Lotus Supercharger Upgrade (with dyno power run and suspension)
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- Опубликовано: 10 фев 2025
- The LOTUS gets a serious power upgrade with a new Harrop Supercharger and dyno tune. Then we uncover the mystery of why it handled so badly on the track and get it fixed!
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Did you say it was a Harrop supercharger?
I geuss if you whant this lotus to be faster u sould buy V6 2GE-FE one exige instad of this.
Number 4, driver needs upgrading
Was totally gonna order a stool while watching the video but I exceed the weight limit. :(
Do you make those stools in men sizes?
Moog picked up an intercooler and didn't play it.
I'm calling the cops.
already alerted the authorities mate they said they'll be a bit of paperwork and it may take some time, but they will have this travesty sorted.
Should call the cops on the Lotus guys for missing that “everything was way off” twice before letting Moog go out on a track and almost get wiped out.
@@xpictos777 I do remember them saying it was off in previous episodes so it was a known factor. No idea why they still ran it knowing or even having a suspicion it was off. Best guess would be they didn’t have time and just wanted to get it on the track! Can’t really blame them there! Heha
THATS ILLEGAL
Also removed the seat and didn’t lick anything, wtf am I even watching
Insert your comment here about adding more power when the car doesn't handle well. Then you can watch the video and check out the bit where we find out what was wrong with the suspension and fix it. Or just comment without watching it - that's cool too 👍
I prefer to backseat comment while I twirl my comical villain moustache and cackle.
Also, great vid.
was thinking the same thing lol...also keen to see what marty does to be able to keep up with something this fast and good handling. Will be interesting for sure to see how he gets on with that task.
I don't know how you keep your head when reading some of the Muppet comments.. great videos. Thank you
Will do!
HA!
surely you guys know that comment munters know better even before they watch your videos.
its your car, you're just bringing us along for the ride....and I for one appreciate that.
Quick shout out to the camera guy. I hate the modern shaker style, gives me vertigo. Your guy is smooth, solid and frames the shots very well. So much so I forget there’s a person holding the camera. Awesome skills. An example to be followed. 👍
it's on a gimbal, but yeah he moves very well
Camera Op here, that dude moves ridiculously well with the gimbal. Not only that but his timing is impeccable. Always manages to pan back to Marty & Moog at just the right part of the sentence.
I know nothing about video production, but I know this is very easy to watch.
I was just thinking about them at the beginning of the video! Do we know who it is?
@@DawnStrider371 IronGav?
shout out to Lotus for being so involved. Earning their enthusiast image.
Lee & Richie basically 'live' at the track so we aren't a normal car dealership that is for sure, check out wha we do :-) www.simplysportscars.com/en/gallery-blog
I thought 3 was going to be “I’m just not a very good driver”
Scrap that, "more power!"
Moog needs to accept he ain't ready for a car of this calibre.
Even when the car was dunk Steve said you didnt push it in the car true power band.
Aka pussy.
Thought the same thing
Yeah, he was not very honest 🤔😁
It has nothing to do with Moogs. The Lotus guys should have picked up all these issues when a) he bought the car and asked them to check if it was ok and b) when they “set it up” prior to the track day. It is outrageous that they’re now saying it is “all wrong” after Moogs was nearly taken out at the track day. I can’t believe no one else is upset as I am about this.
Here for the purity, wasn't disappointed
I cant believe you guys are here, Hello Carnage!!
@@Bevant69 long time fans of MCM
I'd love to see a collab video
@ChrisHallett83 Scotty
@@STREETMACHINETV hi Scotty 👍🏽👊🏽🍺 definitely do a collaboration video. That would be super cool.
Buy a nother corolla 1.8 engine for 500 bucks. Put it in to Yaris hylton and put the lotus original supercharger on it 😁😁
Yaris is gone but they should do another swap or make a sleeper corolla
see if it fits in the mini?
Sounds like a plan 😅👌🏽
They sold the yaris
I wqs thinking of installing the old suoercharger on the truck Marty got
Confirming everyone's suspicions, the suspension setup was well and truly boned. I'm excited to see what it'll do with a proper setup.
You think lotus can’t set up a car? 😂😂😂
As one of the vocal proponents of that theory I am happily vindicated.
Now Moog can feel the true purity of a Lotus.
