Did Doom Eternal's Platforming Actually Suck?
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- Опубликовано: 10 июн 2024
- #doom #doometernal
There's an aspect of the platforming that people rarely talk about.
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I treat platforming as bunch of sequences that allow you to take a breath. Let's face it - Doom Eternal is relentelssly fast paced game, on higher difficulties and later stage maps intensity goes through the roof. You absolutely NEEDED to have something that allow you to admire vistas, have some casual enjoyment and perhaps practise a movement patterns BEFORE you go out there to fight off bunch of deadly monsters. I love them for that.
honestly the opposite of what i need, i like horde after horde arena after arena, im glad platforming is weaved into arenas, but no sir i do not need a break
@rachitgupta8345 yh, if I want a break, I'd just stop
so like a Doom 1 level transition screen
The game is litteraly built like that, gunfight are really intense, so intense that at the end of the fight you feel exhausted. These plateforms passage are necessary and are a good thing to not do an overdose.
This is the peace between two war, litteraly
I tend to agree. On nightmare, certain fights feel your barely hanging on and for that to be the relentless pace the entire game would kill the excitement when a new one begins.
When my Dad was playing Doom Eternal he literally called me downstairs every time there was a platforming section so I could do it for him. There was no platforming in Doom Eternal for my dad.
Based dad
This is kind of adorable ngl.
Awesome lol
Yeah understandable I had to master it myself
@@bearwithsunglassesandicecr5856 what?
Nah, it helped chill and taught the needed mobility
I think this game is best played with MnK for the mobility
That's literally what he was talking about throughout the video
THIS
@@dexter2898He commented this before watching the video
"chill' you're so hip!
I enjoyed the platforming. I wished the Meathook parkour sections were introduced sooner than the second DLC, those were a lot of fun
Dude for real. They could have had incredible moments with that and some very fun puzzles.
Yeah also meathook grapple point really help beginner to understand how the meathook can be used tactically to navigate and dominate the arena. Grapple point should have been in the main game but hey maybe even ID didn't knew the true potential of their meathook when the base game launched.
I think we all expected a ton of it from when it was previewed. So many ways it could have been utilized, or even for more battles than just the one boss fight
I liked the platforming, it taught you how to be mobile. Eventually your skill in movement could allow you to skip entire sections of platforming.
That was the best thing. Skipping the platforming section skillfully is such a nice feeling.
Agreed. I like how you can skip some of the platforming by doing better platforming.
The only problem with platforming is when you have to wait, if you mess up holt squids you have to wat for them to come up again, if you mess up atlantica container you have to wait. When you already figure out a challenge in your head but you have to wait in order to complete it is frustrating.
That's fair
I 100% agree. A lot of it became not much of a challenge but a straight time waster.
@@presidentbruh401 The challenge was don't screw up and get punished by waiting 🤷
@ChristopherCraven it was very easy to not screw up tho, so it was just a lot of downtime
I don't think it sucked, but some sections were buggy at times
Buggy, or just downright broken? Doom Eternal is held up with scotch tape and dreams so quite a few sections in the game are genuinely messed up. I remember once I managed to climb mid air because of a bug with the circular wall climbing section in Doom Hunter Base.
The bugs are the only flaw of the game (in my opinion)
That's not restricted to the platforming sections, all of Eternal is buggy as hell. I don't blame it, because it has a LOT of complex systems working at once, but let's not deny that the game is pretty broken.
@@Vladysluv no its not its one of the best optimised games in my playthrough i havent encountered a single bug
@@2137xd You don't know how happy I am that I can hear someone say that, but I have 500h playtime and my experience was that of a game in which I can't 100% rely on any mechanic (chainsaw, bloodpunch, glory kill, etc) and those are really important in high level play required in Master Levels and modded content like horde mode.
The think I look forward to most in The Dark Ages is that it functions like a well oiled machine.
platforming in doom 2016 on ultra-nightmare scared me more than the demons ngl
True... I died more from that than the demons.
The platforming was better in 2016 IMHO. it felt more natural and less forced-see Mario fireball sticks and silly extra dash icons floating in space.
