GREAT video Jed!! You, are the one, who originally enlightened me about the dangers of nonstick coatings, and I know you have brought this knowledge out to so many others. THANK YOU, you are very much appreciated, good on you my friend!!
Thanks, Jed! Great message! Interesting EPA data on the Gen X chemicals. After switching to carbon steel and stainless steel, I taught my wife how to cook on those pans. She prefers and loves stainless steel. We got rid of all our non-stick pans a couple of years ago. I have no doubt my grandsons will be cooking on my pans after we're gone.
I thank you for your videos and especially these that address the risks of using non- stick cookware. I have completely replaced my non-stick cookware with carbon steel, cast iron and copper cookware.
I agree completely with you about non-stick. I normally only use cast iron, steel and stainless steel. My concern is when scalding or boiling milk - which I do in stainless, its propensity to sticking and burning being a definite drawback as compared to the dreaded non-stick.
Dark Waters is film that never got the attention it deserved. It is one of those films that makes you so mad that you can't help but be motivated to become environmentally conscious !!
I hear you. The entire saga that then became the movie is a large part of what motivated me to make the changes that I did. It's hard to not do something.
I’m 70 now and I came to adulthood cooking on Teflon pans. The beauty of it is it is foolproof. Cook anything without oil and it wont stick was the sales pitch. They never told us how short lived that promise was! Cast iron and carbon steel has a rather high learning curve and certainly not foolproof. I have been learning how to use them for a year now and have made several mistakes. I even burned my seasoning off a skillet due to oldheimers (forgot the burner was on). But the pan was not ruined and the seasoning was replaced. And that is what I like about iron pans. Unlike teflon pans that have to be replaced after relatively few uses. I just wish that I had known this 50 years ago. I would have plenty of Griswold and Wagner collected.
My cast iron pan works so well. Food releases so well. I made some ground beef patties today. They were about 7cm in diameter and when I went to flip the first one, I get under it with my spatula and once I got 1cm under it, the whole thing started moving because it wasn't even stuck to the pan. I've been using my cast iron pan for maybe two months now and this isn't the first time that happens but even now when it happens I'm still amazed.
Excellent video. Great information. This and some other videos and reading has compelled me to replace all my cookware with nonstick coatings. Even my air fryer/grill has it and I LOVE my air fryer/grill. Probably have to replace that too.
The issue is this stuff isnt only on metal pans. It's on clothing, bedding, anything with anti surficants in it to my understanding. So cleaning products, especially automotive cleaners that arent silicone based (silicone we'll find out is also bad given time. And it sheds like crazy, any time i send my oil to testing lab and cars use silicone aftermarket tubing or pipes, IT'S ALWAYS noticable in the charts. Large measures per million of it. ) Even stuff with VINYL, polyvinyl chrloride PVC, and various other names of plastics you've heard of. Where things get extra tricky is when you introduce the stuff into landfillls, the atoms that make the structure of the chenicals NEVER BREAK DOWN. They're not just gonna disperse. Instead what happens is the chlorine atoms attach to other atoms that live in the Ozone layer. The ozone layer deteriorates as these "forever chemicals" latch on like parasites to a host, rendering the part of the ozone inoperable or incapable of filtering UV from the sun. That's how it's being taught more or less in epa certification classes . That chlorine atoms are the absolute worst and companies phased out the core stuff from the early days that used it, but never stopped completely so derivitives of the original chemical exhist and are used today STILL. Microwaved foods, ready made meals, lots of plastics. What happens when that stuff goes to the dumb? it's buried or either incinerated or recycled. Much of recycling cost too much. Incineration isnt helping and burying the stuff literally poisons the ground and water and areas that tap into those resources too. Its quite bleek looking. Probably all going to die from cancer or kidney/organ failure in a painful disapointing kinda way...And it didnt have to be that way.. But hooray capitalism , money, power, science!
sorry cant edit but i meant microwave food containers and readimade containers. Often cooked in the container, yeah... That's why the food slides right off
@@Ata5ll I think they're using this same stuff in car cleaning products. They all boast water repellling poperties through the use of chemicals known as surficants. PTFE or other. We all gonna get kidney cancer or die from kidney failure in the near future i think
Note that if you are bringing up the animal studies, the results of animal studies fail to reproduce human controlled studies. This is why animal studies argument do not apply. Australian government has done plenty of credible research these days regarding the PFTEs (and PFOA). The university of Adelaide launched the entire PTFE Health Programme and they are responsibile one of the largest (human) studies on the subject. For example, they conclude[1]: "We can do studies on animals; these are indicative but can be misleading. For example, the effects of PFAS on what’s called peroxisome proliferation receptors that regulate fats have been measured in rodents. The effects occur at concentrations typically 1,000 times higher than average human blood concentrations, and around 100 times the blood concentrations in contaminated workers. The human system is less sensitive than the mouse system, so mouse and rat studies may overestimate toxicity to humans." Animals have very little (and some none) tolerance for PFTE/PFOA. 1. University of Adelaide article: theconversation.com/amp/we-should-be-cautious-but-not-concerned-theres-little-evidence-pfas-exposure-harms-our-health-122044 In terms of EWG links I think they are rather manipulative. The first EWG link does not provide evidence or citations for their claims, other than repeating the word "toxic" without any reference. The EPA toxicity report does not support their conclusions (like they claim), and the only citations provided in the link are citations of the members of their own EWG board, not EPA members. Thus, it is neither a piece of well-written analysis, nor valid science; it is not deductive, and does not try to falsify its own claims. Inductive reasoning is confirmation bias. Another EWG link provides no credible evidence either. There are many bold claims with no scientific references. For example, they cite C8 studies, but thise do not support their main theses. The C8 panel did not find any strong connection to either cancer (or else) in relation to PFOA. The outcome keyword is "probable link". In terms of science, this means the result was inconclusive. DuPont was fined for disclosing animal studies which show that rodents are sensitive to PFOA. A top of that, the settlements for health damages were also awarded in court on the bases of probable link outcome. *This is as much what we actually know-know* regarding PFOA, the rest is speculation. That aside, EWG also only brings rodent studies which are not reflective. I do not know of EWG, but they seem to be motivated rather politically / ideologically, rather than objectively, towards science and truth. They could probably have a nice chat with David Foreman, though. Note also that, as it currently stands, the research on PFOA indicates that there were efforts at classifying it as "weakly non-specific genotoxic" in terms of harm. Whatever the effect of PFOA, we have to understand that the link will not be strong, since the proposed label isn't. An example of strong genotoxic effect would be smoking cigarattes which causes lung cancer, yet despite of that, millions of people smoke them on daily bases everday (and they are perfectly legal).