@@rhileyradnedge2501 I think Lotus can absolutely set up a car (as the people at Simply Sports Cars show here), but I think the previous owner may have had a bit of trouble.
@@rhileyradnedge2501 it was even said on a previous episode this car was 30mm higher than factory hight. It's not lotus fault some who didn't know what they were doing with it fucked it up
Would of liked to have seen the lap times with it properly sorted , before they put the better super charger in , as it’s a very expensive car should be quick stock
Moog: I'm not used to the lotus handling on the track
Also Moog: I need a bigger supercharger
🤦♂️
Id imagine its not only alighnment but theres most likely bushings as well.
If feel like over 50 % of the issue is tires. Rest can be spread over small adjustments and bushings. I found out first hand how much fresh tires can do when I was starting out. But my opinion doesn't matter. Im no pro
I love how enthusiastic the Lotus guys are. Was very joyful to watch and the whole car... pretty impressive!
Lol @ all the people commenting “wHy dO yOu nEeD mOrE pOwEr yOu cAnT dRiVe iT” without actually watching the entire video and realizing they fully re did the suspension setup/alignment. Keep up the lotus content, RUclips needs more lotus videos!!!
But all 31 of us know
Funny thing is I don’t think 99% of the people in the comments realize how important a proper alignment is. I’ve been a mechanic for years so I’ve driven cars with far from proper alignments and they would cause any driver to spin out. Also doesn’t anyone realize how much attention professional race teams put into alignment?
@@21Willly ESPECIALLY on a lotus, that’s why I was so confused. Especially the whole rake thing. They’re always lower in front by a good amount mine is about 6/7 mm higher in the rear than front
Also need tires. The fact the tires were old coupled with the terrible alignment wearing them unevenly means the girp had to to terrible. Weight transfer and downforce would be terrible with the poor rake, all the nice smooth under tray was doing jack all. The chamber and toe being off and inconsistent kills the predictability of the cornering grip.
That's kind of the point. He had no experience with it in its proper form. I don't think any of us are saying he can't drive (unless I missed some comments) we just want to see more of our friend Moog in the future. Lol
New tyres and correct alignment set up will shave just as much, if not more lap time than the power upgrade alone. Fun times ahead Moog. Now it'll drive and do like it was meant to. It's been a good journey watching you guys over the years going from driveways to track days. Thanks for the huge effort of taking us with you. 👌🏻
13:03 Richie wasn't expecting the lewd puns at all :D
Classic Moog and Marty when he's there
Caught him off guard for sure 😂
A guy called Richie should know all about dick jokes
Rode in my buddy’s Lotus Elise and that thing is raw. Just an absolute go kart. A supercharger would’ve kicked things up to 11 forsure
Mate took me for a ride in a exige back in 2008 or 09. Thing was mental.
@@feral4mr2 Yes “mental” is a great way to describe it 😂 Only time I’ve been in a car weighing less than 3k lb. or pretty much 2k for that matter
Me a poor man, I’ll probably just buy the newer MR2 and pretend :(
@@abel5925 nothing wrong with mr2's man.
Interesting positioning choice of the chopped logo on the stool haha
It feels weird seeing you here haha. Misschien moet je eens een video maken over je Subaru!
I need a stool sample...
Chop your nuts off 🥜 ✌️
Hey Willem! Nice seeing you here. Didn't know you watch MCM.
Israeli edition
"Probably just shit tires...let's throw on a supercharger just in case." 😂
The purity. That’s how it works in RL let’s be honest
Well, yeah.
How else do you turn shit-tires to shit-smoke?
lets be honest tho, we watch mcm for the unconventional approch! if they put new tires on and that was the end of the episode it wouldn't be that exciting ahahah
That little “...sorry Richie!” Moog said 😂
Hahaha 😂 cracked me up too
10:34 Taking the roof off and removing the passenger seat not only made more room for wiring the ECU, it also ...ADDED MORE LIGHTNESS.🧐
Colin chapman intensifies
Think of all the drag the roof off wil cause..
@@Sajuuk9
🤔 hmmm ...
...done.
They engineered the angle of the windshield to flow over the cabin to create a positive pressure. At a high enough speed this pressure is sufficient enough to prevent any wind force from entering the cabin. So even without the roof, the air just flows over the cabin and prevents drag.🤓
Targa top
How do you add lightness though? 🤔
I like how "I'm a slow driver" isn't on the list of explanations for the slow track times lol
@@maiy8786 right, I agree but still found it kinda funny
it's a tricky engine to master just on the first try. Staying in lift (over 6k rpm) to always make good power takes some getting used to.
