We Got TROUBLE!! Everythig was going so good :-0
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- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
- In this video I finally put a test indicator on the table and spindle of this little grinder and was shocked at what I found both in a good way and bad way. Guess there is nothing left to do but try and fix this guy ;-) I'm not to worried about what I found. It will be a good learning experience if nothing else. Thanks to all my subscribers new and old, I really do appreciate you watching.
Looks like the grinding wheel did a good job on the motor power cord. Might be a good idea to replace and secure it.
I think I would just start by using some shims, maybe 0.003 under the rails and test again
I wouldn't even think about doing those on the shaper Steve. That is grinder work for sure.
You'll get it straightened out I'm sure of that.
I agree with you that its grinder work and I have the lower rails sorted . But I may end up having to do the saddle on the shaper and then scrap it in. I don't know anyone who would have a grinder big enough to do the saddle, Brian Block's grinder may be big enough but I'm not sure yet. I'm not sure of anything yet ;-) One way or the other this little grinder is getting fixed.. I'm just not sure how yet.. Good to see you
Must be spring. Steve got a good trim! Thanks for sharing your shop life.
Hi Steve. That really is a lovely little grinder. In your Highly skilled care i am sure you will return it to its former glory. Thank you for taking us along. Best wishes from UK
Excellent,,,,, Now I have an idea what to check for when I shop for a tool grinder. Well done Steve.
I don't know the dimensions of the table but it might fit on my grinder. You are welcome to use it if you want. It would for sure make short work of those bolt on ways.
Thanks Brian, I haven't measured the width and length of the saddle yet but it would take a big grinder. I'll get some measurements and get back with you. I am still not sure what I'm going to do. I'm mapping everything out now to make sure I am not making any stupid mistakes. I'm not above that ;-) Thanks for offering and I may take you up on it, I still got lots to figure out. Not being an experienced machine rebuilder is not helping..
My wheel will cover 12x24". i can fit probably 20x40 on my chuck but I can't grind that in one setup.
bcbloc02 The saddle is about
11" x 17" Brian, how big is your grinder?
bcbloc02 Ok, I just seen you posted the dimensions, That may work🤔.
Steve only an Old Iron Junkie can appreciate the affection we have for our old Iron. I almost sent my little Southbend Shaper a Valentine card ! LOL
I spent a couple years in the cutter grind shop before I got the job I have now. We used a wrench like this to break loose the nut and get the wheel and arbor off the shaft.
m.mscdirect.com/mobileweb/product_detail?id=05924204&hasRestrictedParts=false
We would keep a short brass at the machine, about 3/4 diameter and 4" long, you can put the spanner on the nut and wrap the edge of the spanner and break loose the nut. Then you can use the forked end between the arbor and the flange on the spindle and pop the arbor off the spindle with a flip of the wrist while holding the wheel with the other hand. I'm not going to say that is the correct way to do it, obviously it seems counter intuitive to smack the spindle, but it is how we did it. I was a kid at the time and whatever the older guys said to do is what I did. I will say that in the cutter shop I worked in we would change wheels quite a bit and this was a quick way to do it. We never used a puller, the wrench works quite nicely to knock the arbor loose from the spindle.
Good update. I agree with you and some other commenters, a surface grinder would be the tool of choice for the job, mostly to control removing as little a material as possible. One question I thought of, at the 6:00 mark you started using a parallel to span the entire depth of the table, since most or all attachments clamp to the center 2 ribs how much runout would be found using a shorter parallel? You mentioned in the last video the outer edges were mostly to control coolant/oil, I wonder if the outer edges were never ground evenly or possibly beat up by a previous operator. Just a thought. For an entry level machine its a very nice one, is be happy to have a similar one in my shop. Also I'm the same way sometimes about details, I get lost. Clean, lube, replace the known bad cords and bearings, run the machine to learn it and then start repairs if really needed, like you said most work is done in a small amount of travel. Looking forward to the next installment, possibly at Brian Bloc's shop for some surface grinding! Yahoo
The table is flat and in good shape, I may be visiting Brian soon, we will see. I still have loads of detective work to do before I work on the saddle.. Good to see you Jim
Steve, You might be able to take part of that wear out of the roller containing parts with sandpaper on your surface plate, checking with your indicator from time to time, and save the rest of your repair until you got to use a good surface grinder on it.
