Forgot to mention 3 things: - kuki is a good 4th slot on the burgeon team (more comfy, fischl is higher damage) - ayato is a solid on fielder for Thoma burgeon - for kitain cross spear use burst 1st then skill as opposed to usually using skill first
Some characters can utilize kitain or the claymore counterpart by doing the skill - burst way tho.. just have to be fast.. I use that claymore for dori and i always do the skill-burst combo instead of burst-skill
i was so heartbroken when i found out he was on this banner half and not with wanderer and kokomi. he is so cute and the perfect husband and i really wanted to c6 him but but rip i cant pull on this awful banner 😢
Same, I've been saving primos for quite a while because most 3.0 units didn't really interest me and was really hoping to cash in hard on the Kokomi banner, since I want her, Faruzan and Thoma. I guess my Thoma will stay C4 for a bit longer now :(
I want thoma, but wouldn't risk it since I'm saving up for Wriothesley.. I just hope the next time he got a rerun, it is with ayato.. I mean cmon, ayato & thoma is close lore wise, works nicely with ayato as a NA buffer / shielder with C6 in NA non reaction team, and in burgeon..
Thank you so much for the guide! Finally got my Thoma (risked it all to get him riiight while Furina is around the corner lol) and while I am not brave enough to attempt getting his c6 this time, I legit can't wait to play him. Thank you so much and glhf!
Great timing, I just used Thoma for the first time yesterday and was shocked how fun and good he is. I only have him at 60 but he still was helpful so I'm excited to upgrade him.
Thoma is one of my favourite. I currently play him physical with Raiden’s signature weapon. I think at some point I will give him a second build tailored for burgeon teams, alone with a few crowns. He deserves it.❤
I CANT BELIEVE YOU DONT HAVE CHILDE YET! When you get him, you'll be in for a treat. He is so amazingly fun. International is the only Xiangling team besides Klee that I am not bored of yet. Childe makes you want to kill everything on the map every day. I can't wait to see the content you make when you get him.
International has been my main go to since I got Kazuha. Other team comps have gotten boring but International is always fun. I do play taser Childe and dendro teams with him too, but International is just too good.
Awesome review and thank you for the guide! Just a quick little thing, with Kitain Thoma in particular, it's usually recommended that he starts his rotation with Q then E because of how the weapon's passive works - Kitain initially drains some energy on E but gradually restores more than what it drained, but this passive still activates even with zero energy Anyway burgeon Thoma very fun to play and I hope more people love it too
bro i love your videos because you talk nonstop it’s so good in the background. your videos are like attending a lecture lmao. in all seriousness, i like the effort made into being informative, although i feel there’s still some areas of information lacking
Great guide! I'm enjoying your videos and your philosophies! A tip for your videos: Put your talking head box in the bottom left corner so you're not blocking elements on the screen.
The second half of the current abyss caused me to finally level up my C6 Thoma, who up til this point had gone unused, & I’m so glad I did! I used him as a burgeon trigger along with Nahida, Xingqiu, and Bennett. Thoma, along with the others, proved invaluable in ripping through all of those very pesky hydro and cryo shields! Aside from that, I’m also now trying out C6 Thoma in my C1R1 Wanderer team. Up until now, I ran Wanderer with C6 Faruzan, Bennett, and Zhongli - but now with C6 Thoma built up, he may substitute well for the Zhongli spot!
he's good with burgeon but I think most ppl prefer on field pyros like klee hu tao etc. due to the er issues, more em and flexible pyro app for shield breaking some of his most popular teams these days is support for wanderer or xiao
hu Tao for burgeon is alright the reason it's not better . Klee is a possible contender but she can't be used off field. and people would rather run dendro or hydro units as the onfielders. the real contender obviously for Thoma burgeon is the Bennett and Kazuha Combo. there's diluc and Xiangling but xiangling can be a pain since she triggers pyro too much and also if not alot more energy hungry than Thoma. Diluc well it's not bad, but is it worth to sacrifice personal damage for burgeon damage especially for non em scaled units?
Came here after getting him C6 from Wriothesley's banner. I'm starting to think it might be worth to build him and pair him with Wriothesley. Thoma's C6 seems perfect for a melt team and vaporize team
I use Wanderer with Thoma. He is better than Zhongli on that team. Some of the reasons why he is better than Zhongli are not obvious. For example Zhongli resist shred does not work at long range and Tenacity is c6 Faruzan best set which works a lot better than on Zhongli so he does not have a set he can use effectively. Thoma is also far better supplying energy to Bennett and Bennett to Thoma. This is also really minor but Thoma provides a source of pyro swirls which actually matters a little bit when trying to destroy certain shields or cryo armor. He is also slightly better than Zhongli at using the Fav lance imo. Doing an E + Q + NA gives you 4 chances to proc Fav lance in a fairly quick manner.
Personally i think noelle is an amazing driver in a burgeon team with nahida, xingqiu and thoma. She heals, shields and removes burning so you can generate more seeds. But favonius is a must on her
i enjoy using him with childe and Nahida not the best but it works. just at 173er, Kitain and a single fav is enough for him. sometimes the last slot is flex Bennett for nuking or a dendro healer for extra EM. his biggest weakness would be his energy needs and how con reliant he feels. edit:i forgot to mention about how E then Q would probably be harder. since you have to be fast enough to proc the burst otherwise Thoma collects the particles while the burst is fully charged but not activated.
Only have him C0 but I like him cause I can pair him with my future Burgeon team with Ayato and have an almost entirely Inazuma team while keeping as much of the Kamisato clan together as I can.
Got him to C6 during his release while wishing for Hu Tao. He just kept coming home. And since I didn’t have Zhongli at the time, he was perfect for my Hu Tao team. I benched him when I got Zhongli, but I started using him again when Dendro came. I love using him for burgeon. I used this burgeon team for the current abyss and it made it so easy to clear the second half of floor 12. Also, I use him with Wanderer, Faruzan, and Bennett. Other than that, he has great personality and is a total husbando. Overall, I love Thoma so much!
built him for the 3.7 abyss cuz burgeon was highly recommended for the second half of f12 and i was pleasantly surprised. definitely using him more from now on
I’ve been a day one Thoma main and it’s nice to see he has risen up thanks to Dendro, and seeing people say he and Childe work well is so weird to me because I’ve been doing that since 2.2. 😅
I've leveled Thoma and kept him in my main lineup since his release and he's an amazing support! Everything about him flows well for a 4* and his animations look amazing. If only there was a Sacrificial Lance in the game. He would probably become one of the most used characters since his only weakness is long CD and energy issues.
i hope if there is some kind of sacrificial lance i hope it's em or er based. the problem with it being em based means that characters like Mika can't use it.
Because I don't see anyone else talking about this I feel like I'm missing something that everyone else sees: What about Candace in the hydro slot? She gives hydro infusion which doesn't conflict with Thoma's burst and would let him (or any other polearm/sword onfielder) make the dendro cores as long as there's enough off field dendro application.
