MP5/10: FBI's super-charged submachine gun, with firearms expert Jonathan Ferguson
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 28 ноя 2023
- In this week’s episode, Jonathan unveils a cult classic firearm-the MP5, but with a twist. Discover the more powerful variant developed for the FBI and delve into its enduring legacy in pop culture.
Subscribe to our channel for more videos about arms and armour.
Help us bring history to life by supporting us here: royalarmouries.org/support-us...
Sign up to our museum membership scheme here: royalarmouries.org/support-us...
⚔Website: royalarmouries.org/home
⚔Blog: royalarmouries.org/stories/
⚔Facebook: / royalarmouriesmuseum
⚔Twitter: / royal_armouries
⚔ Instagram: / royalarmouriesmuseum
We are the Royal Armouries, the United Kingdom's national collection of arms and armour. Discover what goes on behind the scenes and watch our collection come to life. See combat demonstrations, experience jousting and meet our experts.
Have a question about arms and armour? Feel free to leave us a comment and we'll do our best to answer it.
A bit of new information thanks to Hans-Christian Vortisch - this fixed stock auto/burst configuration was apparently standard issue for FBI Special Agents (as opposed to specialist units like HRT).
Btw I love that references to R6 Raven Shield, thats exactly where I know the gun from! :D
Was actually a quite powerful weapon in that game. Nice to hear the story where it came from.
Some of those police MPs were in 45acp
Navy seals have said there was an mp10 sd.
I would be amazed if HK hadn't built one, and if they did, they'd surely demo it for Tier 1 SOF. But there's no way it was mass-produced and I would bet that Clancy simply made a mistake. He was never THAT good on technical detail - better than most fiction authors though.@@stewartmckinley7058
Police MP5s in .45 ACP? I'd have to see evidence of that one.@@stewartmckinley7058
The 10mm round is rugged, reliable and ubiquitous making it a popular choice for wastelanders.
Hi ,please tell me what a wastelander is ,is it something to do with the Clancy novel ??
No dude, have you ever played any of the Fallout games?
That is exactly why the 9mm is the choice for martial and enforcement purposes in reality! Ironic.
10 mm sucked I did not like it at the range.
Although it was a 10mm Glock 🤮
@@samholdsworth420 were you firing real 10mm? or the underloaded garbage?
A SWAT Team friend of mine questioned a HK rep about the lack of hold open on their 9mm weapons. The response,”We don’t want the adversary knowing you’re out of ammunition.” His quip to that was,”I should think one of us should know.
When in dout turn a design flaw into a feature
@@AlexVergo764Microsoft mission statement much?
Clearly, the answer Involves at least 10000 parts, a special Swiss watch consultant, 400 hours of machine time… and it taps you on the back and let you know that you're out of ammo.
Kinda like car manufacturers opting to leave out spare tires all together, for "weight savings" lol
That's what you get for using full auto weapons. Learn to count your rounds.
I saw the community post of an MP5 silhouette with a straight mag and thought "nah, impossible, they can't!" bur you did you madlads! A 10mm MP5!
We aim to impress
Waffle stick was orig HK 54 mag.
@@RoyalArmouries On one level I think I like the straight magazine, on the downside though the not very clear plastic of the magazine seems to barely provide a visual indication of spent rounds.
At least it isn't like painted yellow or something foolishness.
Oh and I agree having springs that go flying out of your gun does not seem like a desirable product feature to me. What do they think they are Far Cry 2 ?
@@RoyalArmouries And the HRT aims to suppress
A straight mag on an HK SMG either means 10 mm MP5 or .40 S&" or .45 ACP UMP
I think this is the first physical example of a 10mm MP5 I have ever seen after reading about them in the Rainbow Six novel over 20 years ago. I actually didn't know about the bolt catch, I can only imagine the arm twisting that would have been required to get it added as HK is infamously resistant to any attempts to improve their designs for the people who actually use them.
A Swiss guy has one as well
Glad to see the early Rainbow Six game (Rogue Spear I remember)also has this variant of MP5 in the arsenal.
R6 Rouge Spear and its one of my favorites in the new game Ready or Not
I just came to the comments to write about this.
Yep same, been re reading the early Clancy books
You can tell the MP5 is a point of passion for Mr. Jonathan
it is for a lot of people
@@acatinatux9601 most HK products are ones to lust for
And they also managed to make mp5 in .357
@@TrenaimeWHAT! That would be amazing!
