Removing Severe Tanning from Silver Age Comic Books!
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 23 июл 2023
- In this video i provide the rationale, methods, and materials for removing tanning from silver age comic books. The techniques are compared and contrasted with those for golden age comic books, with emphasis on differences for the comic era. I demonstrate with a copy of Tales to Astonish and include before and after pictures to show results. These techniques should result in either blue Universal label or occasionally Conserved label but in my experience when executed properly do not trigger purple or restored label from CGC.
#comicbooks #comicbookcollecting
#comicbookcleanandpress #comicbookconservation #comicbookrestoration #comicbookdrycleaning #comicbookwetcleaning #goldenagecomics #goldenagecomicbooks #silveragecomics #silveragecomicbooks #marvelcomics
List of materials and tools I use for cleaning and pressing comic books and links to purchase them on Amazon:
Resource Books
Comic Book CPR: amzn.to/3OVR9fe
Comic Book Stain Removal and Whitening: amzn.to/3d9kPIE
Comic Book Pressing and Cleaning: A How To Guide: amzn.to/3BRu4Hw
Equipment
Tusy Press: amzn.to/3YqNzjt
10X Magnifying lamp with LED ring light: amzn.to/3XTnPMH
UV LED Flashlight for detecting Restoration: amzn.to/3SGrSbh
3M P95 Respirator for use with organic solvents: amzn.to/3DdqE1B
Dry Cleaning Tools
Pentel Clic Eraser that i prefer: amzn.to/3A7d5jo
Refills for Pentel Clic Eraser: amzn.to/3p9kSHe
Staedler Mars Vinyl Eraser: amzn.to/3BUGDC1
Prismacolor Magic Rub White Block Eraser: amzn.to/3zNq5Ju
Kneaded Eraser: amzn.to/3bHeQdL
Absorene Putty: amzn.to/3djmxr4
Mini Eraser: amzn.to/3QhxAzE
Prismacolor Art Gum Eraser: amzn.to/3JGchoQ
Dotting tools for hand-working creases and dents: amzn.to/3Abampe
Sticker Removal Tool: amzn.to/3Pbg2Uj
LEDs for Photo Bleaching: amzn.to/3AaEb9d
Galvanized Wire for making staples: amzn.to/3QNXZol
Magazine Backer Boards: amzn.to/3S6h6KQ
65 lb Card Stock: amzn.to/3MwBtQa
Strathmore Bristol Paper for pressing: amzn.to/3qAQb1q
Aluminum plate for pressing: amzn.to/3EDDZlv
Crepe Square Eraser: amzn.to/3Dlq4ym
Wet Cleaning Tools
Un-Du: amzn.to/3dmQSok
Mister spray bottle, darkened for H2O2: amzn.to/3nqKT70
Photography tray for wet cleaning: amzn.to/3dgpUyQ
Non-woven polyester sheet or Remay for wet cleaning: amzn.to/3ZpnOPB
Ultra-Fine Stainless Steel Forceps: amzn.to/3N806CJ
Stainless Steel micro-spatula: amzn.to/3W0EBIc
Teflon-coated micro-spatula: amzn.to/3JGyJ19
Methyl Cellulose: amzn.to/3QhfL3y
Wheat Paste: amzn.to/3MXL2s2
Calcium Hydroxide: amzn.to/3zHXs0p
Bestine Solvent: amzn.to/3VpyYDi
Slabbed Comic Books for sale on Shortboxed:
Shortboxed.com/liberty_hill_co...
My eBay Store (raw comics & more!):
www.ebay.com/usr/liberty_hill...
I've been CPR'ing my books for awhile now and have been researching washing and deacidifying them. Your clear explanations and fantastic videos have really helped me get heading in the correct direction. I have aquired over the years a few books that are so badly tanned or stained that I have never touched them. I also have a box of test books just waiting for a good cleaning. Cannot wait to get started just need the supplies to show up.
Yourself, Immaculate Comics, Top comics pressing, Jerry the jitter bug and Flying L Comics have taught myself and I am sure many others so much. It is greatly appreciated.
😂j
Just found your channel and this is fantastic info. Keep up the good work!
Great work! Really enjoying this channel. I love old comics!
Watching what you do is astonishing...
Thank you for the kind words Craig! I’m just glad my content is finding an audience. I’ve already met some great people in this hobby that greatly enhance my enjoyment of comic books through my channel.
