I could listen to you for two hours Dave. Don’t ever think that you’re not very interesting. The amount of knowledge you have is incredible. Your willingness to dispense it is a blessing to all of us. God bless you. John
@Eye of the Tiger At the lease blow o. We're not always going to be in the most perfect weather! Some of my friends that watched live in colder climate States. Doing some snowmobiling in remote places! Got caught out in it. Noticed there compass didn't work right!
My good friends bought me the Suunto MC-2 global over a decade ago and used it for many years. For some reason, I just started looking at videos about compasses today. I'm happy to see that Dave's preferred compass is mine.
Nice presentation Dave. My ol' vintage, well-used, durable, and trusted compass was the SUUNTO WWII-type Finnish Military model (metal w/ leather strap). Before GPS... It was my go-to for exploring , needed tool as an apprenticing river guide, and carried into outfitting and leadership of fully-guided expeditions. During college days on orientation classes and competitions, it always cleaned the competitor's clocks to other's bewilderments. Nowadays, it's a still working special keepsake. Funny story: I was leading an exploratory multi-mode mountaineering, trekking, and rafting month long tour for a party of 15 German folks. They wondered why I'd hardly ever looked at the maps and seamingly did not take many readings/bearings with a compass. I told them the Caribou know the way, and we shall use that guidance to or destination as better direction seeking than any compass. Our trek would take us from deep in the Brooks Range Mountains to where we would find our boats cashed to start the river segment as the goal. Over several days and miles the Caribou had led us
Good Video. As a professional for over 40 years now semi-retired Archaeologist, I have used the Brunton Pocket transit to make field maps, I now have The Army Compass, which I play around with, but in the main I tended to use the Silva Ranger 2.0 models and Ranger 515 model rather than the Suunto.
About time someone actually covered the nuances of compass choice! Never even seen the subject touched. I never leave for the trail without a compass and hard copy map.
From the title, I would have guessed this was a sponsored video. Boy was I wrong! You've answered all the questions I was looking for some time ago. Very inormative Dave!
Always golden nuggets of truth brother. I am 59 years old and still have my Silva going back to a young teen, at that time it was my primary. I carry the MC2 and tritium lensatic currently, redunancy and quality are key.
I’ve used and still use my old military lensatic M-1 compass the m- 2 were used by field artillery I use my m-1 as my primary over GPS when I hunt out west works great no battery’s 😎
Thank you my astute and erudite friend! Compasses and compass use has long been a source of confusion to the layman. Thanks for your accurate and concise presentation! I has been my experience that most people either buy a cheap "toy" compass and expect to do wonders with it or they buy a vastly over complicated one and never learn to properly use it. Thanks again, regards and best, Pink
We used the M2 in the Army almost 40 years ago to orient our gun system. I bought a Cammenga in 1988 when I got out and it still glows nicely! I recently bought the MC2 and have started playing with it. Compared my Cammenga to the MC2 to my iPhone…I’d trust any of them, at least until my phone battery died 😂.
Great overview Dave! I wish I could convince the parents of my Scouts to get MC2s out of the gate. No matter how many times I tell them MC2 or look for made in Finland, they go to Walmart and buy a cheap compass that's either DOA, loses magnetism quickly, or bubbles in a month or less. I have a stack of dead ones I use as teaching examples. My 2 Globals have been around the world and are still going strong. They've also saved me many hard miles of rerouting when the fidelity on the GPS or the map on my phone would've sent me down the wrong fork on a trail. Just as important is understanding and using a topo map. We do a lot of cross country orienteering scavenger hunts in Scouts. Being able to pick the fastest route and stay on bearing in tough terrain is an art in itself. That would make a great follow up video.
In Australia - next year my son does yr9 school (14yr olds) living in the Victorian Alps at a campus called Timbertop - weekly hikes upto 6 days, 25+ klm runs, cross country & alpine skiing, bush skills, white water rafting, etc. They all carry Suunto m3 compasses - but all their hiking is with maps. Love your videos - thankyou
Wow....I need one of those Silva pocket compasses. I have a Silva Ranger compass that I have been using since the late 1980s. It's very similar to the MC2. But having a backup... thanks for the heads up, Mr Canterbury.
People always seem to totally underestimate the importance of a map and compass. All this GPS stuff but you can't beat BNG and stuff like that. Good video. Keep reminding them!!
Yeah Gen. Parker was like that...he came out to SUT one day at Mackall while I was working there as a DOD contractor during some "Round Robin" training and the active duty cadre was going over the basic use of a map and compass... the general actually made a remark about the gee-whiz technology with GPS and whatnot being the best thing since sliced bread...that compasses were obsolete blah blah blah...the future is now and blah blah blah...I wanted to give him my GPS minus the batteries and drop him off in the training area with a reasonable time limit to get back...after driving him around in circles for awhile...if you can't handle the basics using a compass and reading a map when your "the future is now and technology is next to Godliness" fails you...you are screwed...or worse...
