The CGI people who do The Expanse are excellent and must love doing such elegant, gritty and realistic battles. Whoever storyboards them deserves every penny of their pay.
Take a look at Theo Bouvier's work when you get a chance. He has two shorts scenes called "Nemesis Rising" and "Liberty or Death". The attention to detail and realism goes as far beyond The Expanse as The Expanse did to prior sci-fi combat.
shows/movies that have a literary origin tend to be disappointing compared to the novel adaptation. But this show is beautifully executed and do the books a justice.
They spend the whole inteligence buiilding the ship, and none left to name it. Why the fuck they named it "Corvette Class" and calls it a Light Frigate?
@@rodrigopaim82 according to Spacedock's lore video on this ship class, it was just Mars paying homage or something to the historical role corvettes played in naval warfare.
Huh... Just noticed a small detail there. Each point defense gun directs some of its gases directly out the back to counteract the inertia from the round being fired... Amazing attention to detail
Also, during the strafing run Roci has in the finale when she's firing on the Free Navy ships with her railgun, you can spot it fire it's main engine every time it fires the railgun to negate the force that would generate. You can also see the still jammed PDC not working on Roci. It's super awesome.
When the Zmeya launches its torpedos at 0:13 the thrust on each torpedo is reversed, implying these torpedos are slowing down and "falling" into the Roci's flight path. The attention to detail in this show is stunning.
I still do not understand this. When the Zmeya ejects missiles, they should continue to travel with the ship by default. As soon as missiles turn on their propulsionin that direction, they should gain speed and fly away from both Zmeya and Rocinante.
@@yansakovich Zmeya's main drive is firing, so the ship is accelerating. The missiles need to use their own drives to keep up or they'll be left behind. It's not clear why the Zmeya would want the missiles to waste deltaV in order to reduce the rate that they approach the roci however- possibly they were using the drive plumes as a 'smokescreen' to distract from the missile with the PM on board, or they wanted some missiles nearby to intercept the Roci's missiles as they got close?
@@nerd1000ify Yes, my bad, thanks for pointing out. But I still do not understand the reason why did missiles accelerate away from Roci. Missile drive plumes might act as "smokescreen" in ultra high frequency radio band (idk, but maybe excited plasma is UHF radiation impenetrable), but this still won't help to evade enemy missile with infrared or visible spectrum guidance. And the best missile guidance method in space is definitely infrared, so majority of various missiles, if not all, should be with infrared guidance.
@@yansakovich if the missiles' relative speed towards the target is too high, the missiles' guidance system might not be able to adjust fast enough to hit the target.
@@yansakovichThe closing speed is frankly ludicrous, both ships as of launch were accelerating. So to avoid overshoot and give the torp’s detonation system a chance, they don’t flip, and by the time the Roci cuts its drive, the toros have committed to the flight path
The Expanse is a perfect example of why less is more. Even its largest space battle only featured 3 battleships against a medium sized fleet, it was big enough to be epic but still small enough that you could care about everything that happened. They dont overdo it either, space battles are few and far between, so its more intense when it does happen, and you always feel like the crew is in danger, a bullet could punch through the hull and take out a main character at any point and it would make total sense. Its truly a masterpiece, and I only with Disney would take a few lessons from it and apply them to Star Wars.
Yeah the expanse dedicated more time to cleaning up messes golden made by either failing to communicate or by letting the bad guy go in a dubious display of mercy that ends up killing many orders of magnitude more than the amount of people than it should have taken
The idea that tiny bullets would do anything to spaceships is a joke once you remove gravity you can make armour thick 200mm of steel will stop anything short of AP round from a tank cannon
@PlagueRunner Yes, PDC rounds won’t do much to the ship, but they sure can damage internal components, which very much can damage ships, for example by going though their reactors. Also slapping 20 cm think steel slabs would be so horrendously inefficient and would make a ship accelerate slower then a dead snail. Don’t try to reference science if you don’t understand it
One thing that I love that’s not mentioned enough, it’s just one more thing that grounds this show in reality compared to other sci-fi. The HUD screens are visible! And readable. You can see that theres a lot of missiles incoming on the screen here, and at multiple other points we get show a screen that, without dialogue, would pretty clearly indicate the enemy ship and having a lock on it. Like the Pella locking Drummers fleet, and her clicking through the interface to fire missiles. Compared to Star Trek TNG or voyager, where the ships have touch screen controls, they simply are never shown for production reasons.
They had the benefit of real touch screen interfaces for the production of this. It was all done in post or with very rudimentary faked interfaces in TNG and Voyager. You see them actually interacting with LCARS in the newer shows because they have real practical touch screens.
visually the Roci shot down 29 missiles all together, but visually the Zmeya didn't fire that much, and visually their fore PDC was jammed on the screen before it got actually jamed, so visually this was not good, but plot armor was strong in every way, visually including..
@@quantum_chezburger2279 yeah, the Roci went into the spin, shooting like insane, 99% bullets missing miserably, so much struggle with shooting down those 22 slow, low tech belter missiles, that the Zmeya fired, and then: more incoming! From where? I'll tell you from where: those extra 7 were fired from ship called the Production Error. EPIC BATTLE!!
It's sad knowing that the next season is the last season... The Expanse is simply the best Space Sci-Fi around... From the political intrigue through to the space battles, it's amazing.
Not really the last, there are more books, I guess they simply will rest a year or 2, and then theyll start a sequel serie about the next books, wich take place decades later.
This is definitely cooler than IFF(bullet tornado and railgun, plus the shots of monica) but IFF was far more epic. This was just the Roci being the Roci and shitting on some belter ship. IFF was the Roci pulling some beautiful "crazy ivan" level tactical maneuvers to save the day against a rogue UN ship. Swooping in to save the Razorback and finally meeting Avasarala and Sgt Draper was a multi season payoff.