@@douglassmith215 On that note, Teflon pans are trash in terms of performance (heat variability, heat retention) and end up in a bin at 3 years of use. You will eventually throw them away. And they won’t kill you in the quantities you are getting PFOA in, the call is yours to make. But I still advise against Teflon, it’s crap. Get some cast iron.
I bought a couple items from a yard sale about 15yrs ago and just getting around to the effort of using them. I was shocked to find teflon pots inside both of them. One is a well know infomercial pressure cooker and the other by a well known chef and more of a glorified rice cooker. Neither were ever used. I see they sell stainless steel insert pots averaging $30. Still havn't decided if either is worth the effort.
Even if you ignore the health risks, these pans just don't make sense financially. You can get a brand new Lodge cast iron skillet for $25 of one of their carbon steel skillets for $40. Even if teflon pan is only $10-$15, it's going to need to replaced within a few years and then it ends up in a landfill. The carbon steel pan will last decades, and the cast iron pan will outlast members of your family who haven't even been born yet.
If a person doesn’t want to listen about the health risk they should at least listen to the financial cost of a pan. A frequently used $40 nonstick pan will wear out in a year. A $115 Debuyer will last a lifetime. In 10 years you will spend $400 on nonstick pans and my original Debuyer will still have eggs sliding around in it 🤣😆😂.
Indeed, and add to this piles of garbage pans one is adding to the environment. Convenience often comes at a high environmental and financial cost, esp. as it relates to cooking & food delivery. We can and should do better - Jedd's info & advice is execellent!
You can also spend a little less and still get stainless, carbon steel or cast iron that will last a lifetime. Takes a bit more tlc so there is time spent and oil for seasoning to factor in but it's still way more efficient in the long term.
It's a good thing I switched to stainless and carbon steel. I did it because my roommates used to destroy our teflon pans, but this is another good consideration. PFOAs are very harmful to our environment and could be the asbestos of our generation.
What kind of pan should I use?! I'm a person that don't cook and hate vegetables, but I found a way to cook and enjoy vegetables anyway. I throw frozen vegetables into a non stick pan on max heat (before the pan itself really gets too hot), put a lid on and let the vegetables unfreeze slightly, take the lid off, cut the too big pieces, fry until water is gone and until I get some roasting surface, then lower the temperature and add something with protein. I eat low carb so having lots of fat in the pan is ok. What type of pan should I use? Stainless steel sounds nice in that I can even clean the pan in the dishwasher, but I heard they can't handle high heat? Tried carbon steel and failed, but I can make a new try if you think it is the best. Cast iron I used long long ago and found them too heavy. But maybe there are more modern lighter variants? Suggestions for brands is also welcome.
You'd have to "smoke" the pan higher than 260C for several hours for this to happen. Literally, this is almost equivalent of burning the pan (and the coating).
@@mac1414 please provide common sense. Citations from what exactly, science has been brought and paid for over the last few years. It has discraced itself, so no.... Sod citations, no big chemical company has ethics or troubles itself with morality. It does EXACTLY what it can get away with. If you want proof, look at their history of pollution of the environment or body.
Hello from the Netherlands here Jed. Have you ever heard of an Italian brand called Mepra? They make all kinds of cookware and claim their copper set is right up there with Mauviel and quality and certainly in price. There is a a sale going on now for 40% off and I wonder if you have ever heard from them, as I cannot find much on the internet. Thank you for your videos, and Id love to hear your 2 cents on this.
Tried to tell a friend about this, he said its too late to stop using Teflon... Ive kind of given up telling anyone about stuff like this. Its frustrating. If people are happy poisoning themselves i cant do a damn thing. Ive opened my eyes to a number of things, i get your sentiment but a lot of people are stubborn and happy in their ignorance... After a lot of effort trying to make people i know aware, Its just easyer to let them get on with it.
It took me half a life time to learn, that no one needs non stick pans but the pan dealer and producers. With some tricks it's super easy to make cast iron and forged steel as non-stick as possible. Best method: Use linseed oil after the first very thorough cleaning of the pan. If your pan fits in an oven completely, its easy. Just rub the pan with the oil until its coated but not wet with it. Put it in the oven at about 250°C for an hour or so (maybe shorter, search internet for detailed descriptions). Get it out. Until cool enough just repeat it several times. You will see a groving thin coating of burnt in degraded linseed oil on the surface. When the naked iron surface is vanished completely ,you can use it the firat time with some non sticky food. Use plenty of oil in the beginning. After some usages it becomes more and more non-sticky. After some days i fried some eggs with no problems. Only advice for usage: careful with acidy food, don't use pure salt on hot surface and never clean it with soap or other chemicals! Just hot water, a sponge or brush. And rub it with oil after drying.
The current general scientific consensus is that PTFE is biocompatible and inert, meaning it does not react with bodily tissues or fluids. This also makes it suitable for use in medical implants and devices that are in prolonged contact with the body. I have yet to find a study that specifically says PTFE that is free of PFOAs can cause harm when properly used. It's true new evidence could be eventually found that will prove otherwise, so I guess it's up to you how important the convencience of PTFE is compared to the possible risks that we haven't yet found.
cancer is a leading cause of death and is on the rise in young people who have lived with these chemicals their entire lives. they knew it was toxic just like cigarettes but they don't care. they literally do not care. they want to use their petroleum byproducts any way they can instead of not making a profit off it. we do not have enough data from long term studies to know. don't defend this shit. seriously. the military uses this a lot and they know it's dangerous and tell people not to be exposed to it.
Thanks for your video and honesty. Are the ptfe based (pfoa free) ninja never stick pans also fall into this category? Or the fact that it’s pfoa free makes it safe?
I have a question. But about hard anodized aluminum pans and cookware, is it only the outside and the inside is still Teflon nonstick or similar? I don't think you have a video on that type of utensils, do you?
Hi, no, I don't. Good question though. The pans are fully anodized but then many brands coat the inside with Teflon. Best to find one that isn't coated.
