map go for it. water system whatever. as soon as they get the gameplay and ai down we will be laughing we just gotta give them the time they need and not pressure too hard and alot of the regufees from shooters are the ones being pissed a the state of the game because they didnt taper their expectations, or did no research into the game. and I will always stay constructive because I took the ride i made the choice hell I bought it after it was on sale because i waited to long and zero regrets, its something new its something special and it takes time to be polished.
It sucks this game turned out to be a hunk of shit