Before further work, you need to check, and possibly correct if necessary, if the column is perpendicular to the table and indexes. If your times free, then hand scrape the two roller slide ways parallel and flat to correct for the cross slide error, looks like fine grain to standard cast iron combination, so will function without lubrication. Remember the cross slide is an adjustment slide, not a reciprocating one. I concur with the guys here who say the machine is useable, as is, but it would be nice to see it re-manufactured. Great channel.
Steve . Don't you just love taking things apart , I like watching the way you go about checking parts for wear then formulating a plan to rectify. End result is a machine that is more accurate and in better condition than when you acquired it .
Yet again Steve, a really interesting and educational video. I’m not a machinist by any stretch but your videos allow me to do things in ways I never thought of and with a lot more accuracy. Awesome job, thanks.
Thank you very much
If you're not familiar with Keith Fenner, here on RUclips you should check him out. He's a wealth of knowledge and seems to have a great deal of experience with all things machining. He may be able to get you in the right direction on improving this beauty. Great overview, I always look forward to updates on this little guy.
Great video, love the watching the dissection in progress. Thanks for sharing.
Neat videos Steve. Thanks for your time sharing your work and tips. Good luck. It seems the design almost needs an improvised side locating groove to reduce the amount the saddle tips as it is wound out. ie have a precision key and slot instead of the side wheels. Also, random tip: put a small ziptie on your Allen wrench set. Slides to allow you to select the key then slide back to keep other keys captive.
Thanks for another educational video. Your investigation into the machine helps me to see what I need to look for.
LOL, take what I do with a grain of salt, I'm just a student.
You know if it really bugs you I’d get some .003” shim stock, BUT, remember this is a tool cutter grinder, Not a surface grinder. Your Y axis advances the tool into the grinding wheel to sharpen the edge of the tool cutter. Your Y axis movement is only in thousandths, maybe .005” total to sharpen a worn edge. I’ll let you figure it out, if you have .003-.004 movement over 3-4” of table movement what would be the error be in .005-.010” of table movement. I wouldn’t lose any sleep over it. In fact, thinking about it, I wonder if that taper might be intentional to compensate for eventual wear.
You said it for me Wayne P
Igus make nice products too. self lubricating strips glued on the ways, machinable, scrappable...
Nice little machine! Run out doesn't really matter on a grinding machines spindle, as soon as you dress the wheel it cancels out any run out. Obviously extreme run out isn't ideal. Checking the end float and lift in the spindle bearings is much more important, and will affect surface finish, and in some case cause the wheel to load up if it's excessive.
That makes sense, I have very little experience with grinding so what matters and what don't is still new to me.
Thanks for watching and thank for the comment.
But what about diamond grinding wheels? I wouldn’t think that those can be dressed the same way a normal grinding wheel can, right?
David Miller normally diamond wheels have a slightly bigger bore, so once fitted to the flange and spindle, you leave the flange slightly loose and clock/knock the wheel true, because as you say they can't be dressed like a conventional wheel. Other wise even on a spindle with zero run out, you still need abit of clearance to fit it to the flange and you find you may only be cutting on 30percent of the wheel.
I've always lightly tapped the back of the arbor with a piece of aluminum or a very small brass hammer. Lightly is the key, anything more and you have to take the whole spindle off. By small hammer I'm talking 1" diameter by 2.5" long on an 8" handle. I wouldn't use the shaper on any of that, there are big grinders out there and if someone grinds the saddle, the same wheel (if dished) can be used to bump the faces for the rollers. Grind the ways flat, shimming is a quick fix but not permanent. They don't shim them at the factory.
You might want to make a holder for a wiper strip on each end to remove the grit from the guides, and then , as the oil reservoir is above there, drill a hole through the base into the ways in a place always covered with the guide, and place a wick in the hole to allow oil flow into the way. Will flush out the grit slowly as it is extruded from the wiper strip.
Know anybody who can hard surface that guide, or even have an induction hardened guide if the metal can be hardened. Would definitely replace the rollers though, cam followers are cheap enough and durable, and those old ones will have grit in the inner bearings for sure. If making new ones I would suggest making them a lot longer so as to have a larger bearing area and thus decreased wear on the table, plus it will cock less with overhang.