I used Thoma for a while for my previous VV Hu Tao enabler since he was c6 and I had no Tankfei (still don't have her c4 yet sadly) or Elegy on Amber at the time. Nowdays he's got a nice place in Burgeon or for my Klee monopyro when I don't care to use Bennett.
Better VV vape with sucrose if xingqiu or ayato is in the team because it is easier. Kazuha has to be near the enemy so xingqiu orbitals can accidentally apply hydro. Kazuha VV vape with xingqiu and thoma have to do a N0 which is a normal attack that doesnt hit which activates thoma Q but not xingqiu Q. Thus, the timing is really tight.
I was using Yae for elemental application in my mono anemo dps kazuha, heizou, faruzan team but just got c1Thoma in 1 10pull and the missing link in the team was resistance to interruption (plus solid elemental application as a need)... Thoma is kind of perfect (althogh I cannot use Hakushin on Heizou sadly). I just rolled on Klee for the chance of getting Thoma, I was laughiong my as* off when I got him twice, like what are the chances lmao.
Try Ayato/Nahida/Kuki/Thoma in Abyss 2nd half; just make sure you have enough ER with your units by putting fav on Nahida and Thoma Using Kuki isn't a waste with him because his shield is very weak when he is on a full EM build (but you still get the interrupt res), so running him with a healer is still optimal Rotation would be Nahida EQ ~> Ayato Q ~> Thoma EQ (QE if on Kitain) ~> Kuki E ~> Ayato EN15 ~> finish with Nahida normals ~> repeat The only downside is that you'd want two EM sets
I've been using him a lot lately especially in the current abyss second half. He's by and far the best burgeon trigger compared to existing options given his off field nature and slower application meaning less chance of burning. He's like pyro Kuki in a sense, however unlike Kuki, I feel Thoma has way more caveats. He's actually pretty high investment for a character you stack EM on. He obviously wants lvl 90 for reaction damage. He needs to level both his skill and burst for defensive utility compared to Kuki who only needs to level her E. He also has no innate EM scaling in his kit which doesn't make his shield stronger unlike Kuki's healing. His pyro app is tied to his burst and it can be hard to battery him because he's usually the only pyro. If you can't get enough ER through artifacts then he wants C4. His BIS is R5 Kitain which you need 5 polearm billets for. With all that being said, if you can check all those boxes he's pretty darn good, though his slow pyro app can be a double edged sword. Sometimes he can't break the cryo herald shields in time compared to Xiangling for example.
Yeah, for some reason I love burgeon so I ended up investing in him massively to get sufficient ER substats on a full EM gilded dreams. I kind of love that he was 4* unloved and became a beast
@@Zemos_zermos Yeah, I forgot to mention he does have his share of pros too compared to Kuki. Thoma is pretty unique in his role whereas there's more viable hyperbloom alternatives. He's more comfortable since he doesn't drain HP and has interrupt resist. Lastly, he buffs NA and CA with C6, a small but welcome buff.
With Kitian Cross you go Burst > Skill otherwise you just grief your energy requirements because Kitian will drain the energy away which would prevent you from funneling + you wasting a lot of the Kitian energy.
I really wished thoma was on kokomi’s banner bc i wanted them both! Pulled on klee’s banner and he’s c3 rn, wish i could c4 him but i had to stop bc i’m close to soft pity :’) Thanks for the video!
I got him in 1 pull but this video is tempting me to pull for his cons. Too bad the 5 stars ain't for me. Saving my primos for 3.9 instead. Still it's pretty tempting though.
Personally my favorite Hydro that isn't Xingqiu/Yelan when pairing with Thoma Burgeon is Ayato. Collei/Traveler + a defensive Dendro (Baizhu >> Yaoyao >= Kirara) gives enough application to get at least one core popping off even in ST situations and the burning is a bit of a non-issue with a well-built Ayato dealing decent forward vape damage and having spaced out application to reset the Hydro/Dendro aura on enemies. There's also the advantage of off-field presence from Ayato and his consistency regardless of AoE or ST Nahida can help free the flex slot for Shinobu/Fischl for extra damage, but I don't have her + I like a defensive option hence the ones I mentioned
@@JelloImpact Redundant? Cus she heals and he shields so you don't need both? They both auto-attack things around them with their skills so they work together.
I run Wanderer as one of my mains and wanted Kokomi, so was a bit heartbroken that he was put on the opposite banner. I'll have to try to get more cons for him next time he's on a banner I want! I think he's only at c1 for me so I haven't really used him yet.
hey JELLO, one question... if i use off field characters and they are applying elements .. their EM counts as DMG? or just the final attack that triggers the reaction?
For something like Nilou , burgeon or hyperbloom, only the character that triggers the reaction (explodes the seed) EM will be considered regardless of on field or off field
i think what you could do is Yaoyao on moonpiercer and Thoma with kitain and then after moonpiercer's effect is triggered you can give it to xingqiu or anyone.
Overall I would say no but they’re totally different teams. Check out the teams section of this video and of the xiangling video and see which teams suit you more :)
@@JelloImpact Well the only problem I have with that is I don't have none of those characters lol and also I'm using Alhaitham as my main character but I appreciate the feedback and it was a good vid :)
If I ever need a shield and Pyro in the same slot, my go-to pick is still going to be c4 Yanfei, though not everyone is going to have that constellation. But at the same time, I think it's more likely someone would have Yanfei's c4 than Thoma's c4.
Problem with Yanfei is that she requires enormous ER when used as a shielder which cuts into her HP stats. I think she needs something like 300% ER to get her shield reliably.
there is a problem with using double dendro in burgeon especially if you are using nahida. nahida applies so much dendro just from off field that even c6 xingui barely keeps up. on field nahida is out of the world. that means there will always be a dendro aura on the enemy if you use nahida. when thoma applies pyro it will start a burning (simultaneous dendro+pyro aura) and now xingui has to extinguish the fire first before he can react with dendro to create a seed. now if you get a second dendro unit like baizhu you are guaranteed to generate significantly less seeds because at this point xingui will only be extinguishing burning and causing forward vaporize. so nahida solo is already too much dendro. you need to either increase your hydro or reduce your pyro. slotting in electro helps in latter by applying electro to pyro causing overload and completely removing the pyro. fischl is pretty decent but you can try on field lisa or yae for their faster application being catalyst users. it also synergizes with xingui's burst and thoma's c6 buff that require normal attack and it helps keep nahida off field to keep the dendro application in check because electro will also react with dendro keeping the overall seed generation optimal. i personally use lisa because her elemental burst electro application def shred is a big boost to nahida and xingui's dmg and she has highest catalyst attack speed resulting in faster application from normal attacks. on the other hand if one want to use nahida on field then a double hydro is a must because the limiting factor for creating seeds in nahida teams is hydro and not dendro itself. more hydro more seeds
@@JelloImpact haha i did and you and i both know that anything works for AR60 players 😅 but try using lisa or yae its pretty insane. i use the nahida xingui thoma (built with er/hp/hp) reaching 600 em after gilded buff. rock solid shield with 24k burgeons. they good part is lisa is built for quickbloom with em goblet. 70/170 crit with 600 em (after nahida em sharing) doing 22k hyperblooms. lisa applies so much electro that you see aggravate spread overload vaporize burgeon electrocharge and hyperblooms. its the most chaotic team. on top of that thoma built with hp+ xingui dmg reduction, i cleared consecrated beast floor afk gaming. lisa n3+ tap e infinite chain looping. its a blast 👌
@@srinivasbharadwaj95aha that’s not true, the team has Thoma on fav lance with EM, xingqiu with not even 200 crit value with fav sword, and a full HP kirara. Hardly carried by being AR 60, just a good team. But it’s definitely a blast!
