This is actually THE best watch rant I've seen in recent years. The substance of most watch rants today is only the vloggers opinion to justify their previous opinion, or answering comments, and then selling the watch discussed on their personal online retail store. This one is actually very informative and helpful. Tim is not only helping Omega, but also every other watch brand, for example; Patek, whose now recently admitted their lost of touch with younger generation and then starting to join Instagram with half-baked plans. Salute.
Omega's main problem is their ridiculous number of models and variations. It makes their product feel mass produced and cheap. Rolex's few models and incremental updates makes all their products feel classic and like a long lasting investment.
Yes all their “special” editions just downgrade the brand and cater to a wider audience, which in itself, is the main goal of a business, but us watch nerds like “exclusivity and uniqueness “ of a given model which to us talks about heritage and tradition of a model...
Also another point: there’s a Genta interview out there that he is quoted on saying that the only watch he regretted not designing was the Rolex Datejust
Rolex hasn't done anything truly horologically significant in a long time, unlike Omega. They create fictitious "problems" and then gild the lily to address these straw men. Example: 904L is good steel, but it isn't inherently better than 316L. 904 cannot be heat treated OR hardened. It gets dangerously brittle below 0 degrees F. It also work hardens during machining, like titanium, which is why Rolex reportedly stamps all their cases now; because machine time is absurdly long. 316L can be heat treated (even differentially) and does not get brittle even down to cryogenic temperatures (-320F). After std heat-treatment, they're approximate equals. Further, Omega can additionally cryogenically treat their 316L to have it be both significantly cheaper than 904L AND harder AND equally corrosion resistant. Example 2: The triple lock crown. My 20+ year old Seiko SHC 200m diver has never leaked. Ever. Nor has any other quality Maker's crown seals failed when they weren't supposed to. It's akin to advertising anti lock brakes in 2019; they're mandatory. Making a big deal out of the tripll locked crown is an insult to anyone who understands ISO diver standards. It's a faux "advantage". Next: nearly ALL of Omega's non-chronograph watches have 15 times as much EMI resistance as Rolex's MOST resistant watch, the milgauss. In fact, the 15,000 Gauss rating of current Master Chronometer movements is likely conservative as they currently lack the ability to precisely control fields any stronger than that. A std movement was tested to 60,000 Gauss (6 Tesla) without issue and with the same performance as 1.5T. with the proliferation of inductive phone chargers and neodymium magnets in purses, suitcases, backpacks, car gloveboxes, and even Kindle/iPad cases, magnetic resistance is a KEY component of maintaining precision over time. The current Rolex line may be built and regulated to +2/-2, but we'll see how long that lasts in this EMI dense world we live; we already know that Omegas will shrug that off without issue. Lastly, Chronometeric precision in the real world has been at least equal for the 8800/8900 Master Coaxial as compared to Rolex. Mechanical watches are already an en Vogue type of anachronism. They are a novelty we love. But nobody loves a watch that can't keep time. In ten years, when EVs are inductively charging in garages all over the country, along with phones, earbuds, BT devices, smart watches (for athletic activities), on counters and nightstands and coffee tables.... how well will Rolex's keep time THEN? It's not a fully answerable question, but the notion doesn't bode well for value retention.
Whatever you say, it doesn't change the reality that Omega turned into copy cat of Rolex in recent years. Look at the recenrt models, they all imitate Rolex. No one cares horology. Everyone buys for the aesthetics and Rolex has created the most iconic designs in watch history. If you want the precise time keeping machine, use your smart phone.
Omega has much more history than Rolex. Omega has made in-house movements for 152 years, while Rolex has always until recently bought movements to another company, that now owns. Lemania calibers are in-house for Omega, Rolex has used others calibers for chronographs, Valjoux, Zenith... Omega has many more innovations and fitted into all the line. Omega has Tourbillons since the 40's. Again, Omega has a lot more history.
Len F.Actually this is correct. Rolex until recently outsourced their movements and called them in house. Aegler SA made Rolex's movements until 2004 when Rolex just bought the company. Before that Rolex and Aegler had a decades old relationship in which Aegler only made movements for Rolex. Got to love marketing. And their use of 904L steel. No better than 316L, actually more brittle. Rolex marketing for the masses is unparrelled.
I agree that there’s too much variety at Omega. I hope there’s never the kind of manufactured scarcity that there is at Rolex that over inflates the price of new and used products and frustrates the consumer. The waiting lists at Rolex are ridiculous and considering that Rolex is a mass produced brand quite annoying. I like both brands but Omega is my first choice and I’ve decided to buy a Planet Ocean over a Submariner.
Our hobby is all about opinions, which makes this hobby so interesting. Regardless of history or marketing, both these watches are icons in their own right. As a long time watch collector, buy what you like and what you would wear. Personally, I have both and love wearing them.
This is a great video Tim !! I truly admire your passion for horology and the knowledge and insight you share is impeccable. Keep up your amazing and much appreciated effort. Cheers
I went Omega and In awestruck every time I wear it. I like a few Rolex watches and Ive worn one but they were meh at best, underwhelming to me (except for the sub, damn solid watch).
