Gibson SG Iommi Neck Dive Modification That Actually Works
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- Опубликовано: 21 июл 2024
- All Gibson & Epiphone SG guitars are neck heavy that is a problem. Here's a modification that works brilliantly and one I modified from what Tony Iommi did on his guitars.
Index:
0:00 Start
0:12 Intro and preamble
1:59 The cause of the problem
3:06 How NOT to solve the problem!
3:56 Solve the neck problem for good
4:55 My MOD for the heavy neck
7:20 My completed modification
8:00 Testing the 'Iommi' modification
9:12 Summing up
All Gibson and Epiphone guitars - well all SG type guitars generally suffer from the 'neck heavy' syndrome. A problem certainly if you have never experienced the problem and for some it can result in the selling of the guitar!
But there are a number of ways that you could solve the problem, and I discuss a couple of ways, one you should not do, and one that is similar to that which Tony Iommi uses on his SG guitar - he seems to have it solved.
So I just show you what I did, there's a 'before' and an 'after' example so you can see the difference. The parts cost me about £4 ($6) so anyone can do this but just be careful and heed my comments as I show you whet to do. One more thing - you should find a 'hardened' screw if you can find one and use that because the mounting does get some weight on it in use.
I hope you like the video and please sub, if you have other modifications for the neck drop on SG guitars then post them in the text area.
Don't forget to subscribe, ring the bell and click all for notifications to give my channel a boost - most appreciated and it helps me to continue to make these unique inside and out reviews.
Thanks for watching and if anyone has questions just post them and I'll reply as soon as I can - tony mckenzie
(c) A B Mckenzie and tonymckenzie.com 2009 - 2022
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The original SG was designed to come with the sideways vibrola system. With the weight of the vibrola the sg should be well balanced. Cesar Gueikian explained it on a RUclips video
Thanks for that info. My 1971 Special had a Bigsby on it... maybe not so favoured these days and it did not really have the neck droop as this guitar does. I have not seen that video, but both yourself and another guy commented about either the vibrola or the bridge could be heavier model that would help and I'm sure it would. Good point. and thanks for watching.
Thats a great point. I often wondered how a guitar with neck dive even passes QC.
I have a 61 SG with the Vibrola and there is no neck dive. I have a Korina SG without the Vibrola and there is a serious neck dive issue. I’ve tried lots of fixes but not the one shown in this video. It makes a lot of sense and I may end up going down this path. 👍🏻
Had the same issue on my 2005 SG Supreme and fixed it by removing weight from the headstock and adding weight on the body:
Replaced the Grover tuners with Kluson locking tuners which saved 14 grams per tuner or 84 grams in total
Replaced the plastic Vol./Tone knobs with metal ones from Schaller which added about 80-90 grams on the body.
Now it is perfectly balanced without adding obnoxius amounts of weight or doing any kind of permanent modifications.
Great post and thanks for posting the tips that helped you with this. Oh and thanks for watching too.
Now that was clever. No denying it.
That was well thought out.
When I had an SG, I wanted to fit Schaller Straplocks anyway. I experimented with many different positions, just sort of holding it in place and seeing how the guitar carried itself.
In the end, I moved the strap position on the butt of the guitar up by about 2" so it wasn't central dead on the body, but came up just before the body curves into the top section.
That allowed the bottom of the guitar where the controls are to sit lower at an angle and this was enough to counteract the weight of the neck. I left the original strap button on and just drilled a new hole for the straplock and job done.
I have an E-II Explorer at the moment and I did a similar thing to it. By just moving the button on the butt of the guitar up ever so slightly it was enough to stop it diving but not making it play at an odd angle. You could argue that it doesn't "look" right if the button at the butt (trying not to make innuendos here) isn't right in the middle, but it does hang better.
Great post and thanks for the info on that... ha guys say my mod does not look right either, but its whey I used a black painted strap button so you don't notice it. Thanks for watching.
@@tonymckenziecom Coming from a guy who is used to Fenders with the strap buttons on the tip of the horn, I'm not bothered by the button placement on the horns.
wow, you're the first to mention moving the OTHER button (that i've seen). i'd argue that some of the front button positions can look really weird, depending on the guitar, and maybe doing what you did isn't so weird at all. seems less hairy for a move also. the horns feel tricky at times. less stable. easier to mess up or crack. i'll try that out!
