Golden Sun TLA: ALL Forgeable Items - RNG method
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- Опубликовано: 29 июн 2019
- The complete guide for all forgeable items in Golden Sun TLA. Use this RNG manipulation method to obtain any item you want from Sunshine.
The Chart:
drive.google.com/file/d/1IEm_...
The timing windows are pretty generous, although some systems may have more or less input lag than this emulator. If this method doesn't work, experiment with using your inputs slightly before/after the audio cues shown in this video.
Factors that affect the outcome:
OVERWORLD DJINN (see comment section below)
The hard reset
Start menu mashing (frame perfect to 12 frames slow is fine)
Where you get the encounter (anywhere open near Yallam is fine)
The number of attack cancels
Psynergy you cast
The moving NPC in Yallam (don't touch him!)
The time you enter Sunshine's hut (starting from the moment you enter Yallam)
The time you clear his final text box
Nothing else affects the outcome to my knowledge.
Good luck! Please let me know if it works or doesn't work in the comments! 
Игры
I left the chart and a few more details in the description. Please leave any questions in the comments!
EDIT: This method is affected by the number of missing overworld Djinn!! For each missing overworld Djinni, subtract 1 from the number of attack cancels. Also, each missing overworld Djinni effectively reduces the window for clearing the start menu by 2 frames, so you may have to mash through it quickly. (The Overworld Djinn: Iron, Sour, Chill, Wheeze, Core, Petra)
Does this still work the same on Switch Online? Having trouble getting Excalibur still.
@@brianchesbrough4686 It should work. To troubleshoot, I'd recommend double-checking which overworld djinn you have, and seeing if the NPC movement matches the movement in the video.
What a blessing that I'm allowed to experience this in my life!
2020 and the GoldenSun Community is still alive. God bless you all!
Is there a Discord server for the community ?
one thing for people who have trouble with the audio cue like me: keep the video paused right at the moment he enters the town and unpause the video and follow along at the same time he moves through the door and talks to the blacksmith.. if you unpause at the right time the audio matches up with you
Thank you very much, i played golden sun and golden sun tla once a year since 2007. Finally i can easily get the item that i want
Wow, that’s totally awesome and easy to use!! Thanks so much for figuring this out, it should make my next playthrough someday even better!! ❤️👍🏻👍🏻🎊🎉🍺
Awesome Dyrati, thank you! Well done!
Sick that you came up with this
VIRGEN DEL AGARRADERO!!! It worked! I almost got a heart attack when I got Excalibur first try... Thank you so much!
Holy shit!!! This actually works!!! Amazing find
Got Excalibur first try. Thank you!
Got an Excalibur 1st try, thanks so much!
The music cues are around 12 and 23 seconds after entering the town. Keeping track of the seconds helped me learn the cues.
Thanks a lot mate !
I got Excalibur, thank you!
THANK YOU!!!!
This is pretty cool. Makes me wonder if you can also manipulate the lemurian medal lottery or the drop chances of monsters to get the unique items faster. Its been so long that I played Golden Sun.
There are actually plenty of methods to guarantee item drops from monsters in the first 2 golden Sun games. They're listed in the wikipage
Valeu demais. Obrigado
amazing
Well, going to see how successful i can be to do this on my current run in hard mode. Already got the early Sol Blade but would be nice to have some other buffs in attack or defense.
Does changing djinn (I had to cast Growth, so I needed to change my djinn setup) alter the GRN? I couldn't get the desired item until I saved with the djinn already changed, and then it worked at the first try.
I don't think that should've affected it. However, the timing windows for some of the RN ranges in the table are very slightly different than others.
What do i do if i run into a mad vermin do i restart
hey, may i ask you if all of this is doable playing the game on gameboy sd ? or is it impossible only on pc
Do you think you could come up for a method to get a party with perfect level up like there is for the original Golden Sun? Since Jenna Felix and Sheba start at 5, and Piers at 18 this would probably be insanely hard right?
It wouldn't be difficult. In fact that entire original perfect-leveling guide could be condensed into a single setup. I probably would have made a guide for that already if I wasn't distracted with other projects.
The only real trick is getting a consistent GRN (general random number) at the end of the battle. In GS1 it's easy, the GRN is always the same after a reset. In this forging guide, after the attack cancel part, the GRN is consistent. Once the GRN is known, you can trial-and-error with more/fewer attack cancels prior to defeating the enemy party, until you get a perfect level up.
I did make a lua script for the VBA-RR v24 emulator that displays the RNG on screen while you're playing the game, and lets you modify it. It could be used to make a guide. In case you're interested:
vba-rr: www.emutopia.com/index.php/emulators/item/261-nintendo-gameboy-gameboy-colour/444-vba-rerecording
rn editor: pastebin.com/vPXNcSd8
Dont know what im doing wrong, can't understand sound cue
I'm trying to forge Mythril Clothes from Mythril Silver. Using Frost psynergy per the table, but I keep getting Psychic Circlet instead of Mythril Clothes (like 5 times in a row).
Am I missing something really obvious? Seems like Frost might not be the right psynergy for the 20 to 40 RN range?
I also tried Frost with Stardust, and instead of getting Planet Armor, I'm getting Stardust Ring.
Try subtracting two attack cancels. If you're missing any of the following Djinn: Iron, Sour, Chill, Wheeze, Core, Petra, then you have to subtract one attack cancel for each one missing.
This is amazing! I wished this was known back then in 2003 when I played this and didn't have to spend so much time resetting the game until I got what I wanted haha.
How can you come up with a method like this?