One thing that always bugged me about the expanse (a very nitpicky detail I really love the expanse more than any other show by a lot) but there seemed to be no recoil from the pdcs despite firing many many ship piercing projectiles a second. At 1:23 it shows either anti recoil projectiles being thrown in the opposite direction, or hot exhaust being ejected to help with recoil. This seems small, but for a super nerd like me it really made my day and adds that much more believability to the expanse (:
Nice catch! Those are indeed small thrusters negating the recoil, they can be seen from the very start of the show in season 1, for example on the PDCs of the Donnager class.
@@cerealdreamer7577 the main issue is that it’s throwing all of the pdc rounds out one way, so even when leaving the barrel open there’s probably be a lot of recoil. While it’s possible to account for this I think it would be much simpler and easier to fire rounds out of both directions, giving a net force of 0 on the vehicle. This of coarse has problems of it’s own, such as limited aim, and requiring twice the rounds, but it would also save on rcs reaction mass, and increase accuracy. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see when the expanse becomes a reality lol
@@leezaard3944 The interesting part about the future is that in real life, Laser Point Defense are becoming a reality. Yes, kinetic Point Defense is more palatable for those who have issues with Energy Weapons, but it does not change current or future technological developments. Of interesting note, in space, timed explosive semi-shotgun blasts as shown during the Earth Railgun scene would be more effective in space and the technology to place them in the 20-30mm configuration that the Rocinante's PDC's are in, would be trivially simple by that point.
In the shots where you can see Holden's display, you can see an overview of the PDCs. One of them is read and is says WARNING: JAMMED. I love the attention to detail on this show.
it also says 'WARNING JAMMED' on PDC-1 on an episode much later in this series, as the snarled PDC is not repaired until S6. As you say - attention to detail.......
Everyone talking about the torpedoes remaining static and accelerating slower... it’s to obscure the protomolecule and absorb the inevitable torpedo launch from the Roci. They had to spiral out like that to protect the final torpedo. Otherwise, the Roci could just fire at one or two and take out the whole payload. Holden saying “They were expecting that,” confirms this for me.
I think the PDC is overall one of the most pleasing pieces of visual and audio design in science fiction. The noise you hear isn't a bang, but more like a rattle of the guns chambering a new round, and one of the coolest looking things I've ever seen is the ropes of ammo that they send out
Bull looks through the data and said the fleet consists of “heavy frigates and destroyers”. The Roci is a light frigate, so even one of his ships are likely even better than the Roci, however the Roci is heavily modified so it may have some edge over the free navy ships. In particular, it’s new railgun might come in handy in those CQB situations too far for PDC’s but too close for torpedos. We know some Martian destroyers also have railguns, but at minimum the other heavy frigates likely do not.
@@d0d0birdiexd78 I'd say with the railgun, the Rocinante can punch a bit above its weight at range. But against real Martian warships, a single railgun round will rip it in half and they could dump enough torpedoes at it to overwhelm its PDCs.
The Rocinanté is a heavily modified well oiled war ship, James Holden is a tactical genius, and Alex is a wizard flyboy, Marco was doomed to fail taking on the Roci and her crew... And that rail gun...
if it's the russian word then its a wasted opportunity . in Bulgarian folklore the word stands for a mythical creature between a dragon and a hydra . Described as a scale-covered serpent-like creature with four legs and bat's wings, at other times as half-man, half-snake, with wings and a tail.Often the creature is represented with lust for human women or men .
This is the warship Rocinante. You're aware of our capabilities more than anyone. We're escorting a vessel of refugees away from your AO. Any ship that opens fire on us will feel the sum total of our state-of-the-art Martian arsenal rammed up its ass. We'll all die together. This is our only and final warning, stay clear.
@@BlueonGoldZ Nah, theswingman has a point when people get serious our voice changes accordingly to represent the fact we mean business. After all you wouldn't take someone seriously if they sounded sarcastic would you.
@@Predator42ID it's also at this point that they're still in a burn, so, his voice is likely coming across that way thanks to the G-forces he's experiencing. If you want to experience it yourself, try having a serious conversation on a roller coaster, you'll hear (and feel) your tone change just like his does For those wondering why I'd make such a suggestion, instead of using an aircraft, it's simple: Roller Coasters are fun, and far cheaper to get access to.
This is an amazing show. It's futuristic but still so relatable because they have not achieved ftl travel so every decisions, every message, every trip has a time consequences to them.
The Roci is perfectly designed to counter incoming missiles. Small, maneuverable and packing 6x of the best PDCs in existence with full 360 degree coverage and overlapping fire arcs. I can imagine a few of these in formation with a larger fleet, providing the bulk of the defenses while the bigger ships lob swarms of torpedos and Rail gun volleys back at the enemy
@@henrikkristiansen3869 IIRC, the canon story is that it was on the return trip from _Phoebe Station_ when it got the distress signal from the surviving Canterbury crew. But was also on a safeguard mission for Martian terraforming materials around Jupiter.
@@PrograError I know, I’ve read the books and watched the series. The reasons for having a corvette class light frigate like the Tachi onboard is a simple one: Expanded mission profile and added defensive capabilities for the Donnager.
The physics of this show's space combat and the importance of the Point Defense Cannons cannot be understated. Such an awesome and realisiic take on the CIWS naval concept in space.
The Roci firing its torps and they use RCS to clear the ship then light up their drives and accelerate past the ship that already cleared them is SO cool.
It's kinda terrifying how amazingly effective the Roci is when it is in good hands!! It has beaten stealth ships, martian frigates, destroyers and what not...