Congrats my friend on the 9M views, im surprised it took so long as your videos are some of the best on YT.
I know, I really don't 'stand over the numbers' and I was contacted from vidiq (like seo thing) so how I knew. I do think generally its harder to create videos that pick up many tens of thousands of views, and in many ways still a result of covid, the chip shortage and more. I went a guitar show today and I would rate it compared to the same venue two years ago as about 60% of what it was... and IMO that tells very much about a lot. Little innovation, millions of guitars no one ever heard of, very few new amps and etc. etc. sad really. I'm sure it will come back but from what I see it's very slow here in the UK IMO. Thanks for those kind words and for watching...
Great idea, i took the easy way out and bought an ESP SG style guitar that even has locking tuners that should make
neck dive worse, but they don't, ESP updated the Gibson mistake along with the jack socket issue.
The problem for Gibson is that the buyers want everything kept to the original design, which i think is daft.
When with a few simple mods, the known issues can be fixed.
Now you know why i will never buy a Gibson or Epiphone SG!
There are better options at lower prices.
Thanks for showing us your fix Tony.
ESP makes guitars for guitar players.
Gibson makes "collector items" and "lifestyle brand" stuff for dentists and accountants who might play a couple hours a month, if that.
Not so sure about that... you're thinking PRS surely ;-)
Good solution, that is the same strap pin placement Hagstrom used on their model III and other SG-like shapes in the 60's. As for what Angus Young does, I think the wireless system on his strap provides enough of a counterbalance to keep the neck from diving.
Great info and I certainly learned from those two... thanks for the post and for watching.
The new Gibson SG Supremes have the strap button on the end of the horn and that helps stop the neck dive. They are half thickness mahogany and half thickness maple. The heavier bodies help stop neck dive also. I couldn't make up my mind which Supreme to get so I bought both the wine red and the ebony 3 pickup model only available from Gibson. I believe they are also the best SG's I have ever played. I do my own setups. The cable jack is also on the side instead of the front. I've had many that neck dived and some with and without whammy bars/tremolo's that didn't. I have been playing Gibson SG's for over 50 years and I naturally have the habit of keeping my left hand on the neck and right forearm on the body of my SG's. Your videos are great and keep it up. I like watching some of your older ones like this one that interest me.
I did have a SG that was half maple and half mahogany, but to be honest, (it was some years back maybe 6 or so) I sent it back because the neck drop was so substantial it was putting me off playing. I agree that the body should have helped with the weight of the maple etc. but not in the case of the one I had.. thanks for watching.
Excellent Mod Tony!!! Really AMAZING with a simple way to so it 💪😃
Glad you like it!
@@tonymckenziecom 💪😉
Great Idea Tony,you are the man thinking out of the box,Cheers!have a great weekend!
Thanks for watching this one... if the guitar has the neck drop thing going on its so off-putting. Might help someone but also loads of other options from different viewers too. Thanks.
Great and straight forward fix! Congratulations on 9 million views...! I'd have thought it was more... but what do I know.? Cheers!
Ha yes, these days at least for me the views are harder to achieve, but I guess the platform and the substantially more creators all contribute to redicing those. Then there are some that literally dislike some of the stuff I show (that should never have been sold in the first place) but they never give the makers any grief for selling junk... I don't really get that... but there you go. The guys that do follow me are really the rigt guys and they 'get it' I think. In any case thanks for watching.
The way I elimiate SG neck dive is by buying a PRS SE or Yamaha Revstar instead. I've never owned an SG. I DID own a Yamaha SG 200 which was a very good knockoff, but it still had neck dive. Not as bad, but it was there. Iommi actually has the strap lock right on the tip of the horn, which I do not recommend because it compromises the integrity of the instrument. Putting the lock behind the horn as you do makes more sense, and in fact the LTD Viper, a rather slick knockoff of an SG, has the lock behind the horn and they balance very well. Good video!
Thanks for the info on these guitars... and thanks for watching too.
Great modification 🤘🤘🤘!! Cheers Tony!
It does work :) and thanks...
I looked at various ways to fix mine including what you've done, but ultimately I did a second button on the top curve of the bottom end which sets the balance completely differently because much more of the weight of the guitar body is below the strap line. It's not obvious at all and doesn't risk damage or visible impact on the horns.