Bearings with rubber seals can be lubed with a grease gun if you can find a hypodermic needle adapter, which I used on a regular basis, or I suppose a regular hypodermic from a drug store or farm supply store. You can also pop the seals off. There are some trick bearing greases too. Synthetic auto would do. Automotive bearing grease tended to dry out or be contaminated out rather than metal failure.
if you cant get it as good as you want you could stick liner rails with ball rollers in there really easy if all else fails.seen it done to fix a v-way mill that was toast other wise he got it down to .00017 across the hole 54" bed. thanks for sharing
Good detective work Steve. More pride in making it right after figuring it out. Every time you use it you can rest easy - it's right.
_Dan_
Thanks Dan Good to see you
Two wedges that can be put between the two flanges and then forced together would remove those holders without threads. You could even make a tool which has one forked pair of wedges that are screwed towards an opposing fork to wedge it off.
if you need to grind it.. make a holder for the grindingspindel to the shaper!
I just came up with the idea, I'm gonna try it myself ,when i'll need a grinder.
I have a grinding wheel for the mill , but the grit gets on everything . on the shaper you can grind away from the machine
you can use a wedge to pull the wheel off the spindle (i suspect that's why the spindle arbor has that flange).
if the ways are straight maybe you can just use a shim to align them, probably they're not worn evenly but it's worth a shot to check (or even maybe scrape one of the pads on each side), though I think you probably got the right idea to grind them
Steve, I realize this is an older video and you may have already fixed this issue, but I just looked at it again because of my own work on my universal grinder and I wondered if it would be possible (enough material left) to cut the internal threads on the wheel hubs that don't have them. Absolute accuracy would not be that big of a deal on those I guess....
I love watching your videos!
Peter
first.. put a second block across your back door about 16 inches up. do you have a precision level.. get the post on the grinder vertical.. then check the pads where the cross slide ways bolt down to see if those are level with the vertical. this will allow you to add shim stock to level the bolt on ways.. getting rid of the taper in your z axis. i wonder.. before doing any grinding. if you have checked the z axis on the upper part of the grinder.. i see dovetails up high. just to make sure that the 2 surfaces are parallel.
the puller.. are the threads that hold the nut on the stone the same size of your stone holders.. the OD thread to a puller stud.. i would probably counter bore the end of the stud. put a single ball bearing in it and put a wide face T plug in it to push against the end face of the Double D nut.. i don't like pushing against that but i can't see any other way. since you are going to make this.. you might use a 20 or 24 pitch thread. even a 28.. an Oring groove on the T pusher or a one cut in the counterbore will hold the T in the end of your puller tool. no use dropping the tool end out each time you pick it up. you could also use a o ring groove to retain the ball in the back of the counter bore. i hate chasing balls when they fall out. you could just use a thick cross section oring to retain the ball in the counter bore also without needing to groove it.
i wonder about using hardened shim stock where the rollers push against the side of the carriage.. www.grainger.com/product/LYON-Steel-Shim-Stock-Roll-22ME59
Other than repeating yourself several times, you make some GREAT VIDEO'S Steve!
From the limited views you have some really nice machines! I'm like you in that we are not professionals in machine repair, but we both have a ton of common sense and therefore not afraid to dive into something if nothing else, just to see how the damn thing works!!!
I have a question or two, can I message you?
Great job, I think your on the right track in that it needs to be ground to bring it back into specs. I would not use the shaper to do this one!!!
All the best man, thanks for taking us on your journey!!!
Razor!
I film in clips and sometimes forget if I had covered a topic or not. I find out when editing and cut it if I can without loosing other content. I seen the repeat but decided to leave it in because cutting it would have looked funny. My videos are loaded with mistakes here and there. I just don't have time to redo them. You can private message my YT account and I will give you my email.
Steve Summers,
No worries man, I'm just busting your "you know"...
The content you cover isn't over done and that is most important, I think!! Well done man and you've definitely got a fan!!
Look forward to the next one.
I'll be in touch...
Razor!
Enjoyed Steve!
ATB, Robin
BTW Steve, thanks for your videos, I find them very interesting and informative.
Regarding pulling the non-threaded hubs off the arbour: Could you not remove the left hand threaded stone retainer nut and have a puller designed to use the external threads on the hub as an anchorage? A piece of internal threaded tube or pipe to match the external left hand thread that is capped, drilled and threaded for a jack screw that would push against the arbour comes to mind.