There was a video where Jonathan actually became sad that the cod MW3 operator did not slap the bolt on the MP5
I’ll be amazed if Jonathan didn’t have the Action Man SAS kit as a child.
I still have him, lost the High Power but he still has the gas mask and MP5 😂😂
I swapped a scorpion tank for that!
Jonathan was The Second Man On The Balcony!
I used to work at an indoor range. We had a regular customer who would bring his 10mm MP5 in along with one in 40 S&W. No idea what department or agency he worked for but he was a nice guy.
I love seeing Jonathan going from this nervousness to talk to the camera with a lot of studders to becoming more and more confident in the way he speaks and presents everything
What this this dude doing with gloves on?
He has the right home office licence, so no need to worry about fingerprints. This word comes from licentious.
@@williamnunn8847 These are all museum pieces so its probably a force of habit. Oils from skin can damage some things.
Correct@@isaacs3413
1:10 The "10-94" date is in reference to the 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban signed into law in September and in effect from October onwards (until it expired in 2004). This writing appears on magazines (with more than 10 rounds capacity) destined for the US market during this era to differentiate those mags destined for law enforcement/military from those for the wider civilian market.
Sept. 13th 1994 actually, not sure why H&K did it that way.
@@eddietat95 the CFR said to use the date, but as the MP5/10 was an NFA weapon and there were no non-NFA versions, I'm going to guess H&K asked ATF and they didn't care that it was 10-94. Pre-ban mags did exist, I remember seeing one at an H&K dealer in Georgia.
@@steven-k. I doubt H&K called anyone. The specific regulation is to mark all magazines with a serial and "after" date, referring to the ban. It would not be sufficient to place any date BEFORE September 13, 1994 (i.e. "09-94" which would implicate Sept 1-12 or, perhaps accidentally 08-94 or before).
H&K's "10-94" is not only abbreviated enough to get the job done (how efficient, how German), but it doesn't break the law by introducing a date BEFORE September 13, 1994. Hell, they could give a random April 1997 date and it would still meet the legal requirement of "clearly shows that the device was manufactured or imported after the effective date."
For reference:
H.R. 4296
...
SEC. 4. BAN OF LARGE CAPACITY AMMUNITION FEEDING DEVICES.
...
(e) IDENTIFICATION MARKINGS FOR LARGE CAPACITY AMMUNITION FEEDING DEVICES.-Section 923(i) of such title, as amended by section 2(d) of this Act, is amended by adding at the end the following: ‘‘A large capacity ammunition feeding device manufactured after the date of the enactment of this sentence shall be identified by a serial number that clearly shows that the device was manufactured or imported after the effective date of this subsection, and such other identification as the Secretary may by regulation prescribe.’’.
@@steven-k. I should add that the reason all manufactures didn't constantly update the markings to indicate the newest date of manufacture is because it's expensive to change the tooling needed to make the these markings. In the case of the polymer MP5/10 magazine this is presumably a molding die (could be wrong on the specific type, but that's besides the point).
Easier to put 10-94 on all magazines and be done with. The date clearly meets the standard set by the law.
So its like judnge Dredd esque "I am, THE LAW" from FBI?
FBI agents had these up till around 2016/2017. It was not just limited to HRT. FBI also had 9 MM variants as well.
They probably ditched them after one of the MP5/10s was stolen in San Francisco in January 2017. Because of the epidemic of car break-ins in SF. Welcome to hell a.k.a. California...
www.fbi.gov/contact-us/field-offices/sanfrancisco/news/press-releases/fbi-seeks-public-assistance-in-recovery-of-stolen-firearm
The most recent photo I've seen of FBI SWAT with an MP5/10 is from 2020. Still in inventory, and ATF and US Marshals have a few too. Never seen proof of Secret Service owning any, despite claims, but it wouldn't surprise me. They did, after all, get closed-bolt, full-auto Uzis on special request.
@@Swindle1984 where is this pic?
Can civilians in the US get the 10mm variant? Ofc semi.
Ah yes, mp5/10 chambered in 9mm, of course. Definitely not just a regular mp5, mhm
I love MP5s, the only full auto SMG I've ever fired was a 9MM MP5 and it was fun as hell. Shockingly easy to control really, I can see why they're so popular cause if I could handle it that easily with no prior training or experience on it a real operator could really do some work.