What an amazing episode. The guys from Lotus seem like amazing and genuine guys. So cool that they're helping you guys out.
Man if I had the money... Lotus is so expensive over here :(
That ending shot of the Lotus on the track was pretty cool, gave me chills
Yes, looking forward to the next episode!
That pop on the decel!
“Even martys gonna be dropping in today” unless theres a pt 2 i saw no marty 😂😂
Yeah ahahah completely forgot until you said that
The legs and bare feet.
Ah well, 1 less tool
Marty's bare feet
Maybe them feet wasnt marty 🤔 what if it was cheryls feet 🤔😂
1. Driver
2. Driver
3. Driver
4. Power - hell yeah, that’s why I’m watching
HELLO!!! I want to spend time with celebrities. Just kidding. GAGAGAGAGA! I only want to spend time with my two girlfriends and record RUclips videos for with the 3 of us. OH YEAH. Don't hate me for living the best life, dear d13
@@AxxLAfriku I had a stroke trying to read this.
@@AxxLAfriku Bot
Hi mighty car mods I don’t know if you realise how much influence you are for so many people. You guys has helped motivate so many people including myself to start working on their own cars in a garage with ordinary tool! Thank you for your content! Keep up your exceptional work!
Ever since I got my license I wanted a lotus, I absolutely love these videos because no one else is doing a whole lot with and lotus cars, absolutely beautiful car
It's so awesome to see the mechanical gurus from Lotus continuing to help you out. The wealth of knowledge you're getting from these guys is priceless. Definitely makes sense now why your track day was a bit wonky. Proper alignment and fresh sticky tires are going to make ALL the difference, the extra ponies with the new SC is a nice bonus. Good luck on your next track day, Moog!
I would have liked to have seen some lap times with the suspension/tyres sorted out without the supercharger upgrade to see what a difference it made. Then do the supercharger and see how that affected times
I love that they're using all manual/analog tools for the alignment. Now that's a PURE alignment!!! I do the same whenever I can!
A lot of the race teams do it with string and gauges as well, right at the top level too - I've been to Le Mans several times and seen the LMP1 and GTLM teams doing the suspension setup in the exact same was as the Lotus guys did it
@@intomlinson yeah Richie has many, many years of international racing experience so he sticks to the traditional methods at our flat patch at the workshop.
Rake loves it! As soon as he said negative rake, ole Rake came to mind lol
We miss Rake! :(
He said negative *rate. But, I’m now gonna pretend he said Rake, because we all know that Rake likes this.
@@s3tTz He did say rake, do you know what that is?
@@s3tTz he said rake. As in the angle of the car, negative rake meaning front was higher than rear
But...but...it’s the internet? I can’t be wrong? 😊 (honestly thought it was rate, and that’s what I thought I heard, so I stand corrected)
09:59 Richie bringing over a tyre so he can reach inside cracked me up a bit 😂
HAHHAHA
My favorite McM music 13:55 🕺🏾
Hearing from the Lotus engineers is great, I love hearing their insights.
Moog holding that supercharger in the thumbnail like his first born child.
13:13 it's bigger than i thought richy. Richy:smiles a little embarrassed 😂😂😂
Lets be honest, EVERYONE was sniggering when they heard that XD
“Negative Rake”
Rake didn’t love it
:-(
It's about time he made an appearance
Rake hates this.
It's absolutely hilarious seeing you work on the engine, because my Toyota Matrix XRS from 2006 has the exact same 2zz-ge engine 😂😂 makes me want to slap a supercharger on it if it's easy enough that you can do it in that cramped little engine bay.
10:27 Tuning Fork watching this. I hope you pull the top on your next dyno run for the guy.
Compared to some of the nuggets they've had on the show, this Lotus shows how well a car can be built.
Lotus make some of the best sports car out, period.
The thing I like, is that the recipie is remarkably simple. It's a great chassis, coupled with a reliable, but yet powerful engine (thank you Toyota) - makes for a killer combo!