Thanks for sharing.
Sure would seem that a motorcycle flywheel/magneto puller would be an ideal tool for pulling those hubs, as long as the internal bore is threaded.
Thanks steve, nice job of this one, volume ,picture all good
There is 2 versions of that puller, internal and external. Get the internal 1 it will pay off in spades when you use a diamond wheel for carbide. You need to zero out that diamond wheel to the arbor and leave it on. As far as leavening a regular wheel on an arbor I wouldn't worry about that because eachother time You change a wheel you have to dress it anyway. Feel free to ask questions. Randy
Removal of arbor (12:00 minutes) without the internal thread: I don't know the design intent for this machine, but I have seen machines that use a removal tool that threads on the external threads and presses the taper apart with a jack screw against the center the same way as the tool for the internally threaded ones.
Aha. That;s easier than the wedge idea I posted. Good one.
scraping instead of grinding will hold oil much better. If you grind it , then you should flake it.
Whoa, I noticed at around 15:00 that Steve is carrying. Not surprised, I heard there are some sasquatch in them thar hills where he lives.
That's what the drop bar on the door is for.... Sasquatch!
The Y axis is the in feed for metal removal of the cutting tool to be sharpened. Generally never more than a thou at a time. Often less. The X axis is the one that does all the work. That machine will sharpen a cutting tool as is. However, now it's in pieces...
Regards,
Fellow T&CG owner,
NE Thailand.
Im sure that it will work as is , I'm just not happy with the accuracy of the movements . For me sharping a cutter is only part of the fun. I enjoy working on machine tools and learning machine tool alignment ,correcting errors ect . Not a problem for this machine to be out of service for as long as it takes to get it back true. I dont plan to make money with this machine , its only a hobby.
Thanks for watching , Glad to know they are people out there who have experience running a t&cg.
it looks like the side pieces on your saddle bolt on too. if they do you can take them off and grind them as well.
I think the ways could be shimmed level, it's a constant grade front to back.
Table flatness on the cutter grinder is no big deal unless you are r\trying to use it as a surface grinder. Most tools are ground in some form of workhead that orients and sometimes guides the tool. Even if doing work between centers the runout in the table will. have negligible effect. You use the jackscrews on the end or the table to eliminate taper, or to introduce taper, depending on the work you are doing.
When you use a surface gage & indicator on the surface plate, you should move the part, not the gage.
I’d say you have some shop-made hubs, and that the maker didn’t bother with the internal threads. All of my hubs have those threads. That said, it generally takes almost no torque on the puller screw to remove the hub. The LH threads on the retaining nut insure that it won’t come loose, even if you don’t use much torque installing it. Keep in mind that way wipers can attract grinding dust and do a good job ‘lapping’ the ways, also.
Could be shop made hubs.. After I'm finished with the machine surfaces I plan to skirt the lower section with leather. Good to see you Paul
Don't we all wish we had a magic ''ROBRENZ button'' in the shop where Robin would pop up out of thin air and help you with your mechanical problem whenever you needed? Why not get in touch with Robin himself? What I really wanna see is him breathing on top of your part and see how much it deflects!
Funny you say that, I just talked to him on the phone this morning. He is a real good guy and willing to help.
I second that, some great insight from his channel. I learned a lot.
A micrometer end to end would show taper/wear on the ways that are worn.
Steve, the method you used to check the X axis does not tell you much. If the table was warped gradually downward toward the ends and the bottom of the saddle matched it, the indicator would not move at all even with some severe wear, a curved axis. Surface grinders and mills often have that problem. Check the bottom of the table and the top of the ways with a good straightedge to get a rough idea. Also, before doing anything, make sure you are using the correct sequence of operations to achieve parallel and square on all axes with a minimum of metal removal and effort. If you do not have a copy of "Machine Tool Reconditioning" by Edward Connelly, get one, and read and understand the concepts. Much of it is not really intuitive. Find the machine reference surfaces and work from them to achieve correct geometry and parallelism. If you do not have a copy of the Connelly book, contact me and I will help you with that.
