BATMAN RETURNS + BATMAN 4K UHD BLU-RAY REVIEW
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- Опубликовано: 15 сен 2022
- In planning this review of Batman Returns (1992) I decided that it was not possible to cover it fully without also including the 1989 original 'Batman'. Hence the 1989 film is included despite having done a full review of the 4K of Batman about 18 months previously.
Sound is Dolby Atmos and the image aspect ratio is approximately 1.85.1 although the box inlay cover does have a mistake where it states the aspect ratio is 2.40:1 so keep a lookout for that.
My original review of the 1989 film can be seen here: • BATMAN (1989) 4K UHD B... 
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Batman Returns plays out like a beautiful dream. I love all the snowy scenes and the gloss black Batmobile pushing through the snow. I watch this film every Christmas. I'm currently working on a full size Batman Returns figure for my theater room. Just need a few more costume pieces and a mannequin to put it all together. 🙂
I like the sound of the full size Batman figure James. Do me one too please! John.
My favorite Batman film
@@thischannelisdeleted Quite a few people are telling me that Deleted. It certainly is more highly regarded than when it was new and that's a bit of a relief.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 Although in my experience I’d say I’m in the very few minority to even consider it lol
@@thischannelisdeleted If you have a look through some of the comments on here you'll find that there's about a 50/50 split on those who prefer the 1989 film and those who prefer the sequel. John.
If you love the HDR effect, then go back and look at the scene with Batman and Catwoman talking on the coach in front of that roaring fire. HDR has been such a game changer for movie lovers like me. Another more subtle effect of HDR is how Catwoman's leather suit reflects light, that white studio light really pops off her outfit in HDR. Back in the 90's gigantic fireball explosions were mandatory in most action movies, and Batman returns is no exception. I was tired of fireaball explosions, but HDR made it all brand new to me. The fire itself just looks so much brighter, vibrant, and more detailed. Also, Tim Burton uses weird comic book type lighting in his Batman movies, and it creates a surreal effect when you add in HDR. The HDR isn't the only game changer for me. The increase in resolution is also something my eyes can appreciate, not all people can tell the difference I suppose. But for me I can clearly see more resolution in skin and hair, for instance go and watch the closeup shot of Batman and Catwoman slow dancing at Shrek's party. Their skin texture and hair look totally different and more detailed from the regular blu-ray. Never have I seen closeups like this before 4k and it's amazing. I don't have the first Batman on 4k so that is why I didn't comment on that one.
What a great post Jay - thank you. I suppose I hadn't really noticed these high dynamic range enhancements as much as I should have but I have been screening film throughout the video age and that's possibly why. HDR certainly does make video look more like film and although it hasn't quite achieved the same rich, saturated look it's come damned close. I expect some colours are even richer at times thanks to being able to pick out individual areas of the image to grade them in a computer which wasn't possible with film. I think the 1989 film has a nicer look to it than the sequel but the 1992 film is incredibly sharp for a 35mm production. Whether or not that's been achieved in a computer or because it was really fine grain film stock is open to question but there's a comment a few messages below from thecatdrum3 that possibly confirms it's due to fine grain film.
John.
Two brilliant Movies on two brilliant 4K Discs. Another great video, thanks John.
Thank you LeShark. Batman Returns looks so sharp that I'm a bit suspicious... I'm probably wrong though. John.
Another great review John, keep them coming. I’ve just recently spent an absolute fortune on 4k discs as a treat to myself, including all these older Batman films. I’m looking forward to binge watching these but at the moment my Denon receiver in in for repair so cannot watch in surround sound at the moment. Really frustrating as normal tv sounds so flat without the subwoofer and speakers in use and these films need to be heard in all their glory as well as seen. As usual, your knowledge and ability to explain brings nothing but respect. All the best. Pete
Thank you Griffin. I think what you've just said proves that we all need to have more that one surround sound amplifier just in case something ever goes wrong. I've got four systems but one of them dates back to 1991 so I think most people would think that was inadequate. It's been doing duty on my 35mm projector for the past 20 years or so. I hope you get your Denon back soon and have a great time with the Batman films.
John.
I miss the gothic style of Burton's Batman movies, when I think of Batman I'm reminded of Burton's world. Batman Returns has great HDR btw, the Xmas decorations in Gotham really pop on my Oled.
You mean they explode ThelWebb because I didn't spot that? It does have some rich colours at times but both the Burton movies have that gothic look with the first film enjoying a richer look to the colder look of the sequel. John.
Cheers John. 89 Batman was the first cinema experience that truly blew me away, aged 10. I still suspect that showing at the Cannon cinema ignited my love of film. Also, often overlooked it bagged an Oscar for the art direction.
It's hard to believe the sets weren't more recognized than they were but it's just looking at the attempt to re-create them in the sequel that made me fully realize just how good they were. Pinewood and Sheppterton are a class apart when it comes to that sort of thing. John.
I dare you to do "Batman and Robin" next , John. In all.seriousness I love "Batman Returns" - it's a Christmas favourite in our house.
I do have Batman and Robin on DVD Dan. I think I bought that because I managed to miss it in the cinema. Or it might have been to re-record the Super 8 trailer which is a bit of a stunner but had rather poor sound. Terrible film really but it sounds great. John.
@@moviecollector5920 For what its worth, Batman & Robin "looks" gorgeous in 4K. The colors are insanely good and pop really well.
@@Danbo22987 I have it on DVD Danbo and the sound is fabulous. I haven't watched it in years though so can't recall much about it other than it was all a bit silly. I do have the trailer on Super 8 though and that's fabulous. It's better to say 'rich' colours by the way. I think the word 'pop' was used for things popping off the screen in 1950's 3D films. It seems to be getting crossed over into colours popping off the screen which they never do unless it's a 3D film. Rich, vibrant, vivid... can't think of any more descriptive words for strong colours. John.
Thanks for the review John. Back in 92, parents in the USA were up in arms that this sequel was being marketed to kids via happy meals. Of course, this movie has aged quite well, and I think it's a very strong sequel. Too bad Tim Burton never got to make a trilogy with Keaton.
It's almost laughable how times have changed Mandeep. Today you put the telly on and we have sexual related material rammed down our throats all the time and some of it is quite nauseating really. A few risque remarks in a film in 1992 and it generated a fairly major backlash. Perhaps we could do with a bit of a return to 1992 just to clean up television a little. However, I would question why any parent would be taking a child to McDonald's in the first place. Should have stuck to the Wimpy Bar!!! John.
@@moviecollector5920 Wimpy was my favourite hamburger joint! When it had vanished from the Netherlands, I made sure to pay a visit whenever I was in Great Britain and relive part of my childhood.
@@Piece-O-Pie I too loved the Wimpy Bar when it was a sit down restaurant and the food wasn't handed to you in soggy bits of card and paper. Remember those curly sausages with the sections cut out on the outside? We were only ever taken there occasionally for a treat but today youngsters are in McDonalds eating unhealthy processed food regularly and our bodies don't deal with processed foods well.... but I won't go into that on here.
John.
Hey John another great review. I saw both films at a packed largest cinema In the world. It was an amazing experience. I have always had a slight preference for Batman terms. I love how dark its tone is. The first film has always struggled with the weight of the Jack Nicholson presence. I owned both films on laser disk and they looked great in the old format. After seeing your wonderful review I’ll be adding these to my shopping list. The seamstress is getting very crafty. She secretly had more wood delivered to the home theater Saturday is now completely out of commission 😂 Congratulations on the impending 20 K subscriber mark. Rob
Until I watched the 1989 film again for the first time in years (about 18 months ago) I always struggled with the second half of the film because I felt there was too much Joker in it. It's funny how I didn't find the same thing but I think that's because I was laughing at Jack Nicholson's portrayal so much now that I'm older and it was lost on me when I was younger. I suppose I just wanted to see Batman and I didn't appreciate the villain stealing so much of the show. I was also expecting not to like the second half so that probably helped too.
Fortunately, my seamstress has been behaving herself so we will be in the cinema this evening.
John.
As luck would have it my local cinema is going to be showing this on the big screen this coming weekend to mark 30 years. Awesome.
I hope they've got a 35mm print for the occasion Chucky_boy because there are still copies of the best films around in private collections and archives. That would make the screening really special. John.
Thanks for another great review. Love ‘em.
Thank you Brick Vader. The next video should be interesting because it's going to be a Star Wars retrospective. I've been writing a load of notes this morning and over lunch. Trying to check some of my recollections with other film historians right now so that I don't get anything too horribly wrong.
John.
I finished watching these a few weeks ago. The PQ on all four is Superb. The AQ on all four is very impressive also.
I haven't seen the third and fourth films in 4K but if there anything like the first two then you're appraisal in spot on Steven. John.
Great stuff as always John. There is a scene at the beginning when the penguins' parents are on their way to dispose of him via the sewers. As they cross a little stone bridge, Gotham towers above them, and between Elfmans score and Burtons (then) unique visual style it can truly take the breath away. Although its baggy in places, I totally agree with you regards the villains, as in too many, it's also got a lot going for it.
I thought it was strange when they made such a fuss recently regards Ben Afflecks Batman killing criminals during Batman v Superman. Didn't they see the first ten minutes of this one.
Regards
Because I read Batman such a lot as a youngster I don't even notice when Batman kills a baddie because that's what he did. The deaths tended to be accidents I suppose but the first two Batman films seemed to capture the spirit of those comics in that regard. So, I'm with you there Gary. John.
