I feel sorry for electric car drivers and future owners. They will simply have to learn the hard way .. as I did. These things are a huge hassle, all those lost hours sitting in those charging stations, huge anxiety, plus a outrageous expense in the long run. Good luck trying to sell a used Electric car with wore out battery modules. You'll find out nobody wants to pay the ridiculous price of batteries ... Batteries are very ... very expensive to replace ( thousands and thousands of dollars) ... and make no mistake, you will be replacing them. These batteries are highly toxic to our environment, with a high potential for disaster to our surroundings. DON'T FOOL YOURSELF and CERTAINLY, DON'T LISTEN TO A SALESMAN , ... LITHIUM BATTERIES ARE NOT GREEN CLEAN ENERGY BY ANY MEANS! ... I wish I knew all this before I bought my car . Do your homework before buying !
I bought my EV (scooter) second hand when it was a couple of years old and the original (SLA) batteries were getting a bit tired. I replaced them with Lithium ion packs I made up from used cells. The result was half the weight, more than double the capacity (range), and now charged from home solar which gives me zero fuel costs for most of my local travel (weather permitting). The technology is improving all the time!
It's absolutely amazing how many lithium cells you can harvest from normal devices. I've been doing the same with my scooters as well. Drill batteries and DSLR cameras are the best source I've found so far for cells.
@@AdrianNelson1507 It's branded as Kiwi Eco, presumably just for the NZ market, but there's only been two sold in NZ under that name so it may have been re-badged as various things. I eventually found out it was made by Tao (or TaoTao) Motors in China, possibly an ATE501 but not sure about that. I've emailed the manufacturer several times trying to get more info but they have never replied so all the info I have has been gleaned from RUclips videos. It originally had 5 x 12V/20Ahr SLA batteries but I shoehorned 50Ahrs of recycled 18650 cells into the same space in a 18S20P configuration. Much better!
ICE powered vehicles are subject to major maintenance issues later in life that EVs are not. Personal experience kicks here, replacement of clutch, replacement of disk rotors, replacement or repair of exhaust system, replacement of long life spark plugs ( platinum tipped ), replacement of overhead can drive belts, etc etc. These items collectively add up to thousands of dollars. There are more high cost items that I haven’t mentioned of course. This short list is just to illustrate the point that people worrying about possible EV battery replacement face high costs with ICE vehicle maintenance and repair. It comes down to a case by case basis what the specific life costs are an ICE vehicle. The mechanical simplicity of EVs contributes to far lower regular maintenance costs. So on the balance of probabilities, and EV will cost far less to maintain over say 8 years than an ICE vehicle. Running cost are another dimension to owning an EV. Might be a good topic for the next video!
First Tesla here from 2014, until now 515000km and instead of 504km Range on full it gets now 484. It just ran out of warranty for unlimited km and 8years (yes, the good old times) but still has free supercharging anywhere, anytime. Had two motors (warranty) and they where not broken, but "made noise", loads of tires, windshield wipers and water and the center screen was replaced (free) because it discolored. Besides that, no problem. Nobody worries about the battery. Model 3 from 2019 (private) got now 70000km on it (lock down) and drives and feels like new in every aspect.
Yes. Teslas from a decade ago did proper thermal management and had more robust battery chemistry than some others. Large capacities meant the battery is loafing along most of the time. Consequently they have lasted. Current model EVs have mostly learned and should last similarly.
I own a 2017 Chevy Bolt, and its battery pack was replaced under a safety recall last month. The old pack had 97,000 miles and five years of use on it, with no measurable loss of range, at all. I also own a 2013 Nissan Leaf, which most viewers probably know has a poor battery management system, so is subject to higher degradation than better-designed packs. Even so, with nine years of use, and 75,000 miles, it still has 88% of its original range. I've noticed no measurable degradation over the last two years, moreover. Degradation appears to have hit a plateau on my Leaf. These are only two examples, of course, but they certainly seem to bear out the idea that replacing battery packs is not something that owners realistically need to fear.
You should fear it if you don't adhear to the manual. You can't just let the vehicle sit at 100 percent charge for months. There are so many limitations. Only people that get an EV must be smart. Luckily, most people that are willing to risk new tech are generally smart. This just isn't something an average driver should own right now.
@@ricky4673 "You can't just let the vehicle sit at 100 percent charge for months." True enough, but who would do that? It would have to be someone who did not drive his car for months. Not sure who that would be. Someone who lived overseas half the year, and left his car in his US garage, plugged in, I suppose, but that would be a rare use case, and the only thing you''d need to do is to set your charging limit to something sensible, like 50% charge. "There are so many limitations." I would disagree with that. A more accurate summary is that there are only a few, easy to follow limitations: 1) Keep your state of charge between 20% and 80% most of the time. 2) Charge to 100% only before leaving on a long trip. Time it so that you leave immediately after charging. 3) Charge on a level 2 charger most of the time. Avoid DCFC, except for road trips. That's about it. Easy peazy. No great intelligence or deep knowledge required.
@@ricky4673: Seriously, if you're going to refer to smart people (implying many people are dumb), then learn to spell adhere, proof read, or both. It's like misspelling "genius". There are things you just shouldn't do when writing, especially with spell checking provided.
@@stevenblackthorne4790 How many people still buy cars and never change the oil. How many don't change their timing belts or tranny fluid? EV is not yet at the stage of mass adoption. People continue to destroy their cell phone and laptop batteries from missuse. You say easy to follow but you have to keep in mind how many old people use cars and also how many drugged people that cannot learn anything anymore. How many women can't plug in a VCR or even know how to switch input channels? Yes VCR is old, but the entire time they were around, it seemed only 30 percent even knew how to hook them up. I helped many teachers back in the day and also my parents when I was a child. I will not suggest an EV to anyone until battery limitations and maintenance is fool proof. Perhaps that's when super capacitors or solid state get enough density.
@@ricky4673 "How many people still buy cars and never change the oil." Zero, or close to it. Everybody knows that cars need oil changes. "How many don't change their timing belts or tranny fluid? EV is not yet at the stage of mass adoption. People continue to destroy their cell phone and laptop batteries from missuse. (sic)" "You say easy to follow but you have to keep in mind how many old people use cars and also how many drugged people that cannot learn anything anymore. How many women can't plug in a VCR or even know how to switch input channels?" Not everyone is as smart as you, women especially. We get that. But since EVs require far less maintenance than ICE vehicles, they seem like a great fit for the clueless masses. EVs don't have timing belts, or transmissions, for example. "I helped many teachers back in the day and also my parents when I was a child." Well, all right. You are an expert, then.
The FF misinformation campaign is at new heights! Thanks for info electroheads. Would add couple thoughts. The concern over used EV batteries ignores a 500 pound gorilla. Lithium ion batteries were invented in 1992. Billions and billions and billions were made way before EVs. Even today more batteries are used outside of EVs than are used in EVs (this is changing of course as more EVs come online). Approx 3+ billion annually for cell phones. Drones, kids toys, lawn tools, hand tools, pads, laptops etc etc. billions more batteries. Until EVs came along those billions were either burned or dumped. Today there's growing number of recycling techniques that close the loop and reuse the minerals because of EVs! Interesting BTW that from earliest times to 2012 the cobalt was mined using child labor and environmental damage was growing exponentially. Yet we never heard about these abuses until fossil fuel interests hyper fueled opposition to EVs! Another opportunity to expose the lies of omission FF interests fling daily is to point our the number one use for cobalt. Goto the Cobalt Mining Association homepage and find that cobalt main use is as a catalyst for removing sulfur and other contaminants from fossil fuels. Again there were no fossil fuel adds attacking the fossil fuel industry for child abuse. Thanks for the video!
@@chrisspain And solid state looks to be getting closer now. BMW and Ford are to begin trialling the first batches of solid state batteries later this year....
I watched a few UK videos regarding charging stations. The issues are that either the charging stations are all in use (sit and wait for an hour or two) or the charging station is not working. Another reason why a person should not get an EV vehicle just yet. Infrastructure must be built to support this growing industry.
My first electric car was a home conversion using LiFePO4 cells in 2009. It had no cooling and would get hot when the car sat in an Australian summer sun all day. By early 2018, when I sold it, it had lost about a third of its capacity although it performed as well as new in all other respects. The battery had a small capacity so it was being given a hard life. Overlapping with that car, we had a Mitsubishi iMiev made in 2011. By the end of 2019, when I sold it, it also had lost about a third of its battery capacity while continuing to perform like new in all respects except range. It also lacked battery cooling except that it would blow cooled air from the air-con if it were fast charged but we rarely used DC charging with it. It did not do cooling when it was just plain hot weather. Both of the above cars 1) lacked cooling, 2) were always charged to 100%, and 3) had small capacities so a given distance driven required more charge cycles. Our third electric car was a 'Holden' Volt, a rebadged Chevy Volt aka GM Ampera. Its battery was regulated to only use the middle 2/3 of its capacity so it never went near the extremes of fully charged or discharged and it had liquid cooling that could work any time the battery needed cooling. We owned that for two years from 4 years old to 6 years old. In that time it did not change its pure EV range and seemed to be the same as its new specifications. Other examples had very high milage and little degradation, even in hot climates. The difference seems to be cooling and avoiding state of charge extremes. Now I have a 2019 Hyundai Kona 64kWh. After 2.5 years and 45,000km, there is no perceptible difference from new. I routinely have it set to stop charging at 80% and don't run it below 40% unless on a long trip out of town. It has proper liquid battery cooling. I expect it will be good for several decades. With a large battery capacity, 1000 charge cycles would be around 450,000km, which at our current rate will take 25 years. Modern well managed lithium batteries should be good for several thousand charge cycles so I expect this car to last a long time. I have friends with early 24kWh Nissan Leafs and their batteries have not generally fared so well in a hot climate. One friend replaced his when its capacity became too small for his local driving. It cost Au$10,000 supplied and fitted by Nissan. After a year or two, the replacement is also losing capacity. Nissan have done a considerable disservice to confidence in EVs. I would not recommend one for a hot climate.