Thank you for the PSA! Switched to SS and followed your advice on how properly use SS. It works just as good and even better than nonstick as there's no toxins. Also... would you have time to make a video about SS essential pans/ chef pans? Please 🙏
@Cook Culture Hi there! Yes, it is very similar to a wok, but isn't a wok. It is confusing for me as the same pan shows when googling essential pan, chef's pan and saucier. I was specifically looking at the All Clad d5 4 qt and 6 qt ssential pan. These pans seem like it can do it all: fry, stir fry, sauté, make soup, etc.
Even though you talk a lot about carbon steel and cast iron as an awesome alternative to Teflon, wouldn't enameled or stainless steel cookware also be a good, safe option?
Pretty sure we wouldn't find it in the chemical company executive's kitchen or the fda exec's who approved it, or any of the organizations on the internet, touting that it is NOT poison.
if you go threw these reports its not the pans that are dangerous, its the manufacturing of the Teflon that causes the harmful release of these chemicals. The worry isn't your pans. Real question is should we be supporting this industry as these manufacturing plants contaminate the entire environment we live in and is there a way to regulate these companies manufacturing, or perhaps there is no place for this product if they cant ensure the protection of the environment and contamination it causes.
Teflon is safe as long as you do two things... 1- Don't use metal utensils in it so you don't scratch the coating. 2- Don't heat it about 500 degrees f. And if you are cooking that hot, give up now and order pizza delivery because you don't know what you are doing anyway
Hi, your statements are untrue. PFAS chemical are carcinogenic and have been proven to cause bladder cancer, testicular cancer, colon cancer. PTFE (part of the PFAS family) is the chemical that makes Teflon non-stick, and is toxic. The myth that Teflon is 'safe' was created by the chemical makers and sold as truth because the law does not (yet) protect the general public from thousands of PFAS chemicals.
@@Cook-Culture My statements are absolutely factual "PFAS chemical are carcinogenic" This is true. But increased rates of cancer were only found when the produce was NOT WASHED. If you are stupid enough to eat it while the pesticide is still on it, that's just natural selection at work. "The myth that Teflon is 'safe' was created by the chemical makers" And taat is flat out conspiracy theory bullcrap
@@bakk. "Teflon degrades over time" Once scratched, which is why I said "Don't use metal utensils in it so you don't scratch the coating." If you see a scratch in the coating, it is time to replace it, Teflon IS SAFE. But much like with vaccines, or lab grown meat, the fact something is safe in no way stops fearmongering regarding it.
Do the ceramic nonstick pans fall into this toxic group? My guess is that they are. I use stainless steel All-Clad, but I don’t always get the temperature right and food sticks.
As far as I’ve heard, true ceramic cookware is not using nonstick chemicals but if it cracks, it is toxic. In addition, a lot of companies that claim they sell ceramic cookware, are putting a nonstick coating or a glaze on it. Ceramic is just superheated clay and we’ve been using it to cook for thousands of years. But most modern ceramic cookware I’ve seen has the nonstick coating. That’s why I’m only using carbon steel and cast iron.
Bare minimum the ceramic pans are reinforced with aluminum and may be bonded with things like nano titanium. That’s enough to make me not want to use them.
you absolutely nailed it . But it's all about profit and who can brainwash the general public into thinking . . . . . come on over here " our product is so much better " It goes back to who can walk the walk and talk the talk better . I would be first one at the door to buy a carbon steel pan , but I don't belioeve it gonna fly with manufacturers . good luck and thanks for the post
Yeah the appliance exposure can’t be underestimated. My rice cooker should be discarded. I did see on amazon a ceramic microwaveable rice cooker that I might investigate.
I’m thinking about scooping up a Tatung rice cooker. It’s basically a simple steamer with a stainless steel inner pot. It doesn’t sing when the rice is done though :-(
My wife is not ok to dispose our 10 year old Panasonic rice cooker with minor teflon coating damage. However I bought a few years ago a InstantPot and just learned last year to cook Thai rice with it. Its ok but eventually you need then to prepare that the rice will stick a bit and throw the leftovers away.
They should make a pan that's aluminum in the inside for heat distribution, induction friendly stainless bottom layers, and a nice carbon steel cooking surface. That would be nice.
I use the PTFE as an industrial lubricant at work, spray it from a can it smells like death. I would never want to have that chemical brought anywhere near the food I eat.
The PTFE is an inert compound! What you are smelling are the other solvents and chemicals that are the carriers for the teflon particles. Stop spreading false information!
Why didn't you cite any studies or research? You insist there is danger here, yet you chose not to share any of the scientific studies that would help us make good decisions.
I use a cast iron skillet to cook my eggs that is perfectly non-stick. It belonged to my great grandmother. Back in the early 1980s my sister put water in it while it was hot and cracked it. My grand father was alive then and he brazed the crack with some silver/nickle wire. I am 54 years old now and I have been using this pan myself since about 1993. My great grandmother bought this pan in about 1950 for about 75 cents. That's about one penny per year.
Thanks again for another great video about this issue. Let creuset are advertising a non stick frying pan free of all bad chemicals. Do you think this is not right? Thanks mate 👍
Howdy, I can only see the Canadian site but I see that they are advertising 'Toughened Pro Nonstick'. They say that it's PFOA free but it's made with PTFE. So exactly what I'm talking about in this video. Smoke and mirrors.
Just bought a Debuyer Carbon Steel fry pan for my eggs. The trick is to cook on Very Low heat! The pan heats up fast! The Last pan I will need to buy! $115.
Because the effects of using the pan is not definitive. What you will see soonish is the restrictions on using PFOA which will make selling PTFE harder.
I guess kind of like how the Romans drank water from lead pipes. We think it's silly but in a thousand year people will be saying we ate food cooked on ptfe
I was going to buy a air cooker from Costco and after getting responses from people it's made out if Teflon. How can they get buy with this? It's made in China!!!!
My position is that if cooks all over the world cooked for so long using cast iron and carbon steel (and later stainless steel), and they all managed to cook well, why do we need to think that we need non-stick? Besides, most non-stick is crappy thin pressed steel that warps and easily scratches, which means that you end up tossing it in the landfill. Completely environmentally irresponsible.
This is an dilema. Some iron pans are good and some are not. Back in the days iron pans used to be better, my mums pan was as slick as teflon. I had some not that all thar good and very very heavy. My latest one no matter us burning it in moisting it with oil it sucks oil and goes dry in no time. Bad Iron and Iron is not as guaranteed free of poison. The are lots of types of iron, how pure is it`? Well, as to day when we are making the most in Asia we do not know what it is of. They got lot of scrap yards where they are cooking left overs everything that is undesirable all togheter in a pot making bars and these bars goes to makers that will make everyrhing of that blend selling them items back to us. Steel pans they need a lot of oil and that is of no good either. So actually that me and my wife we will use non-stick pans.