Lovely video John. I know that the 4K scanning really accentuates the film grain so they have to take it back to what it should look like. I guess they don't always get it right.
I think it's a great film. Danny does such a creepy job as the Penguin.
It seems even now, Hollywood seem to rush to get loads of characters in instead of taking their time.
The same happened with Man Of Steel as far as I'm concerned. Then going straight into Superman Vs Batman.
Loved you Teal joke 😆
Take it easy.
Trevor
I was determined to keep a straight face when talking about Teals and Penguins and I think I managed to carry it off. I was chuckling when we went for a walk this afternoon as I'd seen the finished video by then and I've got a dry sense of humour (as you've probably found out by now). Hopefully Warner Bros. will give me a call to set up a new middle-aged Batman film with Tim Burton directing Michael Keaton and Michelle Pfeiffer. I'll insist them make it at Pinewood though so that we can sure the sets are the best they can possibly be, just like in the 1989 film. John.
Great vid as always John. Remember watching this on vhs in 92. A quick question if I may, just found out an old tv series back in my childhood is being remastered from original camera negatives from 16mm to blu- ray, just wondering what we could expect and is it worth the effort coming from 16mm? Best Danny
Morning Danny. Don't underestimate 16mm. A lot depends on the lenses and the negative stock used at the time but usually the results are excellent. Super 8 was almost HD quality so you shouldn't be disappointed as the frame size on 16mm film is about three times that of Super 8.
John.
Was 8 years old on release and I loved it along with the 89 Batman, Whatever they make in the future they'll never beat the old ones for me 👍🏻
Just that opening 20 minutes or half an our in the original film does it all for me Ron because that is Batman as he should always be played and portrayed. The Christopher Nolan trio were damned fine films though, particularly the third one with all that genuine IMAX. Who ever would have thunk it... Batman in genuine IMAX? John.
@@moviecollector5920 Can't argue there the Nolan trilogy is hard to beat and the Dark Knight rises as a whole is on another level 👍🏻
Greetings from Canada 🇨🇦!
I recently saw Batman Returns 🦇 🐈⬛ 🐧 in a hotel room. I could believe how good the 1080p version looked on a crappy tv! I couldn’t take my eyes off it! I hadn’t seen this movie since it came out in theatres. It was heart warming to me that it still held up after all these years. I played the stuffing out of those McDonald’s happy meal Batman toys! Batmobile with the launching cockpit was my favourite
Damn it Jeremy, I didn't know the burger joint was giving away Batmobiles or else I'd have even gone in there. What I'd really like though is a full size version. John.
My favourite Batman movie. I loved the creepiness of it. Tim Burton knew how to make Batman dark like it’s supposed to be and setting it at Christmas? Even better. I must check out this 4K disc. Thank you John.
What is amazing about this disc is the almost complete absence of film grain but there is no apparent loss of detail. If I had a 35mm print I might change my opinion on that but it looked completely natural to me even though it obviously wasn't. A great disc. I think I prefer the quality of the 4K disc of the original 1989 film though as that retained a look more akin to its original 35mm look. See what you think.
John.
Two of my favourite movies. I’ve always thought that BR had that ‘set’ feel (the main square with the Christmas tree is a visual that always pops into my mind when I think of this movie); sometimes I love it, sometimes I wish it was filmed at a bigger scale. I haven’t seen Batman 89 in 4K yet, but I thought Batman Returns looked great; if there was any DNR applied, I didn’t notice. (I still notice the gravestone wiggling when Penguin bumps into it, though). Thanks for the review.
The scenes around the main square/town hall are the ones that really stand out as being a set but the whole reproduction of downtown Gotham was a smaller scale to the previous enormous set at Pinewood. The Batmobile just didn't have the same space to move around in and it all feels a little too compressed. Far fewer extras to simulate a crowded city centre too. But the biggest downfall is that the 4K is so good that it enhances all these things. The 1989 film isn't quite so sharp and has better sets with more extras around so it doesn't suffer so much. There is image noise reduction applied to all scans of films, it just depends on how much has been applied but usually the people doing the work get things spot on. Where too much has been applied, as in the Blu-ray for Predator, was because it was using the same master that had been created for a 3D release. Amazingly no prosecutions were brought for that one!!!
John.
Another great video. I will always prefer the 1st Keaton Batman film as it was the first one I ever saw as a youngster and it completely blew my mind. It was truly an experience I haven't been able to duplicate since.
When I first saw that 1989 Batman I thought it went a bit over the top in the second hour but these days it doesn't give me that impression. Today I think Jack Nicholson was just about perfect as The Joker and I can't see anyone else ever matching up in the same role. John.
Another great review John, and Batman returns is one of my childhood classics, back from the era of Don Lafontaine narrated movie trailers & the ice cream intervals.
That man's voice was so distinctive. He seemed to narrate almost every trailer in the 1990's. Now then Leon, I've got to go as wifey's just brought my tub of ice cream in! John.
@@moviecollector5920 enjoy John! 😋🍦
Great video, thanks. I enjoy the original film more but the music score on this one is amazing and I listen to it frequently.
Thank you Matt. That Danny Elfman chap has done some wonderful work over the years and I think the Batman themes have to be up there among his best. John.
Great review, I loved both films and watched both at the cinema with my wife, memories......☺️
I did too but I just can't remember where I saw the second film which is rather odd. I remember that I didn't like it much back then. John.
what a coincidence, John! the Orpheum cinema here in Sydney is doing a double feature of Batman and batman returns TODAY.
Great review, I haven't viewed these discs in full just yet, but I have browsed through the chapters when I first received the discs. I feel Batman Returns had too much digital noise reduction added, because there is just hardly any grain and looks a little clay-like at points.
I've got the 35mm screening of Pulp Fiction to film up in the booth this Monday (sunday for you). So it will be nice to get such a popular film uploaded to the channel.
I'll try get a shot of the projector, then panning into the porthole to show the dancing sequence (which is definitely the best part of the entire film)
Have a great day, John!
Before I'd got to the end of your comment Clark I was going to ask that you try to get a few seconds of the dancing sequence through the porthole. Travolta really went up in my estimation for that piece of self-mockery magic.
I do wonder if there's been a little more image noise reduction in Batman Returns than there would be normally but thecatdrum3 has commented about the LaserDiscs and how the structure does appear to give evidence to the film being shot on really fine grain negative stock. I did feel that on occasion the waxy look had crept onto the actors faces but I'm happy to be proved wrong about that. Whatever the case, it is a fabulous cine to video transfer even if I prefer the more natural, warmer look of the 1989 film.
Have a good time at The Orpheum tomorrow. It's great that you're getting to capture all this movie magic which we see so rarely anywhere today.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 I'll definitely be getting a couple seconds of the dance sequence through the port.
I suppose I was wrong, its not DNR, it's just very good film stock! fantastic images for a film stock from the 90s.
@@ClarkTeddles From the early 80's I think Kodak started turning out some really fine grain negative stock and other producers followed suit. But there will undoubtedly be some noise reduction applied to because we've been told there always is. How much is what we don't know.
John.
Great review as always John. Wasn't the UK version of the film cut slightly ? I heard it was cut in a scene where an aerosol can put in a microwave. I haven't watched my region 1 DVD for years and can't remember it.
That scene is certainly in this version Steve and I commented on it because a tin can in a microwave would surely just knacker the microwave oven itself. After all, the nuke wouldn't go through the metal so there would be a lot of sparks followed by a fuse blowing or something along those lines. A but nuts but it's a comic book and Batman is hardly based in reality to start with.
John.
Great video thanks for the information
You're welcome Raymond. John.
Thanks for the review John. Do you have any plans on looking at the 4k release of the star trek series. Just ordered ST the motion picture. Can't wait to watch it .
The four film box is going cheap now and I am one of the world's biggest Trekkies. John.
I love both Tim Burton Batman Films, but I've grown to love 'Batman Returns' more over the years. I love its dark gothic setting and Danny De Vito's Penguin steals the Film, not to mention the seductive nature of Michelle Pheiffer's Catwoman. I think both Films have been excellently restored in 4K. I hate how they've changed the Gunshot Sound Effects, the original effects were perfect and they added to Burton's style. I'll get to the two Joel Schumacher films that came in the set I bought, knowing I'm in for some stinkers.
Sometimes when you think you're not going to enjoy a film the opposite happens Cooper. Expectations often play a part when watching a film. As for some of the sound being changed for the Batman films, it's a daft thing to do but at least the image quality of both (particularly the first) is top-notch. A real treat to have them in such high quality so I can forgive the odd cock-up! John.
Great review once again
Thank you MR. John.
Well done John another great review ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Thank you Phil. John.
Great intro. Great video. Great reviewer. I love the great Movie Collector.
John, what you start saying at the 9:03 point puts a big smile on my face - I, for one, look forward to when you see the Blu-ray disc of Baraka and review it (no 4K disc release yet, which is absurd).
Morning Erik. Young Teddles down in Oz got into the projection box for a 70mm screening of Baraka and I can't remember if I pointed you to his video before. I could tell from the brief look through the porthole onto the screen that the image quality of that film is among the best we're ever likely to see. I expect the Blu-ray is better than most 4K discs.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 Yes, you did, and I've seen the Baraka projection video by Teddles.
I too expect that the Blu-ray disc is better than most (if not all) 4K discs. Just look at the image at the 2:21 point in this video: ruclips.net/video/7H2cDS7txKY/видео.html
However, no matter how amazing the Baraka Blu-ray disc may be, it's not as awesome as a Baraka 70mm print - young Teddles is a lucky projectionist.
