I'm really liking Jack's focus on getting cheaper, simpler. and less powerful EVs over the last couple episodes. All I want is an electric car that gets me where I need to go, not a luxury palace with a 5 second or less 0-60.
Exactly. Car makers cram in so much electric powered gadgets... I'd even be fine with hand crank windows... just give me the basics, I'm not living in my car... just driving my five miles to work!
A full conversion kit is exactly what I want, it feels like SUCH a waste to get rid of my old car, plus modern EVs are putting more and more stuff in them that I don't like and find excessive.
Trouble is you can never really know if a pop welded monocoque body would hold together with the stresses caused by the weight of batteries and then passengers. The only "toughened" parts of the mini were the engine bearers and the sub frames. Might be a project for a skilled engineer but perhaps not a keen amateur with basic welding 101.
@@t1n4444 According to this video the car weighs a hair over stock, so (at least in this case) the weight shouldn't be a problem. That said it may be that the kit for whatever model is being retrofitted in the future might include some strengthening bits.
@@KineticLatency Hmm, the mention of "strengthening" implies the body or shell isn't "strong" enough to cope. If you consider the first minis were designed for the "A" series engines and the suspension consisted of rubber donuts then the weight distribution could be quite different post conversion. As before, a project best completed by an engineer and not a hobbyist. Now, that said, if we see hydrogen fuel cells designed for smaller cars and can be engineered into old cars then who knows?
Did that include the car price, or just the retrofit pieces? IN the US, the Mini starts at $30kUSD, so $10kUSD would be reasonable. If they want more than the price of the original car to retrofit their kit, they can KMA.
3:06 Jack standing in front of that Mini compared with the cars he usually stands in front of really shows how stupendously huge modern cars have become.
I thought the same.It's almost like he's standing in front of a toy car but it's because we have got used to SUV nonsense until we were brainwashed into it feeling like the norm.
@@jamiefox54 it’s not just that, it’s all the safety in modern cars too - these days we fully expect to survive a head on collision. In the days of the mini, you were lucky if you spent a few days in hospital before you slipped away, it meant you had time to say goodbye.
Large and Heavy is a function of the crash standards modern cars meet. The same crash that people will walk away from with a few bruises in that Polestar, are instant fatalities in the classc Mini.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes I think the idea that large and heavy equals safe is largely a red herring. Look at the huge high-speed collisions F1 drivers walk away from. Yes you probably need something larger than a Mini to meet modern safety standards, but there's absolutely no need for the enormous lorries that folk are driving around in today.
@@davidf2281 Never heard Engineering and Crash Survival Standards called a "Red Herring" before. That sounds like the same logic as 'safer being thrown from a rolling car then wearing seat belts'.
Please re-do this video every few years with updates! The more I think about it, the more obvious it is to me that this is the way to go for mass transition. New cars are such a colossal waste of resources. We need a parts economy, just like people have been fighting for with regards to cell phone repair.
It should be EVERY year. this topic should be brought to people's mind more often also by other media channels. As @Chrisd__ points out Jack even mentioned in this video that they already did it last year. 4 months to go for the next one. 👍
The drive system is the car. There probably wont be a day where its cheaper than just buying another one. Especially if battery tech can cut the price of the battery in half. If that happens, the cars will be much more affordable in the first place.
40000€ for a 50 year old Mini...which itself costs several thousand even with a blown motor. Seems a rather silly and non sustainable solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
Four years ago I was quoted £20K for my MX5 to be EV converted. Instead this year I brought a two year old Zoe, with super low mileage for £16K. Price is key. A conversion is always going to be a compromise and price wise be competing with second hand EVs which are available at very competitive prices now.
remember when companies were making digital sensors on a cartridge to fit in a 35mm film camera? No? Never caught on as technology rapidly developed and the compromises to great. Except for classic cars, cant see this really happening....
£28k for 100 mile range? - Not exactly tempting unfortunately and as Bak mentions Zoes are just great and at 16k and hopefully soon, less, v tempting I lease the Gt135 and love it, u can hustle it down back roads probably better than a tweaked Cooper S - always out dragging the ICE out of every corner They also handle torque distribution brilliantly - u can powerslide the front without inside wheelspin :) Retro EV conversions for classics need to be less than 1/2 price to appeal to the masses - If I had my 916 GTV TS EV converted I would want 250 ml range, 0-60 in 7 secs or less and VNE of 90 min - @ cheaper than a used Zoe - I would still think twice at £12k Drive in, collect within 72 hrs for sub £10k would be mass market - I appreciate it cant be done now and possibly not within several yrs, but thats how I judge it for the average guy with a sub £5k used classic A universal BYD retro fit kit for $10k would be a winner :)
@@mattsword41 Ughhh.... not comparable at all. Film thickness digital sensors are technologically just impossible. EV conversion is not only immenently doable, but people were doing it by themselves using homemade parts 30 years ago. But those conversions where not safe do to, sometimes not safe to drive, and often very impractical... back then the motors available were not rated for continuous load and would burn up very frequently. The lead acid batteries available were bulky and heavy. And the control electronics primative or completely DIY. Todays conversion shops have access to the same or similar quality parts as what actually goes into commercial EVs. But it comes with a pricetag.
@@davidstuart4915 The history of technology is always the same. The capability goes way up and the price goes way down. To expect ultra low prices at the beginning of a new technology is unrealistic. I am currently writing this on an 8gb Raspberry Pi single board computer which is the size of a cigarette packet, costs £80 in this version (prices start at £35) and has more capability than the most expensive desktop computer you could buy 20 years ago. It can also emulate all of the most expensive consoles you could get 20 years ago. For a monitor I'm using a 42" Plasma TV that I bought 18 years ago for £1500 and weighs 40kg. My newest TV is a 55" LED with full 3D capabilities that cost £500 and weighs 16kg. From Desktop PCs to Raspberry Pis and from Plasma TVs to LED TVs the technology has become leagues better and way cheaper. That will happen with EV Conversions just the same as it has with every other technology.
Why a 70kw motor in a Mini? Way too overpowered, 40kw would be plenty. Also the cost is prohibitive, £40k plus the cost of the donor car. You could buy a new Mini electric, Fiat 500 even the Honda e and an ice powered Mini for less. I am lucky enough to have owned a few original Mini’s in the past, they were fabulous drivers cars brilliant for tight and twisty B roads and lanes, but not exactly comfortable by todays standards.
"Buzz bar" would be a good name for it (given the electrical shock risk), but it's actually a 'busbar'. (Busbar being a contraction of "omnibus bar" -- the bar which everything goes through.)
@@markthomasson5077 yup, it's a bus bar. The rubber is primarily for electrical insulation, not durability. Also I have never heard anyone use the word "componentry" before today. Why not just say components?
@@weeeeehhhhh Yup. It's a little hilarious he used that component as an example of something made pretty because they're "doing it nicely" but can be made cheaper (subtext: without the pretty coating) later.
I do wish their was a big push for this, in a way of seeing as a performance enhancing kit, I feel like that would get a lot more people on board. Making hybrids and full electric.
Why even bother with a DIY hybrid? Once you have the battery, the motors, the high voltage electronics, the software etc, why add the complexity of figuring out how to blend it with a gas engine?
@@patreekotime4578 If you're thinking of the EV component as a way to get more economy, yeah, that's a waste on a classic car. But if you treat it as a power adder, like a supercharger with bypass and clutch, or a large bottle of Nitrous, then it makes sense. Could probably use the front output shaft of a 4WD transfer case as an input from an add on electric motor to drive the rear wheels.
What the Fellten chap says at the end is key: we essentially have 5 years or so to roll this out across the country if it should make any noticeable difference before people will just buy a new EV instead, so that means every MOT garage you see in your neighborhood should be able to order an off the shelf conversion kit for the respective model and re-do a combustion engine into an EV. Possible? Maybe, but it would need a serious government and all hands on deck approach.
I love ev conversions and have one of my own, but I think it will largely be an enthusiast thing. Cost and labor are big, but there's also safety. I love the style and fun of older cars, but when it comes to daily driving and thinking about the safety of myself and my loved ones, I gotta admit that modern cars are much more likely to protect the occupants. And that's a huge factor. Plus, the cars that are best for converting are older pre computerizing of everything, which also means less safety features. Once you get to a newer car with more safety stuff, you have a lot more work to do as far as interfacing with software expecting an ICE engine and all the sensors involved with it. Which is why we talk about converting old Minis and Land Rovers, but not, say, a 2017 Sienna.
Do you think it could be done for newer cars if we bypasses the electronic gizmos? obviously would mean losing safety features, but if you could retrofit other parts into the build?
Sure, absolutely. Anyone driving modern speeds in this Mini is absolutely crazy. I would use this one to show off occasionnally, and at most as a "city" car that tops at 40-ish km/h in dense areas, maybe 60-65 max (15-20kmh less than the limit) in the countryside. I'm not going on a highway with this.