Nearly 4 years on and this is as true as it was then. I want to see Omega continue to grow but focus and not over saturate. I shouldn't have been able to get a brand new SMP300 for $4200 with full warranty. Glad I did, it is a hell of a watch for 4k but still want to see them strengthen the brand.
Great observation that makes so much sense, Tim. Sadly with Omega it’s part of a huge multi-brand almost faceless group. Rolex is still privately held, as is Patek and AP so reflects the personality of its owners.
I would definitely give Omega a try. I have tired buying Rolex SS watches from 10 ADs. Have bought other items from one of them over the years and none of them will sell me one. It is a mafia. I offered to prepay and wait 1 year or more if needed. Still they would not sell me a Daytona, nor a Sea Dweller, nor a Sky Dweller blue. I offered to buy all 3 and keep them. Not for resale. Nothing from any AD. I had to buy a new Sea Dweller from Ebay that came NEW with stickers and cards way over retail. Then I take it to an AD for service/maintenance/authentication and they say warranty is not good, that they can'y verify if original and it was obvious that they did not want to take care of my needs. I ended having to leave it for an appraisal which they did not even tell me total I would pay for this service and it would take about 2 months. Now that is terrible service no matter what has to happen to accomplish this. Rolex does not care about the clients unless they are famous. Rolex does not care about customer service. Rolex only cares about Rolex. It is evident form all my experiences with Rolex and ADs. I even went as far as prepaying for 4 watches to an Jewelry Store that claimed had a Rolex connection and ended up getting scammed. I then informed Rolex and they pretty much looked the other way. I own 2 Rolex watches which I will sell soon. I do not want to support this type of business practices. There are hundreds and hundreds of NEW Rolex watches for sale on Ebay alone. Many more in other websites. This is clearly a mafia. Clients that like the brand have to venture out on the secondary market to risk getting scammed to get one of their sport watches while dealers are selling these watches to their "secondary market distributors". When you buy one of those watches the warranty is not transferable. Rolex does not care about you unless you are famous. A regular hard working person with no connections can not get a sport watch in stainless steel the right way....from an AD and with a warranty. I will give Omega a chance and buy a few watches form them. This is my opinion based on real life experience. If you do not agree....lets agree to disagree.
the thing that sucks about Rolex is tat you have to either work at the jewelry store or be an insider to even get a stainless steel watch. thats not good. a little too scarce
Also, OMEGA should spin-off from the SWATCH Group and they should float 25% of shares on the NYSE, not only because of the marketing ,but so they become available and opened and transparent. This is also the KEY. Being public makes you honest and transparent (in most cases of course).
What is it that makes the Rolex fanboys always go beserk when someone states the obvious that Omega is just much more horology and history than Rolex will ever be. Objectively this is true... no spinning that.
I don't think Omega are that far behind in terms of outright quality and finish but yeah, the marketing of them leaves a lot to be desired, it seems unlikely they would ever usurp Rolex but they are definitely the best placed to get closer than most.
You're missing a key action that Omega needs to take Tim, they must go into the secondary market and buy up the junky watches they produced in the 70s, 80s, and 90s because the modern shopper uses the internet and pulling up a non-water resistance, gold plated, quartz Seamaster for $400 is only a few clicks away...
True. There are so many "limited edition" Omega watches that it's hard for anyone to pick one. Rolex? They only have a few models to pick from and it's a lot less of a tussle for a would-be buyer to pick one.
Tim I love your high quality videos and reviews. Most knowledgeable watch guy on RUclips! Omega should definitely hire you as a brand ambassador! Keep it up
Great video Tim! Just outstanding advice, and Omega may even be able to get their shareholders (Swatch Group) to tolerate it if they can see some long term value. But no one can drive demand like Rolex can. They don't have anyone to answer to except their legacy. They simply have to stay in business, make enough money to fund the non-profit that owns them, and that's easy for them to do. The strategy of choking off supply to drive demand runs counter to the year-over-year growth that publicly traded companies are beholden to.
I have both, 2 Omega' s and 2 Rolex watches. Both brands are great and have iconic watches on offer. I would like to mention that it's becoming very difficult to ascertain steel rolex sport watches and they seem to have a higher demand and almost impossible to buy from the high street rolex dealer.
Daytonas are fabulous watches in it's own right But the past few years of shooting price of Daytona is pulling away the enthusiasts and catering to the ultra rich So in terms of alternatives JLC Chrono Tudor black bay chrono and Omega speed master are terrific alternatives to the Daytona for the enthusiasts
Actually if you venture into the TT daytona, you can still find relatively attractive prices, not only for "ultra rich". Take the 16523 (daytona/Zenith) for instance, it sells between $10K+ gold+stainless, it's good value if you think that the SS 16520 is about $20~50k today.. Or even the 116523 with Rolex movement, also around $10K+... Not bad for this Legend of a watch, and the TT Zenith has probably good chance to appreciate considering the price hike for it's stainless counterpart in recent years.