The UMP is pretty nice aswell. ;)
@@ryshellso526 the MP7 too. HK does good work.
that's exactly what an operator said (I think he was SAS) something like ""if you're not good with an MP5 you're not good with anything".
If you are indoors with civilians running around, and terrorists popping out from doors where you need to be precise and fast between every follow on shot - this is the ideal sized and powered weapon. It would make a better home defense weapon than any 5.56 platform BUT, honestly its expensive and you're unlikely to need more than just a few shots or have the need to stitch your shots between civilians in a residential home. So the good ol 12 gauge would have to win it for home defense for me. Nothing to make you pee your pants like standing in the pitch darkness only to hear the sound of a shell being racked into the chamber just a room away lol.
@@pjburges this is not a weapon for home defense. anyway I don't agree about the 12 gauge thing I don't know what kind of ammunition you use but if a weapon can easily penetrate walls you risk to do more harm than good.
10mm on a MP5? now that's the jackpot!
Or is it... over to Jonathan above ☝
We were told that when H&K quit making them, the FBI bought up all the parts they had and, as they parts were used up, the weapons were phased out of the field in favor of the M4. I was sad when they took mine away - it was identical to the one displayed here. I could hammer nails with that thing...
Jonathan mentioning Rogue Spear made my day, I was thinking of Rainbow Six the whole video and how I would assign teams with kits based off FBI HRT with green uniforms and the MP5/10, SAS with black uniforms and the MP5SD, and USMC with Woodland BDUs and M4A1s
Somewhat unrelated but I remember putting the install CD into my stereo and it played the theme song. Didn’t know that was possible, beforehand.
Rogue spear was quite the title. I played both that & R6 extensively. I was the head everyone saw tilting out before they died.
@@borismuller86 I did that once with the original Spider-Man movie when I was a kid and was pleasantly surprised to hear the soundtrack cause I figured it might play the audio to the movie. Thanks for reminding me of that very nostalgic memory
Jonathan Ferguson, the keeper of firearms and artillery at the royal armories museum in the U.K. Which houses thousands of iconic weapons throughout history. Is a man of culture.
Didn't they also put a bolt hold open on the G41 - the Hk33 variant supposed to compete with the M16 that also had an AR style forward assist?
Yes they did.
I'm curious to know why they didn't adopt the bolt hold open on everything going forward?
I carried an MP5N (Navy model, collapsible stock, 3 lug muzzle, 4 position ambidextrous trigger group) for about 5 years on SWAT during the mid 90s until we transitioned to M4s. A few guys still tended to carry the MP5 and I went to an HK M1 Super 90. When that MP5/10 came out, I drooled over it. In 2005 we transitioned to Sig P226s in 357 Sig and I always thought an MP5 in that caliber would have been awesome.
Probably wouldn't have fed reliably, supposedly bottleneck cartridges feed more reliably but .357 is quite short and stubby. Had all kinds of problems with my Glock 32. And the P226 in .357 SIG was terrible when it first came out in 1996. I couldn't believe how bad it was because my P229 was pretty good, although it did jam more than the .40 Also, I've noticed a lot of variation in the shoulders of cartridge cases from different manufacturers.
Of course the .357 SIG is hilarious as yet another regression of 10mm Auto. 9mm not good enough, make 10mm. "But more like 9mm", make .40 S&W. "But more like 9mm", Make .357 SIG. Then everyone just swaps back to 9 anyway lol
Ah, fond memories of the MP5 (9mm standard) as an AFO some 20 years ago. Great CQB weapon but not at range, hence going to the G36 5.56mm. The MP5 was a delight to shoot. One drill we had to do was have the weapon stripped at our feet at the point in the range, then on the command assemble the weapon and fire 10 aimed rounds in a timed exercise.
My only problem with it was the short stock.
Not to mock, but that sounds like a useless make-work drill to do. Very thin margin of usefulness, which makes it a nearly useless drill practically.
@@baffledking9902 From an operational point of view I would tend to agree, BUT it was to reinforce weapon familiarisation and confidence. Also, back then, we did not carry any secondary weapon (as an ordinary AFO), so our primary weapon was our only weapon as far as a firearm was concerned. Later I trained as a Rifleman, so I had the MP5, a Remington pump shotgun and a Steyr SSG 7.62mm bolt action Rifle with Schmidt & Bender optics.
