There is a long standing debate about what your first hardware purchase should be for sim games like Star Citizen, some say you should get a stick first, other say your should get a head tracker first. Where do you stand on this discussion? Let me know! 👀Grab an Eye Tracker 5 for 15% off using my link: tobii.gg/hybridvcon 🚀Enter Tobii's sweepstakes for a chance to win an Eye Tracker 5 and SC ships: tobii.gg/hybridvcon-contest 🤓Learn more about how Tobii integrates into Star Citizen: robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/18289-Tobii-Eye-Tracker-5 See you all in the next one! o7
Headtracker, especially tobii because it's always there and ready to go. No extra attachment to your headset like track IR or extra room for the sticks.
@@Derzull2468 the price difference is alot £299.00 ($380.98) for the tobii and £127.00 ($161.82)for the trackir 5 check it out tr5 has wireless head mount available it can last for 12 hours with the battery but i use an extra power pack so it can last till i turn it off the tobii5 needs to be reset to centre fairly often, more often than trackir 5 i have used both for ages i finally sold my tobii 5. both items have trouble with natural light merry Christmas to you 😉👌
I have Tobii and its been great to use. There are some settings however that even googling feels a bit underwhelming. An indepth settings video would be useful. Thus far I have kept the default settings.
@Swatmat tobii is mostly smooth, but there are times where it feels a bit jittery on the more precise eye movements. Not certain if that's a sensitivity issue or what. There are times where I need to zoom in on an MFD and move my eyes around slightly to be able to select what I want, but it feels super jittery there. I've learned to live with it, but if there's a setting I could adjust that would be phenomenal
Personally, i don't use eye movement for any head movement, it causes issues as you say, just use the head, however u can still use your eyes for gaze targeting and highlighting which is the real selling point for me. alos turn off auto centre and only have a very tiny dead zone like 0.1@@jchacon103
@@jchacon103 ahh no setting can stop this due to your eyes continually moving i found i had to turn of the eye tracking when i zoomed in, i returned the tobii and bought a trackir 5 even with the wireless it was alot cheaper
So after seeing the audio section of citizencon yesterday i want to thank you for making the Hammerhead turret gunner video. CiG needs to give you credit for the inspiration
tobii is amazing. it works with my glasses, and whats more important, I have this permanent small tick with my head and eyes (head moves left and right and the eyes compensate in opposite direction), and I wont even notice in game, it simply ignores this genetic bs
As a big time mouse and keyboard player, getting a Tobii before getting sticks is probably the only way I'd recommend doing it. For a pretty consistent $250 you get a new perspective in Star Citizen and quite a few other games (Farming Simulator? Unturned? wtf???) There's cool programming stuff you can do with it too, meanwhile you'd be spending about the same on an entry level dual stick setup (if you skip the T16000), but then you have to learn an entirely new form of controller. Looking around in a video game by just turning your head is about as close to VR-level immersion as you can get without strapping a PC to your face.
Have been using TrackIR5 since forever for all kinds of sims and was extremely happy that SC had support for it basically since the beginning. I have always used the standard reflector instead of the active "pro'" beacon, no wires required but the "teletubby" has it's own drawbacks but for me it has been working just fine and I keep it permanently attached to my headset and I always play with headset (boom mic). The missile-locking works with trackir too. IMO some sort of head-tracking is absolutely a game changer for any and all sim-a-likes that support it and I would definitely recommend that over any other hardware purchases simply because of more utility. Of course if the only sim-ish thing one plays is flying then quality dual sticks or hotas is super nice for immersion and generally better control (now that tri-chording no longer give an acceleration advantage on kb I guess stick+mouse is the "most competitive" control scheme)
I have a tobii and absolutely loved it for FPS stuff in Star Citizen, But I still haven't found a sweet spot with settings for flight so I would totally watch a overview video on those options
Well... the wife's been asking what I wanted for Christmas, and until I saw this video, my answer was "nothing." This looks incredible! And LOL at the "matrix reject playing video games." Great video bud. Liked and subscribed.
I would say two flight sticks are the first things to get for Star Citizen. I started with a stick and throttle in SC but two sticks opens up more options to maneuver. I have a Delanclip head tracker and it increases enjoyment but it doesn't fundamentally change gameplay the way flight sticks do.