I actually prefer Omega to Rolex every time. It’s like my past cars... Saab every time. Cried when that brand folded. Have emotion and joy for so many of my watches, though none are what I’d call really high end. I LOVE my planet Ocean 45.5 and bought it when it was first released in Hong Kong, whilst traveling there. I have just USED that watch. Abused it even. And it’s still awesome, my mainstay when not wearing a jacket. I tailor my shirts and have the left cuff made bigger to accommodate this size. If I’m traveling to deliver facilitated meetings, you’ll see me in the Planet Ocean. Easy time zone change, accurate, legible, and so, so strong. The model doesn’t get the love it deserves in my view...
So using which parameters did we establish that Omega has a problem , as a consumer I love and respect Omega , I have 4 of them , and really don't care about Rolex comparisons .
Why oh why does Omega have THREE different kind of Seamasters at about 40 mm (300, 300m, P.O. 600m)?? Why oh why does Omega offer TEN different variants of the Speedmaster? What does Omega stand for? What are it’s best/flagship efforts where no expense has been spared?
Omega has made great strides on their mechanical quality and over time this will improve their brand’s reputation, I tell people that modern Omega is great value. Rolex’s design aesthetic is amazing and timeless like Cartier along with their quality, they’ll never be toppled. Like in n out you don’t need much when you have the best, but they are reaching an unattainable level in price for many people. Omega needs to offer 12mm case options in their sports lines, put a ceramic bracelet on the DSOTM please, stop the speedy special editions unless they’re unique, scale down to 42 mm!!!!!! Stop calling anything other than the speedy pro the moon watch the others are speedmasters, step up their design game, offer thin dress watches, and lastly change the finishing variety on the coaxial movements the red text looks tacky too many similar striping waves show the guts a little more especially if you add exotic materials inside, make it hard for the counterfeiters, ahh taking a breath. Omega we’re harsh on you cuz you do much right but still have so much potential.
I still would take a Omega over a Rolex any day. I like great watches, I don’t need to wear a Rolex to look successful. Rolex should be criticized about their failure to supply their customers, two years is ridiculous. Omega has more options, and you can walk into a jeweler, and walk out wearing one at half the price of a Rolex. A win win !
Its completely true that Omega has too many models. I believe It should have only one chronograph line in Speedmaster, with only 9300 calibers and 1861. One Seamaster only, an improved 300M. One Constellation, th Globemaster, the Manhattan is a questionable design from the original. And one De Ville, the Hour Vision.
Omega has to stop intruducing new design,they need to retain their flagship desain..but they didn't do that..they made a high tech inhouse chronograph,but they put in the watch with new design,and they said it part of moowatch line..i think what they have to do is put the new movement inside the famous speedy pro case,use the same dial (no date) and let the customer choose,they want a manual winding movement or the newer automatic movement with the exact look like the astronaut watch
Amen, Rolex is overrated in my opinion. They hold back production you have to wait years for their watches. I tried a submariner on, to me it was to small of a face. I prefer my Classic 2000 Seamaster professional. Just got a Speedmaster heselite a couple of weeks back. If I want a Omega , I can buy one today and walk of the jeweler wearing it. I’m very happy with the Omega watches I own, and will continue to buy them. I don’t need a Rolex, just to look important.
Patek and Rolex don't know their customers - especially Patek, they are all FAKE customers pretending to be VIPs buying watches to sell them on immediately. Owning the STORES is the KEY in this business, if you need local retailers to convince a customer to buy Omega over Rolex something is WRONG with your PRODUCT.
Two years after this was made...Rolex are now losing huge amounts of customer support owing to their shady trading practices and unscrupulous dealer network. Omega are picking up the drop off with newly enlightened customers.
Lot so good information and advice but also influenced by Tim's employment by a watch seller. Early on he says that Rolexes can sell for more than their list prices and Omegas are limited to list. Omegas sell for significant discounts from list due to the flooding of the grey market.
Definitely Omega should simplify their product line. Dark side of the moon should be reduced to 41-42mm and with new master co-axial movement (I think this is something they will do for next year). They should not use any brand ambassadors, just get rid off them. They should not have the retailers, at all, they should only have their own Omega stores (yes STORE is much better than BOUTIQUE). They SHOULD NEVER EVER EVER EVER do what Rolex and Patek do with exclusivity bullshit, it is tasteless, like you have to wait 8 years for Rolex 116500 or 12 yearas for Patek 5711/1A blue dial - disgusting. Leave that "branding" business to Hermes, Rolex and Patek, but Omega should be better than this, it should not be a scam company. But really, the main thing is simplification of the whole line + owning and controlling the sale process and KNOW YOUR customers.