Thanks David for posting your solution! There are many of course and some work better (or worse) than mine, but it's all about helping others if I get a reasonable solution which this was for me. And thanks for watching too... if you made a vide you can (should) post a link... thanks.
@@tonymckenziecom Sorry Tony, you made a really good helpful video, I should have said thanks for that. I shared picture in the SG FB forum at the time, maybe I will do a video at some point. Thanks anyway.
High Tony, That's a excellent fix to a problem that Gibson just doesn't want to address. I guess they don't want to improve a great guitar. Thanks again for another Great video. Stay safe and well and keep Rocking. Signed John Gregory Zepbass from Munster Indiana. U.S.A.😊😊
Yes I can't understand why... the SG generally has the problem, and just reading the comments highlights many ways of solving it. But Gibson/Epiphine and many other brands just blunder on. It comes to something when a musician like Tony Iommi has to mod his to arrive at a playable guitar. Guitars with the neck dive for me are generally teouble and I had to mod this or sell it. It does not always affect everyone but to me it really is a deal breaker. Not downgraded the guitar as I knew the issue before I bought it. Hipe its nice the Greg... in Munster Indiana... nice here currently but maybe the wet stuff tomorrow :) Thanks for watching...
Great video Tony I have 3 Gibson Sgs only one of them has the neck dive issue my wife bought me the Gibson Tony Iommi Gibson Sg and it makes sense why he put the strap button on the Horn and I took my other one and did the same thing he did the button on the horn it works perfect .
So on the Tony Iommi SG was the button on the horn as standard? The one on the horn has the most opposing leverage IMO but mine is hidden a bit better I think... hence my little diversification. Thanks...
Yes it is on the Horn on the USA production Toni Iommi.
I have a 2013 Epiphone Ltd Ed Genesis Dx Pro, which is basically an archtop LP with a SG doublecut. While the heavier 2" (at the edges) thick body somewhat reduces the head diving tendencies. However the rear placement of the upper strap button on the neck heel combined with the center placement of the bottom button still gives it a tendency to twist and face downwards. I'm seriously considering doing the Iommi Mod too, even if it will reduce the value of this relatively rare guitar thats still in near mint condition.
Yes, many might baulk at that, but in reality if we can't use the guitar because of the problem, then IMO it really does matter to the player. It can be easy to just 'cast off' the problem, especially if you don't have a guitar with the neck dive on its design. Thanks for the post and for watching.
I had an SG. I either used a leather strap that was suede on the back. It kind of grabbed my shirt. The other solution was to just sling the guitar lower.
Another thing to try would be to move the bottom strap button toward the low strings bout an inch and a half or so.
Good point and a couple of guys recommended the strap (wider or as you say) but for me that 'pulled' on my flimsy tops and I could not handle it. And on the moving of the original button I left mine as is because I wanted the back top remain standard. On the one I fitted note that it was a black button (matching the guitar) so it's really hardly noticeable... so for a while guitar use a white one etc. Some won't like it of course, and I guess its like the original Tony Iommi one many might not like how it looked (me included) hence my little shift to that. But it does work really well. Thanks for the info and for watching.
I have a Schaller 458, the Gold version of the 456 Bridge and its weight helps relieve a lot of the dive issue
Very good point and one I did not consider at the time. My original back in about 71 had a Bigsby on it and I don't remember neck dive on that one - likely why! I'll remember that one - my guess its better than my divers weight :) Thanks for watching.
@@tonymckenziecom Plus the sustain it adds not to mention the fine tuners like on a Floyd Rose
What about on the back of th horn?
I had a 61 RI that had a decent sized neck too that balanced well, no dive, but it had the VOS finish and felt sticky all over the guitar.
A Canadian strap maker "Well Hung Straps" makes padded straps with a one way fabric on the side against your body that won't allow the dive.
A good solution without adding any weight or having to modify the guitar.
You could put it on the back of the horn of course... but it does get angled a bit on mine, so I decided on this solution. The strap solution is also a good answer particularly if you don't want to harm the guitar in any way. Thanks for watching.
This vid needeed to be done! I run the back of my strap through my pants belt loop, it works and no extra holes in the guitar.. You could also put the strap button on the back of the horn too. Ideally I'd like the Tony Iommi position but don't want to drill extra holes.