I would if not that US made is so dam expensive ove here after all those fees and taxes are placed up on top. Friendship? Hahaha.. European politicians have been working against US for ever favouring China. I can think of a lot of made in US to buy but as been charged up to 50% more than an average american that it will remain as an dream.
Nobody knows anyone who's become directly sick from them., that's the point of becoming more educated on what the larger issue is. I would argue that health care is one of the top issues to all Canadians. Should we not be more educated to what poisons our environment, leading to Cancer, like the prolific use of PFAS chemicals ?
You would think you were American by the BS you spew. I read the references to the paper on the EPA site. Quote "None of the six polymers studied showed any detectable weight loss" this was measured between the temperatures of 150 to 525°C. PTFE is safe as long as high heat is not used, and is replaced every 18 to 24 months if used daily. The manufacture of PTFE is a completely different story. That is why PTFE is only manufactured in third world countries. Might want to stop the fear mongering, you would think you are a Trump supporter.
"and is replaced every 18 to 24 months if used daily"" - you are suggesting that it's appropriate to replace your cookware every 24 months? The more PTFE made, the larger the problem. Unfortunately, the manufacturing of products with PTFE is not all made just in 3rd world countries. No matter what the argument, for or against, no body needs non-stick cookware.
@@Cook-Culture 30 years ado I switched from PTFE to stainless, because the PTFE failed so regularly. This was long before the dangers of PTFE were publicized. I switched because I was too cheap to keep replacing cookware.
The issue is maintenance. It takes a short amount of time to wash & hand dry a nonstick pan. Cooking potato skins for 30 minutes to season a carbon steel pan or baking a cast iron pan for hours is way too much.
It's a little bit of up front effort. But, once properly seasoned, just cooking with it regularly is enough to keep it seasoned. A quick post season after use and you're good to go next time. It really doesn't take that long. Driving to Walmart every 2-4 years to buy a new pan is way more annoying
A little extra upfront time spent prepping a cast iron or carbon steel pan is worth it to avoid unnecessary exposure to forever toxic compounds. Once seasoned, cast iron or carbon steel cookware is nonstick forever. Worth it in my books...
I think there is way too much focus on getting the right seasoning and that hurts new adopters. A lot of cast iron at least is pre-seasoned and so you don’t have to do any of that. Just start cooking and drying it properly and a light coat of oil in the pan every now and then. People go crazy with the seasoning and it makes it seem super difficult to maintain the pans.
@@shigemorif1066 yes! I bought a 12" Lodge and oven seasoned it 5 times like a giant nerd before using. More recently, I bout the big 15" Lodge and just started using it right out of the box and it's been fine.
Keep fighting the good fight! Thanks for the information. Now we just have to convince all of our friends and families.
Step by step!
GREAT video Jed!! You, are the one, who originally enlightened me about the dangers of nonstick coatings, and I know you have brought this knowledge out to so many others. THANK YOU, you are very much appreciated, good on you my friend!!
Thanks, Jed! Great message! Interesting EPA data on the Gen X chemicals. After switching to carbon steel and stainless steel, I taught my wife how to cook on those pans. She prefers and loves stainless steel. We got rid of all our non-stick pans a couple of years ago. I have no doubt my grandsons will be cooking on my pans after we're gone.
Right on! Thanks, Geoff!
I thank you for your videos and especially these that address the risks of using non- stick cookware. I have completely replaced my non-stick cookware with carbon steel, cast iron and copper cookware.
Good on you! Great move.
I agree completely with you about non-stick. I normally only use cast iron, steel and stainless steel. My concern is when scalding or boiling milk - which I do in stainless, its propensity to sticking and burning being a definite drawback as compared to the dreaded non-stick.
I find that rinsing the SS pot with cold water before adding milk to heat up lessens the sticking/burning.
@@pwp8737 I'll try that next time.
Ceramics? In germany called emaille. And carefull heating.
Dark Waters is film that never got the attention it deserved. It is one of those films that makes you so mad that you can't help but be motivated to become environmentally conscious !!
I hear you. The entire saga that then became the movie is a large part of what motivated me to make the changes that I did. It's hard to not do something.
I’m 70 now and I came to adulthood cooking on Teflon pans. The beauty of it is it is foolproof. Cook anything without oil and it wont stick was the sales pitch. They never told us how short lived that promise was! Cast iron and carbon steel has a rather high learning curve and certainly not foolproof. I have been learning how to use them for a year now and have made several mistakes. I even burned my seasoning off a skillet due to oldheimers (forgot the burner was on). But the pan was not ruined and the seasoning was replaced. And that is what I like about iron pans. Unlike teflon pans that have to be replaced after relatively few uses. I just wish that I had known this 50 years ago. I would have plenty of Griswold and Wagner collected.
You're in the right place now. Good on you!!
Better to put your cast iron in the oven to season it at 300 degrees for 1 hour.
My cast iron pan works so well. Food releases so well. I made some ground beef patties today. They were about 7cm in diameter and when I went to flip the first one, I get under it with my spatula and once I got 1cm under it, the whole thing started moving because it wasn't even stuck to the pan. I've been using my cast iron pan for maybe two months now and this isn't the first time that happens but even now when it happens I'm still amazed.
Nice! Thanks for the comment!
Excellent video. Great information. This and some other videos and reading has compelled me to replace all my cookware with nonstick coatings. Even my air fryer/grill has it and I LOVE my air fryer/grill. Probably have to replace that too.
That EPA link just states the chemical process to create PTFE is dangerous not the PTFE itsself?
The issue is this stuff isnt only on metal pans. It's on clothing, bedding, anything with anti surficants in it to my understanding. So cleaning products, especially automotive cleaners that arent silicone based (silicone we'll find out is also bad given time. And it sheds like crazy, any time i send my oil to testing lab and cars use silicone aftermarket tubing or pipes, IT'S ALWAYS noticable in the charts. Large measures per million of it. )
Even stuff with VINYL, polyvinyl chrloride PVC, and various other names of plastics you've heard of. Where things get extra tricky is when you introduce the stuff into landfillls, the atoms that make the structure of the chenicals NEVER BREAK DOWN. They're not just gonna disperse. Instead what happens is the chlorine atoms attach to other atoms that live in the Ozone layer. The ozone layer deteriorates as these "forever chemicals" latch on like parasites to a host, rendering the part of the ozone inoperable or incapable of filtering UV from the sun. That's how it's being taught more or less in epa certification classes . That chlorine atoms are the absolute worst and companies phased out the core stuff from the early days that used it, but never stopped completely so derivitives of the original chemical exhist and are used today STILL. Microwaved foods, ready made meals, lots of plastics. What happens when that stuff goes to the dumb? it's buried or either incinerated or recycled. Much of recycling cost too much. Incineration isnt helping and burying the stuff literally poisons the ground and water and areas that tap into those resources too.