Remember it survived some battles purely by high luck. It was a pin cushion where a few shots missed the drive core by inches when they took out the stealth ships
@@soul1d Yeah good point. It's awesome how they mention that luck in the series as well how lucky they were and how Alex was simulating that same battle over and over again.
LOL Rocinante go BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
This is a very impressive scene, and probably the most PDC fire I have ever seen in this show. Still... all this is a bluff by the Zmeya. Don't believe me? at 0:15 starts launching a *lot* of missiles, all of which have yellow drive cones and hold their relative postions around the ship... except the last one at 0:21. That one has a *blue* drive cone and flies straight forward and is almost instantly out of sight. Now all of the Zmeya's missiles start moving towards the Rocinante... but *slowly* (relatively I mean), their drive cones still pointed towards the Roci. If they had turned around first and accelerated (or hell, just stopping would be almost as fast), the Roci would have a lot less time to shoot down or evade them. And we're seen from when Ashford hunted down those pirates in the Tynaan that missiles in the Expanse can go past their targets, turn around and then attack again from behind almost instantly. This is a good example of just how tricky Inaros is. I mean, if you've got 20 missiles bearing down on you, how much attention are you going to spare on the one that's heading away from you? In fact, I'm not even sure how explosive those missiles were. Considering none of them went more than *paf!!* when they got shot down, and they were mainly meant as a distraction, they might just be an empty shell with propulsion and guidance (which might be bad enough at certain speeds).
I was wondering that myself. The close call that took out one of the Roci's forward PDCs detonated really close and should have done more way more damage
yea, I noticed that too. Pretty big mistake from writers, unless it is intentional, maybe to somehow help hide the last torpedo with epstein drive that might had protomolecul on it.
Who wants to see a 6 episode mini series ( 2 hours each) about Laconia and the Earth Mars,Transport union squaring off against a Magnetar Class ship? I'd love to see the self healing armour in action along with the Field Projector. We, the fans, need this show to live on.
Goddamn, beautiful Roci. Notice all the belter missiles are nosecone toward the Roci, if they are accelerating towards her it should be the other way though. Maybe the intention was to to use the drive plumes to hide the one that got away all along.
It's true that the missiles are accelerating away from the Roci, but the Roci has so much velocity left over from their initial high-g burn that the missiles are still closing in relative to the ship. Your theory about obscuring the protomolecule missile does sound plausible, though!
There may also be a 'window of engagement' where if the missiles are traveling too fast (relative to the target) they might not be able to maneuver enough to hit...by sitting on their own drive they put the dominate thrust in opposition of their vector.
It's nice watching a show that has people actually thinking about what stuff would be doing during the CGI shots. I dunno how many times I've watched a show and a ship that's supposed to be entering orbit is burning in the same direction it's moving. It's called a retro burn for a reason lol. Not so with The Expanse. This show the CGI guys are just flexing with all the little details. Jammed gun not firing in the next shot, the inertia you can feel in the camera work, engines always facing the proper way... It's all beautiful.
One small detail I don't see talked about much is the exhaust firing out the backs of the PDCs. It's to eliminate recoil because in space firing that many rounds in such rapid succession the force of all the recoiling can really mess with the ships trajectory. Which isn't something you want mess with when trying to target and eliminate multiple incoming torpedoes. It's similar to how they pulse the drive cone when firing their forward mounted rail gun. Just on a smaller scale.
I always wonder about the bullets fired in these space battles of the expanse. They will just keep flying forever, right? I would think that after a major fleet engagement, they must declare a vast volume of space around it a no fly zone for a few days, until the cloud of bullets has dissipated sufficiently to make the odds of being hit acceptable.
It's been so many years -- and I JUST noticed that the monitor view of the guns reads (for us 80's kids): "ATTACK PROFILE - DEATH BLOSSOM" (nod to Last Starfighter)
Something about the railgun shots that I've noticed. The Earth railguns fire a glowing orange shot like superheated metal. But the Martian railguns fire what looks like a purple gas. Which makes me believe that the Martian railguns shoot plasma rather than solid slugs.
Neat little detail: the belter torpedoes normally have yellow engine flares, and when the Zmeya fires its torpedoes, you can see that one has a blue engine, and we do not see a blue torpedo get shot down. It was probably a Martian one, and the one which had the protomolecule.
The drive plume is probably blue because the missile is using an Epstein Drive (because it needs to be long-ranged), whereas the other Belter torpedoes use short-range chemical rockets that are cheaper to manufacture.
The Expanse was also compelling because of the toll of space flight on the crew. Mars was a perfect example, high G accel and Decel was dangerous to the crew and could kill them as easily as a rail gun or missile could.
Simple, they have crappy guidance systems and they’re so close that if they turn around to burn towards the Roci it’ll pass them before they have a chance to turn around
@@slajmichekelund8511 Hard to say as there is no distinct values on either the speed of the torpedoes, the speed of the Roci or the distance between the two, it is wholly possible that if the Roci was travelling fast enough and was close enough that by the time the torpedoes had spun and refired their engines the Roci would have passed through a clean intercept point meaning that the torpedoes would then have to spin again, reignite their engines and then catch up to the Roci.
@@L8ugh1ngm8n1 We've seen torpedo take less than half a seconds to spin around its long axis. They have way more than enough time to flip around and burn hard for the Roci, so I have no idea as well why those torpedo made it easy for the PDC to intercept them by slowing down relative to the Roci.