@@loekegaard9 Really interesting Erik. When was that little documentary made though because they were talking about their 8K scanner being the highest resolution in the world at that time? I've been told Death on the Nile was scanned at 12K but from there it went a bit awry and was edited and output as 4K, which was what I suspected when watching in the Odeon. At least they realized 70mm has somewhat higher resolution than 8K though so there has been some progress.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 That little documentary was probably made in 2007 as the Baraka Blu-ray was released in 2008.
As we've discussed the matter of Death on the Nile's post-production image process before, I'd love it if you'd share any more information you may have. If Death on the Nile was scanned at 12K, I'd say that is further evidence that photochemical 70mm prints are superior to 70mm prints struck from DIs (4K or otherwise).
Samsara, the sequel to Baraka, was also shot on 65mm, but it wasn't completed photochemically like its predecessor; it was scanned at 8K and completed digitally with an 8K DI. It was released to theatrers as a 4K DCP in 2011 - absurdly enough, no 70mm prints were struck. It would've been revealing to see a photochemical 70mm print of Baraka screened back-to-back with a non-photochemical 70mm print (struck from the 8K DI) of Samsara (a 65mm film shot the same way as Baraka by the same director/cinematographer, Ron Fricke).
@@loekegaard9 I think it's the VistaVision principal that film makers are going for today whereby the image quality is there on the negative and it shrinks down onto the release prints or video copy. I didn't think it worked particularly well for Death on the Nile but that could have been because of all the green screen, back projection and computer animation. There were some scenes with none of that that looked like 70mm. Yes, I've been thinking about that film and that 70mm screening ever since. At least they struck 70mm prints even if they weren't true 70mm prints. For the James Bond that was shot mainly with genuine IMAX there wasn't a single print struck. Not even for the upcoming 60th anniversary unless they have a big surprise awaiting for us shortly. I'd be straight up to the BFI IMAX if they announced a 15/70 (finished on film) print of No Time To Die.
One thing that was mentioned in the making of Baraka featurette was that there is a level where we can no longer perceive any more and at the time they thought 8K was good enough. They may still be right today but just the maths suggests that 70mm is more than 8K in reality. Even if 35mm really was the equivalent of only 4K then 70mm would have to be 10K. I think Jaws proved that a 6K transfer of 35mm produces superior results so that indicates around 15K for 70mm and that then suggests 45K for genuine IMAX.
By the way, I think I saw Jaws being advertised as IMAX recently which is patently ridiculous. It's a 35mm film so unless someone magically enlarged that frame by nine times but somehow also increased the definition by the same amount it cannot be classified as IMAX. This all smacks of desperation to me and perhaps indicates that cinema is in real trouble. If it's been successful though and got people back into the cinema then well done. I wonder how many other classic films will get similar treatment if it's worked. I also wonder if it's been done because there aren't enough new films getting a theatrical release now meaning that cinemas don't have enough to exhibit.
John.
Great video John, love these movies with Micheal Keaton as the best batman, i have these movies on 4k as well but have not yet got around to watching them i shall do that in the coming days
A good excuse for a Saturday evening double bill if you ask me Paul. It's possible I'd think more highly of the sequel if I watched it directly after the first film. I could always do without Danny DeVito eating raw fish though! John.
Not a Batman super fan, have seen 3 of the films, never have rewatched any and have no plans to. However your commentary here is just so interesting, educational, well worth the time....as always. Thanks.
The 1989 film might be worth a try sometime Pete because you may find that it's improved with age. I found Jack Nicholson's Joker portrayal a bit too over the top back in '89 but when I watched the 4K about 18 months ago my opinion had changed and I thought he was both hilarious and brilliant. The whole thing is very like the comics from when Batman was a bit of a villain himself (in 1939 and early 1940's) and the opening 20 minutes or so captures that well. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Good points, I may do just that, as the Nicholson Batman film (Joker) is one I did see soon after it came out, and I am a Nicholson fan.
I liked Batman 89 better when I was a kid, but now I think I like Returns more. I just love how bizarre and grotesque it is. And I think the plot is more interesting.
I don't think you're alone there because I remember it being universally considered disappointing in 1992 and now so many people love it. It's clearly aged well... just like me!
John.
@@moviecollector5920 That's the way I remembered it as a kid, before the internet, but Batman Returns actually has a better critic rating than Batman on Rotten Tomatoes.
@@ed1rko17 That evidence that it's improved with age because that certainly wasn't how it was received in 1992. John.
I love Batman Returns. I watch it every year around Christmas. I love the snowy Christmas aesthetic with Burton's gothic designs of Gotham City. It goes together so perfectly. Michelle Pfeiffer's performance as Selina Kyle/Catwoman is so enchanting, every time I watch it. I too wish Penguin was in a separate movie. While DaVito is a great Penguin and his design is fantastic, his character is quite grating at times. I streamed the 4K version on Amazon Prime last night and was very pleased with the transfer. The clarity was excellent and colors were pretty close to my memories of watching this on older physical media. Some of the nighttime and underground/sewer scenes had a darker, teal tint to it that stands out if you compare it to the same shots from previous transfers. Thankfully it wasn't too distracting and I felt like I was watching the movie I grew up with. I'm contemplating getting the 4K disc and I'm curious what the 1989 Batman 4K transfer looks like now.
Morning Andy. I showed the BATMAN trailer in my review of that 4K disc and in spite of that I had many comments telling me that the people responsible for the transfer for the 4K disc had messed it up. They were citing a 'teal' colour which is rather meaningless to me as I speak English! I worked out that they thought the cine transfer had somehow generated a blue hue to it which is nonsense of course but it is possible that the colour grading applied to match the 35mm prints generated a bit of a blue tint. Nothing to do with the transfer. I am still perplexed by this blue tint criticism though because I kept asking people to look at the 35mm trailer within the review video and tell me how different they thought it looked to the 4K disc. To this day no one has. I think what happened with Batman and Batman returns is that people had become used to the look of VHS copies, LaserDisc, DVD and Blu-rays and therefore assume that is the correct colour grade for the films. The correct colour grade would be an original 35mm master print (or 70mm blow-up if they were struck) and failing that a general release print. Without having one of those the closest we can get is a 35mm trailer. It's in the review video! Both Batman and Batman Returns our excellent 4K discs with Batman having the edge as far as I'm concerned but it is the better film too so that might have some bearing.
John.
Maybe they told you wrong. Im fairly certain it is the blu ray that has a very teal or blue tint to it. It is definitely noticeable i have seen it. On the 4k it is gone and it looks fine. @@moviecollector5920
Thank you John.
Thank you Cheekster. Have a good weekend assuming you're not working or on duty at a rather important funeral service on Monday. John.
Great Video John, I enjoyed both of Tim Burtons Batman movies,the Quality definitely went down after he left the directors Chair and Michael Keaton was superb in both movies
Well I'll second that Gary. Maybe now they've got Michael Keaton to put the suit back on they can tempt him and Tim Burton back for a middle-aged Batman film. John.
Thanks for sharing John,I haven’t seen Batman Returns in quite some time I do like the Batman movies although I’m not a lover of Dark films.
Keep up the good work.
Batman Returns is a bit of a dark film Paul but not dark in terms of picture, dark in terms of story and humour. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Thanks for the info John
Great job John 👌.....IV never seen the original batman 🫣..... Only batman returns in the cinema.....but iv ordered the 1-4 4k set on Amazon Italy for only 25e.....so il do the marathon.... thanks again for your review.
I hope you enjoy them all Roy. I had never seen the sequel since it was in the cinema. Haven't seen the third film since the cinema either but I did purchase the fourth film on DVD and I think that was because I missed it in the cinema. John.
I first saw batman returns when I was in Paris with subtitles.
I was 7, and I'm American. So that's why it was so memorable for me.
I liked this more. It has an actual plot. What really was Nicholson even trying to accomplish?
Even, ledgers joker who refers to himself as a dog chasing cars, had a plan.
That said, I rented batman so much, that mom just bought it for me.
I don't even remember my cinema visit for this film Grant which is quite unusual. I think that's because I really didn't like it much. The funny thing is that I don't see the plot in it whereas I do in Batman but I can see what you mean. They're both basically comics brought to the screen so they don't really need to do more than entertain in the same way the comics did. The look and general atmosphere was probably achievement enough. John.
Despite being a 100% bona fide teal spotter, I found that joke hilarious 🤣 🐦
Good to know Robert. I was surprised I managed to play it with a straight face. John.
I have both the US & UK 4K for Batman returns and while they are different discs they have the same transfer.
You still see the film grain, especially on the wide shots but when compared to the original widescreen laserdisc I found that the grain had the same look so it might have just been a very fine grain film stock used at the time. With the budget they probably invested heavily on the materials.
The reason I feel the image is soft at times is due to the cgi used. The bats in the background or for the opening title plus many penguins are cgi.
This is what makes those scenes less than the rest due to the way they printed the effects into the film. Not to mention the final cut of the film was made the week of release due to the change in ending.
I find it to be a fantastic disc and one of the best natural presentations you can get but many discs are better.
That all makes sense. I'm not sure there are many better discs from 35mm originals but certainly from the larger film formats. A couple of movies shot on video might rival it too but I'd have to have a closer look at the really good videos to compare them. Ambulance would probably rival it but I'd have to find a sequence where the camera wasn't shaking all over the place!