Thank you, Dave...always learning something new when I watch your channel. I picked up the Suunto MC2 after watching an orienteering video by Shawn Kelly. Great video and I carry the notes taken on all of my hikes so that I can practice. I also have one of the military compasses that was given to me as a gift from a friend when we were both active duty circa 1972. We were on a deployment in Morocco and that compass saved my ass. While browsing on Amazon I found a pocket Brunton glow in the dark compass and tested it against the Suunto and it's okay but if my life were at stake the Suunto MC2 and a set of pacing beads would always be in my pack or pocket.
Well Dave. I broke the Suunto MC-2. I used it and stored it in my chest rig. So either through transport. Shooting prone on the ground and pressing it against mags behind the pouch it broke the mirror cover off the compass. Can still use it with a map but using it to get an azmith and shoot a bearing with an object in the distance is a no go my friend. Had to order the Cammenga for tactical trainings and such. Guess I need to remember to do the math going forward for declination when using the Cammenga
I got the first compass you showed in a box of yard sale junk! It has a crack in the glass. But after your video I’m definitely going to figure out how yo use it.
If you haven't seen Dave's comprehensive tutorial series on navigation, do download it. It's divided into sections to make it easy. Like leaning to walk, you'll just need practice. It's approximately 4years after this video. (Best I've seen anywhere.)
Thank you Dave for covering the difference between the lensatic and base plate compass as far as declination. I have always used camenga with tritium but have since acquired Suunto MC-2. Love both.
I bought the Suunto a few years ago at your suggestion,and never went back to any other compass..I do like that Silva though. Thank you for all you do brother 💪💪
Excellent video...I leaned how to use my compass when I started hunting ,that was 50 years ago ,im 65 now lol...Im no expert but it saved my ass from getting lost many of times on unfamiliar hunting grounds..Kids today would rather buy a gps than learn anything new lol thanks for the video
Because the compass needle rotates independently from the degree scale on a base plate compass, but the degree scale (degree card) rotates with the needle on a Cammenga type compass. I have found it helpful to think of how to use the two different types of compasses, as working kind of the opposite way of each other. [I never use the adjustment for mag declination on compasses that have that function, because I like to play round with different kinds of compasses. Some base plate compasses don't have an adjustment, only a declination scale printed inside the compass housing. And compasses like the Cammenga, Francis Barker, etc. don't even have a mag declination scale. I find it easier to just always account for mag declination manually. It is quite easy once you understand mag declination, but most people convince themselves magnetic declination is difficult. It isn't. If you don't make it so. --- If mag declination is 7˚ West, to orient your map to local terrain, just rotate your map 7˚ CW (from magnetic north orientation). If instead mag declination is 15˚ East, rotate your map 15˚ CCW (from magnetic north orientation position). Then you can take your compass azimuth directly off the map by laying the edge of the compass along the desired direction of travel. No math involved. If no map, forget about it, ah, er, it has no bearing. But the math method is also easy: [The map WAvES to the compass. And the compass WAvES back(wards) to the map.] WAvES, = West Add v East Subtract. Meaning when you measure an azimuth on your map of say, 200˚ (referenced to grid north), and your mag declination is 12˚ West. You would use a compass (manetic) azimuth of 212˚ to go to your destination. [From West Add 200˚+12˚= 212˚ - Map WAvES to the compass]. But if you measure a compass (magnetic) azimuth to a distant road junction of say, 112˚, on the map you would use an grid referenced azimuth of 100˚, The compass WAvES (West Add back(wards)) to the map. Thus -- West Add backwards becomes, west subtract. 112˚ +(-12)= 100˚. And of course if your local mag declination were instead 12˚ East. Map WAvES to the compass would become 200˚-12˚-= 188˚ mag azimuth. And Compass WAvES back to the map would become 100˚+12˚ = 88˚ map grid north azimuth. [East Subtract backwards]. Man, I keep thinking I'd like to get a Brunton Transit type compass, just to play around with one. But haven't yet been willing to $pend the money for one. And don't want one of the cheap low quality clones. I've only been motivated enough to $pend the money to order a Francis Barker M73 from Pyseroptics in the UK. A fun compass to own. Accurate to 0.5˚. The Silva Expedition 54 or the newer version Silva Expedition 55 6400/360 prism compasses are fine too. About $94, also 0.5˚ accuracy. Not really needed as the Cammenga accuracy is 2.25˚(40 mils) , and the Suunto compasses are accurate to 2.5˚, which is plenty accurate for pedestrian land navigation.