Peter Campbell: Good points and examples. With most modern BEV's from good makers, for traditional LI batteries, they manage the battery with software to prevent 100% physical charging or 100% discharging, to protect the range. And even better, the LIFP (Lithium Ion Iron Phosphate) batteries that are getting cheap and popular have a GREAT reputation for durability (total charge cycles). With those, especially if you are careful not to charge or discharge completely, the battery should statistically last a VERY long time. The energy density is lower (thus far) and the iron is heavier so they have somewhat lower range and acceleration, but for middle class cars, they compare VERY well to ICE's, and outfits like CATL are improving the energy density significantly in recent years. 10 or even 5 years ago, I would have had reservations about battery life. Now, I'd just go with an outfit with a good reputation and a good track record on batteries, not overcharge or over-drain the battery 99% of the time, and figure the battery will statistically outlast the car -- especially given the way BEV's will continue to improve in the next couple decades.
My Hyundai Kona 64 kWh battery made by LG was replaced under a recall last February. My other car Chevy Bolt had it’s 60 kWh replacement with a 66 kWh under a recall in April of this yr, also made by LG & no cost to me the owner. I expect these batteries to outlast the car as they are liquid cooled & protected by the car’s BMS. Love both car’s, here in Vancouver BC Canada Dave
Why do you think that ? Those dendrites are constantly creeping, so we are told, so we never know if they are going to short the battery out, resulting in a car fire, like many others. Good tip, charge it well away from the house and garage on a long charge lead just to be safe. You never know ?
My Kia E Niro 4+ is now 1 year old has done 10,000 miles and no drop off, still achieving over 260 miles in summer months! I am super happy with my EV.
This is from June 2022...yesterday, Sept 2022, on the news a man said his battery died and his car is now a large piece of trash because replacing the battery costs $23,000
I have a 2019 Chevy Bolt. My battery was replaced under warranty. Now I have a longer range than my car started with due to the newer battery technology. I am not worried about degradation. I have 259 mile range and that meets all my needs for in state driving.
I purchased my leaf in 2018, and it is showing no sign of degradation in all the 4 years of its life. So when, and if,as a pensioner I will be selling it that battery 🔋 is in top notch condition.
Had my kona 64kw about 21 months when I bought it its range was stated at 258 miles After 3 or 4 updates at dealership 2 services 25,000 miles covered charged it to 100% last weekend showing 303 miles drove it 158 miles still showing 49% summer I know but I'm getting 250-260 in winter on motorway and town driving so is somehow better than when I bought it
I think the first few BMS software upgrades designed to fix the battery fire/recall issues had the effect of displaying more range than stated at new. I don;t know if this translated to actual range as I never drove it far enough to test, often enough. When we got our replacement recall battery, I noticed that the range indicator said 450km when I drove it away from the dealers. It's displayed 440-odd for the few times I've charged it to 100% since then.
All the ICE cars I have owned mileage degraded (53 years of driving). The Plymouth Fury about 1% a year to the Ford Explorer 5% a year. Before 1960 car engines only lasted 60k miles before overhaul (it was cheep as everyone knew how), ten years later the engine typically outlasted the car.
That’s quite true. I’d never considered some kind of degradation as the possible cause. Over a 12 year period, my Ford Diesel went from slightly over 800km on a full tank to well below 700km, no matter who was driving it 🤔
We bought our ID4 about 4 months ago and we love it. I don’t worry about the battery life at all and with gas prices the way they are we no longer worry about the gas station.
My question, seriously, does the cobalt really come from mining operations in Africa with children mining the cobalt? What about when the batteries die, what do they do with them, I’m told they are very corrosive and toxic to animals and at this time not recycled. What about the fire possibilities when the batteries get wet and impossible to put out?
My first generation 2017 Hyundai Ioniq has been on the road through 5 Canadian winters and has yet to drop below the original rated range. They were rated for 200km. When new, I was averaging 245km in summer and about 200km in winter with the drag of snow tires. As we come into summer, my range as we speak is right back up around 240km on a full charge.
@@JensSchraeder I took a 2700 km road trip holiday 2 years ago in a 200 km range EV, 150 km between charging stops. Saw places I didn't plan to visit, worked perfectly.
I drive every day on average 500 km or 2 people driving 1600 km taking turns we drive to ontario taking turns in under a day 16 hrs, that would stop under using an electric vehicle even if you said the range was 500km it would still add at least 5 hrs each charge to the trip, i only get 10 days vacation, l dont want to use my vacation time sitting waiting for a battery to charge, l can gill my f150 in under 5 mins with over a 1000km of gas granted for a lot more $ but it ads 5 mins to our drive time
But when the Batteries Finally Crap Out, what do they do with that worn-out battery pack? It is in fact Toxic Gabage Times Hundreds of Thousands of cars eventually.
No one is concerned about the batteries for the first decade, it is after 10 years. In Australia motorised transport that is 11 years and older, accounts for over 40% across the country. The second hand market is where 75% of all purchases are made. Trucks, industrial and commercial machinery is used for many years. The problem or concern is that electric cars will be dumped in large numbers within 20 years of manufacture because the battery cost will exceed the value of the machine. The availability of automobiles over decades of production is a great benefit and massive economic advantage. The electric car seems like a economically disposable car that is limited to the life of the battery, when we see the batteries start to fail or offer significantly reduced storage in numbers, the price impact on EV's will hit like a brick. The Tesla models will be the cars that will set this mark for the EV industry and they are mostly still less then 10 years old, with the early models about 12 years old. The long term of Tesla rests on its batteries; the economics of the whole thing will come crumbling down if the batteries start to fail or degrade quickly even at 15 years old. It means these very expensive cars are going to devalue at a high rate and wipe out any savings that cheaper electricity provided. The fast charging is going to put pressure on these battery life times.
I guess with so many people leasing or choosing PCP the prospect of having to deal with an ageing battery is near zero, but the free market would take recovery/replacement/recycling into account, keeping the finance deals a little higher.
That's good. If you were on EDF's EV tariff - which still onlycharges 4.5p per kwh - you'd be looking at 1p per mile running costs. Just don't ask what the daytime rate on that tariff is though.....
Don't forget that the efficiency of petrol and diesel cars also drops over time. Also there are specialist suppliers who can fit Nissan Leafs, for example, with longer range batteries than the original at reasonable cost.
Here in Sri Lanka Nissan Leaf car the electric vehicle was a complete failure the electric battery didn't last even 2 years. Nissan company turn a blind eye on this. Cost of the battery was around three quarters of the value of the car. Most people have abandoned these cars. We are very sorry for them.
Not sure who looked at Tesla model S/X warranty as they did not look at the website shows they do cover it for 8 years or 150,000 miles, whichever comes first, with minimum 70% retention of Battery capacity over the warranty period.
That 70% number is the cutoff Tesla uses to consider the battery unusable. That is not saying the battery will never get under 70%. They intentional publish it that way. Read the fine print. Telsa also accepts up to 13% battery loss in the first year. Meaning they will not even address the issue until more than that. So your 300 miles goes to 260 it's ok by Tesla standards. Until it gets below 210 they consider it a "good" battery.
Sounds like a sponsored video. Many people are driving vehicles 15+ years old with 150k+ miles on them and still running well. No EV today can compare to that.
What they are not telling you is that batteries age regardless of mileage. It's a function of time and charging cycle, not mileage used. So if you don't drive enough miles, you still lose battery to time decay. To make your money worth, you have to have enough mileage use. If you only drive a little bit, a plugin hybrid could actually be more less carbon footprint and last longer.
I'm on year 5 with my b250e and my range is still the same even with these older cells. Had my motor replaced due to Tesla making my motor half assed lol but otherwise it's been 60k amazing cheap miles!
Richard Denson: It is disappointing to hear how often Tesla motors have to be replaced. I wonder if it's because Tesla markets their cars like they're racecars, and so lots of people DRIVE them like racecars, pushing the motors hard very frequently. I've been driving ICE's for 47 years now, and I've VERY RARELY put the pedal near the floor. Even when driving my G37 fast on country roads, I still don't mash the pedal to the floor -- it isn't good for a an engine you want to last. I would imagine the same principle applies to motors. Either way though, an out of warranty Tesla motor replacement will be EXPENSIVE. Tesla fanbois love to claim Teslas will last forever, but I don't want a $5000 to $10,000 bill buying replacement Tesla motors, any more than I do for ICE engine or transmission replacements. So unless Tesla sorts that out and such motor replacements become RARE, like say, Toyota engine replacements. I'm not buying the whole Teslas will last forever claims at alll.
You don't necessarily *have* to replace the battery pack. You can have it refurbished at a fraction of the cost of a full replacement. There are independent EV specialists already doing this work in the UK.
Sounds great. Might as well get the most out of the battery pack you already own. Do you have any names of specialists who will do this or is it just a case of searching ev battery refurbishment UK?