@@slajmichekelund8511I believe that if they turned and burned straight towards the Roci, the difference in their vector would become so great so quickly that the missile guidance wouldn’t have time to intercept the Roci
![Hunxho - Ball Forever [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nki9ZTF9Uls/mqdefault.jpg)
The CGI people who do The Expanse are excellent and must love doing such elegant, gritty and realistic battles. Whoever storyboards them deserves every penny of their pay.
Take a look at Theo Bouvier's work when you get a chance. He has two shorts scenes called "Nemesis Rising" and "Liberty or Death". The attention to detail and realism goes as far beyond The Expanse as The Expanse did to prior sci-fi combat.
shows/movies that have a literary origin tend to be disappointing compared to the novel adaptation. But this show is beautifully executed and do the books a justice.
But it's graphics is ugly, on same level with movies from the beginning of late 90th or even earlier.
@@arturscherbakov2543 Maybe watch it in true HD instead of a pirate 144p stream? XD
realistic?:O
Noone can deny. Mars made one hell of a ship when they built the Corvette class light frigates.
"We both know Mars builds to well" -Naomi trying to force open a martian door on the Donnager
@@nickvangeel 😂
They spend the whole inteligence buiilding the ship, and none left to name it.
Why the fuck they named it "Corvette Class" and calls it a Light Frigate?
@@rodrigopaim82 Tachi class would of been better name. Corvette class frigate is confusing as hell. They would never do that in the military.
@@rodrigopaim82 according to Spacedock's lore video on this ship class, it was just Mars paying homage or something to the historical role corvettes played in naval warfare.
I love space battles in Expanse! They are truly unique due to adherence to physics and gravity. No energy shields.
You know, shields can be breached, right?
Their using real weapons too. Apart from the railgun(if DARPA is to be believed, that's just for the moment).
@@ethanlauder4887 the railgun is real US navy have build one
@@AgentK-im8ke Good point. Correct me if I'm wrong but they're not standard issue because they're expensive, right?
@@ethanlauder4887 Lasers are also "real weapons", just saying.
0:20 last fired missile from Zmeya had blue propulsion and gone dark right after...very nice "hidden" detail
It’s probably got the blue goo on it
@@themightyjagrafess8596 most definitely, and if you notice, the next thing Marco is looking at is the torpedo’s trajectory towards the ring gate
ahh definitely hidden if you watched at midnight after a long day! completely missed that.
Holy crap, you're not wrong. Good catch!
You can also see it go forward on the radar
Huh... Just noticed a small detail there. Each point defense gun directs some of its gases directly out the back to counteract the inertia from the round being fired... Amazing attention to detail
I know i only just noticed...just...holy crap...just that detail blows me away
Also, during the strafing run Roci has in the finale when she's firing on the Free Navy ships with her railgun, you can spot it fire it's main engine every time it fires the railgun to negate the force that would generate. You can also see the still jammed PDC not working on Roci. It's super awesome.
When the Zmeya launches its torpedos at 0:13 the thrust on each torpedo is reversed, implying these torpedos are slowing down and "falling" into the Roci's flight path. The attention to detail in this show is stunning.
I still do not understand this. When the Zmeya ejects missiles, they should continue to travel with the ship by default. As soon as missiles turn on their propulsionin that direction, they should gain speed and fly away from both Zmeya and Rocinante.
@@yansakovich Zmeya's main drive is firing, so the ship is accelerating. The missiles need to use their own drives to keep up or they'll be left behind. It's not clear why the Zmeya would want the missiles to waste deltaV in order to reduce the rate that they approach the roci however- possibly they were using the drive plumes as a 'smokescreen' to distract from the missile with the PM on board, or they wanted some missiles nearby to intercept the Roci's missiles as they got close?
@@nerd1000ify Yes, my bad, thanks for pointing out.
But I still do not understand the reason why did missiles accelerate away from Roci. Missile drive plumes might act as "smokescreen" in ultra high frequency radio band (idk, but maybe excited plasma is UHF radiation impenetrable), but this still won't help to evade enemy missile with infrared or visible spectrum guidance. And the best missile guidance method in space is definitely infrared, so majority of various missiles, if not all, should be with infrared guidance.
@@yansakovich if the missiles' relative speed towards the target is too high, the missiles' guidance system might not be able to adjust fast enough to hit the target.
@@yansakovichThe closing speed is frankly ludicrous, both ships as of launch were accelerating. So to avoid overshoot and give the torp’s detonation system a chance, they don’t flip, and by the time the Roci cuts its drive, the toros have committed to the flight path
The Expanse is a perfect example of why less is more. Even its largest space battle only featured 3 battleships against a medium sized fleet, it was big enough to be epic but still small enough that you could care about everything that happened. They dont overdo it either, space battles are few and far between, so its more intense when it does happen, and you always feel like the crew is in danger, a bullet could punch through the hull and take out a main character at any point and it would make total sense. Its truly a masterpiece, and I only with Disney would take a few lessons from it and apply them to Star Wars.
Yes, the tendency of some shows to put so many ships in that they become meaningless is part of the old quantity vs quality thing.
Yeah the expanse dedicated more time to cleaning up messes golden made by either failing to communicate or by letting the bad guy go in a dubious display of mercy that ends up killing many orders of magnitude more than the amount of people than it should have taken
Lol star wars is shit when it comes to space.
I cant take that shit seriously.. and the designs are NOT suited for space.