This is a middle knowledge video about compass's and you nailed it, I'm glad you didn't go into "what is declination " question, you should already have this knowledge at this point. Just saying. Thanks for sharing.
Enjoy using the M2 Compass. Spent a few years as an 82C (Field Artillery Surveyor). The ability to find azimuth and elevation can put you anywhere you need to be.
Thanks Dave! This really clears things up for me on compass purchase. Also, the mini screwdriver that you mentioned in your SAK is great if you need to tighten the screw on eyeglasses! I was teaching many years ago (15-20) in a Christian school and had several kids ask me to fix their glasses. The screw would come out. When SAK came out with that gem I bought it and kept it at the ready for students' glasses. Never thought to use it for declination screws on compasses! Thanks.
I taught myself how to find latitude and longitude using a Brunton Geo azimuth compass. Difference from the pocket version is a hinge degree inclinometer. Simple set up, for precision work I include a precision solar watch, a Brunton tripod and tables for declination and GMT SNT, as well as a lat/lon map to record position. It’s a fun thing to do.
I carry button compasses and they`re what i use by far the most (in a pants coinpouch backup at other places). Especially when in cities. I have used others and own another one but that`s the one i use most but then again i`m in central europe and it`s hard to get really lost here when in the countryside.
I just found this channel. You and Blackie Thomas are the best and the most informative instructors that I have seen. I'm looking forward to seeing more of your videos. Thank you for your presentations.
Not a compass pro but I was lucky enough to pick one of the compass’s your showing as my 1st nice Cordura holder well built and has alout of bells and whistles that I need more time to learn how to use.
I appreciate the info, Dave! I've been trying to decide on a compass for a while and was getting discouraged with conflicting info. I trust your opinion and I think I've made my decision. Thank you, sir!
Dave, good info, thanks for the break down. Like the suunto. Looked for the pocket compass, right now it is coming up as unavailable. Silva was my backup compass on the army and I carried the pocket one but it got lost in travels and been looking for awhile to replace. Thanks again.
Brunton TruArc 3 Compass.... favorite compass, sure its not the "best" but it does the job well and sometimes better than more expensive compasses for fifteen dollars.
I made a living using a Brunton pocket transit for navigation and mapping in archaeology. For adjusting magnetic declination on a Brunton, a dime or penny is ideal. A trick you can use for orienteering is to hold compass with mirror partially elevated near your body. Hold the body level using the bulls eye level. You look down into the mirror and see the sighting arm with the hair line which can set vertical to the compass dial. You align the hairline in the mirror with the hair in the sighting arm. Look at your target with both hairlines together and read BOTH ends of the needle. In this orientation, with the mirror near your body, the white end is the declination from you TO your target. The black end of the needle is the declination FROM your target to you. You will find there are a number of tricks you can employ. The mirror for instance can also be used as a signal mirror, and has a hole through compass lid for that purpose.
Thanks for the info Dave. I started trying to figure out a good basic compass I need to carry a while back and found lots of info out there that done nothing but confuse me. I appreciate the straight forward advice. I assume you have info on your channel here about basic use of a compass, such as the MC-2. I will start watching them as well. I do like short to the point videos like this. Thanks again.
Good review Dave! I have a Cammenga Mil-Spec tritium lensatic compass and a Suunto MC2 compass, but being an "old" Ranger who is still very good at land nav (backpacking, orienteering, etc.), my primary compass remains the Mil-Spec tritium lensatic compass, eventhough I understand the multi-use advantages of the MC2, it is my backup compass.
Used the Brunton artillery compass in the Mortar platoons back in my Army days. The military/artillery Brunton transits show NATO Mil-radians instead of true Mil-radians. NATO Mil-radians have 6400 Mils in a circle. True Mil-radians have 6283 Mils in a circle. The difference between NATO and true Mil-radians may get you off course.
Relearned land nav years ago with your videos and invested in the recommended compass your talking about; wow; it makes navigating way easier; wish the MIL would have used this style..
As somebody who has owned & used various compasses for the last 35+ years in army & bushcraft applications I second the small & lightweight "SILVA Ranger SL". I've used it on long UL solo hikes with success in the Ukrainian Carpathian Mountains, a wild terrain without much signs & paths. An equally capable model is the RECTA DP6G / SUUNTO MB-6NH. The advantage is that the mirror folds downward so that the image isn't inverted, as compared to all other sighting compasses with an upward folding mirror. Regards from Germany, Gereon
I paused the video and bought a Suunto MC-2 and started looking for the Silva but I missed the model name. Rewatching to see if you mentioned it. Thanks for sharing this information!