Lmao yes, argent tower got me playing with my hands shaking every time I had to jump
@@justingoers I mean eternal is a goofy looking game man. Purple goo gore nests and all. They just went 100% for it and people act like eternal is as grounded as 2016
LOL true! After Eternal, I think any game instakilling you for falling into a pit is bullshit. Just reset the player with a health penalty at most.
I would say that the game should already have the Air Control rune from the start. Like not a Rune, but a default feature of Doom Slayer's movement control.
Yea in hindsight I find it odd that double jump is the base ability and not air control. In 2016 it just felt like a powerful ability, in Eternal it feels much more necessary considering how the movement and platforming changed to be more Arcady and less grounded.
Yes. That was an odd design choice for sure
I personally never really found use for air control. Never once even triggered the rune lol. Beat game on UN. If you're not used to it, it's really not missed.
Agreed but remapping jump and dash to l2 and r3 is even more important
Yea I don't believe you lmfao
Air control is literally the only rune that matters
I’m replaying eternal rn since the dark ages trailer. The only area where the platforming felt off was the first lvl where you don’t have dash unlocked. You can’t really backtrack for collectibles without it.
That's why there is fast travel at the end of every level. Took me 2 years to find out it exists.
@@Narko_Marko how the heck did it take you 2 years to find out about fast-travel when every single level has a fast-travel notification at the end lmao
@@DreamyAileen i don't look at notifications because notifications are for unimportant things, codex entries and shit like that I don't care about. And when i tried to collect all toys I just sent 1 by 1 and didn't need it.
My main issue with the platforming is how artificial and 'videogamey' the platforming sections feel. Most of the mechanics have no context in the setting and mess with the immersion, which is a problem when you're shoving cutscenes and lore documents in the player's face to try and get them to care about the story.
Also, the sections where you climb up walls feel really clunky and break the flow, there's not enough of a sense of momentum.
Same, I played Doom and Eternal back to back and the atmospheric design change is a real sudden slap.
I want to disagree but you're right. It's one of the the things I hated with Doom Eternal when it was revealed. I still love the pixelated beauty of the originals but I appreciate the grungy and "upgraded" aesthetics of 2016. As opposed to a better "Doomsday" graphics of Eternal and how sometimes there's no logic or cohesion with its platforming. In 2016, it actually does, across the game.
But that's how Doom's supposed to feel. It never set out to be anything other than a fast-paced, brutal, arcadey shooter. If anything, the attempt to create a detailed lore is what's out of place, not the platforming.
The only legit complaint I've ever seen for the platforming is some variant of "I don't like platforming". Which, yeah thats fair enough if thats a person's personal preference. Its those that repeat things like "Eternal is 50% platforming" or "jumping should remain in Mario" that makes me roll my eyes. Usually these are the same people that will also say multiple enemies can only be killed in a specific manner
I laugh because Classic Dooms had platforming. You had to platform to complete levels like Underhalls, Perfect Hatered and The Chasm.
Platforming became a part of Doom since Doom 2.
Heck. Even I'm Doom 1 on the level phonos lab. There is a tiny little "jump" you have to do to get 2 secrets from the lifts.
Platforming has always been a part of doom
Even on the first ever doom level hanger. You have to run to a area and then run quickly into a secret lift to activate the secret.
Ehhh, the people (not YTers) who complain about platforming complain about enemy/weapon complexity and strategy overall.
@@muizzsiddiquetrue I call them fake boomers since those are people who got introduced to the franchise through doom 3 and doom 2016
@@filip2210 Doom 3 specifically, because Doom 2016 also had platforming sections. basic and rudimentary, but platforms nonetheless.
@@pepepenasalme9241 yeah I even forgot about those
And for my next Doom video "Why they should bring back the pistol..."
and make it operate like the starting weapon in DEVIL DAGGERS
I think the point the platforming got excessive in doom eternal was when it stopped being about these things, teaching the player how to move in real combat or just providing cool transitions between arenas. The timed obstacle course in Blood Swamps is what I would point to as the moment it "went too far". All that part taught me was how to get through the obstacle course, and it's not what anyone comes to a doom game for.
