I had the same Problem, after the third fuel pump i took a look at the PRV and it was stuck open. I have had low pressure - bout 20-40 bar overall. Changed it, Problem solved! 👍🏻 thanks for the vid, now I can boost on 💪🏻
Thanks for this video!! I had the same problem and searched it for weeks, my Mechanik said its the Chain whats rattling & now its solved just because i found your Video, you just saved Thousand of euros for me!! 😂 Thanks a lot bro! ♡
Started getting the same twitchering/whisteling noise as yours, also threw a code P0089 on the track. Changed the valve and knock on wood so far so good. Only time will tell. Thanks
im wondering if this is my problem. as i go on the gas im getting a hesitation is acceleration. it goes and ease up goes. power no power. it gets worst as it heats up. this valve is expensive. i have done everything. even removing injectors and swapping them. new plugs new coils. new turbo. i mean everything. can you tell me whats the driving characteristics of the vehicle when this valve fails.
EXtremely useful thank you. I have a slightly rough idle and a mysterious squeaky ticking noise. HPFP pressure never dropped below 400 at idle but I did this and saw fuel pressure drop after 1450
Would it cause to leak fuel and throw a cylinder 1 misfire code? I've replaced the spark plugs using ngk and gapped .28 and I've switched around the coils. I see some wetness around the first injector area.
+Wowzerz00 hard to tell what the problem could be. i would need to see a datalog to give any good advice. did you already try and look it up at the mazdaspeedforums?
+Unknown Username this is from a different forum. forum.mazda6club.com/speed6-engine-drivetrain/262135-gas-leak.html#/forumsite/20967/topics/262135?page=1
this is a topic from 2013??? is this about your car or just the same problem? cause i can name you more than a dozen problems that could lead to any problem causing a misfire... from a stuck injector in open/close position or failed injector seal, failed HPFP i need data logs!
damn i just reread what i wrote. no fuel is coming from the rail side its coming from the pump side. but when i block it off the car starts up. with the line off the car wont start. i would really appreciate your help with this. as ive spent so much money already and nothing. i dont mind paying for your time and sending funds via paypal
Hey guys, I'm having trouble interpreting the time scale on the x-axis. How long should we be trending the fuel pressures after shutting off the ignition? Anything x 10^6 seconds seems kind of off to me? (i.e. 1 x 10^6 = 1,000,000 sec = 12 days, LOL). Was the accessport maybe recording in milliseconds?
Let your car run for 5 to 10 min. To warm up than you shut the engine of you should see the pressure rise by 2 to 4 psi per second in the beginning and that will slow down the more pressure the system builds up so it could take again something like 10 min for the complete test!
my speed3 has a rattling noise coming from the hpfp. with the engine on at idle, the fuel pressure stays around 200psi. when it goes into boost under load it only goes up to about 1400psi, it used to hit around 2000psi. I did the test with the key on, engine off and the pressure stayed at 61psi. maybe bad hpfp internals?
My speed3 has a P0300 code and is misfiring at idle, changed the plus and coils but still having the same issue. Mine also has a rattling noise, could it just be the HPFP?
Just installed a turbo in a cx7 and it runs good but oil is coming from everywhere! Going to try again. Any pointers, i love mazda, like the car, its in excellent shape.
just get new gaskets for the turbo clean the surfaces and replace the old gaskets than torque the bolts to spec! oil and water supply 7,8 to 10,8 Newton (70-95 in-lbf). make sure that the surface of the oil pipe and the turbo and engine are super clean! this should fix the oil leaking from the turbo... unless its coming from a other place than the gaskets... if its leaking from the center house rotation assembly. if its coming from the CHRA than the turbo is not good...
so mine does the EXACT same thing, squeals, falls on it's face, stalls out intermittently and dies. do you think the squealing is because there is not enough pressure on the HPFP?
The sqeel happens because of the design of the valve. There is a mesh screen that opens when the pressure is to high but if the mesh fails than it opens and starts vibrating and causes the squeel
I am having issues wkth my 2013 mazdaspeed 3. Going lean at hi boost.. but i can run half throttle at hut 15 psi at 11.5 afr. But the second i go more then half throttle hofo acct pressure drops from 1850 to 1400 1000 800 400 and leans out bad. I have a dw300 in tank pump and auto tech internals . With 10k on them and ran fine until just recently. Koeo hpfp pressure is 51 to 48. And went to 46 and 44. Idle fuel pressure goes down to 350. When doing the test engine warmed up koeo with position to on the hpfp pressure goes down not up. 430 410 400 380 365 then trickles down slowly. Only codes i have seen on the car is p0455 and the purge valve is working sealing and functioning.
If do the test i showed in the video and the pressure goes up to 2100psi than its not the valve on the fuel rail! If your hpfp also has a good spill valve than it could be either a bad LP fuel pump, fuel filter that is dirty or maybe a bad injector. Easiest thing to do is change the fuel filter. Data log the commanded injector duty and the real injector duty. And maybe setup a map that protects your engine by lowering the commanded boost and retarding the timing when fuel pressure drops to 1000 when at 100% throttle cause running 400psi fuel when going full boost will 200% kill your engine due to knock!
I know it's an old vid but if you're still active - my hpfp (I thought, have replaced now) is extremely noisy mainly when coasting. Very loud ticking noise. My car is warm so I can't cold start but while driving could you hear the ticking echo around the street? I can grab a log soon, no performance issues it seems. Cheers
You'r sure it's the HPFP? If it's the hpfp than you can remove the pump to check the Spring and retainer clips in the washer plate that keeps the Spring in place... The Spring shouldnt be loose so if there is movement in the spring you might have to replace it....