John.
i have seen the 1989 original when i was way too young (like 9). the first reveal of jokers face made be get nightmares for several days. nowadays i see this movie as a way more entertaining one. also got the 4k - great review :)
Childhood memories really can't be beaten. Sadly I was already getting old by the time I saw the film in 1989 but fortunately I wasn't grown up and I never will be! I didn't much care for The Joker at the time but now I love Nicholson's portrayal. John.
Another top notch video, I just watched the 4k of Black Hawk Down , my favourite Ridley Scott film forgot how great it is, the picture is incredible and the dolby atmos sound Wow, I know you'll have seen it but have you seen it on 4k? Also love the extra scenes in it. Have the German bluray of 1492 to watch next then The Last Duel on bluray which I've been putting off because of the reviews but I'll make my own mind up on it.
Morning Laura. I've had the DVD of Black Hawk Down so long and have watched it many times. A terrific film and one of Ridley's best, although he's made so many great films. I haven't seen 1492 for years and years and can barely remember it now. As for The Last Duel, if it turns out to be another Ridley Scott classic you'd better let me know. It looks rather good to me but I get concerned whenever I see large scale computer animation in any film. Even Gladiator suffered due to CGI but the rest of it was so damned good I was able to look past it. John.
The 4k release in Australia does seem to have a forced teal bias. I have the old bluray and the colours are more accurate to the cinema release. You can tell more in the joker scenes, the factory scene, and the finally in the street. Jokers white face has a blueish tinge. Totally agree with returns having too many villans and not enough batman. Good comparison with spiderman 3. Although spiderman 3 was more the fault of the studios forcing more characters, rather than the director trying to out do themselves. Great review as always John!
Thank you Daniel. We don't have the blue hue to Batman on our video projector but it's more evident on our telly so it could be the colour bias of the backlight or something like that. John.
As a rule of thumb, a movie's cinema box office profits may be calculated as gross profit ÷ 2 (- production budget) = net profit. So 287 million divided by 2 equals 123.5 million - 80 million implies 53.5 million profit. This doesn't include 1992 VHS and TV sales, of course.
I expect that Batman Returns made a lot of money in the end. VHS sales alone must have been enormous. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Indeed. Jack Nicholson made 70 million in royalties from Batman '89. He took a paycut for his role plus 10% of all gross profits. Weirdly Rainman and Return of the Jedi (both massive hits) returned losses to the producers. Hollywood accounting sucks.😭
@@quadropheniaguy9811 I'd have played the role for half that amount!
Batman is perfectly fine. HDR looks great.
Batman Returns is however an absolute beauty. Up there with The Shining in terms of PQ.
You're right there Jez. The Shining is another beautiful 35mm. Quite unusual for 35mm to look so good on video and probably only a couple of movies shot on video would rival them. 70mm and other large film formats are considerably superior though but that's to be expected. John.
BATMAN is a classic example of hidden movie costs and why a comparison of production budget and worldwide gross doesn't tell the full story.
BATMAN had a production cost of $54m and a marketing cost of $62m.
From its worldwide gross and first year ancillaries it took in $253.4m net.
However it didn't make a profit for Warners theatrically because of gross participation points for the likes of Nicholson, Keaton and Burton and others added up to over $100m. A year after release it was $30m in the red. However I'm sure in the 30 years since it has turned a profit.
I think VHS sales might have produced another hundred million or so Richard. Everyone seemed to be buying it when it first came out. No doubt all the licensed goods sales brought in a hefty sum too but whether or not that has ever been included in anything I don't know.
John.
Great review as ever
Thank you Simon. John.
Batman was the last film I saw at the cinema with my best friend - he sadly passed away a couple of years later - I still have his VHS copy and the cinema ticket - understandably itll always be one of my favourites and Michael Keaton will always be Batman
I'm beginning to wonder if Keaton will be tempted to make a middle-aged Batman film. There were some great comics that did that over the years and now that they've managed to get the outfit on him again lately it's got to be a possibility. Get Tim Burton back to direct it though. I think you told me about your friend before Dean as I remember the story so unless there are two of you out there with a similar story then I kept his memory too. It's a beautiful story and I would feel exactly as you and would also have kept the cinema ticket and the VHS. Well done!
John.
@@moviecollector5920 He was supposed to have a cameo in the upcoming The Flash film, as an older Batman I think. But I don't know if the plan has been cancelled.
@@GRORGvideot They'll just have to make a third Batman film. And have him married to Selina Kyle played by Michelle Pfeiffer. Well, we can all dream. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Indeed, would be great
@@moviecollector5920 I would definitely like to see Keaton return and yes, I’m sure I’ve probably mentioned the story on you review of Batman but always lovely to get a reply - thank you
No problem your welcome
Always very insightful 👍
Morning Phil. Your replies seem to be turning up as new comments so next time see if you've got a 'Reply' option below my last reply because that will keep everything within one conversation for anyone else reading. John.
@@moviecollector5920 ok 👍
I'm leaning so much about film quality, aspect ratios and stuff from watching your videos, thanks man! Oh btw I don't like Batman and Robin films lol the only Batman and Robin I liked is Dell and Rodney Trotter's take on it!😁😂
And that Only Fools & Horses episode was a classic too. But take a look at the opening 20 minutes or so of the 1989 Batman and that's how he should be portrayed and played. The comic books of 1939/1940 and the 1970's brought to life.
If you ever have any questions about film gauges, aspect ratios and all that myriad confusing nonsense then you know where I am. The basic answer is, the bigger the film gauge, the better the image quality.
John.
An excellent review. I have the dvd laserdisc and 4k versions of these films. The laserdiscs are slightly softer which tend to negate the grain. Of course this is subjective as well as being equipment dependent. I was fortunate to frequent the old Movie Boulevard shop in Leeds on a regular basis where I gloried in rare and hard to get discs and memorabilia from around the world but nobody seems to remember it so sad.
We seem to have similar memories in a way Mike because in London I frequented Stereo Regent Street (which moved onto Shaftesbury Avenue about 1995) and The Cinema Store on St. Martin's Lane. Between those two specialist shops discs from all over the world could be purchased plus magazines, books and memorabilia in the Cinema Store and the greatest HiFi imaginable in SRS. Now there's only Forbidden Planet and FOPP left in central London and as much as I could see all the specialist store closures coming I didn't think London would suffer so badly so quickly.
John.
I used to get NTSC Laserdiscs from Movie Boulevard. Used to love going in there. Very expensive and at times the fellas that owned the shop were grumpy to say the least.
@@stevenandnicola123 I've just had my Star Wars LaserDiscs out for the forthcoming Star Wars thing I'm working on. It's easy to forget how special the packaging was for LD's and I think that style packaging is why LP's have enjoyed such a resurgence. John.
@@stevenandnicola123 thanks for replying I thought ,l was alone remembering this shop. I got lots of soundtracks from there. I had forgotten about the grumpiness. ,!!!
@@moviecollector5920 I miss laserdiscs but not the prices. I've thought about getting another player but can't justify getting one. I had the "faces" laserdiscs of the original trilogy, the ones with Yoda, a Stormtrooper and Darth Vader on the covers. I heard they put them one on each cover so they wouldn't have to pay Mark Hamill et al for using their pics.
As always, it is a pleasure to see you at work, our great story teller! Informative and captivating!
What did you think of the video I recommended to you previously: "BATMAN 4K - FIXED & RESTORED"? Nitpicking or great recommendations?
I had a look at it Dmitri and it does look a bit different. The funny thing is that my 35mm trailer looks more like the 4K disc but that's a trailer and was out before the film was completed so may look different to the final release of the film. Is it possible the people tasked with grading the 4K disc matched it to the trailer? To tell the truth, I don't really care because the 4K disc of Batman looks wonderful. It does look a bit bluish at times on my telly but that may be the colour temperature of the backlight. Same with a projector, it could be that the lamp causes a more natural look which some tellies do not. It's been an interesting discussion though even if I don't understand why so many people hooked onto this 'teal' description. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I agree that most of the comments are simply nitpicking. But I would not bother you with that video if it was just about the color. Those guys point out at and fix a lot of other very interesting imperfections, which are interesting from both: technical and aesthetic point of view. They deal with fire, shadows, perspective, composite shots, slightly incorrect sequence of events and more. When you watch a movie, you don't pay much attention at such things, unless you are a die hard fan and this is your 100th viewing of the movie.
If all this seems interesting to you, give it one more look.
Dmitri
@@dmitripopov8570 The continuity in the vandalism of the art gallery is legendary but that's film making. Every film has errors, compromises and problems but that's what makes them what they are. We put on sections of the 4K of Star Wars last night and I had forgotten how truly awful that special edition version was. In going back to 'fix' all the things that couldn't be sorted at the time the film was made it's destroyed a piece of film history. There are parts of that special edition that I think are better than the 1977 release but it needed someone else to tell George where to stop. I like to see things like wires in a film occasionally which probably seems a bit odd but I keep thinking about the flying car in Blade Runner and how odd it is to see those thick cables lifting it up and down on the set but it somehow makes the film more real to me and tells us we're looking at a film made in 1982. Batman was 1989 and I dare say the makers were up to their necks in pressure to get it out by a specified date - particularly with the huge marketing campaign that seemed to be everywhere. Ultimately, you just have to stop work and get the completed negatives to the lab. I wonder how all the little foibles an inadequacies stood out on the 70mm blow-up prints. John.
@@moviecollector5920 John, you are the best! Ha! A new wonderful word to put into my dictionary - "foibles". Thank you!