Hi, I can see more conversions going on as the scrap nos of EV’s increase. Using a donor vehicle as the supply of your parts makes sense. Expect to see more Leaf based kits in the future, along with Tesla components, if not whole parts. Was thinking of a Freelander 2 one but white van man pulled out. Take care M.
@@em-jd4do *Crackling of 78rpm record* *Opening bars of 紀元ニ千六百年* I used to have a hillclimb mini I'd regularly take to 70(ish) across Cambridgeshire. I wish I still had it, was a hoot.
It's quite a sight, seeing Jack fitted into the Mini with his legs still bolted on, and even so his head isn't up against the ceiling...and then him standing outside it and wondering just where _did_ the stick go? Because you know it was needed.
Nicely put together video. It's much more environmentally friendly to convert an existing ICE vehicle into a BEV. Unfortunately it's not easy, and the newer the doner, the harder it becomes. After about 2000, more cars used CAN data buses to allow various modules to communicate. Removing the ICE and it's ECM causes all sorts of issues with data buses, giving warnings, codes and sometimes complete failure of other modules in the vehicle. This is the challenge to overcome, which will take many hours of diagnostics by some very smart technicians. I've been involved with converting an old Freelander 1 from diesel to electric, using salvaged parts from other damaged BEV vehicles, and that's not gone to bad, mainly because the Freelander 1 systems are older and able to function as stand alone units, so the brakes still have ABS, and the speedometer still functions. I'd like to do a similar conversion on my Freelander 2, but alas the electronics in that vehicle would pretty much prevent a BEV conversion at this time.
Would it need custom control modules? Is there such a thing? There has to be a scene building up for that. Since manufacturers lock everything down, the only way would be to go open source on the control units.
@@t1n4444 depends on the country I guess. If you convert a car to EV, you'd have to have it approved as a one-off build, the same as if you nailed it together from Lego and 2x4s. 😁 So I honestly don't know if they check the modules for software, since whatever you'll put in there has nothing to do with the original car anymore.
With newer cars, I would expect there to be all sorts of software locks designed to prevent tampering without approval of the manufacturer. To get around them, I would not be surprised if you ended up needing to rip out and replace almost everything electronic in the car - even components like the radio and infotainment screen which have nothing to do with the combustion engine. The need to do this would, of course, drive up the price of the conversion.
In the early 80's, I sold personal computers for around £4000 per unit. The same PC with far greater ability is now £400 or even less. If you requested a custom PC to fit into a retro case, that would inevitably cost more. Thanks for the video and can we see the outtakes of you being eased into the Mini? 😊
Hardly a matching analogy. A car is a mobile cabin, the value is that the cabin can move and take you somewhere in some comfort. The systems behind the motion are a significant part but still there is the cabin and the comfort it provides - this is the value that is retained by a good condition old car to be converted (without even mentioning the nostalgia). The chassis of a PC is of little value even when new, it is just a structure to contain the real value - the compute resources, which at the pace of development in PCs becomes less value much faster than do any particular car, though you can change the PC internals and keep the same case quite often - I certainly did - as long as the standard the chassis design followed is still current for the components.
Why would it cost more? You are using the same motherboard, power supply, wiring and components as the current generation. the only old part is the housing3 I know this because I have a core I 5 and a Core I 10 in cases that originally had Pentium 1 and 3's With EV's the real problem is the battery cost and lack of energy density To get an EV with any useful range (sub 100 miles is a joke) you need 700-1,200lb in batteries which doubles the weight of a mini which started out at 1,275lbs.
Hey Jack, Fully Charged team, you should montage a number of "Jack standing next to a car" shots with the ones next to the Mini, to really bring home the message, how big current cars have become!😉 Oh and I would love to see the video footage of Jack folding into the Mini🤭
I've been watching Fellten from the very first video they made on RUclips when they converted a very yellow Mazda MX5. Glad to them here on Fully Charged well done Jack good to see you,re looking further a field than just those big SUV's. At 6' 2" I too can fit in a mini, without the stick and gel though, and it was just like driving a go cart great fun, loved it.
I'd love to convert my classic Mini. I drive it every day all year round and it's a cracking little run around but the petrol engine with the carb does need some work to keep running in tip-top condition. The amount of maintenance that would be removed just by converting it would be massive and would make such quality-of-ownership difference. I don't know realistically how cheap they could go but if they could get them even down to £10-15k I'd jump at the chance.
In the same vein of retrofitting, I have always had an idea that I could just put a Tesla axle on the rear axle of my 09' FWD CR-V and have the controller and the battery fit to the boot, where there's plenty of storage space, and then use something like a thumb throttle leaver or something a like, electric bikes use to engage the battery powered axle. That way I can drive EV when I want to or drive petrol for longer distances. Same concept of a plug-in hybrid but in this case retrofitting an older vehicle to run on either or, instead of in conjunction with each other.
yes mee too😊 but in DK i'm dont see that happening anytime soon 🤬 we are unfortunately not allowed to do that, not without paying a big amount of taxes
It's going to take a while for EV conversions to be anywhere near a new car in terms of dollars spent per horsepower or kwh of range. ( I should know, I'm doing one, $25000 for just the EV parts, and even then it's just 100 miles of range but 650hp) If you're doing this, it's as a passion project and for fun, or you absolutely adore a specific car and want to make it the ultimate daily driver
I have a 31 year old vehicle (not a MINI) that suits me well and is so much fun to drive and I have looked into the idea of retrofitting it to be full electric. The cost estimates I have received so far have been very prohibitive but if it can become reasonable in the next 5 years, then I will do it since I have already had the rusted out metal replaced with new steel.
Great video, I love this kind of stuff. I'd love to see you follow up and see them install this. FYI, a busbar is an electrical conductor, I imagine they're using them on the battery packs somewhere. The rubber coating is the insulator.
Would love to convert my 70s vw camper but some way to go before it's affordable for me. Wish the wheel hub motor gave a hybrid option, or some of the promised drop in/ 'shoebox' range extender motors meant smaller battery packs were more realistic helping to cut costs. Fingers crossed.
I think they should do kits for buses, lorry's, bin lorry's, the types of vehicles that have about a 30 year life expectancy but also are used everyday. Because the saving in fuel costs would easily offset the cost of the kit. And the people who own buses, lorry's and bin lorry's are massively interested in saving money, show them a spread sheet and they will instantly buy these kits, they don't worry about anything else except fuel costs, maintainence costs.
Agree. Check out sea-electric in Australia. They are doing a lot of work on commercial vehicles and have a AU$1 billion contract to electrify 8500 Toyota Hiluxes and Landcruisers for the mining industry.
That is the exact reason Musk quoted in the Tesla Semi release event - the savings to the eco-system of reduced commercial vehicle emissions is massive. It's something like 5% of all vehicles, and 20% of all emissions. Plus on top, commecial vehicles often park at warehouse type buildings, add a solar powered recharging station to those, and every time the truck/bus/etc is parked, it can be recharging - some companies could easliy have a fleet of delivery vehicles that effectively cost nothing to run outside of tyres, insurance, registration, suspension mainteance and a replacement battery every ten years - get the cost of the battery down to the price of replacing or rebuilding a truck or bus motor, and companies would be throwing money at the conversions folks.
Great video. And fantastic to see a local company making things too, yes it's expensive for now but hopefully the costs will come down. If the UK govt would support it like the French do with subsidies then it could be like transition one.
Fascinating. I wish HMG would boost these companies rather than big oil. (we know why) it is not a total solution but certainly fills a sector of the car ownership. Minis (original) were Superb. I think Issigonis would love this.He would lead the EV world, Simpler,Cheaper,Faster and more space!
LOVE what they're doing here! It may not be the best in terms of range yet, better batteries/more efficient motors will make this better as time goes by.
This seems like the most sensible thing. Please keep actively updating on this. I feel like if we want to be genuine about emissions and impact, this answer makes the most sense, and is the best looking! Classic cars are so beautiful!
I really want to do an EV conversion on my '86 Fiero. We'll see how expensive that is when I get ready to drop a powertrain in (gotta restore some of the frame first, and I'll probably work on some body panels and what not too)
You want to do it yourself, like we all do with our classics, same as swapping a transmission or adding a turbo, a lot of the enjoyment comes from putting it together in your own garage.... but all these kits seems to be 'Only fitted by authorised,...', same BS as 'Ony Dealer Serviced for Warranty Conditions'.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes Don't forget you'd have to satisfy the DoT (in UK) and your insurer as to a converted vehicle's structural integrity etc, etc. After all it's the insurer that carries the risk. It might be useful to contact your insurer (any insurer) in advance to determine if you could get cover ... and what certification is required prior to acquiring insurance cover. Far too many "starry eyed enthusiasts" are blissfully unaware of the legalities of the situation. Not to mention quite a few lack the engineering skills and facilities required.