@@jaspervermaas It seems to be in that area. Other guy and I tested listening through a screwdriver and it seems to be from the fuel pump. I had a guy install it who has done his own hpfp and mine twice now (and said my original one was not good) so this is my second set of internals (and second fuel pump as that is what I thought the issue was)
spencer. dont boost your Car! if your fuel pressure drops below 1500psi when your on fuel boost you could go blow your engine! and a around idle you should have 400psi! 2000psi is already upgraded HPFP so inspect your piston of your HPFP and the pump house for demage!
doing this test, my fuel pressure would drop before 1400. Now after replacing the valve it only gets to around 900. Any advice on what else I should check?
Have you checked your hpfp.. it could be that needle valve on top of the pump (the nut with the connector) is sticky or dirty. What could also be possible is that you have a injector that is leaking.... The injectors leaking can be checked by running the engine idle and checking the LTFT en STFT. If this numbers are showing like -15% or -21% than it could mean you have a leaking injector. Cause fuel is leaking in the engine and it wants to compensate for the extra fuel...
@@jaspervermaas ok thank you, I'll check that next and if that doesn't work i might just get a hpfp O-ring kit and rebuild. You're a damn legend for being so helpful to everyone years later.
I've pulled this part number but it says it doesn't fit the speed 6. I'm having the same issue where it feels like the fuels cuts off at certain rpms. I'm looking at replacing the fuel pressure sensor as well
The part should be the same! From my knowledge you could ask your local Mazda dealer for the part number! If you have bad pressure sensor you also have problems with high knock retarding or high or low AFR and your LTFT and STFT would be showing really high or low number like ±15% since the ECU uses the pressure sensor to calculate the injection time and this will affect the AFR.
@jaspervermaas ok. Thank you. I know it bogs down real bad and acts like it's gonna die on acceleration like the fuel is cutting out. I have new injectors, plugs, and MAF sensor. Trying to troubleshoot everything we can.
if the rail pressure sensor is dead or on its way out you would also see when idle... Than the pressure should be close to 450 or 600psi from what i remember... So if its only happening at full power thans more than likely thats its the valve and not the sensor!
@jaspervermaas ok. I will take a look at it. It's a brand new motor and we've been troubleshooting everything these last few weeks on why it's running the way it is. You've been a huge help
Just in case you only need to take the intake out and a 17 deep socket and voila, no need to take those 4 bolts or anything else. And to take off the lock just twist the flat head screwdriver
Hi great vid - wondering if your issue was similar to this? my car drives fine upon first startup and warm up drive, sometimes when I have stopped then restarted I get CEL code: "P0091 Fuel Pressure Regulator 1 Control Circuit Low" - Viewing my Accessport I can see that the HPFP volts are at 0.60 (usually 1.50 and above, idle and driving) And HPFP pressure is around just 500 KPA (usually 3000 idle up to 10000) - The car drives like it is misfiring and barely makes revs, though oddly enough after about 1-2 minutes the system all goes back to normal - Volts go up, pressure is at normal levels and the car runs perfect,
Are your STFT, LTFT and Lambda good? As for what you would expect for the load en rpm? Don't know if you have accesstuner cause than you will be able to see where in the tables it wants to be... If the holding test that I show in this video should show if it's your relief valve... What you could also do is try to warm up the fuel rail without starting the engine... Warming the fuel in the rail will also make the liquid expand and should also increase the fuel pressure in the rail if you see that it opens early than you that it is the relief valve. But I could also be a sticky hpfp (the top of the pomp where the connector is has a small spill valve that can get vault) of a bad injectoren or on its way out injector.
@@jaspervermaas Hi thx for quick reply - don't have accesstuner, only AP - I checked out the valve on the pump housing (I assume the really small nipple directly on top?) gave it a good clean. I also have Autotech HPFP - it's less than a year old so hopefully not faulty, first thing I did was change out NGK plugs for Denso ITV22, no change there, though the lucky thing with this issue is how it only lasts 1 minute - always after it has been running (never on first startup/run for the day), then sitting for 10 - 30 minutes (made me think maybe just the battery is going so not supplying HPFP with the right voltage at key in engine on - literally running like it's misfiring a cylinder, spluttering and then completely resolves which may or may not rule out a few things.
@@mitchp85 check the following data. Injector duty cycle, fuel pressure, hpfp duty, vvt cycle, LTFT/STFT. Make a log of it when you start the engine and when you don't have the probleem any more and compare the data. Might even be a egr that is stuck and you engine has to compensate for low oxygen (exhaust gas mixture with intake air) and this make your car run rich...
@@jaspervermaas Ok thanks, good idea, ill log when it does it again and just normal working conditions - my EGR is deleted recently, but yes it could be stuck too.
As long as your fuel pressure stays at +1900psi when you did the test that I describe than your reliefvalve should be fine! And if you do a data log of the fuel pressure when driving and under boost and the commanded pressure is reached and you'r not running
You could always check if there is dirt in the needle of the pressure controller of the HPFP. But if all values are good when logging than there shouldn't be any mechanical issue!
On my speed 6 I just did the fuel pump internal upgrade and now my HPFP Act Press when the key is on the On position reads at 969 when I turn the car on it reads 68-75... I'm thinking this could be it. Any idea's?
±65 PSI is the pressure that the main pump in the fuel tank puts out. than the HPFP or CDFP boost the pressure to the desired output the ECU wants. this should be around ±400 PSI, The relief valve is nothing more than a safety valve. is the pressure becomes higher than ±1900 psi than it should release this pressure to low pressure side of the HPFP. so if thise valve is broke than the HPFP cant hold the pressure. the only way to test if its your relief valve is to listen for the whistling sound of fuel that passes true the valve... the other methode is by seeing if your fuel rail can build up pressure by letting "warm fuel" expanding and seeing if it spills this fuel over the valve.. as a small pressure drop . if you don't see this hapening than you could have a stick fuelpump valve. this is the valve that on the top of the HPFP where the connector connects. a stick fuelpump presure valve can come from getting to much ethanol (E85) or any fuel concentration with more than 30% ethanol....