@@tubularG Cleveleys Electric Vehicles, in Gloucestershire. They posted a video on RUclips about 3 years ago, of a battery refurb they carried out on a 10 year old Nissan Leaf. The job took 4 hours, and cost the Leaf owner £600.... Other EV specialists also exist.... The vids are often posted under James And Kate... (James works for Cleveleys) Cleveleys service and repair most EV's. Tesla's, Leafs, Zoe's etc, they do them all. James is the travelling service guy, and he covers most areas from the South Coast to Scotland, doing EV servicing and repairs. He frequently posts videos of his travels on RUclips.....well worth a watch. And he doesn't use a diesel van. He drives an MG5 electric estate car, covering most of Britain in the process.... Here.. ruclips.net/video/ohCgTFMFwsI/видео.html
Let’s not forget, it’s not going to be cheap to run an EV forever. Energy cost will increase and the govt will want their fuel duty and RFL replaced somehow.
There is a long-held belief on all UK online newspaper forums that EV batteries only last two to three years and no amount of reasoning can change the viewpoint of the contributors.
That long held belief is from someone whom has obviously never owned an EV. Nor have they even bothered to find out that a new electric car comes with an 8 year battery warranty. These folks are either Daily Mail readers, or they're paid by the oil companies to try to slow the uptake of EV's. In which case it it isn't working too well, as VW have sold their *entire* EV production for 2022 - into 2023. And Kia have sold their entire production quota for their EV6 for *three years* in some of the markets in which they sell the car..... These fools probably also believe the World is flat, that trains run on time, and Jeremy Corbyn is a nice bloke really....... They are fully fledged members of the "don't confuse me with the facts, because I've already made my mind up" camp...
I know of just a couple of incidents were batteries have been replace, both were in early Nissan leafs one didn’t require a full replacement just a couple of cell packs and the other leaf was owned by the Fully charge V-logger, it got an upgraded battery pack from I believe an insurance write off. Eight years is a long time and by then I believe batteries will be cheaper, have larger capacity and be available through companies that specialises in EVs.
Nissan Leaf (2017) is at 47% battery life. Their software was saying that the battery was at 72%. After reprogramming the computer it showed the actual percentage and now Nissan is replacing the battery. Problem is it takes him about three months to get the new battery in.
Don't fool yourself, buying an electric car will come back and bite you in the A$$ .... as it did my family ! ... Forget Batteries ! ... an lets move on to a newer energy source that won't poison everybody on earth !!
The running costs are only cheaper if you can charge your vehicle at home and on cheap rate. I live in a flat so would have to use public chargers which typically charge around 50p/kWh. Therefore a 50kwh battery will cost £25 to fully charge and give me an approximate range of 160-180 miles
Buy your food at your nearest Tesco, and use their free chargers. They offer free charging at 400 of their UK stores. There is free charging at Ikea, LDL and some Sainsburys branches too. 50p per kwh seems a lot. I was looking at some public chargers near where I parked last Wednesday morning, and they were 30p per kwh.... You unfortunately are in the minority. Around 60 to 70% of EV owners charge at home 90% of the time. It was probably a major factor in the decision to get an EV. You may find that if you actually subscribed to a particular charging network, you get charged less than 50p per kwh. It may even be 10 to 12p per kwh less, but you'd need to investigate the pricing structures of various charge networks...
Have you bought £25 worth of diesel recently? I put £25 worth in the wife's VW Eos, which does ~ 50 MPG. That £25 worth of diesel will get it less than 150 miles, and that's in a car that does about 50 MPG. So even on expensive 50 Pence per kWHr chargers, electric vehicles aren't any more expensive than an efficient small diesel vehicle.
@@DumbledoreMcCracken My average stop once a week when I do charge external is 15-20mins? Normally I am shopping during that time and it is free. So, no, my time is not worthless because it needs no time. Petrol however needs a trip to the petrol station (time) and 100 pounds to fill it up. So you pay on top of your lost time.
There's a simple way to estimate the range of a used EV. Take the usable battery capacity of the car when new, then assume 2.5% degradation each year. If the car is 5 years old, that's 12.5%. As an example, the Zoe R90 has a 41kWh battery, which is also the usable capacity in this case. The car was made in 2018, so the battery capacity should now be around 36kWh. In the worst case scenario that equates to 3 miles / kWh = 108 miles range. In the best case scenario (warm weather, dry conditions, not too many hills, and no strong headwinds) = 4 miles / kWh = 144 miles range. You can pick up a used Zoe R90 for less than £9k in 2023.
Great video, thank you for sharing. At the moment Ev sales so far are around 750,000 on the U.K. roads. At the moment there are around 32 million ICE and EV mixed cars on the U.K. roads. The U.K. Government are saying that they are hoping to have 300,000 chargers available on U.K. routs by 2030. If EV sales hit the 15 million by 2030 the if we work out the maths 300,000 chargers for 15 million EV cars this would equate to 50 EV cars sharing one charger. Well let’s hope the 300,000 chargers will become far more by 2030.
No it wouldn't, because statistically 80% of EV owners charge at home on an off-peak tariff. Why might you use public charging, when charging at home off-peak costs only a fraction as much? Public charger might typically be 60p per kwh. Home charging is 7.5p to 12p per kwh.......
@@Brian-om2hh 80% where did you obtain that figure and have you taken into consideration the people who can not have a home charge as they have no drive way or anyway to plug their EV into a charger, so these people would need to rely on the charger network.
Don't fool yourself, buying an electric car will come back and bite you in the A$$ .... as it did my family ! ... Forget Batteries ! ... an move on to a newer energy source that won't poison every body on earth !!
I drive a 2004 Buick Century. (ICE) I’ve owned it sense 2015. I have a full tune-up/check-up and oil change done at least once a year. I have additional oil changes done another 1-2 times a year. I only drive 10,000 to 15,000 miles a year. My mpg have dropped from 28 to 19. That’s a 4% drop in efficiency per year over the last 7 years. It’s only 68% as efficient as it was when I first purchased it. It has been a good vehicle and I will continue to drive it until it is no longer drivable or I no longer have any use for it. However, I can’t wait to be driving my first EV. I have a reservation for an Aptera.
Battery tech improving performance, efficiency and price so replacements in future should be no problem. UK need more direction to produce more EV,s and batteries.
I have just bought a 2023 Chevy Bolt and am loving it so far. I fully expect that in 8 years or so I would likely be looking to get a newer even better EV by then. But if not, I wonder if there will be an after market for replacement batteries. If batteries are getting cheaper, I wonder if that means I could get a replacement battery that is not only cheaper, but perhaps would even give me more range.
People that push batteries are literally the stupidest among us. She stops at 6 years... then just sites a possible 10-20 years... She shifts from 6 years to mileage rather staying with time. Smaller batteries have to be charged more, that shortens life. Large batteries weigh more, that destroys tires/roads (all energy bois and gurls) and require fuck loads more energy to make that large battery than one half it's size or smaller. I know people who run ICE cars to 300k miles in 5 years... I' don't base the longevity of the vehicle on mileage because much of it simply didn't have time to erode. The engine might be tired but most stuff is fine. Just existing takes a toll, sitting or running. In the end you're still powering your EV with FF... Solar and winder are made with gigantic amounts of FF and the batteries in EV are mass polluting and destructive to mine for... also mining condition are horrific and I guess if you don't mind child labor EV's are great. I'm not pushing ICE or FF just because I point out many of the horrible side effects of giant, idiotic batteries in EVs. I get it, you want to be cool and better than everyone else... well, you're not... you just fell for branding and advertising.
I still have 12 bars on my Nissan Leaf 30kWh battery after 5 years. However, the range has dropped and I suspect the BMS upgrade 6B doesn’t just release reserved battery capacity, it seems to have recalibrated the GOM to disguise the reduced range.
The number of bars mean nothing other than it is fully charged. Its the driving range that matters. How quickly those bars start dropping as you drive.
no, it's about 20% more the the equivalent petrol car (size, power, equipment) but it has a higher resell value and it lasts longer. Also, the more you drive, the quicker you see your money back, especially in urban situations where petrol cars are at there worse. Factor in congestion charge, parking, road tax and the possibility to charge with your own solar power for free, for EVER, it really is a no brainer.
Er, it isn't. Check the cost of a new Nissan Leaf. Then go check how much a new petrol Astra, Focus or Golf is..... (i'll save you the trouble. They cost around the same)
Less that 1% loss per year for my PHEV that I bought four years ago and have driven 3100 miles (50 000 km) since. On the other hand, a PHEV doesn't top off the battery like an EV, so the comparison might be skew.
Thanks for the nice video. There are even many reports about the latest LFP batteries, that will go up to 700.000 mls and more. But i have to disappoint you on that estimated price drop of batteries. Between 2019 and 2021 the drop in price slowed down significantly to 6% in 2 years. And since the last 5 months prices are going up between 10 and 20% depending on type of battery.
My understanding is Big increase in demand for batteries and not enough elements being mined to meet demand. Law of supply and demand affects prices. Chip shortages affecting all car production hence general lack of all types of car not just BEVs.
7-8 years ago, I bought an Audi A3 (gasoline) and I drove it for about 120'000km doing all the maintenance. One day, the starter broke and pieces of iron spread in the engine...which was unusable. The garage offered me to replace the engine for about 10'000 US$, which is more than the residual value of the vehicle. I sold the wreck for almost nothing and bought a Q3, all maintenance done regularly for 5 years. Today it has 170'000km with many defects (like loss of power/shaking between 2000 and 2500 rpm) that no garage has managed to repair, and I know that this car will definitely break down. The repairs exceed 10'000US$ (transmission, power loss,...). People who criticize electric cars and the cost of batteries never look at the exorbitant cost of repairs and troubleshooting on combustion vehicles. My next car will be electric, of course.
You did buy an Audi though, not known for their reliability or longevity of newer models. Most Japanese or Korean makes would have done that mileage without significant expense. What people also don't realise ICE maintenance and expenditure is over many years, a battery failure is a big expense all at once. On an ICE car many jobs can be done by skilled home mechanics, and parts sourced from many places, that isn't the case yet with battery packs and won't be in the near future. And those saying you only have to replace a few cells in the pack, there is a lot of labour involved and not that many places yet that offer that service, yes it might be in the future but certainly not now or even in the next few years in places like Australia where ev uptake is very low.