Adding weight inside the wheel (unsprung mass) is bad for handling and worse for ride. Drive packs that feet in to exsisting Differentials or Drive Trains is a better solution for anything larger then a Mo-ped.
I so want the Transition One thing to happen. Modern small cars last a lot longer than classic minis for sure and they would be massively economic to convert. I hope Feltten can do a similar kit
Absolutely, but I'd like to see them switch from a motor bolted to an existing gearbox to hub motors. This way you free up a lot of under-bonnet space for batteries, so that you could have a half decent range. Currently the range of a transition one vehicle is very low.
I used to think that too. However, with hub motors you add a lot of unsprung mass, which makes the car more uncomfortable to drive and is very bad for suspension in general. Additionally most folks don't like how they look...
@@antontaylor4530 Hub Motos are good for lightweight bikes, they're not good for cars. Too much "Un-Sprung Mass" negatively affects the handling and ride - that's why Ally Wheels are prefered over Steel. A motor and gearbox that can bolt in under the floor, directly coupled to the Differential of a rear wheel drive, with the battery pack up front to mimic the mass of an engine and transmission, is ideal for a lot of vehicles, from small two-doors up to giant Pick-ups. Front Wheel Drive is easier to drop in an all-in-one replacement like shown here, with an extra battery where they fuel tank used to be. What's missing, is a long-range set-up for Mini Vans and Pick-Ups, where the large unused spaces under the rear floor could have extra batteries added.
@@antontaylor4530 For simplicity some converters use the existing gearbox, but the one in this video eliminates it. On many classics the original driveshafts and diffs can't handle the EV torque, so if you are going to replace those anyway, might as well ditch the entire transmission and either place the electric motor in the transmission tunnel, or get rid of the entire drive line and mount the motor in the rear going striaght to the half-shafts.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes There are a couple of EV manufacturers (such as Lightyear and Protean) using them already, and the unsprung mass problem turned out to be much less of an issue than people thought. These aren't race cars. It's not as critical as it would be in a racing car, suspension technology is advanced enough that the problem isn't insurmountable.
I think the price can come down massively when a company doesn't do them bespoke to order, but brings in cars does conversions on mass to be sold at their car show rooms. That will reduce the cost massively and be a great growth market in the future.
I have a 1976 Mazda 121 that I would love to give the EV treatment. The drivetrain can wait until I have restored the body though, so there is time for more development
I think there's a real future for retrofitting of commercial vehicles. Transits and Vivaros that don't do a lot of range - which is a lot of them, such as tradesmen in London. Lots of room under the floor for a battery pack, and you've got a long vehicle sales lifespan (Mk 1 Vivaro was 12 years of the same model). Not for everyone, but that's what I'd be looking at for a business - particularly with a Vivaro needing a new gearbox every few years, and people generally chucking £5k at if if you buy and fit new at a main dealer.
I would absolutely love something like this for our 2011 Astra. Engine in that was absolutely abused by the previous owner so it's misfiring like an absolute beater, but it _looks_ gorgeous inside and out. So to convert that into an EV would be glorious.
I’m surprised that there aren’t companies producing prefabricated conversion kits to turn conventional vehicles to electric. Seems like it would bring the cost down considerably.
I know they did this to the mini, but I for some reason want this done for me with a mid-90s Buick Le Sabre. The inside is pretty comfortable actually so I think it would be kind of nice.
I would love to convert my fourteen year old Peugeot 4007 to electric. It is in superb condition, very comfortable and perfect for my needs. I have had the car for twelve years and have no intention to replace it. I have looked around and not found anything on the market that is as good.
Nice mini, I would have wanted to lose the rear seats and put more batteries there to increase range but such a conversion is something I would really like to do. Having a generalised kit available would make that so much easier to do. In terms of such kits, I feel it would be for the best if the kit is based on the cars weight and come without batteries so that such things could be tailored to the individual vehicle. Unfortunately the prices mentioned in the video are either the same or more than what you would spend on a new EV (which I really can't see myself being able to afford).
Well, adding more of the most expensive element is not going to help with the cost issue. Lithium will get cheaper eventually, but I wouldn't bet on it within 2 years.
@@concinnus well I doubt it. If the demand is high, the price goes up. And demand, thanks to EU and other maniacs will skyrocket in next 12 years. Later, after 2035 it will be only worse.
Really enyoyed this. I know this channel is focused on fully electric, but I have always wondered why no one seems to offer an aftermarket hybrid conversion kit. Say, I own a 2012 Elantra, couldn't they find a why to electrify the rear wheels and get the car to spend a lot less fuel in city driving or accelerating?
Curious to understand the bureaucracy too - I was under the impression that in the UK you’d need an IVA since the engine/gearbox is a big chunk of the original car. Then the insurance would be a minefield too no doubt?
@@Umski insurance is a pain, only really 1 or 2 options. Its all based on points system, stay within the allowed points and IVA not required. I use original gearbox and so they view it as engine swap. Some videos and overview on my RUclips channel
The Chinese have been churning out the Wuling mini EV and other similarly sized EV cars. The Wuling is practically the same size as the classic Mini Coopers. That's just proof that small compact EVs have a market.
Great video. The myriads of people converting gas/petrol cars to electric for the past few decades paved the way for the production electric car. Elon Musk was inspired by seeing conversions racing. For many years, converting was the only way to have an electric car. A culture of DIY converters and conversion shops evolved, and it was not so much a hobby for the rich, as an environmentalist movement. In the U.S., the Electric Vehicle Association was originally built around conversions, and people are still doing it. A visit to your local chapter meeting might reveal some interesting conversion projects.
A lot of people are also sentimental to their beloved cars, so such conversions are the best option to go electric and breathe new life to an old flame. 🔥👌
I'm 6'5" and my first car was a classic mini. Ridiculously fun car. Shame about the awful brakes and flimsy bodywork. But it's amazing how much you can get in one!
The issue is classic cars are not cheap and getting dearer, a Mini in a usable condition, a Capri or Cortina MK3 GT (these are what I want) will set you back a pocket destroying amount before even thinking of buying an EV kit.
I would 'really' like to convert my VW Scirocco 2014 keeping everything as it is (with the exception of an auto gear selector). You would have thought doing this would be much cheaper than buying new now not in 5-10yrs time.
I feel that as a main stream mean to help transitioning to EVs, converting ICE car into EVs is probably already dead or will remain limited to specific cases. Within the next 5 years, what will happen is that the EV 2nd hand market is going to increase even more and there won’t be any logic/financial interest to convert an ICE car to EV.
@@wiegraf9009good thing I'm learning to drive (and gonna smash it) and getting a classic for my first car. Doing this in 6 years could be really cool and it'd be interesting when everything around is electric anyway
At Fully Charged live in Austin in 2020, there were a few conversions including a 280Z that cost about $70,000 to convert. In a little over three years, it seems the price has come down a bit. I'm very encouraged that conversions will be a thing.
@@Jerra3007 yes, very true. However (if you are intending to keep the car as a classic collectible) I still think they will become far more valuable if they still have their original ICE engines…
@@philtucker1224 potentially, system like the Fellten one do not cut or drill anything and the original engine is kept on its caddle in the wooden box the electric drivetrain came in (y)
Yes, if there’s not, there should be standard kits for many old cars like the mini. There are lots of these old cars that people want to keep and are technically sound. Think of many older model Volvo, BMW, Citroën, Volkswagen etc. However, the price of the kits should under €15.000. There are millions of these cars around and it would be better for the environment, planet, jobs etc., if these cars were not destroyed but converted.😎
As the owner of 98 Cooper this video was brilliant to watch. Was left wondering what the charge time was like and the top speed relative to that weight lost. However I'd love to know if there is a option to have a gear type selection? Half the fun of a Mini is quick shifting up through the four gears, I think I'd miss that if I couldn't replace it with something.
I wish the government would put incentives to this sort of work. I saw a really great looking 1970's Cadillac just yesterday... how great would that be as electric. Also, here in my area there is a big problem with people stealing catalytic converters off of cars... those are not cheap to replace (from what I hear)... how great would it be for them to just convert over. Those are often work vans that really don't need a lot of range anyway as they just drive to a local work spot and spend a good portion of their day in one locale. But I'm thinking this is going to have to come more to the Transition One price point to help the folks who really cannot afford a newer car.
@@philtucker1224 Those things are a bit heavy... if folks start doing that I'm sure you'll hear stories of thief trapped under car battery having to be rescued and then jailed.
