When Bands Change Singers: What Makes Success Stories or Epic Fails?
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- Опубликовано: 27 сен 2024
- In episode 185 of Heavy Metal Philosophy, Jon Barbas analyzes bands from the past who changed lead singers and uses those patterns to predict the reception for Linkin Park and The Black Dahlia Murder.
What factors contribute to a band's success or failure when they change vocalists? Is it the chemistry, the fan base, or the ability to adapt? We’ll analyze key moments and the fan's reactions!
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#LinkinPark #TheBlackDahliaMurder #leadsinger
Everything you stated here is perfect. Zero arguement. Noticing that lovely Fear Factory shirt has me PINING, for Milo on vocals in a studio.
Thank you. And yea if FF put out a few good albums that would probably put them in the eras category? Then again he might crush it! 🤘🤘
@@heavymetalphilosophy i think he will. Based on his experience and training over the years, he is gonna crush it. It will be an eras thing.
The Black Dahlia Murder will forever be The Black Dahlia Murder, so they will be remembered in the way Cannibal Corpse was, I am sure of it.
Linkin Park is always a Mike Shinoda project, so if he is down, I have no problem with it either.
Changing drummers certainly doesn't seem to have affected them.
@@heavymetalphilosophy All thanks to Mike Shinoda's exceptional leadership.
Stand with you 100% on STP.
Love that band so much! 🤘🤘
Awesome topic! I just saw Sepultura on their 40th anniversary retirement tour. I was one who stopped paying much attention to that band after the Cavelera Brothers left, and now I have to catch up. Derrick Green filled a tough role and the sound changed, but he won me over. Obituary and Agnostic Front were 🤘🤘🤘 Great tour.
Fates Warning has a divided fan base that says "No disrespect to the great Ray Alder, but John Arch is not replaceable." But IMHO Matheos would have changed their sound anyway, different FW eras wasn't about the vocalist so it is not an apples to apples comparison, both are legends. For some reason in this case, I never had a problem always thinking of it as FW, not wishing for a name change.
Anthrax during the Bush era. Should have been a name change.
Thank you. Yes Sepultura and Anthrax would've been great examples to include. 🤘🤘
I respect any band trying to move forward. A salty take is Linkin Park isn't Metal! I get a lot of pushback from people over the years for saying that but it's just my opinion. Another great example I think from hearing the singles is Rivers of Nile! I think their new album is going to crush it and seems to be well received by fans🤘
Oh yeah great example. Just like TBDM, an existing member took over on lead vocals.
The Linkin Park comeback, frankly, imho, is only controversial to a few jackasses online. I'm not, to be clear, calling you "a jackass". I am just saying, most of the controversy is not genuine. These folks follow controversy to controversy. They'll forget about it and move on in a week. (Most of those folks have already moved on to other controversy.)
I think you're spot-on with putting LP in the "eras category".
Thank you for clarifying. I thought I was gonna have to go outside and hug my donkey for consolation 😆
@@heavymetalphilosophy , hahaha. Nah, the poor donkey is fine. I just get really sick of drama. I think you handled this topic well, and in a way that didn't immediately invite drama.
Shinoda still sucks 😂 no idea the extent of his engineering behind the scenes of their music but Bennington was no doubt the talent that put that band on the map. Don’t pretend here. Shinoda just talks into a microphone dudes boring
@@bobsagetsbastarddaughter4591 "Shinoda just talks into a microphone"
And that's how I know you haven't LISTENED to enough of Mike to be qualified to speak about this.
Go back and listen to some of the stuff that DIDN'T make it onto the albums if you think he just TALKS.
For a guy that did was MOSTLY rapping in the early stuff he can put alot of ANGER and SHOUTING into his vocals when he wants to.
For real! A LOT of them already moved onto the Dave Grohl controversy only a few days after the LP Reveal of Colin, Alex and Emily.
"Because of her history with Scientology or because she's not Chester". It doesn't even cross our minds that it's just good old misogyny.🙄
I'm sure there are people that hate her solely because she's a woman and no other reason but how many people is that really? What's the ratio you think?
Her defending a rapist and being part of a religion that says there's no such thing as depression replacing someone who suffered from a deadly case of depression seems quite a bit more pressing to me than her gender.
@@heavymetalphilosophy Dude, have you not paid attention to the culture war ? Anytime a film or game instroduces a women all the incels come out to bitch and moan about "woke" and "feminism" etc.