I think part of the complaints about DE's platforming also come from the general arcady vibe. Platforming itself may not be immersion breaking in the right context, but when you have Mario spinning beams and shit floating through the air for no real reason, it certainly is, the same way some people didn't like the massive glowing powerups or looney tunes stun effect.
Please do more look backs, this feels like 2020 again and I love it.
the falling platform also comes with a funny cutscene where a zombie grab it only to fall along with the platform.
I kinda wished combat part also had a better tutorial than an intrusive message that says "this is a cacodemon, feed them grenade for easy glory kills" tbh.
It isn't intrusive; the message appears before combat, never during, unlike in other games like Sekiro.
,,,, turn off tutorials-
Some random enemies to pop during these sections could have been fun.
Eternal was an absolute onslaught of action. It really didn't need enemies during the platforming
But there were random enemies during some of the platforming, just not as much as I wish we could have gotten.
My biggest problem with the platforming segments was that there was nothing to kill (with some exceptions ofc). I recently talked to a mate about how I preferred how you are constantly engaging in the core gameplay in the original Doom - shooting demons until they die (except when backtracking). On the opposite side of that is for example Exultia (edit: I meant Urdak) in D:E where you have large segments where you just get propelled from place A to place B while nothing else is going on. So in my eyes that's a loss of control that I wasn't a fan of.
True, it's like that shot from the Chasm. There's Cacos in that room while you walk along thin walkways and jump down the platforms to the ledge below.
Short answer: Hell nah, it was awesome. Long answer: gimme 7 minutes to watch the video...
edit: I agree 100% and you can totally do more videos like this, looking back at the game
Short answer: No.
This definitely isn't the sole reason, but I think the tonal shift between DOOM 4's more serious and gritty tone to Eternal's arcady feel is why some people were apprehensive to the platforming. DOOM 4 had platforming, but it was always worked into the environment. DOOM 4 gave you the feeling of traversing a damaged or destroyed space station, whereas Eternal was a lot less seamless.
I'll admit, I thought the arcade platforming sections were jarring for me at first. But they quickly grew on me.
I agree with your assessment, I liked the design of the platforming sections (except when it made you wait after resetting). What I’ve had an issue with is the actual platforming mechanics: they feel janky, floaty and unpolished. Just from memory, the hit boxes on monkey bars are so large that I would interact with them mid fight without wanting to (sometimes even with my back turned to them), whereas on the contrary walls are so inconsistent to trigger that spamming interact is the best bet and even then sometimes it just doesn’t work. The platforming being unrefined didn’t stick out as much in 2016 when there wasn’t as much of a focus on it, but in Eternal it was and it’s not polished enough to make the platforming sections as enjoyable as it should have been
This video was nostalgic.
I was again in 2020 when Doom Eternal came out and I found your channel.
No
@purebaldness, Yes!
@@tedpaydi2293 No
least it spawns you back with decreasing health abit that saved me compared 2016
Whether you played on PC or console is a massively underrated part of this discussion IMO. I and my friends who played on PC all loved the platforming, but 3 of my friends who played on Playstation quit the game partway though specifically because of a platforming section they found too difficult. Turning around in the air is a lot harder when you're using a controller, especially if you're new, and I think maybe some of the platforming sections were not designed with this limitation in mind.
It’s entirely doable you’ve got a bit of experience with any movement shooter
Most likely just low sensitivity and a lack of experience as I had no problems even on my first go
Although then again I did do titanfall 2 on master and movement shooters are far less popular on console
I confirm this. If you are a casual who has no experience with such accurate platforming with a controller, it is a pain to play Eternal. I have never finished it. I gave up when I was trying a jump for 10 minutes. I wanted to kill demons and not contemplate how to aim a jump from stick A to B to reach platform D from where I had to make a pixel-perfect double-jump-with-triple-dash to avoid falling into lava. Doom Eternal was a disappointment to me after the perfect experience with Doom 2016.