I will keep on reminding you, please find and give a try to "Star Wars - Despecialized Edition". It is truly the best of all the editions, with an amazing story of it's creation and all the related restorations! You will not be disappointed.
You are absolutely right about the Batman movie and the rest of the cinema. For the most part, I could not care less for special effects at all if the story is gripping and acting at a great level. Facial closeups on the entire screen with almost no background, like in Top Gun? I am down for that! A great puppet show usually has no fx or even facial animations, but it inspires imagination and can hold you tight on your seat. So, I don't mind the flaws, but I very much admire the enthusiasts' efforts.
Dmitri
@@dmitripopov8570 I ran the third of the four reels of Star Wars on Super 8 yesterday to remind myself how good the film really is. It hurt me to see that 4K because it simply isn't Star Wars. I can see why some people scoff at it now because in making the clarity so perfect for tiny home screens has made all of it look fake. The computer animation additions are sometimes excellent and sometimes absolutely awful. After the opening 15 minutes the first computer addition comes in with a stormtrooper riding on a Dewback and it is so obviously not really there that there is only one thing to do with that scene and that's to cut it out. But there it is to completely take you out of the picture and tell you you're watching something second rate. I did see the 'Special Edition' on the 58 foot wide screen at the Odeon Marble Arch and it didn't look anywhere near so bad but at the time I was regarding the show as a bit of fun whereby George Lucas had come up with an idea to get Star Wars back into cinemas for a new generation. What I didn't expect was that this butchered version of Star Wars would supplant the original masterpiece. I'll have to take another look at this 4K but I'm dreading it. All I really want to do is run the final reel of the Super 8 even though the Super 8 was never very good. I've put my most powerful Super 8 projector in place for the brightest image (it's the only such Super 8 projector in the UK as far as I know) to see how good I can make the print look. Oh well, rant over. I should have been talking about Batman and Batman Returns but I suppose the point of this is that I can understand why some people might be a little upset about possible or purported changes to Batman... even if those changes are nothing compared to the scale of the changes to Star Wars.
John.
After reading : Batman :Return of the dark knight. Batman in the 80's and 90's were a big disappointment. But Batman begins I really liked. Great video as always. 👍
Take a look at the 1970's comics Tom and those from 1939 and the early 1940's and you'll see the Batman of the 1989 film. That's why I like it so much. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I do love old Batman Comics but after the impact of Return of... In 86/87 I was completely blown away. And thought they were going to make something like that one. But probably my bad. 😁😁
@@storthode I need to read more Batman comics!
great review
I knew you'd say that Steffy!
John.
Just picked up the 4k on a deal on ebay £3.99 looking forward to watching it 😀 👍
Good grief! It will almost cost that much to post it!! Have a good time watching. John.
I'm still upset with WB for not including the theatrical mix for Batman and Batman Returns. Not a fan of the remastered audio. It's inferior to the LD and original DVD mix. Video quality is good but for some reason they're really obsessed with the teal. They've been doing it with a lot of old movies on 4K and Blu-ray.
Perhaps someone at Warner Studios is breeding ducks Rinal, that would explain it! Seriously though, neither of these 4K's look at all green or blue here but our telly does generate a bit of a blue/green look to some scenes. Could be the colour temperature of the backlight.
John.
Why do movies need to have these colour gradings at all? Can't they just be the same colour as when they were released? I don't see the point of putting a colour bias onto a film. The film-makers do that in their colour choices for the film in the first place. I think the Star Wars releases are overly saturated with blue. I guess a film like Alien will have an obvious green throughout, but I don't want another layer of green over the top. In fairness the Alien 4K is great, I'm just using it as an example- there is no need to add more green to that film.
@@leehawkins616 I agree with you. I've been looking at the 35mm version of some films like The Matrix, original Star Wars trilogy and Jurassic Park online and they look better than the 4K Blu-ray. The 35mm version of The Matrix and Jurassic Park have much better colours. Some of the scenes on the Jurassic Park Blu-ray have been brightened and as a result there's visible noise/grain. A good example is the scene where the main characters are watching the Mr. DNA sequence. The 35mm version is a bit more darker and there's no noise/grain issue.
Batman 1989 I like the best because on Michael K. And Jack N. They had so many classic lines. Batman Returns was good. Great cast. Enjoyed your review.
So far the responses are about evenly split over which is the better film Craig. It's good that the sequel has improved with age because it wasn't well liked when it was new.
John.
The 'too much teal' is definitely a problem when comparing the 4K scan to the old home video releases. I've had Batman on VHS, DVD and Blu Ray and the image on the 4K scan is so teal - like Blade Runner vs. BR: The Final Cut.
I put the 35mm trailer in the review for the 4K of the 1989 film and it looks strikingly similar to what we got on 4K. That's not conclusive as it's the trailer but it is interesting. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Oh I understand that. What I mean is - if you look online at comparison screenshots you will see that the grading is vastly different. I know a lot of films experienced a 'warmer' colour grade/timing when coming to home video (The Matrix 35mm/4K remaster vs. the 1999 DVD, for example) but I don't think Batman looks as good with the heavy teal. The look of the film directly influenced the Animated Series and that is remembered for its strong browns and reds. Hope this helps explain what I was trying to say, great content and I've subscribed!
@@systemmonitor5295 I think 'teal' refers to the green eyebrow of the duck but the 4K of Batman through my system doesn't have that colour bias. It does have the colour bias of the 35mm trailer though so assuming that was how the 35mm internegative was graded then it's likely the people tasked with applying the colour and density used a 35mm print of master print as the reference. It's also possible they might have used the trailer! John.
I have never seen that bluray player from Panasonic before. Is it a model only available in England?
I have several Blu-ray players but the 4K I run in the home cinema is a 400 series. Think it's a 420.
John.
Hello, techinical Question here, Will a 4K Upscaling Player do just as Good vs an Actual 4K Player? it's about pricing, I will save $150 from purchasing a 4K Player with an Upscale Player. But still, I tend to think a 4K Player is likely the right choice, rather than wonder if the upscaling is compromising image quality?
My recommendation is to not even consider an upscaling machine. 4K players over here start at less than £100 now so find an entry level 4K UHD Blu-ray player and see how you get on with that rather than messing around with something that isn't really 4K. Having said this, if you watch on a telly you'll struggle to spot the difference between a Blu-ray and a 4K anyway, it's usually just the high dynamic range that makes the difference but there have been a few exceptions. Easier to spot with projection of course unless you have a telly that's seven feet wide or more.
John.
John will you in the future do a review of Rollerball and are you a fan of it 👍🏻
Rollerball is one of my favourite films Ron. If it ever appears in 4K over here I'll take a look. I was tempted by the German release but it was rather expensive to import it and it was in an oversized box which didn't appeal much. Years ago I did import a German Super 8 release of the film though and that was - and still is - pretty terrific. I had to re-record the dubbed German sound into English though.
John.
"You're just jealous because I'm a genuine freak and you have to wear a mask ", is one of the best and the strangest vilan lines I have ever heard.
Danny DeVito clearly enjoyed himself with that suit and make-up on Timothy. I would have preferred to have him as a solo villain with a more focused story though. Catwoman would have been my choice for this second film... but what do I know?!? John.
@@moviecollector5920 Actually, I think you're right. Too many vilans is often a problem with films like this one. Nolan did the same thing in The Dark Knight Rises,..was Catwoman really needed in there?, Bane was a big enough problem for Batman if you ask me. Don't even get me started about The Batman, ..was that even Catwoman at all? (I'm black so I'm not being racist. I just prefer a more cat-like Catwoman) Michelle Pfeiffer is the best, she was definitely the cat's meow.
@@timothymathetes When you look like Michelle Pfeiffer and have her acting abilities then there's not really much chance of anyone else ever surpassing her performance. This is the problem that all remakes tend to have because we get used to the first person to carry a role and then anyone else stepping into their shoes has to live up to it and it's just not possible. Michael Keaton had just the right qualities for Bruce Wayne and Batman and despite everyone else who has ever played Batman since, there is no way to match his overall performance. In some respects others have been better but not overall. Catwoman was always an interesting character in the comics and I liked her portrayal and inclusion in The Dark Knight Rises which I think was the best of the Nolan Batman films. It was about 3 hours long so it was a little easier to incorporate side stories and an extra character or two. Condense that into two hours and they'd have to be excised. Just my opinion of course. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I enjoyed watching Anne Hathaway, but at the same time, I thought she didn't really feel necessary. I've only seen the film once, maybe I will look at it again and see if I still feel the same way.
salut bonne Revue sur le film Batman et belle vidèo cool comme toujour
Merci Alain. Beaucoup de gens aiment vraiment ce film maintenant, il est donc intéressant de voir comment certains films vieillissent bien... tout comme moi! John.
Cheers John. I think this disc looks lovely on the oled. Colours are fantastic.
Would've loved to have seen a third Burton film.
I'd pay to see a middle-aged Batman film with Michael Keaton in the title roll. I don't know if enough youngsters would be interested though and that will be the stumbling block. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I think people will give up on super-hero films, in a few years, unless they branch out and start doing more mature stories, as you're suggesting. Keaton did have an edge the others have never matched.
I just saw the latest Thor film and it was terrible. Found the last one amusing, but they're becoming increasingly puerile and are terribly written. Strange when you consider how many stories they have to draw from. I grew up on Spider-man, FF, Hulk, Cap & Thor comics.