all great ideas that will NEVER happen. Omega could over take Rolex in 3-5 years if it did this and a few other steps. They could rebuild their brand. Here is the problem. Omega is a part of a publicly traded company. They would never be able to take 12-20 quarters of earnings hits to straighten out the mess that they created. They are entirely dependent on the grey market. Every year they force their dealers to take 5% more product to hit Omega/Swatch's revenue targets. The dealers sell off inventory at cost to the grey market because they can not possibly sell off all the watches they are forced to buy. Consumers are aware they can buy an Omega at 50% off in the gray market. So consumers are bypassing ADs more and more. They don't need them. However, even the gray market can not absorb all these Omega watches and models. It is reaching a tipping point. Omega needs to pare down models and quantities like Rolex. But they are unwilling to take the revenue hit over the extended timeframe required. their stockholders would fire the management team. The management team wants to keep their own jobs and salaries in the short term. If they were privately owned it would be a different story. They could take a long term view like rolex. Most of us could rattle off Rolex's entire SS mens catalogue off the top of our heads excluding PM and 2 tone. One explorer 1 version, two explorer 2 versions, one air king, two subs, two GMT, etc etc etc. Omega has 4 sizes, 3 dial colors, and 2 bracelet/strap options on virtually every model. Thats 24 variants in one watch! Then they have variants within variants. They have an aqua terra and they have a seamaster. and then they have aqua terra seamasters??? WTF is that! Or a Seamaster Railmaster!! WTF is that??? Is it a Seamaster or a Railmaster??? Or is it a 1957 Seamaster Railmaster with a side order of Trilogy with coleslaw.... whew
I think this hits the nail on the head. Rolex is self-owned by a non-profit corporation. They have no stakeholders. They can choke supply on certain models as they see fit and this drives demand through the roof! In reality, Omegas are far superior in technology and design. I love all the special editions and frequent changes personally. I say make as many cool an interesting watches as possible. But they'll never drive demand like Rolex can because they are accountable to the CEO and the CEO has to answer to the board, and the board has to answer to shareholders.
Omega makes great watches.. yet they try too many gimmicks in so many of their designs and the associated marketing that is devaluing the brand.. they should stick to core designs and robust marketing. Typical of a company run by accountants focusing on short term sales and profits... they should look at Rolex, AP, Patek and learn..., 😖
Rolex are not worth the cost anymore. The company creates a shortage of their tool watches to increase the price. The watch is just not worth it. You would have to be out of your mind to wear a sub in the ocean or lake for fear of losing it.
This is actually THE best watch rant I've seen in recent years. The substance of most watch rants today is only the vloggers opinion to justify their previous opinion, or answering comments, and then selling the watch discussed on their personal online retail store.
This one is actually very informative and helpful. Tim is not only helping Omega, but also every other watch brand, for example; Patek, whose now recently admitted their lost of touch with younger generation and then starting to join Instagram with half-baked plans.
Salute.
Omega should hire Tim and put him in charge of their marketing team!!!
I don't think it is a "devils advocate video". All what he said is quite evident.
More like operations. Distribution!
Omega's main problem is their ridiculous number of models and variations. It makes their product feel mass produced and cheap. Rolex's few models and incremental updates makes all their products feel classic and like a long lasting investment.
Point taken. To each their own.
Thanks for your feedback, and thanks for watching!
- WatchBox Team
Yes all their “special” editions just downgrade the brand and cater to a wider audience, which in itself, is the main goal of a business, but us watch nerds like “exclusivity and uniqueness “ of a given model which to us talks about heritage and tradition of a model...
Also another point: there’s a Genta interview out there that he is quoted on saying that the only watch he regretted not designing was the Rolex Datejust
@benvolio mozart AMEN brother.
Agree absolutely. Too many variations. They need to make it lesser for exclusivity.
To summarize: Omega are more focused on innovations, while Rolex are more focused on marketing.
That's an interesting take, thanks for your input Gail!
- WatchBox Team
Agreed. Rolex are the masters of luxury marketing. I don’t want Omega to be like Rolex.
Rolex hasn't done anything truly horologically significant in a long time, unlike Omega. They create fictitious "problems" and then gild the lily to address these straw men.
Example: 904L is good steel, but it isn't inherently better than 316L. 904 cannot be heat treated OR hardened. It gets dangerously brittle below 0 degrees F. It also work hardens during machining, like titanium, which is why Rolex reportedly stamps all their cases now; because machine time is absurdly long. 316L can be heat treated (even differentially) and does not get brittle even down to cryogenic temperatures (-320F). After std heat-treatment, they're approximate equals. Further, Omega can additionally cryogenically treat their 316L to have it be both significantly cheaper than 904L AND harder AND equally corrosion resistant.
Example 2: The triple lock crown. My 20+ year old Seiko SHC 200m diver has never leaked. Ever. Nor has any other quality Maker's crown seals failed when they weren't supposed to. It's akin to advertising anti lock brakes in 2019; they're mandatory. Making a big deal out of the tripll locked crown is an insult to anyone who understands ISO diver standards. It's a faux "advantage".
