Has affirmative action done more harm than good?
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- Опубликовано: 11 фев 2024
- Affirmative action had unintended consequences. Does that mean it hasn't worked?
Watch the full Soho Forum debate between Jason Riley & Nikhil Pal Singh here: ruclips.net/user/liveVHCg5BQBVcs
Claudine Gay is the canary in the coal mine to show how Affirmative Action actually harms the community. Glenn Lowery has spoken extensively on this.
Affirmative Action may have been a solution for its time, but not for all time.
sure, it's "*a* solution".. but it seems there is evidence that it's not even a good solution.
As was stated in the original decision….Sandra Day O’Connor mused that 50 years was likely….
@@darbyheavey406 But apparently things flipped much sooner than O'Connor could have realized in favor of minorities as evidenced via university records of applications and admissions over the last couple of decades. Not to mention visual demographic video evidence of the last 10 or 20 years of commencement ceremonies that people can go and watch for themselves.
Riley: "What is the point of flunking out of Berkeley, when they can graduate from UC Santa Cruz?"
Answer : "I feel good about myself for helping Blacks, even if that help is artificial and detrimental in the long run."
U.C. Santa Cruz is literally the worst University, even more leftist (arguably) than Berkeley. They are both neo-Marxist Indoctrination camps destroying our society, -Western Civilization and the entire World.
Through experience: If there are people in a class that aren't qualified to be in that class, the teacher then has to teach to the lowest common denominator. This diverts resources and time unnecessarily. It slows down the progress of the entire class and by the end of the class, everybody that was qualified fell short of the original learning goals.
I'm a teacher. Can confirm.
Immediately they're talking about two different things. First guy is talking about black families becoming better off in material terms at a faster rate before Affirmative Action policies, and the other guy is talking about California shitlib concerns about the diversity of a university campus. I don't think a black kid in Baltimore who has grown up in poverty without parents gives a shit about how many blacks have professorships at Harvard.
I think it’s important to understand why blacks at that time were doing better. It was in the middle of Jim Crow & segregation was still legal. hell I don’t think black people could buy white companies stock at the time. When you isolate a group like that of course they would have a better sense of community & productivity because they had to. That would translate to better off materially because you would have a parallel society thats much more community focused again because they had to be.
But to achieve that the community in my thinking would have to borderline be communist or socialist to a degree & we know how to United States government feels about communism. Hell they left W.E.B. Du Bois in Ghana for the thought of him being communist.
Plus at that time Black people would have been more skilled being the end of sharecropping. They probably had all the right skills just couldn’t sell to whites so what did they do? Changed there price point and sold to blacks making black goods much cheaper & far more competitive. That would be illegal now to change a price point based on race. So I think looking back that far in time we should understand the difference from today & then. Some of the things that would be considered acceptable then would not be now.
@@Bgrk or could it be that the black families had a mother and father in the home? Even during Jim Crow.
The DIE cult was always for the benefit of the elite - women, black, white saviours etc.
They don't care what impact their policies have on poor women, poor nlacks or poor whites etc
@kerrycarter330 I thinks thats partly his point. The point that they had a better sense of community and one of the major points is having a family structure in a vlose knit community.
Affirmative Action hurts all races although in different ways- Thomas Sowell
Punishing the son for the sins of the father on steroids.
How are white men being punished? Please tell me.
@@MaleahsDiary You have two applicants with equal or similar capabilities. If one of them is black and the other is white, affirmative action compels you to hire the black one. Hence, if you're white, you need to excel more to be deemed an equal applicant.
This discussion is very interesting but also at least in the beginning it sounds as if they are making different points. Generalized black middle class upward mobility and black tenured professors at Ivy league institutions are not equivalent
Nepotism and cronyism are the way to go. Great honest debate.
He's cherry picking extremely small samples to try and draw national conclusions from. "Tenured Harvard professors" is a pool of what, a few dozen people at most? That's supposed to be representative of hundreds of millions of people?
I don't think a stance of, "let me ignore other ivy league schools and only focus on this *one*, where the numbers support my stance" is not a very good stance.
it's just refreshing to see someone answer this question, because just asking it would get me fired and cancelled.
"I didn't come here to debate" LOL
It is far more important to consider someone’s complexion than one’s aptitude to signify one’s own complexion based superiority.
One only needs to look at the Biden crew to see the hilarious result of neo-Marxist hiring practices. What a freak show 🤪
As a right handed blonde I agree.
Left handed blondes analogy was perfect!