So i did the test that you mentioned because i was getting a brief chirping and clattering noise from the hpfp side of the engine and my hpfp peaks at 1743 before dropping off. Is that a sign of a bad relief valve?
1743psi is ok if you haven't upgraded your hpfp and not running a tune. Cobb maps run at 1750psi fuel pressure so that means that the valve will be open constantly (and it will break!) For a stock car it's fine cause that only goes up to 1600psi with the pump.
@@jaspervermaas i meant that with the engine off after driving the fuel pressure peaks at 1734 before bleeding off. I have upgraded hpfp internals and a freektune custom base map tune
@@jb6574 the relief valve works as a safety valve meaning that if you run 1750psi fuel pressure the valve shouldn't be open... It should open for example at +10% of the wanted pressure... If it now opens at 1750 that means that when the ECU commands that pressure it will not open the presure control valve on the op of the hpfp to control the pressure. So in my opinion I would swap out the relief valve cause a good working valve should not open at 1750 but more likely at 1850 to 1900. If the relief valve already opens at 1750 that means that it's going bad in my opinion....
So my car idles right about 100psi I replaced my entire fuel pump with CPE and still isn't fixed. The exhaust is sputtering and the pump has a Loud chattering. Is this relief valve the fix?
Bryce Sponsler start your car let it run so the fuel gets warm than turn the engine off and check fuel pressure... The pressure should start to rise (thermal expansion) if the prusure doesn't go up you most likely have this problem...
i took the line that goes to the top of hpfp from the pressure relief valve and with the key on fuel just poors out of it and the car wont start until i put my finger over it and build some sort or resistance. so it has to be the pressure relief valve is wide open. ??
Sorry man i said it wrong. The fuel is coming out of the hpfp side not the hose that comes off the rleif valve. As if thats the intank fuel pump pressure. If i slowly block the pressure off the car starts. On my scan tool the hpfp status blinks all the time from no and off. It flickers on and off. I have a good scan tool maxisyspro. Today im going to log the actual pressure like you did. At idle i need 400psi and driving on max boost more than 1500 as i think you said.
+Mark Rampersaud if the key is in on position and the car is not yet started than the pressure should be around 50 to 60psi when the car idles it should be around 400psi and om full load it should be 1600psi did you also check your LTFT (long term fuel trim) this should be between -8% and 8% at idle if your LTFT is higher for example -20% or 20% than there is a good change you have a air leak in your intake system this air leak can cause stumbling of the engine.
+Unknown Username ok im going to check the ltft as well as i just reached to work. im doubtful thats its a air leak. as a ltft would pull a dtc code i would think. i do believe its a fuel pressure or delivery problem. the car makes power dies the comes in again. i can also hear it missing and go again. this is why all new coils plugs. and even took out all injectors and clean them. the spray pattern on all injectors looks good and none are leaking. looking at the plugs i can see a lean condition as there very white. this i feel has to do with hpfp. something is causeing the car to run on only the lpfp only. the status of the hpfp never stays on for more than 1 second. i will do as you said as well as monitor ltft.
In hopes you might see this since you seem to know your stuff. I'm having stuttering problems that occur around 2-3k rpm with my ms6. Have cleaned the MAF, air filter, spill valve and changes the spark plugs. My tuner is suggesting to check the reliefe valve next since on acceleration (not wot but decent) the fuel pressure drops under 1600psi right around where the stutters happen. Idle is around 450psi and I did the test on this video and after getting the car warm and turning it to on position the pressure got up to around 1500 psi in 10 minutes. Does that sound normal or should I look into replacing the relief valve?
If it only goes up to 1500psi than it sounds like the relief valve is busted. That stuttering is the effect of not enough fuel pressure. Even if you drive with normal load the ECU demands 1600psi (stock) fuel pressure at around 2k+ RPM. If you log the injector dutty with right now you will most likely see that it's at 90%+ meaning maxxed out... Like I explained in the video do the hold test and if you don't get the 1900psi than you can say with a 80 to 90% change that the relief valve is dead! Just swap it out and you will see that it hold 1900psi again!
Sounds logical. While stuttering I got a miss fire code from cylinder 4. Can that also be caused by a drop in fuel pressure? I feel like a complete noob with this stuff.
Correct! Fuel pressure and injection duration dictate how much fuel is being injected. For example if the fuel pressure is high you can have a short injection duration. Same like a water hose that you use to fill up a bucket of water. If the water pressure is high more water comes out of the hose. And if the pressure is low you need to wait longer for the bucket is full. Now a mis fire can happen because of TO rich mixture or not enough fuel and that scenario is more likely. ( There are more reasons for a mis fire like bad plugs to wide or small gap plugs or to cold plugs... Bad coils but let's say this are good )
@@jaspervermaas Thanks for the insight! Will change the prv and see if it helps. If the condition of the spill valve is anything to go by, it just might be the cause. Running on e30 btw so some buildup will happen.
@@onvaa E30... Make sure the spill valve in the HPFP is clean cause that starts to faul and the valve can stay in a open or leaking position! Google mazdaspeed HPFP cleaning than you can find blogposts about the needle valve in the hpfp that fails because of gumming of the e85 fuel!
I'm not getting any fuel to spark plugs on my 06 mazda speed6 2.3l awd turbo. To test and see if the pump was working we cranked it with that yellow hose unplugged and fuel came out, any ideas what can be causing no fuel to spark plug?