Next: nearly ALL of Omega's non-chronograph watches have 15 times as much EMI resistance as Rolex's MOST resistant watch, the milgauss. In fact, the 15,000 Gauss rating of current Master Chronometer movements is likely conservative as they currently lack the ability to precisely control fields any stronger than that. A std movement was tested to 60,000 Gauss (6 Tesla) without issue and with the same performance as 1.5T. with the proliferation of inductive phone chargers and neodymium magnets in purses, suitcases, backpacks, car gloveboxes, and even Kindle/iPad cases, magnetic resistance is a KEY component of maintaining precision over time. The current Rolex line may be built and regulated to +2/-2, but we'll see how long that lasts in this EMI dense world we live; we already know that Omegas will shrug that off without issue.
Lastly, Chronometeric precision in the real world has been at least equal for the 8800/8900 Master Coaxial as compared to Rolex.
Mechanical watches are already an en Vogue type of anachronism. They are a novelty we love. But nobody loves a watch that can't keep time. In ten years, when EVs are inductively charging in garages all over the country, along with phones, earbuds, BT devices, smart watches (for athletic activities), on counters and nightstands and coffee tables.... how well will Rolex's keep time THEN? It's not a fully answerable question, but the notion doesn't bode well for value retention.
Goof ; Rolex is the most profitable and most popular watch in history
Absolutely brilliant description, I’m saving up for an omega
amazing comment!!
@@wesleylouie140 and? How does that dispute what he said? Goof.
Whatever you say, it doesn't change the reality that Omega turned into copy cat of Rolex in recent years. Look at the recenrt models, they all imitate Rolex. No one cares horology. Everyone buys for the aesthetics and Rolex has created the most iconic designs in watch history. If you want the precise time keeping machine, use your smart phone.
Omega has much more history than Rolex. Omega has made in-house movements for 152 years, while Rolex has always until recently bought movements to another company, that now owns. Lemania calibers are in-house for Omega, Rolex has used others calibers for chronographs, Valjoux, Zenith... Omega has many more innovations and fitted into all the line. Omega has Tourbillons since the 40's. Again, Omega has a lot more history.
simple google search will prove this comment wrong.
Len F.Actually this is correct. Rolex until recently outsourced their movements and called them in house. Aegler SA made Rolex's movements until 2004 when Rolex just bought the company. Before that Rolex and Aegler had a decades old relationship in which Aegler only made movements for Rolex. Got to love marketing. And their use of 904L steel. No better than 316L, actually more brittle. Rolex marketing for the masses is unparrelled.
I agree that there’s too much variety at Omega. I hope there’s never the kind of manufactured scarcity that there is at Rolex that over inflates the price of new and used products and frustrates the consumer. The waiting lists at Rolex are ridiculous and considering that Rolex is a mass produced brand quite annoying. I like both brands but Omega is my first choice and I’ve decided to buy a Planet Ocean over a Submariner.
Hey Tim! Omega should hire you as the head of their Marketing team! Bravo! Excellent rant and points!👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Omega need to pay you for this advice. Great advice.
OMG!!! Somebody please send this to Jeán Claude Biver. He needed to hear this yesterday. Tim needs to be a CEO! Simply brilliant.
Biver, who left Omega in 2003?
He's been with LVMH for years now, heading up Hublot and Tag within that group.
I really hope someone at Omega is watched this.
He is absolutely right on every point.
That is some really interesting insight, Tim. Well done!
Our hobby is all about opinions, which makes this hobby so interesting. Regardless of history or marketing, both these watches are icons in their own right. As a long time watch collector, buy what you like and what you would wear. Personally, I have both and love wearing them.
In the tiny niche of horology fans, Tim is our rockstar anchor man.
This is a great video Tim !!
I truly admire your passion for horology and the knowledge and insight you share is impeccable. Keep up your amazing and much appreciated effort. Cheers
Here is my copyrighted quote:
"Rolex created and driven by business ,
Omega created and driven by horologists"
That's the difference.
I went Omega and In awestruck every time I wear it. I like a few Rolex watches and Ive worn one but they were meh at best, underwhelming to me (except for the sub, damn solid watch).
Nearly 4 years on and this is as true as it was then.
I want to see Omega continue to grow but focus and not over saturate. I shouldn't have been able to get a brand new SMP300 for $4200 with full warranty. Glad I did, it is a hell of a watch for 4k but still want to see them strengthen the brand.
You’re the best Tim! Plain and simple! Nobody does it better!
Great observation that makes so much sense, Tim. Sadly with Omega it’s part of a huge multi-brand almost faceless group. Rolex is still privately held, as is Patek and AP so reflects the personality of its owners.