There's a whole bunch of white dudes ready to bash anything a woman does, they don't give a fuck about Scientology...
You know you're an average Linkin Park fan when you use buzzword with no explaination.
@@heavymetalphilosophy Well it's the progressive / conservative devide isn't it?
Progressive people are concerned about mental health and rape culture while conservatives are getting angry about "woke".
It's hard to give you a number, but RUclips is full of culture war videos talking about how DEI is "ruining the country" so yeah, not a majority but definitely a lot.
"live up to Meteora and Hybrid Theory"...even OG Linkin Park ages ago couldn't come close, so why put so much pressure on a new band to do the same? One More Light album was absolute dog shit, boring, uninspired, poppy but not enough catch to measure to the competition.
Fair point.
The song OML is great, the rest of the album not so much
When the songwriter is gone is when the band should stop. A singer can be replaced if they're not the songwriter.
That makes sense. 🤘
Mike is the biggest songwriter in the band
I'm rooting for emily!!
It works way better when you change name
Creed and Alter Bridge are both massive and in different parts of the world, but the completely changed the image
Building off of your final point, I feel like the circumstances of the past singer's departure seems to make a pretty big difference. The fan base more or less "inherits" the attitude of the band itself. A new singer is more likely to be received well if the old singer either left on good terms, or due to illness or death. Fans might still prefer the old singer, but they usually won't resent the new one.
Great point! 🤘
Iron Maiden is a "eras" band, Blaze's albums are my favorites and other people love Paul Di'anno
One of the problems with Linkin Park: their new stuff sounds phoned in. Just a total snooze fest.
I couldn't afford to travel such as Young as I was 14 years old travel in their only van going see metallica Chicago with Dave thr strength staine
Brian Johnson is an anomaly, such a thing will never happen again.
One of the biggest surprises to me was Alice In Chains. William DuVall kills it. He's no Layne Staley but sounds similar enough while still be able to hold his own.
Another interesting band when it comes to this is The Gathering.
They went from Death/doom to ethereal when they brought in Anneke van Giersbergen and they blew up into the stratosphere and basically invented gothic metal (one of the OG bands at least). But then she left and was replaced with Silje and to me didn't have the same magic anymore.
William DuVall not only sounds like Layne, but he added a second guitar to AIC, which ended up having some pretty cool results
You should of talked about Veil Of Maya, the vocal change worked and they are still going strong. DreamShade is another band that changed vocalists.. from MDM to metalcore but it works.. also Sylosis changed over a decade ago but works..
Great examples! 🤘🤘
Arch enemy have had 3 different singers
Man, I’m just glad LINKIN PARK is back, this just shows you that LINKIN PARK wasn’t just all about Chester. The band was about everyone involved. even Chester said it himself, he would say that Mike is the genius, and he also told the story about how Warner Brothers wanted mike kicked out the band and have him be the main focus, but he said no.
Whoa! 🤯
Yep, that just tells you that despite his amazing talent Chester wasn’t egotistical.
You forgot to mention Van Halen, I prefer David Lee Roth over Sammy Hagar.
@@123theprodigy5 I totally mentioned Van Halen 😆
My bad bro, I didn’t watch the whole video before I commented. but there is one band you should mention though, three Days Grace, their singer quit and they got a new one.
Brian was already in TBDM and was doing backing vocals before Trevor passed tragically. The fans were knew who Brian was. I'd say that isn't the same for LP at all. No one really new who Emily was then the whole scientology stuff came out and it fucked everything up.
💯
Nirvana would have just become Foo foghters, so it’s good he made Foo fighters I guess.
And we would've been pissed! This way Foo Fighters had a fighting chance.
Some die hard Chester Fans will never accept Emily and will claim that Linkin Park should have changed their name but that was never going to happen anyway considering the Brain of the Band is still alive and CLEARLY enjoying himself on the stage. I saw LP live in Hamburg last weekend and Mike was smiling from ear to ear and I am beyond happy for him.
That feels good to hear 🤘
When the change is for the better everyone is happy:
I can't even listen to Arch Enemy with Angela. Honestly, if Alicia wasn't there I wasn't even a fan. Not sure why, but I don't like her singing.
Nightwish, changed to Floor and became a different band and is so much better. Now it is almost gringy to listen to Tarja singing. Floor is so much better in almost anything.