Electric Classic Cars headed by Richard Morgan (an old friend of Fully Charged) do kits for classic car conversions tailored to specific models. They sell them on to approved fitters who can then pop them in to a fossil car in exactly the same manner as with Fellten. Everything is ready to go. It's not much more complicated than building a radio controlled car kit. That's why it can take as little as ten hours to complete a conversion if the donor car is in good condition. There are a number of companies doing this and it will become an expanding trend.
@@t1n4444 Exactly! We are a long long way off affordable conversions. Don't get me wrong I love these things. If you really want a classic and have loads of money then this is great ... otherwise just spend the same on an existing EV and get twice the range, comfort, performance and crucially safety. (Unfortunately an original Mini can only drive on our roads because it doesn't have to meet the latest crash test regulations for new cars. All other cars were much smaller on the roads back in the day ... don't try crashing into a hefty modern SUV in an old Mini.)
Magnificient episode! Loving this recent new content you guys have been producing, and people we are are 2000 subscribers away from 1 million, these guys truly deserve a sub!
I used to have a VW bus, 69, red w/ white top. Loved it, best camping vehicle ever. It would be nice to have an electric 69. Ok, so the id Buzz is coming out, but all I really want is my old 69 back, fully EV, lots of range, no infotainment screen, no useless gadgets. Maybe a good stereo system, and disc brakes that’s all. All pretty much attainable, except the 400+ miles of range, that would cost.
The software side will also be wanted I think. It is overlooked at the moment but will probs become pretty standard, I.e. the fusion of gps, drive assist and software control of things like climate, seat position, music etc.
I’d go for a Jeep conversion with a 200 mile range! Brilliant show! Conversions will be big. People love old cars, even though the engines on a lot of those cars just weren’t that great in the first place.
Do you have a system to give a linear acceleration rate that can tame accelerator control to a "regular town driving" acceleration so that planting the accelerator will not result in rapid acceleration. Kind of mimicing a sporty but not overpowering original mini power output?
I really want to electrify my 2006 Toyota Land Cruiser 100. It would be really interesting to see, what that would cost and the amount of range you could get out of it. I imagine it would actually be quite well suited for the task because of the enormous amount of underfloor room (where the tank was and spare wheel) and also in the gear tunnel and under the hood.
The biggest issue is the availability of charging stations with high charge rates and batteries that can be charged an awful lot quicker than the current ones. To be blunt, unless you only need a car for short journeys that you can charge at home over night I would give ev's a miss for the next ten years. Although by then most people will not be able or allowed to own a vehicle I expect.
I have an 87 Suzuki hatch... it's got Mustang suspension now, was thinking of squeezing in a V8 with a lot of cutting, but thinking it needs a silly EV swap. It just needs a loud engine to cover the road noise.
About 12 years ago I was toying with the idea of getting another mk3 Capri, and EVing it into something pretty fun, while retaining the retro cool factor. I priced up what I'd need to buy to get 300hp and around a 150 mile range, then realised that it was a pipe dream when the total quickly got north of £40k (Without the car's purchase cost !). On top of that there was all the questions about how the hell do you go about getting the thing re registered as an EV in a way that would allow you to get all the benefits of EV ownership (Like CAZ exemption, etc), and what would the insurance company do when confronted with working out a quote for it (Best guess was that they'd look at whatever premium their computer spat out for £50k of highly modified, petrol Capri, then treble it !)? In the end, I just gave up and bought a diesel golf (Like the government were busy encouraging people to do back then) and gave up on the classic EV idea.
This is the idea I have been looking for! A Cheap kit to convert my 2001 Nissan (Europe) Pulsar Hatch 1.8 with 92KW. Would Love a significant upgrade in Power to say 150-200KW would be a rocket for me. Thanks you Jack, All the best from Australia.
Thank you. This is a subject that should have its own slot on your program. True classic car Gear Heads will go to no ends to take on a project, as long as the wrenches are spinning and my Fluke meter still works I'm in my happy space. Electrify an old air cooled Corvair or a Granada Estate bring them all on.
my model car had an option for 4wd, mine doesnt have it, however I have considered repurposing the rear driveshaft/differential to make it into a manner of hybrid vehicle, namely regen braking.
As auto manufacturers are facing up to the inevitability of having to go electric, well most of them anyway, I'm wondering if they will come to see the continuing need to support ICE componentry as something of an expensive pain in the bum, ten to fifteen or even twenty years from now as their fleeting manufacturing finally, becomes fully EV. Might they simply decide to design conversion kits for their most popular models and use (this) as a direct revenue stream replacement model that ICE parts and servicing currently occupies? P.S. The look of sheer enjoyment on Jack's face was priceless.😅
I remember researching EV conversion projects a decade ago. Back then converters used lead acid batteries, and only a handful of proper motors were available... with many DIY conversions using motors out of clothes dryers which had very short lives under continuous load. Control electronics were primative and some DIYers had VERY primative solutions... I remember a guy with an electric Mustang drag racer that just used a giant copper bar as a knife switch mounted between the seats.... which he had to replace everytime he drove it because it would melt itself. Terrifying. My point is that not a small amount of the cost of these conversions is in the safety and engineering and knowhow to do them safely.
I love the idea and have been following them on/off for years. In reality, if there were incentives out there the main manufacturers will be the ones pioneering this IMHO. They have the designs already, they just need a team to make the brackets for a universal battery pack. Manufacturers already repurpose their chassis and designs over the generations and not afraid to reuse the designs to make new ones.
Jack, you are my favorite. Always making me laugh. Love the show. Keep up the great work. I WISH the U.S. could be as enthusiastic about smaller, affordable electric vehicles. I don't need 1000 miles or even 300 miles, just affordable with highway speeds for occasional longer trips.
I'm really liking Jack's focus on getting cheaper, simpler. and less powerful EVs over the last couple episodes. All I want is an electric car that gets me where I need to go, not a luxury palace with a 5 second or less 0-60.
Exactly. Car makers cram in so much electric powered gadgets... I'd even be fine with hand crank windows... just give me the basics, I'm not living in my car... just driving my five miles to work!
Unfortunately this is not it.
Me too. I’d love to do this to my car.
fully agreed.
@@chrisbailey1966 still a lot of fun though. And as explained, this is new tech in R&D. Big up to the men in tweed for funding it!
A full conversion kit is exactly what I want, it feels like SUCH a waste to get rid of my old car, plus modern EVs are putting more and more stuff in them that I don't like and find excessive.
Trouble is you can never really know if a pop welded monocoque body would hold together with the stresses caused by the weight of batteries and then passengers. The only "toughened" parts of the mini were the engine bearers and the sub frames.
Might be a project for a skilled engineer but perhaps not a keen amateur with basic welding 101.
@@t1n4444 According to this video the car weighs a hair over stock, so (at least in this case) the weight shouldn't be a problem. That said it may be that the kit for whatever model is being retrofitted in the future might include some strengthening bits.
@@KineticLatency
Hmm, the mention of "strengthening" implies the body or shell isn't "strong" enough to cope.
If you consider the first minis were designed for the "A" series engines and the suspension consisted of rubber donuts then the weight distribution could be quite different post conversion.
As before, a project best completed by an engineer and not a hobbyist.
Now, that said, if we see hydrogen fuel cells designed for smaller cars and can be engineered into old cars then who knows?
Eve are shocking to look at, no pun intended.
My big thing is safety features. That old mini will be crumpled like a coke can if its in a head on collision with a modern car or SUV
1:13 "... will set you about 40,000 Pounds in retrofitting components..."
Thanks for sharing the actual amount, and that too in the beginning!
Did that include the car price, or just the retrofit pieces? IN the US, the Mini starts at $30kUSD, so $10kUSD would be reasonable. If they want more than the price of the original car to retrofit their kit, they can KMA.
3:06 Jack standing in front of that Mini compared with the cars he usually stands in front of really shows how stupendously huge modern cars have become.
I thought the same.It's almost like he's standing in front of a toy car but it's because we have got used to SUV nonsense until we were brainwashed into it feeling like the norm.
@@jamiefox54 it’s not just that, it’s all the safety in modern cars too - these days we fully expect to survive a head on collision. In the days of the mini, you were lucky if you spent a few days in hospital before you slipped away, it meant you had time to say goodbye.
Large and Heavy is a function of the crash standards modern cars meet. The same crash that people will walk away from with a few bruises in that Polestar, are instant fatalities in the classc Mini.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes I think the idea that large and heavy equals safe is largely a red herring. Look at the huge high-speed collisions F1 drivers walk away from. Yes you probably need something larger than a Mini to meet modern safety standards, but there's absolutely no need for the enormous lorries that folk are driving around in today.
@@davidf2281 Never heard Engineering and Crash Survival Standards called a "Red Herring" before. That sounds like the same logic as 'safer being thrown from a rolling car then wearing seat belts'.