@@TegliG definitely over-exaggerating there when half of the posts that give you a dash boost you don’t even need it and you still get like five seconds pin the few drop platforms
@@CheeseSoup probably yes, but still, I wanted play Doom and slay demons. Not play Super Mario. I am not saying Eternal is a bad game and platforming is bad, but it was not for me.
if you go back to Doom 2016, how does movement and platoforming feel now? Boring? well paced? too simple? Just right? Im not sure cause i havent played it in a while but i remeber liking it more than the movement in eternal because it was easier to mess up. The 2 dashes do help you a bit too much in the end. its harder to end up in a position you didnt wanna end up and its easier to get out of that position. In Doom 2016 to get out of bad position i felt i had to tink and react way way better in that moment.
In all honesty, I love Doom 2016 but when I tried replaying it after mastering Doom Eternal gameplay mechanics. It just made me want to play Doom Eternal instead.
the platforming while difficult for beginners was a complete non issue after people figured out ballista boosting
the reaction of the devs following the advent of that technique was the admirable thing, they saw our progress and decided to goad it instead of stifle it by making ever more intricate movement puzzles
I'd like to hear your thoughts about arena design and flow, like how different spaces lead to unique challenges or emphasized the role certain demons played
The platforming was fun but it contributed to making Doom Eternal alot less immersive than Doom 2016.
I mean immersion wasn’t a goal and they were very much self aware
Oh yes, immersion, the thing that people misunderstand and use it to criticize good games
@@gu3282or maybe people place different amounts of value on world building and immersion than you do. I myself enjoy the most immersive games far more than other types because they're escapism. Some people don't care about that aspect, and that's fine. Give me Battlefields 3 and 1, Hunt Showdown, DOOM 2016 etc. any day for their immersion to their worlds over e.g. Call of Duty with its wacky skins and cataclysm of competing design choices or DOOM Eternal's literal Mario fireball chains and giant open platforming spaces that don't fit the world design. I get that these mechanics can be "fun" but the balance is not nailed right and the feedback you're getting from people is that the balance needs to be better struck between the mechanic and the worldbuilding so as not to be a jarring and obvious sore thumb to players.
@@RyneLanders if you value world building and "immersion" over gameplay you simply hate videogames (or misunderstand what is a videogame/ you're stupid). Almost every famous games praised for "immersion" are braindead and boring like Red Dead 2 and... Doom 2016. Sniper V2 and Papers Please are rare gems that has good "immersion" without lobotomizing your gameplay.
Also. Spinning fire balls are childish, I know, but if it is part of that world, like Mario, you shouldn't complain about it for "braking the world building" or whatever that means.
Sounds like people are forcing a narrative to hate good games bcs fuck it, they want to complain.
Look back video on the Marauder next?
So nostalgic to hear mayo talking about doom... wouldnt mind a few more videos like this
I wouldn't even call the platforming a pacebreaker. The climbing parts may be, but not the jumping and swinging with dashes in between etc..
The platforming was fine, it just felt kind of floaty at times in my opinion.
Something I wanted to see was parkour WITH combat, because nightmare sometimes was a cakewalk
Getting caught up with all your videos. I'm just as excited to see your Dark Ages content as I am for the game itself! Great stuff as always, Mayo. Also, hell yeah I'd definitely like to see more Eternal retrospect videos
My first playthrough of Doom Eternal I bounced off the platforming in the Urdak level, specifically the orange circles that zoomed you across big gaps. Made it all the way to the almost very end of the game and then didn't come back to it for years because I hated it that much.
What did you think of the swimming/diving sections? I absolutely hated those.
Personally I found them a little cool and immersive. Not crazy deep obviously but neat. The original Doom had toxic pools you had to navigate as well, so it's not unprecedented to see in Eternal.
I think the worst one was in UAC Atlantica in the first DLC. That large area towards the end with the shark was soooo big and open and a slog if you were trying to find the secrets.
Thing that annoyed me about the platforming in eternal was accidentally grabbing a ledge I just jumped down from and back into the waiting claws of the chasing demons. Forced me to always face away from a ledge I want to jump down from or jump extra far from it to make sure I don't accidentally auto grab back up the ledge. Got me killed many times.