The idea that tiny bullets would do anything to spaceships is a joke once you remove gravity you can make armour thick 200mm of steel will stop anything short of AP round from a tank cannon
@PlagueRunner Yes, PDC rounds won’t do much to the ship, but they sure can damage internal components, which very much can damage ships, for example by going though their reactors. Also slapping 20 cm think steel slabs would be so horrendously inefficient and would make a ship accelerate slower then a dead snail. Don’t try to reference science if you don’t understand it
One thing that I love that’s not mentioned enough, it’s just one more thing that grounds this show in reality compared to other sci-fi. The HUD screens are visible! And readable. You can see that theres a lot of missiles incoming on the screen here, and at multiple other points we get show a screen that, without dialogue, would pretty clearly indicate the enemy ship and having a lock on it. Like the Pella locking Drummers fleet, and her clicking through the interface to fire missiles. Compared to Star Trek TNG or voyager, where the ships have touch screen controls, they simply are never shown for production reasons.
They had the benefit of real touch screen interfaces for the production of this. It was all done in post or with very rudimentary faked interfaces in TNG and Voyager. You see them actually interacting with LCARS in the newer shows because they have real practical touch screens.
one of the most visually impressive scenes so far.
visually the Roci shot down 29 missiles all together, but visually the Zmeya didn't fire that much, and visually their fore PDC was jammed on the screen before it got actually jamed, so visually this was not good, but plot armor was strong in every way, visually including..
@@elvisibra bruh it's still visually impressive
@@quantum_chezburger2279 yeah, the Roci went into the spin, shooting like insane, 99% bullets missing miserably, so much struggle with shooting down those 22 slow, low tech belter missiles, that the Zmeya fired, and then: more incoming! From where? I'll tell you from where: those extra 7 were fired from ship called the Production Error. EPIC BATTLE!!
@@elvisibra bullets often miss especially when your opponent can dodge.
@@elvisibra also, they could have been fired at another time. Like seconds after they cut.
It's sad knowing that the next season is the last season... The Expanse is simply the best Space Sci-Fi around... From the political intrigue through to the space battles, it's amazing.
We gotta enjoy it for what we got. I agree though. Hopefully the ideas to add more later down the road come to fruition.
Better for a show to leave us wanting more than for it to go on longer than it should.
@@duaneclarence8758 what? It's based on book series
Not really the last, there are more books, I guess they simply will rest a year or 2, and then theyll start a sequel serie about the next books, wich take place decades later.
For their respective eras, only Babylon 5 and the Original Star trek even came close.
Sci-fi doesn’t get any better than this
It's good but don't get carried away.
This series just itrodused you realm of hard sci-fy. It is just tiny bit of it.
@@johncee853 Oh pls, The Expanse is one of the greatest Sci_Fis series ever, top 3 easily.
@@Irfan87 and I can say...oh please, it's not. It's good, no doubt about it. This is opinions...
@@johncee853 Name me better ones on TV then.
I've watched this more than CQB, Thoth and IFF. I just can't stop.
"I'm putting us into a spin"
So smooth, like a ballet dance.
This is definitely cooler than IFF(bullet tornado and railgun, plus the shots of monica) but IFF was far more epic. This was just the Roci being the Roci and shitting on some belter ship. IFF was the Roci pulling some beautiful "crazy ivan" level tactical maneuvers to save the day against a rogue UN ship. Swooping in to save the Razorback and finally meeting Avasarala and Sgt Draper was a multi season payoff.
what do the abbreviations stand for?
IFF was incredible, my jaw dropped, and I felt just that little more love for the show, much like the donnager battle episode in season 1.
One thing that always bugged me about the expanse (a very nitpicky detail I really love the expanse more than any other show by a lot) but there seemed to be no recoil from the pdcs despite firing many many ship piercing projectiles a second. At 1:23 it shows either anti recoil projectiles being thrown in the opposite direction, or hot exhaust being ejected to help with recoil. This seems small, but for a super nerd like me it really made my day and adds that much more believability to the expanse (:
Nice catch! Those are indeed small thrusters negating the recoil, they can be seen from the very start of the show in season 1, for example on the PDCs of the Donnager class.
@@ill3260 yea guess I didnt notice it until now lol
There's always the possibility that the PDC rounds are fired in an open barrel, that way you minimize the recoil (and reduce RCS use while firing)
@@cerealdreamer7577 the main issue is that it’s throwing all of the pdc rounds out one way, so even when leaving the barrel open there’s probably be a lot of recoil. While it’s possible to account for this I think it would be much simpler and easier to fire rounds out of both directions, giving a net force of 0 on the vehicle. This of coarse has problems of it’s own, such as limited aim, and requiring twice the rounds, but it would also save on rcs reaction mass, and increase accuracy. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see when the expanse becomes a reality lol
@@leezaard3944 The interesting part about the future is that in real life, Laser Point Defense are becoming a reality.
Yes, kinetic Point Defense is more palatable for those who have issues with Energy Weapons, but it does not change current or future technological developments.
Of interesting note, in space, timed explosive semi-shotgun blasts as shown during the Earth Railgun scene would be more effective in space and the technology to place them in the 20-30mm configuration that the Rocinante's PDC's are in, would be trivially simple by that point.
In the shots where you can see Holden's display, you can see an overview of the PDCs. One of them is read and is says WARNING: JAMMED. I love the attention to detail on this show.
it also says 'WARNING JAMMED' on PDC-1 on an episode much later in this series, as the snarled PDC is not repaired until S6. As you say - attention to detail.......
Everyone talking about the torpedoes remaining static and accelerating slower... it’s to obscure the protomolecule and absorb the inevitable torpedo launch from the Roci. They had to spiral out like that to protect the final torpedo. Otherwise, the Roci could just fire at one or two and take out the whole payload.
Holden saying “They were expecting that,” confirms this for me.
0:52 I stopped counting how many times I watched that shot. So awesome.
Same. It’s great
me too!
great animators
Man I love the sound of PDC shredding, this was one sweet battle.