I would definitely give Omega a try. I have tired buying Rolex SS watches from 10 ADs. Have bought other items from one of them over the years and none of them will sell me one. It is a mafia. I offered to prepay and wait 1 year or more if needed. Still they would not sell me a Daytona, nor a Sea Dweller, nor a Sky Dweller blue. I offered to buy all 3 and keep them. Not for resale. Nothing from any AD. I had to buy a new Sea Dweller from Ebay that came NEW with stickers and cards way over retail. Then I take it to an AD for service/maintenance/authentication and they say warranty is not good, that they can'y verify if original and it was obvious that they did not want to take care of my needs. I ended having to leave it for an appraisal which they did not even tell me total I would pay for this service and it would take about 2 months. Now that is terrible service no matter what has to happen to accomplish this. Rolex does not care about the clients unless they are famous. Rolex does not care about customer service. Rolex only cares about Rolex. It is evident form all my experiences with Rolex and ADs. I even went as far as prepaying for 4 watches to an Jewelry Store that claimed had a Rolex connection and ended up getting scammed. I then informed Rolex and they pretty much looked the other way. I own 2 Rolex watches which I will sell soon. I do not want to support this type of business practices. There are hundreds and hundreds of NEW Rolex watches for sale on Ebay alone. Many more in other websites. This is clearly a mafia. Clients that like the brand have to venture out on the secondary market to risk getting scammed to get one of their sport watches while dealers are selling these watches to their "secondary market distributors". When you buy one of those watches the warranty is not transferable. Rolex does not care about you unless you are famous. A regular hard working person with no connections can not get a sport watch in stainless steel the right way....from an AD and with a warranty. I will give Omega a chance and buy a few watches form them. This is my opinion based on real life experience. If you do not agree....lets agree to disagree.
the thing that sucks about Rolex is tat you have to either work at the jewelry store or be an insider to even get a stainless steel watch. thats not good. a little too scarce
Also, OMEGA should spin-off from the SWATCH Group and they should float 25% of shares on the NYSE, not only because of the marketing ,but so they become available and opened and transparent. This is also the KEY. Being public makes you honest and transparent (in most cases of course).
The insight displayed here is uncanny. Omega needs to hire this guy.
Can’t believe I haven’t seen this vid before.. that was epic!!
Wow! This guy is super insightful and has a plethora of knowledge.
What is it that makes the Rolex fanboys always go beserk when someone states the obvious that Omega is just much more horology and history than Rolex will ever be. Objectively this is true... no spinning that.
Boooom, keep up the good work Tim!
I don't think Omega are that far behind in terms of outright quality and finish but yeah, the marketing of them leaves a lot to be desired, it seems unlikely they would ever usurp Rolex but they are definitely the best placed to get closer than most.
That was deep. But good. Omega doesn't need to prove itself against Rolex. Rolex relies on celebrity endorsement
I love this rant.
You're missing a key action that Omega needs to take Tim, they must go into the secondary market and buy up the junky watches they produced in the 70s, 80s, and 90s because the modern shopper uses the internet and pulling up a non-water resistance, gold plated, quartz Seamaster for $400 is only a few clicks away...
True. There are so many "limited edition" Omega watches that it's hard for anyone to pick one. Rolex? They only have a few models to pick from and it's a lot less of a tussle for a would-be buyer to pick one.
Tim I love your high quality videos and reviews. Most knowledgeable watch guy on RUclips! Omega should definitely hire you as a brand ambassador! Keep it up
Great video Tim! Just outstanding advice, and Omega may even be able to get their shareholders (Swatch Group) to tolerate it if they can see some long term value. But no one can drive demand like Rolex can. They don't have anyone to answer to except their legacy. They simply have to stay in business, make enough money to fund the non-profit that owns them, and that's easy for them to do. The strategy of choking off supply to drive demand runs counter to the year-over-year growth that publicly traded companies are beholden to.
I have both, 2 Omega' s and 2 Rolex watches. Both brands are great and have iconic watches on offer. I would like to mention that it's becoming very difficult to ascertain steel rolex sport watches and they seem to have a higher demand and almost impossible to buy from the high street rolex dealer.
Steel rolex Daytona is for sure a good idea that's if you can get one though
WOW, thats was such an imaginative and inspiring video, superb. Hope Omega are watching..
Tim: You are really good at this and a real asset to the world of horology! Congratulations.
Very direct and no nonsense tip for OMEGA. Hope OMEGA hears this.
Tim that was awesome! Omega should throw money at you for doing their work!
Daytonas are fabulous watches in it's own right
But the past few years of shooting price of Daytona is pulling away the enthusiasts and catering to the ultra rich
So in terms of alternatives JLC Chrono Tudor black bay chrono and Omega speed master are terrific alternatives to the Daytona for the enthusiasts
Actually if you venture into the TT daytona, you can still find relatively attractive prices, not only for "ultra rich". Take the 16523 (daytona/Zenith) for instance, it sells between $10K+ gold+stainless, it's good value if you think that the SS 16520 is about $20~50k today.. Or even the 116523 with Rolex movement, also around $10K+... Not bad for this Legend of a watch, and the TT Zenith has probably good chance to appreciate considering the price hike for it's stainless counterpart in recent years.