Its quite bleek looking. Probably all going to die from cancer or kidney/organ failure in a painful disapointing kinda way...And it didnt have to be that way.. But hooray capitalism , money, power, science!
sorry cant edit but i meant microwave food containers and readimade containers. Often cooked in the container, yeah... That's why the food slides right off
@@OWNERAdminUser It's in everyone's tapwater.
@@Ata5ll I think they're using this same stuff in car cleaning products. They all boast water repellling poperties through the use of chemicals known as surficants. PTFE or other. We all gonna get kidney cancer or die from kidney failure in the near future i think
@@Ata5ll Caribbean tap water too ?
Note that if you are bringing up the animal studies, the results of animal studies fail to reproduce human controlled studies. This is why animal studies argument do not apply. Australian government has done plenty of credible research these days regarding the PFTEs (and PFOA). The university of Adelaide launched the entire PTFE Health Programme and they are responsibile one of the largest (human) studies on the subject. For example, they conclude[1]:
"We can do studies on animals; these are indicative but can be misleading. For example, the effects of PFAS on what’s called peroxisome proliferation receptors that regulate fats have been measured in rodents.
The effects occur at concentrations typically 1,000 times higher than average human blood concentrations, and around 100 times the blood concentrations in contaminated workers. The human system is less sensitive than the mouse system, so mouse and rat studies may overestimate toxicity to humans."
Animals have very little (and some none) tolerance for PFTE/PFOA.
1. University of Adelaide article: theconversation.com/amp/we-should-be-cautious-but-not-concerned-theres-little-evidence-pfas-exposure-harms-our-health-122044
In terms of EWG links I think they are rather manipulative. The first EWG link does not provide evidence or citations for their claims, other than repeating the word "toxic" without any reference. The EPA toxicity report does not support their conclusions (like they claim), and the only citations provided in the link are citations of the members of their own EWG board, not EPA members. Thus, it is neither a piece of well-written analysis, nor valid science; it is not deductive, and does not try to falsify its own claims. Inductive reasoning is confirmation bias.
Another EWG link provides no credible evidence either. There are many bold claims with no scientific references. For example, they cite C8 studies, but thise do not support their main theses. The C8 panel did not find any strong connection to either cancer (or else) in relation to PFOA. The outcome keyword is "probable link". In terms of science, this means the result was inconclusive. DuPont was fined for disclosing animal studies which show that rodents are sensitive to PFOA. A top of that, the settlements for health damages were also awarded in court on the bases of probable link outcome. *This is as much what we actually know-know* regarding PFOA, the rest is speculation. That aside, EWG also only brings rodent studies which are not reflective.
I do not know of EWG, but they seem to be motivated rather politically / ideologically, rather than objectively, towards science and truth. They could probably have a nice chat with David Foreman, though.
Note also that, as it currently stands, the research on PFOA indicates that there were efforts at classifying it as "weakly non-specific genotoxic" in terms of harm. Whatever the effect of PFOA, we have to understand that the link will not be strong, since the proposed label isn't. An example of strong genotoxic effect would be smoking cigarattes which causes lung cancer, yet despite of that, millions of people smoke them on daily bases everday (and they are perfectly legal).
Thanks for the comments.
Thank you for this comment. Was debating on throwing out my ninja pans… may hold off!
@@douglassmith215 On that note, Teflon pans are trash in terms of performance (heat variability, heat retention) and end up in a bin at 3 years of use.
You will eventually throw them away. And they won’t kill you in the quantities you are getting PFOA in, the call is yours to make. But I still advise against Teflon, it’s crap. Get some cast iron.
I bought a couple items from a yard sale about 15yrs ago and just getting around to the effort of using them. I was shocked to find teflon pots inside both of them. One is a well know infomercial pressure cooker and the other by a well known chef and more of a glorified rice cooker. Neither were ever used. I see they sell stainless steel insert pots averaging $30. Still havn't decided if either is worth the effort.
Even if you ignore the health risks, these pans just don't make sense financially. You can get a brand new Lodge cast iron skillet for $25 of one of their carbon steel skillets for $40. Even if teflon pan is only $10-$15, it's going to need to replaced within a few years and then it ends up in a landfill. The carbon steel pan will last decades, and the cast iron pan will outlast members of your family who haven't even been born yet.
Exactly!
Just like cars used to be...
Can you please elaborate if this affects ALL air fryers with non-stick drawers/baskets? Thank you very much for your time.
It will over time, yes.
If a person doesn’t want to listen about the health risk they should at least listen to the financial cost of a pan. A frequently used $40 nonstick pan will wear out in a year. A $115 Debuyer will last a lifetime. In 10 years you will spend $400 on nonstick pans and my original Debuyer will still have eggs sliding around in it 🤣😆😂.
arguably numerous lifetimes!
Indeed, and add to this piles of garbage pans one is adding to the environment. Convenience often comes at a high environmental and financial cost, esp. as it relates to cooking & food delivery. We can and should do better - Jedd's info & advice is execellent!
You can also spend a little less and still get stainless, carbon steel or cast iron that will last a lifetime. Takes a bit more tlc so there is time spent and oil for seasoning to factor in but it's still way more efficient in the long term.
You can spend 20 bucks, get cast iron, get a lil olive oil and pop it in the oven at 600°F and you're golden.
This is true, however the hassle of keeping a SS pan is too much for me.
It's a good thing I switched to stainless and carbon steel. I did it because my roommates used to destroy our teflon pans, but this is another good consideration. PFOAs are very harmful to our environment and could be the asbestos of our generation.
Good on you!
Thank you for sharing!
Thank you for all your videos, but for this one in particular. I recently ditched all my nonstick stuff and embraced cast iron and carbon steel.
Yup, my go-to trio is carbon steel, stainless steel, and cast iron. Need that stainless steel for acidic stuff, I like my tomato sauce.
What kind of pan should I use?!