Looks like Tobii 5 has surpassed Track IR for low light functionality. Head/eye tracking and dual sticks will likely be my next hardware purchases. I kind of need a better desk first as right now I'm just using a folding table (one piece top, just the legs fold).
I obliviously don't know how much it costs to make this device but the price seems a little over the top... Like I'd me more willing to recommend it for $120. At the current price I'm not really so sure you need have a lot of money to burn and play enough game's you'll use it in. I find the head tracking to be a little more janky than I would like which is a shame since think most Star Citizen players are going to be far more interested in the head tracking part than the eye side of thing. I do feel like mixing just a touch of eye tracking in does make things feel smoother but I'm like 94~96% head. Maybe if I used sticks instead of M&K I'd be willing to use a little more eye assuming I wouldn't glance down as often but the same thing would still apply when looking at second display or whatever else. The way I have the device set up now it kind of requires focusing my eyes in certain direction to make the camera pan but I can't glance around without too much effect. I even like the dead space configured a little high for the head tracking too.
id say twin sticks, then a head tracker, there is free head tracking software (its not nearly as refined as tobii or track IR) that you can get with your android or iphone and use that until you decide if you want to get a more professional solution.
The Tobii Eye Tracker 5 is more and more responsive patch after patch. I have it since 2 years now and come from the Trackir 5 before. Today the difference is close from the head tracking point of view but the eyes tracking add a more natural feeling in the camera movements... I recommande.
Head tracking is a MUST, at least in smaller ships! It's an absolute game-changer, but you only need a webcam for it. You can use the in-game software or other head tracking software. The gaze targeting feature sounds awesome for SC, but I like to play in darkness a lot which means cameras struggle seeing my face clearly, so I think that's a huge plus for the TrackIR 5 where the camera looks at the light of the headset, not your face.
Yeah I used a webcam for months and now that I have my Tobii I can tell you that a standard webcam is definitely not even close in the accuracy comparison and fluidity.
I just mount the reflector on the top of my headset using one of my wifes hair ties, easy to put on and take off and no wires, works pretty good for me guessing because there's no other light sources messing with it. Also Grass monkey king head tracker has a updated version of trackir that uses a wireless version that attaches to the side of your headset via velco that could be a alternative its half the price of TrackIR they have a website and operate in the US.
Please go over how you set up the options for Tobii ... I have been struggling to get a smooth experience with it. It tends to jerk around when I keep my head still. Not sure why?
I really like my grass monkey king head tracker. It was cheap and it does what I need to do. eye tracking is kinda cool but all I really wanted to do was look out the windows.
One thing you forgot to mention is that you can use the headtracking and looking around in the 3rd person view. So this is also a great tool for machinima filmmakers.
I want to see a benchmark showing how much of an FPS hit there is using this vs trackir (given more interpolation needs to happen in software drivers). Also, is there an increased perceived head tracking latency, when switching from track IR
Yeah my initial reaction is that it's not quite worth for the amount I play Star Citizen or other appropriate games these days. I'm sort of afraid that if we get to a point that I really start to mainly play Star Citizen the hardware will have improved at that point and we'll be on Tobii 6 or something like that. :P
I game changing expiriance it complements well with my existing equipment setup. Good investment ☆☆☆☆☆ thanks. After attending citizenscon 2953 yesterday and hearing their sound quality I can see how your "Hammerhead turret gunner video" you previously created have inspired Starcitizen audio team to improve their sound quality.
I actually use Tobii with the Samsung 34-Inch Odyssey G5 Ultra-Wide monitor it's a 1000R curved screen not sure if that might be why but it works extremely effectively for me after calibrating the eye tracker in the app they install I don't have any issues with tobii at all it's been really nice to have as I can look all the way from one corner of the screen to the other. However, I am not entirely sure if it will work better or worse on a bigger screen or if it's not curved so I can't say for sure but if your screen falls into a similarish area it may just work for you.
I use tobii with a 49 inch super ultra wide. No issues at all. You may want to reduce gaze tracking to about 5%. Your eyes looking around the large screen should not move the view very much. That feels unnatural
Does the eye tracker bar have to be at eye level? Will it work at the top or bottom of a screen if that's not in line with your eyes? I play on a 55-inch TV.... No-one ever mentions this aspect.