Unfortunately I live to far away to meet u sir.. ur in Cali I'm in Toronto.. maybe one day I'll take a trip.. until then u do stuff that I didn't think was possible w old fragile comic books..
Hi friend, I have for ever heard of these processes but never saw up close this fascinating work. So thanks it’s much appreciated,Craig.
that was amazing to see . thanks for posting this video !
Great video, very educational
Another great video! I was surprised by the amount of filth that came of on the first wash with just water 👍
Great video. Thanks for the informative tutorial
Where do you source the paper you had the cover between when washing if I may ask sir @drpaulkosnik
very informative video.
Great info, just subscribed for more 🙂
10:22 - That is AMAZING!!
Great job Dr.Paul!! Looks so much brighter and cleaner now. Weird how it was so dirty. brown, tan so much on inside the front cover. Not on outside of the front and outer back covers. Where you'd expect it to be much dirtier. Or exposed much more to UV rays, smoke, and dirt/oil from oils of human touch. Thank you so much for the time you took cleaning this for me. WOW! Big improvement.
This was a great project! Thanks for sending it to me and thanks too for the eventual trade. 👍🏽
Nice advice on keeping tape away from your books Dr. Paul! I once ripped the cover of my Iron Man #1 with tape😔
Good job on brightening of interior cover...
I got my first conserved-washed book back from cgc universal label. I tried a second one using more than distilled water. I had some color loss which im not sure to attribute to rocking the tray or the calcium hydroxide. I am not giving up though. Going to try another one and take out the rocking step. Thanks for the teaching sir
Interesting to see this technique. I'm just starting out with dry cleaning and this is obviously an advanced technique. I can certainly appreciate the final product but my concern was the loss of cover ink which is clearly seen at the top of the book and the left upper corner. I was impressed that so much tanning was removed with a simple bath technique. There are also little spots on the cover where ink was lifted.
I've seen other videos where a 1.5% solution of hydrogen peroxide is used and it seems to me there is little to no cover ink removed. I 'll review those videos again with a sharper eye. All in all, an impressive concept. I'm also looking for videos that show removal techniques of old, browning scotch tape residue if you have any. Thank you for posting. Best to all.
Hi Joe welcome to the channel and thank you for the thoughtful question. Your attention to detail will serve you well in the comic book cleaning and pressing hobby.
With regard to the loss of ink, as conservators we are trying to balance longevity and permanence of the paper with appearance. While i did notice the slight loss of ink, i think overall we improved this comic book dramatically and extended the life of the paper by decades or centuries. This book came to me a CGC graded 7.5, with grader's notes indicating the cover tanning. The grade was already held back by the severe tanning and frankly the comic was at risk of further paper degradation due to the acidic paper. We removed the acidic contents of the paper with an archival method preferred by library and museum conservators and left an alkaline reserve in the paper to preserve it and protect it against future acid-catalyzed hydrolysis of the cellulose matrix of the paper. By doing so, we improved not only the appearance of the paper, but the strength and longevity as well. I did not re-submit it to CGC, but I'm confident it would be awarded at least the 7.5 if not higher after our treatment.
If there was a method to save paper this far gone and not affect the inks at all, i'd be all on board but to date, as far as I'm aware from my study of the paper conservation peer-reviewed literature, there is not a better known method, and there is no free lunch with paper this far gone. Use of hydrogen peroxide is considered an invasive method by paper conservators and reserved only for bleaching when no other methods can produce the desired results. It does little to remove acids from the paper matrix and does nothing to protect the paper long-term from degradation, so i only use it in very specific instances in which i need the bleaching qualities, and then never above 0.5%, and always with a basic buffer to overcome the acidic nature of pulp paper and stop oxidative damage to the paper from the hydrogen peroxide.
Regarding tape removal, yes, i have a few videos on the process! Here is the one i recommend you check out: ruclips.net/video/HLKLf3cijkU/видео.html
Again thank you for the thoughtful questions and welcome to the channel!
That was awesome 👌. Where can I send comics to have them improved?
Wow.. never knew u could do this to comic especially old ones.. your technique is so delicate and professional
Thank you Craig! Welcome to the channel. Lots of similar content here if you want to see more!
@@DrPaulKosnik
Differently will continue to chk out ur channel and technique.. love to get that give away lol
Btw I'm from Ontario Canada 🇨🇦
Amazing process. Can you do a buy low comic video? On buying lower priced after the air has left the fed bubble burst
Metal Bum, i guess all of my unboxing videos are bubble burst videos these days! It's rare i buy anything that is more than 50% of the pandemic highs, unless it's Golden Age books that have single digit copies in the CGC Census.