In the middle of having my 2016 Kia Soul EV's battery replaced under warranty because one cell failed, and is only registering 37% capacity. The other cells still have over 90%.
2015 Mercedes with Tesla drive line still at 90 to 107% depending on the external temperature. Sometimes at 92 miles vs 87 miles EPA. In winter can be down 62 miles or 70%.
To instil confidence in the used ev market, there needs to be a way to accurately check battery degradation on that specific vehicle (rather than just an app that gives an idea) because so many factors affect battery degradation.
We have a 2013 Renault Zoe. Now 9yrs old. One of the first in the UK. Still getting 80 miles in the summer. My wife who's retired loves it just to runaround in . Usual trips, Hairdresser, shopping, nails, shopping, chesterfield to Sheffield to see her mates and also did I mention shopping ? She loves the acceleration especially at the traffic light grand Prix 👍🔌🤣
well the good news is : energy densities of batteries would only get higher so when it does come to replace your large batt pack for BEVs especially one could get even more range at the cost of charging times?
2014 Nissan Leaf, it lost 6% in 6 years and 47,000 miles. I have a Tesla model 3 now, I guess it must have lost some range but it has so much anyway I haven't even bothered to work it out.
Owners talk about slow degradation ( there are reserve capacities being released to the operating region) but my understanding is the battery issues/warnings can come abruptly and isn't directly related to battery degradation. If current Li-ion batteries were so robust, why don't manufacturers offer reasonably priced extended warranty beyond 10, 12 or 15 years? Why did Tesla removed unlimited mileage warranty on the S and X in early 2020? Check Tesla motor club and note third party battery warranty providers' businesses are booming in the US. If batteries last 20 years, we wouldn't expect business to be brisk. Eight year warranty is mandated by government, not from the largesse of manufacturers. My next car will be BEV but we need to know facts and reality.
My Nissan Leaf from 2017 (now 2024) still has at least 95% battery health and has done 50,000kms. I suggest we Dont charge the battery up full capacity all the time and let it run down to 20% capacity before recharging. Also, charge it on the lowest charging at home, not at those stations…they stress the battery and wear it down. And give it a little drive often without smashing the accelerator too much. Letting it sit there fully charged does it no good. If you just tinker around gently that’s going to keep the battery nice and healthy loooooong time. See? 😊
Another positive here is that BMW and Ford are to begin trialling the first batches of solid state batteries later this year..... Solid state will mean a reduction in pack size/weight, and more efficiency/range..... they are also non flammable. The game moves on....
dcbel: That's common with lots of products with lots of electronics. Just look at computers. In the 80's an IBM PC or clone was horrendously expensive, unreliable (relatively speaking compared to modern PC's, slow, and had VERY little power). Modern PC's are basically cellphones, or dirt cheap used laptops (unless you have to have a fancy shiny new Apple, et. al), and have AMAZING power and durability if you get a good brand and take care of it. Re battery tech, I expect BEV's will have a similar improvement curve for decades (not as fast, but a huge overall improvement in cost, durability, range, safety re fire risk, etc). Lithium Iron Phosphate BEV batteries have ALREADY taken a huge step forward for people who want decent family cars and can accept moderate range and acceleration for MUCH less money and MUCH better durability on the battery.
Hi Electroheads, I shall be showing this to my 'stick in the mud' ICE mates who tell me the landfill sites across the UK will be full of toxic battery packs soon 😵💫We need a UK Richrebuilds here in blighty to sort out cheaper battery pack replacements. 😄
Thanks for a great video on EV batteries. My 2013 Fiat 500e has 67, 100 km on it and I am getting around 200 km range from a full charge. The range when new was around 140 km so my EV is actually getting better range every year. I try to train my battery to get better range by driving it down to 20% and then fully charge it to 100%, it seems to work well for me but my Tesla friends have advised me to charge to only 80%. Anyway, my battery pack was made by Samsung and the electric motor was made by Bosch. Hopefully when it comes time to replace the battery pack I would like to replace it with air battery. LOL
Most big companies make s bulk of their money from repairs. Their Car brand being faulty and being brought back for repairs but with electric cars what will be the equivalent of that?
Our Hyundai Ioniq 38kwh which is just over one year old needs a new battery. We had a battery management failure message. Luckily it is covered by the warranty and is on lease. It has been sat at Tilbury import centre since Easter waiting for a new battery with no news as to when it will arrive. To be fair to Hyundai they have supplied us with a 64kwh Kona which we love so we aren't that bothered. Kona for Ioniq lease money!
I did replace my Nissan leaf 24kwh battery with a 40kwh battery not because the old battery was no good it had only lost about 10miles range in its 9years on the road and 72000miles, I changed it to give me more range and I got just over 20kwh of home storage and it only cost me £6000 and 4hours work
I'm on 15 years with original battery and doing 75mpg toyota prius 2007 do i still need a new car? i don't think so think about it my car is more efficient then any new electric car right now i mean total combined financials and emissions for 15 years
I have owned EVs for 6 years and my advice is to always be prepared to pay for maintenance as not every essential element of the drivetrain is covered under the manufacturer’s warranty. Even a small replacement part can cost between £2,000 to £10,000.
Not a bed on EV roses.... as yet.... Depreciation of EVs with current battery tech and increasing fire intensity risks, plus big Tesla price cuts... a huge cost. Insurance companies are giving some nasty surprises to EV owners, including building insurance if EV charging is include within the structure... Rental car companies like Hertz and Sixth have had nasty surprises from residual values and damage... Plus range anxiety, plus queues for charging, plus not operational chargers...
Yea.... maybe if you keep the SOC always between 40% & 80%, never DC fast charge & live in a cold climate the pack will last 200000+ miles. That's a lot of limitations.
hybrids make more sense for towing caravans etc, in Australia half your holiday would be charging every 2 hours otherwise towing, yes i have driven a EV around Tasmania they are quick lol
My ZS showed full battery capacity for over a year/15,000 miles. However, over the last 5,000 miles or so, it's dropped by a little less than 5%. No idea how that's affecting range though, since I've never really believed the remaining range.
Plenty leafs struggles with a packs degradation since it have no cooling system. I replacing them and do a range extenders, folks calling me from all over US.
One common mistake: If the average of cars on the road is 8 years, that does not mean cars typically last 8 years. If cars were evenly spread from 0 to 16 years, the average age would be 8 years. In fact since there were more new cars purchased in the last 8 years than the previous 8, and some cars 'die young'..... cars have to be lasting more like on average 20 years, to give a current average age of 8 years.
While you reviewed the cost of "replacing" the battery, it will not normally require complete replacement. The James & Kate channel had one of the 48 cell blocks replaced with a "good used" on a Nissan for approx. £500. The dealers don't want this business but there are specialists out there who do. Similarly, it may cost £5.5k to replace a Leaf battery with a used one but the old battery withh also have a significant value - at least half this sum.
Can you please do a video on the take over of SPIN e-scooters by TIER in Essex and how the price of rentable scooters is increasing compared to being able to own your own scooter
I feel sorry for electric car drivers and future owners. They will simply have to learn the hard way .. as I did. These things are a huge hassle, all those lost hours sitting in those charging stations, huge anxiety, plus a outrageous expense in the long run. Good luck trying to sell a used Electric car with wore out battery modules. You'll find out nobody wants to pay the ridiculous price of batteries ... Batteries are very ... very expensive to replace ( thousands and thousands of dollars) ... and make no mistake, you will be replacing them. These batteries are highly toxic to our environment, with a high potential for disaster to our surroundings. DON'T FOOL YOURSELF and CERTAINLY, DON'T LISTEN TO A SALESMAN , ... LITHIUM BATTERIES ARE NOT GREEN CLEAN ENERGY BY ANY MEANS! ...
I wish I knew all this before I bought my car . Do your homework before buying !
I bought my EV (scooter) second hand when it was a couple of years old and the original (SLA) batteries were getting a bit tired. I replaced them with Lithium ion packs I made up from used cells. The result was half the weight, more than double the capacity (range), and now charged from home solar which gives me zero fuel costs for most of my local travel (weather permitting). The technology is improving all the time!
It's absolutely amazing how many lithium cells you can harvest from normal devices. I've been doing the same with my scooters as well. Drill batteries and DSLR cameras are the best source I've found so far for cells.
Dude im litterally gonna do the same thing w/ my nans mobility scooter lol, can quadruple the range and still weigh 2kg less!
@@SustainableGal I've got one of those waiting in the wings to be done too, but I'm hoping I won't need it for a while.😉
Curious to know which model scooter this was! :)
@@AdrianNelson1507 It's branded as Kiwi Eco, presumably just for the NZ market, but there's only been two sold in NZ under that name so it may have been re-badged as various things. I eventually found out it was made by Tao (or TaoTao) Motors in China, possibly an ATE501 but not sure about that. I've emailed the manufacturer several times trying to get more info but they have never replied so all the info I have has been gleaned from RUclips videos. It originally had 5 x 12V/20Ahr SLA batteries but I shoehorned 50Ahrs of recycled 18650 cells into the same space in a 18S20P configuration. Much better!