@@dougquaid570 To be fair to the people tasked with making the comic book films, they have got to be under enormous pressure to turn out a certain amount of them every year because they are just about all that are attracting an audience today. The constant rush to get the next one into cinemas has to be the reason for lack of story and poor quality effects but if it gets children, teenagers and youngsters into cinemas then that's all that's got to be the main ambition. When you're young you don't really care about character or anything else and just want to be entertained with action and special effects. I mainly read Spider-Man as a child but Batman was always there and occasionally Superman too. The others were always a bit second rate to me and I still regard them as second best today. I can't really imagine how anyone thought a film all about Thor, Iron Man or The Green Arrow would be worthwhile but if these things are bringing money in then that's what it's all about. My brother always really liked Silver Surfer so maybe that's one they could have a go at.
John.
Danny Elfmans main theme for Batman is my my favourite of all time 😎😎😎
He's done quite a few great scores and themes Shaun. But I think you may be right that Batman's is his best. John.
Great video John. Likewise I much prefer the 1989 film. I believe they filmed Returns in America and it lacks so much grittiness of the original- the rusty, dirty lived-in look of the 1989 film is brilliant art direction and craft. Just feels more real and convincing.
Will never understand the fascination of these superhero movies with the villains. It's clear here that Burton prefers the bad guys and seems rather bored by Batman. In the comics the focus was always on the hero -Batman, Spiderman etc - and yet the movies always get distracted by the bad guys. Irritates me no end and partly why I enjoyed the most recent The Batman film- at least it focused more on the title character than some recent superhero efforts I could mention.
I expect Pinewood was unavailable and so the sequel had to be shot at Universal and Warner Studios. It may have hurt the overall look of the film but it seems to be more popular now than it was when it was released. You are right in your assessment of the fascination with the villains but the first two Spider-Man films weren't really the same in that regard as first The Green Goblin and then Doctor Octopus were both fundamental in the development of the Peter Parker/Spider-Man character. Catwoman should have been the same to Bruce Wayne/Batman in the 1992 film but there was so much else going on with the other two baddies to tackle that aspect within a two hour film. A bit of a shame but you never know, maybe Burton, Keaton and Pfeiffer could be tempted back for a middle-aged Batman film. I'd pay to see that.
John.
Great review John :)
I love both films but will always prefer Batman 1989 since it has a darker tone, better plot and story. I think Batman Returns has too many villains even though they're all great. But I agree that it would have been a better idea to let Catwoman be the main villain together with Max and create an interesting story about her relationship with Batman since she's a more interesting character than The Penguin . The big difference between the two films is that Batman is more serious and Returns is a bit too silly sometimes. Then we have Nicholson’s Joker who is far more intimidating than Devito’s Penguin.
Well I agree with all of that. Funny thing is that in the discussions so far many people find that the second film has more of a plot which I'd never considered. I thought the second film was a bit of a mish mash due to there being too many characters. Wouldn't it be exciting if WB decided a middle-aged Batman story would be a good idea and Tim Burton was brought back to direct Michael Keaton and Michelle Pfeiffer to reprise their roles and it turned out they'd got married shortly after the events in Batman Returns. A more normal villain would be my choice for a Batman film and have him just go after a crime boss or something like that so it could all be more grounded in reality.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 Another Batman film with Michael Keaton is what I'm hoping for now when he finally is back and it would most likely be a far more successful film than the planned The Batman 2. I think it would be a good idea to bring back Tim Burton.
@@mirvmn2 Maybe we should start a campaign similar to the one for the re-edit of Justice League because that one turned out alright.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 Sounds like good idea and it might work :)
I believe they say it has a teal tint.
It has a cool, not warm look on my TV. I think
That is normally what most people mean by blue, or green.
I'll have to watch it again. It could be a settings issue.
We don't have the blue or green through our video projector but do have it a little on the telly so it could be the colour temperature of the backlight or something like that. In one of my Elmo Super 8 projectors I have an HTI lamp in it and that has a blue bias that gives all film passing through it more of a blue look so I expect it's the way tellies are made or certain brands of tellies.
John.
Loved this Sequel, on release i went to the cinema about 6 or 7 times to see it , once with the girlfriend at the time,whos now the wife!! Was excited to hear Keaton was back as Batman, hope he gets to be seen ,
I'm hoping they'll get the original team back and make a new Batman film Aidey - Batman 3 perhaps. But they'll have to shoot it over here to ensure the sets are as good as the first film. Pinewood is the top dog when it comes to that sort of thing. John.
My fav Batman movie hands down...
4k looks amazing! feels like a christmas movie to me
It's possible the image noise reduction has been a little overdone for this one Megadeth but not so much as to generate that waxy side effect look. Both the 1989 film and the sequel both look very good but the 1989 film does look more like a film and that's probably why I prefer it. John.
Great review John 👍 your dead on right that Batman 1989 was better than Batman Return's but it's still a very good film and I remember when they decided to film it in the U.S. and an old friend told me when they were filming Batman 1989 they were recording the casino scene at Bruce Wayne's mansion it was at Hatfield House and I was told about Jack Nicholson had many bodyguards around him. Plus the colour differences I've seen with another film called The Hidden 1987, the Blu-ray from Spain has a better picture unlike the HMV premium collection Blu-ray has a lot of green tinge in the picture from the re-mastering but the picture has a lot of green from the sets, clothing etc. And as you said it could be because of the settings on their 4k Blu-ray players or their TVs. settings on
We don't get the green hue on our video projector Andrew but occasionally it can be picked out if you really look for it. On the telly it's more prominent but not overkill so there could be particular eras of televisions or brands that are causing it. No one has advised they have a different version from overseas so I think we can be fairly sure now that it's a hardware issue.
John.
Batman Returns is pretty good in 4k, one of the best catalog WB titles. Really good disc. Batman 89 however it has that blue/teal color grading added with gun shot changes so I prefer blu ray on batman 89! You can compare it with the 2009 blu ray which has the old 5.1 as well. The original look of batman 89 is really nice with gray and dark look. I look at batman returns as a burton film with batman in it that why it looks like that. Batman has magical power that he ripped the eyeliner make up at the end of batman returns. lol
Batman doesn't have the 'teal' colour here Ghetti but on our telly there is more of a green look to it at times. I think that may be the colour temperature of the backlight. It does look surprisingly similar to the 35mm trailer though so it's interesting how different equipment produces different results. Some have got quite hot under the collar about this green bias but even if some equipment is producing that it's still got to be a darned fine disc. 35mm quality for £20 (even less these days) is unbelievable to me.
John.
I think the problem here is that there is a bit more blue/teal in some of the footage, but nothing that wasn’t in the original 35mm prints. The old video transfers, including the first Blu-ray release, were overly brightened and had the colors more neutralized which people have gotten used to over the years.
@@Motorheadache95 That would explain it Motorheadache. It would also explain why the 35mm looks remarkably similar. Someone must have mentioned this 'teal' description for the colour and everyone else picked up on it. At least it was an excuse for me to have some fun with it. I somehow managed to keep a straight face too which wasn't easy. John.
Batman 89 4K has that awful new sound mix with new foley effects that completely ruin it for me unfortunately. Revisionist filmmaking at close to George Lucas levels! The Laserdisc PCM mix is still the best mix available to my ears. I’ve not watched/heard Batman Returns 4K yet, but I’m guessing the sound mix wasn’t as tampered with?
@@RNGTR I actually like the sound mix but I’m in full agreement that with that kind of sound revisionism they absolutely should have included the original audio mix. You can actually watch the 4K transfer on iTunes with the original audio effects if you set your audio to Dolby digital 5.1.
Returns has revised audio effects as well, but way less than the first film. I think it’s just a couple whoosh sounds or something. I didn’t really notice but your mileage may vary.
Not a fan of the first one, but boooy do I love the 2nd one.
And the 4k is spectacular (IMO)
The 4K of the 1992 is spectacular... to the point that I suspect it may be too good to be true. I really must track down a 35mm master print to check it against. Sadly there's no chance of that! John.
Its a dead heat for me. I love both movies
I expect quite a few people are going to say exactly the same thing Humble Bugg. John.
Im with you, love Them both
Batman and Batman Returns are 2 of my favorite along with the Batman trilogy by Christopher Nolan. I believe the 1989 Batman was the first to utilize DD (AC3) when it was released on LD. Batman Returns was one of the 2 times that I know of that Christopher Walken played the bad guy (the other was James Bond View to a Kill). Jack Nicholson IMHO stole the show in the 1989 Batman. His screen presence and one liners were some of his best work.
I'm with you there Scott as I think the Burton Batman's are terrific as are the Nolan films. Jack Nicholson is one of the greats so I don't suppose we should be surprised at how good he was as The Joker. Impossible act to follow really.
John.
Hi you should be in TV your highly interesting and informative reviews would be great in tv
I am and was always very mixed on “Batman Returns”.
On the positives, the world building of Gotham is amazing. They did such a good job with the production design, the art direction and the visual effects. On a technical level, it’s possibly one of the overall best looking movies I’ve ever seen.