Iron Maiden, Bruce Dickinson is one of the best ever!
You even have the case of Queen that found a replacement for Freddie Mercury, which is impossible and everyone knows it. But they didn't disrespect Freddie.
However Linkin Park changed for the worse. Much worse in this case. They are just milking the fans at this point. Linkin Park the band is now over. She can't sing for sh1t, let's be honest here.
Yea the Queen situation should be a fifth category, where the band just tours but doesn't make new music.
I'm surprised he didn't bring up Fear Factory especially since he's wearing they're shirt
Easter Egg 😁🤘🤘
Thoughtful video sir! Personally...I'd argue that Nightwish has managed to catch lightning in the bottle three different times. Between Tarja, Annette, and Floor..they've managed to survive and thrive across multiple singers. I still remember being heart broken that Tarja left with such bad blood going on...but they've managed to surprise me with each new album being it's own wonderful thing.
Thank you! And definitely Nightwish is a special band.
Did you forget Gwar existed? Them continuing moving forward without Brockie was strange. Also Brian never left, he just switched roles
Gwar is a great example! I don't think I said Brian left, but Ryan did come back which is awesome. 🤘🤘
Candlemass had 6 vocalists😅 But most people just love Messiah. Corrosion of Conformity had 5 but most just love Pepper era.
Pepper forever! 😆🤘🤘
Anyone here remember Wovenwar? No? Maybe? Maybe a couple of you do. They are the reason I do not think that it's just as simple as a band starting over with a new name. For anyone who doesn't remember Wovenwar, after Tim Lambesis of As I Lay Dying was arrested for attempting to hire a hitman to kill his wife, the rest As I lay Dying stayed together but formed a new band called Wovenwar. They enlisted the help of Shane Blay of Oh Sleeper to be the singer and they went for a new sound with a clean vocal and a less aggressive style of Metalcore. But As I Lay Dying was one of the largest metalcore bands of it's day. If there was a big four of metalcore, they would have been the Metallica or Megadeth of it. And yet, they went from massive sell out shows to tiny little bars and clubs. They were good. And I did see them when they came to the UK. But it clearly didn't work for them because the second Tim was out of prison, they decided to go back to the success of As I Lay Dying. Ironically, of the 4 members who started Wovenwar and then went back to rejoin AILD, 3 have since left again leaving just Phil and Tim who still tour as AILD and are still having a lot of success, more than Wovenwar ever did. Maybe they should have continued AILD without Tim and then they could have led a version of AILD which was more successful than Wovenwar and still had 4 members rather than 2. This is all to say, even though I did like Wovenwar, I think they made the wrong move. I think they should have kept As I Lay Dying going and replaced Tim rather than trying to start again. Now 3 of those 4 memebers have neither Wovenwar or AILD. Thankfully Josh has at least seen some major success joining Spiritbox. But Nick and Jordan are nothing compared to where they used to be.
Instructive example 🤔
I cant wrap my head around Fear Factory without Burton, even though i think Milo's voice is in better shape then Burtons. Im glad Kerry didnt try ti replace Tom. It was the right call. However i enjoyed Sepultura with Derrick Green. Max was replaced relatively early in their career. Where as replacing a vocalist after 30 years is a harder pill to swallow. I would still see Fear Factory live though. I dont like anything Arch Enemy has done without Angela.
Agreed, forming a new band was definitely the right move for Kerry. 🤘🤘
Lorna Shore and Nightwish changed their lead singers as well.
For the first one it was an improvement and the second fell into the “era category”. I never heard of Lorna Shore before Will Ramos came as a new vocalist but I was listening to Nightwish less after Tarja left.
Great contrasting examples! 🤘🤘
There’s Suicide Silence… where the initial reception to Eddie was off the charts and then plummeted after Self Titled. There’s We Came As Romans where they just continued as a 5 piece after Kyle passed and the reception has overall been positive. Lorna Shore actually gained popularity with each vocalist change they’ve been through.
Lorna Shore is a great point! 🤘🤘
One band who changed vocalist is electric callboy, they became better after the change
After talking with people I thought I should add a fifth category. Bands that just replace the singer to tour but no new music, like Queen. I guess this could be a super rare 6th category where the band gets better. 🤘🤘
No Doubt did it. Their original singer died and Gwen stepped up.
Whoa! 🤯I didn't know that.