The recursive RNG formula (found via debugging tools like VBA-SDL-H) is rng(x+1) = mod(1103515245*rng(x) + 12345, 2^32). The RNG value is stored at one consistent spot in memory, which you can view using the memory viewer of gba emulators (address 0x030011BC). The middle 2 bytes of that value are used for mathematical formulas that require random numbers, and that part can range from 0 to 65535.
Armed with that formula, I created a lua script that runs on the VBA-RR emulator that displays the number of advances the RNG has made. With a little testing, I noticed that the RNG advanced by 1 the moment you cleared Sunshine's last text box. I tried modifying the value directly, and found that specific ranges from 0-65535 corresponded to specific items, and i used that to figure out the percent chance for each item.
After that I had to come up with a setup that results in a consistent RNG value at that point in time. The RNG resets to 0 when you reset the game, but it advances each frame during the title screen, so after clearing that screen, you're not sure what the RNG count is, but you can know that it's within some small range if you cleared the title screen quickly. I cast Tremor to offset the RNG so that the next 12 RNG counts all give unique enemy encounters, and that allows you to ascertain which RNG count you're on based on the next enemy encounter. Then I use attack cancels to collapse all those counts to 1 specific RNG count.
When you walk into Yallam, the RNG starts going crazy because each NPC movement causes it to advance. That's why the timing is important. I picked audio cues that I thought were easy to hear and close to points where NPCs aren't moving for a few moments. Entering Sunshine's hut also advances the RNG, and that can affect NPC movement as well, so I needed 2 audio cues.
After that I went back and tested various combinations of psynergy to arrive at specific RNG counts by the time you're talking to Sunshine. Anyways, I'd recommend hanging out in the Golden Sun Hacking Community (GSHC) discord or the Golden Sun Speedrunning discord for anyone interested in learning how to do stuff like that.
@@dyrati4650 thank you for all that explanation! It is even more impressive understanding all the work you did to made that work! As a casual player (I love to watch speedruns tho or stuff like this) but with completionist tendencies, those makes a real difference haha. Thank you! :D
What are the audio cues? All i hear is music.
I didn't know you can go to the sanctum instead to get out
Same here lol
You can also spnd the night at the inn...😊
And also another question, is this crafting stuff overpowered in game ? I mean, it must deal some crazy damage on enemies right ?
It should be doable on any system. A lot of the strongest items in the game are made here with forging.
I wish I knew about this when I was still playing. When was this discovered?
I discovered it two days before I uploaded it (June 28th, 2019)
RNG manipulation methods like this one have been present in speedruns for a long time, although only for the spirit ring as far as I know. I just generalized it, after figuring out how to use the RNG to calculate which items get forged.
So maybe it's just me but I don't hear the audio cue... Anybody else having a hard time hearing it?
Hi! You're not the first person to have struggled with that. I made this image to help a little bit.
drive.google.com/open?id=1K2aw-o5whq_7PTOxl8pv1cnxLakYd4Ij
The lines represent notes in the music. High lines are high notes, low lines are low notes. Orange is the main melody, and black is background notes. I've circled the audio cue locations. (side note, in the video I actually made audio cue 2 text appear very slightly too early).
Tried to use the method to grab Excalibur, followed everything and it gave me Xylion armor.
i'm using mGBA. Does changing emulators affects the rng?
The emulator shouldn't affect the RNG, although it's possible that the timing will be very slightly different. Did you account for the missing overworld djinn? There are 6 of them in TLA. If your party is missing Iron, Sour, Chill, Wheeze, Core, or Petra then you'll have to subtract 1 attack cancel for each one you're missing. (I didn't know that affected it when I made the video)
@@dyrati4650 i will give it a try again, i'm missing only one.
@@dyrati4650 It worked, thank you for this. Stay safe!
@@dyrati4650 oh i thought the missing djinn meant if you HAD them you had to subtract 1 attack cancel... maybe that explains why i kept getting the wrong thing
How to get item for forging ?
You may get them in treasures around the world or as drop items from enemies (search on google how to RNG manipulate specific item drop)
amazing. if i use the technique to get into anemos inner santum without all djinn just when i can get to acess it, i can acess it, get the orihalcum and the dark matter, and then rush to shaman village and abuse the trial road glitch. after that, i can get as many orihalcun and dark matter as i would need (actually, just 2 for 2 excaliburs, but may use some to get some good armor to help face jupiter lighthouse as well). So i actually get very powerful items just before jupiter lighthouse.
Good lord... When I think of all the time I wasted trying to game what I assumed was just a randomized outcome...
Which emulator do you use?
VBA-ReRecording v24
@@dyrati4650 ty!
After 10000000000 times I get always another item. I follow the same steps and even went further and did the same movements and copied the same exact moment when you enter the house and talk to the smith, still at the exact same time and music, no chance to get excalibur. I am playing the original game in Switch.
Did you account for missing overworld Djinn? (pinned comment on this video)
If you're missing Iron, Sour, Chill, Wheeze, Core, or Petra, you must subtract one attack cancel for each one missing. If it's another issue, lemme know.
I have all Djinns and still same issue. I get literally every other item than excalibur
Next question: When you enter Yallam, is the NPC movement exactly the same as in the video? If you leave Sunshine's hut immediately, is it still the same movement?
Have you gotten any encounters not in the list?
If you take a step in any direction in the overworld after the attack cancels, then use a breakable item (like an adept ring), does it break? (it should break if you're on the correct rng count)
Or you could go into the Debug Room and get what you need
I didnt undertood shit
wtf ..
why need to do this ? it ruin the thrill of the game lol