I'm jumping in just to say that I've watched this channel over the years and IMO the best review channel. Chris gets right to the point and I really like his clear and soothing voice and lots of detailed information which is helpful. Thank you Chris for your wonderful channel and content.
A key point to remember is that the lens is designed for leica cameras which have very thin IR filters. The sony a7r cameras have quite thick IR filters. This reduces corner image sharpness for lenses designed for thin filter stacks.
I strongly doubt a slighly thicker IR filter in front of the sensor has that much optical effect on the corners. The effect would also show up the in other lens/adapter/sensor combinations. It does not.
@@caleidoo It very much shows up on other adapted rangefinder lenses, the issue is well documented, including tests on modified cameras with replaced filter stack. The key is, the wider, the faster, and the shorter flange distance it was designed for, the larger the issue generally is.
@@caleidoo Phillip Reeves conducted a comprehensive analysis of the effect of thicker Sony Sensors paired with native M-mount glass. IQ does seem to be substantially worse if the lens is not optimized for E-mount. There are in fact services for replacing the Sony IR filter for something thinner in Japan. I tried linking the article in this comment, but RUclips deleted my comment multiple times. You can google “PhillipReeves Different Filter Stacks”
@@caleidoo It is a highly documented issue when adapting Leica M lenses. The thicker sensor stack literally diffracts light more than a thinner stack. It varies from brand to brand. Nikon has a thinner stack for example and you see less of it but it is still there.
Could be. I feel like all of the thypoch lenses were built for Leica which is notoriously bad adapting to other cameras. They made all the other mounts as an afterthought
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I don't really get why they bothered making this available for anything other than M-mount. It's clearly optimised for Leica's thinner sensor array, and preforms rather well on those cameras.
When you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
Thypoch is paying shills for promoting their lenses on reddit, without making this public. That is marketing i truly dislike. I think the design of the lens is nice, but the IQ really is disappointing at this price. Thanks for the review.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I use the Simera 28mm on Leica SL2 and it's my current fav lens. And I have Nikon Z lenses, GFX and XF lenses. This to me proves lenses aren't just about charts and brick walls but real life scenarios.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
Horrible image quality for the price. Thank you for your honest review. I’m a subscriber since the beginning and I never buy a lens until I watch the review from you.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
"Character" is usually shorthand to refer to aberrations that are very well defined, understandable, and quite visible. Field curvature, under- or over-corrected spherical aberration, vignetting... these are all very real things quickly referred to as "character."
@Zrinko_Maloseja words of blissful ignorance. Sorry but you have no idea what you're talking about. There's a reason why award winning photographers use old Leica and Zeiss lenses instead of Sony and Sigma lenses. Prime lenes that are overcorrected need to be doped with a lot of glass elements. Eventually, they become like fixed zooms, in that they are ultimately very sharp but have poor rendition, low colors, no tonality, poor contrast, the list goes on. A lens should be just then just sharp, we're not using copy machines here but art tools. I'd rather keep an artful lens that can create naturally beautiful lenses, rather than an ultra sharp lens which needs half an hour of editing in post to look half decent. If you disagree, you've simply never used a truly awesome lens to tell the undeniable difference. And the problem is with youtube influencers like Jared Polin and T&C who push people to buy portrait lenses that are flat and sharp at 3000$, only to spend hours softening the skin and removing detail... my advice, stop listening to youtubers who get a kickback for new lenses they sell and try a real awesome lens with all the beautiful characteristics that it beholds. It will unleash your photography potential.
I bought the pergear 35 1.4 full frame manual lens. Might go look on the website for photo comparisons to see what this thypoch for 4x the cost would get me.
I guess a slightly lower aperture like F1.8 or something like that would be enough to have on this lens since you already going to stop down the aperture so you don't need the aperture to be as big as it is here. Having a lower aperture would make probably make the image quality a little better so it has better performance especially in the corners. Really nice to do as a small upgrade. If the performance of a lens is not the best but the lens has a really big aperture than I guess it is better just to have a slightly lower aperture because that will be enough
I've been watching your videos for years. Thank you for all the effort you put into each of them. Any chance you will review any of the new Lumix full-frame lenses? They have quite a lineup now.