Get a OBD2 Dongle or a use your Cobb access port to see if the HPFP makes any pressure... The fuel pump in your tank should make between 45 and 60psi than the HPFP should make minimal 400psi. Maybe your injector fuse is broken... This video only shows how to diagnose the relief valve on your HP fuelrail... And should open close to 2100 psi to protect your fuelrail and injectors.
@@outfishing3909 check your fuses in the engine compartment. And if they are all good than get yourself a ELM327 Bluetooth dongle and OBD scanner tool for your smartphone like "car scanner" for Android than you can monitor live data from your engine and than you can do a good diagnose and not play parts bingo by throwing a new pump on your car and finding out that for example your pressure sensor is broken and because the engine sees no pressure it will not inject fuel...
that slow goat no you idle around 450psi because the HPFP releases the pressure via regulator valve in the pump. When you turn of the the engine than the regulator valve close and due to the heat that had build up in the high pressure fuel rail the pressure will rise and this pressure can only escape via the relieve valve(let's call it a safety valve) and that's why you see the pressure build up X PSI. So when the relief valve opens before the 1600 psi (stock) or 1900 psi (upgraded HPFP) is reached than your HPFP can't pump enough fuel to the injectors (more pressure means more flow so loosing pressure means less flow means running lean means zoomzoomboomboom)
Unknown Username gotcha..new to this whole GDI system setup. one more question..with key on and engine off, is the fuel pressure shown the fuel pressure from the low pressure side of the fuel system?
that slow goat no it measures it from the hp fuel rail. There is no low pressure sensors that I know. You only need the car in key on the on position to get power to the sensor and so you can't read the pressure. As soon as you start the engine the spill valve will open in the HPFP needs to idle at around 450 ±50psi
Unknown Username makes sense. does the low pressure side on the ms3 have an test port on the low side of the fuel system to test the pressure coming from in tank fuel pump
that slow goat the accesport can't read the low pressure side. But it's easy to test if your LPFP works just disconnected the flexible fuel line get a big bottle hang the fuel supply in the bottle and put the key on the ON position than there should be fuel coming out of that line cause the car wants to "prime" the fuel system. You could also listen for a buzzing sound from the rear seat (fuel pump is under the rear seat) if you don't hear any sound than 1st check the fuses!
yes every time it will fail it will have a different point some time the whole spring just fails and some times its just that you overstresed it and than the valve will need a lower pressure to open (some thing we don't want because of your fuel injection)
Just did this test it got up to 1411 psi and then started to drop bought the car used with mods I'm going to check if there are after market hpfp in the car. Should I change this valve running a cobb stage 2 tune (car came like this)
Do not run a stage 2! A stage 2 needs ±1800psi. And running lower could meansl that you will not get enough fuel in the cilinder and could lead to knock or a blown engine. Run a stage 0 (stock) and replace the relief valve! Checking the hpfp to see if it has upgraded internals never hurts!
@@andrewtroina6407 it's safe! Just check if your LTFT stays between -7,5% and 7,5%. If it goes up to 15% you would need to calibrate your MAF. Also check your HPFP pressure and see if the car cand hold 1600psi but remember your relief valve opens at 1400psi now so it's harder for the hpfp to keep up with "leaking" of fuel and thus fuel pressure!
in your video i dont see your fuel pressure ever hit 400psi at idle. mine is at 450 psi at idle. and on full boost it hits 1650psi. and my ltft is at 0%
the log is from the fuel pressure is when the engine is warm and not running... when I start my engine the HPFP starts to regulate the fuel pressure and than it drops down to 400psi at idle and 1700psi at fuel boost ( I have a upgraded fuel pump) do you have mods on your car? and is your car tuned?
No my car is fully stock. I used to get a misfire on cylinder number 4 and after i swap the injectors around i can still feel it missing but the vehicles computer simply wont pull a missfire code.
ok i have a mazda cx7 08 and driving u get up to 25 starts jurking then sometimes its running fine 70 down the road and then bam nothing help parts are not cheap
Cassie Shotts when sudden stops of the car appear than this can be caused by grounding problem or a random fault by any possible sensor... Like for example the crank angle position sensor... To know for sure what's going on with your car you really need a data logger! For example the ELM OBD2 Bluetooth dongle and a smartphone with a free app like torque lite this tools can show freeze frames from the ECU and this can help you solve your problem
I had the same Problem, after the third fuel pump i took a look at the PRV and it was stuck open. I have had low pressure - bout 20-40 bar overall.
Changed it, Problem solved! 👍🏻 thanks for the vid, now I can boost on 💪🏻
Did your motor start with the PRV stuck open?
Thanks for this video!! I had the same problem and searched it for weeks, my Mechanik said its the Chain whats rattling & now its solved just because i found your Video, you just saved Thousand of euros for me!! 😂
Thanks a lot bro! ♡
Thanks for the message! How your mechanic diagnosed it as chain problem is a bit strange but good to hear that it save you a shit ton of money
Started getting the same twitchering/whisteling noise as yours, also threw a code P0089 on the track. Changed the valve and knock on wood so far so good. Only time will tell. Thanks
This fixed my Speed3. Had 80k on it when it started loosing fuel pressure above 4k rpm. Mine made the same rattling noise too.
good to hear that you solved your problem cause loosing fuel pressure can be fatale to the speed3! zoomzoomboom!
im wondering if this is my problem. as i go on the gas im getting a hesitation is acceleration. it goes and ease up goes. power no power. it gets worst as it heats up. this valve is expensive. i have done everything. even removing injectors and swapping them. new plugs new coils. new turbo. i mean everything. can you tell me whats the driving characteristics of the vehicle when this valve fails.