@@JelloImpact oh your using kirara for strong shields. i just made my thoma hybrid for that reason. i sacrificed em main stats for hp with really good em rolls on substats basically making him "shieldbot" that claps 😅. got an R4 kitain. burgeon and hyperbloom have such a high floor that even 500 em makes my shieldbot do 23-24k burgeons. i make up for the lost damage by having a strong on field driver lisa in this case who loves a nice shield. what actually makes thoma so great is with the coming of dendro even a simple shieldbot thoma can dish out as much damage as some carries. imagine doing 24k damage per second for being a shielder 😶. ofcourse thats only in burgeon but thats still a great feat. love this character
With Thoma, nahida and xinquiu, I find that the most comfortable 4th slot is Kuki, she and Thoma end up sharing the bloom cores, and she heals quite a bit even with full em build
I’ve been wanting thoma since I started playing and 60 wishes in he’s no where to be found. I don’t want eula or klee at all, like I want to lose a 50/50 before that, but for 4 stars I’ve only gotten 3 razors and 3 trash weapons in 60 pulls.
If you didn't have to farm those mushrooms i would build him up for sure. Still will. Passively farming beetles for heizo and maybe The mushrooms for thoma
One of my main teams is Hu Tao, Xingqiu, Kazuha, Diona. (I don't have Yelan or Zhongli) And wanted to replace Diona with Thoma! (Or C4 Yanfei) so I can swirl Pyro using Kazuha and not sacrifice a shield. But I pulled 9 Razers and 6 Mika's, and no Thoma's :( And I pulled Klee, with an early Diluc after that so don't want to pull anymore, want to save for Kokomi.
Can I use YaoYao instead of Baizhu for the dendro healer with Nahida, Xingqui and Thoma ? Do you think Xingqui is better than Yelan in this team because I already have Xingqui C4 and Yelan C0 ?
Pre-c6 xingqiu I would actually suggest kuki for a healer option which I should have talked about in the video. The electro helps burning from taking over. Same with Yelan I would go with kuki as the final slot
i didn't even mean or want to get his constellations, but at the beginning of me plsying in may i somehow got c4...got c6 now with this banner, so, guess i might as well start building him now when hes my first c6 huh? lmfaoo i only have c3 xiangling even😭
Now with Lyney out who deals more dmg in mono pyro teams, I was wondering if I Thoma would be a good option in this team as my shielder? Lyney's best team is supposed to be Xiangling, Bennett and Kazuha as far as I've heard, but I personally very much prefer having a shielder in my team. Would Thoma be an okay replacement for Xiangling or Bennett or maybe even Kazuha without losing too much damage?
I haven't fully leveled him but I gave him guilded dreams artifacts for burgeon, I also how I got him at c13😂, haven't build a burgeon since I suck with out survivability at burgeon, Xingqui's heal is not cutting for me, Bennett, Diona, and Kuki are my built healers
Really annoyed that Mihoyo switched Thoma to the Eula/Klee banner instead of Kokomi/Wanderer like it was initially leaked. Dreams of upgrading to C4 Thoma shattered.
Thoma, yanfei, klee are all slight upgrades over diluc so its okay not to use them. What matters are just the EM and levels for the burgeon dmg. The reason diluc is slightly worse is just the need to use his very long burst animation to gain pyro infusion for his normal attacks. Thoma can allow xingqiu to delay his E a bit later to start thoma abilities for burgeon sooner. Yanfei and klee just have innate pyro normal attacks so dont have to use their E or Q.
I want his remaining cons (he’s C3), especially his C4 since it should make his energy needs totally manageable for me. But I missed C1 Kazuha, so now I’m guaranteed, and I really don’t want Eula or Klee. Aaaaaaaaaah.
A word of warning about Burgeon Thoma's ER needs. Running Kitain Cross doesn't allow you to consistently get your burst back depending on the enemies you're facing. My c6 Thoma has 180% ER (ER sands) plus r2 Kitain is not always self sufficient which was a huge letdown for me. It even brought his total EM down to 662 just to get that ER and it's still not consistent. I have not been able to 36* this abyss with him even if the second side is extra burgeon friendly. My Nahida national team way outperforms him and is able to 36*. I guess that is why I see a lot of people using Bennett to battery Thoma in burgeon teams which seems like a huge waste to me. Maybe if I ran more fav weapons on other characters, or if you run with quick-swappy units and can get another skill in mid rotation. Either way I just want to put that warning out there. If you are used to Kuki/Raiden hyperbloom, Thoma is going to feel really really scuffed no matter your investment. The rotation is slightly different with Kitain too since it steals your energy when you use your skill, so ideally you should ult first and then skill and stay to catch the particles. It can't steal energy if you're at 0, so it's a net gain.
hmmm. idk cause i have less ER around 172 than you and just a single fav, and even at r2 kitain i was able to get my burst back on cooldown. maybe c4 makes a difference here or maybe because the team i played involved barbara-Xingqiu-Fav Nahida and Thoma since that team is very quickswappy. and yeah normally if i do burgeon thoma i just do q first then e cause so that i get the energy back.
@@usmanya5110 Yeah it depends on what kind of enemies you are facing. In most situations he is fine, but when you can't get that last bit of energy when your burst is out it feels really bad compared to something like Raiden or Kuki who never have that problem (pre C2 Kuki can feel a little scuffed due to having downtime). My Thoma is C6 so it's not a constellation issue. Maybe it's just me being spoiled by the comfort of hyperbloom.
I know most of his team comp.. is in burgeon. But I am using him with Kazuha, as just a pyro applicator and shielder.. I wonder if I am using him right.
I have 170 but he catches his own particles plus fav and I have fav on my team. 200 sounds about right. It is team, rotation, and number of fav dependant. Also mine is juuust short of enough
Everyone : thomas is good at burgeon jello : he is better than everyone think also jello : i teach you thomas best is burgeon and mostly even isnt that great but thats it also vaguely other stuff but yeah burgeon, see everyone was wrong lol
I have to disagree on his shielding power. I love Thoma and i have him on full shield batterymode with hp weapon and artifacts and ult on cd in yoimia team and his shield melts like butter on talent level 10. So be warned if you are looking for xhongli replacement. It will not happen.