Great video man! Glad to find ya
Thank you! 🙏🤘
My favorite Arch Enemy is the Johan Liive era! The first 3 albums destroy. Anthrax's Sound of White Noise with John Bush on vocals was also killer!
Deo era Black Sabbath ,Heaven and Hell, did feature Bill Ward on drums and Geezer Butler. Bill did leave the band during the tour if I'm not mistaken but he plays on the album. Amazing album!
I know Linkin is Mike's band, but Chester was the face of the band with his insane vocals. As for TBDM, their sound remains intact. Same for Killswitch and Arch Enemy. But I watched the Metal Tempest's video: the front man or woman is massively fundamental for all metal and rock bands. They are the human front with most voices rarely sounding identical. You can borrow guitar and bass tones and drum sets, but not voices. Who could replace Chino Moreno, Mustaine, Hetfield, Ozzy or Fred Durst? Death died with Chuck Schuldinger.
Definitely. Great examples too. No Chino no Deftones. Same for Carpenter. He's one of the rare guitar players.
I hate the argument that bands cannot continue after a member dies or leaves. Don't get me wrong, there are some exceptions to the rule. I actually disagree with your comments on Motorhead not continuing after a major member leaves or dies. Not because I think Motorhead can continue without Lemmy. But because they did continue without key members. By the time Lemmy died, Phil and Eddie had already left the band in 92 and 82 respectively and I believe Phil had died earlier the same year as Lemmy died. Motorhead was just Lemmy by the end. And so Motorhead could and did continue without key members. But I think it's over now because with Lemmy gone, all of the OGs are gone. It wouldn't be motorhead, the same way that Judas Priest would be over without Rob and Ian or Megadeth would be over without Mustaine, even though both bands have seen many many many band members already leave but continue. If all the classic members are gone, then sure, call it a day. But a band should 100% be allowed to continue with 1, 2 or even 3 classic members gone. Because bands can still change the world with a missing member. And this is where I want people to imagine a simple premise. If we disbanded every band which loses a major influencing member, then imagine it's 1986 and Cliff Burton of Metallica has just tragically passed away. Metallica as a result disbands. A major blow to metal. Especially since the last few years have been so unkind. With "Fast" Eddie Clarke leaving Motorhead in 1982, Paul Dianno leaving Iron Maiden in 1981, Ozzy Osbourne leaving Black Sabbath in 1977 and Al Atkins leaving Judas Priest in 1973, none of these bands now exist in 1986. As a result we lose major albums in metal such as 'And Justice for All' & 'Metallica (The Black Album)' by Metallica, 'Number of the Beast' and 'Piece of Mind' by Iron Maiden, Heaven and Hell by Black Sabbath, 'British Steel', 'Screaming for Vengeance' & 'Painkiller' by Judas Priest. And without these albums, bands like Slipknot, Lamb of God, Machine Head, Trivium, Avenged Sevenfold, Dream Theatre, In Flames, Arch Enemy, Gojira and many more would likely never have started without the metal greats to influence them. And to take it a step further, maybe none of the greats would have existed either. Because when Pete Best left the Beatles in 1962, The Beatles would cease to be. And no Beatles, Ozzy wouldn't have been influence to start writing music. And no Ozzy, no Black Sabbath and no Black Sabbath, no metal.
I agree with everything you said here. I think the lineage of metal is an excellent point. I would only point out that the subject of the episode is about singers, the face and voice of the band. But to your point the bands that pulled it off still had some of their other core members to keep everything flowing. 🤘🤘
@@heavymetalphilosophy I guess i did kind of forget you were specifically talking about singers. But then again, I don't think the singer should have any special exceptions from other band members. Iron Maiden for example is obviously best known for Bruce's powerful vocals, but it's Steve Harris who really drives the band forward. Same with Linkin Park really. Everyone thinks it was Chester's band but Mike Shinoda has arguably always been the glue of the band. And in both Slipknot and A7X, the band later revealed that Paul Gray and The Rev respectively were a major writing force behind their bands. I'm not saying Corey Taylor isn't iconic to Slipknot, but replace him with say Rob Flynn of Machine Head, and I think that Slipknot would still be successful, just as it was still successful after replacing Joey and Paul among others. The singer really isn't the be all and end all of these bands and I don't think we should treat them as such
Where does deep purple fit in hear
I'm not well versed on my Deep Purple discourse but I would assume the eras category no?