I'm a person that don't cook and hate vegetables, but I found a way to cook and enjoy vegetables anyway. I throw frozen vegetables into a non stick pan on max heat (before the pan itself really gets too hot), put a lid on and let the vegetables unfreeze slightly, take the lid off, cut the too big pieces, fry until water is gone and until I get some roasting surface, then lower the temperature and add something with protein.
I eat low carb so having lots of fat in the pan is ok. What type of pan should I use?
Stainless steel sounds nice in that I can even clean the pan in the dishwasher, but I heard they can't handle high heat? Tried carbon steel and failed, but I can make a new try if you think it is the best. Cast iron I used long long ago and found them too heavy. But maybe there are more modern lighter variants? Suggestions for brands is also welcome.
Stainless might work but you might need to alter your technique.
Hi, you may find that Field Cast Iron works well for you. High quality and light(er)
I’ve got 3 parrots and it is very well known that fumes from nonstick cookware will kill your pet birds in a matter of hours.
You'd have to "smoke" the pan higher than 260C for several hours for this to happen. Literally, this is almost equivalent of burning the pan (and the coating).
@@mac1414 that is largely untrue as there are multiple documented cases of these pans killing birds quite quickly.
@@noncthibodeaux1834 Please provide citations.
bro i had two parrots and very old teflon pan that was in very bad shape and nothing happened
@@mac1414 please provide common sense. Citations from what exactly, science has been brought and paid for over the last few years. It has discraced itself, so no.... Sod citations, no big chemical company has ethics or troubles itself with morality. It does EXACTLY what it can get away with. If you want proof, look at their history of pollution of the environment or body.
Hello from the Netherlands here Jed. Have you ever heard of an Italian brand called Mepra? They make all kinds of cookware and claim their copper set is right up there with Mauviel and quality and certainly in price.
There is a a sale going on now for 40% off and I wonder if you have ever heard from them, as I cannot find much on the internet. Thank you for your videos, and Id love to hear your 2 cents on this.
Seems to be something wrong with my username.. weird
Thanx for sharing mate.
Are porcelain enamel coated pans non-toxic? If some are and some aren’t, how can I know? What type of material is under the porcelain enamel?
I love how your amateur t-shirt is out of focus, while the background is in focus. Thanks for the video though.
Hard to be an Amateur and get it right 100% of the time!
Tried to tell a friend about this, he said its too late to stop using Teflon... Ive kind of given up telling anyone about stuff like this. Its frustrating. If people are happy poisoning themselves i cant do a damn thing. Ive opened my eyes to a number of things, i get your sentiment but a lot of people are stubborn and happy in their ignorance... After a lot of effort trying to make people i know aware, Its just easyer to let them get on with it.
I hear ya. I like to help those that want the help, not the other way around.
It took me half a life time to learn, that no one needs non stick pans but the pan dealer and producers.
With some tricks it's super easy to make cast iron and forged steel as non-stick as possible. Best method: Use linseed oil after the first very thorough cleaning of the pan. If your pan fits in an oven completely, its easy. Just rub the pan with the oil until its coated but not wet with it. Put it in the oven at about 250°C for an hour or so (maybe shorter, search internet for detailed descriptions). Get it out. Until cool enough just repeat it several times.
You will see a groving thin coating of burnt in degraded linseed oil on the surface. When the naked iron surface is vanished completely ,you can use it the firat time with some non sticky food. Use plenty of oil in the beginning.
After some usages it becomes more and more non-sticky. After some days i fried some eggs with no problems.
Only advice for usage: careful with acidy food, don't use pure salt on hot surface and never clean it with soap or other chemicals! Just hot water, a sponge or brush. And rub it with oil after drying.
Good on you!
Made the switch to cast iron and stainless steel a few years ago. Never looking back
Good on you!
The current general scientific consensus is that PTFE is biocompatible and inert, meaning it does not react with bodily tissues or fluids. This also makes it suitable for use in medical implants and devices that are in prolonged contact with the body. I have yet to find a study that specifically says PTFE that is free of PFOAs can cause harm when properly used. It's true new evidence could be eventually found that will prove otherwise, so I guess it's up to you how important the convencience of PTFE is compared to the possible risks that we haven't yet found.
cancer is a leading cause of death and is on the rise in young people who have lived with these chemicals their entire lives. they knew it was toxic just like cigarettes but they don't care. they literally do not care. they want to use their petroleum byproducts any way they can instead of not making a profit off it. we do not have enough data from long term studies to know. don't defend this shit. seriously. the military uses this a lot and they know it's dangerous and tell people not to be exposed to it.
Thanks for your video and honesty. Are the ptfe based (pfoa free) ninja never stick pans also fall into this category? Or the fact that it’s pfoa free makes it safe?
Hi, yes, but they are ceramic, which have a very short life, even compared to Teflon.
I have a question. But about hard anodized aluminum pans and cookware, is it only the outside and the inside is still Teflon nonstick or similar? I don't think you have a video on that type of utensils, do you?
Hi, no, I don't. Good question though. The pans are fully anodized but then many brands coat the inside with Teflon. Best to find one that isn't coated.
What about ceramic pans? How to pick good one?
Thank you for the PSA!
Switched to SS and followed your advice on how properly use SS. It works just as good and even better than nonstick as there's no toxins.
Also... would you have time to make a video about SS essential pans/ chef pans? Please 🙏
Great to hear!
Are you talking about All-Clad's pans in the deep wok shape?
@Cook Culture Hi there! Yes, it is very similar to a wok, but isn't a wok. It is confusing for me as the same pan shows when googling essential pan, chef's pan and saucier. I was specifically looking at the All Clad d5 4 qt and 6 qt ssential pan. These pans seem like it can do it all: fry, stir fry, sauté, make soup, etc.
@@m3llie615 Ok, got it, Great pieces!
Even though you talk a lot about carbon steel and cast iron as an awesome alternative to Teflon, wouldn't enameled or stainless steel cookware also be a good, safe option?
Yes, but with less non-stick-e-ness.
I have hard water and it chips the enamel. I use the plain cast iron.
Pretty sure we wouldn't find it in the chemical company executive's kitchen or the fda exec's who approved it, or any of the organizations on the internet, touting that it is NOT poison.
Very good point!!
And plumbers in the UK use PTFE tape for joining water pipe connecters in homes, taps, toilets and anything where water is used.
Yes but it’s not meant to touch the water. It’s not used as a sealant. It’s used as a thread lubricant.