Thoma was never really "bad" he was just "unnecessary" for the time he came out. Only Hu Tao could really utilize him or I guess Klee in mono pyro but TankFei always existed so there was that, and TankFei wouldn't fuck up your vapes on Hu Tao, granting the same benefits. Thoma had the longer lasting, and stronger shield overall, but he was an absolute mess before C4 where he'd get the energy refund. Basically, he was just kinda...there...unfortunately, HYV classically not having a fucking clue of how their players play, made him ascend with ATTACK of all things, instead of ER, EM, or HP which would have been infinitely better. He's...strange. he's only good because of Burgeon, deadass. Also Yelan exists now so stealing Hu Tao's vapes isn't a thing if you run XQ and Yelan together with Hu Tao. He just suffers from the problem of never really needing him, nor something he's truly made for or BiS for. Burgeon thank god works with his quick fire waves, but that's not intended, it just happens to work out. If he had Dehya level procs he'd be shit as well, but thankfully, the gods allowed him to have a quick fire wave lol.
It’s true he was kinda cope with vv hu Tao compared to yanfei, especially without c6. He as always good for vv with yoimiya though. Also I don’t understand what you mean by he just happens to work with dendro. To make a reaction as complicated as dendro, they were likely working on it since release. You think they just slapped it together in a couple months? I would be absolutely shocked if they didn’t test Thoma with dendro before releasing him
@@JelloImpact If he was meant to be used alongside Dendro, like Yae and Kuki, they would have baked EM into his kit or had some kind of EM or HP:EM kind of interaction, but they didn't. The ONLY reason he works with Dendro is because 1: off field application and 2: QUICK application, allowing for enough burgeons to happen. Thoma has literally nothing in his kit related to EM or Dendro reactions whatsoever. It just so happens that his kit ALSO works good with Burgeon. It basically is a happy accident. Yae and Kuki both have Elemental mastery boosts or scalings in their kits that allow them to take advantage of Spread/Aggravate or Hyperbloom. Yae's turrents specifically target bloom cores, while Fischl's Oz does not. If they were "working on it since release" as much as you say they were...then why doesn't Beidou and Fischl interact with the bloom cores as well? Certainly, they would have taken this into consideration if it's as you say it is. No. Thoma just happens to work with Burgeon off of lucky, happy chance. I'm glad that he does, but don't pretend he was built for it in any way. He would have had EM scaling as ascension or had EM tacked on like Nahida and Al Haitham do in their kits. Everything he does damage wise is built off of ATK strictly. Everything he does defensively, HP based. This is unlike Kuki where you have interplay between EM and HP. Or Yae where she straight up gets dmg bonus from having EM, coincidentally being the stat most valuable for Dendro based reactions.
@@JelloImpact This would also mean that Klee was designed with Dendro in mind and my man...that's just...mega cap. Same thing as Burgeon Diluc. It FUNCTIONS but it sure as hell wasn't intended...it's just usable. Klee and Diluc are early units with very little ICD, for example Diluc's E has no ICD and therefore vapes every use. Same with Klee's Jumpty Dumpty and I believe her CAs.
i built him, gave him tons of different sets and types of team and in the end the only viable team is a burgeon team...The rest we have better units, hu tao vape Tankfei is better, with Geo, again, bennet and tankfei with ttds or xangling are way better. He is one of those copium chars, for map exploration anything goes.
I hate when people say "When compared to bennett" well obviously they're not bennett. If you want to play bennett play bennett. Hoyo wont make another bennett cause he's broken. If they could change one thing they'd make him a five star
To think there was a time where Thoma was the worst 4 star character in the game and the worst pyro character in the game. Now those positions are used by Dori and Dehya respectively.
Pretty sure it is Xinyan, both before and after. Dori can at least be played as a scuffed hyperbloom trigger. Xinyan has no use cases, her best team is her getting hard carried by 3 of the best units in the game.
Thoma was never the worst 4*. And there were still wrose 5* Aloy exists Xinyan exists Amber exists (yes Elegy Amber is good in Hu Tao but this is not Amber being good it's Elegy being good and Amber is just a Pyro for a VV set up) Qiqi still existed Ningguang exists. Yes she has some very niche 12s rotation teams that almost nobody plays and that aren't that great in the end. Thoma was still more useful as flexibel shielder.
Can we please stop pretending Genshin doesn’t know what they’re doing when it comes to characters? Mkay? Let’s take focus off that and direct it towards other issues. Like their character pull system.
![DON'T BUILD HIM WRONG! Full Thoma Guide & Review [Best Artifacts, Weapons, Teams] - Genshin Impact](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LUU_9PLlETU/mqdefault.jpg)
Forgot to mention 3 things:
- kuki is a good 4th slot on the burgeon team (more comfy, fischl is higher damage)
- ayato is a solid on fielder for Thoma burgeon
- for kitain cross spear use burst 1st then skill as opposed to usually using skill first
Some characters can utilize kitain or the claymore counterpart by doing the skill - burst way tho.. just have to be fast..
I use that claymore for dori and i always do the skill-burst combo instead of burst-skill
He got a banger theme song, amazing shield and an insane machine for burgeon! Love this guy!
It really is such a good song
i was so heartbroken when i found out he was on this banner half and not with wanderer and kokomi. he is so cute and the perfect husband and i really wanted to c6 him but but rip i cant pull on this awful banner 😢
Yeah it’s kind of criminal he’s not with wanderer
I risked it. I'm on guaranteed. And still pulled caused I was at C3 already and his C4 is his best cons for Burgeon because of the energy refund.
Same, I've been saving primos for quite a while because most 3.0 units didn't really interest me and was really hoping to cash in hard on the Kokomi banner, since I want her, Faruzan and Thoma. I guess my Thoma will stay C4 for a bit longer now :(
Same, Hoyoverse did us dirty on this one ☹
I want thoma, but wouldn't risk it since I'm saving up for Wriothesley..
I just hope the next time he got a rerun, it is with ayato..
I mean cmon, ayato & thoma is close lore wise, works nicely with ayato as a NA buffer / shielder with C6 in NA non reaction team, and in burgeon..
Thank you so much for the guide! Finally got my Thoma (risked it all to get him riiight while Furina is around the corner lol) and while I am not brave enough to attempt getting his c6 this time, I legit can't wait to play him. Thank you so much and glhf!
Great timing, I just used Thoma for the first time yesterday and was shocked how fun and good he is. I only have him at 60 but he still was helpful so I'm excited to upgrade him.
Thoma is one of my favourite.
I currently play him physical with Raiden’s signature weapon.
I think at some point I will give him a second build tailored for burgeon teams, alone with a few crowns. He deserves it.❤
“I would leave his talents at level 6”
Me who double crowned Thoma 👀
If Thoma is full EM, there is a reason to level up the skill and burst to help with the shield so at least no damage from burgeon.
I CANT BELIEVE YOU DONT HAVE CHILDE YET! When you get him, you'll be in for a treat. He is so amazingly fun. International is the only Xiangling team besides Klee that I am not bored of yet. Childe makes you want to kill everything on the map every day. I can't wait to see the content you make when you get him.
International has been my main go to since I got Kazuha. Other team comps have gotten boring but International is always fun. I do play taser Childe and dendro teams with him too, but International is just too good.