@@Plentisaki
ARV AFOs have always carried a secondary/pistol, haven't they? Used to carry .38 revolvers before being replaced with the Glock 17 in the mid 90s..?
@@baffledking9902 it's rudimentary, but the task is useful for gauging multiple performance criteria. Composure, coordination, weapon familiarity, eye health - an poorly exercised eye can take up to 3 seconds to adjust focus.
FBI we need more powerful cartridge
also FBI: no recoil too bad for our noodle arms
I mean it's weird considering they were previously issued .357 Magnum revolvers (although to my knowledge issued .38 Special +P ammo), I haven't handled a 10mm but it can't be that much worse. I figure most FBI guys are prioritizing doing investigations over shooting guns though.
I think the issue was the girth of S&W 1076, as much as the "power" of the cartridge; very long reach to the trigger for the double-action first shot.@@justalurker3489
even garand thumb and micah who were making fun of that fact didnt like how spicy it was on their recent video
And no big guns for us.
Really 10mm fine for confident shooters with full frame handguns, but the use of compact and sub compact hanguns lead to many of the issues.
Once its in full size submachine gun it has no issues.
@@SuperFunkmachine G40, quite nice to shoot actually. G29, not so much it turns out...
Name a better duo than Jonathan and an MP5. I'll wait.
(As I write this I realize there is indeed a better duo. Jonathan and an EM2)
Great video again, always love listening to Jonathan talking about whatever he is passionate about. Especially the MP5.
Ian Mccollum and Vickers gun? Dirty Harry and the S&W Model 29? James Bond and the Walther PPK? Nobody's a winner; they' all good!
@@thedevilinthecircuit1414 I would've paired Ian with a FAMAS personally, but agreed, they're all good.
there are lots of magazines on the US market marked for LE/govt use only, 94-04 the federal assault weapons ban prohibited sales of >10rd mags to normal people, so LE mags were marked that way. after it sunset, they went out on the commercial market. I have AR and Glock mags marked similarly.
What Americans don't realize is that illegal import of post-ban mags became such a problem for Glock that in 2000 they had to start marking mags sold outside the US with: "Post 9.13.94 manufacture" US law required US made mags to be marked: "For Export Only" but obviously that didn't apply to foreign-made magazines. Glock got really worried that they'd end up in trouble if they didn't put a stop to it.
I've actually fired one of these a few times, back when they were new. Very excellent, handled like the regular MP5, recoil difference was negligible.
Cool experience. Even in a handgun platform, mainly 1911, the full house hardcast is manageable. I have a 5" 1911 & less than full house is a breeze with very quick followups.
The MP5/10 as shown was issued to FBI Agents until around 2018. The fixed stocked guns with safe/semi/2 shot burst trigger groups were issued to regular Agents. FBI SWAT and HRT were issued collapsible stocked versions with safe/semi/2 shot burst/full auto trigger groups. FBI SWAT and HRT made the transition to 5.56mm carbines sooner than the rest of the FBI but the 10mm MP5 was in common usage until fairly recently. One drawback of the bolt hold open was that the sharp corners of the cutout in the left side of the receiver seemed to be a point of stress accumulation and the receivers would develop cracks from these areas. This was not observed in guns issued to Agents but was seen in guns used extensively in the training environment like those used at Quantico for new Agent training.
Can second this anecdotally, saw this exact fixed stock, safe/semi/2-shot with the grey square mag config owned by a regular agent as well circa 2009/2010. IIRC by that point one of the magazines didn't like being topped off fully (left out the last 4 usually), and I was told he had a choice between a newer M4 and that MP5 when being issued a long gun.
The hood open position was a smart addition. You know as the shooter you’re empty and it also helps with a faster reload because you’re removing an entire step.
Fell out of favour in the late 90s when SWAT/STAR teams started toting HK53s and Colt 604s. Turns out 5.56 fragments just fine. Almost every MP5/10 I have seen being waved about in anger is fitted with a flash hider from the Hk53 platform.
As a fan of the Rainbow Six novel I wanted to thank you for featuring this one and also for clearing the confusion with the MP10 name and it being integrally suppressed in the novel; it's quite rare to find content on this specific firearm. :)
Striborg now makes a straight mag roller 10mm PCC. I wonder if this is what gave them the idea.