Bob Korves Thanks Bob, I do have a copy of Connelly' book. I have datum / unworn surfaces on the ways of the table that seem to agree with what I am seeing on the X. I'm still not 100% sure of anything yet. I plan to work from the main casting up. The saddle is my main concern. What I'm seeing on the table I may be able to live with. I need a bigger surface plate before I can make any accurate measurements.
+ lots of homework 👍
Great, sounds like you are on the right track, Steve.
Like Wayne said, this is a KO Lee. I was a cutter grinder for GE back in the 70's and we had a dozen of these little grinders for doing single point tools and for grinding endmills with a work head and a Weldon fixture. This is not a Surface Grinder. Even new ones weren't all that close.
That just seems strange to me, In my mind a cutter grinder should be as accurate machine.. But I admit I know almost nothing about them never using one before. Thanks for watching and commenting.
Steve Summers As accurate as what? These were never designed to be surface grinders. Have you ever ground reamers, end mills, single point tools or drill tips? Think about what is happening and consider where the motion accuracy is coming from. The accuracy is coming from the table traverse and the attachments like an airflow fixture, work head or wheel head. Infeed in this case is just how much you will be dusting off the work as long as the distance measurement is good you can at least accurately grind off material. Straightness and axis squareness at least is very fixable in this case. At some point in time when you can get access to a surface grinder th is issue can be fixed. That is a very clean KO Lee. .
Looks like you are on your way to a good machine.
That should be easy to fix Steve. Good luck
never seen that before but the smooth bore collet nut have 2 holes if tapped, a normal gear puller could be used
Like others have suggested, try using some shims, at least for the time being. Get the dimensions from those ways while they are out, and prepare to make new ones. Make a shout out for suggestions on improving them, at least in the lubrication department.
Stefan has demonstrated on how "cheaper, entry level" equipment leaves room for ideas on improvement, why not do that here?
That was very interesting. But remember, this is a tool and cutter grinder. So suppose you were sharpening a 1" endmill. So you put it in a collet and adjust all the angles (there are many) then drive the table. For your average endmill the movement will be the radius of the endmill. Not much - 0.5". Will the .003" error in Y matter that much? Dunno but I doubt it. I would go about this backward. Try sharpening a drill bit on it . Does the grind come out OK? If not. you are right. Grind or scrape the pads. Otherwise move on to an endmill. The only site I know about that covers T&C grinders is Stefan Gotteswinter.
Hello, new to your channel. I enjoyed this video, and will check out more as time allows. But I was wondering about your DTI.
I pride myself on knowing a lot about machinist tool brands, but have never seen a Highwood branded DTI. It looks like a Brown and Sharpe, or interapid style. Curious where you picked it up?
Steve Watroba It was made in Japan. I bought it used off fleabay. It really is a nice test indicator at .00001" smooth and responsive. I had not seen them before either but it was cheap and it being made in Japan is the reason I bought it. Glad I did because it has become favorite and most used test indicator.
Thanks for stopping by and glad you enjoyed the video. I have plenty more.
A generic puller or bearing puller should do what you need for all your wheel adapters.
If those WAYS are identical, I would ponder the idea of trying to see what the Run-out would be if you put the LEFT WAY and the RIGHT WAY in Each-other's Position.. Then check the RUN OUT.. Check to see if there are markings to show proper installation? Just something to consider?? Maybe..... They might be able to be "Shimmed" ????
Spindle -The runout on both the male and female tapers shout be around 15 microns. Also on the male arbor where the wheel fits on the resting lip should also be 15 microns.this is on all the spindle grinder I have worked on. As well as all cnc spindles
Once you fix the ways what about some oil grooves? I look fwd to some videos on using this machine. I've always wondered how they were used.
As others have stated, they surely appear they could be flipped. If not...I would first try shimming.... that aside...doing nothing is likely fine for a t&c grinder, at least for now.
I might be "way" off :P, but seeing that the wear is constant in one direction and that the ways are only seating in two small places, couldn't be a solution just to hand scrape the front seating surface to correct the inclination?
Worse case you get some turcite and scrape them in and add oil channels maybe a little oil driper to each side. Might add a knife edge way scrapers made from G10 by copying what your scraper has.
Options too many options not enough time....or money......
The end caps on the right removable way, missing on the left, looks like it should hold our could hold way wipers.
sean van buren It had metal shields but no wipers. I removed them for service. I plan to skirt this machine with leather and make new shields\ wipers.