ICE powered vehicles are subject to major maintenance issues later in life that EVs are not. Personal experience kicks here, replacement of clutch, replacement of disk rotors, replacement or repair of exhaust system, replacement of long life spark plugs ( platinum tipped ),
replacement of overhead can drive belts, etc etc. These items collectively add up to thousands of dollars. There are more high cost items that I haven’t mentioned of course. This short list is just to illustrate the point that people worrying about possible EV battery replacement face high costs with ICE vehicle maintenance and repair. It comes down to a case by case basis what the specific life costs are an ICE vehicle. The mechanical simplicity of EVs contributes to far lower regular maintenance costs. So on the balance of probabilities, and EV will cost far less to maintain over say 8 years than an ICE vehicle. Running cost are another dimension to owning an EV. Might be a good topic for the next video!
Indeed. around 20 moving parts in an average EV, versus hundreds in a typical ICE car.....
Odd, I have an 8 year old ICE van and have spent a whole $350 since I bought it.
Batteries are no longer dropping in price: Inflation, demand for raw materials and EVs, and the trade war with China.
Electroheads, would it be possible to add links to the studies and articles mentioned in the video?
First Tesla here from 2014, until now 515000km and instead of 504km Range on full it gets now 484. It just ran out of warranty for unlimited km and 8years (yes, the good old times) but still has free supercharging anywhere, anytime. Had two motors (warranty) and they where not broken, but "made noise", loads of tires, windshield wipers and water and the center screen was replaced (free) because it discolored. Besides that, no problem. Nobody worries about the battery.
Model 3 from 2019 (private) got now 70000km on it (lock down) and drives and feels like new in every aspect.
Yes. Teslas from a decade ago did proper thermal management and had more robust battery chemistry than some others. Large capacities meant the battery is loafing along most of the time. Consequently they have lasted. Current model EVs have mostly learned and should last similarly.
I own a 2017 Chevy Bolt, and its battery pack was replaced under a safety recall last month. The old pack had 97,000 miles and five years of use on it, with no measurable loss of range, at all. I also own a 2013 Nissan Leaf, which most viewers probably know has a poor battery management system, so is subject to higher degradation than better-designed packs. Even so, with nine years of use, and 75,000 miles, it still has 88% of its original range. I've noticed no measurable degradation over the last two years, moreover. Degradation appears to have hit a plateau on my Leaf.
These are only two examples, of course, but they certainly seem to bear out the idea that replacing battery packs is not something that owners realistically need to fear.
You should fear it if you don't adhear to the manual. You can't just let the vehicle sit at 100 percent charge for months. There are so many limitations. Only people that get an EV must be smart.
Luckily, most people that are willing to risk new tech are generally smart. This just isn't something an average driver should own right now.
@@ricky4673 "You can't just let the vehicle sit at 100 percent charge for months."
True enough, but who would do that? It would have to be someone who did not drive his car for months. Not sure who that would be. Someone who lived overseas half the year, and left his car in his US garage, plugged in, I suppose, but that would be a rare use case, and the only thing you''d need to do is to set your charging limit to something sensible, like 50% charge.
"There are so many limitations."
I would disagree with that. A more accurate summary is that there are only a few, easy to follow limitations:
1) Keep your state of charge between 20% and 80% most of the time.
2) Charge to 100% only before leaving on a long trip. Time it so that you leave immediately after charging.
3) Charge on a level 2 charger most of the time. Avoid DCFC, except for road trips.
That's about it. Easy peazy. No great intelligence or deep knowledge required.
@@ricky4673: Seriously, if you're going to refer to smart people (implying many people are dumb), then learn to spell adhere, proof read, or both.
It's like misspelling "genius". There are things you just shouldn't do when writing, especially with spell checking provided.
@@stevenblackthorne4790 How many people still buy cars and never change the oil. How many don't change their timing belts or tranny fluid? EV is not yet at the stage of mass adoption. People continue to destroy their cell phone and laptop batteries from missuse.
You say easy to follow but you have to keep in mind how many old people use cars and also how many drugged people that cannot learn anything anymore. How many women can't plug in a VCR or even know how to switch input channels? Yes VCR is old, but the entire time they were around, it seemed only 30 percent even knew how to hook them up.
I helped many teachers back in the day and also my parents when I was a child. I will not suggest an EV to anyone until battery limitations and maintenance is fool proof. Perhaps that's when super capacitors or solid state get enough density.
@@ricky4673 "How many people still buy cars and never change the oil."
Zero, or close to it. Everybody knows that cars need oil changes.
"How many don't change their timing belts or tranny fluid? EV is not yet at the stage of mass adoption. People continue to destroy their cell phone and laptop batteries from missuse. (sic)"
"You say easy to follow but you have to keep in mind how many old people use cars and also how many drugged people that cannot learn anything anymore. How many women can't plug in a VCR or even know how to switch input channels?"
Not everyone is as smart as you, women especially. We get that. But since EVs require far less maintenance than ICE vehicles, they seem like a great fit for the clueless masses. EVs don't have timing belts, or transmissions, for example.
"I helped many teachers back in the day and also my parents when I was a child."
Well, all right. You are an expert, then.
The FF misinformation campaign is at new heights! Thanks for info electroheads. Would add couple thoughts. The concern over used EV batteries ignores a 500 pound gorilla. Lithium ion batteries were invented in 1992. Billions and billions and billions were made way before EVs. Even today more batteries are used outside of EVs than are used in EVs (this is changing of course as more EVs come online). Approx 3+ billion annually for cell phones. Drones, kids toys, lawn tools, hand tools, pads, laptops etc etc. billions more batteries. Until EVs came along those billions were either burned or dumped. Today there's growing number of recycling techniques that close the loop and reuse the minerals because of EVs! Interesting BTW that from earliest times to 2012 the cobalt was mined using child labor and environmental damage was growing exponentially. Yet we never heard about these abuses until fossil fuel interests hyper fueled opposition to EVs! Another opportunity to expose the lies of omission FF interests fling daily is to point our the number one use for cobalt. Goto the Cobalt Mining Association homepage and find that cobalt main use is as a catalyst for removing sulfur and other contaminants from fossil fuels. Again there were no fossil fuel adds attacking the fossil fuel industry for child abuse. Thanks for the video!
Well said, sir... 👍
Like me, you're also clearly a fan of a certain Mr Llewellyn... 😉
New Batteries are cobalt free anyway.
@@chrisspain And solid state looks to be getting closer now. BMW and Ford are to begin trialling the first batches of solid state batteries later this year....
I watched a few UK videos regarding charging stations. The issues are that either the charging stations are all in use (sit and wait for an hour or two) or the charging station is not working. Another reason why a person should not get an EV vehicle just yet. Infrastructure must be built to support this growing industry.
My first electric car was a home conversion using LiFePO4 cells in 2009. It had no cooling and would get hot when the car sat in an Australian summer sun all day. By early 2018, when I sold it, it had lost about a third of its capacity although it performed as well as new in all other respects. The battery had a small capacity so it was being given a hard life.
Overlapping with that car, we had a Mitsubishi iMiev made in 2011. By the end of 2019, when I sold it, it also had lost about a third of its battery capacity while continuing to perform like new in all respects except range. It also lacked battery cooling except that it would blow cooled air from the air-con if it were fast charged but we rarely used DC charging with it. It did not do cooling when it was just plain hot weather.
Both of the above cars 1) lacked cooling, 2) were always charged to 100%, and 3) had small capacities so a given distance driven required more charge cycles.
Our third electric car was a 'Holden' Volt, a rebadged Chevy Volt aka GM Ampera. Its battery was regulated to only use the middle 2/3 of its capacity so it never went near the extremes of fully charged or discharged and it had liquid cooling that could work any time the battery needed cooling. We owned that for two years from 4 years old to 6 years old. In that time it did not change its pure EV range and seemed to be the same as its new specifications. Other examples had very high milage and little degradation, even in hot climates. The difference seems to be cooling and avoiding state of charge extremes.
Now I have a 2019 Hyundai Kona 64kWh. After 2.5 years and 45,000km, there is no perceptible difference from new. I routinely have it set to stop charging at 80% and don't run it below 40% unless on a long trip out of town. It has proper liquid battery cooling. I expect it will be good for several decades. With a large battery capacity, 1000 charge cycles would be around 450,000km, which at our current rate will take 25 years. Modern well managed lithium batteries should be good for several thousand charge cycles so I expect this car to last a long time.
I have friends with early 24kWh Nissan Leafs and their batteries have not generally fared so well in a hot climate. One friend replaced his when its capacity became too small for his local driving. It cost Au$10,000 supplied and fitted by Nissan. After a year or two, the replacement is also losing capacity. Nissan have done a considerable disservice to confidence in EVs. I would not recommend one for a hot climate.
Peter Campbell: Good points and examples. With most modern BEV's from good makers, for traditional LI batteries, they manage the battery with software to prevent 100% physical charging or 100% discharging, to protect the range. And even better, the LIFP (Lithium Ion Iron Phosphate) batteries that are getting cheap and popular have a GREAT reputation for durability (total charge cycles). With those, especially if you are careful not to charge or discharge completely, the battery should statistically last a VERY long time.
The energy density is lower (thus far) and the iron is heavier so they have somewhat lower range and acceleration, but for middle class cars, they compare VERY well to ICE's, and outfits like CATL are improving the energy density significantly in recent years.
10 or even 5 years ago, I would have had reservations about battery life. Now, I'd just go with an outfit with a good reputation and a good track record on batteries, not overcharge or over-drain the battery 99% of the time, and figure the battery will statistically outlast the car -- especially given the way BEV's will continue to improve in the next couple decades.
My Hyundai Kona 64 kWh battery made by LG was replaced under a recall last February.
My other car Chevy Bolt had it’s 60 kWh replacement with a 66 kWh under a recall in April of this yr, also made by LG & no cost to me the owner.
I expect these batteries to outlast the car as they are liquid cooled & protected by the car’s BMS.