My first introduction to this was R6: Rogue Spear, many moons ago. "The year is 2001. The world is a very dangerous place..." Definitely appreciate the acknowledgement of the game after showcasing the details and differences. An interesting piece of kit, no doubt.
i think the game "Global Operations" had it as well
Mr Ferguson looks soo happy in the thumbnail
10mm really is the best mm
I had the MP5 (and also G3) as service weapon for many years. And yes NOBODY used the push button mag release. I never used the push button mag release on both these weapons. Always the paddle
Well, yeah. The paddle is a one-handed operation, while the actual button requires both. I've never understood why HK insisted on removing the paddle mag release from their more recent civilian offerings. As an AK guy, I felt right at home with the paddle switch on my Mp5k
@@1lovesoni Also I see the push button hard to use with cold weather gear like mittens. Gloves do not work well in cold weather because they leak to much heat. So on the left hand we had left hand mittens with a free thumb. Just grab the magazine as high as you could and use the thumb to release it
@@afre3398 That makes a lot of sense. I honestly find the button release to be a bit too fiddly and difficult to use quickly under any stress with just my bare hands (and that's just in low-level competitions & training). I can only imagine that padded or insulated gloves would magnify that significantly, mitten even more so. That sounds less than ideal for manipulating weapon controls, especially in combat conditions.
Out of curiosity, did you use the sliding A3/F type stock on the MP5, or stick to the fixed/A2 type stock on both? I'm mostly curious about hearing if the sliding stock's metal arms/struts gave any significant issues with cheekweld or aiming in the cold (and if so, what was done to reduce or eliminate these issues). I'm in the process of filling out the necessary paperwork to add a sliding/collapsing stock to my MP5k clone (SHF KES stock), but I also recently moved to Michigan (where the winters are much colder/longer than I was previously used to).
@@1lovesoni My service weapon had the fixed stock. But we trained sometimes with a system that was like an advanced laser tag system. With real weapons converted to this system firing blanks but allowing for semi auto and full auto. Because with blanks normally the blow-back was far from enough to even move the bolt assembly. So we had to manually cycle the weapon for each shot. But never the less that latter weapons had sliding stock. And to be honest I felt more comfortable standard stock, as it felt more sturdy by far. But of course you felt much more "special force" walking around with the stock slided in. So my two cents is that slideing stocks are more for looks on the MP5, for us mere mortals
This channel is such good therapy. From one Jonathan across the pond to another, we salute you, good sir!
Wow! That takes me back, I used to spend hours upon hours playing RB6 Raven Shield. At it's time, was probably the most realistic shooter one could get.
In my opinion, the height of the RB6 gaming franchise before it went really silly.
Thanks for the flashback, Jonathan!
It's a very fine game, and most people would enjoy it once they grasp that teammates including the controlled character can die, but it's not the end of the mission.
the other FBI mp5/10's ive seen have safe-semi-burst-full lowers. great review of a unique firearm. there was also the .40 cal mp5 available to the US gov (irs/wildlife/other LEO).
This has always been a top 3 dream gun for me. Omega made some semi auto 10mm clones, but they are hard to come by. Thanks for covering this gun in detail!
Oh I didn't know that. Now I have to find one.
There has been some MP5/10 receiver 'flats' made (kinda like an 80% receiver), and I've seen some pistols, rifles, and SBRs done on those.
The weapon of choice of Team Rainbow in the original Tom Clancy Rainbow Six novel is an MP5SD in 10mm referred to in the book as the "MP-10". I don't think there ever was an SD version of 10mm MP5, but Clancy did his homework, like with every other book.
And if I remember correctly, the book talks about 3 rounds burst.
10mm auto out of a smg barrel is something like 420-450 m/s, so if you use a ported barrel and reduced powder-load you could get the round subsonic, but at that point it´s ballistic performance wouldn´t be better than .45 or .40, so kinda pointless.
Huh in Modern Warfare (2019) I combined the 10mm ammo switch and the SD barrel without knowing that. Makes me like that parts combo more.
@@guillaume4519 Yes, and I'm pretty sure they exclusively went for headshots. Three of those bad boys will end your day in short order.
Holy jeebus...fictional books and video games. I've owned 10mm pistols. The early Glock 20 and the S&W 1006.
After that brief flirtation I went to or returned to the .45ACP-.45+P and.45 Super.
Always a good day when I see a new video with Johnathan. I hope to meet him someday!