I think the PDC is overall one of the most pleasing pieces of visual and audio design in science fiction. The noise you hear isn't a bang, but more like a rattle of the guns chambering a new round, and one of the coolest looking things I've ever seen is the ropes of ammo that they send out
Now I'm actually terrified knowing Inaro's fleet has ships just as good as the Roci
Bull looks through the data and said the fleet consists of “heavy frigates and destroyers”. The Roci is a light frigate, so even one of his ships are likely even better than the Roci, however the Roci is heavily modified so it may have some edge over the free navy ships. In particular, it’s new railgun might come in handy in those CQB situations too far for PDC’s but too close for torpedos. We know some Martian destroyers also have railguns, but at minimum the other heavy frigates likely do not.
@@d0d0birdiexd78 I'd say with the railgun, the Rocinante can punch a bit above its weight at range. But against real Martian warships, a single railgun round will rip it in half and they could dump enough torpedoes at it to overwhelm its PDCs.
But belter crews cannot handle high-G combat maneuvers like inners do.
@@nicolaslecellier6980 Yeah but the Roci has a part belter crew...
The Rocinanté is a heavily modified well oiled war ship, James Holden is a tactical genius, and Alex is a wizard flyboy, Marco was doomed to fail taking on the Roci and her crew...
And that rail gun...
Roci: Surrender or we'll open fire.
Zmeya: Jokes on you inyalowda, imma blow myself up.
Should have waited until they were boarding to set it off, take them with them, but the plot didn't allow it.
Zmeya means Snake in Russian
he's pronouncing it wrong tho. he says za-ME-ya, whereas it's zme-YA
Dead language
@@mikhaillankin6832 Hardly surprising as pronouncing "Anubis" was a running joke in the series...
@@godslayer1415 what do you mean?lol
if it's the russian word then its a wasted opportunity . in Bulgarian folklore the word stands for a mythical creature between a dragon and a hydra . Described as a scale-covered serpent-like creature with four legs and bat's wings, at other times as half-man, half-snake, with wings and a tail.Often the creature is represented with lust for human women or men .
Anyone ever notice how Holden’s voice gets “i am Batman deep” when he he super serious? Now you cant not see it...
This is the warship Rocinante. You're aware of our capabilities more than anyone.
We're escorting a vessel of refugees away from your AO. Any ship that opens fire on us will feel the sum total of our state-of-the-art Martian arsenal rammed up its ass. We'll all die together.
This is our only and final warning, stay clear.
I've noticed it too. He seems to over-act in times like this.
@@BlueonGoldZ I get that way whenever playing with friends in Warships and whatnot lol. It's normal human behavior honestly.
@@BlueonGoldZ Nah, theswingman has a point when people get serious our voice changes accordingly to represent the fact we mean business.
After all you wouldn't take someone seriously if they sounded sarcastic would you.
@@Predator42ID it's also at this point that they're still in a burn, so, his voice is likely coming across that way thanks to the G-forces he's experiencing. If you want to experience it yourself, try having a serious conversation on a roller coaster, you'll hear (and feel) your tone change just like his does
For those wondering why I'd make such a suggestion, instead of using an aircraft, it's simple: Roller Coasters are fun, and far cheaper to get access to.
My favorite part is that if you look at Holden's console at 1:07. It says, "Death Blossom" a homage to The Last Starfighter.
Great spot
This is an amazing show. It's futuristic but still so relatable because they have not achieved ftl travel so every decisions, every message, every trip has a time consequences to them.
The Expanse has the best space battles of any scifi show or movie, period.
wished there's more
The Roci is perfectly designed to counter incoming missiles. Small, maneuverable and packing 6x of the best PDCs in existence with full 360 degree coverage and overlapping fire arcs. I can imagine a few of these in formation with a larger fleet, providing the bulk of the defenses while the bigger ships lob swarms of torpedos and Rail gun volleys back at the enemy
That would explain why the MCRN Donnager had the MCRN Tachi(Rocinante) onboard.
@@henrikkristiansen3869 IIRC, the canon story is that it was on the return trip from _Phoebe Station_ when it got the distress signal from the surviving Canterbury crew. But was also on a safeguard mission for Martian terraforming materials around Jupiter.
@@PrograError I know, I’ve read the books and watched the series.
The reasons for having a corvette class light frigate like the Tachi onboard is a simple one: Expanded mission profile and added defensive capabilities for the Donnager.
Honestly some of the best space combat in any movie or show
“I’m putting us into a spin”. The delivery of that line gets me every time
The physics of this show's space combat and the importance of the Point Defense Cannons cannot be understated. Such an awesome and realisiic take on the CIWS naval concept in space.
The Roci firing its torps and they use RCS to clear the ship then light up their drives and accelerate past the ship that already cleared them is SO cool.
It's kinda terrifying how amazingly effective the Roci is when it is in good hands!! It has beaten stealth ships, martian frigates, destroyers and what not...
Remember it survived some battles purely by high luck. It was a pin cushion where a few shots missed the drive core by inches when they took out the stealth ships
@@soul1d Yeah good point. It's awesome how they mention that luck in the series as well how lucky they were and how Alex was simulating that same battle over and over again.
The only Sci-fi series that actually made the viewers imagine how life will actually be in the future.
Incredibly badass scene. That spin with the PDCs fully unleashed... man.
I just realized that the PDC's are recoilless which is a really cool detail as you wouldn't want them to push the ship around when they are firing
Yeah. Somehow I think we will not see this type of details in other Sci-Fi movies/series for long time.
attack profile death blossom. awesome profile for an awesome scene.
Definitely one of the coolest Sci-Fi battle scenes!
This is my favorite battle in the series and one of my favorite space battles on screen!
it's so lovely filmed... my heart pumping full of adrenaline. Nice job.