The baseplate compasses are the best for map work. They're the easiest to use when getting a bearing off the map or when transferring a bearing to a map, because you don't need to align the map with north. Lensatic compasses are the best for sighting bearings, but they do need the map to be aligned with north. The Cammenga also has the disadvantage of not having a 1 degree scale, working only with 5 degree increments, and the mil scale is also slightly bigger than 1 degree, and the bezel only rotates in 3 degree increments, which means you can't get better than +/- 1.5 degrees with it. This may be offset by the build quality, since some baseplate compasses might not be able to achieve that +/- 1.5 degree accuracy despite having 1 degree increment scales.
JMO- I've had one of the military cammenga units I gave seventy bucks for. It stuck on it's axis and got me bad lost in the wee hours. My buddy had one that did the same in the sticks at 10,000 feet, so needless to say I don't use those. My old 40 year plus Silva still does ok. I think the majority of folks just need the needle to point correctly every time and all the other stuff is superfluous
Dave , in setting the compass, you say if you didn't leep frog your off course, am i ms understanding that. This is my first compass, watc and learn a lot from you , Thanks
I have the suunto mc2 and have had it since 2008 a bit old now... sadly some of the print has started to come off a bit on the back but only for the ruler parts not the degrees in the middle.... though next time despite it works very well I agree with David on that part for sure... but I might next time get a Silva Expedition S compass instead just to try something new but also coz I hope it will keep the print longer... Cheers great content right here 👍
Great video Dave thank you for the information. There are so many compasses out there it is just ridiculous. Thanks for narrowing it down a little bit.
on your recommendation a few years ago i got the Suunto and love it.. i don't use it that often but it is easy to read and does everything i need it to do and yes the magnifier will light char material lol
I was a surveyor for almost 40 years and of all the equipment I bought, the one thing I wanted, was a Brunton(for some reason, everyone referred to this as an "After Brunton" ... do not know why) Surveyors don't really use the Brunton(or any compass), to survey, as much as to "re-survey", or trace old properties that had originally set up by compass(with a recorded date(i.e., June 1, 1947), so the declination for the original survey can be ascertained, and compared to the present day declination ... A big issue with this is that all along a property, local attractions may effect the original compass readings. A surveyor's Transit will not indicate bearings affected by local attractions, and magnetic readings(reverse and forward), should present an exterior or interior angle, Always "re-survey", with similar equipment, to get similar results.
I have the Cammenga as my go to with a set of ranger beads on it.. I do the PAULS nav as well, it works great for that. Have the K and R that is like your Suntto but it just doesn't do it for me, except for the survival reasons you described. Hope all is well, Great Vid.👍
I could listen to you for two hours Dave. Don’t ever think that you’re not very interesting. The amount of knowledge you have is incredible. Your willingness to dispense it is a blessing to all of us. God bless you. John
No need to apologize for the length of this video. Like always another informative well done video. Thanks
That's good an all. But nobody talks about cold weather affects on Compasses!
@@dale2625 now your really getting in depth!
@Eye of the Tiger At the lease blow o. We're not always going to be in the most perfect weather! Some of my friends that watched live in colder climate States. Doing some snowmobiling in remote places! Got caught out in it. Noticed there compass didn't work right!
The hardest and most Priceless Compass I've ever worked with was a moral one.
Does it come with or without adjustable declination?
As soon as you hit RUclips that compass hits serious magnetic disturbances in your equilibrium.
My good friends bought me the Suunto MC-2 global over a decade ago and used it for many years. For some reason, I just started looking at videos about compasses today. I'm happy to see that Dave's preferred compass is mine.
This video is great with my morning coffee. No apologies necessary. There is a new crop of learners every day.
You're a legend David and definitely my favorite dual survivalist. You and Cody were the golden age of survival reality TV programs.
Thank you Dave for explaining a few things about compasses. Much appreciated.
I have been carrying that little Silva for years and is all i need for what I do.
Brought back images of my army days. Thanks for the video. Keep posting. Brilliant at explaining. Good instructor. Bye for WALES!
Nice presentation Dave. My ol' vintage, well-used, durable, and trusted compass was the SUUNTO WWII-type Finnish Military model (metal w/ leather strap). Before GPS... It was my go-to for exploring , needed tool as an apprenticing river guide, and carried into outfitting and leadership of fully-guided expeditions. During college days on orientation classes and competitions, it always cleaned the competitor's clocks to other's bewilderments. Nowadays, it's a still working special keepsake. Funny story: I was leading an exploratory multi-mode mountaineering, trekking, and rafting month long tour for a party of 15 German folks. They wondered why I'd hardly ever looked at the maps and seamingly did not take many readings/bearings with a compass. I told them the Caribou know the way, and we shall use that guidance to or destination as better direction seeking than any compass. Our trek would take us from deep in the Brooks Range Mountains to where we would find our boats cashed to start the river segment as the goal. Over several days and miles the Caribou had led us
Good Video. As a professional for over 40 years now semi-retired Archaeologist, I have used the Brunton Pocket transit to make field maps, I now have The Army Compass, which I play around with, but in the main I tended to use the Silva Ranger 2.0 models and Ranger 515 model rather than the Suunto.