Love both car’s, here in Vancouver BC Canada
Dave
Why do you think that ? Those dendrites are constantly creeping, so we are told, so we never know if they are going to short the battery out, resulting in a car fire, like many others. Good tip, charge it well away from the house and garage on a long charge lead just to be safe. You never know ?
@@stevezodiac491 Nope!
@@stevezodiac491 That's only true if you think the new cells have the same fault as the old ones.
Which do you prefer?
My Kia E Niro 4+ is now 1 year old has done 10,000 miles and no drop off, still achieving over 260 miles in summer months! I am super happy with my EV.
This is from June 2022...yesterday, Sept 2022, on the news a man said his battery died and his car is now a large piece of trash because replacing the battery costs $23,000
18000 miles done in just under a year in a 2021 Volkswagen E-Up! battery shows absolutely no signs of degradation at all. It looks promising 🙂
So you believe what the computer in the car tells you about the battery?
@@timothydevries383 I work for VW. I have access to all the data.
@@justinholding02 Where can I buy one 🧐
@@IDann1 in France we have some available
I have a 2019 Chevy Bolt. My battery was replaced under warranty. Now I have a longer range than my car started with due to the newer battery technology.
I am not worried about degradation. I have 259 mile range and that meets all my needs for in state driving.
I purchased my leaf in 2018, and it is showing no sign of degradation in all the 4 years of its life. So when, and if,as a pensioner I will be selling it that battery 🔋 is in top notch condition.
My 2017 30kw leaf still has all its battery bars. I normally charge at home overnight.
Had my kona 64kw about 21 months when I bought it its range was stated at 258 miles
After 3 or 4 updates at dealership 2 services 25,000 miles covered charged it to 100% last weekend showing 303 miles drove it 158 miles still showing 49% summer I know but I'm getting 250-260 in winter on motorway and town driving so is somehow better than when I bought it
I think the first few BMS software upgrades designed to fix the battery fire/recall issues had the effect of displaying more range than stated at new. I don;t know if this translated to actual range as I never drove it far enough to test, often enough. When we got our replacement recall battery, I noticed that the range indicator said 450km when I drove it away from the dealers. It's displayed 440-odd for the few times I've charged it to 100% since then.
I have a Tesla 2 and after 100,000 miles the battery was 50% shot and range down to 75 Miles.
All the ICE cars I have owned mileage degraded (53 years of driving). The Plymouth Fury about 1% a year to the Ford Explorer 5% a year.
Before 1960 car engines only lasted 60k miles before overhaul (it was cheep as everyone knew how), ten years later the engine typically outlasted the car.
That’s quite true. I’d never considered some kind of degradation as the possible cause. Over a 12 year period, my Ford Diesel went from slightly over 800km on a full tank to well below 700km, no matter who was driving it 🤔
We bought our ID4 about 4 months ago and we love it. I don’t worry about the battery life at all and with gas prices the way they are we no longer worry about the gas station.
My question, seriously, does the cobalt really come from mining operations in Africa with children mining the cobalt?
What about when the batteries die, what do they do with them, I’m told they are very corrosive and toxic to animals and at this time not recycled.
What about the fire possibilities when the batteries get wet and impossible to put out?
My first generation 2017 Hyundai Ioniq has been on the road through 5 Canadian winters and has yet to drop below the original rated range. They were rated for 200km.
When new, I was averaging 245km in summer and about 200km in winter with the drag of snow tires.
As we come into summer, my range as we speak is right back up around 240km on a full charge.
200 km sucks.
@@JensSchraeder
You’d be surprised.
@@JensSchraeder I took a 2700 km road trip holiday 2 years ago in a 200 km range EV, 150 km between charging stops. Saw places I didn't plan to visit, worked perfectly.
I drive every day on average 500 km or 2 people driving 1600 km taking turns we drive to ontario taking turns in under a day 16 hrs, that would stop under using an electric vehicle even if you said the range was 500km it would still add at least 5 hrs each charge to the trip, i only get 10 days vacation, l dont want to use my vacation time sitting waiting for a battery to charge, l can gill my f150 in under 5 mins with over a 1000km of gas granted for a lot more $ but it ads 5 mins to our drive time
The average age of cars on the road is not the same as average live expectation.
But when the Batteries Finally Crap Out, what do they do with that worn-out battery pack? It is in fact Toxic Gabage Times Hundreds of Thousands of cars eventually.
No one is concerned about the batteries for the first decade, it is after 10 years. In Australia motorised transport that is 11 years and older, accounts for over 40% across the country. The second hand market is where 75% of all purchases are made. Trucks, industrial and commercial machinery is used for many years. The problem or concern is that electric cars will be dumped in large numbers within 20 years of manufacture because the battery cost will exceed the value of the machine. The availability of automobiles over decades of production is a great benefit and massive economic advantage. The electric car seems like a economically disposable car that is limited to the life of the battery, when we see the batteries start to fail or offer significantly reduced storage in numbers, the price impact on EV's will hit like a brick.
The Tesla models will be the cars that will set this mark for the EV industry and they are mostly still less then 10 years old, with the early models about 12 years old. The long term of Tesla rests on its batteries; the economics of the whole thing will come crumbling down if the batteries start to fail or degrade quickly even at 15 years old. It means these very expensive cars are going to devalue at a high rate and wipe out any savings that cheaper electricity provided. The fast charging is going to put pressure on these battery life times.
I guess with so many people leasing or choosing PCP the prospect of having to deal with an ageing battery is near zero, but the free market would take recovery/replacement/recycling into account, keeping the finance deals a little higher.
If the average age of an ICE car on UK roads is 8 years, it doesn’t mean they only last 8 years.
Have 2019 Nissan Leaf with 35,000 miles zero battery degradation. Averaging 4.4 KW per mile. Very happy.
That's good. If you were on EDF's EV tariff - which still onlycharges 4.5p per kwh - you'd be looking at 1p per mile running costs. Just don't ask what the daytime rate on that tariff is though.....
Don't forget that the efficiency of petrol and diesel cars also drops over time. Also there are specialist suppliers who can fit Nissan Leafs, for example, with longer range batteries than the original at reasonable cost.
Yes, quite a few mods and adaptions for older Leafs. Available from a number of independent EV specialist......
Here in Sri Lanka Nissan Leaf car the electric vehicle was a complete failure the electric battery didn't last even 2 years.
Nissan company turn a blind eye on this. Cost of the battery was around three quarters of the value of the car. Most people have abandoned these cars. We are very sorry for them.
Not sure who looked at Tesla model S/X warranty as they did not look at the website shows they do cover it for 8 years or 150,000 miles, whichever comes first, with minimum 70% retention of Battery capacity over the warranty period.
That 70% number is the cutoff Tesla uses to consider the battery unusable. That is not saying the battery will never get under 70%. They intentional publish it that way. Read the fine print. Telsa also accepts up to 13% battery loss in the first year. Meaning they will not even address the issue until more than that. So your 300 miles goes to 260 it's ok by Tesla standards. Until it gets below 210 they consider it a "good" battery.
Sounds like a sponsored video. Many people are driving vehicles 15+ years old with 150k+ miles on them and still running well. No EV today can compare to that.
All rigged surveys and over hyped battery life. Let's wait for another 2 to 3 years and see what happens. I am sure it's going to be heartbreaking.
What they are not telling you is that batteries age regardless of mileage. It's a function of time and charging cycle, not mileage used. So if you don't drive enough miles, you still lose battery to time decay. To make your money worth, you have to have enough mileage use. If you only drive a little bit, a plugin hybrid could actually be more less carbon footprint and last longer.
Hi there, could you please state your sources for the data? The studies you refer to? Thank you kindly.
I'm on year 5 with my b250e and my range is still the same even with these older cells. Had my motor replaced due to Tesla making my motor half assed lol but otherwise it's been 60k amazing cheap miles!
Richard Denson: It is disappointing to hear how often Tesla motors have to be replaced. I wonder if it's because Tesla markets their cars like they're racecars, and so lots of people DRIVE them like racecars, pushing the motors hard very frequently.
I've been driving ICE's for 47 years now, and I've VERY RARELY put the pedal near the floor. Even when driving my G37 fast on country roads, I still don't mash the pedal to the floor -- it isn't good for a an engine you want to last.
I would imagine the same principle applies to motors. Either way though, an out of warranty Tesla motor replacement will be EXPENSIVE. Tesla fanbois love to claim Teslas will last forever, but I don't want a $5000 to $10,000 bill buying replacement Tesla motors, any more than I do for ICE engine or transmission replacements. So unless Tesla sorts that out and such motor replacements become RARE, like say, Toyota engine replacements. I'm not buying the whole Teslas will last forever claims at alll.
You don't necessarily *have* to replace the battery pack. You can have it refurbished at a fraction of the cost of a full replacement. There are independent EV specialists already doing this work in the UK.
Sounds great. Might as well get the most out of the battery pack you already own. Do you have any names of specialists who will do this or is it just a case of searching ev battery refurbishment UK?
@@tubularG Cleveleys Electric Vehicles, in Gloucestershire. They posted a video on RUclips about 3 years ago, of a battery refurb they carried out on a 10 year old Nissan Leaf. The job took 4 hours, and cost the Leaf owner £600.... Other EV specialists also exist.... The vids are often posted under James And Kate... (James works for Cleveleys) Cleveleys service and repair most EV's. Tesla's, Leafs, Zoe's etc, they do them all. James is the travelling service guy, and he covers most areas from the South Coast to Scotland, doing EV servicing and repairs. He frequently posts videos of his travels on RUclips.....well worth a watch. And he doesn't use a diesel van. He drives an MG5 electric estate car, covering most of Britain in the process.... Here.. ruclips.net/video/ohCgTFMFwsI/видео.html
How about a video on the cost to produce a battery in terms of the environment and human lives of children mining in the Congo.