Yeah this is the actual problem imo. The platforming mechanics in eternal was not polished enough to make the platforming as enjoyable as it should have been
auto-grabbing ledges is super jank, should've just made you press the jump key again. It gives me flashback on how awful assassins creed auto-parkour felt...
Oldschool Doom didn't have jumping. It had "run off this ledge and hope it works."
Doom Eternal's platforming was fine for the most part, but it wasn't needed. I'm glad The Dark Ages is going with a more grounded approach.
I'd love to see a vid on the importance of the landmark doom wads over the years (Eternal Doom, Scythe, BTSX, Eviternity, Heartland, etc.) and their influence on the evolution of classic vanilla doom's design.
It was one of the reasons why i liked Doom Eternal better than the first one
I loved the double jumps, dashes, platforming, and overal versatility of Doom Eternal.
I still really wanted at least a few sections of combat WHILE platforming. Fighting cacos while hopping between walls, sniping soldiers as you swing on monkey bars, would have been an interesting change up
The Shield-Saw acts a propeler, similar to the dash, and I suspect the flail is going to work as the meat hook but with a parabolic trajectory
No it didn’t
I liked the platforming and basically had the exact same thought process you did when playing the game. Developing the platforming skills did overall help me understand the movement philosophy of the game earlier than I would have if the platforming was not included
love it! perhaps doing a funzone follow up? Your fun zone video is one of my all time faves!
It's also very fitting in a game so focused on movement and speed. And yeah it feels kinda old school at the same time, like the people who made it clearly loved the old games.
Valid points , but the reason why i only played through the game once and the end of every session where i wanted to go play some fun doom is always getting to one of these sections. it puts so much noise in the way of the signal, it goes to a strict No do this, exactly this and stop having fun are you doing exactly what i asked? no then fail and go back! when a few moments ago i was having fun playing doom.
i loathe the platforming.
I've never played any doom game, besides Doom Eternal, I had no idea platforming wasn't part of doom, it felt naturally part of it. They should keep it.
Shame on you.
@griminale1334 bro? 😂 u good?
It is though. The old Doom games had plenty of platforming, just not as advanced obviously.
Platforming wasn't "part" of it. But mobility has and always has been there. A most primary example is the infamous cyberdemon fight where the player needs to learn the art of circle strafing. Which then helps in certain map navigation in episode 3 of the original.
@@scragglie All the better now someone's asked me mate, I love and appreciate ya. 🫶🏼
One of the best things about Doom Eternal's platfoming is that the better you get at it the faster you can traverse platforming sections. Most platforming sections on repeat playthroughs can be breezed through and are not the neck-breaking pace ruiners so many people who just can't be arsed to engage with the mechanics claim them to be.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on the melee balancing of doom eternal- especially how the dash does more damage than the base punch.
No, it didn't suck, but it was a little out of place in a few cases. Swimming sucks though
The swimming was awful.
Swimming almost always sucks in games, it's measured not about whether it's great or not, it's about whether it's tolerable or otherwise.
Yes, yes it did. Particularly the absurd Mario-esque jump on the sinking platforms magically hovering above the lava floor part. That made my eyes roll so far back that I could see my own brain.
Agreed, it is the main reason it is the only Doom I have not finished even once. I found the platforming tedious, and kinda felt like a weird amusement park to me.
It was just not what I was looking for in a Doom game. Preferred the previous game in every way.
Looking forward to this new one though, seems like it might be more for me.
I really like the way you talked about platforming in Eternal because I was one of those people who needed to learn about dash spacing because im a very impatient person I do things quickly in games that let me so learning the right moments to slow down and focus was really rewarding while playing Doom Eternal.
Doom Eternal took me from someone who played videogames on normal to someone who plays videogames on the hardest difficulty. So it was very good at teaching me things. Also, I'll always watch a doom Eternal video, they're great!
Gotta have Mario segments
An important note: the monkey bar in Cultist Base becomes more complicated for the particular subset of players who did not pick Air Mobility rune to that moment, as it's required to jump forward to the platform and then back to the bar without reverting mid-jump.
I never equipped air control and I do not even remember that part, dude. You are overselling it.
Absolutely incorrect.