So yes you are correct👍.
Thanks for watching and commenting
looks like you could flip those slides over and use the other side? also it seems some oil channels might be a good idea, wicks and somwhere to oil it from
Jusb1066 Really? Flip them over? Think on that just a short time. 1) Counterbored mounting holes. Where do the bolt heads go? 2) The wear pattern has the ways in a wedge shape. There will still be slope.
I agree about need for lubrication. Perhaps study the shaper's method. It might yield some interesting ideas.
i admit i did not think about the bolts, but as for the wear, it would easily be shimmed under two bolt holes, fixings could also be counterbored the other side it has worn in a strange way, rather than a dip in the middle and high at both ends, it should be shimmable on one end
I was thinking switch them left to right. Then the taper would be opposite the taper on the table ways. He said there was .006 but only sees .003 on the lower half. The spring load would be reversed though which may not work against the force of the wheel, I've never run a grinder.
Shim It. Your Not Far Out and In Your Case Shims Will Do The Trick. As Far As The Roller Wear It Is More Important That All 4 Rollers Are Working Correctly And The Spring Tension Is Consistent . The Wear Should Be Consistent As Well. You Can Design Some Type Of Oiling Devise And Wipers As Well. Before You Operate It Make Sure Every Bearing You Can Find Is In Good Condition. The Bearings Are The Most Important Small Part Of The Entire Machine.
hi steve. thank you for doing these videos.you mentioned using your shaper on the saddle. i have an old 7 inch shaper. when i first got it i cleaned the ram ways and gib and shimmed the table. every time i put something in the vise and shaped it it was from 2 to 7 thousands off. one day i had a job too big for the vise so i removed it and bolted the piece right to the table. i checked the piece on the surface plate and it was within 2 tenths. i thought it was a fluke but everything i bolt to the table is accurate to way less than a thou. have you ever removed your vice in a similar situation ? i would guess that your vice weighs more than my entire shaper including the motor and stand.
I have the same grinder and the same issues.
Keith Rucker from Vintage Machinery has a larger grinding machine.
Lifetime lube means lubed for the life of the bearing that depends on fresh lube getting to the bearings. Grease is oil dissolved in lithium or other soap - It eventually dries out and cannot reach the bearings until they start to fail and the heat of friction melts the dried grease. Permanently lubed bearings are a reaction by manufacturers to jack leg mechanics contaminating and over tightening them causing failure under warranty.
I completely agree. I'm not sure what to do about spindle lube at this time. I'm sure after 20 - 30 years the lube in this spindle is far from good. I plan to address it at some point soon. I just have not had time to do the research necessary to come at this issue informed.
Steve Summers , Wait until you get a manual and see how hard bearing access is and how much bearings cost. The spindle bearings in my Sioux valve grinder were noisy when I got it 30 years ago and under light usage initially, to no usage in the last 15 years it seemed to get no worse.
You could use Don Bailey's friend cigarette papers of brass shim stock.
Sharon HKW has some nice video on balancing the wheels.
Yeah, I watched him do it the other day. They are several good videos on the subject out there. Thanks for watching
We all learn from each other and what ever perspective an individual is looking at resolving an issue. We are both students as long as we are willing to learn. Appreciate your humble nature and humor.
In my comment about balancing the wheel that was Shadon HKW, automatic spelling gets me.
That kind of machines are NOT as accurate as you may think. You should try to make that guides parallel on the shaper. No need to grind. Light pass on the shaper and some finish scraping.Shims can be also used (i used it on mine). In the video is not clear where the taper direction is on the guide. Accordingly with standard indicators the guide is thick near the spindle (back side). Have you measured if the saddle and table together are parallel ?
I'm not sure the wear is that big of a deal for a cutter grinder, in theory you aren't moving the table that much for end mills and such. These are not like surface grinders, but I don't own a cutter grinder so take what I say with a grain of salt. Keep in mind the travel when sharpening bits, most are not that big and not too much travel is needed.
On the spindles could you use to tapered wedges to take off the arbor
Is there any way you can add an oiling system for the ways on there? How would you keep the grit out of the oiling ports?
Can you shim those guides at one end to take up the wear ?