About time someone actually covered the nuances of compass choice! Never even seen the subject touched. I never leave for the trail without a compass and hard copy map.
big help, big heart, thank you from australia,.........saving lives,.......I love you brother
From the title, I would have guessed this was a sponsored video. Boy was I wrong! You've answered all the questions I was looking for some time ago. Very inormative Dave!
Imagine how many lives this guy has saved just through his knowledge. Good job mate
Always golden nuggets of truth brother. I am 59 years old and still have my Silva going back to a young teen, at that time it was my primary. I carry the MC2 and tritium lensatic currently, redunancy and quality are key.
I’ve used and still use my old military lensatic M-1 compass the m- 2 were used by field artillery I use my m-1 as my primary over GPS when I hunt out west works great no battery’s 😎
Thank you my astute and erudite friend! Compasses and compass use has long been a source of confusion to the layman. Thanks for your accurate and concise presentation! I has been my experience that most people either buy a cheap "toy" compass and expect to do wonders with it or they buy a vastly over complicated one and never learn to properly use it. Thanks again, regards and best, Pink
We used the M2 in the Army almost 40 years ago to orient our gun system. I bought a Cammenga in 1988 when I got out and it still glows nicely! I recently bought the MC2 and have started playing with it. Compared my Cammenga to the MC2 to my iPhone…I’d trust any of them, at least until my phone battery died 😂.
I was doing a refresher on land nav and missed this video. Im glad i watched it. Didnt know about that pocket compass. Thanks.
Great overview Dave! I wish I could convince the parents of my Scouts to get MC2s out of the gate. No matter how many times I tell them MC2 or look for made in Finland, they go to Walmart and buy a cheap compass that's either DOA, loses magnetism quickly, or bubbles in a month or less. I have a stack of dead ones I use as teaching examples. My 2 Globals have been around the world and are still going strong. They've also saved me many hard miles of rerouting when the fidelity on the GPS or the map on my phone would've sent me down the wrong fork on a trail. Just as important is understanding and using a topo map. We do a lot of cross country orienteering scavenger hunts in Scouts. Being able to pick the fastest route and stay on bearing in tough terrain is an art in itself. That would make a great follow up video.
In Australia - next year my son does yr9 school (14yr olds) living in the Victorian Alps at a campus called Timbertop - weekly hikes upto 6 days, 25+ klm runs, cross country & alpine skiing, bush skills, white water rafting, etc. They all carry Suunto m3 compasses - but all their hiking is with maps. Love your videos - thankyou
Sharing your knowledge of the different options and applications is much appreciated. Thanks Dave. Keep the great content coming!
As usual, I learned something new. Thanks as always Dave.
I own 2 compasses a M2 artillery compass, and a suunto MC-2. And man, I enjoy the MC-2 so much.
No one explains it like Dave. Thank you sir.
I've used a Suunto or Silva for decades and it's the best. Thanks for sharing what the differences are. I never knew.
Great video Dave. Spot on regarding compasses. Buy once, cry once. The Suunto Mc2 is perfect.
Wow....I need one of those Silva pocket compasses. I have a Silva Ranger compass that I have been using since the late 1980s. It's very similar to the MC2. But having a backup... thanks for the heads up, Mr Canterbury.
Great video. I was trained on a military compass, but the MC-2 is the best choice for most people , especially someone who is learning.
People always seem to totally underestimate the importance of a map and compass. All this GPS stuff but you can't beat BNG and stuff like that. Good video. Keep reminding them!!
Yeah Gen. Parker was like that...he came out to SUT one day at Mackall while I was working there as a DOD contractor during some "Round Robin" training and the active duty cadre was going over the basic use of a map and compass... the general actually made a remark about the gee-whiz technology with GPS and whatnot being the best thing since sliced bread...that compasses were obsolete blah blah blah...the future is now and blah blah blah...I wanted to give him my GPS minus the batteries and drop him off in the training area with a reasonable time limit to get back...after driving him around in circles for awhile...if you can't handle the basics using a compass and reading a map when your "the future is now and technology is next to Godliness" fails you...you are screwed...or worse...