I would say it won't work well on the top of the screen, but it actually should be below eye level. It's designed to go on the bottom of your monitor. I have mine stuck to the metal grill on my center speaker below the monitor. Works like a charm
Why is nobody comparing Tobii to the build in webcam tracking in Star Citizen? I would like to know if it's a significant upgrade or not, if it's almost the same experience you could save hundreds and just get a cheapy webcam. The built in webcam method also works for facial expression tracking which Tobii doesn't do.
So i saw somewhere that someone controlled their turret or gimbals with tobii, but for the life of me can not figure it out as the crosshair remains forward. Any advice there?
Ive both Trackhat and Tobi, both are excellent, yet with tobi there is no garbage to have to wear, its 2023 for christs sake. VR is a no no, VR is a pain and dated, to big and cumbersome, stagnant and costly development. Tobi is a natural choice, being both totally awesome and unobtrusive. Excellent commentary as usual, interesting and informative
Wait what? I got my tobii 5 about a year ago and I didn't have a usb extender cable in mine??? luckily I can route the cable but she's taunt without give!
It works pretty well in low light. Don't know about full darkness though. It likely uses IR tracking, so might work. As to leaning back, it has no issue with leaning back in your chair
I'd love one of these, but I have a problem. I play in a low light room (because I pay the electric bill), and I wear glasses. So the monitor light would hide my eyes. T-T First world problems...
Even though I mostly agree, I'd say latency is the main motivation for grabbing the Tobii anyway. Low latency is essential for head tracking to not be frustrating
Honestly between TrackIR, GRASSMONKEYSIMULATION's version of TrackIR and Tobii, I'm glad Tobii is giving it out to streamers and giving them a kickback for helping sell its product. This kind of device needs to go more mainstream it improves SC and other games like it greatly.
As long as it's clear this is a sponsored video, I have no issue with it. The Tobii is absolutely great and absolutely expensive AF. There's your downside, lol
There is a long standing debate about what your first hardware purchase should be for sim games like Star Citizen, some say you should get a stick first, other say your should get a head tracker first. Where do you stand on this discussion? Let me know!
👀Grab an Eye Tracker 5 for 15% off using my link:
tobii.gg/hybridvcon
🚀Enter Tobii's sweepstakes for a chance to win an Eye Tracker 5 and SC ships:
tobii.gg/hybridvcon-contest
🤓Learn more about how Tobii integrates into Star Citizen:
robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/18289-Tobii-Eye-Tracker-5
See you all in the next one!
o7
Headtracker, especially tobii because it's always there and ready to go. No extra attachment to your headset like track IR or extra room for the sticks.
@@Derzull2468 the price difference is alot £299.00 ($380.98) for the tobii and £127.00 ($161.82)for the trackir 5 check it out tr5 has wireless head mount available it can last for 12 hours with the battery but i use an extra power pack so it can last till i turn it off
the tobii5 needs to be reset to centre fairly often, more often than trackir 5 i have used both for ages i finally sold my tobii 5.
both items have trouble with natural light
merry Christmas to you 😉👌
Don't buy new ships, buy tobii and HOSAS. You will never go back.
Why not both 😂
Best advice right here!
@@aromaticsugar Thats if you have a lot of disposable income.
This is really good advice. Buy all your ships after. Sticks and tracker first. Then new 34 ultra wide LG or Asus monitor.
Yeah experience purchase is the way to go with this game. You can always steal ships.
I have Tobii and its been great to use. There are some settings however that even googling feels a bit underwhelming. An indepth settings video would be useful. Thus far I have kept the default settings.
What are your problems? I have it for a good while now and think I've got it nailed down
@Swatmat tobii is mostly smooth, but there are times where it feels a bit jittery on the more precise eye movements. Not certain if that's a sensitivity issue or what. There are times where I need to zoom in on an MFD and move my eyes around slightly to be able to select what I want, but it feels super jittery there. I've learned to live with it, but if there's a setting I could adjust that would be phenomenal
Personally, i don't use eye movement for any head movement, it causes issues as you say, just use the head, however u can still use your eyes for gaze targeting and highlighting which is the real selling point for me. alos turn off auto centre and only have a very tiny dead zone like 0.1@@jchacon103
@@jchacon103 ahh no setting can stop this due to your eyes continually moving i found i had to turn of the eye tracking when i zoomed in, i returned the tobii and bought a trackir 5 even with the wireless it was alot cheaper
TLDW: Yes. Trust me. When I have it deactivated I move my head and feel really dumb when nothing ingame is happening. I can't play without it anymore.