Let’s not forget, it’s not going to be cheap to run an EV forever. Energy cost will increase and the govt will want their fuel duty and RFL replaced somehow.
There is a long-held belief on all UK online newspaper forums that EV batteries only last two to three years and no amount of reasoning can change the viewpoint of the contributors.
Don’t confuse them with facts, their minds are made up!
That long held belief is from someone whom has obviously never owned an EV. Nor have they even bothered to find out that a new electric car comes with an 8 year battery warranty. These folks are either Daily Mail readers, or they're paid by the oil companies to try to slow the uptake of EV's. In which case it it isn't working too well, as VW have sold their *entire* EV production for 2022 - into 2023. And Kia have sold their entire production quota for their EV6 for *three years* in some of the markets in which they sell the car..... These fools probably also believe the World is flat, that trains run on time, and Jeremy Corbyn is a nice bloke really....... They are fully fledged members of the "don't confuse me with the facts, because I've already made my mind up" camp...
I know of just a couple of incidents were batteries have been replace, both were in early Nissan leafs one didn’t require a full replacement just a couple of cell packs and the other leaf was owned by the Fully charge V-logger, it got an upgraded battery pack from I believe an insurance write off. Eight years is a long time and by then I believe batteries will be cheaper, have larger capacity and be available through companies that specialises in EVs.
Nissan Leaf (2017) is at 47% battery life. Their software was saying that the battery was at 72%. After reprogramming the computer it showed the actual percentage and now Nissan is replacing the battery. Problem is it takes him about three months to get the new battery in.
Don't fool yourself, buying an electric car will come back and bite you in the A$$ .... as it did my family ! ... Forget Batteries ! ... an lets move on to a newer energy source that won't poison everybody on earth !!
The running costs are only cheaper if you can charge your vehicle at home and on cheap rate. I live in a flat so would have to use public chargers which typically charge around 50p/kWh. Therefore a 50kwh battery will cost £25 to fully charge and give me an approximate range of 160-180 miles
Wow, expensive
Buy your food at your nearest Tesco, and use their free chargers. They offer free charging at 400 of their UK stores. There is free charging at Ikea, LDL and some Sainsburys branches too. 50p per kwh seems a lot. I was looking at some public chargers near where I parked last Wednesday morning, and they were 30p per kwh.... You unfortunately are in the minority. Around 60 to 70% of EV owners charge at home 90% of the time. It was probably a major factor in the decision to get an EV. You may find that if you actually subscribed to a particular charging network, you get charged less than 50p per kwh. It may even be 10 to 12p per kwh less, but you'd need to investigate the pricing structures of various charge networks...
Have you bought £25 worth of diesel recently? I put £25 worth in the wife's VW Eos, which does ~ 50 MPG. That £25 worth of diesel will get it less than 150 miles, and that's in a car that does about 50 MPG. So even on expensive 50 Pence per kWHr chargers, electric vehicles aren't any more expensive than an efficient small diesel vehicle.
@@johnnodge4327 but do take a lot more time to fill. If your time is worthless, then it is a good trade.
@@DumbledoreMcCracken My average stop once a week when I do charge external is 15-20mins? Normally I am shopping during that time and it is free. So, no, my time is not worthless because it needs no time. Petrol however needs a trip to the petrol station (time) and 100 pounds to fill it up. So you pay on top of your lost time.
I would love a battery leasing option where I can get a new one once they get better.
Might have to wait for NIO.
There's a simple way to estimate the range of a used EV. Take the usable battery capacity of the car when new, then assume 2.5% degradation each year. If the car is 5 years old, that's 12.5%. As an example, the Zoe R90 has a 41kWh battery, which is also the usable capacity in this case. The car was made in 2018, so the battery capacity should now be around 36kWh. In the worst case scenario that equates to 3 miles / kWh = 108 miles range. In the best case scenario (warm weather, dry conditions, not too many hills, and no strong headwinds) = 4 miles / kWh = 144 miles range. You can pick up a used Zoe R90 for less than £9k in 2023.
Great video, thank you for sharing. At the moment Ev sales so far are around 750,000 on the U.K. roads. At the moment there are around 32 million ICE and EV mixed cars on the U.K. roads. The U.K. Government are saying that they are hoping to have 300,000 chargers available on U.K. routs by 2030. If EV sales hit the 15 million by 2030 the if we work out the maths 300,000 chargers for 15 million EV cars this would equate to 50 EV cars sharing one charger. Well let’s hope the 300,000 chargers will become far more by 2030.
No it wouldn't, because statistically 80% of EV owners charge at home on an off-peak tariff. Why might you use public charging, when charging at home off-peak costs only a fraction as much? Public charger might typically be 60p per kwh. Home charging is 7.5p to 12p per kwh.......
@@Brian-om2hh 80% where did you obtain that figure and have you taken into consideration the people who can not have a home charge as they have no drive way or anyway to plug their EV into a charger, so these people would need to rely on the charger network.
I own 2020 Nissan Leaf SL Plus I live in Florida, the car is black, super charge maybe once a month & the car is doing great so far :)
If your only charging once a month your mileage needs are a fit for EV. Most people drive alot more than that.
Got a Leaf 2014 with about 90% capacity left after 8 years and 93.000 km.
Don't fool yourself, buying an electric car will come back and bite you in the A$$ .... as it did my family ! ... Forget Batteries ! ... an move on to a newer energy source that won't poison every body on earth !!
I drive a 2004 Buick Century. (ICE) I’ve owned it sense 2015. I have a full tune-up/check-up and oil change done at least once a year. I have additional oil changes done another 1-2 times a year. I only drive 10,000 to 15,000 miles a year. My mpg have dropped from 28 to 19. That’s a 4% drop in efficiency per year over the last 7 years. It’s only 68% as efficient as it was when I first purchased it.
It has been a good vehicle and I will continue to drive it until it is no longer drivable or I no longer have any use for it. However, I can’t wait to be driving my first EV. I have a reservation for an Aptera.
Battery tech improving performance, efficiency and price so replacements in future should be no problem. UK need more direction to produce more EV,s and batteries.
I have just bought a 2023 Chevy Bolt and am loving it so far. I fully expect that in 8 years or so I would likely be looking to get a newer even better EV by then. But if not, I wonder if there will be an after market for replacement batteries. If batteries are getting cheaper, I wonder if that means I could get a replacement battery that is not only cheaper, but perhaps would even give me more range.
People that push batteries are literally the stupidest among us. She stops at 6 years... then just sites a possible 10-20 years... She shifts from 6 years to mileage rather staying with time. Smaller batteries have to be charged more, that shortens life. Large batteries weigh more, that destroys tires/roads (all energy bois and gurls) and require fuck loads more energy to make that large battery than one half it's size or smaller. I know people who run ICE cars to 300k miles in 5 years... I' don't base the longevity of the vehicle on mileage because much of it simply didn't have time to erode. The engine might be tired but most stuff is fine. Just existing takes a toll, sitting or running.
In the end you're still powering your EV with FF... Solar and winder are made with gigantic amounts of FF and the batteries in EV are mass polluting and destructive to mine for... also mining condition are horrific and I guess if you don't mind child labor EV's are great.
I'm not pushing ICE or FF just because I point out many of the horrible side effects of giant, idiotic batteries in EVs. I get it, you want to be cool and better than everyone else... well, you're not... you just fell for branding and advertising.
I still have 12 bars on my Nissan Leaf 30kWh battery after 5 years. However, the range has dropped and I suspect the BMS upgrade 6B doesn’t just release reserved battery capacity, it seems to have recalibrated the GOM to disguise the reduced range.
The number of bars mean nothing other than it is fully charged. Its the driving range that matters. How quickly those bars start dropping as you drive.
The ongoing costs are cheaper than an ICE but the initial capital outlay to purchase is double or more of the equivalent ICE car.
no, it's about 20% more the the equivalent petrol car (size, power, equipment) but it has a higher resell value and it lasts longer. Also, the more you drive, the quicker you see your money back, especially in urban situations where petrol cars are at there worse. Factor in congestion charge, parking, road tax and the possibility to charge with your own solar power for free, for EVER, it really is a no brainer.
Er, it isn't. Check the cost of a new Nissan Leaf. Then go check how much a new petrol Astra, Focus or Golf is..... (i'll save you the trouble. They cost around the same)
Less that 1% loss per year for my PHEV that I bought four years ago and have driven 3100 miles (50 000 km) since. On the other hand, a PHEV doesn't top off the battery like an EV, so the comparison might be skew.
Thanks for the nice video. There are even many reports about the latest LFP batteries, that will go up to 700.000 mls and more.
But i have to disappoint you on that estimated price drop of batteries. Between 2019 and 2021 the drop in price slowed down significantly to 6% in 2 years.
And since the last 5 months prices are going up between 10 and 20% depending on type of battery.
That's the chip shortage, it will go away in 1-2 years
My understanding is Big increase in demand for batteries and not enough elements being mined to meet demand. Law of supply and demand affects prices. Chip shortages affecting all car production hence general lack of all types of car not just BEVs.
Not to mention COVID shut down a lot of stuff
Cost are actually going up on batteries right now due to supply and demand:(
7-8 years ago, I bought an Audi A3 (gasoline) and I drove it for about 120'000km doing all the maintenance.
One day, the starter broke and pieces of iron spread in the engine...which was unusable.
The garage offered me to replace the engine for about 10'000 US$, which is more than the residual value of the vehicle.