One I have not heard before... thanks for posting it... and thanks for watching.
Congrats on 9 million views! Your channel is really cool 💥🌞💫 question: I’m curious about the owl. Why did you name your studio that and why is it your mascot? 🦉
The studio was renamed because I have a car registration that reads EVIL OWL' and it looks great on fast sports cars :) there is no other reason for it except its a cool thing to have... and it's always watching :)
i put a full size bigsby on and it (i know they're not designed for it, but i've always just loved em) it pretty much balances perfectly.
Well on this guitar I later fitted an FRX tremolo and that did not level up the guitar. For me, this was the easiest way to solve it as I could hardly use the guitar with it neck heavy. Thanks...
The Jackson Juggernaut guitars add an extra bit to the horn to strengthen it, for the strap button but it looks a bit odd. Most pointy shaped makers just add the strap button on the back of the horn instead of the tip
I was a bit concerned that the button might hit my ribs... on the back of the horn placement... maybe not... but my mod worked out fine for me... and thanks for posting the info and for watching... appreciated.
I put the strap buttons right on the tip of the horns of each of my Epiphone SG's and it works great! No neck dive or forward roll of the SG and it feels wonderful! it is definitely easier to drill the hole on an Epiphone if you simply remove the bolt on neck. I also used longer screws so I don't have to worry about the strap button ripping out and I used some bar soap on the screw in order to reduce the friction while screwing it in to reduce the potential of cracking the horn. If/when I get a Gibson SG, I am pretty sure that I will do the same. Yeah, yeah, I know, it will probably reduce the resale value but if it's mine and it works, that's all that matters.
Good points for sure. I opted to fit mine where it is shown in the video because I was concerned a bit about the load on the screw itself. Thanks for watching...
Not ALL SG’s has this problem. I’ve bought a lot of SG’s since 1970. I had one that had bad neck dive because some idiot at Gibson thought it was a good “idearrr” to put the strap button on the back of the horn instead of where it should go. I drilled a new hole and problem solved. 😊
I agree. Some are particularly bad though re the neck drop... thanks...
There is not a lot of wood material under the horn .
I moved the pin behind the horn ...on the back ..about 1 inch below the top where there is more material . It's better but not ideal
Thanks for the info.... and of course for watching too.
I saw a video of someone who made a clip that attaches to your pants belt and the guitar strap that worked very well. Also I saw a pic of Elvis with a double neck SG and the strap was tied to the headstock just above the nut like the old days. Both beat putting new holes in the guitar.
I can't wait to hear Elvis on a double neck SG! Probably playing stairway :) But interesting point and thanks for the post.
I like that mod it looks good!
Yes nicer than some of the very 'in your face' mods I have seen off and on. Strap button colour same as the body makes a big difference to hiding it too. Thanks.
I love you Tony. Jim from Long Island, NY. I really enjoy your presentations, and your amazing style of conveying info. I just bought an SG Tribute Husk, and finished the assembly last night. I just Hate the forward fall on the sg. I noticed that if I have a wider strap , it can brace against the upper horn, and keep it close to my body,but when you move some it slips off. Also, Why the Hell does the neck extend so far out like a Bass Neck? Explorers too. I really want to keep this SG, but I am thinking otherwise. It sounds great with teh Gibson 61 Burst Buckers, and the circuit I installed from RS guitar works.I hand Polished the hell out of the satin finish with 3M Hand Glaze, and Virtuoso polish, and Man does it look so glossy, and beautiful. I just want to solve this without adding another strap pin.Hmmm... Thanks for ALL OF YOUR INFO Tony. God Bless you Buddy
It is possible with a strap... but I still like this way as its not really that invasive and it certainly works. You are where I too have been and I sold a very nice SG at one stage because of the neck droop thing. Hope you solve it OK and thanks for the kind words and for watching.
I don't see any pictures where Tony Iommi does it that way, they are all at the top of the horn.
Correct, but I did talk about the Tony Iommi fitting in the video? Thanks for watching
I have seen the strap lock on the inside of the horn, the part that is facing your body.
I'm sure that would work too, but I was concerned it might 'stick in' to my body as I played - hence this change. Thanks for the info and for watching...