Just got two Intertwined Fates from something and threw them at the banner and pulled him, lol. Wondering wether or not to start building him.
Really depends on the teams you want to build :)
Awesome review and thank you for the guide! Just a quick little thing, with Kitain Thoma in particular, it's usually recommended that he starts his rotation with Q then E because of how the weapon's passive works - Kitain initially drains some energy on E but gradually restores more than what it drained, but this passive still activates even with zero energy
Anyway burgeon Thoma very fun to play and I hope more people love it too
Yaaa forgot to mention that. Unless you have a ton of ping 😭
@@JelloImpact oh yeah XD
I built Thoma for a shield when I first got him and used him, but since dendro's release, I have been using him a lot more.
bro i love your videos because you talk nonstop it’s so good in the background. your videos are like attending a lecture lmao. in all seriousness, i like the effort made into being informative, although i feel there’s still some areas of information lacking
Great guide! I'm enjoying your videos and your philosophies!
A tip for your videos: Put your talking head box in the bottom left corner so you're not blocking elements on the screen.
The second half of the current abyss caused me to finally level up my C6 Thoma, who up til this point had gone unused, & I’m so glad I did! I used him as a burgeon trigger along with Nahida, Xingqiu, and Bennett. Thoma, along with the others, proved invaluable in ripping through all of those very pesky hydro and cryo shields!
Aside from that, I’m also now trying out C6 Thoma in my C1R1 Wanderer team. Up until now, I ran Wanderer with C6 Faruzan, Bennett, and Zhongli - but now with C6 Thoma built up, he may substitute well for the Zhongli spot!
he's good with burgeon but I think most ppl prefer on field pyros like klee hu tao etc. due to the er issues, more em and flexible pyro app for shield breaking
some of his most popular teams these days is support for wanderer or xiao
hu Tao for burgeon is alright the reason it's not better . Klee is a possible contender but she can't be used off field. and people would rather run dendro or hydro units as the onfielders. the real contender obviously for Thoma burgeon is the Bennett and Kazuha Combo. there's diluc and Xiangling but xiangling can be a pain since she triggers pyro too much and also if not alot more energy hungry than Thoma. Diluc well it's not bad, but is it worth to sacrifice personal damage for burgeon damage especially for non em scaled units?
Came here after getting him C6 from Wriothesley's banner. I'm starting to think it might be worth to build him and pair him with Wriothesley. Thoma's C6 seems perfect for a melt team and vaporize team
Wrio Nahida Benny Thoma
I use Wanderer with Thoma. He is better than Zhongli on that team. Some of the reasons why he is better than Zhongli are not obvious. For example Zhongli resist shred does not work at long range and Tenacity is c6 Faruzan best set which works a lot better than on Zhongli so he does not have a set he can use effectively. Thoma is also far better supplying energy to Bennett and Bennett to Thoma. This is also really minor but Thoma provides a source of pyro swirls which actually matters a little bit when trying to destroy certain shields or cryo armor. He is also slightly better than Zhongli at using the Fav lance imo. Doing an E + Q + NA gives you 4 chances to proc Fav lance in a fairly quick manner.
I built him for Hu Tao because I don't want to roll for Zhongli. Pleasantly surprised that he is a regular now for my Abyss clears.
Personally i think noelle is an amazing driver in a burgeon team with nahida, xingqiu and thoma. She heals, shields and removes burning so you can generate more seeds. But favonius is a must on her
for sure.
yep! nobody mentions her. there are many characters that are not mentioned by youtubers, like Yanfei, Layla, etc.
i enjoy using him with childe and Nahida not the best but it works. just at 173er, Kitain and a single fav is enough for him. sometimes the last slot is flex Bennett for nuking or a dendro healer for extra EM. his biggest weakness would be his energy needs and how con reliant he feels.
edit:i forgot to mention about how E then Q would probably be harder. since you have to be fast enough to proc the burst otherwise Thoma collects the particles while the burst is fully charged but not activated.
Only have him C0 but I like him cause I can pair him with my future Burgeon team with Ayato and have an almost entirely Inazuma team while keeping as much of the Kamisato clan together as I can.
Got him to C6 during his release while wishing for Hu Tao. He just kept coming home. And since I didn’t have Zhongli at the time, he was perfect for my Hu Tao team. I benched him when I got Zhongli, but I started using him again when Dendro came. I love using him for burgeon. I used this burgeon team for the current abyss and it made it so easy to clear the second half of floor 12. Also, I use him with Wanderer, Faruzan, and Bennett.
Other than that, he has great personality and is a total husbando. Overall, I love Thoma so much!
built him for the 3.7 abyss cuz burgeon was highly recommended for the second half of f12 and i was pleasantly surprised. definitely using him more from now on
I’ve been a day one Thoma main and it’s nice to see he has risen up thanks to Dendro, and seeing people say he and Childe work well is so weird to me because I’ve been doing that since 2.2. 😅
I loved using Thoma before the release of Dendro. I normally use him in my Hu tao team, Scara team and Ayato vapourize team.
I've leveled Thoma and kept him in my main lineup since his release and he's an amazing support! Everything about him flows well for a 4* and his animations look amazing.
If only there was a Sacrificial Lance in the game. He would probably become one of the most used characters since his only weakness is long CD and energy issues.
i hope if there is some kind of sacrificial lance i hope it's em or er based. the problem with it being em based means that characters like Mika can't use it.
Because I don't see anyone else talking about this I feel like I'm missing something that everyone else sees: What about Candace in the hydro slot? She gives hydro infusion which doesn't conflict with Thoma's burst and would let him (or any other polearm/sword onfielder) make the dendro cores as long as there's enough off field dendro application.
Thoma se convirtió en uno de mis favoritos desde que salió, me alegró en extremo cuando dendro lo hizo tan poderoso 😊
I used Thoma for a while for my previous VV Hu Tao enabler since he was c6 and I had no Tankfei (still don't have her c4 yet sadly) or Elegy on Amber at the time. Nowdays he's got a nice place in Burgeon or for my Klee monopyro when I don't care to use Bennett.
Better VV vape with sucrose if xingqiu or ayato is in the team because it is easier. Kazuha has to be near the enemy so xingqiu orbitals can accidentally apply hydro. Kazuha VV vape with xingqiu and thoma have to do a N0 which is a normal attack that doesnt hit which activates thoma Q but not xingqiu Q. Thus, the timing is really tight.
I FORGOT ABOUT BURGEON WITH AYATO NOOOO
I was using Yae for elemental application in my mono anemo dps kazuha, heizou, faruzan team but just got c1Thoma in 1 10pull and the missing link in the team was resistance to interruption (plus solid elemental application as a need)... Thoma is kind of perfect (althogh I cannot use Hakushin on Heizou sadly).
I just rolled on Klee for the chance of getting Thoma, I was laughiong my as* off when I got him twice, like what are the chances lmao.