It's so arrogant of the Bennington family to act like Chester was the only guy in Linkin Park that mattered. It's so inconsiderate of the other members, like Mike Shinoda, the freaking main guy.
Interesting point. Nobody ever asks the bassist how they feel.
Absolutely.
I'm surprised that you failed to mention #IanGillan in regards to #BlackSabbath. The #BornAgain album had at least one great song with #Trashed (the record's only single), despite the production sounding thin and decidedly lo-fi (IMHO). Ian's screams are gut-wrenching and piercing (both in a good way). He's one of my favorite old-school metal singers of all time. His abilities are equal to those of #Dio, #BruceDickinson, and #Halford, to my old ears.
It wasn't the only single. There is a music video for Zero The Hero. The only songs I really love on that album are Trashed, Disturbing the Priest, and Zero the Hero. The bad thing is all those songs are side A so side B is kind of a bore
My poor guy, I Gary Charone'd him 😣😆
I have one band who became worse after they changed vocalist
Sonic syndicate in 2009 former vocalist roland johansson left and they took in nathan j biggs instead
They went from heavy to pop metal
I'm not familiar with them. Should I check out their Roland era material?
@@heavymetalphilosophy If you enjoy the 2010 era of metalcore then absolutely. Lyrics can be a bit cringe but overallthe Trilogy "Eden Fire",. "Only Inhuman" and "Love and Other Disasters" are fantastic records. The first one I would say is more Melo Death Metal while the later ones heavily shifted into the Metalcore sound.
In era music and chances of voice to continue is like the next power of metal to keep the reign alive. DIO MY OPINION DESTROYS EVERYTHING EVERYONE AND GOING TO EXIST BEYOND. just seems from a friend's kicking me to see Black Sabbath and Ozzy era seems I blame them cus Dio had better vocals and my opinion to hell with the madmen that will want to strike me in the eye. Aarruugghhhhh!!! Just for drawing ozz diffrent and more disturbing on cover of The Ultimate Sin didn't get paid was a joke cus nobody knew I was an artist till this day.
Dio!! Arrruuughhh!🤘🤘
@@heavymetalphilosophy saw dio before he passed away bands like dirty deeds open up finally when bands came down south texas because if we are impatient as how fans make bands upset reasons for any appearance just to South Padre Island is when tickets became expensive and working at island seems a life on a job that only paid 5.50 an hr and had a friend that worked as electrical engineer assistant no degree was lucky watch all bands that csme he was very open mouth about it but seems well invite get me some tickets seems theirs alot those ok enjoy your live shows but don't be all openly just be quite and enjoyable
@@heavymetalphilosophy definitely aarruugghhh!!
At end of the day whether it makes sense or not, folks got to do what they love and have to earn an income etc…
I'll say one thing. Don't hire a safepoint for scientology. That's like rule number 1.
I don't know what that term means and yet somehow this seems like good advice to me.
The best thing Anthrax did was fire their first singer with Joey Belladonna. Worst thing they did was fire Joey for Bush."
😆That's a few times now I've seen someone decry the Bush era in the comments.
Tbdm are my favorite band.. and the new album rips 🤘🤘
Rips!! 🤘🤘
Awesome assessment! Love your breakdown and predictions.
Thank you! 🙏🤘
I'm probably in the minority I actually think Linkin Park new singer while I'm not blown away by the new music live she sounds pretty good
She has a great voice. How she sounds isn't an issue at all for me. 😁
I can see LP being one and done as far as making new material and then going into legacy act status and just playing festivals.
@@toyotaecw Honestly I thought that WAS what was going to happen. Not that I'm complaining, I'm really digging the new material so far, but I figured they'd just grab a new vocalist, and just tour around with no new music.
Like the fear factory shirt what this video is on lol fear factory should halt… without Burton, Raymond, Christian, it’s not fear factory. Edsel does a decent job for static x but are basically living off Wayne and are more like a tribute band.
Yea what Edsel is doing is like Queen and Journey. No new albums but we can still see them live. That could be a fifth category really.
In the example of Chester. He wasnt the original singer of linkin park. So. That probably sways the consensus more than people anticipate.
🤔
Exactly. They didn't even HAVE a singer when the band was formed. Mark joined AFTER Xero was started, then left, THEN Chester came in from Arizona.
Chester was there when he band got famous, and was a contributor TO that success, but he wasn't a founding member.