Fantastic work! Where are you located in TX? My daughter up is in Plano. Thanks
Great video. Are you going to the Bell County Comicon this weeked? Chuck Norris is gonna be there.
Stunning! Thank you for another fantastic video. In your experience, has CGC or CBCS ever noticed / commented / downgraded for the difference between the whiter interior cover and the story pages? If I was a grader looking for possible resto work, I'd wonder why the interior tanning didnt spill to the interior spine. I guess there's no real way of determining if work was done here though as the de-tanning process is so unobtrusive right?
@@DrPaulKosnik Amazing thank you as always!
TechnoViking, personally i have not yet received the dreaded Purple Label for cleaned cover. Yes, i believe this is in part at least because what i'm doing is quite conservative, and you could argue that unless someone competes this deacidification process these comic books will be dust in another 100 years. That said, the 3rd party grading companies are trying to give the next buyer fair warning what has been done to the comic book. In an odd way, although the seller pays them, it's the next buyer's interests they are trying to protect. In their endeavor, they are making value judgements and i do think a big difference between the cover paper quality and the interior page quality could be a red flag in their value judgment. This book was not headed for grading and does not have a significant financial value, but if it was headed for grading, or was a very high dollar book, then best practice would be to deacidify the interior pages as well.
Dear Dr Paul, It looks beautifully done. The staples are always a challenge but well-done. I do almost the same bath technique for silver age. From my experience, no more than 10 min in a warm tap water bath followed by quick rinse and drying. But I like your idea of the 5-5-5 min and would like to give it a try soon. I’ve experimented in the past with longer periods and there’s a risk of increased color loss/color spotting with the SA. Nice finale, great job!
@@DrPaulKosnik I’m glad I could help Dr Paul with the Spidey 121. I need to send that copy to CGC soon. Congrats again on getting rid of the tan. Really commendable job.
Color loss is part of the territory (especially with reds, blacks & blues), use a chip clip to hold the interior together for better alignment. The biggest problem when doing a full wash is shrinkage of the paper itself. The measurements of the cover will be a tad small and it will get flagged as a cleaned cover (Purple label), they will only come up up with cleaned cover because the edges weren't trimmed. Immaculate Comics has a proven method of no shrinking when doing the drying process.
Hi John thanks for the comments! I'm actually not getting any shrinkage in the paper--check out a recent video i did in which i measured the page height and width to within 1/32" and saw no change with a full wet submersion bath. I'll provide the link below. I've also submitted hundreds of books that i've conserved and have not received a single Purple label yet, though i'm sure it may happen from time to time. Point is generally it's not happening to my conservation projects. I am familiar of course with Immaculate Comics, i use several of their products, but i'm not familiar with the video you referenced above. I'd like to check it out--can you point me to it? Thanks again for the feedback!
ruclips.net/video/LthLZMsG5BI/видео.html
Very nice done! So on this particular book, we would leave the inside pages alone? I'm still learning. Thanks for all you do!
@@DrPaulKosnik Ah, very cool. Thanks for the answer as I'm still learning.
Interior pages are graded separately, with the Page Quality designation. If they are not badly tanned or need other repairs like tear seals then i typically leave them alone because as you can imagine it's 12 times the work and the costs outweigh the benefits for all but the most valuable comic books. This is especially true of books that are going to be graded, in which 90% of the value is tied up in the grading of the cover.
I’m a fan of the hulk! ❤
Great video Dr Paul, would you recommend the same treatment for a bronze age Marvel?
Yes Maurice. In fact i think the Bronze Age books respond a bit better than the Silver Age Marvels.
I acquired an x-men 1 grail. Detached page from the staples. You mentioned that its possible to restore books with your patch method, without getting a restoration grade? How many books out of 10 would say have come back after grading like that?
This video is 10 months old now, but I wanted to add a relevant comment. I tried using your triton X solutions recommended for golden age comics on a silver age Cap #106 and it was a disaster. Lots of ink flecked off of the cover. I wish I had rewatched this video before I attempted conservation. If, per chance, you would like to make a video out of my fail as a cautionary tale, I could provide you with before and after videos and pictures. I would benefit from learning what part of my procedure did the most damage. Thanks Dr. Paul.