Interesting breakdown of an obscure variant. I remember using this in Raven Shield and being fascinated by it.
Actually, with progressive stamping, it would most likely be the case of swapping just a few die sets along the original manufacturing line to adapt for the bigger magwells, so the they wouldn't have to develop a completely new set of tooling.
All the mag related stamping dies would need to be designed and made specifically for this. Thats not cheap. Plus man hours to swap them out... though id imagine theyd do them in large runs
the p-mag makes me think of a PEZ dispenser XD
Ahh yes the high powered pez dispenser.
Forbidden candy...
Like you, Jonathan, I've been a fan of the MP5/10 since I bought Rainbow Six (the book) all those years ago, as well as watching the Joan lunden FBI HRT documentary you mentioned. I was pleasantly surprised to see it appear in the game Ready or Not, and has been fun to use in that, with 2 shot burst and all. Definitely give it a shot (ha) if you're able!
I basically alternate between the MP5SD and MP5/10 in Rainbow Six 3 for my teams, absolutely solid kit in nearly all circumstances
Fun fact here: On the 9mm Mp5's used by the danish police, the boltgroup and the spring are two seperate units aswell.
Garand Thumb's latest video shows that 10mm is significantly more powerful and penetrative than 9mm when loaded to its max potential. A lot of commercial 10mm is actually under-powered. The FBI decided 10mm was too much as agents were performing poorly with it under testing. They then went to .40 SW which in theory still had more power than 9mm but less recoil than 10mm.
10mm probably is a bit much out of a handgun for your average shooter to handle, but I'd imagine out of an MP5 the recoil would be fairly managable.
I was today years old when I learned that H&K was headquartered right down the road from me in the US. Go figure! Love your videos!
You know, I was watching this while using World of Guns to disassemble an MP5. Very enjoyable game, also get to learn.
I didn't know the museum have a channel that does this style of videos and I already love Forgotten Weapons so this is perfect
We used to call this "the Centimeter" when I did training with it. Sad it never lasted, just like the other 10mm experiments the FBI delved into and then dropped. "Allegedly" because female agents couldn't accurately handle/control the power. Let's just say I never read any kind of official explanation for the end of the 10mm unification project, but that allegation matches what I've witnessed on the range... Hell of it was up to me we'd still be using the Monitor lol
The initial load of 10mm which the FBI used was actually pretty hefty for a pistol, and supposedly it made it much harder to qualify for many agents ("women and asians," is what you might hear people repeat). The later "FBI Load" of 10mm was much milder, and Smith & Wesson would plain copy that load in a slightly shorter case to create the .40 S&W cartridge.
Incidentally, Gaston Glock quietly stole two rounds of .40 S&W from Smith & Wesson's booth at Shot Show (or whatever the equivalent was named at the time), and then developed and launched the Glock 22 (.40) before Smith & Wesson had released their own first pistol in the caliber to market.
Lol women agents. I want a woman trying to enforce laws lol
That whole story is basically made up. The FBI never considered full power 10mm. One of the employees brought in 10mm handloads (reduced power) to test. They ended up liking the round enough to adopt it with the less powerful load. They realized pretty quick that it's pretty wasteful to use 10mm when you don't actually want all that extra power which is why we have .40 now.
The original load was a 200 at 1300fps. Thats a cannon & close to full house.
What I was told by a retired agent is if you put the 10mm from the mp5 into a sw 1066 pistol, it would shoot out a fireball of unburnt powder, so they had 2 loads of 10mm, one for the mp5, one for pistols, so they decided to switch to .40 for pistols because that was essentially what they were already using just with a larger case.
HK was like, "What if someone encounters a bear during CQB?"
Wow Hearing someone talk about Raven shield really took me back. i use to play the hell outta that game.
Brilliant comparison and review!
Early wooden furniture MP5s with straight mags looked awesome 👌🏻
Luv the MP-5 Nice 💯Great Video Jonathan , Thanks for Sharing 💥💥💥💥💥💥💥
Thank you for an interesting video. I still play *Raven Shield* today. It's old, but runs fast and I still love the planning, inventory and maps. As indicated, I usually equip with a rifle, not a sub!
Excellet background, all very visible thanks!
10mm still has a subculture of people who just love the cartridge. Some carry it in areas where they may run into bears. Damn hard hitting cartridge. Good episode.