Try Ayato/Nahida/Kuki/Thoma in Abyss 2nd half; just make sure you have enough ER with your units by putting fav on Nahida and Thoma
Using Kuki isn't a waste with him because his shield is very weak when he is on a full EM build (but you still get the interrupt res), so running him with a healer is still optimal
Rotation would be Nahida EQ ~> Ayato Q ~> Thoma EQ (QE if on Kitain) ~> Kuki E ~> Ayato EN15 ~> finish with Nahida normals ~> repeat
The only downside is that you'd want two EM sets
I've been using him a lot lately especially in the current abyss second half. He's by and far the best burgeon trigger compared to existing options given his off field nature and slower application meaning less chance of burning. He's like pyro Kuki in a sense, however unlike Kuki, I feel Thoma has way more caveats. He's actually pretty high investment for a character you stack EM on. He obviously wants lvl 90 for reaction damage. He needs to level both his skill and burst for defensive utility compared to Kuki who only needs to level her E. He also has no innate EM scaling in his kit which doesn't make his shield stronger unlike Kuki's healing. His pyro app is tied to his burst and it can be hard to battery him because he's usually the only pyro. If you can't get enough ER through artifacts then he wants C4. His BIS is R5 Kitain which you need 5 polearm billets for. With all that being said, if you can check all those boxes he's pretty darn good, though his slow pyro app can be a double edged sword. Sometimes he can't break the cryo herald shields in time compared to Xiangling for example.
Yeah, for some reason I love burgeon so I ended up investing in him massively to get sufficient ER substats on a full EM gilded dreams. I kind of love that he was 4* unloved and became a beast
@@Zemos_zermos Yeah, I forgot to mention he does have his share of pros too compared to Kuki. Thoma is pretty unique in his role whereas there's more viable hyperbloom alternatives. He's more comfortable since he doesn't drain HP and has interrupt resist. Lastly, he buffs NA and CA with C6, a small but welcome buff.
9:40 Do crystallize-created shields not count for Geo resonance?? I thought they did.
I really want Thoma C4, just had him at C2 at the moment
I have C6 Razor at the moment, so I dont wanna be getting disappointed with his dupes
With Kitian Cross you go Burst > Skill otherwise you just grief your energy requirements because Kitian will drain the energy away which would prevent you from funneling + you wasting a lot of the Kitian energy.
Yes
I really wished thoma was on kokomi’s banner bc i wanted them both! Pulled on klee’s banner and he’s c3 rn, wish i could c4 him but i had to stop bc i’m close to soft pity :’)
Thanks for the video!
Tru using both Kuki and Thoma in the same team
I got him in 1 pull but this video is tempting me to pull for his cons. Too bad the 5 stars ain't for me. Saving my primos for 3.9 instead. Still it's pretty tempting though.
Stay strong!
Thoma is now rocking with my Chlorinde!
I used Kuki instead of fishl in all last abyss 3.8 2nd chambers
Personally my favorite Hydro that isn't Xingqiu/Yelan when pairing with Thoma Burgeon is Ayato. Collei/Traveler + a defensive Dendro (Baizhu >> Yaoyao >= Kirara) gives enough application to get at least one core popping off even in ST situations and the burning is a bit of a non-issue with a well-built Ayato dealing decent forward vape damage and having spaced out application to reset the Hydro/Dendro aura on enemies. There's also the advantage of off-field presence from Ayato and his consistency regardless of AoE or ST
Nahida can help free the flex slot for Shinobu/Fischl for extra damage, but I don't have her + I like a defensive option hence the ones I mentioned
5:29 Where is Kuki???!!!
I know people do that but it seems redundant to me and sort of a waste but I guess it makes sense
@@JelloImpact Redundant? Cus she heals and he shields so you don't need both? They both auto-attack things around them with their skills so they work together.
I run Wanderer as one of my mains and wanted Kokomi, so was a bit heartbroken that he was put on the opposite banner. I'll have to try to get more cons for him next time he's on a banner I want! I think he's only at c1 for me so I haven't really used him yet.
hey JELLO, one question... if i use off field characters and they are applying elements .. their EM counts as DMG? or just the final attack that triggers the reaction?
For something like Nilou , burgeon or hyperbloom, only the character that triggers the reaction (explodes the seed) EM will be considered regardless of on field or off field
got him c6 on his very first banner, double crowned. now that we have dendro, i dont actually have to cope very hard to make him good lol
Hmmm... I have Moonpiercer on Thoma and Kitain on Yaoyao... not the best plan?
i think what you could do is Yaoyao on moonpiercer and Thoma with kitain and then after moonpiercer's effect is triggered you can give it to xingqiu or anyone.
C1+C2=100% burst up time
Thoma is off-field so you can delay xingqiu E a bit later so thoma starts burgeoning a bit sooner in the rotation.
I just got Thoma but my question is, is he better that Xiangling? ( I'm new to genshin).
Overall I would say no but they’re totally different teams. Check out the teams section of this video and of the xiangling video and see which teams suit you more :)
@@JelloImpact Well the only problem I have with that is I don't have none of those characters lol and also I'm using Alhaitham as my main character but I appreciate the feedback and it was a good vid :)
im happy i can use Qiqi again on floor 12 because of him. I use Qiqi (fav/clam) Thoma / Xingqiu / Nahida
If I ever need a shield and Pyro in the same slot, my go-to pick is still going to be c4 Yanfei, though not everyone is going to have that constellation. But at the same time, I think it's more likely someone would have Yanfei's c4 than Thoma's c4.
Really depends for new players. But yes yanfei is great too. Uptime is not as good but still really good option
Problem with Yanfei is that she requires enormous ER when used as a shielder which cuts into her HP stats. I think she needs something like 300% ER to get her shield reliably.
I use thoma for my hu tao team and he is perfect for getting pyro resonance! His shields do the job and looking to c6 for 15% more dmg (charged)
He's a really good support for melt Ayaka if you use him with nahida
14:44 is enough ER to spam his shield?
there is a problem with using double dendro in burgeon especially if you are using nahida. nahida applies so much dendro just from off field that even c6 xingui barely keeps up. on field nahida is out of the world. that means there will always be a dendro aura on the enemy if you use nahida. when thoma applies pyro it will start a burning (simultaneous dendro+pyro aura) and now xingui has to extinguish the fire first before he can react with dendro to create a seed. now if you get a second dendro unit like baizhu you are guaranteed to generate significantly less seeds because at this point xingui will only be extinguishing burning and causing forward vaporize. so nahida solo is already too much dendro. you need to either increase your hydro or reduce your pyro. slotting in electro helps in latter by applying electro to pyro causing overload and completely removing the pyro. fischl is pretty decent but you can try on field lisa or yae for their faster application being catalyst users. it also synergizes with xingui's burst and thoma's c6 buff that require normal attack and it helps keep nahida off field to keep the dendro application in check because electro will also react with dendro keeping the overall seed generation optimal. i personally use lisa because her elemental burst electro application def shred is a big boost to nahida and xingui's dmg and she has highest catalyst attack speed resulting in faster application from normal attacks. on the other hand if one want to use nahida on field then a double hydro is a must because the limiting factor for creating seeds in nahida teams is hydro and not dendro itself. more hydro more seeds
I hear you and I know this theoretically but somehow it still just works fine 😭 see my last abyss clear in the a video.