Please re-do this video every few years with updates! The more I think about it, the more obvious it is to me that this is the way to go for mass transition. New cars are such a colossal waste of resources. We need a parts economy, just like people have been fighting for with regards to cell phone repair.
Wait, it this a re-upload? I'd have sworn I'd seen it before.
Edit: Nevermind, 2:33
No Its not the way at all . @@ChrisD__
It should be EVERY year. this topic should be brought to people's mind more often also by other media channels.
As @Chrisd__ points out Jack even mentioned in this video that they already did it last year.
4 months to go for the next one. 👍
The drive system is the car. There probably wont be a day where its cheaper than just buying another one. Especially if battery tech can cut the price of the battery in half. If that happens, the cars will be much more affordable in the first place.
40000€ for a 50 year old Mini...which itself costs several thousand even with a blown motor.
Seems a rather silly and non sustainable solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
Four years ago I was quoted £20K for my MX5 to be EV converted. Instead this year I brought a two year old Zoe, with super low mileage for £16K. Price is key. A conversion is always going to be a compromise and price wise be competing with second hand EVs which are available at very competitive prices now.
remember when companies were making digital sensors on a cartridge to fit in a 35mm film camera? No? Never caught on as technology rapidly developed and the compromises to great. Except for classic cars, cant see this really happening....
£28k for 100 mile range? - Not exactly tempting unfortunately and as Bak mentions Zoes are just great and at 16k and hopefully soon, less, v tempting
I lease the Gt135 and love it, u can hustle it down back roads probably better than a tweaked Cooper S - always out dragging the ICE out of every corner
They also handle torque distribution brilliantly - u can powerslide the front without inside wheelspin :)
Retro EV conversions for classics need to be less than 1/2 price to appeal to the masses - If I had my 916 GTV TS EV converted I would want 250 ml range, 0-60 in 7 secs or less and VNE of 90 min - @ cheaper than a used Zoe - I would still think twice at £12k
Drive in, collect within 72 hrs for sub £10k would be mass market - I appreciate it cant be done now and possibly not within several yrs, but thats how I judge it for the average guy with a sub £5k used classic
A universal BYD retro fit kit for $10k would be a winner :)
@@mattsword41 Ughhh.... not comparable at all. Film thickness digital sensors are technologically just impossible. EV conversion is not only immenently doable, but people were doing it by themselves using homemade parts 30 years ago. But those conversions where not safe do to, sometimes not safe to drive, and often very impractical... back then the motors available were not rated for continuous load and would burn up very frequently. The lead acid batteries available were bulky and heavy. And the control electronics primative or completely DIY. Todays conversion shops have access to the same or similar quality parts as what actually goes into commercial EVs. But it comes with a pricetag.
@@davidstuart4915 The history of technology is always the same. The capability goes way up and the price goes way down. To expect ultra low prices at the beginning of a new technology is unrealistic. I am currently writing this on an 8gb Raspberry Pi single board computer which is the size of a cigarette packet, costs £80 in this version (prices start at £35) and has more capability than the most expensive desktop computer you could buy 20 years ago. It can also emulate all of the most expensive consoles you could get 20 years ago. For a monitor I'm using a 42" Plasma TV that I bought 18 years ago for £1500 and weighs 40kg. My newest TV is a 55" LED with full 3D capabilities that cost £500 and weighs 16kg. From Desktop PCs to Raspberry Pis and from Plasma TVs to LED TVs the technology has become leagues better and way cheaper. That will happen with EV Conversions just the same as it has with every other technology.
Why a 70kw motor in a Mini? Way too overpowered, 40kw would be plenty. Also the cost is prohibitive, £40k plus the cost of the donor car. You could buy a new Mini electric, Fiat 500 even the Honda e and an ice powered Mini for less. I am lucky enough to have owned a few original Mini’s in the past, they were fabulous drivers cars brilliant for tight and twisty B roads and lanes, but not exactly comfortable by todays standards.
"Buzz bar" would be a good name for it (given the electrical shock risk), but it's actually a 'busbar'. (Busbar being a contraction of "omnibus bar" -- the bar which everything goes through.)
As it just joins two components, is it actually a bus bar?
@@markthomasson5077 yup, it's a bus bar.
The rubber is primarily for electrical insulation, not durability.
Also I have never heard anyone use the word "componentry" before today.
Why not just say components?
@@weeeeehhhhh - Shrubbery… 😉
@@weeeeehhhhh Yup. It's a little hilarious he used that component as an example of something made pretty because they're "doing it nicely" but can be made cheaper (subtext: without the pretty coating) later.
I love your intro about how big we need our cars. Thank you Jack. Long life Fellten and similar-minded people !
I do wish their was a big push for this, in a way of seeing as a performance enhancing kit, I feel like that would get a lot more people on board. Making hybrids and full electric.
Me too but like video say, it a race of on what affordable first, the new ev or the retrofit kit.
Hope retrofit win faster
Not going to happen till it's Self Install.
Why even bother with a DIY hybrid? Once you have the battery, the motors, the high voltage electronics, the software etc, why add the complexity of figuring out how to blend it with a gas engine?
@@patreekotime4578 If you're thinking of the EV component as a way to get more economy, yeah, that's a waste on a classic car. But if you treat it as a power adder, like a supercharger with bypass and clutch, or a large bottle of Nitrous, then it makes sense.
Could probably use the front output shaft of a 4WD transfer case as an input from an add on electric motor to drive the rear wheels.
There was a small push until the Americans jumped in and either killed them or mysteriously the factory burned down.
What the Fellten chap says at the end is key: we essentially have 5 years or so to roll this out across the country if it should make any noticeable difference before people will just buy a new EV instead, so that means every MOT garage you see in your neighborhood should be able to order an off the shelf conversion kit for the respective model and re-do a combustion engine into an EV. Possible? Maybe, but it would need a serious government and all hands on deck approach.
Buying new cars in general is a financial hole, I don't know why people waste their money like that
"Requires a serious government" Ah, alas,
I love ev conversions and have one of my own, but I think it will largely be an enthusiast thing. Cost and labor are big, but there's also safety. I love the style and fun of older cars, but when it comes to daily driving and thinking about the safety of myself and my loved ones, I gotta admit that modern cars are much more likely to protect the occupants. And that's a huge factor. Plus, the cars that are best for converting are older pre computerizing of everything, which also means less safety features. Once you get to a newer car with more safety stuff, you have a lot more work to do as far as interfacing with software expecting an ICE engine and all the sensors involved with it. Which is why we talk about converting old Minis and Land Rovers, but not, say, a 2017 Sienna.
It's also a bunch of labour and other costs, which is only going to add to the costs.
Doubly so if it turns out your mechanic botched it.
Do you think it could be done for newer cars if we bypasses the electronic gizmos? obviously would mean losing safety features, but if you could retrofit other parts into the build?
Sure, absolutely. Anyone driving modern speeds in this Mini is absolutely crazy. I would use this one to show off occasionnally, and at most as a "city" car that tops at 40-ish km/h in dense areas, maybe 60-65 max (15-20kmh less than the limit) in the countryside. I'm not going on a highway with this.
Hi, I can see more conversions going on as the scrap nos of EV’s increase.
Using a donor vehicle as the supply of your parts makes sense.
Expect to see more Leaf based kits in the future, along with Tesla components, if not whole parts.
Was thinking of a Freelander 2 one but white van man pulled out.
Take care M.
@@em-jd4do
*Crackling of 78rpm record*
*Opening bars of 紀元ニ千六百年*
I used to have a hillclimb mini I'd regularly take to 70(ish) across Cambridgeshire. I wish I still had it, was a hoot.
It's quite a sight, seeing Jack fitted into the Mini with his legs still bolted on, and even so his head isn't up against the ceiling...and then him standing outside it and wondering just where _did_ the stick go? Because you know it was needed.
Perv.
Mini’s have a lot of room, they are a masterpiece of design
Those legs are wide spread
I think we all demand a RUclips short of Jack getting and out of a mini!!
and shots of what happened to the pointy stick😂
What is here meant by 'the pointy stick'? @@oojimmyflip
Nicely put together video.
It's much more environmentally friendly to convert an existing ICE vehicle into a BEV. Unfortunately it's not easy, and the newer the doner, the harder it becomes.
After about 2000, more cars used CAN data buses to allow various modules to communicate. Removing the ICE and it's ECM causes all sorts of issues with data buses, giving warnings, codes and sometimes complete failure of other modules in the vehicle. This is the challenge to overcome, which will take many hours of diagnostics by some very smart technicians.
I've been involved with converting an old Freelander 1 from diesel to electric, using salvaged parts from other damaged BEV vehicles, and that's not gone to bad, mainly because the Freelander 1 systems are older and able to function as stand alone units, so the brakes still have ABS, and the speedometer still functions.