I use 1/2oz wheel weights that are rubber coated in the pots cavity... works well, no extra holes!
:) Thanks for the tip.... and for watching.
Assuming the body is actual mahogany, there really shouldn't be any issues with planting the screw right in the end of the horn. If you're terribly worried you can let a bit of thin CA glue wick into the fibers in the hole you pre-drill. Make your own washer with some Sugru to fit the contour.
Well to be honest, personally having that in the end of the 'horn' looks really bad to me and that was a second concern really. Where I placed this was for me a good option of a half-way house really and it did work for me. Ha it 'could' be Mahogany... or some other derivative they call Mahogany - often they are like that... I don't really trust what I read re the wood. Thanks for the post and for watching.
@@tonymckenziecom Agreed! I just recently got my first SG, as (despite being a big Black Sabbath, AC/DC and The Doors fan) I've usually played strats and superstrats for most part throughout the years, and I can't force myself to place a strap button on the upper horn (Tommy Iommi style), as it just looks off to me.
Thankfully, the neck dive is not that big of an issue on my guitar and a simple wide leather strap does the job quite enough to keep the guitar playable when standing.
But neck dive and different hand positioning aside, I am very happy that I finally bought an SG. For someone used to strat-styled guitars it is quite a different beast, but once you get used to them, they're a joy to play.
HI, SAY YOUVE RECORDED A SONG AND WHILST YOURE MIIXING AND LISTENING BACK IS THERE ANYWAY TO CHANGE PROFILES ON THE KEMPER SAY YOU RECORDED A MARSHALL PROFILE AND YOU WANT TO SEE HOW A MESA PROFILE WOULD SOUND, LIKE YOU CAN DO WITH MIDI INSTRUMENTS
I know whart you're getting at, and I have not done that one myself. What they normally do in the studio is record two outs... one with the amp sim and one clean... if the amp sim is not 'right' for example, then they resend the clean back out to the device (in this case a Kemper) and simply find the tone they want. That way you can 'find' what you need for the track. It might be possible somehow but I have never had to try and do that somehow in the Kemper, but rather recorded the clean signal so I can re-amp the thing if necessary. Hope it helps... and thanks for watching.
I currently own 4 SGs, three of them I have no issues with at all but the fourth one is an Epiphone and the headstock drops like a stone. I have owned it for 25 years and for most of the time I did exactly what Tony Iommi does and poked a strap button in the tip of that top horn. Thing is it changes the position the whole guitar hangs on a strap and I much prefer the heel strap button so I moved the button back and filled the control cavity with wheel weights - problem solved.
But then the overall guitar is heavier? I did try a few different weights but preferred the change I made of the two... - thanks for the info and for watching...
Excellent Tony the guitar looks cool mate i bought the LP version and very happy with it
Cheers The real John Smith 😉
Yes Mr Smith I had one of those too and reviewed it on my channel (not the custom) and it was very good. But I sold it because I bought the SG... A few more simple mods and fixes that they should have done and it will be a winner. Trust you're OK... and that finger mended itself... mine did but took about a year! Regards
@@tonymckenziecom
All good thanks Tony and pleased you are well and fighting fit again mate.
Good to see you uploading again always interesting stuff Tony👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
I've seen the tony fix and I will most likely be doing it to my sg bass
I did not go the whole way for the Iommi fix because personally it looked extreme. I think this was nearly the same result and far less noticable. Thanks for watching.
Tony, that looks like a Dunlop locking strap lock.
Congratulations on the 9,000,000 views.
Ha could be... I guessed :) - man those views too near enough ten years... there are I'm sure many that achieve far higher than me, we could all name them, but I tend to be far more diversified than the 'sales' videos or the 'tribal' videos (if you get what I mean) so I was impressed when that came on an email. So thanks you and everyone for the views... and anyone on here it's likely those strap buttons could be Dunlop... argghh.. ha at least I tried :).
@@tonymckenziecom Hey, I was just relaying that as that screw needs to be deep in the pocket so the male end of the strap lock fits.
Thus a smaller screw.
They do it so you buy their proprietary equipment.
I use em on all my axes.
SGs are definitely not my cuppa.
Yet I like juniors and double cuts.
Regardless, it’s a great video on the “small stuff” that needs to be talked about.