Thank you, Dave...always learning something new when I watch your channel. I picked up the Suunto MC2 after watching an orienteering video by Shawn Kelly. Great video and I carry the notes taken on all of my hikes so that I can practice. I also have one of the military compasses that was given to me as a gift from a friend when we were both active duty circa 1972. We were on a deployment in Morocco and that compass saved my ass. While browsing on Amazon I found a pocket Brunton glow in the dark compass and tested it against the Suunto and it's okay but if my life were at stake the Suunto MC2 and a set of pacing beads would always be in my pack or pocket.
Well Dave. I broke the Suunto MC-2. I used it and stored it in my chest rig. So either through transport. Shooting prone on the ground and pressing it against mags behind the pouch it broke the mirror cover off the compass. Can still use it with a map but using it to get an azmith and shoot a bearing with an object in the distance is a no go my friend. Had to order the Cammenga for tactical trainings and such. Guess I need to remember to do the math going forward for declination when using the Cammenga
I got the first compass you showed in a box of yard sale junk! It has a crack in the glass. But after your video I’m definitely going to figure out how yo use it.
It's very nice, and the glass can be replaced. I like them because they were made to be dropped on rocks by geologists.
@@ernststravoblofeld good point, I never thought of that.
If you haven't seen Dave's comprehensive tutorial series on navigation, do download it. It's divided into sections to make it easy. Like leaning to walk, you'll just need practice.
It's approximately 4years after this video.
(Best I've seen anywhere.)
Thank you Dave for covering the difference between the lensatic and base plate compass as far as declination. I have always used camenga with tritium but have since acquired Suunto MC-2. Love both.
Loved using them compasses - the second one - in Land Nav. Had mighty nice results with em.
I bought the Suunto a few years ago at your suggestion,and never went back to any other compass..I do like that Silva though. Thank you for all you do brother 💪💪
Check out Suunto MCB
Excellent video...I leaned how to use my compass when I started hunting ,that was 50 years ago ,im 65 now lol...Im no expert but it saved my ass from getting lost many of times on unfamiliar hunting grounds..Kids today would rather buy a gps than learn anything new lol thanks for the video
Because the compass needle rotates independently from the degree scale on a base plate compass, but the degree scale (degree card) rotates with the needle on a Cammenga type compass. I have found it helpful to think of how to use the two different types of compasses, as working kind of the opposite way of each other.
[I never use the adjustment for mag declination on compasses that have that function, because I like to play round with different kinds of compasses. Some base plate compasses don't have an adjustment, only a declination scale printed inside the compass housing. And compasses like the Cammenga, Francis Barker, etc. don't even have a mag declination scale. I find it easier to just always account for mag declination manually.
It is quite easy once you understand mag declination, but most people convince themselves magnetic declination is difficult. It isn't. If you don't make it so. --- If mag declination is 7˚ West, to orient your map to local terrain, just rotate your map 7˚ CW (from magnetic north orientation). If instead mag declination is 15˚ East, rotate your map 15˚ CCW (from magnetic north orientation position). Then you can take your compass azimuth directly off the map by laying the edge of the compass along the desired direction of travel. No math involved. If no map, forget about it, ah, er, it has no bearing.
But the math method is also easy:
[The map WAvES to the compass. And the compass WAvES back(wards) to the map.]
WAvES, = West Add v East Subtract.
Meaning when you measure an azimuth on your map of say, 200˚ (referenced to grid north), and your mag declination is 12˚ West. You would use a compass (manetic) azimuth of 212˚ to go to your destination. [From West Add 200˚+12˚= 212˚ - Map WAvES to the compass]. But if you measure a compass (magnetic) azimuth to a distant road junction of say, 112˚, on the map you would use an grid referenced azimuth of 100˚, The compass WAvES (West Add back(wards)) to the map. Thus -- West Add backwards becomes, west subtract. 112˚ +(-12)= 100˚.
And of course if your local mag declination were instead 12˚ East. Map WAvES to the compass would become 200˚-12˚-= 188˚ mag azimuth. And Compass WAvES back to the map would become 100˚+12˚ = 88˚ map grid north azimuth. [East Subtract backwards].
Man, I keep thinking I'd like to get a Brunton Transit type compass, just to play around with one. But haven't yet been willing to $pend the money for one. And don't want one of the cheap low quality clones. I've only been motivated enough to $pend the money to order a Francis Barker M73 from Pyseroptics in the UK. A fun compass to own. Accurate to 0.5˚. The Silva Expedition 54 or the newer version Silva Expedition 55 6400/360 prism compasses are fine too. About $94, also 0.5˚ accuracy. Not really needed as the Cammenga accuracy is 2.25˚(40 mils) , and the Suunto compasses are accurate to 2.5˚, which is plenty accurate for pedestrian land navigation.
This is a middle knowledge video about compass's and you nailed it, I'm glad you didn't go into "what is declination " question, you should already have this knowledge at this point. Just saying. Thanks for sharing.