I'd like to do a similar conversion on my Freelander 2, but alas the electronics in that vehicle would pretty much prevent a BEV conversion at this time.
i'm dreaming about doing that on my 1999 Citroen XM 2,5 td.
but in DK, taxes are insane 🤬
Would it need custom control modules? Is there such a thing? There has to be a scene building up for that. Since manufacturers lock everything down, the only way would be to go open source on the control units.
@@jochenstacker7448
Type approval" might be tricky to arrange.
@@t1n4444 depends on the country I guess. If you convert a car to EV, you'd have to have it approved as a one-off build, the same as if you nailed it together from Lego and 2x4s. 😁
So I honestly don't know if they check the modules for software, since whatever you'll put in there has nothing to do with the original car anymore.
With newer cars, I would expect there to be all sorts of software locks designed to prevent tampering without approval of the manufacturer. To get around them, I would not be surprised if you ended up needing to rip out and replace almost everything electronic in the car - even components like the radio and infotainment screen which have nothing to do with the combustion engine. The need to do this would, of course, drive up the price of the conversion.
In the early 80's, I sold personal computers for around £4000 per unit. The same PC with far greater ability is now £400 or even less. If you requested a custom PC to fit into a retro case, that would inevitably cost more. Thanks for the video and can we see the outtakes of you being eased into the Mini? 😊
Hardly a matching analogy. A car is a mobile cabin, the value is that the cabin can move and take you somewhere in some comfort. The systems behind the motion are a significant part but still there is the cabin and the comfort it provides - this is the value that is retained by a good condition old car to be converted (without even mentioning the nostalgia). The chassis of a PC is of little value even when new, it is just a structure to contain the real value - the compute resources, which at the pace of development in PCs becomes less value much faster than do any particular car, though you can change the PC internals and keep the same case quite often - I certainly did - as long as the standard the chassis design followed is still current for the components.
Mini’s are surprisingly easy to get in and out of and have plenty of room for larger drivers(both height and bulk).
@@sergentcolon1 Except for mutant sized people it seems ...
@@barendencrone try fitting one in an Amiga... 😊
Why would it cost more?
You are using the same motherboard, power supply, wiring and components as the current generation. the only old part is the housing3
I know this because I have a core I 5 and a Core I 10 in cases that originally had Pentium 1 and 3's
With EV's the real problem is the battery cost and lack of energy density
To get an EV with any useful range (sub 100 miles is a joke) you need 700-1,200lb in batteries which doubles the weight of a mini which started out at 1,275lbs.
Hey Jack, Fully Charged team, you should montage a number of "Jack standing next to a car" shots with the ones next to the Mini, to really bring home the message, how big current cars have become!😉
Oh and I would love to see the video footage of Jack folding into the Mini🤭
I've been watching Fellten from the very first video they made on RUclips when they converted a very yellow Mazda MX5. Glad to them here on Fully Charged well done Jack good to see you,re looking further a field than just those big SUV's. At 6' 2" I too can fit in a mini, without the stick and gel though, and it was just like driving a go cart great fun, loved it.
Bang the drum “circular economy, circular economy” repeatedly and loud, may help open up your market. Love it.
Well done Fellten. Circular economy needs companies like you. Another interesting review thanks Jack
I'd love to convert my classic Mini. I drive it every day all year round and it's a cracking little run around but the petrol engine with the carb does need some work to keep running in tip-top condition. The amount of maintenance that would be removed just by converting it would be massive and would make such quality-of-ownership difference. I don't know realistically how cheap they could go but if they could get them even down to £10-15k I'd jump at the chance.
In the same vein of retrofitting,
I have always had an idea that I could just put a Tesla axle on the rear axle of my 09' FWD CR-V and have the controller and the battery fit to the boot, where there's plenty of storage space, and then use something like a thumb throttle leaver or something a like, electric bikes use to engage the battery powered axle.
That way I can drive EV when I want to or drive petrol for longer distances. Same concept of a plug-in hybrid but in this case retrofitting an older vehicle to run on either or, instead of in conjunction with each other.
Hope it’s not too long a wait until these cost £10k or less. I have a list of cars I’d like to convert!
yes mee too😊
but in DK i'm dont see that happening anytime soon 🤬
we are unfortunately not allowed to do that, not without paying a big amount of taxes
It's going to take a while for EV conversions to be anywhere near a new car in terms of dollars spent per horsepower or kwh of range. ( I should know, I'm doing one, $25000 for just the EV parts, and even then it's just 100 miles of range but 650hp)
If you're doing this, it's as a passion project and for fun, or you absolutely adore a specific car and want to make it the ultimate daily driver
I have a 31 year old vehicle (not a MINI) that suits me well and is so much fun to drive and I have looked into the idea of retrofitting it to be full electric.
The cost estimates I have received so far have been very prohibitive but if it can become reasonable in the next 5 years, then I will do it since I have already had the rusted out metal replaced with new steel.
Great video, I love this kind of stuff. I'd love to see you follow up and see them install this.
FYI, a busbar is an electrical conductor, I imagine they're using them on the battery packs somewhere. The rubber coating is the insulator.
Nice one, thanks
Would love to convert my 70s vw camper but some way to go before it's affordable for me. Wish the wheel hub motor gave a hybrid option, or some of the promised drop in/ 'shoebox' range extender motors meant smaller battery packs were more realistic helping to cut costs. Fingers crossed.
£27,000!!! To the retrofitter…. Yeah I’m out 😢
I think they should do kits for buses, lorry's, bin lorry's, the types of vehicles that have about a 30 year life expectancy but also are used everyday.
Because the saving in fuel costs would easily offset the cost of the kit. And the people who own buses, lorry's and bin lorry's are massively interested in saving money, show them a spread sheet and they will instantly buy these kits, they don't worry about anything else except fuel costs, maintainence costs.
Plus tons of torque right away, no annoying gearbox, silence and not polluting the cities. It's such a huge win.
Agree. Check out sea-electric in Australia. They are doing a lot of work on commercial vehicles and have a AU$1 billion contract to electrify 8500 Toyota Hiluxes and Landcruisers for the mining industry.
That is the exact reason Musk quoted in the Tesla Semi release event - the savings to the eco-system of reduced commercial vehicle emissions is massive. It's something like 5% of all vehicles, and 20% of all emissions. Plus on top, commecial vehicles often park at warehouse type buildings, add a solar powered recharging station to those, and every time the truck/bus/etc is parked, it can be recharging - some companies could easliy have a fleet of delivery vehicles that effectively cost nothing to run outside of tyres, insurance, registration, suspension mainteance and a replacement battery every ten years - get the cost of the battery down to the price of replacing or rebuilding a truck or bus motor, and companies would be throwing money at the conversions folks.
Check out Kleanbus
There are already companies doing this to buses, since there is a very large push to make buses electric.
Great video. And fantastic to see a local company making things too, yes it's expensive for now but hopefully the costs will come down. If the UK govt would support it like the French do with subsidies then it could be like transition one.
So very close to the million subscribers, I’ve been watching your channel growing for 8 years. Roberts a hero, uk
Great video! I’d love to see more electric conversion content! Think of how cool it’d be to see an old Impala or Cadillac running fully electric 🤯
Fascinating. I wish HMG would boost these companies rather than big oil. (we know why) it is not a total solution but certainly fills a sector of the car ownership. Minis (original) were Superb. I think Issigonis would love this.He would lead the EV world, Simpler,Cheaper,Faster and more space!
So glad that Zero EV has become so serious and professional under this new banner. Well done and long live Fellten!
Subscriber number is still subbornly hovering just below the 1million mark. Come on people, this channel deserves to hit that 1 million milestone!
LOVE what they're doing here! It may not be the best in terms of range yet, better batteries/more efficient motors will make this better as time goes by.
This seems like the most sensible thing. Please keep actively updating on this. I feel like if we want to be genuine about emissions and impact, this answer makes the most sense, and is the best looking! Classic cars are so beautiful!
I really want to do an EV conversion on my '86 Fiero. We'll see how expensive that is when I get ready to drop a powertrain in (gotta restore some of the frame first, and I'll probably work on some body panels and what not too)
Love Fieros! Had 3 of them in 80/90s
You want to do it yourself, like we all do with our classics, same as swapping a transmission or adding a turbo, a lot of the enjoyment comes from putting it together in your own garage.... but all these kits seems to be 'Only fitted by authorised,...', same BS as 'Ony Dealer Serviced for Warranty Conditions'.
Did you see the Ronald Finger rebuild?
@@john_barnett yup! It was awesome!
@@PiDsPagePrototypes
Don't forget you'd have to satisfy the DoT (in UK) and your insurer as to a converted vehicle's structural integrity etc, etc. After all it's the insurer that carries the risk.
It might be useful to contact your insurer (any insurer) in advance to determine if you could get cover ... and what certification is required prior to acquiring insurance cover.