Why am I not surprised Jonathan is a fellow OG R6 enjoyer. 😁
"I carry a 10mm because they don't make an 11" -FBI agent in the late 1980's (maybe)
Uh, but they do. .45ACP is 11mm.
@@JohnHughesChampigny11.43x23mm, but who's counting?
you could also say .44 magnum is "11" because its 10.9x33 @@UpToSpeedOnJaguar
I've learned about that on the Surefire Magazine on HKs anniversary. Awesome! A 10mm mp5!
Very interesting thank you Jonathan
FYI, Jeff Cooper's creation, the 10mm auto round, was meant to be _incredibly spicy._ Only the boutique 'defense' ammo manufacturers make 10mm loaded to the original specs.
Another fun fact: the FBI quit using the 10mm because of high disqualification rate of female agents (and the 'armchair agents') using pistols in that caliber...THAT is the dirty little secret about the FBI's brush with a cartridge _meant_ to put down humans with one shot.
Rogue Spear was great it had a lot of MP5 variations. Fell in love with the SD right there, click click click click
It would be really cool, if you guys could do the Savage 99. Thank you.
Great video, I was really hoping to see a more detailed explanation of how the bolt catch mechanism works though. We didn't even see how or where it interacts with the bolt. It's a major difference between this gun and the original (or any other roller-delayed firearm), so I think it deserves a closer look. Where does it catch the bolt/carrier? How mechanically is the force from the magazine transferred through the device? This could also have been a good time to explain why BHO mags (mag follower blocks bolt from closing) aren't really a thing for roller-delayed guns, but are for others (like AKs).
Was definitely expecting a Raven Shield/Rogue Spear shout out. Loved those games.
The MP5/10 was first issued to the Bureau in '92 with the priority being HRT and the Regional Office SWAT teams. While it stood into the armories until 2016 as other comment mentioned, it fell on favor of AR carbines circa 2008 for agents in general. Last time I saw the HRT guys running the MP5 operationally was in 2005, by next year, they had fully switched to the M4 already, followed by the other SWAT teams afterward. I remember the Quantico guys running custom muzzle devices to tame the full power 10mm used by these guys. The gun exposed is a "regular" agent version, having only semi and two round burst positions. SWAT and HRT guns had full auto, of course.
Yeah, every once and a while you can still find fairly recent pictures/video from some of the regional SWAT guys using these. You can tell by looking at many of them that they are very clearly old, well-used guns (by modern standards) that have seen a lot and are being kept alive through care & maintenance. Most of the ones I've seen as an outsider looking in have been extensively modified with aftermarket MP5 furniture (quad rails, optics mounts, muzzle devices, etc.) as well.
My understanding is that -- as you said -- HRT traded these in for other weapons (primarily AR variants) quite some time ago. Additionally, most "regular" Agents have been instructed to do the same. The only ones who still use the MP5/10 in any meaningful capacity within the last few years were the aforementioned regional SWAT teams and even then standing orders are to run them until the proverbial wheels fall off, ship them back to Quantico, and then receive an AR variant in exchange. I understand this is largely due to institutional inertia and the fact that many of these field offices had absolute stockpiles of 10mm Auto JHP along with some localized spare parts.
i remember when this came out and my dad was talking about it. i always wanted to shoot a MP5/10 with full power 10 auto rounds on burst. i can only imagine how hard it kicks
So neat!! We have an h&k museum here in Virginia
Love the fixed stock MP5 drools!
The HK G41, basically a HK33 that accepts STANAG AR magazine also had a bolt hold open tab.
Raven Shield was my jam back in high school and college.
I remember reading about the 10mm MP5 in Tom Clancy's novel "Operation Rainbow" back in the 90s. I was surprised by the fact it actually existed(I found out it had been used by the FBI HRT team during the Waco hostage crisis a short time after the novel came out) and it was a good idea at the time. Now, short barreled rifles have rendered most pistol caliber SMGs and carbines obsolete, at least for military purposes. But back in the day, a 10mm SMG bridged the capability gap between 9mm and rifle calibers.
He is so good at his job.
Actually the first Novel/Game release im aware of was with the Star Wars Shadows of the Empire multimedia project in 1996, which was set up as essentially a film release tie in media blitz, without a film. It eas an expirement to see if the Star Wars brand was still active and strong enough to sell merchandise without a major theatrical release. Turns out, it was. Its success led to the start of production of the Prequel trilogy.