I actually prefer Omega to Rolex every time. It’s like my past cars... Saab every time. Cried when that brand folded. Have emotion and joy for so many of my watches, though none are what I’d call really high end. I LOVE my planet Ocean 45.5 and bought it when it was first released in Hong Kong, whilst traveling there. I have just USED that watch. Abused it even. And it’s still awesome, my mainstay when not wearing a jacket. I tailor my shirts and have the left cuff made bigger to accommodate this size. If I’m traveling to deliver facilitated meetings, you’ll see me in the Planet Ocean. Easy time zone change, accurate, legible, and so, so strong. The model doesn’t get the love it deserves in my view...
Tim? When are you going to become CEO of a major Watch brand?
Excellent analysis as always Tim 👍👍
Dear lord this was a good video
I also think they should make the Speedmasters waterproof like the Daytona...
I agree mostly, but I feel in today’s age Omega needs young trendy famous celebrities promoting their business. Not Nicole, Cindy, and George.
Tim, The Watch Genius. Thank you. Well said.
Tim Mosso aka The Walking Watch Encyclopedia.
- WatchBox Team
Tim dropped a banger on this one.
Huge support for this video!
Thanks Dean, we appreciate your support!
- WatchBox Team
So using which parameters did we establish that Omega has a problem , as a consumer I love and respect Omega , I have 4 of them , and really don't care about Rolex comparisons .
You Sir are a GENIUS
Why oh why does Omega have THREE different kind of Seamasters at about 40 mm (300, 300m, P.O. 600m)?? Why oh why does Omega offer TEN different variants of the Speedmaster? What does Omega stand for? What are it’s best/flagship efforts where no expense has been spared?
Tim Mosso for Omega president!!
Is it me or is the audio in this video extremely quiet?
Every single one hits the point!!
Omega has made great strides on their mechanical quality and over time this will improve their brand’s reputation, I tell people that modern Omega is great value. Rolex’s design aesthetic is amazing and timeless like Cartier along with their quality, they’ll never be toppled. Like in n out you don’t need much when you have the best, but they are reaching an unattainable level in price for many people. Omega needs to offer 12mm case options in their sports lines, put a ceramic bracelet on the DSOTM please, stop the speedy special editions unless they’re unique, scale down to 42 mm!!!!!! Stop calling anything other than the speedy pro the moon watch the others are speedmasters, step up their design game, offer thin dress watches, and lastly change the finishing variety on the coaxial movements the red text looks tacky too many similar striping waves show the guts a little more especially if you add exotic materials inside, make it hard for the counterfeiters, ahh taking a breath. Omega we’re harsh on you cuz you do much right but still have so much potential.
Basically, Omega needs it's own Sergio Pininfarina.
Your speeches are top notch. For heaven sakes; omega, zenith, someone should just hire you instead. Biver's speeches got nothing on this.
Write all that down in an email and send it to Omega, they need to see it.
Why aren't you running Omega Tim? You get it. They don't.
I still would take a Omega over a Rolex any day. I like great watches, I don’t need to wear a Rolex to look successful. Rolex should be criticized about their failure to supply their customers, two years is ridiculous. Omega has more options, and you can walk into a jeweler, and walk out wearing one at half the price of a Rolex. A win win !
Its completely true that Omega has too many models. I believe It should have only one chronograph line in Speedmaster, with only 9300 calibers and 1861. One Seamaster only, an improved 300M. One Constellation, th Globemaster, the Manhattan is a questionable design from the original. And one De Ville, the Hour Vision.
Omega has to stop intruducing new design,they need to retain their flagship desain..but they didn't do that..they made a high tech inhouse chronograph,but they put in the watch with new design,and they said it part of moowatch line..i think what they have to do is put the new movement inside the famous speedy pro case,use the same dial (no date) and let the customer choose,they want a manual winding movement or the newer automatic movement with the exact look like the astronaut watch
Govberg hit the lottery with you. You could easily end up the CEO of any watch brand you want... your brain astonishes me.
Spot on
Very technical. Very well said. Yeah you should get paid Tim. Mire power to you.
Thank you; I'm honored by this friendly feedback!
Best,
Tim
Nick Jonas is now a brand ambassador... they're not listening Tim!
Omega should beg you for consultancy services!!! 🤣🤣🤣
Bangin damn watch-talk, as always.
when do u think a logical person can get a daytona at AD? good stuff bro!
I will get an omega one day. I do think they have too many models. At the same time it keeps them "affordable". I dont want them turning into rolex.
Omega all day. Saving for the seamaster diver 300m. 2018 8800 movement. The submariner can take the back burner.
Amen, Rolex is overrated in my opinion. They hold back production you have to wait years for their watches. I tried a submariner on, to me it was to small of a face. I prefer my Classic 2000 Seamaster professional. Just got a Speedmaster heselite a couple of weeks back. If I want a Omega , I can buy one today and walk of the jeweler wearing it. I’m very happy with the Omega watches I own, and will continue to buy them. I don’t need a Rolex, just to look important.
Mixed message, Tim
Second hand Omegas are the best value. They're very much cheaper than Rolex!
I see the Omega Speedmaster and it reminds me of Paul Pluta.
LOL!!!! So do I.