Lol same here)
Please do the follow up video that details all the options!!! That would be so incredibly useful!
So after seeing the audio section of citizencon yesterday i want to thank you for making the Hammerhead turret gunner video.
CiG needs to give you credit for the inspiration
tobii is amazing. it works with my glasses, and whats more important, I have this permanent small tick with my head and eyes (head moves left and right and the eyes compensate in opposite direction), and I wont even notice in game, it simply ignores this genetic bs
Geez you sir are a decent salesman I just bought one, thank you.
As a big time mouse and keyboard player, getting a Tobii before getting sticks is probably the only way I'd recommend doing it. For a pretty consistent $250 you get a new perspective in Star Citizen and quite a few other games (Farming Simulator? Unturned? wtf???) There's cool programming stuff you can do with it too, meanwhile you'd be spending about the same on an entry level dual stick setup (if you skip the T16000), but then you have to learn an entirely new form of controller. Looking around in a video game by just turning your head is about as close to VR-level immersion as you can get without strapping a PC to your face.
Have been using TrackIR5 since forever for all kinds of sims and was extremely happy that SC had support for it basically since the beginning. I have always used the standard reflector instead of the active "pro'" beacon, no wires required but the "teletubby" has it's own drawbacks but for me it has been working just fine and I keep it permanently attached to my headset and I always play with headset (boom mic). The missile-locking works with trackir too.
IMO some sort of head-tracking is absolutely a game changer for any and all sim-a-likes that support it and I would definitely recommend that over any other hardware purchases simply because of more utility. Of course if the only sim-ish thing one plays is flying then quality dual sticks or hotas is super nice for immersion and generally better control (now that tri-chording no longer give an acceleration advantage on kb I guess stick+mouse is the "most competitive" control scheme)
Tobii + VirPil Alpha HOSAS = superFUN
The only thing missing is a VR
I have a tobii and absolutely loved it for FPS stuff in Star Citizen, But I still haven't found a sweet spot with settings for flight so I would totally watch a overview video on those options
you have to adjust alot in the options of star citizen to make it
Didn't even get all the way through the video before I bought one with your code!! LETS GOOO!! Please do a video on the in game settings please!
Well... the wife's been asking what I wanted for Christmas, and until I saw this video, my answer was "nothing." This looks incredible! And LOL at the "matrix reject playing video games." Great video bud. Liked and subscribed.
I would say two flight sticks are the first things to get for Star Citizen. I started with a stick and throttle in SC but two sticks opens up more options to maneuver. I have a Delanclip head tracker and it increases enjoyment but it doesn't fundamentally change gameplay the way flight sticks do.
Do you need a pedal?
I use the stick rotation input for controls usually handled by pedals. @@-detectivealec8937
Always good to see what RUclipsrs actually look like, spied you at 3:25 ;-)
Looks like Tobii 5 has surpassed Track IR for low light functionality. Head/eye tracking and dual sticks will likely be my next hardware purchases. I kind of need a better desk first as right now I'm just using a folding table (one piece top, just the legs fold).
Fun to test your PVS-14 in the same room your Tobii is in. IR is very very bright under night vision. :)
I obliviously don't know how much it costs to make this device but the price seems a little over the top... Like I'd me more willing to recommend it for $120. At the current price I'm not really so sure you need have a lot of money to burn and play enough game's you'll use it in.
I find the head tracking to be a little more janky than I would like which is a shame since think most Star Citizen players are going to be far more interested in the head tracking part than the eye side of thing. I do feel like mixing just a touch of eye tracking in does make things feel smoother but I'm like 94~96% head. Maybe if I used sticks instead of M&K I'd be willing to use a little more eye assuming I wouldn't glance down as often but the same thing would still apply when looking at second display or whatever else. The way I have the device set up now it kind of requires focusing my eyes in certain direction to make the camera pan but I can't glance around without too much effect. I even like the dead space configured a little high for the head tracking too.
id say twin sticks, then a head tracker, there is free head tracking software (its not nearly as refined as tobii or track IR) that you can get with your android or iphone and use that until you decide if you want to get a more professional solution.