That's is the first time hearing about a pocket base plate compass. I'm going to look out for one of those.
Great video. I know a hundred Times more than I knew b4 watching. Thank you.
Enjoy using the M2 Compass. Spent a few years as an 82C (Field Artillery Surveyor). The ability to find azimuth and elevation can put you anywhere you need to be.
Thanks for another great video full of important information. I like my Silva Ranger best so far.
I have the first 3. Glad to know I'm on point with my mapping and Land Nav.
Thanks Dave! This really clears things up for me on compass purchase. Also, the mini screwdriver that you mentioned in your SAK is great if you need to tighten the screw on eyeglasses! I was teaching many years ago (15-20) in a Christian school and had several kids ask me to fix their glasses. The screw would come out. When SAK came out with that gem I bought it and kept it at the ready for students' glasses. Never thought to use it for declination screws on compasses! Thanks.
I taught myself how to find latitude and longitude using a Brunton Geo azimuth compass. Difference from the pocket version is a hinge degree inclinometer. Simple set up, for precision work I include a precision solar watch, a Brunton tripod and tables for declination and GMT SNT, as well as a lat/lon map to record position. It’s a fun thing to do.
I carry button compasses and they`re what i use by far the most (in a pants coinpouch backup at other places).
Especially when in cities. I have used others and own another one but that`s the one i use most but then again i`m in central europe and it`s hard to get really lost here when in the countryside.
I just found this channel. You and Blackie Thomas are the best and the most informative instructors that I have seen. I'm looking forward to seeing more of your videos. Thank you for your presentations.
Not a compass pro but I was lucky enough to pick one of the compass’s your showing as my 1st nice Cordura holder well built and has alout of bells and whistles that I need more time to learn how to use.
I appreciate the info, Dave! I've been trying to decide on a compass for a while and was getting discouraged with conflicting info. I trust your opinion and I think I've made my decision. Thank you, sir!
May you always have a great health master Dave!
The British M-73 or M-88 prismatic march compasses are also fantastic compasses extremely accurate available in mils and degrees.
I will definitely be taking your advice and getting one of these. I got a cheap compass on sale recently and that’s the last time I do that.
Dave, good info, thanks for the break down. Like the suunto. Looked for the pocket compass, right now it is coming up as unavailable. Silva was my backup compass on the army and I carried the pocket one but it got lost in travels and been looking for awhile to replace. Thanks again.
Brunton TruArc 3 Compass.... favorite compass, sure its not the "best" but it does the job well and sometimes better than more expensive compasses for fifteen dollars.
Lots of compasses Dave. Glad you took time to explain the differences between each type.. many thanks.
Nice video! you have to try the RECTA compass... just amazing. Is actually the compass in use in the Swiss Army.
I made a living using a Brunton pocket transit for navigation and mapping in archaeology. For adjusting magnetic declination on a Brunton, a dime or penny is ideal. A trick you can use for orienteering is to hold compass with mirror partially elevated near your body. Hold the body level using the bulls eye level. You look down into the mirror and see the sighting arm with the hair line which can set vertical to the compass dial. You align the hairline in the mirror with the hair in the sighting arm. Look at your target with both hairlines together and read BOTH ends of the needle. In this orientation, with the mirror near your body, the white end is the declination from you TO your target. The black end of the needle is the declination FROM your target to you. You will find there are a number of tricks you can employ. The mirror for instance can also be used as a signal mirror, and has a hole through compass lid for that purpose.
Still have my original issue compass from 30 years ago, thanks Uncle Sam.
Hows the tritium doing ?, any life still in it?,
I like the direction you went with this. Thank you for pointing out the pro’s and con’s of these compasses.
Thanks for the info Dave. I started trying to figure out a good basic compass I need to carry a while back and found lots of info out there that done nothing but confuse me. I appreciate the straight forward advice. I assume you have info on your channel here about basic use of a compass, such as the MC-2. I will start watching them as well. I do like short to the point videos like this. Thanks again.
Good review Dave!
I have a Cammenga Mil-Spec tritium lensatic compass and a Suunto MC2 compass, but being an "old" Ranger who is still very good at land nav (backpacking, orienteering, etc.), my primary compass remains the Mil-Spec tritium lensatic compass, eventhough I understand the multi-use advantages of the MC2, it is my backup compass.
Used the Brunton artillery compass in the Mortar platoons back in my Army days. The military/artillery Brunton transits show NATO Mil-radians instead of true Mil-radians. NATO Mil-radians have 6400 Mils in a circle. True Mil-radians have 6283 Mils in a circle.
The difference between NATO and true Mil-radians may get you off course.
Relearned land nav years ago with your videos and invested in the recommended compass your talking about; wow; it makes navigating way easier; wish the MIL would have used this style..