@@JelloImpact haha i did and you and i both know that anything works for AR60 players 😅 but try using lisa or yae its pretty insane. i use the nahida xingui thoma (built with er/hp/hp) reaching 600 em after gilded buff. rock solid shield with 24k burgeons. they good part is lisa is built for quickbloom with em goblet. 70/170 crit with 600 em (after nahida em sharing) doing 22k hyperblooms. lisa applies so much electro that you see aggravate spread overload vaporize burgeon electrocharge and hyperblooms. its the most chaotic team. on top of that thoma built with hp+ xingui dmg reduction, i cleared consecrated beast floor afk gaming. lisa n3+ tap e infinite chain looping. its a blast 👌
@@srinivasbharadwaj95aha that’s not true, the team has Thoma on fav lance with EM, xingqiu with not even 200 crit value with fav sword, and a full HP kirara. Hardly carried by being AR 60, just a good team. But it’s definitely a blast!
@@JelloImpact oh your using kirara for strong shields. i just made my thoma hybrid for that reason. i sacrificed em main stats for hp with really good em rolls on substats basically making him "shieldbot" that claps 😅. got an R4 kitain. burgeon and hyperbloom have such a high floor that even 500 em makes my shieldbot do 23-24k burgeons. i make up for the lost damage by having a strong on field driver lisa in this case who loves a nice shield. what actually makes thoma so great is with the coming of dendro even a simple shieldbot thoma can dish out as much damage as some carries. imagine doing 24k damage per second for being a shielder 😶. ofcourse thats only in burgeon but thats still a great feat. love this character
With Thoma, nahida and xinquiu, I find that the most comfortable 4th slot is Kuki, she and Thoma end up sharing the bloom cores, and she heals quite a bit even with full em build
I watch a random guide and get Fontaine spoilers. Part of the cool thing of the early archon quests was hanging out with the archons unknowingly.
Apologies It just seemed obvious to me idk
As a wanderer main i'm playing a lot of monopyro team and i'm so sad he wasn't on this banner ☠️
I’ve been wanting thoma since I started playing and 60 wishes in he’s no where to be found. I don’t want eula or klee at all, like I want to lose a 50/50 before that, but for 4 stars I’ve only gotten 3 razors and 3 trash weapons in 60 pulls.
If you didn't have to farm those mushrooms i would build him up for sure. Still will. Passively farming beetles for heizo and maybe The mushrooms for thoma
At least Thoma's shrooms are easier farm compared to like
Stupid Rukkhashava Mushrooms
If it weren't for Thoma burgeon I would still be struggling with that disgusting 3.7 abyss.
One of my main teams is Hu Tao, Xingqiu, Kazuha, Diona. (I don't have Yelan or Zhongli)
And wanted to replace Diona with Thoma! (Or C4 Yanfei) so I can swirl Pyro using Kazuha and not sacrifice a shield.
But I pulled 9 Razers and 6 Mika's, and no Thoma's :(
And I pulled Klee, with an early Diluc after that so don't want to pull anymore, want to save for Kokomi.
Can I use YaoYao instead of Baizhu for the dendro healer with Nahida, Xingqui and Thoma ?
Do you think Xingqui is better than Yelan in this team because I already have Xingqui C4 and Yelan C0 ?
Pre-c6 xingqiu I would actually suggest kuki for a healer option which I should have talked about in the video. The electro helps burning from taking over. Same with Yelan I would go with kuki as the final slot
Koki is very good with him as well
With Alhaitham , is he a good option as a support?
i didn't even mean or want to get his constellations, but at the beginning of me plsying in may i somehow got c4...got c6 now with this banner, so, guess i might as well start building him now when hes my first c6 huh? lmfaoo i only have c3 xiangling even😭
Now with Lyney out who deals more dmg in mono pyro teams, I was wondering if I Thoma would be a good option in this team as my shielder? Lyney's best team is supposed to be Xiangling, Bennett and Kazuha as far as I've heard, but I personally very much prefer having a shielder in my team. Would Thoma be an okay replacement for Xiangling or Bennett or maybe even Kazuha without losing too much damage?
The way I’m so addicted to pulling ain’t no way I’m pulling on both Eula and Klee banner rather pull on the standard banner ✋
for wander + thoma team, which build is the best for him
I haven't fully leveled him but I gave him guilded dreams artifacts for burgeon, I also how I got him at c13😂, haven't build a burgeon since I suck with out survivability at burgeon, Xingqui's heal is not cutting for me, Bennett, Diona, and Kuki are my built healers
Really annoyed that Mihoyo switched Thoma to the Eula/Klee banner instead of Kokomi/Wanderer like it was initially leaked.
Dreams of upgrading to C4 Thoma shattered.
me who triple crown my Thoma 🤭❤️
the best house husband ❤❤
Please tell Flip he has to use my art as his profile, also nice vid.
This makes me want to try an alhaitham burgeon 🤔
i built Diluc for Burgeon team ...is Thoma an upgrade to him or should i stick with Batman .. my Thoma is just C3 for now ..
Hmm I think he’s an upgrade but whether it’s worth it for you depends on your other teams tbh
Thoma, yanfei, klee are all slight upgrades over diluc so its okay not to use them. What matters are just the EM and levels for the burgeon dmg. The reason diluc is slightly worse is just the need to use his very long burst animation to gain pyro infusion for his normal attacks. Thoma can allow xingqiu to delay his E a bit later to start thoma abilities for burgeon sooner. Yanfei and klee just have innate pyro normal attacks so dont have to use their E or Q.
I want his remaining cons (he’s C3), especially his C4 since it should make his energy needs totally manageable for me. But I missed C1 Kazuha, so now I’m guaranteed, and I really don’t want Eula or Klee. Aaaaaaaaaah.
Stay strong!!!
why nobody say anything about Noelle? why not having Zhongli we can only use Thoma?
That's not what ANYBODY has been saying at all
Daddy Thoma is daddier than Alhaitham.
How can your nextdoor nerd be daddier than litteral dad
@@inhinh7017 Hmmm... Loves books, scribe in the academia - the literal nerd. Nothing wrong being a need though.
A word of warning about Burgeon Thoma's ER needs. Running Kitain Cross doesn't allow you to consistently get your burst back depending on the enemies you're facing. My c6 Thoma has 180% ER (ER sands) plus r2 Kitain is not always self sufficient which was a huge letdown for me. It even brought his total EM down to 662 just to get that ER and it's still not consistent. I have not been able to 36* this abyss with him even if the second side is extra burgeon friendly. My Nahida national team way outperforms him and is able to 36*. I guess that is why I see a lot of people using Bennett to battery Thoma in burgeon teams which seems like a huge waste to me. Maybe if I ran more fav weapons on other characters, or if you run with quick-swappy units and can get another skill in mid rotation. Either way I just want to put that warning out there. If you are used to Kuki/Raiden hyperbloom, Thoma is going to feel really really scuffed no matter your investment.