Most people aren't actually aware of this
Emily Armstrong just sounds terrible in general. The worst pick for a replacement aside from all her drama
No she doesn't stop coping. It;s been 7 years you can hop off Chester's D. We all miss him but let the man rest.
She sounds amazing live.
Is Linkin park really metal though 🤷♂️
Nu - Metal. Your mileage may vary on if that counts or not though 😆
@@heavymetalphilosophyI cant associate them with metal no matter the genre gymnastics
it might be nu metal but it is terrible nu metal. anyone who actually was old enough to be part of the scene in early 2000s know what a joke linkin park was, no one would ever even talk about them in metal scene, even if u mentioned them you would be laughed at, they were just an industry plant combining terrible rap, terrible electronic, terrible pop hooks with terrible nu metal riffs... it's funny how the narrative changed, just because 10 years olds from 2000s have a bit of nostalgia and no awareness of the scene they are somehow considered legends, ... of what exactly... they are nickelback of nu metal and nothing more (they sold lots of records).. it's sad when people like heavy metal philosophy who i respect starts talking about linkin park just because he knows he is gonna get views, just like so many metal youtubers these days... i don't believe anyone actually enjoy them.
@@trapeznikwhat did linkin park do to you
@@fionnsheehan7569 I had to live through their peak popularity where you just could not avoid them and their music simply annoyed me from the day 1, I guess if i liked their first song I might like all of them since they all sound the same on their first 2 albums... Too bad it's all annoying to me. Also no one would ever mention them who was interested in similar music that I was, but nowadays we get bunch of youtubers even older ones like HM philosophy talking about them... i am definetly not trying to act true or gatekeeping, but linkin park is just too much, it just has nothing to do with (underground) metal, or if you wanna talk about it then be honest about it specially if you are old enough, don't just try to please the newer viewers who'll give you clicks. No wonder we are getting more and more silly metal "gatekeeping" youtubers which try to act true and underground, despising bunch of "false" metal, they do make me laugh but when more and more traditional metal youtubers are bringing cringey bands like linkin park into conversation or rating their albums, it's the definition of sellout and clickbaiting and it's probably time to stop watching or at least demand more honesty.
For linkin park it's a mix of the scientology with also that their new single is awful. It's actually the most bland rock music. If the new music was good they would be received differently. But they keep wanting to make it about "emily isn't trying to be chester" . But they should be saying "our new singer isn't in a wierd cult". Even with the cult I think it's doable if the songs are good
I'm reminded of discourse about pro fighters. "Winning takes care of everything else"
I don't know about you but both new songs being in the top 10 spotify global plays is a proof that its working. Phus HitC is a song that 1:1 could be on Meteora.
Here's the thing, the new Linkin Park doesn't even sound like Linkin park. It sounds like a Linkin Park cover band with a female singer. Black Dahlia murder with their new singer, still sounds like Black Dahlia murder. Same with cannibal corpse, or Killswitch engage, even Van Halen some bands can pull it off. But their sound either evolves, or it is very similar. The new Linkin Park neither evolves or sounds similar. It sounds like a completely different project.
Now that would be interesting if the next album would be a complete departure. I bet that would really stir the discourse 😆
@@heavymetalphilosophy I would actually prefer it that way.
I don;t know what song's your listening to, but these pas two songs are Linkin Park down to their very core.
You can't just say it doesn't sound like Linkin park because it's not Chester singing, Linkin Park isn't JUST Chester.
You talk about a cover band but if you listen to some dude singing Numb at Drunken Karaoke night you really gonna say "Nope! That's not a Linkin Park song!"
These two new songs have been EVERYTHING fans CLAIM they've wanted from Linkin Park, just with a new singer that happens to be a woman, because Chester, may he rest in peace, isn't with us.
I'll never understand the mental gymnastics it takes to try and call Linkin Park NOT Linkin Park just because they got a new singer. The cope is unreal. Chester is Gone, it's been 7 years. We miss him but it;s time to move on man, you can't expect this band to abandon the name and the songs THEY helped build (because it wasn't JUST chester) because weirdos that are afraid of change wont like it.
@@rashira9610 TL:DR
The fact that you had to write an entire book defending this situation, leaves me to believe I'm right.
And you said I'm the one using mental gymnastics.
Awww too scared to do a little reading because you;re afraid it might make your asinine opinion sound even more stupid?
It;s okay, I understand, Autism makes it very difficult to function like an adult.