The Tobii Eye Tracker 5 is more and more responsive patch after patch. I have it since 2 years now and come from the Trackir 5 before. Today the difference is close from the head tracking point of view but the eyes tracking add a more natural feeling in the camera movements... I recommande.
Head tracking is a MUST, at least in smaller ships!
It's an absolute game-changer, but you only need a webcam for it. You can use the in-game software or other head tracking software.
The gaze targeting feature sounds awesome for SC, but I like to play in darkness a lot which means cameras struggle seeing my face clearly, so I think that's a huge plus for the TrackIR 5 where the camera looks at the light of the headset, not your face.
Yeah I used a webcam for months and now that I have my Tobii I can tell you that a standard webcam is definitely not even close in the accuracy comparison and fluidity.
@@ronniecole138
But which head tracking software did you use? Cause the one integrated in the game is ass.
This was a great video! Production and content value is awesome.
Please do a follow up video!!
Great video. Didn’t even know about padlocking!
I have track IR and the wires make it such a pain in the ass to keep it nice and stable with my setup. I'm gonna have to pick this up for SC and DCS.
I just mount the reflector on the top of my headset using one of my wifes hair ties, easy to put on and take off and no wires, works pretty good for me guessing because there's no other light sources messing with it.
Also Grass monkey king head tracker has a updated version of trackir that uses a wireless version that attaches to the side of your headset via velco that could be a alternative its half the price of TrackIR they have a website and operate in the US.
@@MeoithTheSecond ill check that out too! Thanks for the heads up
Please go over how you set up the options for Tobii ... I have been struggling to get a smooth experience with it. It tends to jerk around when I keep my head still. Not sure why?
That sounds like a bug or a lighting problem. That's not something you're going to fix with settings
Tobii went down for a bit; software Issue on my side, and I couldn’t hardly stand to play SC without it. 10-10 would buy again
I really like my grass monkey king head tracker. It was cheap and it does what I need to do. eye tracking is kinda cool but all I really wanted to do was look out the windows.
^This and its half the price of TrackIR with a better refresh rate
Yes, please release another video for Tobii settings!
One thing you forgot to mention is that you can use the headtracking and looking around in the 3rd person view. So this is also a great tool for machinima filmmakers.
But he did say that?
That was definitely mentioned :P
Side question: do you actually use HOSAS for ground vehicles as well? Can you share your setup?
I want to see a benchmark showing how much of an FPS hit there is using this vs trackir (given more interpolation needs to happen in software drivers). Also, is there an increased perceived head tracking latency, when switching from track IR
My glasses are fucked they basically fold in half when I wear them and my Tobii still works perfectly, Tobii the goat
Please do fallow up video with settings detailed!
As always.. love your content, Hybrid! I'd love to get Tobii if it wasn't a little out of my price range
Yeah my initial reaction is that it's not quite worth for the amount I play Star Citizen or other appropriate games these days. I'm sort of afraid that if we get to a point that I really start to mainly play Star Citizen the hardware will have improved at that point and we'll be on Tobii 6 or something like that. :P
If you have an IPhone you can get precise wireless head tracking for 10 bucks if you don’t want to spend 250
I game changing expiriance it complements well with my existing equipment setup. Good investment ☆☆☆☆☆ thanks. After attending citizenscon 2953 yesterday and hearing their sound quality I can see how your "Hammerhead turret gunner video" you previously created have inspired Starcitizen audio team to improve their sound quality.
Oof, sick outro music, you gotta send me that!
Thought about buying one of these but they are limited if you use an ultrawide.
I actually use Tobii with the Samsung 34-Inch Odyssey G5 Ultra-Wide monitor it's a 1000R curved screen not sure if that might be why but it works extremely effectively for me after calibrating the eye tracker in the app they install I don't have any issues with tobii at all it's been really nice to have as I can look all the way from one corner of the screen to the other. However, I am not entirely sure if it will work better or worse on a bigger screen or if it's not curved so I can't say for sure but if your screen falls into a similarish area it may just work for you.
woks perfectly with my ultrawide
I use tobii with a 49 inch super ultra wide. No issues at all. You may want to reduce gaze tracking to about 5%. Your eyes looking around the large screen should not move the view very much. That feels unnatural
Does the eye tracker bar have to be at eye level? Will it work at the top or bottom of a screen if that's not in line with your eyes? I play on a 55-inch TV.... No-one ever mentions this aspect.