As somebody who has owned & used various compasses for the last 35+ years in army & bushcraft applications I second the small & lightweight "SILVA Ranger SL". I've used it on long UL solo hikes with success in the Ukrainian Carpathian Mountains, a wild terrain without much signs & paths. An equally capable model is the RECTA DP6G / SUUNTO MB-6NH. The advantage is that the mirror folds downward so that the image isn't inverted, as compared to all other sighting compasses with an upward folding mirror. Regards from Germany, Gereon
I paused the video and bought a Suunto MC-2 and started looking for the Silva but I missed the model name. Rewatching to see if you mentioned it. Thanks for sharing this information!
I bought compass for $10 in 1957
I still have it .the mirror is rather scratched but it still works
The baseplate compasses are the best for map work. They're the easiest to use when getting a bearing off the map or when transferring a bearing to a map, because you don't need to align the map with north. Lensatic compasses are the best for sighting bearings, but they do need the map to be aligned with north. The Cammenga also has the disadvantage of not having a 1 degree scale, working only with 5 degree increments, and the mil scale is also slightly bigger than 1 degree, and the bezel only rotates in 3 degree increments, which means you can't get better than +/- 1.5 degrees with it. This may be offset by the build quality, since some baseplate compasses might not be able to achieve that +/- 1.5 degree accuracy despite having 1 degree increment scales.
Very informative video. I have had a Suunto M-3 for a few years and plan to upgrade it in the future.
Thanks for that video Sir, it is great I asked you questions about this a little while ago and this is more than I asked for.
Thanks you!
JMO- I've had one of the military cammenga units I gave seventy bucks for. It stuck on it's axis and got me bad lost in the wee hours. My buddy had one that did the same in the sticks at 10,000 feet, so needless to say I don't use those. My old 40 year plus Silva still does ok. I think the majority of folks just need the needle to point correctly every time and all the other stuff is superfluous
I have the pocket transit, the geological version. I have even found it suitable for cave mapping.
Very good video
Thank you for the tips, David! Navigation is a fundamental skill for sure.
Dave , in setting the compass, you say if you didn't leep frog your off course, am i ms understanding that. This is my first compass, watc and learn a lot from you , Thanks
I have the MC2 but will definitely be getting the Silva. Thanks Dave!
definetly a very helpful video, thanks!
I've got an old engineer compass and it works pretty damn well!
That was awesome!!! Very informative and educational! Thank you!!!
I bought the MC-2 and love it. It really is a multifunctional great piece of equipment. The mirror is amazing.
i learned what declination is. that's good.
I'd agree the MC2 is a great compass, I use the cammenga personally. Great video and stay safe.
Just the video I was looking for, thanks brother🙏
Excellent presentation!
Thank you!
Thank you for the information on the compasses
Just got the silva pin on compass not long ago and its great.
That was an outstanding informative video. Thank you
I have the suunto mc2 and have had it since 2008 a bit old now... sadly some of the print has started to come off a bit on the back but only for the ruler parts not the degrees in the middle.... though next time despite it works very well I agree with David on that part for sure... but I might next time get a Silva Expedition S compass instead just to try something new but also coz I hope it will keep the print longer... Cheers great content right here 👍
Excellent clarification! Thank you Dave!
Great video Dave thank you for the information. There are so many compasses out there it is just ridiculous. Thanks for narrowing it down a little bit.
Thank you, David.
on your recommendation a few years ago i got the Suunto and love it.. i don't use it that often but it is easy to read and does everything i need it to do and yes the magnifier will light char material lol
Good stuff man. Thanks. Hope to make a class sometime.
I was a surveyor for almost 40 years and of all the equipment I bought, the one thing I wanted, was a Brunton(for some reason, everyone referred to this as an "After Brunton" ... do not know why)
Surveyors don't really use the Brunton(or any compass), to survey, as much as to "re-survey", or trace old properties that had originally set up by compass(with a recorded date(i.e., June 1, 1947), so the declination for the original survey can be ascertained, and compared to the present day declination ... A big issue with this is that all along a property, local attractions may effect the original compass readings. A surveyor's Transit will not indicate bearings affected by local attractions, and magnetic readings(reverse and forward), should present an exterior or interior angle,
Always "re-survey", with similar equipment, to get similar results.
Suntto Mc 2 only thing I’ve carried for yrs never had a problem
Great video made me realize that I bought a junk cheap compass
I have the Cammenga as my go to with a set of ranger beads on it.. I do the PAULS nav as well, it works great for that. Have the K and R that is like your Suntto but it just doesn't do it for me, except for the survival reasons you described. Hope all is well, Great Vid.👍
Always learn something every video I watch. Keep up the good work.