On Leica rangefinder camera, this lens isn't bad at all. I wish Thypoch would optimize their lenses for different mount. Without optimization, lenses designed for M mount perform the worst on stock Sony E cameras than any other mounts.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I would rather buy the Laowa 35mm f/0.95 (i did, i owned it for the last 2 years since it came out) this lens is cool too, but performance wise its ehhh.. cool factor is there though.
I certainly do appreciate these tests and try to watch them all. I don't know about other amateurs but I always look for edge sharpness. Perhaps we should ask Chris to do an edge sharpness comparison. I know professionals will be looking for much more than this.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. And indeed, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I shoot strictly with manual focus lenses nowadays, primarily Zeiss, and Laowa if I'm in the mood for macro. But man, some of these companies seriously need to settle down with their prices, as it compares with the quality of the lenses. You're almost better off going with vintage lenses for 1/4th the price.
iIt is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
So it’s expensive, soft wide open, has tons of purple fringing, no weather sealing, messy corner sharpness, soft close focus, flares a lot, but it makes up for it by making you feel like it’s a Leica lens but with the overall image quality is more like a Kamlan than even a Tamron.
This test is not accurate due to Sony's thick sensor stack. This is a well documented issue. All Leica M lenses will perform poorly on thicker sensor stacks.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
They allow Voigtlander which is potentially the best MF lens maker out there. Also, I wouldn't call this a weak lens, its images are mostly sharp enough and very interesting to look at.
Huh? It's an F1.4 lens. Many people will be able to shoot it at F1.4 and get good enough sharpness in the center 2/3, beautiful bokeh and great colors and overall contrast from what we can see in the sample images. Yes the price of 700$ is a bit steep, but sharpness is not what defines a lens.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
@mauricerijnders3507 people have been poisoned with the idea that they need sharpness in the right a** corners. Litteraly there is never a situation where this will be relevant, especially for an artistic lens intuended to be used for street, potraiture etc... this lens as demonstrated in other review burries modern lenses in rendering, bokeh, color saturation and 3d pop. No one looks at a picture at 300%, but they will instinctively like a picture that is pleasingly rendered rather than the flat images produced by most modern lenses.
Quite a disappointing lens at that price. For that price you could easily get a Used Sigma 35mm 1.4 art lens which is much better and has AF, or a used Tamron 35 1.8 VC for almost half the price.
Too many people seem to be now obsessively fixated on getting the sharpest lens, which is ultimately useless if you have to spend 1 hour editing the images to get decent contrast, colors, tonality and bokeh. This lens has plenty of great attributes and is seemingly sharp enough for 99% of people of share content anyway on social media where resolution and details are crushed. Stop playing the sharpness police, you can produce beautiful and artful pictures with this lens, and this supercedes the importance of critical sharpness at F1.4.
Im not buying a £600 lens to only share content on social media. And this lens is horrible for this price. I can produce more "artful" pictures with a £150 Takumar.
@todanrg3 a takumar will cost even lens but will also be worn out and possibly have all sorts of problems. This is brand new with a metal build and probably uses optical glass that is more expensive. Sorry to say, but many people are buying much more expensive sigma lenses that are made in China, render flat, and are known to fall apart within a few years. There is nothing horrible that I could see in this lens. When you think that manual focua lenses with similar levels of sharpness can cost 15k, it helps to put things into perspective.
This lens is way overpriced for what it is. You're better off picking up a 40 year old 35mm f1.4 manual focus lens that fits your camera. Nice over view...thx.
I honestly don't understand what's even the point of lenses like this under any scenario if they are so bad. Character? No. It's called bad, plain and simple. And its not budget either, this is actually a lot of money. Nonsensical..
It isn't a bad lens, it's just a bad lens on Sony cameras with thick filter stacks, like many wide rangefinder lenses. If you've already modified your Sony for wide rangefinder lenses, it will perform a lot better.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I'm jumping in just to say that I've watched this channel over the years and IMO the best review channel. Chris gets right to the point and I really like his clear and soothing voice and lots of detailed information which is helpful. Thank you Chris for your wonderful channel and content.