Far too many "starry eyed enthusiasts" are blissfully unaware of the legalities of the situation. Not to mention quite a few lack the engineering skills and facilities required.
That would be amazing. Would love to see Jack trying to shoehorn in there. Please upload the out takes.
I wonder if the upcoming in-wheel motors (Elaphe, etc) will make conversions easier / cheaper? It'd free up space for more batteries etc.
Adding weight inside the wheel (unsprung mass) is bad for handling and worse for ride. Drive packs that feet in to exsisting Differentials or Drive Trains is a better solution for anything larger then a Mo-ped.
this channel is almost at 1,000,000 subs! i've been a viewer of this channel for about 5 years. 👏🏽
I would like to see a company start turning out revived car lines with EV. The Nash Metro, the Studebaker Lark, the Ford Falcon.
I love old cars and I also want to be environmentally sustainable! I hope there could be a one size fits all solution to retrofitting.
I so want the Transition One thing to happen. Modern small cars last a lot longer than classic minis for sure and they would be massively economic to convert. I hope Feltten can do a similar kit
Absolutely, but I'd like to see them switch from a motor bolted to an existing gearbox to hub motors. This way you free up a lot of under-bonnet space for batteries, so that you could have a half decent range.
Currently the range of a transition one vehicle is very low.
I used to think that too. However, with hub motors you add a lot of unsprung mass, which makes the car more uncomfortable to drive and is very bad for suspension in general. Additionally most folks don't like how they look...
@@antontaylor4530 Hub Motos are good for lightweight bikes, they're not good for cars. Too much "Un-Sprung Mass" negatively affects the handling and ride - that's why Ally Wheels are prefered over Steel.
A motor and gearbox that can bolt in under the floor, directly coupled to the Differential of a rear wheel drive, with the battery pack up front to mimic the mass of an engine and transmission, is ideal for a lot of vehicles, from small two-doors up to giant Pick-ups.
Front Wheel Drive is easier to drop in an all-in-one replacement like shown here, with an extra battery where they fuel tank used to be.
What's missing, is a long-range set-up for Mini Vans and Pick-Ups, where the large unused spaces under the rear floor could have extra batteries added.
@@antontaylor4530 For simplicity some converters use the existing gearbox, but the one in this video eliminates it. On many classics the original driveshafts and diffs can't handle the EV torque, so if you are going to replace those anyway, might as well ditch the entire transmission and either place the electric motor in the transmission tunnel, or get rid of the entire drive line and mount the motor in the rear going striaght to the half-shafts.
@@PiDsPagePrototypes There are a couple of EV manufacturers (such as Lightyear and Protean) using them already, and the unsprung mass problem turned out to be much less of an issue than people thought.
These aren't race cars. It's not as critical as it would be in a racing car, suspension technology is advanced enough that the problem isn't insurmountable.
I think the price can come down massively when a company doesn't do them bespoke to order, but brings in cars does conversions on mass to be sold at their car show rooms. That will reduce the cost massively and be a great growth market in the future.
MY DREAM: a classic car body on a fully electric platform with modern suspension and braking systems.
How awesome to watch a RUclips video without adverts! Thank you!
And a really great and informative video!
there will always be folks who love their old tech car and will be willing to go EV.
I have a 1976 Mazda 121 that I would love to give the EV treatment. The drivetrain can wait until I have restored the body though, so there is time for more development
I’ve a 1949 Hudson… bring it on! It gets 10 kilometers on a liter so it’s not that bad but no noise and no smells would be more awesome!
Yeah this will be a hobby for a long time to come
I think there's a real future for retrofitting of commercial vehicles. Transits and Vivaros that don't do a lot of range - which is a lot of them, such as tradesmen in London. Lots of room under the floor for a battery pack, and you've got a long vehicle sales lifespan (Mk 1 Vivaro was 12 years of the same model). Not for everyone, but that's what I'd be looking at for a business - particularly with a Vivaro needing a new gearbox every few years, and people generally chucking £5k at if if you buy and fit new at a main dealer.
I love everything about this. I hope to see many electric classic minis on the road soon
I doubt it, there aren’t that many left on the road.
I would absolutely love something like this for our 2011 Astra. Engine in that was absolutely abused by the previous owner so it's misfiring like an absolute beater, but it _looks_ gorgeous inside and out. So to convert that into an EV would be glorious.
I’m surprised that there aren’t companies producing prefabricated conversion kits to turn conventional vehicles to electric. Seems like it would bring the cost down considerably.
Thoroughly impressed that Jack managed to get himself inside that Mini.
Having had 4, I’m not
Electro-fitting 🤔🤔
I know they did this to the mini, but I for some reason want this done for me with a mid-90s Buick Le Sabre. The inside is pretty comfortable actually so I think it would be kind of nice.
2:32 is this a camera trick or is he that tall? Or the car that small?
He's like 10 inches taller than the door too.
I would love to convert my fourteen year old Peugeot 4007 to electric. It is in superb condition, very comfortable and perfect for my needs. I have had the car for twelve years and have no intention to replace it. I have looked around and not found anything on the market that is as good.
Nice mini, I would have wanted to lose the rear seats and put more batteries there to increase range but such a conversion is something I would really like to do. Having a generalised kit available would make that so much easier to do. In terms of such kits, I feel it would be for the best if the kit is based on the cars weight and come without batteries so that such things could be tailored to the individual vehicle. Unfortunately the prices mentioned in the video are either the same or more than what you would spend on a new EV (which I really can't see myself being able to afford).
Electric classic cars managed to squeeze more batteries in. Also 300hp! Check their channel.
Well, adding more of the most expensive element is not going to help with the cost issue. Lithium will get cheaper eventually, but I wouldn't bet on it within 2 years.
@@concinnus well I doubt it.
If the demand is high, the price goes up.
And demand, thanks to EU and other maniacs will skyrocket in next 12 years.
Later, after 2035 it will be only worse.
Really enyoyed this. I know this channel is focused on fully electric, but I have always wondered why no one seems to offer an aftermarket hybrid conversion kit. Say, I own a 2012 Elantra, couldn't they find a why to electrify the rear wheels and get the car to spend a lot less fuel in city driving or accelerating?
I did mine for £2000. DVLA won't update the V5 to electric though because it's a 2003
Surely there's more to it than its age? What other things are required for DVLA to accept it?
Curious to understand the bureaucracy too - I was under the impression that in the UK you’d need an IVA since the engine/gearbox is a big chunk of the original car. Then the insurance would be a minefield too no doubt?
@@Umski insurance is a pain, only really 1 or 2 options. Its all based on points system, stay within the allowed points and IVA not required. I use original gearbox and so they view it as engine swap. Some videos and overview on my RUclips channel
The Chinese have been churning out the Wuling mini EV and other similarly sized EV cars. The Wuling is practically the same size as the classic Mini Coopers. That's just proof that small compact EVs have a market.
Love the idea, let me know when I can find a kit for my scirocco or better for an RX8 ^^
Sure they could sort you out a kit if you have £40k burning a hole in your pocket
Great video. The myriads of people converting gas/petrol cars to electric for the past few decades paved the way for the production electric car. Elon Musk was inspired by seeing conversions racing. For many years, converting was the only way to have an electric car. A culture of DIY converters and conversion shops evolved, and it was not so much a hobby for the rich, as an environmentalist movement. In the U.S., the Electric Vehicle Association was originally built around conversions, and people are still doing it. A visit to your local chapter meeting might reveal some interesting conversion projects.
A lot of people are also sentimental to their beloved cars, so such conversions are the best option to go electric and breathe new life to an old flame. 🔥👌
I'm 6'5" and my first car was a classic mini. Ridiculously fun car. Shame about the awful brakes and flimsy bodywork. But it's amazing how much you can get in one!
You are 6'5'' and had a mini? That mini was a convertible.
The issue is classic cars are not cheap and getting dearer, a Mini in a usable condition, a Capri or Cortina MK3 GT (these are what I want) will set you back a pocket destroying amount before even thinking of buying an EV kit.
Add in having to modify the vehicle structure, and that kills any resale value, making the bolt-in style a requirement within that cost of conversion.
I would 'really' like to convert my VW Scirocco 2014 keeping everything as it is (with the exception of an auto gear selector). You would have thought doing this would be much cheaper than buying new now not in 5-10yrs time.
I feel that as a main stream mean to help transitioning to EVs, converting ICE car into EVs is probably already dead or will remain limited to specific cases. Within the next 5 years, what will happen is that the EV 2nd hand market is going to increase even more and there won’t be any logic/financial interest to convert an ICE car to EV.
It will be only for hobbyists converting classic cars. But that's fine.