EXtremely useful thank you. I have a slightly rough idle and a mysterious squeaky ticking noise. HPFP pressure never dropped below 400 at idle but I did this and saw fuel pressure drop after 1450
Would it cause to leak fuel and throw a cylinder 1 misfire code? I've replaced the spark plugs using ngk and gapped .28 and I've switched around the coils. I see some wetness around the first injector area.
+Wowzerz00 hard to tell what the problem could be. i would need to see a datalog to give any good advice. did you already try and look it up at the mazdaspeedforums?
+Unknown Username I did and it seems like the verdict is that it's coming from the fuel rail.
+Wowzerz00 can you give me a link to the Mazdaspeedforum topic?
+Unknown Username this is from a different forum. forum.mazda6club.com/speed6-engine-drivetrain/262135-gas-leak.html#/forumsite/20967/topics/262135?page=1
this is a topic from 2013??? is this about your car or just the same problem? cause i can name you more than a dozen problems that could lead to any problem causing a misfire...
from a stuck injector in open/close position or failed injector seal, failed HPFP i need data logs!
damn i just reread what i wrote. no fuel is coming from the rail side its coming from the pump side. but when i block it off the car starts up. with the line off the car wont start. i would really appreciate your help with this. as ive spent so much money already and nothing. i dont mind paying for your time and sending funds via paypal
Hey guys, I'm having trouble interpreting the time scale on the x-axis. How long should we be trending the fuel pressures after shutting off the ignition? Anything x 10^6 seconds seems kind of off to me? (i.e. 1 x 10^6 = 1,000,000 sec = 12 days, LOL). Was the accessport maybe recording in milliseconds?
Let your car run for 5 to 10 min. To warm up than you shut the engine of you should see the pressure rise by 2 to 4 psi per second in the beginning and that will slow down the more pressure the system builds up so it could take again something like 10 min for the complete test!
@@jaspervermaas sorry, didn't see your reply until now. Thank you for your response!
my speed3 has a rattling noise coming from the hpfp. with the engine on at idle, the fuel pressure stays around 200psi. when it goes into boost under load it only goes up to about 1400psi, it used to hit around 2000psi. I did the test with the key on, engine off and the pressure stayed at 61psi. maybe bad hpfp internals?
My speed3 has a P0300 code and is misfiring at idle, changed the plus and coils but still having the same issue. Mine also has a rattling noise, could it just be the HPFP?
Just installed a turbo in a cx7 and it runs good but oil is coming from everywhere! Going to try again. Any pointers, i love mazda, like the car, its in excellent shape.
spoada this depends on where the oil is coming from. If it's coming from a surface that has a gasket than I would replace that gasket.
just get new gaskets for the turbo clean the surfaces and replace the old gaskets than torque the bolts to spec! oil and water supply 7,8 to 10,8 Newton (70-95 in-lbf). make sure that the surface of the oil pipe and the turbo and engine are super clean! this should fix the oil leaking from the turbo... unless its coming from a other place than the gaskets... if its leaking from the center house rotation assembly. if its coming from the CHRA than the turbo is not good...
so mine does the EXACT same thing, squeals, falls on it's face, stalls out intermittently and dies. do you think the squealing is because there is not enough pressure on the HPFP?
The sqeel happens because of the design of the valve. There is a mesh screen that opens when the pressure is to high but if the mesh fails than it opens and starts vibrating and causes the squeel
I am having issues wkth my 2013 mazdaspeed 3. Going lean at hi boost.. but i can run half throttle at hut 15 psi at 11.5 afr. But the second i go more then half throttle hofo acct pressure drops from 1850 to 1400 1000 800 400 and leans out bad. I have a dw300 in tank pump and auto tech internals . With 10k on them and ran fine until just recently. Koeo hpfp pressure is 51 to 48. And went to 46 and 44. Idle fuel pressure goes down to 350. When doing the test engine warmed up koeo with position to on the hpfp pressure goes down not up. 430 410 400 380 365 then trickles down slowly. Only codes i have seen on the car is p0455 and the purge valve is working sealing and functioning.
If do the test i showed in the video and the pressure goes up to 2100psi than its not the valve on the fuel rail! If your hpfp also has a good spill valve than it could be either a bad LP fuel pump, fuel filter that is dirty or maybe a bad injector. Easiest thing to do is change the fuel filter.
Data log the commanded injector duty and the real injector duty. And maybe setup a map that protects your engine by lowering the commanded boost and retarding the timing when fuel pressure drops to 1000 when at 100% throttle cause running 400psi fuel when going full boost will 200% kill your engine due to knock!
I know it's an old vid but if you're still active - my hpfp (I thought, have replaced now) is extremely noisy mainly when coasting. Very loud ticking noise. My car is warm so I can't cold start but while driving could you hear the ticking echo around the street? I can grab a log soon, no performance issues it seems. Cheers
You'r sure it's the HPFP? If it's the hpfp than you can remove the pump to check the Spring and retainer clips in the washer plate that keeps the Spring in place... The Spring shouldnt be loose so if there is movement in the spring you might have to replace it....
@@jaspervermaas It seems to be in that area. Other guy and I tested listening through a screwdriver and it seems to be from the fuel pump. I had a guy install it who has done his own hpfp and mine twice now (and said my original one was not good) so this is my second set of internals (and second fuel pump as that is what I thought the issue was)
@@frogsta360 and how did he come to the conclusion that the hpfp was bad? Did you have misfires or no power or a ECU light on?