Tony always has the strap button screwed on the upper horn instead of the back to prevent dive.
It looks precarious to me... like feeble... but it certainly works for him. Thanks for the post and for watching.
Change the Bridge and tail piece to either Brass or Steel, Use stick on Tire weights in the cavity wrap them in electrical tape and stuff the cavity, change the knobs from Plastic to Steel or Brass, change the tuners to lighter locking. There is literally no need to drill extra holes in the guitar grant it its a cheap epiphone and if you are gigging its more practicality over something as an investment. A Gibson SG this is a hard Nope to, SGs are a bit fragile particularly at that Neck joint, they are cheap compared to an LP but used a bit harder so the amount that survive over a 20 year period is going to be low.
I have tried many ideas :) but thanks for these points and I'm sure they will help many guys - thanks for watching.
My old man used a small iron weight, probably weighed less than a pound, and hung it from the end to keep it level. Eventually he just tied the strap lock to his belt with a shoelace. He was a school teacher and played songs at school events, so he didn't care how bad it looked, he just wanted to play.
Funny you have the owls, I just saw an owl in my backyard as I was writing this
My evil owl gets everywhere :) I did fasten him down with a weight too :) (not true) :) but I tried the weight on the older Gibson SG and that was not feeling right so it had to go at the time. Thanks for watching.
Yeah this is a very common problem with these Guitars. I'd imagine that the newer versions have a Heavier body that matches the weight of the neck, this way it would balance better.
Agreed, but some still are neck heavy by a long way. Thanks.
@@tonymckenziecom Gibson has really improved the design of the SG over the years.
Tony I do think your placement is better than on the top of the horn.
Yes I have an image close up of one I saw today at a guitar show and maybe I'll post that - honestly mine is saintly in comparison and that one I photographed was as Tony Iommi has his... it looks not good. So that was why my mod was a little less 'full frontal' so to speak :) Thanks.
Angus Young always had a wide strap and a transmitter taped to the strap.
Thanks for the info - I did not check him out but should have... a useful point... a few mentioned the strap but not the TX... thanks for watching.
Here's a 2 part solution that requires zero modifications to the guitar. Tip Number 1. "Scratch Pad" is a removable static stick on product that you put on the back of guitars to protect them from scratches. The side that faces you is some sort of felt material, it clings to your shirt. Just don't leave it on nitro finishes for long periods of time unless the finish is completely cured. This might be all you need, but for good measure try tip number 2. Use a coiled cable and feed it under the strap from the back/bottom, over the strap to the jack on the guitar. The cable I use has a length of non coiled part a few inches on each end, so it fits really nicely. I started doing this a long time ago to avoid accidentally unplugging my guitar, but it also helps with neck dive because the coiled cable is heavier and provides some resistance (pull) while you're using it.
Thanks for the post and I'm sure it will help many guys.
The application of the strap button to end of horn is very stable and I’ve had several guitars built with the strap button on the tip of horn. The new Gibson Iommi “monkey” SG has the button on horn tip too, all very stable. The inside application here would bother my OCD
Well it sort of looked out of place to me and from what I saw on the ones that were done that way they had 'flatted off' the end of the 'horn' so I wanted to keep that part normal, hence my own mod. It's likely that the one you describe is better re the neck drop counterbalance because of the location though. Ha I'm the other way around and it did not 'look right' on the one on the end of the horn... in any case, thanks for the post as it will help many I'm sure. And thanks for watching too!
@@tonymckenziecom If you fabricate a little collar with a V notch and use a felt washer, as well as a carefully chosen screw, I don’t see why the end of the horn wouldn’t work fine. Vox has an SG-like guitar that uses that arrangement. What you did is fine too… it’s just about what looks best to you.
Thanks! Diverse information for divers is always welcome.
:) I know... I'm full of that :) Thanks...
Someone needs to come out with an "SG Strap" that is weighted on the one end!
Indeed a good idea... and thanks for watching.
Couldn't you buy an Axeeze to avoid drilling into your guitar?
Sorry don't know that one...
The bigger problem is no volute on the neck and chronic head/neck snaps.
Of course they happen - but never did to me.... thanks for watching.
Angus had the neck sanded slimmer by a lot because he has very small hands, this took a few pounds off the neck and balanced his SG.