Its why I stopped eating out. No control of what they cook on or with.
Cast iron pans are also using metals that are not good for you. Hard to find one that doesn't do this
if you go threw these reports its not the pans that are dangerous, its the manufacturing of the Teflon that causes the harmful release of these chemicals. The worry isn't your pans. Real question is should we be supporting this industry as these manufacturing plants contaminate the entire environment we live in and is there a way to regulate these companies manufacturing, or perhaps there is no place for this product if they cant ensure the protection of the environment and contamination it causes.
Yes, totally understand your point and so fat that has not been shown. It seems that's the justification of the legislation.
Teflon is safe as long as you do two things...
1- Don't use metal utensils in it so you don't scratch the coating.
2- Don't heat it about 500 degrees f. And if you are cooking that hot, give up now and order pizza delivery because you don't know what you are doing anyway
Hi, your statements are untrue. PFAS chemical are carcinogenic and have been proven to cause bladder cancer, testicular cancer, colon cancer. PTFE (part of the PFAS family) is the chemical that makes Teflon non-stick, and is toxic. The myth that Teflon is 'safe' was created by the chemical makers and sold as truth because the law does not (yet) protect the general public from thousands of PFAS chemicals.
@@Cook-Culture My statements are absolutely factual
"PFAS chemical are carcinogenic"
This is true.
But increased rates of cancer were only found when the produce was NOT WASHED.
If you are stupid enough to eat it while the pesticide is still on it, that's just natural selection at work.
"The myth that Teflon is 'safe' was created by the chemical makers"
And taat is flat out conspiracy theory bullcrap
Teflon degrades over time even if you don't heat it past 500 F
@@bakk. "Teflon degrades over time"
Once scratched, which is why I said "Don't use metal utensils in it so you don't scratch the coating."
If you see a scratch in the coating, it is time to replace it,
Teflon IS SAFE.
But much like with vaccines, or lab grown meat, the fact something is safe in no way stops fearmongering regarding it.
@@Cook-Culture That is false.
Stop fearmongering
Do the ceramic nonstick pans fall into this toxic group? My guess is that they are. I use stainless steel All-Clad, but I don’t always get the temperature right and food sticks.
Add carbon steel to your arsenal for particularly sticky foods!
As far as I’ve heard, true ceramic cookware is not using nonstick chemicals but if it cracks, it is toxic. In addition, a lot of companies that claim they sell ceramic cookware, are putting a nonstick coating or a glaze on it.
Ceramic is just superheated clay and we’ve been using it to cook for thousands of years. But most modern ceramic cookware I’ve seen has the nonstick coating. That’s why I’m only using carbon steel and cast iron.
Bare minimum the ceramic pans are reinforced with aluminum and may be bonded with things like nano titanium. That’s enough to make me not want to use them.
you absolutely nailed it . But it's all about profit and who can brainwash the general public into thinking . . . . . come on over here " our product is so much better " It goes back to who can walk the walk and talk the talk better . I would be first one at the door to buy a carbon steel pan , but I don't belioeve it gonna fly with manufacturers . good luck and thanks for the post
Thanks!
Do you know the Xtrema and Hoffman Germany brands? What do you think about these brands? If you don't know, can you research it for me?
thank you so much for this video.
You are so welcome!
Where does enameled cast iron fall in this spectrum? I’d assume it’s safe and I’m already invested in some for most things people use stainless for.
Hi, that can be questions with some enamel but it's not in the same realm of issues like PFAS
Only thing left in the house with Teflon is my Zojirushi rice cooker. Gonna be hard to say goodbye but it’s gotta go too.
Oh damn, I completely forgot my rice cooker is non stick :-(
Yeah the appliance exposure can’t be underestimated. My rice cooker should be discarded. I did see on amazon a ceramic microwaveable rice cooker that I might investigate.
I’m thinking about scooping up a Tatung rice cooker. It’s basically a simple steamer with a stainless steel inner pot. It doesn’t sing when the rice is done though :-(
@@ryanb107 thanks for the tip. I’ll look into that cooker.
My wife is not ok to dispose our 10 year old Panasonic rice cooker with minor teflon coating damage. However I bought a few years ago a InstantPot and just learned last year to cook Thai rice with it. Its ok but eventually you need then to prepare that the rice will stick a bit and throw the leftovers away.
I mostly concerned with the inability of your camera to focus on you!
I have a pair of ptfe pans just for fun. Is it safe under 500 degrees or just unsafe for overall use?
Unsafe period
They should make a pan that's aluminum in the inside for heat distribution, induction friendly stainless bottom layers, and a nice carbon steel cooking surface. That would be nice.
Wouldn't that be awesome! @stratacookware
Maaaan..... You are incredible! Keep on going! 🙂
Thanks for the support
Thank you for this information ❤
My pleasure 😊
is tefal brand safe?
fightin the good fight! remember that camera focus :)
Thanks! I need to stop relying on the auto settings
Hi, are wall paints having teflon safe for use?
Sorry, I don't have knowledge of paint.
All my pans are teflon, i can't buy new ones, i live in the Caribbean, things are tough and i dont work
I use the PTFE as an industrial lubricant at work, spray it from a can it smells like death. I would never want to have that chemical brought anywhere near the food I eat.
Yuck!
The PTFE is an inert compound! What you are smelling are the other solvents and chemicals that are the carriers for the teflon particles. Stop spreading false information!
Why didn't you cite any studies or research? You insist there is danger here, yet you chose not to share any of the scientific studies that would help us make good decisions.
I use a cast iron skillet to cook my eggs that is perfectly non-stick. It belonged to my great grandmother. Back in the early 1980s my sister put water in it while it was hot and cracked it. My grand father was alive then and he brazed the crack with some silver/nickle wire. I am 54 years old now and I have been using this pan myself since about 1993. My great grandmother bought this pan in about 1950 for about 75 cents. That's about one penny per year.
Thanks again for another great video about this issue. Let creuset are advertising a non stick frying pan free of all bad chemicals. Do you think this is not right?
Thanks mate 👍
Howdy, I can only see the Canadian site but I see that they are advertising 'Toughened Pro Nonstick'. They say that it's PFOA free but it's made with PTFE. So exactly what I'm talking about in this video. Smoke and mirrors.
@@Cook-Culture I thought so. Thanks for taking a look at it for me. We'll stick to the wrought iron 👌
@@ryanodea5417 Anytime!