If Harvard didn’t have enough black professors in the 1970s and decided to hire people based on their skin color instead of their credentials, that might lower the quality of their faculty. Do we have any data that might point to a decrease in the scholarship of their faculty since the 1970s?
That is one of their goals.
They want to undermine all the institutions, customs, culture etc. So they foment their revolution and usher in the socialist utopia.
it is racist and pushes people into positions that they may not be qualified for, but at the least does displace those that are more qualified in some cases.
Who would want a job in which your colleagues may wonder if you are qualified or not.
He put an exclamation point on it at the end.
It’s reverse discrimination it always has been and always will be. 😂
No, just racial discrimination!
Forward, reverse, sideways etc - all the same beast!
Yes. It has.
It's fair to discredit that which cannot be vetted.
Affirmative action promotes mediocrity.
I believe the guy on the left because he talks like a data scientist. The guy on the right cherry picks and shrinks the sample size.
Riley is a long time WSJ reporter. He is the black gentleman on the viewers left.
5:20 i didn't come here to debate the central question of this debate.
Yes it has
When discussing such things we have to look at from a wide view. What else happened in the 70s the crack epidemic began and black men were heavily targeted by police, welfare system kicked men out, and so there was an increase of black incarceration, decreased in black fathers in the home etc. so was it AA or other factors?
It turns out, that if you are merely an academic, and do not go out into the world, you have no toolset for verifying, or more importantly, falsifying your ideas.
Affirmative Action Jackson.🤟🏻
If you give a person a job or promotion they don't merit, sure you can spin the person is better off and hence this is good. Unimpressive.
When I was in the military everything I wanted to do, I was told there were no billets open for a Caucasian male 😳
After 4 years I got out unrated. 👺
Claudine Gay is a Harvard affirmative action "success" -- an extremely underwhelming candidate to start with (in terms of amount of published material) who was later found out to be much worse than even mediocre.
Yes. The other part that is not helping is the hidden prejudice afterwards where society is not valuing an AA recipient’s degree equally.
Who’s the dude on the left? He’s great. Dude on the right lives in a bubble
Jason Riley. He, like me, is a big Thomas Sowell fan. He needs to be careful though. His arguments sound exactly, word for word, like what Sowell has said.
Look at Thomas Sowell's Affirmative Action Around the World
Mister, your Robert Putnam NJ but
I didn't qualify for ANY financial aid for college because, as the black female working in the fin. aid dept at my urban-area university stated to me: "If you were black, single, pregnant and w/ a hispanic surname, i could get you all you need, but you don't qualify for anything" (me, a 23 yo female at the time, 1991). where's my "reparations"? LOL Affirmative Action RIP
No AA didn’t work snd even if it did, it shouldn’t be allowed. It is enough
To comment on the pre 1970s vs. post 1970s financial gain of black Americans, the nation underwent 3 recessions between 1970 and 1980. In 1970 the average black household income was around $32K as opposed to average white household income of $51K. Like any other recession, people who already had less money to begin with, were more drastically impacted. So to make the argument that affirmative action suddenly slowed black progress, without considering external factors, is silly.
Yes, it has been anti beneficial. When you get preferred treatment, equality feels like discrimination!
Didn’t Gay just get demoted for plagiarism? You’re doing the same thing.
You cannot expect racial harmony by emphasizing racial differences.
I believe in affirmative action as if it’s not used like pure “equity” . I’m completely against “equity” but certain groups do need a little help from what cultures they came from .
Irrespective of the level of discrimination based on race and/or sex, affirmative action IS discrimination on the basis of race and/or sex.
Possibly change the culture then. Ain’t gonna happen.
@@kerrycarter330 it looks like they’re trying to change the wrong culture!
@@kerrycarter330 if you look at music and movie award shows it’s obvious the left controls the culture. People have been socially engineered the way they are!
@@HEELMACHINE and what culture would that be?
Woa bro stop w the logic and data
Thia black guy ia projecting really hard.
One side seems to believe what they do is for the greater good, and they are achieving many of the objectives they wish to achieve, which are not anything like the results they promised.
Why was affirmative action created in the United States? If some employers were not racist, we wouldn't need affirmative action. If it were up to some people, black people would not work and watch us starve to death.
I am a self-employed black person partially because it's my passion and partially because I do believe I have experienced racial discrimination by non blacks duirng the job interview process.
Instead of complaining, I created my own job.
I AM NOT A DEMOCRAT OR A REPUBLICAN. I AM A REGISTERED INDEPENDENT VOTER. So don't bother calling me woke.
Next up: Has slavery done more harm than good?
How could it with all that cotton that was produced?
LOL
Yes!