I remember TotalBisquit disliking parkour (and/or "parkour puzzles") and the level design being build around it so much in Titanfall 2. I imagine he would most certainly HATE Eternal's platforming sections, despite probably absolutely loving everything else in the game.
The bit where you have to swing off a bar and immediately 360 back on the same bar was so cool
It didn't.
I can't even imagine the new Doom not having platforming, it's so good in Doom Eternal
100% do videos looking back and evaluating on on old doom eternal stuff
Ahh, classic Mayo. I'd love more Doom retrospectives like this as we wait for The Dark Ages!!!
I think there's more pros than cons to Eternal's platforming. It's good! But not flawless. I think it's at its best in the second half of Exultia, the toxic sewers of Super Gore Nest, the open space of Mars Core, and speeding across the massive expanses of Urdak.
It gives you some much appreciated time to breath inbetween arena fights. It teaches you how to move around in midair which is very helpful during arena fights. It's genuinely fun to bounce and swing all over the place. The wall-climbing animation is chunky and satisfying. It makes levels bigger and more open. You can figure out shortcuts and tricks to skip parts of the sections which can feel cool and rewarding.
Eventually, I learned that you don't have to climb up walls their entire length to advance in platforming sections. You actually jump off of them pretty high. This means you can bounce between walls almost as fast as you can look at them! It's quite satisfying once you get it down!
This faster method, however, likely isn't very doable on controller with the sticks... As well, the platforming isn't necessarily "expressive" or deep. There's very rarely multiple paths to choose from. You basically do it the same way every time, unless you figure out those shortcuts, which to an intermediate player like myself don't seem that plentiful unless you do game-breaking speedrun stuff.
I also want to say that the Meathook grapple points in TAG2 were fantastic, and I really wish they had been used throughout the entire game. Those sections felt so fun and creative, and actually taught me that moving sideways while Meathooking propels you forward with great speed! I had only been jumping during my hooks to send me upwards higher. They really helped me open up my mobility more. I remember Hugo saying during your interview with him that they weren't in the base game due to time constraints, which is a huge shame, but oh well, I still learned the technique.
I don't think 2016 was badly paced or lacking without platforming, even when returning to it after Eternal; it still has climbing and minor platforming sections. I do think Eternal is marginally better and has more of an identity thanks to the platforming. I wouldn't say it was a revelatory game-changer, but I appreciate it for what it is!
People generally seem to think that platforming doesn't work in first person, but Eternal actually has me curious about how far the concept can go. If I ever somehow get the chance to work on a boomer shooter, I'd love to do stuff with wall-jumping and grapple hooking! That sense of momentum feels great, and I argue works very well in arena shooters which are already focused on high-octane mobility.
I did not like it one bit. Platforming or glory kills or chainsaw animations. What a pace breaker. Every time I mentioned it anywhere, that I didnt enjoy it, people would get back at me “oh its the loop and without it it wouldnt work” or how genius it was. Im glad that those people were happy and now its our turn to brute our way through.
Bro I understand the platforming bit but fucking glory kills and chainsawing xd? It's not like you're forced to do glory kills opposite to platforming and they are fucking awesome, they give you sense of how badass Doomslayer is and how he can beat the shit of demons with his bare hands. Without it he would just be the super fast guy running around them in circles, not really badassery.
@@kamilekzdun6929 well that is your opinion and here we are with next Doom game that doesnt have “animations” for melee/chainsaw etc
Gay Donkey Kong
nintendo on june 1st
meanwhile nintendo july 1st at 1201 AM: so long gay bowser!
Hey mayo are you going to play the DMC reboot and make a video on it? It has some stuff you might like like a must style mode where enemies only take damage if you're styling
DMC4 first.
Funny, was just chatting about this subject earlier. Very cool!
Agreed on everything, felt it was overhated. Doom Eternal's platforming felt very good to navigate. I can maybe sympathize with people not liking the aesthetic though. Not sure if you saw the Hugo interview, but apparently Dark Ages combat will be inspired by Classic Doom - with slower projectiles, stepping away from multi-tiered arenas, and more than double the AI on screen. Weaving through the projectiles will apparently be the "jungle gym" of combat, which is interesting. The lack of jumping in the trailer (and even no Meathook) makes me wonder if they might just outright remove jumping for Dark Ages entirely?