@@wiegraf9009good thing I'm learning to drive (and gonna smash it) and getting a classic for my first car. Doing this in 6 years could be really cool and it'd be interesting when everything around is electric anyway
At Fully Charged live in Austin in 2020, there were a few conversions including a 280Z that cost about $70,000 to convert. In a little over three years, it seems the price has come down a bit. I'm very encouraged that conversions will be a thing.
I’m thinking of converting my old classic 2012 Tesla in 2035! 😂🤣😂🤣
Their web site does not appear functional. Not sure what kind of range one can get with a low-cost kit like they were planning to offer.
great video, would love to retrofit my car
Mini?
@@philtucker1224 no Volvo 850 but I think it would be a great electric estate, and their is not much choice in electric estates anyhow
@@Jerra3007 yes, very true. However (if you are intending to keep the car as a classic collectible) I still think they will become far more valuable if they still have their original ICE engines…
@@philtucker1224 potentially, system like the Fellten one do not cut or drill anything and the original engine is kept on its caddle in the wooden box the electric drivetrain came in (y)
Yes, if there’s not, there should be standard kits for many old cars like the mini. There are lots of these old cars that people want to keep and are technically sound. Think of many older model Volvo, BMW, Citroën, Volkswagen etc. However, the price of the kits should under €15.000. There are millions of these cars around and it would be better for the environment, planet, jobs etc., if these cars were not destroyed but converted.😎
As the owner of 98 Cooper this video was brilliant to watch. Was left wondering what the charge time was like and the top speed relative to that weight lost.
However I'd love to know if there is a option to have a gear type selection? Half the fun of a Mini is quick shifting up through the four gears, I think I'd miss that if I couldn't replace it with something.
Have a look at the recharged heritage site. Lots of info on there about 0-60 etc
You can't
I wish the government would put incentives to this sort of work. I saw a really great looking 1970's Cadillac just yesterday... how great would that be as electric. Also, here in my area there is a big problem with people stealing catalytic converters off of cars... those are not cheap to replace (from what I hear)... how great would it be for them to just convert over. Those are often work vans that really don't need a lot of range anyway as they just drive to a local work spot and spend a good portion of their day in one locale. But I'm thinking this is going to have to come more to the Transition One price point to help the folks who really cannot afford a newer car.
I expect the cat converter thieves are just keeping their hand in for when they start nicking everyone’s Lithium batteries at 8k apiece..
@@philtucker1224 Those things are a bit heavy... if folks start doing that I'm sure you'll hear stories of thief trapped under car battery having to be rescued and then jailed.
"Buss bar" not "buzz bar"!!!
Electric Classic Cars headed by Richard Morgan (an old friend of Fully Charged) do kits for classic car conversions tailored to specific models. They sell them on to approved fitters who can then pop them in to a fossil car in exactly the same manner as with Fellten. Everything is ready to go. It's not much more complicated than building a radio controlled car kit. That's why it can take as little as ten hours to complete a conversion if the donor car is in good condition. There are a number of companies doing this and it will become an expanding trend.
I would hope the posters take notice of the "approved fitter" thing.
@@t1n4444 Exactly! We are a long long way off affordable conversions. Don't get me wrong I love these things. If you really want a classic and have loads of money then this is great ... otherwise just spend the same on an existing EV and get twice the range, comfort, performance and crucially safety. (Unfortunately an original Mini can only drive on our roads because it doesn't have to meet the latest crash test regulations for new cars. All other cars were much smaller on the roads back in the day ... don't try crashing into a hefty modern SUV in an old Mini.)
Magnificient episode! Loving this recent new content you guys have been producing, and people we are are 2000 subscribers away from 1 million, these guys truly deserve a sub!
@@danz_w Good you noticed the typo, fixed the comment!
7:55 is the time stamp for price of kit, plus fitting.
First?
I used to have a VW bus, 69, red w/ white top. Loved it, best camping vehicle ever. It would be nice to have an electric 69. Ok, so the id Buzz is coming out, but all I really want is my old 69 back, fully EV, lots of range, no infotainment screen, no useless gadgets. Maybe a good stereo system, and disc brakes that’s all. All pretty much attainable, except the 400+ miles of range, that would cost.
The software side will also be wanted I think. It is overlooked at the moment but will probs become pretty standard, I.e. the fusion of gps, drive assist and software control of things like climate, seat position, music etc.
I’d go for a Jeep conversion with a 200 mile range! Brilliant show! Conversions will be big. People love old cars, even though the engines on a lot of those cars just weren’t that great in the first place.
Do you have a system to give a linear acceleration rate that can tame accelerator control to a "regular town driving" acceleration so that planting the accelerator will not result in rapid acceleration. Kind of mimicing a sporty but not overpowering original mini power output?
Good to see really good quality engineering here in the UK. All in-house.
I really want to electrify my 2006 Toyota Land Cruiser 100. It would be really interesting to see, what that would cost and the amount of range you could get out of it. I imagine it would actually be quite well suited for the task because of the enormous amount of underfloor room (where the tank was and spare wheel) and also in the gear tunnel and under the hood.
What a cracking episode! Thanks fully charged. Thabks Jack
The biggest issue is the availability of charging stations with high charge rates and batteries that can be charged an awful lot quicker than the current ones.
To be blunt, unless you only need a car for short journeys that you can charge at home over night I would give ev's a miss for the next ten years.
Although by then most people will not be able or allowed to own a vehicle I expect.
It's been so long since i wanted to see the 1 million mark...you are soooo close...early Congratulations !!!
I have an 87 Suzuki hatch... it's got Mustang suspension now, was thinking of squeezing in a V8 with a lot of cutting, but thinking it needs a silly EV swap. It just needs a loud engine to cover the road noise.
Jack needs to highlight some companies in the US doing the same.
About 12 years ago I was toying with the idea of getting another mk3 Capri, and EVing it into something pretty fun, while retaining the retro cool factor.
I priced up what I'd need to buy to get 300hp and around a 150 mile range, then realised that it was a pipe dream when the total quickly got north of £40k (Without the car's purchase cost !). On top of that there was all the questions about how the hell do you go about getting the thing re registered as an EV in a way that would allow you to get all the benefits of EV ownership (Like CAZ exemption, etc), and what would the insurance company do when confronted with working out a quote for it (Best guess was that they'd look at whatever premium their computer spat out for £50k of highly modified, petrol Capri, then treble it !)?
In the end, I just gave up and bought a diesel golf (Like the government were busy encouraging people to do back then) and gave up on the classic EV idea.
This is the idea I have been looking for! A Cheap kit to convert my 2001 Nissan (Europe) Pulsar Hatch 1.8 with 92KW. Would Love a significant upgrade in Power to say 150-200KW would be a rocket for me. Thanks you Jack, All the best from Australia.
Thank you. This is a subject that should have its own slot on your program. True classic car Gear Heads will go to no ends to take on a project, as long as the wrenches are spinning and my Fluke meter still works I'm in my happy space. Electrify an old air cooled Corvair or a Granada Estate bring them all on.
James Hunt always loved his Austin A35 van because loads of fun CAN be had at low speed..!
my model car had an option for 4wd, mine doesnt have it, however I have considered repurposing the rear driveshaft/differential to make it into a manner of hybrid vehicle, namely regen braking.
As auto manufacturers are facing up to the inevitability of having to go electric, well most of them anyway, I'm wondering if they will come to see the continuing need to support ICE componentry as something of an expensive pain in the bum, ten to fifteen or even twenty years from now as their fleeting manufacturing finally, becomes fully EV.
Might they simply decide to design conversion kits for their most popular models and use (this) as a direct revenue stream replacement model that ICE parts and servicing currently occupies?
P.S. The look of sheer enjoyment on Jack's face was priceless.😅
I remember researching EV conversion projects a decade ago. Back then converters used lead acid batteries, and only a handful of proper motors were available... with many DIY conversions using motors out of clothes dryers which had very short lives under continuous load. Control electronics were primative and some DIYers had VERY primative solutions... I remember a guy with an electric Mustang drag racer that just used a giant copper bar as a knife switch mounted between the seats.... which he had to replace everytime he drove it because it would melt itself. Terrifying. My point is that not a small amount of the cost of these conversions is in the safety and engineering and knowhow to do them safely.
I love the idea and have been following them on/off for years.
In reality, if there were incentives out there the main manufacturers will be the ones pioneering this IMHO. They have the designs already, they just need a team to make the brackets for a universal battery pack. Manufacturers already repurpose their chassis and designs over the generations and not afraid to reuse the designs to make new ones.
Cool, I can’t wait to convert my Mark IV. Retro fitting the sunroof with a solar panel will be a must.
Jack, you are my favorite. Always making me laugh. Love the show. Keep up the great work.
I WISH the U.S. could be as enthusiastic about smaller, affordable electric vehicles. I don't need 1000 miles or even 300 miles, just affordable with highway speeds for occasional longer trips.