None of the articles mention PTFE, they mention PFAS
PTFE belong to the PFAS group of chemicals
Just bought a Debuyer Carbon Steel fry pan for my eggs. The trick is to cook on Very Low heat! The pan heats up fast! The Last pan I will need to buy! $115.
Great tip!
Why can they legally still sell them?
Because the effects of using the pan is not definitive. What you will see soonish is the restrictions on using PFOA which will make selling PTFE harder.
@@Cook-CultureEventually it will be like lead paint and gasoline.
It's really hard to avoid non-stick So many appliances are nonstick from air fryers to sandwich makers Most bakeware is too.
Yes, but the worst is cookware. Most of the other tools don't endure such high heat, which destroys the surface and kills the pans.
I guess kind of like how the Romans drank water from lead pipes. We think it's silly but in a thousand year people will be saying we ate food cooked on ptfe
Good point!
I was going to buy a air cooker from Costco and after getting responses from people it's made out if Teflon. How can they get buy with this? It's made in China!!!!
What's going to happen is, it's no longer toxic. Then yrs later, they'll come out & say it is toxic. This stuff happens all the time.
There has never been a point that PFAS was not harmful to humans. It depends on who you choose to listen to.
They have tons of it you don’t think they will just stop did you ?
Please help me find an airfryer without Teflon????
Breville.
@@Cook-Culture I found one but it's way to expensive!!! If you know a reliable source locally in MN I can buy this brand cheaper let me know 🙏
My position is that if cooks all over the world cooked for so long using cast iron and carbon steel (and later stainless steel), and they all managed to cook well, why do we need to think that we need non-stick? Besides, most non-stick is crappy thin pressed steel that warps and easily scratches, which means that you end up tossing it in the landfill. Completely environmentally irresponsible.
Well said!
So why isn't it banned for cookware? Cast iron is cheaper anyway!
Because the toxic levels are within the allowable amount.
@@Cook-Culture Allowable according to the companies that sell it...
@@RealMTBAddict actually, kind of. The rules that govern the allowable amount of PFAS chemicals were developed using industry data.
And this is why 99g of my cooking is done in High Carbon, Enameled Cast Iron and Stainless.
Good stuff!
what is your gym or workout regimen?
You gotta fix the focus on your camera. Once is a mistake, twice it's a bad habbit.
You just want to see his sparkling eyes.
Yeah! I know. I get it right and then I don't. I rely too much on the auto settings, which is my mistake.
Cast iron is my favourite
Will the United States ever have consequences for ever allowing this they knew it a long time ago
They still allow cigarettes....
@@Cook-Culture and they stop seat belts does that make sense
This is an dilema. Some iron pans are good and some are not. Back in the days iron pans used to be better, my mums pan was as slick as teflon. I had some not that all thar good and very very heavy. My latest one no matter us burning it in moisting it with oil it sucks oil and goes dry in no time. Bad Iron and Iron is not as guaranteed free of poison. The are lots of types of iron, how pure is it`?
Well, as to day when we are making the most in Asia we do not know what it is of. They got lot of scrap yards where they are cooking left overs everything that is undesirable all togheter in a pot making bars and these bars goes to makers that will make everyrhing of that blend selling them items back to us.
Steel pans they need a lot of oil and that is of no good either.
So actually that me and my wife we will use non-stick pans.
Buy USA made and save the headache.
I would if not that US made is so dam expensive ove here after all those fees and taxes are placed up on top. Friendship? Hahaha.. European politicians have been working against US for ever favouring China.
I can think of a lot of made in US to buy but as been charged up to 50% more than an average american that it will remain as an dream.
People have used these for years! Don’t know anybody that got sick from it. I think Canadians have bigger worries than their cookware right now. 🙄
Nobody knows anyone who's become directly sick from them., that's the point of becoming more educated on what the larger issue is. I would argue that health care is one of the top issues to all Canadians. Should we not be more educated to what poisons our environment, leading to Cancer, like the prolific use of PFAS chemicals ?
Nothing but cast Iron for me!
Nice!
They will only get left
This is why I use cast iron only lol.
Yes!
@@Cook-Culture I don’t understand why people use Teflon pans. Carbon steel is just as good as cast iron and it’s lighter. Stainless steel is ok too.
All class of this substances should be banned
You would think you were American by the BS you spew. I read the references to the paper on the EPA site. Quote "None of the six polymers studied showed any detectable weight loss" this was measured between the temperatures of 150 to 525°C.
PTFE is safe as long as high heat is not used, and is replaced every 18 to 24 months if used daily.
The manufacture of PTFE is a completely different story. That is why PTFE is only manufactured in third world countries.
Might want to stop the fear mongering, you would think you are a Trump supporter.
"and is replaced every 18 to 24 months if used daily"" - you are suggesting that it's appropriate to replace your cookware every 24 months? The more PTFE made, the larger the problem. Unfortunately, the manufacturing of products with PTFE is not all made just in 3rd world countries. No matter what the argument, for or against, no body needs non-stick cookware.
@@Cook-Culture 30 years ado I switched from PTFE to stainless, because the PTFE failed so regularly. This was long before the dangers of PTFE were publicized. I switched because I was too cheap to keep replacing cookware.
@@laneromel5667 That's a good enough reason!
The issue is maintenance. It takes a short amount of time to wash & hand dry a nonstick pan. Cooking potato skins for 30 minutes to season a carbon steel pan or baking a cast iron pan for hours is way too much.
It's a little bit of up front effort. But, once properly seasoned, just cooking with it regularly is enough to keep it seasoned. A quick post season after use and you're good to go next time. It really doesn't take that long. Driving to Walmart every 2-4 years to buy a new pan is way more annoying
A little extra upfront time spent prepping a cast iron or carbon steel pan is worth it to avoid unnecessary exposure to forever toxic compounds. Once seasoned, cast iron or carbon steel cookware is nonstick forever. Worth it in my books...
for hours?! It should take 15-30 min at most.
Also a nonstick pan will always degrade no matter how well you treat it
I think there is way too much focus on getting the right seasoning and that hurts new adopters. A lot of cast iron at least is pre-seasoned and so you don’t have to do any of that. Just start cooking and drying it properly and a light coat of oil in the pan every now and then. People go crazy with the seasoning and it makes it seem super difficult to maintain the pans.
@@shigemorif1066 yes! I bought a 12" Lodge and oven seasoned it 5 times like a giant nerd before using. More recently, I bout the big 15" Lodge and just started using it right out of the box and it's been fine.