The rotation is slightly different with Kitain too since it steals your energy when you use your skill, so ideally you should ult first and then skill and stay to catch the particles. It can't steal energy if you're at 0, so it's a net gain.
hmmm. idk cause i have less ER around 172 than you and just a single fav, and even at r2 kitain i was able to get my burst back on cooldown. maybe c4 makes a difference here or maybe because the team i played involved barbara-Xingqiu-Fav Nahida and Thoma since that team is very quickswappy. and yeah normally if i do burgeon thoma i just do q first then e cause so that i get the energy back.
@@usmanya5110 Yeah it depends on what kind of enemies you are facing. In most situations he is fine, but when you can't get that last bit of energy when your burst is out it feels really bad compared to something like Raiden or Kuki who never have that problem (pre C2 Kuki can feel a little scuffed due to having downtime). My Thoma is C6 so it's not a constellation issue. Maybe it's just me being spoiled by the comfort of hyperbloom.
I know most of his team comp.. is in burgeon. But I am using him with Kazuha, as just a pyro applicator and shielder.. I wonder if I am using him right.
For the overworld absolutely 👍🏻 give him lots of ER and HP
For the abyss it depends on the other team members
Thoma burgeon is perfect for those playing on mobile and need to clear abyss 12 second half. 😂
How much ER for shiledbot? 200-ish?
I have 170 but he catches his own particles plus fav and I have fav on my team. 200 sounds about right. It is team, rotation, and number of fav dependant. Also mine is juuust short of enough
Diluc next? 🙏
I use thoma with kazuha, nahida and childe.
I have him c6 unbuilt, I don't have wanderer
The new set!
Everyone : thomas is good at burgeon
jello : he is better than everyone think
also jello : i teach you thomas best is burgeon and mostly even isnt that great but thats it also vaguely other stuff but yeah burgeon, see everyone was wrong
lol
I have to disagree on his shielding power. I love Thoma and i have him on full shield batterymode with hp weapon and artifacts and ult on cd in yoimia team and his shield melts like butter on talent level 10. So be warned if you are looking for xhongli replacement. It will not happen.
Is he good for Hutao? I have him C6
Not as good as zhongli but still good
I like it best with Yelan and xingqiu. And I talk about vv vape in this team wjth xingqiu and sucrose or kazuha
Thoma was never really "bad" he was just "unnecessary" for the time he came out. Only Hu Tao could really utilize him or I guess Klee in mono pyro but TankFei always existed so there was that, and TankFei wouldn't fuck up your vapes on Hu Tao, granting the same benefits. Thoma had the longer lasting, and stronger shield overall, but he was an absolute mess before C4 where he'd get the energy refund. Basically, he was just kinda...there...unfortunately, HYV classically not having a fucking clue of how their players play, made him ascend with ATTACK of all things, instead of ER, EM, or HP which would have been infinitely better. He's...strange. he's only good because of Burgeon, deadass. Also Yelan exists now so stealing Hu Tao's vapes isn't a thing if you run XQ and Yelan together with Hu Tao. He just suffers from the problem of never really needing him, nor something he's truly made for or BiS for. Burgeon thank god works with his quick fire waves, but that's not intended, it just happens to work out. If he had Dehya level procs he'd be shit as well, but thankfully, the gods allowed him to have a quick fire wave lol.
It’s true he was kinda cope with vv hu Tao compared to yanfei, especially without c6. He as always good for vv with yoimiya though.
Also I don’t understand what you mean by he just happens to work with dendro. To make a reaction as complicated as dendro, they were likely working on it since release. You think they just slapped it together in a couple months? I would be absolutely shocked if they didn’t test Thoma with dendro before releasing him
@@JelloImpact If he was meant to be used alongside Dendro, like Yae and Kuki, they would have baked EM into his kit or had some kind of EM or HP:EM kind of interaction, but they didn't. The ONLY reason he works with Dendro is because 1: off field application and 2: QUICK application, allowing for enough burgeons to happen. Thoma has literally nothing in his kit related to EM or Dendro reactions whatsoever. It just so happens that his kit ALSO works good with Burgeon. It basically is a happy accident. Yae and Kuki both have Elemental mastery boosts or scalings in their kits that allow them to take advantage of Spread/Aggravate or Hyperbloom. Yae's turrents specifically target bloom cores, while Fischl's Oz does not. If they were "working on it since release" as much as you say they were...then why doesn't Beidou and Fischl interact with the bloom cores as well? Certainly, they would have taken this into consideration if it's as you say it is. No. Thoma just happens to work with Burgeon off of lucky, happy chance. I'm glad that he does, but don't pretend he was built for it in any way. He would have had EM scaling as ascension or had EM tacked on like Nahida and Al Haitham do in their kits. Everything he does damage wise is built off of ATK strictly. Everything he does defensively, HP based. This is unlike Kuki where you have interplay between EM and HP. Or Yae where she straight up gets dmg bonus from having EM, coincidentally being the stat most valuable for Dendro based reactions.
@@JelloImpact This would also mean that Klee was designed with Dendro in mind and my man...that's just...mega cap. Same thing as Burgeon Diluc. It FUNCTIONS but it sure as hell wasn't intended...it's just usable. Klee and Diluc are early units with very little ICD, for example Diluc's E has no ICD and therefore vapes every use. Same with Klee's Jumpty Dumpty and I believe her CAs.
i built him, gave him tons of different sets and types of team and in the end the only viable team is a burgeon team...The rest we have better units, hu tao vape Tankfei is better, with Geo, again, bennet and tankfei with ttds or xangling are way better. He is one of those copium chars, for map exploration anything goes.
I hate when people say "When compared to bennett" well obviously they're not bennett. If you want to play bennett play bennett. Hoyo wont make another bennett cause he's broken. If they could change one thing they'd make him a five star
Letsgoooo!
Commenting for the algorithm
You’re a gem
They keep putting Thoma on terrible banners!! I want him so bad hoping for the next time.
To think there was a time where Thoma was the worst 4 star character in the game and the worst pyro character in the game.
Now those positions are used by Dori and Dehya respectively.
Pretty sure it is Xinyan, both before and after. Dori can at least be played as a scuffed hyperbloom trigger.
Xinyan has no use cases, her best team is her getting hard carried by 3 of the best units in the game.
Thoma was never the worst 4*. And there were still wrose 5*
Aloy exists
Xinyan exists
Amber exists (yes Elegy Amber is good in Hu Tao but this is not Amber being good it's Elegy being good and Amber is just a Pyro for a VV set up)
Qiqi still existed
Ningguang exists. Yes she has some very niche 12s rotation teams that almost nobody plays and that aren't that great in the end. Thoma was still more useful as flexibel shielder.
My biggest gripe is that he looks way more bad ass than he appears. Look doesn’t match the personality
Can we please stop pretending Genshin doesn’t know what they’re doing when it comes to characters? Mkay? Let’s take focus off that and direct it towards other issues. Like their character pull system.
Yea everyone hates this guy for some reason lol. If you ask on discord social servers if they built Thoma it’s always hell nah.
errr, still a bad unit.