A key point to remember is that the lens is designed for leica cameras which have very thin IR filters. The sony a7r cameras have quite thick IR filters. This reduces corner image sharpness for lenses designed for thin filter stacks.
ok...it seems to me one can get better corner sharpness from a cheaper lens then or at least the same and spend far less. $600 is alot
I strongly doubt a slighly thicker IR filter in front of the sensor has that much optical effect on the corners. The effect would also show up the in other lens/adapter/sensor combinations. It does not.
@@caleidoo It very much shows up on other adapted rangefinder lenses, the issue is well documented, including tests on modified cameras with replaced filter stack.
The key is, the wider, the faster, and the shorter flange distance it was designed for, the larger the issue generally is.
@@caleidoo
Phillip Reeves conducted a comprehensive analysis of the effect of thicker Sony Sensors paired with native M-mount glass. IQ does seem to be substantially worse if the lens is not optimized for E-mount. There are in fact services for replacing the Sony IR filter for something thinner in Japan.
I tried linking the article in this comment, but RUclips deleted my comment multiple times. You can google “PhillipReeves Different Filter Stacks”
@@caleidoo It is a highly documented issue when adapting Leica M lenses. The thicker sensor stack literally diffracts light more than a thinner stack. It varies from brand to brand. Nikon has a thinner stack for example and you see less of it but it is still there.
I wonder if the image quality here is affected by Sony's thicker sensor stack vs Leica's thin one.
Yes it is. The lens is made for Leica sensors.
Could be. I feel like all of the thypoch lenses were built for Leica which is notoriously bad adapting to other cameras. They made all the other mounts as an afterthought
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I don't really get why they bothered making this available for anything other than M-mount. It's clearly optimised for Leica's thinner sensor array, and preforms rather well on those cameras.
When you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
Thypoch is paying shills for promoting their lenses on reddit, without making this public. That is marketing i truly dislike. I think the design of the lens is nice, but the IQ really is disappointing at this price. Thanks for the review.
It's because it's being used on a mount it wasn't designed for.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
The Leica M-Mount version is great in image quality, even beat my Voightlander 40 F1.2 in some aspect.
It could the poor adaptation to Sony cameras.
I use the Simera 28mm on Leica SL2 and it's my current fav lens. And I have Nikon Z lenses, GFX and XF lenses. This to me proves lenses aren't just about charts and brick walls but real life scenarios.
Or, in this case, it's about this lens on a camera with a thin filter stack (your Leica) versus a thick filter stack (Christopher's Sony)
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
A review I have been waiting for. Great review. Many thanks!
Horrible image quality for the price. Thank you for your honest review. I’m a subscriber since the beginning and I never buy a lens until I watch the review from you.
Thanks God we have Christopher. Not as the average dustuber.
💯
Only because it's a thicker sensor stack. This test is not accurate because the lens was never made to handle thick sensors like Sony.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
Ah "character". That lovely word. Just like "warmth" in vinyl.
"charm", "personality", "quirkyness", "classic" 😂
Got to love some buzzword lingo.
@@SyntheticFuture haha Whatever works to sell subpar gear for unreasonable amount of money.
"Character" is usually shorthand to refer to aberrations that are very well defined, understandable, and quite visible. Field curvature, under- or over-corrected spherical aberration, vignetting... these are all very real things quickly referred to as "character."
@@StephenStrangways the real shorthand is "sub par quality" or "compromised optical quality". That's what it was called back in the day as well 🤭
@Zrinko_Maloseja words of blissful ignorance. Sorry but you have no idea what you're talking about. There's a reason why award winning photographers use old Leica and Zeiss lenses instead of Sony and Sigma lenses. Prime lenes that are overcorrected need to be doped with a lot of glass elements. Eventually, they become like fixed zooms, in that they are ultimately very sharp but have poor rendition, low colors, no tonality, poor contrast, the list goes on. A lens should be just then just sharp, we're not using copy machines here but art tools. I'd rather keep an artful lens that can create naturally beautiful lenses, rather than an ultra sharp lens which needs half an hour of editing in post to look half decent. If you disagree, you've simply never used a truly awesome lens to tell the undeniable difference. And the problem is with youtube influencers like Jared Polin and T&C who push people to buy portrait lenses that are flat and sharp at 3000$, only to spend hours softening the skin and removing detail... my advice, stop listening to youtubers who get a kickback for new lenses they sell and try a real awesome lens with all the beautiful characteristics that it beholds. It will unleash your photography potential.