If I could buy a new sports car, it would hands down be a Lotus Evora GT410 Sport. Comfortable to use everyday, but brilliant on the track! And not to mention one of the sweetest sounding V6's on the market! Partially helped by the factory titanium exhaust!
@@upgradeNEVER yup amazing what a exhaust can do to a camry v6
And bolt on parts that actually fit! (Falls off of chair.)
Mechanically they are very good. The bodywork is a nightmare though. Mine has un-even panel gaps everywhere and the drivers door needs completely re-fitting as it's way off. But then you get the same thing on the F40 etc and people only notice if they look close enough :P
I hear the current ones are far better put together though.
@@BlatentlyFakeName Low number car's issues any "exotic" car producer ever had, still has and probably ever will have. (Except Bugatti while Ferdinand Piëch still was around, of course)
Would've been interesting to see him drive it with a good suspension tune first and then the supercharger replacement
Yes potentially, although at least it created a good baseline to work from to then show how improvements can be made by addressing all the key areas like brakes, tyres, suspension, cooling, oil management etc.
I’m really happy you got the suspension sorted. Watching the first track test was scary, Lotus cars are amazing to drive and you didn’t seem that happy with the car. Great job guys. Great video as well as always.
That car is SO beautiful. I can't wait to see what it can do with a proper alignment. That HAS to be the issue you were fighting at your last track day. More so than the lower than expected power output.
Bicester is local to me! Awesome to hear a random UK town mentioned on MCM 🇬🇧 🇦🇺 ❤️
It's a bit bigger now than I bet he remembers from 20 years ago
I'm from a little village just outside it was strange hearing bicester in mcm
Us limeys get everywhere. Greetings from Florida
Love all this new content, I've been watching you guys for almost ten years and you keep just getting better and better!!!
The purity of that fitted Lotus workshop protective cover for the back end is off the charts!
He sounds like an Australian who occasionally attempts a cockney accent.
I remember watching how to pimp your car for under $500 in highschool. Ypu guys have come so far, ive moved on to 4wds but always love watching MCM keep the good work up legends
I love how you Australians are so proud of your country I watch a lot of international content and you folks are the only ones I've seen take the same pride in your home land as Americans
Moog: Starts talking about his accent
Rich: *cockney geezer intensifies*
soap! Soap? SOAAAAP!!
He's from Oxford, a long was from being a cockney, you Edward!
If he was really a Pom he would’ve asked for a cup of tea when offered a coffee
Err . . . . An Australian accent is closer to Cockney than an Oxfordshire accent is. See "Only Fools and Horses"
Americans: They're the same accent.
"3 possible reasons the track time was slow"
driver familiarity with the car is NOT among them lol
Yeah but he did blame himself ( a lot) on track day. This was sort of vindication it wasn’t all his fault
Every day they snuff out failure and supercharge success - these guys own the backstreets as they defer from taking it up the ass for high performance motoring - I salute you
GREAT Video.. Love how you guys provided just enough quick details... allowing others to folow build. Hope you enjoy driving Lotus as much as I have over past 10 years
"It's bigger than I thought richie"
Legends 😍😂
If you convince them its way smaller before hand, they will never be disappointed.....
You guys are the Quinten Tarantinos of car videos. By that I mean you're both into foot stuff
MAN THAT SOUNDED GOOD AT THE END
All the people that were whining about the sponsored content a few episodes back should now apologize. You guys could have made this video into a three piece with ease and instead treated us with all the purity in just a one epic piece. Awesome work and thank you for the excellent content, can't wait to see the track footage!
You guys from Simply Sports Cars are awesome!!! Just shows you have fantastic Simply Sports Cars is with the right attitude, customer assistance and on going support for Lotus products. The best sports car for your money. My Exige is awesome!!! Thanks SSC and thanks Lotus!! Regards, Jim.
Poor Marty... I feel like he might be depressed after Rodney came and your car is becoming epic... maybe you should get him a Christmas present to cheer him up!
Engine rebuild upgrade
When you were recording videos in the driveway did you ever think one day you would be working on your Lotus with a couple of the best tech's in the business?
You mean the absolute worst mechanics/techs of all time that almost got Moogs killed at the track? They’re boarderline criminals. They had two opportunities to inspect and setup the car prior to the first track day, only after Moog lost it multiple times did they actually check it and say “literally everything is wrong”. I wouldn’t take a push bike to those guys.