I'm really loving how all these new Doom games are separate an have their own identity. The only thing I've genuinely hated was being locking in a room with Sam and having to listen to him talk for five minutes.
I always defended the platforming because it's technically part of the "gameplay" unlike the upgrade menu system (feels like a very AAA thing).
Maybe people thought the presentation was "too Mario" but if you tweaked certain aspects, it wouldn't be that off.
I once wrote ideas for new stuff i think they should try for platforming/level design in both that Rentry meytr post and my doom-nerdo-666 blog.
I also think the Mars Core could've had some low grav sections and Cultist base could've had slippery ice floors.
Why? because yes.
Another idea or two i had was energy walls the player can use as platforms or destroy like exploring barrels using plasma.
And also machinery and stuff that you shoot plasma at so you can power it and then plasma energy recharge centers like those things in Wolfenstein TNO, so the plasma rifle is also a "tool".
In general, the platforming exists to make use of your mobility and even your guns since you have to shoot buttons and in TAG2, meathook stuff (underused)
I do hope Dark Ages at least gets creative with exploration and puzzles.
I forgot how much I actually liked the platforming in this game. I wish it had snapmap like 2016 to see what kind of levels people could make for it
imo the Air Control rune shouldn't have been a rune. It should have been just part of the controls since the very beginning. I would have LOVED having another rune slot for something else while still being able to move around in the air. I have yet to see anyone NOT have the rune to the point where I think it should part of the slayer's passive kit.
Doom Eternal's platforming didn't suck like Arkham Knight's batmobile didn't suck.😉
Batmobile didn't suck. The cobra tank sections definitely did. Same with DE's underwater puzzles.
Not comparable at all.
Both broke pacing but one served as a test to ensure players did not get frustrated when facing enemies encounters that required mobility. The other one was just a boring movement puzzle that didn't teach anything useful that could be translated to the main combat loop
It ended up being a chore on replays, but it did help teach me the extent of the Slayer’s agility, which improved my combat skill.
So maybe there was just a little too much.
I feel like there was maybe 7 minutes of platforming sections throughout the game. I never had an issue with it, I had more of an issue getting used to the new strafe jumping mechanics.
I just wish it was more involving. I felt like most of the time the obstacles were too easy to skip entirely (the spinning chains, for instance). There was this one section in the DLC when you had to do a longer platforming section in a limited time and it was cool (a bit janky, though).
My problem with it was how often it was unclear where I was supposed to go as a new player. Even now sometimes I look around for a bit before I find the right path in some levels. I seriously spent so much time just wishing I could be fighting but being stuck cause they hid a button behind a statues ass
Don't they always mark those with whatever is glowing so you get an instinct to either jump, or punch it?
@@danielgeronimo5538 Modern gamer can't figure out things by himself without a NPC screaming "over here" with a gigantic purple arrow pointing where's he's supposed to go.
@@gu3282And to think we complained about yellow paint in recent RE.
No. I never had a single problem with it. Accidentally using the monkey bars sometimes was pretty annoying (I was always begging for a hotkey instead) but that was so minor.
I would love to see more doom videos, seeing how it may apply to the upcoming game.
I love how niche your content is. Your videos are good enough to accompany meals
The basic platforming was fine, I only hated the parts where you had to swing around on the grappling hook, that's where I started to use cheats for infinite dash and jump.
Those platforming sections always felt refreshing and im always kinda sad that they are so short (neon white enthusiast lol) btw i know you don't like being reduced as a doom creator, but we are so back and i love it. Peak videos
Wow. Interesting point. Your understanding of game design and the way you prent it is just amazing.
I never realized the platforming taught me to actually move around in eternal. but heck yes, it did! I wasn't able to pull that off before those sections.
If you have more thought like that. PLEASE share. i love your thoughts on gameplay!