Yikes sorry to hear that Jason! Feel free to contact me via IG or FB and send me your methods and pictures and let’s see if you can figure out where everything went wrong. Better yet, if you are on FB, join our FB group Comic Book Conservation Community, and post there for everyone to contribute to solving your issue. 👍🏽
Wow how many covers have u torn to pieces? Wet paper is weak paper u are super delicate.
Early on I did split a cover that was extremely worn. But if you are detail oriented you can learn your boundaries very quickly. 👍🏽
In your experience, any difference between tap and distilled water? I know some other creators are worried about contaminants in tap water.
Thanks for video tutorial. Just so I'm sure before I start attempt one. In the event of a city dweller who has no access to well water. Distilled water is OK and probably the best I can do.
Was the client happy with the outcome of this book? Just curious because I personally found the amount of color loss on the front cover to be a major bummer...when you look at the masthead area of the cover at the beginning of the video and compare it to the reds and purples at the end of the video the color loss is quite shocking (to me anyway)
That being said, I get what you are saying, the process is designed to preserve the book , not necessarily improve it's appearance, which I applaud you for that and throughly impressed by this video...However if I received this book back, when I first saw all that white speckling that was now on the book's cover I think I would be quite depressed and mad at myself for doing that...
(Just My Opinion - You are amazing and thanks for sharing the video !!)
Greg, Thank you for the kind words and thoughtful analysis. I think you hit the nail right on the head of the issue--not everyone values different comic book flaws the same. Some can't stand missing pages, and would never buy a book with missing pages, while someone else might be fine with a missing page if it didn't affect the story.
With regard to the loss of ink, as conservators we are trying to balance longevity and permanence of the paper with appearance. While i did notice the slight loss of ink, i think overall we improved this comic book dramatically and extended the life of the paper by decades or centuries. This book came to me a CGC graded 7.5, with grader's notes indicating the cover tanning. The grade was already held back by the severe tanning and frankly the comic was at risk of further paper degradation due to the acidic paper. We removed the acidic contents of the paper with an archival method preferred by library and museum conservators and left an alkaline reserve in the paper to preserve it and protect it against future acid-catalyzed hydrolysis of the cellulose matrix of the paper. By doing so, we improved not only the appearance of the paper, but the strength and longevity as well. I did not re-submit it to CGC, but I'm confident it would be awarded at least the 7.5 if not higher after our treatment.
If there was a method to save paper this far gone and not affect the inks at all, i'd be all on board but to date, as far as I'm aware from my study of the paper conservation peer-reviewed literature, there is not a better known method, and there is no free lunch with paper this far gone. Use of hydrogen peroxide is considered an invasive method by paper conservators and reserved only for bleaching when no other methods can produce the desired results. It does little to remove acids from the paper matrix and does nothing to protect the paper long-term from degradation, so i only use it in very specific instances in which i need the bleaching qualities, and then never above 0.5%, and always with a basic buffer to overcome the acidic nature of pulp paper and stop oxidative damage to the paper from the hydrogen peroxide.
All that said, it's a value judgement and not all of us are going to agree because there is not an objective right or wrong. The owner of this book was thrilled with the outcome, because he really hated the severe tanning to the cover and wanted to book preserved. And at the end of the day, that is what matters. I shared this, warts and all, to help inform others of what can be done; it's up to each individual to decide what should be done.
@@DrPaulKosnik Thanks Doc for that detailed and informative response, much appreciated !
So tanning on the cover (even on the inside) is a bigger problem then color of the inside wraps? Could you also wash those - obiously lot more work and not that much impact on the grade? Kind regards
Correct! Actually CGC grades the interior wrap page quality and the cover page quality separately. The paper quality designation on the label (e.g. White Pages) refers only to the interior wraps. The page quality of the cover is included in the overall numerical grade. Covers with tanning severely limit the overall grade the comic can receive. So deacidification and tanning removal on the cover will give a numerical boost to the grade on an otherwise high grade book that is being held back by the poor paper quality of the cover, as this one was.
In this video you state that the most silver age books will tolerate is short, distilled water aqueous baths - in later video with avengers #1 the calcium hydroxide solution is used so I have 2 questions:
1) does the calcium hydroxide ameliorate ink loss ?
2) Apologies if you covered in another video (but haven't found it specifically) how much calcium hydroxide do you add to the distilled water to make the saturated solution?
Thanks for your insight!