@@jaspervermaas I had a Mazda mechanic suggest the internal seals of the fuel pump had died and hence creating the metal on metal ticking
If the hpfp isnt working, how can you do the koeo test if the hpfp isnt building any pressure or if the rv is bad
The HPFP is driven by the cam. So if the engine can't start than you can't test it... It's hard to test without the HPFP running
spencer. dont boost your Car! if your fuel pressure drops below 1500psi when your on fuel boost you could go blow your engine! and a around idle you should have 400psi! 2000psi is already upgraded HPFP so inspect your piston of your HPFP and the pump house for demage!
doing this test, my fuel pressure would drop before 1400. Now after replacing the valve it only gets to around 900. Any advice on what else I should check?
Have you checked your hpfp.. it could be that needle valve on top of the pump (the nut with the connector) is sticky or dirty. What could also be possible is that you have a injector that is leaking.... The injectors leaking can be checked by running the engine idle and checking the LTFT en STFT. If this numbers are showing like -15% or -21% than it could mean you have a leaking injector. Cause fuel is leaking in the engine and it wants to compensate for the extra fuel...
@@jaspervermaas ok thank you, I'll check that next and if that doesn't work i might just get a hpfp O-ring kit and rebuild. You're a damn legend for being so helpful to everyone years later.
I've pulled this part number but it says it doesn't fit the speed 6. I'm having the same issue where it feels like the fuels cuts off at certain rpms. I'm looking at replacing the fuel pressure sensor as well
The part should be the same! From my knowledge you could ask your local Mazda dealer for the part number! If you have bad pressure sensor you also have problems with high knock retarding or high or low AFR and your LTFT and STFT would be showing really high or low number like ±15% since the ECU uses the pressure sensor to calculate the injection time and this will affect the AFR.
@jaspervermaas ok. Thank you. I know it bogs down real bad and acts like it's gonna die on acceleration like the fuel is cutting out. I have new injectors, plugs, and MAF sensor. Trying to troubleshoot everything we can.
if the rail pressure sensor is dead or on its way out you would also see when idle... Than the pressure should be close to 450 or 600psi from what i remember... So if its only happening at full power thans more than likely thats its the valve and not the sensor!
@jaspervermaas ok. I will take a look at it. It's a brand new motor and we've been troubleshooting everything these last few weeks on why it's running the way it is. You've been a huge help
@@jaspervermaas so after messing with the car, the hpfp acctual pressure only reads extremely low. Would that still be the relief valve?
Just in case you only need to take the intake out and a 17 deep socket and voila, no need to take those 4 bolts or anything else. And to take off the lock just twist the flat head screwdriver
Hi great vid - wondering if your issue was similar to this? my car drives fine upon first startup and warm up drive, sometimes when I have stopped then restarted I get CEL code: "P0091 Fuel Pressure Regulator 1 Control Circuit Low" - Viewing my Accessport I can see that the HPFP volts are at 0.60 (usually 1.50 and above, idle and driving)
And HPFP pressure is around just 500 KPA (usually 3000 idle up to 10000) - The car drives like it is misfiring and barely makes revs, though oddly enough after about 1-2 minutes the system all goes back to normal - Volts go up, pressure is at normal levels and the car runs perfect,
Are your STFT, LTFT and Lambda good? As for what you would expect for the load en rpm? Don't know if you have accesstuner cause than you will be able to see where in the tables it wants to be... If the holding test that I show in this video should show if it's your relief valve... What you could also do is try to warm up the fuel rail without starting the engine... Warming the fuel in the rail will also make the liquid expand and should also increase the fuel pressure in the rail if you see that it opens early than you that it is the relief valve. But I could also be a sticky hpfp (the top of the pomp where the connector is has a small spill valve that can get vault) of a bad injectoren or on its way out injector.
@@jaspervermaas Hi thx for quick reply - don't have accesstuner, only AP - I checked out the valve on the pump housing (I assume the really small nipple directly on top?) gave it a good clean.
I also have Autotech HPFP - it's less than a year old so hopefully not faulty, first thing I did was change out NGK plugs for Denso ITV22, no change there, though the lucky thing with this issue is how it only lasts 1 minute - always after it has been running (never on first startup/run for the day), then sitting for 10 - 30 minutes (made me think maybe just the battery is going so not supplying HPFP with the right voltage at key in engine on - literally running like it's misfiring a cylinder, spluttering and then completely resolves which may or may not rule out a few things.
@@mitchp85 check the following data. Injector duty cycle, fuel pressure, hpfp duty, vvt cycle, LTFT/STFT. Make a log of it when you start the engine and when you don't have the probleem any more and compare the data. Might even be a egr that is stuck and you engine has to compensate for low oxygen (exhaust gas mixture with intake air) and this make your car run rich...
@@jaspervermaas Ok thanks, good idea, ill log when it does it again and just normal working conditions - my EGR is deleted recently, but yes it could be stuck too.
i replaced my prv but th3 whining noise still there could the hpfp be busted?
As long as your fuel pressure stays at +1900psi when you did the test that I describe than your reliefvalve should be fine! And if you do a data log of the fuel pressure when driving and under boost and the commanded pressure is reached and you'r not running
You could always check if there is dirt in the needle of the pressure controller of the HPFP. But if all values are good when logging than there shouldn't be any mechanical issue!
@@jaspervermaas did all of that and the noise still there
Were you having any performance issues before this fixed?
Inthepocket none at all!
On my speed 6 I just did the fuel pump internal upgrade and now my HPFP Act Press when the key is on the On position reads at 969 when I turn the car on it reads 68-75... I'm thinking this could be it. Any idea's?