The pontiff the Governors governor
AC3
So it should remind about the Pontiff, as this timepiece defines the borderline between the shitters and fine watches
The best way I explain it to friends is
Rolex=Apple IOS
Omega=Google Android
Omega goes by METAS chronometer certification.
God I love this dude
Rolex the same old thing over and over Tudor a homage watch 100 %. Nomos beautiful watches Omega just that THE OMEGA.
This video is too quiet.
Bravo!!!
Patek and Rolex don't know their customers - especially Patek, they are all FAKE customers pretending to be VIPs buying watches to sell them on immediately. Owning the STORES is the KEY in this business, if you need local retailers to convince a customer to buy Omega over Rolex something is WRONG with your PRODUCT.
Bravo!
* Takes a bow *
Thank you Jeffrey!
- WatchBox Team
Two years after this was made...Rolex are now losing huge amounts of customer support owing to their shady trading practices and unscrupulous dealer network. Omega are picking up the drop off with newly enlightened customers.
wow. on point...
You on point Russ?
- WatchBox Team
Why the glasses? Why?
Lot so good information and advice but also influenced by Tim's employment by a watch seller. Early on he says that Rolexes can sell for more than their list prices and Omegas are limited to list. Omegas sell for significant discounts from list due to the flooding of the grey market.
Definitely Omega should simplify their product line. Dark side of the moon should be reduced to 41-42mm and with new master co-axial movement (I think this is something they will do for next year). They should not use any brand ambassadors, just get rid off them. They should not have the retailers, at all, they should only have their own Omega stores (yes STORE is much better than BOUTIQUE). They SHOULD NEVER EVER EVER EVER do what Rolex and Patek do with exclusivity bullshit, it is tasteless, like you have to wait 8 years for Rolex 116500 or 12 yearas for Patek 5711/1A blue dial - disgusting. Leave that "branding" business to Hermes, Rolex and Patek, but Omega should be better than this, it should not be a scam company. But really, the main thing is simplification of the whole line + owning and controlling the sale process and KNOW YOUR customers.
all great ideas that will NEVER happen. Omega could over take Rolex in 3-5 years if it did this and a few other steps. They could rebuild their brand. Here is the problem. Omega is a part of a publicly traded company. They would never be able to take 12-20 quarters of earnings hits to straighten out the mess that they created. They are entirely dependent on the grey market. Every year they force their dealers to take 5% more product to hit Omega/Swatch's revenue targets. The dealers sell off inventory at cost to the grey market because they can not possibly sell off all the watches they are forced to buy. Consumers are aware they can buy an Omega at 50% off in the gray market. So consumers are bypassing ADs more and more. They don't need them. However, even the gray market can not absorb all these Omega watches and models. It is reaching a tipping point. Omega needs to pare down models and quantities like Rolex. But they are unwilling to take the revenue hit over the extended timeframe required. their stockholders would fire the management team. The management team wants to keep their own jobs and salaries in the short term. If they were privately owned it would be a different story. They could take a long term view like rolex. Most of us could rattle off Rolex's entire SS mens catalogue off the top of our heads excluding PM and 2 tone. One explorer 1 version, two explorer 2 versions, one air king, two subs, two GMT, etc etc etc. Omega has 4 sizes, 3 dial colors, and 2 bracelet/strap options on virtually every model. Thats 24 variants in one watch! Then they have variants within variants. They have an aqua terra and they have a seamaster. and then they have aqua terra seamasters??? WTF is that! Or a Seamaster Railmaster!! WTF is that??? Is it a Seamaster or a Railmaster??? Or is it a 1957 Seamaster Railmaster with a side order of Trilogy with coleslaw.... whew
I think this hits the nail on the head. Rolex is self-owned by a non-profit corporation. They have no stakeholders. They can choke supply on certain models as they see fit and this drives demand through the roof! In reality, Omegas are far superior in technology and design. I love all the special editions and frequent changes personally. I say make as many cool an interesting watches as possible. But they'll never drive demand like Rolex can because they are accountable to the CEO and the CEO has to answer to the board, and the board has to answer to shareholders.
Why do you wear Nascar lovin', lifted truck drivin' style sunglasses?
What? Ferrari is the real deal. Rolex just pretends to be.
Seiko of Switzerland 😅😅😅
Why aren’t you working in Marketing? Omega should offer you the job.
Omega makes great watches.. yet they try too many gimmicks in so many of their designs and the associated marketing that is devaluing the brand.. they should stick to core designs and robust marketing. Typical of a company run by accountants focusing on short term sales and profits... they should look at Rolex, AP, Patek and learn..., 😖
the problem of omega begins when it is absorbed by the swach group
and Rolex by FAKE foundation where profit is split between lawyers and notaries.
That’s the truth!
Sorry, omega is not lambo, or is it anywhere close to rolex...
Rolex are not worth the cost anymore. The company creates a shortage of their tool watches to increase the price. The watch is just not worth it. You would have to be out of your mind to wear a sub in the ocean or lake for fear of losing it.