It also showcased that videogames had come far enough as a market to stand on their own as a story telling medium.
Really like how they implemented this gun in Ready or Not.
What a fantastic video, thankyou for going so indepth with the details on the bolt design. really fascinating stuff. Is it possible you could elaborate on what it is like to shoot compared to the 9mm? recoil impulse, accuracy etc? on single and full auto? Sad we can not even have these in semi in the UK!
The chambers were fluted. Years ago in the 1990's when I was still living in the PRC, (callie, not the other one). I was shooting my Glock 20, at the San Gabriel Valley range in Duarte.
10 mm brass for reloading, was very hard to come by compared to 9mm. I was amazed to find a pile of 10 brass on the ground at the pistol range. Scoped it up without further ado, and took it home to reload it. When I got it home and started cleaning and depriming it. I was amazed to see strange marks on all the fired brass.
Figured it could have only come from the fluted chambers of the FBI's MP 5's in 10 mm. Many LEO's used the range for training outside the normal shooting hours.
What does LEO stand for?
@@Random_Guy_20xxlaw enforcement officer
7:20 "magazine hold open device" ;)
The 10mm MP-5 in the FBI was widely used outside of the HRT by Field Agents and SWAT Teams. Additionally, most WERE equipped with 'A2' buttstocks. Interestingly 10mm cases ejected by the MP-5/10mm were frequently split.
Love it. The HK53 is even better. The MP5 is cooler in an SD configuration. Solid stock a must.
I fired one of these in full auto. It was chambered in 40 s&w and i was shocked at how easy it was to dump a full mag into a standard target at 10 yards
Ding! You had me at Rogue Spear
Love my HK MP5 SD6 in .22LR, such an iconic firearm
Interesting thing, on the latest civilian SP5 from HK, the return spring is also separate from the bolt carrier group... quite frankly never knew that it was attached as a single unit in the 1st place
Less parts to loose i guess. Coming from Norway and using the MP5 as service weapon back in the day. Doing a field strip in a dark tent at wintertime you want as few loose parts as possible. Because snow tend to disappear small parts very easy
These are legendary
That was such a good game.
Thanks from Louisiana!
A company called liberty civil defense makes a very lightweight projectile , 60 grains, in 10mm auto, from just a 6.5-7” barrel pistol it averages around 2700 fps or 823 meters per second, putting it in high power rifle category in terms of energy. It’s almost like having a full-size 5.45x39 ak74 but in the palm of your hand…..
I'm sure it seems that way to people who don't know what sectional density is. Good old marketing.
@@chaimafaghet7343 3/4 of the projectile still goes about 12” into ballistic gel
@@chaimafaghet7343 I’ve seen tests it still penetrates car doors and other intermediate barriers and still achieves close to 12” penetration into gel
the sliding Stock of the normal MP5 is not interchangable with the Mp5/10 - it needs a special sliding stock with a cutout for the bolt release
I believe the A3 stock has a relief cut for bolt hold open latch. I have an A3F type stock that has this which makes me wonder how many MP5/10 and MP5/40 guns were out there.
I still periodically read Rainbow 6. Wish the later games had the same level of tactical planning.
I've never actually seen one of these before. An interesting read.
The MP5/10 with the famous surefire flashlight handguard will always be peak MP5 to me. It just looks right!!!
Johnathan has THE best job in the world
11:55 maybe at a guess, if you had a wide variety of bullet weights in 10mm auto you might need to swap the recoil springs and locking pieces easily to ensure reliable function with that specific ammo?
Whellp! The MP5A2 Was allready my favourite SMG of all time, and now its the MP5A2/10 !
I allways thought submachine guns should have slightly bigger bullets than pistols.
And in the background Col Cooper and “ Thumper “ concept
Jonathan we already knew that you like the MP5 but seeing the familiarity with which you handle and disassemble it something else comes out.
Tell the truth: every now and then, after your lunch break, you take one out and play with it a bit.
Be honest!
10mm - Gigachad
.40 S&W - Limp Noodle
Very nice.
The FBI did extensive testing with 5.56 to make sure it wouldn't overpenetrate during raids. Of course, they're able to use self defense rounds instead of full metal jacket, which reduces overpenetration, because the bullet dumps energy quickly.
Local cops,use HPs
All the greatness of the mp5. Only this time its got a real round in it