±65 PSI is the pressure that the main pump in the fuel tank puts out. than the HPFP or CDFP boost the pressure to the desired output the ECU wants. this should be around ±400 PSI, The relief valve is nothing more than a safety valve. is the pressure becomes higher than ±1900 psi than it should release this pressure to low pressure side of the HPFP. so if thise valve is broke than the HPFP cant hold the pressure. the only way to test if its your relief valve is to listen for the whistling sound of fuel that passes true the valve... the other methode is by seeing if your fuel rail can build up pressure by letting "warm fuel" expanding and seeing if it spills this fuel over the valve.. as a small pressure drop .
if you don't see this hapening than you could have a stick fuelpump valve. this is the valve that on the top of the HPFP where the connector connects. a stick fuelpump presure valve can come from getting to much ethanol (E85) or any fuel concentration with more than 30% ethanol....
So i did the test that you mentioned because i was getting a brief chirping and clattering noise from the hpfp side of the engine and my hpfp peaks at 1743 before dropping off. Is that a sign of a bad relief valve?
1743psi is ok if you haven't upgraded your hpfp and not running a tune. Cobb maps run at 1750psi fuel pressure so that means that the valve will be open constantly (and it will break!) For a stock car it's fine cause that only goes up to 1600psi with the pump.
@@jaspervermaas i meant that with the engine off after driving the fuel pressure peaks at 1734 before bleeding off. I have upgraded hpfp internals and a freektune custom base map tune
@@jb6574 the relief valve works as a safety valve meaning that if you run 1750psi fuel pressure the valve shouldn't be open... It should open for example at +10% of the wanted pressure... If it now opens at 1750 that means that when the ECU commands that pressure it will not open the presure control valve on the op of the hpfp to control the pressure. So in my opinion I would swap out the relief valve cause a good working valve should not open at 1750 but more likely at 1850 to 1900. If the relief valve already opens at 1750 that means that it's going bad in my opinion....
Got it thanks
So my car idles right about 100psi I replaced my entire fuel pump with CPE and still isn't fixed. The exhaust is sputtering and the pump has a Loud chattering. Is this relief valve the fix?
Bryce Sponsler start your car let it run so the fuel gets warm than turn the engine off and check fuel pressure... The pressure should start to rise (thermal expansion) if the prusure doesn't go up you most likely have this problem...
Bryce Sponsler did you find out what the problem was. I'm having the same symptoms as you?
i took the line that goes to the top of hpfp from the pressure relief valve and with the key on fuel just poors out of it and the car wont start until i put my finger over it and build some sort or resistance. so it has to be the pressure relief valve is wide open. ??
yes if that hapens than the valve is broken! you should get changed
Sorry man i said it wrong. The fuel is coming out of the hpfp side not the hose that comes off the rleif valve. As if thats the intank fuel pump pressure. If i slowly block the pressure off the car starts. On my scan tool the hpfp status blinks all the time from no and off. It flickers on and off. I have a good scan tool maxisyspro. Today im going to log the actual pressure like you did. At idle i need 400psi and driving on max boost more than 1500 as i think you said.
+Mark Rampersaud if the key is in on position and the car is not yet started than the pressure should be around 50 to 60psi when the car idles it should be around 400psi and om full load it should be 1600psi
did you also check your LTFT (long term fuel trim) this should be between -8% and 8% at idle
if your LTFT is higher for example -20% or 20% than there is a good change you have a air leak in your intake system this air leak can cause stumbling of the engine.
+Unknown Username
ok im going to check the ltft as well as i just reached to work. im doubtful thats its a air leak. as a ltft would pull a dtc code i would think. i do believe its a fuel pressure or delivery problem. the car makes power dies the comes in again. i can also hear it missing and go again. this is why all new coils plugs. and even took out all injectors and clean them. the spray pattern on all injectors looks good and none are leaking. looking at the plugs i can see a lean condition as there very white. this i feel has to do with hpfp. something is causeing the car to run on only the lpfp only. the status of the hpfp never stays on for more than 1 second. i will do as you said as well as monitor ltft.
my ltft is at -9
In hopes you might see this since you seem to know your stuff. I'm having stuttering problems that occur around 2-3k rpm with my ms6. Have cleaned the MAF, air filter, spill valve and changes the spark plugs. My tuner is suggesting to check the reliefe valve next since on acceleration (not wot but decent) the fuel pressure drops under 1600psi right around where the stutters happen. Idle is around 450psi and I did the test on this video and after getting the car warm and turning it to on position the pressure got up to around 1500 psi in 10 minutes. Does that sound normal or should I look into replacing the relief valve?
If it only goes up to 1500psi than it sounds like the relief valve is busted. That stuttering is the effect of not enough fuel pressure. Even if you drive with normal load the ECU demands 1600psi (stock) fuel pressure at around 2k+ RPM. If you log the injector dutty with right now you will most likely see that it's at 90%+ meaning maxxed out... Like I explained in the video do the hold test and if you don't get the 1900psi than you can say with a 80 to 90% change that the relief valve is dead! Just swap it out and you will see that it hold 1900psi again!
Sounds logical. While stuttering I got a miss fire code from cylinder 4. Can that also be caused by a drop in fuel pressure? I feel like a complete noob with this stuff.
Correct! Fuel pressure and injection duration dictate how much fuel is being injected. For example if the fuel pressure is high you can have a short injection duration. Same like a water hose that you use to fill up a bucket of water. If the water pressure is high more water comes out of the hose. And if the pressure is low you need to wait longer for the bucket is full. Now a mis fire can happen because of TO rich mixture or not enough fuel and that scenario is more likely. ( There are more reasons for a mis fire like bad plugs to wide or small gap plugs or to cold plugs... Bad coils but let's say this are good )
@@jaspervermaas Thanks for the insight! Will change the prv and see if it helps. If the condition of the spill valve is anything to go by, it just might be the cause. Running on e30 btw so some buildup will happen.