I bought the pergear 35 1.4 full frame manual lens. Might go look on the website for photo comparisons to see what this thypoch for 4x the cost would get me.
(Fun-fact "Simera(see-me-rah/σήμερα)" means "today" in greek)
I guess a slightly lower aperture like F1.8 or something like that would be enough to have on this lens since you already going to stop down the aperture so you don't need the aperture to be as big as it is here. Having a lower aperture would make probably make the image quality a little better so it has better performance especially in the corners. Really nice to do as a small upgrade.
If the performance of a lens is not the best but the lens has a really big aperture than I guess it is better just to have a slightly lower aperture because that will be enough
I've been watching your videos for years. Thank you for all the effort you put into each of them. Any chance you will review any of the new Lumix full-frame lenses? They have quite a lineup now.
I'm hesitant to get in touch with Panasonic's PR team after the whole Gerald Undone debacle...
On Leica rangefinder camera, this lens isn't bad at all. I wish Thypoch would optimize their lenses for different mount. Without optimization, lenses designed for M mount perform the worst on stock Sony E cameras than any other mounts.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I would rather buy the Laowa 35mm f/0.95 (i did, i owned it for the last 2 years since it came out) this lens is cool too, but performance wise its ehhh.. cool factor is there though.
Thanks for this review. Been waiting for it. No need to run out and get this one for my Nikon Z.
Nikon has a thinner sensor stack so you'll get better results
I certainly do appreciate these tests and try to watch them all. I don't know about other amateurs but I always look for edge sharpness. Perhaps we should ask Chris to do an edge sharpness comparison. I know professionals will be looking for much more than this.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. And indeed, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I shoot strictly with manual focus lenses nowadays, primarily Zeiss, and Laowa if I'm in the mood for macro. But man, some of these companies seriously need to settle down with their prices, as it compares with the quality of the lenses. You're almost better off going with vintage lenses for 1/4th the price.
It is designed for Leica M camera, but I wonder how this Thypoch can be used on a Leica M with rangfinder given the lens' dreadful focus shift.
2:40 is this a speck of dust in the lens between 12 and 1 o'clock?
I love my pergear 35mm f1.4, which cost 6 times less than this far from being perfect Thypoch. Plenty of flaws, but still very charming.
Zeiss 35 1.4 zm is the best. For a cheap one ， there come the TTartisan 35 1.4
Would love to see reviews for the other Simeras! To my understanding, this one is the worst performer.
iIt is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
I think at around $600 there are better choices
And with autofocus.
TL;DW - You're definitely not buying this one.
At least, not if you shoot with an unmodified Sony.
A Fashion accessory
So it’s expensive, soft wide open, has tons of purple fringing, no weather sealing, messy corner sharpness, soft close focus, flares a lot, but it makes up for it by making you feel like it’s a Leica lens but with the overall image quality is more like a Kamlan than even a Tamron.
This test is not accurate due to Sony's thick sensor stack. This is a well documented issue. All Leica M lenses will perform poorly on thicker sensor stacks.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
You know it's a weak lens when Canon allows it for RF mount.
😂😂😂
They allow all MF lenses don't they? Idk I ditched Canon years ago because of their bs after using them for 20 years
Canon doesn’t disallow any manual focus lenses, though.
They allow Voigtlander which is potentially the best MF lens maker out there. Also, I wouldn't call this a weak lens, its images are mostly sharp enough and very interesting to look at.
Canon don't disallow MF lenses because, well they can't. There are no electronic. As far as the camera is concerned there is no lens.
Those corners are just not acceptable. They don't have to be perfect, but for the $$$, they are waaaay too soft.