Today it's Epiphones that neck dive. Gibsons shouod have the neck and body matched by a person by hand to balance. Epiphone just put any neck amd body through the machines. If you get a neck diving Gibson SG it's a Friday afternoon guitar some dealer sent you to try palm it off to you becauseyou brought online, all the good Gibsons go to physical stores where people try before they buy and Gibson know this, smaller more expert dealers get given better guitsrs than guitsr center because guitar center get to many guitars to hand check them all. Buy in person, buy from a smaller family owned guitar shop who specialise in something (acoustics, rock axes, hollow bodies, repairs, used Gibsons and so on). Buy smart, try 5 and buy the best one. I've got 3 Gibson SGs, no neck dive or other issues.
I had an SG with maple top (Gibson) and it was so bad I returned it! This epiphone was actually still there but not as bad as the Gibson - just my experience... and thanks for that post of what you found... good stuff.
I love the dad jokes
They were real.... (not) :)
Most Gibsons today do not neck dive. Body & neck are matched to balance well. It's Epiphones that *neck dive because they are made with less attention to detail and any neck is added to any body.
That could be true, but I had a SG made by Gibson (Maple cap etc you know them, and it dived so bad I changed it after about a week. I really like Gibson etc. and my first real guitar was a Gibson SG special of 1972 period that certainly did not dive. Good point and thanks for watching.
@tonymckenziecom Something definitely went wrong there, maple is much heavier than mahogany. You were rite to let it go, they mite of had to put extra coats of finish on the neck because of a problem or not Slim the neck enough because of a knot in the wood or something. Or ot could of been a damp piece of rosewood fingerboard, which will shrink. The ebony fingerboard Gibson SG's are slightly neck heavy but the early 2000s faded ate worth putting a bigsby on to balance them.
i really had to laugh when you popped that tape onto your neck. heh heh (i have a gretsch streamliner jr that dives BAD. a little semi-hollow. ironically, an SG from HAMER doesn't have the SG problem and doesn't dive.)
Ha Indeed I remember that well :) all created to lighten the mood of the video (its boring enough with me in there :) and I often do that sort of thing but remember English humour is sometimes missed abroad (which is a pity - they don't know what they are missing :) On the mod, the further you move that strap in towards the neck the better of course. In my case I was reserved a little as this particular guitar is pretty good. Not sure about the Stramliner. Good info about the Hamer SG though - many are put off with the neck heavy SG's and finding one that has likely cg=hanged the design somehow is very useful. Where do they put the neck side strap button? and thanks for watching.
Sounds like you’re from Stoke? 🙌
Smoke on Stench ... all the way ;-)
Personally I always play sitting down, and even when I'm standing I always instictively hold onto the neck anyway. So Neck Dive isn't really a problem for me
It does vary also depending on the SG model I found. Thanks for watching.
@@tonymckenziecom no problem o7
I've seen a number of photos of the Gibson Grabber and Ripper Basses that has the Strap Pin in the position you decided to put yours. I don't know if they came stock that way or if it was a common mod, but it shows up frequently there.
Here's a RUclips link showing one: ruclips.net/video/PU9rom2ntGI/видео.html
Thanks for the info... interesting stuff - and thanks for watching.
Estupenda guitarra
Gracias por tomarse el tiempo para ver el video , es muy apreciado ...
Neck dive has been haunting me for years. And if you don't have neck dive, then the guitar is too heavy. This is a good idea. Makes you wonder why they don't do this when they make them. I guess it's too expensive to find the exact place or something.
Oh I don't know. Maybe its 'controversial and some might not like it. Personally the Tony Iommi one was really 'out there' and affected the aesthetics in a big way IMO, but it would work very well. My slight diversification from his sort of hides the strap button (particularly if its the same colour as the body) and the neck drop has gone. Read the comments in general as there are many other options too - all pretty useful... and thanks for watching.
Get one with a Bigsby. That does the trick.
I can't play SG's. They're too small and light, they just feel like toys to me. And therefore the balance is awful, as you discuss here.
What I really wish is that people didn't want 300 dollars for old Tony Iommi Gibson signature pickups. I loved the one I put in an old Epiphone LP; the string-to-string clarity was just amazing. My bass player said when I first played it at practice, "WOW I can actually hear every note in a full chord, regardless of the distortion!" and the drummer and I agreed.