1:02 Ohhhhhhh she's so pretty when she twirls... Also, feeling bad for WALL-E there at 1:15 (the PDCs always remind me of that, LOL)
In real life, the closest things we have to PDC’s on real navy ships (phalanx auto cannons) look a lot like R2-D2!
@@d0d0birdiexd78 Phalanx looks like a Minion with a minigun!
Now we know why the last of the missiles the Zmeya deployed was a different colour!
Love that foreshadowing detail this show has.
The last torpedo fired has a blue trail and is the one carrying the protomolecule. They showed it to us the whole time!
This scene played out exactly like a game of Children of a Dead Earth
That’s what I was thinking, great game
Man, I didnt know this one, thanks, bought on steam!
Yessir! Unfortunately, the missies have enough Δv and good guidance in that game lmao
@@kevgm Try using it with community material mod as well.
Except they skip the boring and incomprehensible orbital maneuvers.
No I'm not salty.
Man I miss this show! best scenes and space battles
Just noticed the geometry of the PDCs clipping through the hull a little bit as they unfold.
I love any fictions that depict missiles properly and dangerously.
The front blue torpedo!
Blue means Protomolecule LOL...
@@Phrancis5 The blue flame is an epstein drive, same thing they use on the ships because its extremely fuel efficient and made for long range.
@@DrakeOola I think yellow also means some kind of fusion drive, but less efficient, used on belter freighters.
Expanse could've been 8 seasons easy. Loved this show
Just pausing at 2:10 and looking at the displays are amazing
The best show on anything right now.
LOL Rocinante go BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
I keep coming back here to be hyped and motivated ❤
Same here!
This is a very impressive scene, and probably the most PDC fire I have ever seen in this show. Still... all this is a bluff by the Zmeya.
Don't believe me? at 0:15 starts launching a *lot* of missiles, all of which have yellow drive cones and hold their relative postions around the ship... except the last one at 0:21. That one has a *blue* drive cone and flies straight forward and is almost instantly out of sight.
Now all of the Zmeya's missiles start moving towards the Rocinante... but *slowly* (relatively I mean), their drive cones still pointed towards the Roci. If they had turned around first and accelerated (or hell, just stopping would be almost as fast), the Roci would have a lot less time to shoot down or evade them. And we're seen from when Ashford hunted down those pirates in the Tynaan that missiles in the Expanse can go past their targets, turn around and then attack again from behind almost instantly.
This is a good example of just how tricky Inaros is. I mean, if you've got 20 missiles bearing down on you, how much attention are you going to spare on the one that's heading away from you? In fact, I'm not even sure how explosive those missiles were. Considering none of them went more than *paf!!* when they got shot down, and they were mainly meant as a distraction, they might just be an empty shell with propulsion and guidance (which might be bad enough at certain speeds).
I was wondering that myself. The close call that took out one of the Roci's forward PDCs detonated really close and should have done more way more damage
It's brilliant. I'm kicking myself for not catching it on first-watch.
What’s the difference between the yellow and blue coned torpedo ?
Blue means it's fitted with an epstein drive (probably), so it has bigger dV, Yellow means it's a normal one, so it has less dV
@@cerealdreamer7577 Yellow Likely = chemical rocket
"Charging up the main rail gun" - well, that is where the fun begins.
you see the protomolecule sample blasting off, it's the last ''torpedo'' to launch
This alone made me a fan of the franchise.
I like how the torpedos just slowed down instead of turning and rushing towards the roci.
technically, they didn't slow down but accelerated less :P
yea, I noticed that too. Pretty big mistake from writers, unless it is intentional, maybe to somehow help hide the last torpedo with epstein drive that might had protomolecul on it.
@@ulariv1701 well belter torpedoes are known to be really really shitty
@@ulariv1701 pretty sure everything is intentional in this show.
@@rafaelsantosx They have made mistakes before tho. For example Ganymede slingshot should have taken a lot longer than it was in show.
The Roci used Rapid Spin - It's super effective!
Who wants to see a 6 episode mini series ( 2 hours each) about Laconia and the Earth Mars,Transport union squaring off against a Magnetar Class ship? I'd love to see the self healing armour in action along with the Field Projector. We, the fans, need this show to live on.
Bro the Rocinante’s spin with the PDCs going absolutely ham on the torpedoes was fucking METAL
"I'm putting us into a spin" - never heard that on other sci fi space battles.
He'll try spinning, I hear it's a good trick
Goddamn, beautiful Roci. Notice all the belter missiles are nosecone toward the Roci, if they are accelerating towards her it should be the other way though. Maybe the intention was to to use the drive plumes to hide the one that got away all along.
It's true that the missiles are accelerating away from the Roci, but the Roci has so much velocity left over from their initial high-g burn that the missiles are still closing in relative to the ship. Your theory about obscuring the protomolecule missile does sound plausible, though!
There may also be a 'window of engagement' where if the missiles are traveling too fast (relative to the target) they might not be able to maneuver enough to hit...by sitting on their own drive they put the dominate thrust in opposition of their vector.
They have to slow down to get to the target faster.
This was such a cool scene. The Expanse is definitely one of the best sci-fi shows ever made
PDC's was the thickest plot armor the expanse could offer
Man I love this show, we need more somehow some way.
"Evasive manoeuvres" - does a barrel roll.
It's nice watching a show that has people actually thinking about what stuff would be doing during the CGI shots. I dunno how many times I've watched a show and a ship that's supposed to be entering orbit is burning in the same direction it's moving. It's called a retro burn for a reason lol.
Not so with The Expanse. This show the CGI guys are just flexing with all the little details. Jammed gun not firing in the next shot, the inertia you can feel in the camera work, engines always facing the proper way... It's all beautiful.