00.00-7.00 was just endless repetition- you can say all that stuff while working.
Are the ways worn to the same extent? You commented on approximately 0.008" wear when you checked the table, but you only demonstrated half of that on the bed after the table was removed. It's an interesting problem, forgive me if this is completely wrong, but if the wear is so consistent, could you not just shim it? Whatever the solution, it needs oil ways and button oilers minimum afterwards.
Best
Stuart
Hi mate. Not telling you what to do but I think that the power-lead needs some electrical tape ; )
Marcel Timmers No way. LoL. I talked about the wiring already in last week's video.
I do not see why a guy could not just shim those bars up the thickness they are worn. I think that is what I would try, because if you grind the bar (ways) you are going to have a problem with the alignment of the feed screw and you will still need to shim them if you make them thinner.
end theek een nieuw kabbel
Dear Steve,
Maybe first trying to solve the problem by using shimms.
Good luck,
Ron
it is interesting it has worn into a near constant angle than the usual of dip in the middie and rising at both ends
I believe that is because the entire way is always in contact with the saddle. He will probably find some sag in the bottom of the saddle though.
Send it out to someone with a large surface grinder and have it done right. No point in spoiling the machine by skimping a few dollars.
Look up a forked wedge that is used on Jacobs chucks. Make two. I have noticed the surface grinder sites recomend leaving the wheel hubs with the wheels to preserve the balance. Make or buy more hubs for each wheel you have.
A balancing fixture for the wheels is a good project.
Thanks
Dennis Williams I
Most tool and cutter grinding uses fairly small od wheels (usually 4.0 inches ) so balance is not critical...on older machines bearing would be a concern if vibration becomes a problem
There are absolutely no provisions for lubing the saddle ways like the table, via wicking from an oil reservoir?
No, but I am thinking of adding one
Steve, you mentioned that you don't have a manual for this machine. Have you checked with Keith Rucker - VintageMachinery.org ? I know that he is involved with creating a huge archive of manuals etc. for old/vintage/historic/redundant machinery. Peter.
Well, since those ways only have two contact points why not just shim it?
SORRY.. I should have read the Replies..
I would say the same thing just flip it 👍
Might want to check spindle bearing lube.
It seems to be a sealed unit that is preloaded and "life time lubed " But I could be wrong, haven't dug that deep yet.
Steve Summers , Well, I guess there is little harm in waiting for failure depending in the price, availability, and difficulty of access, replacement, and greasing. Precision bearings are beyond my 30-40 years of auto experience. At some point early on, I started examining failed and other replaced standard ball and roller bearings (usually because of noise, play, age, quality of grease, discoloration, brutal installation, sketchy appearing grease and an accumulation of factors) and brutality and grease failure/age were the two main causes. If the bearings are noisy, they are pretty much beyond repair, but lube may slow deterioration. Be gentle and press in bearings avoiding force that loads bearing balls, avoid hammers when possible and use a driver that supports inner and outer race. Balls can dent the races if forces are excessive. Rollers are much more durable, but I have seen yellowing or bluing from gross over-tightening of tapered rollers. With balls and rollers there has to be enough room for the oil film, shear forces can cause great heating. Have I droned on enough? Sorry!
How about just shiming the ways up seeing they are screwed on with just two points of contact
You seem to forget that this is a cutter grinder not a surface grinder. How much movement of the table will be required to sharpen a cutter? Your cutter will move in respect to the grind wheel. Yes I know that you want it perfect, don't we all.
Yeah I have thought about it. Not sure that in actual use that small inaccuracies will make much difference. I do want it close but not looking for perfection. I think I could deal with .0001 deviation over the entire travel in
X Y ;-) Just kidding. I just want it close for my own mental well being..
a trip to brian blocks maybe??
Could be.... Not sure yet. Thanks for watching
swap them to the opposite side and check again
why not just shim two of the four points the ways carry on
or scrape down two of the points
they probably scraped/ground down the points in the factory to get the table levell
Scrape the base
what brand and model is the grinder?
BA860 KO LEE
Is the wear on the top or on the ways?
From everything I'm seeing so far it looks to be on the removable casting ways and on the bottom of the saddle.
Steve Summers I'm referring to the X axis table. I work with a vehicle mill that is worn on the top of the table. It is visible because the scraping is worn away.