Now on what I don’t like about the movie, it all has to do with the story and attempt. This was too much of a Tim Burton movie than an actual Batman movie like its predecessor that it’s almost a disservice to the Batman lore and a somewhat betrayal of the 1989 film. Danny DeVito, while fantastic in his performance, could have portrayed a more faithful Penguin, but I hate the direction they went with the character. They really missed the opportunity to translate the Penguin from the comics to the screen. Max Schreck was a useless villain and I wish they had gone with their original plan to have Harvey Dent and to set him up as Two-Face at the end. You’re right about the movie focusing less on Batman, considering that the movie is called “Batman Returns”. The character is given very little to do that he may as well be a supporting character in his own movie. This certain movie feels more like “Batman Departs”, because of the outcome and aftermath it created, even though I consider “Batman Forever” as my second favorite Batman film and I quite enjoy “Batman & Robin” a lot. It’s been a great guilty pleasure of mine and I always highly respected it. For me, “Batman Returns” was definitely not as good as the 1989 film. As a follow up to the 1989 film, Michael Keaton’s Batman deserved better.
I think this year's THE FLASH is one of the best BATMAN films. A perfect vehicle for Michael Keaton to bring his tongue-in-cheek style of Batman portrayal back and to show how the character should be played. More of a comedy than anything else but I love it. I haven't seen Batman Forever in so long that I can barely remember it. I may have only seen it that one time at the cinema actually.
John.
I love both movies of those
There seem to be a lot of us who do Victor. John.
Great review John. I agree with the storyline and would of prefer your version. That would of been great. Still a good movie and probably the first Batman I watched so good memories for me
Wouldn't it be nice if Burton and Keaton got back together to make a third film in which Bruce Wayne was middle-aged and struggling to keep up with his crime fighting duties while married to Selina Kyle played by Michelle Pfeiffer? I don't suppose youngsters would be interested though.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 I think that would be really interesting. Especially as the Flash movie is likely opening a multiverse and everyone's love for nostalgia
@@KeepYaHeadUpTS I've enjoyed many of the subsequent Batman films but there's nothing quite like the original. It would be nice to bring that back and make it almost entirely with old school film making methods which would mean booking Pinewood Studios. John.
@@moviecollector5920 my friend and I say the same. There's something in film sets being made with detail and passion, shots done practically with little or no CGI... unfortunately convenience is often the winner in movies today
@@moviecollector5920 ahh John, I also wanted to ask you if you'd seen The Fabelmans trailer? For me it looked brilliant. Hoping for another great Spielberg movie
One disc that I know with 100% certainty has a different transfer in the USA than we have here is Looper, the USA release was graded under supervision of Steve Yedlin who was the DoP for Rian Johnson whereas our version was done by god knows who.
If you could get both then that might make for a cracker of a video....👍
Funnily enough I have been looking for Looper in HMV Andy but it's been sold out every time I've been in. Shame I missed it when it was in the 3 for £30 offer a while back. Often a perceived colour change can be down to the colour curves applied and this can result in a sort of greenish look. Maybe that's what people are talking about with Batman but it doesn't appear green or blue on our video projector - does occasionally on our telly though but I wouldn't have thought it was worth pointing out even if I'd have spotted it. Maybe some tellies are greener than others.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 I think it's accepted that all TV's are different in their own ways, even the same model from the same manufacture has deviations which is why you shouldn't use someone else's "calibrated" settings on your TV.
In the case of the USA Looper release, it's a completely different transfer.
Both Burton Batman movies look good on Blu-Ray. I'm excited that Night of the Living Dead (1968) and King Kong (1976) get released on 4K Blu-Ray in November in Europe.
I didn't know the 1976 remake of King Kong was getting a 4K UHD disc release. Quite amazing when you think about it. Maybe that film has gained popularity recently owing to the plethora of other monster movies. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I really like the 1976 remake. The extented 3 hour tv version was released on normal Blu-Ray last year in the US by Shout Factory.
@@Ankka939 It was released in original theatrical form by Marketing Film International in 1979 but I don't recall ever seeing a print. I might have seen the 400ft cut down at some point though. I remember I liked the film but can't recall if that was at the cinema or on a television broadcast. I think the Universal Studios tour had a King Kong sequence based on the 1976 film and I have a shot of that on Super 8 somewhere which I think I took in 1994. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I'm not sure if the 4K Blu-Ray is coming to UK. I pre-ordered the steelbook version from Amazon Germany.
@@moviecollector5920 4K Blu-Ray of King Kong (1976) is now available to pre-order in the UK. The release is by StudioCanal. Would be great to see your review of it.
According to the BBFC website, the movie is a 12 now. It was a 15 back in the day and still says 15 on the 4k disc. The special features must have pushed it over.
Interesting. Perhaps there are different rules or requirements between home video and theatrical releases.
John.
Regarding 4 k transfers and color grading of the same movie in different territories.In case of Batman series its all released by Warner.So transfer is 1:1 in all territories.Some releases like Cliffhanger,Leon,Fifth element are released by different labels.Studiocanal in eu and uk.And Sony in 🇺🇸.That's why there can be different color grading,bitrate or even cuts released.Leon in UK has only Directors cut in 🇺🇸 there are both
Thank you for explaining that side of it Romualds. Makes a lot of sense now and rather confirms this blue or green tint that some are seeing is down to equipment which further proves that all our systems are different. John.
I had that book of Birds myself decades ago if I remember and I could be wrong on page 262 is the Peregrine Falcon.
Spot on Paul - I just checked. Page 195 is even more important though because that's Teal. John.
Are you going to look at the new 4k disc of 'star trek the motion picture directors cut' ?
I might get the four film box set now that it's going cheap Michael. I'm a bit of a Trekkie. John.
I have all 4 on bluray and nee to go back to these but poltegeist and lostboys has just turned up so it will be next payday at best for me :-( still your review has helped my buyer option on this so great vid and cheers as always. Excelsior ;-)
Thank you Delboy. I hope The Lost Boys looks terrific but I can confirm that Poltergeist will because I have it full length in 'Scope on Super 8 and it's one of the best 'quality Scope releases of all time. John.
The thing that bothers me most about the Batman 89 4K disc is the swapped out gunshot sound effects. Having watched the movie so much as a kid, I simply cannot hear the new sounds without being mentally ripped out of the movie.
I think you may have told me that before Matthew but I'd forgotten. I don't agree with changing sound or films as I consider them to be works of art of their time. But they are product made to produce revenue for private companies and if the studios can tinker with an old product to make it more appealing to a modern audience then that is going to bring in money to hopefully fund more movies.
I've had Batman on VHS since late 1989 and although I watched it to death back then I don't think the sound was good enough to imprint on my memory. Perhaps give it another try with the volume either lower or at ear splitting level to disguise those gun shots.
John.
It's been so long since I have seen this movie (I was a young kid). Interested to see it as an adult and compare to the original.
Regarding the original, my version in Canada did not have any issues with teal.
Morning Mowgli. I hadn't seen Batman Returns since 1992 so it was good to see it with fresh eyes. I still have problems watching Danny DeVito eat raw fish but it didn't make me feel as sick as it did back then.
Good to know you didn't have any problems with ducks on your copy of Batman either. It does seem to be down to certain televisions making the picture appear slightly blue or green in some scenes as I had it a bit on my telly but not to the point I'd have spotted it and thought it worth mentioning.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 I have a Sony xh90 if that helps others
@@Mowglibaloo2 Now you've made me think that I should have asked people with the duck problem to have left a comment with the make and model of their telly. Oh well, too late now. John.
Could you please review Bram Stokers Dracula on ULTRA 4K Blu Ray Next for its 30th Anniversary
I'll have to take another peak at that one Daniel but I did get it and look at it in the expectation of doing a review video but the 4K was relatively poor and so I didn't bother. Probably nothing wrong with the 4K and more the way the film looked in 1992. I hadn't seen it in all the intervening years but remembered that I really liked the first half and not so much the second and it was the same with the viewing on 4K. Having said all this, I've learned quite a bit about how these cine to video transfers are done and I may be able to interpret the image quality better now so I'll take another look sometime.
John.
Nice review, think I’ll stick with the Blu-rays unless a real good deal comes my way….you know me.
I purchased Batman Returns because is was £9.99 Gary and I'd had quite a few requests to review it. I think HMV still have it on offer as they're doing all sorts of Batman related deals right now. John.
I am not a big fan of Tim Burton. But I think that his two Batman movies is his best movies to date.
I certainly won't argue with you there Niels. Only Tim Burton could have been responsible for those two films. John.
For me, “Batman” is a nostalgic trip to a simpler time. It’s visually stunning and imaginative-but as an actual movie, it’s just not that good. The summer of ‘89 was certainly a great one-and “Batman” was part of the fun.
I used to find that the first hour of Batman was great and then not so great thereafter. But just like a rash, it's grown on me. Some films do improve with age and maybe this is another of them... or maybe The Joker just doesn't get on my nerves like he once did.
John.
good video i like them both
Thank you Chris. The opening of the 1989 film has never been surpassed by anything else as far as I'm concerned. That was the Batman I always knew. John.
@@moviecollector5920 true though i really like the start of the batman
Danny De'Veto as Penguin, AKA Dr. Caligari haha, Tim Burton owes that film a lot!
I hadn't spotted that Luke so thank you. John.
@@moviecollector5920 I think a lot of his visual style comes from that era, and that film in particular, when looking at the sets of Nightmare Before Christmas etc.
@@lukekingsland5851 I do feel that Batman Returns is a little too much like Beetlejuice in some ways Luke. Nightmare Before Christmas too and maybe even Mars Attacks. John.
We watched poltergeist 4K last night…they did a fantastic job with this I recommend you get it…never looked better and even though there was no Dolby atmos the remastered dts track is revelatory
Good to know it's another fabulous 4K release Barrie. I've had it for years on Super 8 and it's one of the best ever 'Scope Super 8 prints. I was only thinking that it was about time I ran those magical reels again so you may have just encouraged me to do so. Good to know they didn't remix the sound into Dolby Atmos too because they might have messed it up. Better to stick with the original sound where possible... although some mono films from the late 1970's have certainly benefited from a multi-channel remix.