I sold the wreck for almost nothing and bought a Q3, all maintenance done regularly for 5 years. Today it has 170'000km with many defects (like loss of power/shaking between 2000 and 2500 rpm) that no garage has managed to repair, and I know that this car will definitely break down.
The repairs exceed 10'000US$ (transmission, power loss,...).
People who criticize electric cars and the cost of batteries never look at the exorbitant cost of repairs and troubleshooting on combustion vehicles.
My next car will be electric, of course.
You did buy an Audi though, not known for their reliability or longevity of newer models. Most Japanese or Korean makes would have done that mileage without significant expense. What people also don't realise ICE maintenance and expenditure is over many years, a battery failure is a big expense all at once. On an ICE car many jobs can be done by skilled home mechanics, and parts sourced from many places, that isn't the case yet with battery packs and won't be in the near future. And those saying you only have to replace a few cells in the pack, there is a lot of labour involved and not that many places yet that offer that service, yes it might be in the future but certainly not now or even in the next few years in places like Australia where ev uptake is very low.
In the middle of having my 2016 Kia Soul EV's battery replaced under warranty because one cell failed, and is only registering 37% capacity. The other cells still have over 90%.
Really interesting to hear some real life experiences, thank you for sharing!
Still using my my note 9 with a 1000+ recharges on it and I'm pretty sure it holds the charge as good as when it was new.
I want to know with a plug in hybrid can you find out how many miles the battery has done out of the total on the odometer!.
Do you have you heard anything else about scooters illegal legal in the UK
?
2015 Mercedes with Tesla drive line still at 90 to 107% depending on the external temperature. Sometimes at 92 miles vs 87 miles EPA. In winter can be down 62 miles or 70%.
2011 leaf, 55% range remaining at 180,000 km. Fine for what I need it for. I've seen loads of older EVs with almost no degradation.
My mom has KGM Torres EVX and she loves it.
To instil confidence in the used ev market, there needs to be a way to accurately check battery degradation on that specific vehicle (rather than just an app that gives an idea) because so many factors affect battery degradation.
We have a 2013 Renault Zoe. Now 9yrs old. One of the first in the UK.
Still getting 80 miles in the summer. My wife who's retired loves it just to runaround in .
Usual trips, Hairdresser, shopping, nails, shopping, chesterfield to Sheffield to see her mates and also did I mention shopping ?
She loves the acceleration especially at the traffic light grand Prix 👍🔌🤣
well the good news is : energy densities of batteries would only get higher so when it does come to replace your large batt pack for BEVs especially one could get even more range at the cost of charging times?
In Scotland and got a BMW i3 2014 still get 86 miles in the summer and 64 miles deep winter, I only do 25 to 35 miles a day max.
When I sold my 7 year old ZOE, the battery State of Health (SoH) was 98%.
2014 Nissan Leaf, it lost 6% in 6 years and 47,000 miles. I have a Tesla model 3 now, I guess it must have lost some range but it has so much anyway I haven't even bothered to work it out.
Owners talk about slow degradation ( there are reserve capacities being released to the operating region) but my understanding is the battery issues/warnings can come abruptly and isn't directly related to battery degradation.
If current Li-ion batteries were so robust, why don't manufacturers offer reasonably priced extended warranty beyond 10, 12 or 15 years? Why did Tesla removed unlimited mileage warranty on the S and X in early 2020?
Check Tesla motor club and note third party battery warranty providers' businesses are booming in the US. If batteries last 20 years, we wouldn't expect business to be brisk.
Eight year warranty is mandated by government, not from the largesse of manufacturers.
My next car will be BEV but we need to know facts and reality.
My Nissan Leaf from 2017 (now 2024) still has at least 95% battery health and has done 50,000kms. I suggest we Dont charge the battery up full capacity all the time and let it run down to 20% capacity before recharging. Also, charge it on the lowest charging at home, not at those stations…they stress the battery and wear it down. And give it a little drive often without smashing the accelerator too much. Letting it sit there fully charged does it no good. If you just tinker around gently that’s going to keep the battery nice and healthy loooooong time. See? 😊
8:50 the price of batteries is going down, and technology is evolving and improving at the same time!
Another great video, thank you Eilis!
Another positive here is that BMW and Ford are to begin trialling the first batches of solid state batteries later this year..... Solid state will mean a reduction in pack size/weight, and more efficiency/range..... they are also non flammable. The game moves on....
dcbel: That's common with lots of products with lots of electronics. Just look at computers. In the 80's an IBM PC or clone was horrendously expensive, unreliable (relatively speaking compared to modern PC's, slow, and had VERY little power).
Modern PC's are basically cellphones, or dirt cheap used laptops (unless you have to have a fancy shiny new Apple, et. al), and have AMAZING power and durability if you get a good brand and take care of it.
Re battery tech, I expect BEV's will have a similar improvement curve for decades (not as fast, but a huge overall improvement in cost, durability, range, safety re fire risk, etc). Lithium Iron Phosphate BEV batteries have ALREADY taken a huge step forward for people who want decent family cars and can accept moderate range and acceleration for MUCH less money and MUCH better durability on the battery.
Hi Electroheads, I shall be showing this to my 'stick in the mud' ICE mates who tell me the landfill sites across the UK will be full of toxic battery packs soon 😵💫We need a UK Richrebuilds here in blighty to sort out cheaper battery pack replacements. 😄
We have Electron Garage... They are doing amazing things with UK companies and have even developed a conversion kit for black cab Taxis👍👍👍
Thanks for a great video on EV batteries. My 2013 Fiat 500e has 67, 100 km on it and I am getting around 200 km range from a full charge. The range when new was around 140 km so my EV is actually getting better range every year. I try to train my battery to get better range by driving it down to 20% and then fully charge it to 100%, it seems to work well for me but my Tesla friends have advised me to charge to only 80%. Anyway, my battery pack was made by Samsung and the electric motor was made by Bosch. Hopefully when it comes time to replace the battery pack I would like to replace it with air battery. LOL
Running costs will be cheap until the government decides to charge tax by the mile
5:56 Typically in the UK? Right.... here where I live it took 2 weeks for the battery replacement under warranty.
Most big companies make s bulk of their money from repairs. Their Car brand being faulty and being brought back for repairs but with electric cars what will be the equivalent of that?
Our Hyundai Ioniq 38kwh which is just over one year old needs a new battery. We had a battery management failure message. Luckily it is covered by the warranty and is on lease. It has been sat at Tilbury import centre since Easter waiting for a new battery with no news as to when it will arrive. To be fair to Hyundai they have supplied us with a 64kwh Kona which we love so we aren't that bothered. Kona for Ioniq lease money!
Tesla warranties cover degradation now, too. Mine does.
I did replace my Nissan leaf 24kwh battery with a 40kwh battery not because the old battery was no good it had only lost about 10miles range in its 9years on the road and 72000miles, I changed it to give me more range and I got just over 20kwh of home storage and it only cost me £6000 and 4hours work
I'm on 15 years with original battery and doing 75mpg toyota prius 2007
do i still need a new car? i don't think so
think about it my car is more efficient then any new electric car right now i mean total combined financials and emissions for 15 years
I have owned EVs for 6 years and my advice is to always be prepared to pay for maintenance as not every essential element of the drivetrain is covered under the manufacturer’s warranty. Even a small replacement part can cost between £2,000 to £10,000.
Not a bed on EV roses.... as yet....
Depreciation of EVs with current battery tech and increasing fire intensity risks, plus big Tesla price cuts... a huge cost.
Insurance companies are giving some nasty surprises to EV owners, including building insurance if EV charging is include within the structure...
Rental car companies like Hertz and Sixth have had nasty surprises from residual values and damage...
Plus range anxiety, plus queues for charging, plus not operational chargers...
Yea.... maybe if you keep the SOC always between 40% & 80%, never DC fast charge & live in a cold climate the pack will last 200000+ miles. That's a lot of limitations.
hybrids make more sense for towing caravans etc, in Australia half your holiday would be charging every 2 hours otherwise towing, yes i have driven a EV around Tasmania they are quick lol
My ZS showed full battery capacity for over a year/15,000 miles. However, over the last 5,000 miles or so, it's dropped by a little less than 5%. No idea how that's affecting range though, since I've never really believed the remaining range.
Your readout may be a little pessimistic. They say average battery degradation is normally around 3 to 4% per year....
Plenty leafs struggles with a packs degradation since it have no cooling system. I replacing them and do a range extenders, folks calling me from all over US.
I'm happy that some love there EVs, I'm more than happy that I'll never own one.
An outfit in Montreal, Canada that specialize in Nissan Leaf battery replacement & upgrades in capacity offer really good prices.
The same is happening here in the UK too Graham......lots of mods etc for the Leaf now...
One common mistake: If the average of cars on the road is 8 years, that does not mean cars typically last 8 years. If cars were evenly spread from 0 to 16 years, the average age would be 8 years. In fact since there were more new cars purchased in the last 8 years than the previous 8, and some cars 'die young'..... cars have to be lasting more like on average 20 years, to give a current average age of 8 years.
While you reviewed the cost of "replacing" the battery, it will not normally require complete replacement. The James & Kate channel had one of the 48 cell blocks replaced with a "good used" on a Nissan for approx. £500. The dealers don't want this business but there are specialists out there who do. Similarly, it may cost £5.5k to replace a Leaf battery with a used one but the old battery withh also have a significant value - at least half this sum.
That's an excellent point! Thanks for sharing
Indeed.
I wonder what proportion of EV Cars were completely written off after an accident due to damage to the battery structure?
Can you please do a video on the take over of SPIN e-scooters by TIER in Essex and how the price of rentable scooters is increasing compared to being able to own your own scooter
Just sell it after three years, and get a new one. Treat it like phone, throw away concept.
Thanks for sharing