One small detail I don't see talked about much is the exhaust firing out the backs of the PDCs. It's to eliminate recoil because in space firing that many rounds in such rapid succession the force of all the recoiling can really mess with the ships trajectory. Which isn't something you want mess with when trying to target and eliminate multiple incoming torpedoes. It's similar to how they pulse the drive cone when firing their forward mounted rail gun. Just on a smaller scale.
Am I the only one who thinks the ship is look pretty much alike like the KOL Battleship from Sins of a Solar Empire RTS game?
You're right :O
This show was to F-in good.
That's the problem with dealing with fanatics. They have really weird ideas about life and death
I’m pretty sure the last missle the zmeya deploys is the protomolecule. For some reason the rocket color is blue
Correct. Last torpedo had an epstein drive.
Amazon could have saved a lot of embarrassment and saved a billion dollars by not canceling the expanse to make Rings of Power
I loved this show tbh, hope they make more shows like that
That's a pretty spinning death machine if I ever saw one
i gotta say. when the roci gets into a spin with the PDCs coming out. man that looked sexy as heck
Most realistic space series ever.
God damn Expanse just utterly destroys its competition in space combat
That spin tho 😍🤩😍🤩
Always liked how no one ever aimed torpedoes in The Expanse. You let them loose, *then* activate them and let them aim themselves.
I always wonder about the bullets fired in these space battles of the expanse. They will just keep flying forever, right? I would think that after a major fleet engagement, they must declare a vast volume of space around it a no fly zone for a few days, until the cloud of bullets has dissipated sufficiently to make the odds of being hit acceptable.
Nah PDC rounds would eventually be caught by gravity and pulled into an atmosphere or the sun!
...railgun rounds tho? Oof.
Not exactly forever, but for a long, long time. Chances of catching one by accident, unless you're really close, are close to zero, though.
"I'll try spinning - that's a good trick!"
Short, but so fucking sweet.
Okay; great attention to physics + detail! But … space battles are S-I-L-E-N-T 🤫
I expected Rocinante would need to go back for restocking ammo after a battle like that.
They do mention in the following battle that they're VERY low on ammo, without Drummer's mutiny they would've been done for.
It's been so many years -- and I JUST noticed that the monitor view of the guns reads (for us 80's kids): "ATTACK PROFILE - DEATH BLOSSOM" (nod to Last Starfighter)
Spoiler! After finishing the season and rewatching this battle, I noticed that one of the Zmeya's torpedos had a different drive colour...
Likely an Epstein Drive to allow it to get all the way to Medina Station and Laconia
Something about the railgun shots that I've noticed. The Earth railguns fire a glowing orange shot like superheated metal. But the Martian railguns fire what looks like a purple gas. Which makes me believe that the Martian railguns shoot plasma rather than solid slugs.
Neat little detail:
the belter torpedoes normally have yellow engine flares, and when the Zmeya fires its torpedoes, you can see that one has a blue engine, and we do not see a blue torpedo get shot down. It was probably a Martian one, and the one which had the protomolecule.
The drive plume is probably blue because the missile is using an Epstein Drive (because it needs to be long-ranged), whereas the other Belter torpedoes use short-range chemical rockets that are cheaper to manufacture.
The Expanse was also compelling because of the toll of space flight on the crew. Mars was a perfect example, high G accel and Decel was dangerous to the crew and could kill them as easily as a rail gun or missile could.
Holden : It's not Impossible
No it's Necessary
This is real "star wars" for me!!! Best TV show ever!! 😊
Five-armed Torpedo Tennis!
Why does Semi-Realistic space warfare actually look way cooler than normal Sci-Fi?
i hope there is going to be a large space battle between Inaro's and UN + MCRN battleship
With someone high up in the MCR supporting Marco's "Free Navy", I have a feeling it'll just be the UNN facing off against them.
Well there is one, I wish they showed more of it,
Thats gonna be next season with UN+MCRN full force against FreeNavy.
Your wish was granted.
@@BNRmatt what do you mean?
I love how like this videos bring smart rts gamers together
PDC 2 FTW!
This was so tense watching it even now, and this is not even one of the most intense battles.
BSG: "My PDC are the coolest in all sci-fi!"
TheExpanse: "Hold my martian lasagnas"
every time those PDCs come out Disco music should start playing.
Did anyone else notice that the Zmeya's missiles approach the Roci engine-first. Can anyone explain the science of that for me?
Simple, they have crappy guidance systems and they’re so close that if they turn around to burn towards the Roci it’ll pass them before they have a chance to turn around
One of the most accurate space combat scenes ever. The breaking burns on the first torpedos gets you kind of disoriented... but correct.
why didnt the zmeyas torpedos just burn straight towards the roci? there is no way they could take out all of them if they all burned towards the roci
@@slajmichekelund8511 Hard to say as there is no distinct values on either the speed of the torpedoes, the speed of the Roci or the distance between the two, it is wholly possible that if the Roci was travelling fast enough and was close enough that by the time the torpedoes had spun and refired their engines the Roci would have passed through a clean intercept point meaning that the torpedoes would then have to spin again, reignite their engines and then catch up to the Roci.
@@L8ugh1ngm8n1 We've seen torpedo take less than half a seconds to spin around its long axis. They have way more than enough time to flip around and burn hard for the Roci, so I have no idea as well why those torpedo made it easy for the PDC to intercept them by slowing down relative to the Roci.
@@slajmichekelund8511I believe that if they turned and burned straight towards the Roci, the difference in their vector would become so great so quickly that the missile guidance wouldn’t have time to intercept the Roci