Thanks, just did one on the weakpoint system. I have tutorials for Sifu that break down the gameplay and theory. And I really dive into this stuff in my survival horror videos. Like the review of Crow Country
i was so happy for the platforming in doom eternal, i grew up on the the classic doom games and the original unreal tournament and it was such a crucial part of the game play
The one platform section that I hated at launch was the stupidly long-range jump in Urdak. Thankfully it was patched.
There’s another reason as well, they have these amazing heavy metal album cover vistas, that rely on floating islands and disconnected surfaces- the best way to preserve that visual appeal and make the map traversable- is to make platforming sections.
I think a look-back on Doom games in general would be amazing. I'm personally gonna be looking at the originals because the game's description talks about taking direct inspiration from those games.
I almost always like when there's a little bit of a change of pace like the platforming in Eternal. Helps give you some exercise on skills for combat, as you say, and also is just fun in ita own right, as long as it's not just auto platforming. It needs to have a bit of player engagement
I don’t like a lot of platforming in my fps games. That’s just my personal preference. I get why the designers did it in doom eternal because they wanted the arena battles to have that fast fluid flying movement and the platforming teaches that.
But here is the thing, for me, I don’t enjoy that either.
I want to either shoot at a distance or get close in melee.
Flying/jumping around isn’t a style of play I enjoy. It’s good that it’s there for those who enjoy it, but it would be awesome if the designers gave players the choice to do other play styles.
When a game is designed to accommodates multiple play styles, that is something I appreciate.
TDA is obviously a more grounded (in a literal sense) game than Eternal but I doubt it won't have platforming in it, I think they just didn't show it in the trailer because...well...platforming isn't all that exciting, unless there's some unique movement tech like the Meathook in Eternal
I mostly agree with you, but what I really didn't like was some of the platforming needed for secrets in the DLCs.
It was imo kinda excessive, and got really iritating, since this kind of FPS platforming is servicable at best I think.
I hope you make a video in which you talk about your opinion of the new update to the game Cyberpunked 2077 2.1
That... will never happen because I'm not going to play Cyberpunk again.
I subbed for Doom stuff and did like your other content but would love to see you cover it again. Personally, I will be avoiding new Doom spoilers (even post release).
Hi have you checked rage 2 i recently been playing it and it has a lot of doom eternal vibes but in openworld sandbox, I'm actually surprised it gets as much a bad rep
Mainly because it was released at the same time by the same company in similar genres and Eternal is far better so people only compare Rage 2 to Eternal even though it’s also good
How about on how bad the difficulty spike is in the ancient gods dlc, cause even on easy mode, you still die so fast in the dlc
"Mayo, the Battlerina" 🔫💃
make some more of these. i reckon they are great retrospective. that is, if you have something new to add of course, and given the time passed and all the games you played, you probably do.
I think it's more of a presentation and aesthetics issue, which is also a point of contention on a larger scale for people.
Doom Eternal's levels are very arcedy for some as the combat arenas dictate almost all of the levels' design. Best example for this is Reclaimed Earth from TAG2 which really is just one combat box to another.
ARC Complex on the other hand is the least like that. It flows more naturally if that makes sense.
People love and value immersion a lot, regardless of how crazy a game's setting is. Doom 2016 had the combat box designs as well but the level surrounding them had a more coherent flow to them. Seeing platforms flying out of nowhere and flaming balls on a chain just circling around can get people out of the game.
Platforming would have been less of an issue for people I think if the environments they showed up in made more sense.
The platforming is cool when it makes sense depending on the environment like scaling a building while it crumbles is cool as hell, but then floating platforms with perfectly placed monkey bars to swing on looks really goofy. it doesn’t help when some sections hide secrets that require prior knowledge to find that won’t let you go back for them because it’s impossible to make the jump back forcing you to restart the level or forcing the player to backtrack after completing it with the teleporting at the end of the level hopefully these issues are fixed in the next game.
By all means, Mayo. If you feel inspired to talk more about Doom, do it. I'll definitely be tuning in. ^_^
I'm curious to see what they'll fill the gaps between combat with in Dark Ages when the levels seem to be more open and larger in scale. 2016 didn't have as much platforming but it also featured much smaller spaces and had a more corridor design.