Hey Fastest! Thanks for the questions. Firstly, we never use distilled water in conservation because it removes native calcium in the paper and can actually lead to acidification of the paper. Calcium Hydroxide deacidifies the paper and provides protection into the future and is also safe with inks. Here is a video i did that goes over the basics of how to make these solutions and use them. Give it a watch and let me know if you still have any more questions.
ruclips.net/video/_hpXewc8_tY/видео.html
Why not use the calcium hydroxide solution in all cases vs regular tap water?
@@peterwiese1729 I do always use the Ca(OH). The conversation is about whether you use tap water as your base solvent for the Ca(OH) solution. The answer is generally yes if you have well water or hard water, no if you have chlorinated water.
Nice video very informative however that's way too much work only to get a conserved label
Thank you for the kind words. Unless there is other conservation work, in my experience, this is going to receive a Universal label from CGC.
So off-white pages only refers to the back of the cover? Not the middle of the book.
Brian, Actually it refers to the interior pages (all of the pages but the cover). It's presumed that the interior pages are in similar condition so one designation can capture them all, but that is why a range is sometimes given (Off-White to White). In my experience, the first wrap, being directly beneath the cover, is most exposed to the elements of the inner wraps and therefore experiences the most aging, so looking at this page is usually what gives you your page designation.
Is this considered restoration?
The answer is tricky--if done correctly, Universal Label. If detectable but considered to be professional grade by CGC, then Conserved label. If done poorly, then Restored. Obviously not ideal in that it leaves something up to interpretation by CGC but on the other hand they are also trying to protect the buyer of the book and if the work is done poorly they have an obligation to inform the next owner of the sub-standard work.
what percentage get universal and not conserved ?
Hey Sean personally I have never received a Conserved label for washing unless I also performed tear seals. But others that have used similar results do occasionally get them. It ends up a judgment call at CGC based on their impression of the end result.
i may have a great candidate for this = a first try book Hulk 107 got a 8.0 but looks 9.6 but tan city inside the front cover@@DrPaulKosnik
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Nice! Eleven thumb's up seems good.
Hope he doesn't mind a purple label if he got it graded.
Appreciate your concern but I’ve submitted hundreds of books with similar treatments and no purple labels-only archival materials are used. You frankly don’t know what you are talking about. Did you watch my interview with Matt Nelson, President of CGC, in which we discussed this?
So, you're saying that book was graded and did NOT receive a purple label or even a conserved label with no mention of "cover whitened"? It's VERY obvious that this was performed. I'm not saying it wasn't a good job. I'm saying that stark white SA covers are unnatural and routinely receive purple and gray labels. If I am wrong, I'd love to see that graded book. And yes, I have been doing this for years as well.
@@DrPaulKosnik
Not going to get a 7.5 with all that ink lost. I think it would be 6.5 purple label now.
If I send it in for grading, I’ll post results here. No reason for a conservation wash to trigger Restored label though, right?
You removed the staples, the CGC will not overlook that. The best you can hope for is the dreaded purple label, if they decide not to send it back.
Kahn, with all due respect, you do not know what you are talking about. CGC allows staple removal in Universal grade and i (and others) do it routinely. I have never received anything other than Universal grade from CGC for removing and correctly replacing staples from a book.
@@DrPaulKosnik You already replied to this post two months ago. You seem to have deleted our previous text about this subject . I took your word on the matter.👍
@@kahnlives sorry RUclips erased all of my comments! Just going back through and rewriting a few month’s worth, especially those (like yours) that I really didn’t want to leave unanswered for the viewer that is scrolling through comments in the future. Appreciate your understanding. 👍🏽
@@DrPaulKosnik You should checkout West Coast DAVEngers last episode. He submitted Amazing Spider Man number 2 which was given a purple label for staple removal, the restoration was top notch.✋
@@kahnlives thank you for the head’s up, I will do that!
Please don't reuse fasteners.
Not sure what you mean? Are you referring to the staples?
Hello, do you have an instagram account?
loss too much color on cover. BLED would have done a better job on the cover. Inside wraps look good
Skin, perhaps Blue LED would work better for aesthetics (deatable), but it does nothing to remove the acids that are causing the tanning. In fact, it accelerates deterioration of the paper by damaging cellulose molecules. As Conservationists we are not just seeking the highest grade or best aesthetic outcome, but are trying to preserve the book for future generations. Wet cleaning is a superior alternative to BLED for that goal by far.