Ha me too :) I wish I could get those pickups 'cheap' but unlikely these days. I really like Mr Iommi and his playing and I do have particular periods where he is absolutely king... how he did it all with the finger tip problem is a lesson for anyone too. Thanks for watching... love the name...
@@tonymckenziecom thanks! I love Iommi so much that I named my little black dog in the avatar Sabbath :)
I think I paid 150 for my Iommi pickup, new. If Gibson would just see fit to make another run of them I'd be very happy.
My understanding is that they had six regular pole pieces on one coil and one bar/blade "polepiece" on the other, and that helped with the string-to-string balance.
LOL!
TOP...🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻
Indeed!
I have 3 SG’s (89 special, 01 gothic, and 05 standard) and none of them dive. Guess I got lucky
Yes I think some are worse than others. I had a 72 SG special that did not dive, but I have had one of those newer ones with the maple on top that was honestly horrendous - in fact I returned it because of that. You ARE lucky. :) Thanks for watching.
I don't know why, but the stars and stripes strap combined with this british accent gave me weird feelings.
Fancy a party in Boston? ;-)
Says a lot about a company that they will let an known, obvious design flaw go unfixed for 50+ years.
Careful, it applies to most companies with this design and they don't 'fix it' either! ... but good point and thanks for watching.
You can just move the strap button closer to the neck on the back where is already is! Easy and not ugly. Like that.
But that does not resolve the issue because the C ogf G is not moved as far... check Iommi yourself and you'll see that... Had it been that easy ha I would not have made the vid ;-) but hey thanks for weatching.
@@tonymckenziecom I will always be watching buddy. Maybe that one has heavier tuners. I have had a few and only one had the neck dive. But the moving button closer to the headstock did work. Great show.
A Rawhide Leather strap or a "suede" Underside on a Fabric\Webbing strap is another solution.
Friction!
I did try a different strap but because I often have flimsy tee shirts (or similar) it pulled them awkwardly - one reason I moved on the the TI modded one here. Thanks for the info and for watching.
Magic
Ah Niall - thanks for watching...
@@tonymckenziecom
No worries great tips.
I almost guarantee that that mod fails pretty soon. The combination of shorter screw and the compressed wood that epiphone tend to use is a bad idea IMO. My Gibson SG doesn’t neck dive- luck if the draw I guess
Ha well we shall see... ;-) I'm not entirely sure it will fail though... look at Tony Iommi original which is what I would say would fail, but seems to be fine. Thanks for this post... interesting for sure and if it should ever fail make no mistake I'll post it... and thanks for watching.
I just use a leather strap. It doesn’t move.
Youre lucky, all the ones I have had neck weight... thanks.
Get a guitar strap that doesn’t slip on your shoulder.
That 'pulls' my tee shirt so I decided against that one. Good idea I know but did not work for me... thanks for watching
Fill the back cavity with a bag of ball bearings or lead sinkers and you're good to go, it'll save you from butchering the guitar 😉
Good tip! but my divers weights were working too... thank god I can swim (just kidding) :) Actually the bearings I think could work but the cavity is on this one very tight. Thanks.
Does it rattle when you play?
Never seen a PRS neck dive… just saying
Great point Charlie... me neither... but the bodues are heavier and I think thats the reason... thanks for the post and for watching.
I have an SG. Never once have I experienced or complained of this "neck dive" issue because my one hand is on the neck and fingerboard and the other is picking strings....is everyone just hanging their guitar around their neck and putting your hands up in the air? Play the damn thing and you won't have "neck dive".
If you never experienced neck dive on an SG you really are lucky or the guitar is a 'similar product' that maybe does not allude to it. There is no doubt they dive... My first real guitar was a 1971 Gibson SG special and even in 1971 it had neck dive. Please try and see further because many players will tell you that it does exist. And when Tony Iommi has to mod his guitar because of that problem, well I guess it says it all. But hey, no problem and thanks for watching.
shut up
this video should have been 30 seconds long 🤣
I see you watch the BBC... ah that explains it. Thanks.
Why does this take 11 minutes ?
Why should it not? If you want to make a 30 second video please do and then I'l come and criticise yours ;-). Thanks.