@@xpictos777 And moog could have put new tyres on which would have helped. Regardless moog was in control even when the car span, if he hadnt been hed have ended up in the gravel.
@@xpictos777 you obviously aren't getting to see all the behind the scenes activity, discussions, advice, recommendations being provided & are viewing an 'edited' story. Lee & Richie have been involved with Lotus & motorsport both locally or internationally for 30+ years, managed race winning teams/cars and are generally at race tracks day in & day out during that time too. They wouldn't actively put anyone in danger, it's not how they operate. As you'd already know from what content that MOOG create they are also taking people on a step by step journey for a mix of education and entertainment.
me: *watching mcm on this tab*
also me: * looking at used lotus prices in another tab*
Ebay 23-28 grand US all day long less than a new Camry
ruclips.net/video/Mi9F1fp2UAg/видео.html
This is how we get the MCM tax.
They are pretty cheap near where I live
@@ErectileSceptile define pretty cheap..
@Mighty Car Mods Damn bro, Special Edition MCM WD40 Cans!? How fuckin big have yall gotten mate, I remember watching yall soooooo many years back, when subs were in the quadruple digits, which was huge back then, then quintuple digits, now MCM WD40 Cans, and septuple digits with 3.44m subs!!??? Well shit.. I'm getting old I guess lol, well deserved though, yall are great, and I appreciate everything, this content was/is a major foundational building block to my love of cars, not starting by seeing all these gorgeous, American Muscle Cars, but by working on them, fuckin around in em, and just enjoying it all in it's entirety, so thank you
3:00 that guy has a weird hybrid british australian accent, its throwing me off as a brit haha
When I was in school in the US I was friends with a guy who had moved from New Zealand. His accent and slang was a wild mix by the time we graduated.
British accent🤔🤔🤔
@@statementleaver8095 😂😂
Really enjoying the lotus content👏
You don't bring an English Lotus mechanic coffee.
You bring him Lotus tea!
So he can sit around and miss that “everything was way off” on the setup and leave Moog to nearly get killed on the track.
Or serve him a proper cup per of gravy aka a really dark cup of tea
@Martin I like drinking builders tea, puts chest hairs on a man xD
Those stools are also great for circumsized members!
Chopped!!
Nice to see you found the issue with the alignment, hope this gives you your confidence in the car back, so you can really enjoy it! Greets from Austria!
12:36 anyone else hold their breath while he was swinging the supercharger around with one hand I don't know about you but that gave me complete anxiety 😂
12:55 where can I listen to the full song?? 🤘🤘
Edit: Marty still needs to buy a Caterham to race against the Lotus 😁
A Lotus Super 7 Caterham, that one?
@@FFM0594 no
Honestly listening to these songs make me feel ive missed out on a lot of good music :/
would love to see marty’s mr2 turned into a budget lotus as well
Suspension is such an art.
In japan negative rake is actually preferred by drifters to try and keep the car squatted down at the back to limit the weight transfer to the front to prevent uncontrollable liftoff oversteer.
So in some cases negative rake is used to maintain rear grip, but then in this case they must also have their reasons for positive rake having the same effect under different driving styles.
The nerd part of me loves this side of cars.
These Lotus episodes are purely AMAZING! Lotus mechanics are true living legends... just appreciate that string alignment rig... I need to know EVERYTHING they know. ✌️
"The new MCM stool, a perfect device to use at your track day while waiting for your tow truck"
Everyone: you need to drive faster, Moog.
Moog: we need more power!!!
Everyone: OK
😂
Sorry we yelled over the sponsored episodes...your Lotus is nice.
Love that Richie and the others play along with Moog's antics and games, it's hilarious and hella heartwarming.
That last shot of the lotus was fire, think you have got an absolute track weapon there.
Every time I hear Moog saying "more power" my brain automatically complete the sentence with "babe".
Mo powa babeh!!!
AND THEN you beat your wife owo
For me I picture Jeremy Clarkson grinning.
4. Suspension.
5. The driver.
always thought the fix of lift off oversteer is more power......
Most of all the Driver for sure..
ruclips.net/video/Mi9F1fp2UAg/видео.html
@@IanMicheal ding ding ding bingo!
tires and suspension first. Adding more power is just going to magnify the handling problems at this point
@@BabyJesus440 he said last episode the tyres were really old, maybe that's why the lotus didn't behave
Moogs face in the last episode when he realised his lotus was 5 seconds slower than the brz
I have been with you guys from “how to turbo a car “ video, never missed a video! You guys are awesome!!!