John.
Both look and sound amazing in 4k and I enjoy them both but Batman is just the better film in my opinion.
That's two of us Jace but it's going to be interesting to see how many prefer the sequel. John.
Ok, thanks for the review. Right, I'm going to hopefully watch the original tonight on my PJ... and then tomorrow go Batman Returns. I've literally not watched the 1989 since the flicks as I never liked it, yet bought it in packs multiple times... and I'm comment back with my honest opinion and certainly take into consideration your thoughts as well. Will report back Sunday!
I will be looking forward to reading what you think about them both Mark. The opening of Batman portrays Batman as I always knew him in the comics so that alone would always make that film stand apart from anything else. If he'd have chucked that hoodlum off the roof I wouldn't have been at all surprised. John.
@@moviecollector5920 Ok... this is my take. I've just watched Batman again for the first time in 33 years since the cinema and here are my thoughts prior to watching Batman Returns tomorrow (17th September) which is fair so I don't compare them straight away. I'll split this into two sections really, one on the 4k disc and the other on the film. Apologies for the lengthy review... but there is a lot to discuss on this one!
Ok, first things first the 4k transfer and disc. I enjoyed the aspect ratio of this filling nigh on the whole 10ft screen so gave it that full on cinema look, something a lot of modern films miss. It is however, a drab/dour looking film with very little colour and varying degrees of good and bad blacks... a washed out feel to it somewhat... which is fine as this suits the city scape and I really enjoyed some of the old school matte effects, even on 4k and obviously false, they have an old school charm and certainly prefer to a world of CGI. There are scenes of pure detail and other where focus struggles a little but to be expected on this kind of production. All in all, a solid if not striking image although I would have to say, once Joker is in full glory in the purple get up... the colours and details go up a notch or two and those scenes pop a little more.
Sound wise, I actually liked this Atmos remix and Danny Elfmans score was outstanding (it's a shame over the years all his scores sounded the same with barely any variation!)... in certain scenes there's plenty of echo in the surrounds/height i.e. in the warehouse etc.. slight caveat, the dialogue was almost too clear almost removing the voices from the film especially in the early scenes sounding/looking like it was dubbed... but I'd prefer this than struggling to hear words (see Tenet, Nope). It is biased towards the front but there's certainly an array of things happening for for the era I really was surprised at the sound more than the picture have to admit! So considering the original material/date and cinematography and what they were trying to achieve I'd give it a 6/10 picture and a 7/10 for sound.
So, moving onto the film... I have to admit, 40 minutes into the film I was surprised how much I was enjoying it... I was ready to be converted... then I felt the movie just lost it's way somehow... became a little messy with more "set scenes" rather than the movie flow and story which I'd appreciated in the first 1/3rd of the film... and like I remembered from 1989... the musical museum scene came back to haunt me... a scene that in my opinion was never needed... I know what they were trying to do, but it always for me seemed out of place especially the choice of "music". The final act pulls together and weirdly reminded me of the finale of The Crow with a similar setting. I do think they could of edited the middle act a little tighter though I'll be honest... whern I checked the running time I feel there was a good 5 minutes that wouldn't be missed from a fat middle act?
The effects/makeup on Nicolson... superb and just shows what we can do without computers. The sets did feel grand if a little empty i.e. I never quite felt it was a real city i.e. populated... which is weirdly I think the opposite of what you said in review? so it'll be interesting to see how Batman Returns pans out from a sets perspective so I can do the same comparison. I do like the film noir feel to it like reminding me somehow of Sam Spade film plus little things like the police in silloette through glass etc... with the 1930's look to villains... it does have a nice balance of comic book/film to it, something the Bale films 100% did not... I'm not a comic book reader but I can see a clear connection and it works.
I loved the old Batmobile, you forget just how good it looked... performance wise, Basinger (wow) was actually surprisingly good in the role, a lot better than I remember her... Nicolson was his usual enigmatic self and for the time late 80s, played it perfectly...I am actually surprised he took the role at that point in his career. Keaton who I do genuinly rate rate nailed it as Wayne/Batman... a solid supporting cast with so many familiar faces I'd forgot about, Fairbrass, Palance etc.
So, how do I rate the film... well I'm going for a 6/10. In it's day I can see why it was so loved... but for me... I can't quite buy into it properly and I'm not sure why...
So, lets see what Batman Returns brings.
@@MrPugheaven Excellent post Mark and thank you for taking the time. I expect part of my appreciation for the film is from my love of the original comics and you're spot on there with the 1930's style crooks because that's exactly how they looked in the early comics. It's a combination of the best years of Batman comics though and you are right that the 'Dark Knight' trilogy did not match the look of the comics. Those Christopher Nolan films were still damned good though. In 1989 I loved about the first hour and then felt that it went a little too over the top. I had it on VHS and watched it many times but always found that I didn't like the second half which is largely what you've just said too. I hadn't watched it for many years when I finally purchased the 4K and time had changed my opinion. I enjoyed Jack Nicholson's Joker portrayal more than ever and for that reason the second half of the film did not play the same way as it always had. Perhaps I was expecting to be disappointed with the second half but this time around I was laughing at the crazy nature of it all and that made the difference. The image quality is better than I think you've given it credit for but it's so often down to equipment that it's impossible to all agree on the results. I actually prefer the look of Batman to Batman Returns but I think you may prefer 'Returns' because the definition is far too good for a 35mm transfer. Results like Batman Returns should be made illegal otherwise we'll expect such clarity all the time!
Thanks again for such a long and good comment Mark. Good luck with Batman Returns this evening.
John.
@@moviecollector5920 Ok... finished Batman Returns and wow... once again I'll give you my thoughts John in two sections and I've not seen this film in approximatley a decade so, it was good to reconnect with it again so thank you for your reviews, as it's making me think about revisiting films again:
The 4k disc... what a fantastic transfer this is... if there is DNR it wasn't to a point of distraction and all I got was a fantastically DEEP picture with deeper blacks that actually looked black instead of washed out greys.. adding SO MUCH MORE depth than the original washed out Batman 1989. Have to say we will disagree on this... I thought the picture was fantastic going from an almost black and white in a considerable amount of scenes... to some stunning colour especially in the final 1/3rd of the film and tyhe reflections in the Artic World sewer... for me this blows the 1989 into the weeds asthetically. I do think HDR helps here though, fires, highlights etc all pop alot more and it makes for an almost 3D like imagine which I liked... the 1989 was just too flat for me personally.
For sound, well once again, another level for me compared to 1989 original... a fuller more grand sound stage in Atmos... a deeper fuller front stage... I was truly shocked just how good this sounded, from small things happening I'd never heard to the depth in the voices... so from me my scoring is Picture = 8/10 and Sound = 8/10 (bearing in mind both do obviously need to be compared to reference modern day so I can't give them 10/10, but for their era right up there for me!).
As for the film, once again, borderline perfect comic book film for me. From the opening scenes with the Cobblepots, the snow throughout the film and setting it at Xmas... there's barely a moment where I found myself distracted, this for me as I remember in 1992 (possibly my favourite and what I call golden year) really truly brought me into comic book adaptations and how I thought they should be done (I've since lost all faith in the last 10 years!). For me, it's dark, moody, darkly comedic... and as you stated Devito's performance quite frankly blew Jack Nicolsons away from 1989... absolute perfection as was Pfiffer (did she ever act or look more stunning?). Walken who is one of my personal favourite actors of all time was perfect for that role. I would normally not like alot of protagantists in my film like you stated in your review (too many villains can cause problems as we found out in later films), however, because the focus was on Catwomen and Penguin I didn't feel that Shreck was one too many... and as Batman takes a side role in this film compared to others I felt it allowed Penguin and Catwomens stories to unfold better instead of just being baddies... I truly had emphathy for them.
As a side note, I was paying particular attention to the sets... I do see where you are coming from. The sets of which there are many do not quite have the sheer scale somehow as the originals... BUT I'd argue that they were more detailed small sets? Not sure, but I agree the sets feel different here than on the 1989 original,
So, all in for me, you know what I have to give this a 9/10 for comic film. I'm not the biggest genre fan by any stretch but over the years when I look at the ones that stand out for me, Batman Returns, The Crow, Ironman, Blade etc... I truly think that Batman 1992 stands out in it's own right.
So, now you've reignited my Batman light... I'm going to continue and move onto Batman Forever tomorrow night. Not sure if you carried on yourself to do all four of the early films, I think I will now. Thanks Mark
@@MrPugheaven That's given me a real lift this morning Mark so thank you! You've made me want to take another look at Batman Returns now so you should be doing these reviews on RUclips too. I suspect I will always like the 1989 film better but different equipment as the years go on will no doubt give me different impressions of each of the two films down the line. What I really need are 35mm prints of them so I can see exactly how they looked on theatrical general release. That would make for an interesting follow-up video.
John.
Batman Returns brilliant. Music brilliant
And with an exceptionally fine grain picture quality too. They don't come much better from 35mm full frame anamorphic. John.
I consider Returns a reference disk
I think it's a 35mm reference disc Brian but 35mm doesn't match the quality of 70mm films. Good work went into this 4K disc though, no doubt about that. The noise reduction might have been a little too liberal but it managed to avoid the waxy look so excellent work. John.