It's effectively an F/4.0 lens.
Huh? It's an F1.4 lens. Many people will be able to shoot it at F1.4 and get good enough sharpness in the center 2/3, beautiful bokeh and great colors and overall contrast from what we can see in the sample images. Yes the price of 700$ is a bit steep, but sharpness is not what defines a lens.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉
@mauricerijnders3507 people have been poisoned with the idea that they need sharpness in the right a** corners. Litteraly there is never a situation where this will be relevant, especially for an artistic lens intuended to be used for street, potraiture etc... this lens as demonstrated in other review burries modern lenses in rendering, bokeh, color saturation and 3d pop. No one looks at a picture at 300%, but they will instinctively like a picture that is pleasingly rendered rather than the flat images produced by most modern lenses.
@@ralphsaad8637 Fully agree! Wide open with a corner sharpness request rarely happens 🙂
I can get a Sony GM 35mm 1.4 from Hong Kong for just over £800!
Quite a disappointing lens at that price. For that price you could easily get a Used Sigma 35mm 1.4 art lens which is much better and has AF, or a used Tamron 35 1.8 VC for almost half the price.
This is a very exquisit lens. It uses the same optical design and patent of the Leica Summilux-M 35mm f/1.4 asph..
Seems way too expensive for what you get. There are better 35mm f1.4 lenses with autofocus for less.
My 100€ used Fuji kit-lense from 2012 has better image quality...
What a piece...
A £600 lens from a NEW manufacturer, that has not done its homework?, No, thanks.
Yeah, no.
As a Fujifilm user, you can find the Fujinon XF 35mm F1.4 R almost for the same price with autofocus and aperture ring, so no thank :)
First from Hyderabad, India. Been watching your reviews since 2019 Chris. God bless.
Nice review, very poor lens!
Not sure who would pay £600 for this.
600 DOLLAR??? Oh my, with worse performance than a Chinalens for 150 bucks LOL
Oh too much like the 28mm . For Fuji a 35mm 1.4 you nearly get for that money a 33mm 1.4 ......with AF and thats a killer ...... sorry
Isn't the 28mm better?
Too many people seem to be now obsessively fixated on getting the sharpest lens, which is ultimately useless if you have to spend 1 hour editing the images to get decent contrast, colors, tonality and bokeh. This lens has plenty of great attributes and is seemingly sharp enough for 99% of people of share content anyway on social media where resolution and details are crushed.
Stop playing the sharpness police, you can produce beautiful and artful pictures with this lens, and this supercedes the importance of critical sharpness at F1.4.
Im not buying a £600 lens to only share content on social media. And this lens is horrible for this price. I can produce more "artful" pictures with a £150 Takumar.
@todanrg3 a takumar will cost even lens but will also be worn out and possibly have all sorts of problems. This is brand new with a metal build and probably uses optical glass that is more expensive. Sorry to say, but many people are buying much more expensive sigma lenses that are made in China, render flat, and are known to fall apart within a few years. There is nothing horrible that I could see in this lens. When you think that manual focua lenses with similar levels of sharpness can cost 15k, it helps to put things into perspective.
calm down
@@theyaoster ?
Why buy this lens instead of same priced voigtlander if it's not sharper or better in other aspects ?
This lens is way overpriced for what it is. You're better off picking up a 40 year old 35mm f1.4 manual focus lens that fits your camera. Nice over view...thx.
Seems like a terrible lens for the price. Loads of better options at cheaper prices.
Thanks for the review 👍😊
I honestly don't understand what's even the point of lenses like this under any scenario if they are so bad. Character? No. It's called bad, plain and simple. And its not budget either, this is actually a lot of money. Nonsensical..
It isn't a bad lens, it's just a bad lens on Sony cameras with thick filter stacks, like many wide rangefinder lenses. If you've already modified your Sony for wide rangefinder lenses, it will perform a lot better.
Yes, it is designed for Leica. Plus, when you focus in the corners it is sharp there too: If your subject is positioned more on the edge of the frame and you are not shooting brick walls (or test posters) 😉