@@onvaa E30... Make sure the spill valve in the HPFP is clean cause that starts to faul and the valve can stay in a open or leaking position! Google mazdaspeed HPFP cleaning than you can find blogposts about the needle valve in the hpfp that fails because of gumming of the e85 fuel!
I'm not getting any fuel to spark plugs on my 06 mazda speed6 2.3l awd turbo. To test and see if the pump was working we cranked it with that yellow hose unplugged and fuel came out, any ideas what can be causing no fuel to spark plug?
Get a OBD2 Dongle or a use your Cobb access port to see if the HPFP makes any pressure... The fuel pump in your tank should make between 45 and 60psi than the HPFP should make minimal 400psi. Maybe your injector fuse is broken... This video only shows how to diagnose the relief valve on your HP fuelrail... And should open close to 2100 psi to protect your fuelrail and injectors.
When I use my obd2 scanner it says fuel system ok, im new to using these more high tech scanners I'm used to the old show code and reset code ones.
@@outfishing3909 check your fuses in the engine compartment. And if they are all good than get yourself a ELM327 Bluetooth dongle and OBD scanner tool for your smartphone like "car scanner" for Android than you can monitor live data from your engine and than you can do a good diagnose and not play parts bingo by throwing a new pump on your car and finding out that for example your pressure sensor is broken and because the engine sees no pressure it will not inject fuel...
Also my fuses should all be ok as far as I can tell
When I use starter fluid it sounds a lot better but still doesn't start if that makes any difference
are you idleing at 1600 psi..I only idle at 430ish..or is that because of the safe map
that slow goat no you idle around 450psi because the HPFP releases the pressure via regulator valve in the pump. When you turn of the the engine than the regulator valve close and due to the heat that had build up in the high pressure fuel rail the pressure will rise and this pressure can only escape via the relieve valve(let's call it a safety valve) and that's why you see the pressure build up X PSI. So when the relief valve opens before the 1600 psi (stock) or 1900 psi (upgraded HPFP) is reached than your HPFP can't pump enough fuel to the injectors (more pressure means more flow so loosing pressure means less flow means running lean means zoomzoomboomboom)
Unknown Username gotcha..new to this whole GDI system setup. one more question..with key on and engine off, is the fuel pressure shown the fuel pressure from the low pressure side of the fuel system?
that slow goat no it measures it from the hp fuel rail. There is no low pressure sensors that I know. You only need the car in key on the on position to get power to the sensor and so you can't read the pressure. As soon as you start the engine the spill valve will open in the HPFP needs to idle at around 450 ±50psi
Unknown Username makes sense. does the low pressure side on the ms3 have an test port on the low side of the fuel system to test the pressure coming from in tank fuel pump
that slow goat the accesport can't read the low pressure side. But it's easy to test if your LPFP works just disconnected the flexible fuel line get a big bottle hang the fuel supply in the bottle and put the key on the ON position than there should be fuel coming out of that line cause the car wants to "prime" the fuel system. You could also listen for a buzzing sound from the rear seat (fuel pump is under the rear seat) if you don't hear any sound than 1st check the fuses!
When mine went out I was getting 100 psi just pressure from the pump in tank. I thought it fp but it was the valve.
yes every time it will fail it will have a different point some time the whole spring just fails and some times its just that you overstresed it and than the valve will need a lower pressure to open (some thing we don't want because of your fuel injection)
Just did this test it got up to 1411 psi and then started to drop bought the car used with mods I'm going to check if there are after market hpfp in the car. Should I change this valve running a cobb stage 2 tune (car came like this)
Do not run a stage 2! A stage 2 needs ±1800psi. And running lower could meansl that you will not get enough fuel in the cilinder and could lead to knock or a blown engine. Run a stage 0 (stock) and replace the relief valve! Checking the hpfp to see if it has upgraded internals never hurts!
Unknown Username if I run stage 0 is it safe I have a sri intake, and turbo xs catless down pipe
@@andrewtroina6407 it's safe! Just check if your LTFT stays between -7,5% and 7,5%. If it goes up to 15% you would need to calibrate your MAF. Also check your HPFP pressure and see if the car cand hold 1600psi but remember your relief valve opens at 1400psi now so it's harder for the hpfp to keep up with "leaking" of fuel and thus fuel pressure!
Unknown Username how do I check for the hpfp pressure? Sorry new to all this wish the person I bought the car from was honest
I'm going to replace that valve as soon as possible as I daily drive this car
Hey guys i have mazdaspeed 3 when i go high rpm my car drowning and I see black smoke i try to race but i cant lol i need help
in your video i dont see your fuel pressure ever hit 400psi at idle. mine is at 450 psi at idle. and on full boost it hits 1650psi. and my ltft is at 0%
the log is from the fuel pressure is when the engine is warm and not running... when I start my engine the HPFP starts to regulate the fuel pressure and than it drops down to 400psi at idle and 1700psi at fuel boost ( I have a upgraded fuel pump) do you have mods on your car? and is your car tuned?
No my car is fully stock. I used to get a misfire on cylinder number 4 and after i swap the injectors around i can still feel it missing but the vehicles computer simply wont pull a missfire code.
ok i have a mazda cx7 08 and driving u get up to 25 starts jurking then sometimes its running fine 70 down the road and then bam nothing help parts are not cheap
Cassie Shotts when sudden stops of the car appear than this can be caused by grounding problem or a random fault by any possible sensor... Like for example the crank angle position sensor... To know for sure what's going on with your car you really need a data logger! For example the ELM OBD2 Bluetooth dongle and a smartphone with a free app like torque lite this tools can show freeze frames from the ECU and this can help you solve your problem