Gotta love when things come apart or go together easier than you thought. Getting a lot of that with my RX-8 that I'm rebuilding.
"Cubic pounds of unicorns and awesomeness!"..Moog 2020
Finally the alignment is sorted, it seemed way off in the racetrack by the way the car was throwing off its balance
PLS SHOW THE LOTUS VIDS LOVE! I want to see them keep building it c:
Happy to see how much you guys have grown in the 6 years I’ve subscribed to your channel. Here’s to more success for MCM cheers!
Last time I watched MCM it was a patina tutorial. Amazing to see what y’all have become.
We need:-
First step jack up your car.
on a t-shirt please.
Would love to see you race Marty’s Mr2 in the lotus. You could do a cheap mid engine car vs expensive mid engine car challenge.
I would love to see that also. But the MR2 needs some PGUP's before that.
Poor old poo barge will have trouble hanging onto the lotus.
I was waiting for “you can sit down on a couple of our fingers and relax” but it never came. Disappointed, Moog
I like to see you using torque marks on bolts, I do it all the time very satisfying and good practice
I had a Pulsar GtiR with a shagged suspension setup. Installed some camber bolts and new springs with new tyres and wheel alignment and the thing was completely different animal on track. Night and day
Oh, come on! You can't just say "we put a new set of tire on" when it comes to a track car! Brand, model, and size....please! ;-)
If you look closely on the first shots of Moog removing the wheels (approx at 08:14 ), it had some Yokohama Advan Neova AD08R tires, in 17 inches it seems, and they seem to have put some Kuhmo Ecsta V700 ( seen when they are doing the alignment, approx at 15:05 ). Don't know what it's capable of tbh.
They run the same tires on a their cars
I think they haven't disclosed it today because they aren't sponsor branded tyres!
They probably don't want to say because they don't have their Bridgestone sponsorship anymore.
Wide, low and sticky
I just wish cars from Lotus weren't so expensive... I'd love to own one.
Broham you can get an Elise for a pretty reasonable price! Last time I checked (been the better part of a decade at least) you could get a fair one for 20k USD. I'm not sure where you're at... Sure they don't have as much power, but it'd be a hell of a drive still until you can save up for some mods!
Depends where you live lotus Elise with the rover engines go for around 8k and Toyota ones go for 15-20k
I was looking around at prices the other day, the ones I saw had spiked considerably in the last year or so, to 30-50k....so much for an attainable "super car"
This car cost less than a Golf R
@@mightycarmods lotuses in Uk can be cheap as chips. Not so much in Oz
People recommend more seat time, maybe some driver training ...
Moog: naaaah mate, MORE POWER!
So good to see old school string alignments. The proper way to do it.
They finally take the roof off, looks amazing! Keen to hear the new supercharger whine!
9:37 when you see the feet 😂
Can you guys do a "build my car" series? Where you raffle off tickets and ship the winners car to you to get modded? :)
Not gonna lie: I love it but it hurts, my 2ZZ-GE Corolla TS has been down for too many weeks now..
What's up with it?
@@g.bergervoet4505 it span a bearing on me. Wasn't even low on oil or anything, and oil had like 7-8K km, so should still have been alright..
Try some Wynns liquid bearing repair additive. It's amazing stuff.
@@Gooie69 when your span bearing results in a clear knock I wouldn't rely on fluids only... And I've pretty much managed to secure a box filled with everything I need to rebuild the low end (only thing I don't have new in that box is the crankshaft and the rods). But I don't have neither the place to work on my car nor the equipment and with this lockdown thing and our current weather plus some private life stuff everything keeps getting delayed more and more
@@tsuyoikaizoku4829 maybe try Wynns liquid knock be gone?
you guys have come so far, i remember watching the vids of you in your driveway.
That bad alignment explains how the rear was stepping out at the last track day. Excited to see how it does with that fixed!
He can pronounce Bicester, he's English!
He hasn't lost his midlands / Thames Valley twang that is for sure.
What a place Bicester is........
@@Lazerus2008 Midlands???
@@mattlawson2578 Rhymes with fister and sister.
@@FFM0594 two words often seen together on the internet