I would say it won't work well on the top of the screen, but it actually should be below eye level. It's designed to go on the bottom of your monitor. I have mine stuck to the metal grill on my center speaker below the monitor. Works like a charm
Why is nobody comparing Tobii to the build in webcam tracking in Star Citizen? I would like to know if it's a significant upgrade or not, if it's almost the same experience you could save hundreds and just get a cheapy webcam. The built in webcam method also works for facial expression tracking which Tobii doesn't do.
So i saw somewhere that someone controlled their turret or gimbals with tobii, but for the life of me can not figure it out as the crosshair remains forward. Any advice there?
So, I tend to look down at my keyboard often when typing and looking for keys. is this going to flip my screen view down and up and dizzy my screen?
Ive both Trackhat and Tobi, both are excellent, yet with tobi there is no garbage to have to wear, its 2023 for christs sake. VR is a no no, VR is a pain and dated, to big and cumbersome, stagnant and costly development. Tobi is a natural choice, being both totally awesome and unobtrusive. Excellent commentary as usual, interesting and informative
Wait what? I got my tobii 5 about a year ago and I didn't have a usb extender cable in mine??? luckily I can route the cable but she's taunt without give!
can i turn off the eyetracker for walking around? or in other words, can i have it only for when i am in a seat of a ship?
can you use a joy stick with star Citizen ?
20% off for Black friday
Also based on my research, Tobii doesn't seem to support screens bigger than 30".
It has been working on my 35" NO issues.
@@osuave7811
I am seeing conflicting reports on this.
Thanks hybrid. Track IR has irritated me for a while now and you answered every question I had.
Yes
How well it works with a reading glasses?
does it work in dark and what if i lean further back with controller?
It works pretty well in low light. Don't know about full darkness though. It likely uses IR tracking, so might work.
As to leaning back, it has no issue with leaning back in your chair
I cannot fly without my tobii.
I'd love one of these, but I have a problem. I play in a low light room (because I pay the electric bill), and I wear glasses. So the monitor light would hide my eyes. T-T First world problems...
I was skeptical, too, thinking that would be on issue, but after using it for weeks now, there are no issues to report
Personally I would rather better VR support
Yes 👍
Hybrid has a sponsor now #startedfromthebottomrankofraidshadowlegends
yes
I find it difficult to believe that a device for $300 is worth the extra cost over the same thing that can be done for $30.
Even though I mostly agree, I'd say latency is the main motivation for grabbing the Tobii anyway. Low latency is essential for head tracking to not be frustrating
@eavdmeer So far, there are NO issues to report.
Does it use a lot of system resources?
I don’t see why it would.
@@TheLoneLlamaNO
@@osuave7811 huh?
I would say stick first. Folk don't get into this game to fly with a mouse in general. Then Tobii
If only it wasn't so expensive. 😆
:0
No, its too expensive.
Only buy one if your a 6 hour a night pvp pilot and/or have a lot of dispposable income.
You do not NEED it
Entirely true. You may just want it anyway though. It's like Virpil flight sticks 🤷🏻♂️
@@eavdmeerthat used to be my opinion too, but now I'm enjoying the new addition to my system with no issues to report.
Tobii: Here's a free Tobii, promote it along with the other 50 we've given out to streamers.
and these streamers are giving their honest opinion on them. Look for someone slamming it. I'd like to hear the complaints lol.
Honestly between TrackIR, GRASSMONKEYSIMULATION's version of TrackIR and Tobii, I'm glad Tobii is giving it out to streamers and giving them a kickback for helping sell its product.
This kind of device needs to go more mainstream it improves SC and other games like it greatly.
As long as it's clear this is a sponsored video, I have no issue with it. The Tobii is absolutely great and absolutely expensive AF. There's your downside, lol
way too expensive
The same thing can be done with a smartphone camera and a £10 app. So NO the Tobii Eye Tracker is not worth it!