It seems to me that the rise of "cinematic" being something that comes exclusively from the look of an image follows pretty much in line with the rise of higher fidelity visuals on RUclips and Instagram, but misses the point that what makes an image feel cinematic has very little to do with the dynamic range, the contrast, the depth of field, the color grade, or camera movement. Rather, it has everything to do with whether or not the way those things are used support the storytelling and give the audience a deeper understanding of the storytelling. Which is why the AI won't be taking cinematographers' jobs any time soon, either.
I agree completely - but that said I definitely see people forgetting your point and only focusing on the visual side, and I dare say those jobs might be at risk if changes aren't made. Thanks for watching!
AI SHOULDNT take the jobs of cinematographers, but this makes the assumption that the person hiring the cinematographer understands story instead of simply wanting cinematic visuals.
The keywords in your comment is "any time soon." AI will eventually take over those jobs. I see the advancement it is making and am just shocked at how well it is imitating us humans. The video talks about the writing in Hollywood movies hurting them and this is where AI will shine. Not only will it make a good script, but it will add the videos and FX to a degree that will surpass us.
"do my videos actually have substance or do they just look good." that's a stomach punch, but perhaps a good one. i agree with you tom. being a filmmaker, the space is crowded enough with people making cinematic shots with no substance. the way to stand out is with great stories, with well worked out ideas and original concepts. having watched your videos for over a year now (jeez) i can really see you improving your craft both visually and substance wise. keep up the great work :)
Thanks for your comment mate, much appreciated. I sucker punch myself as well talking on some of these topics, but it's good to mull this stuff over and keep improving eh! Thanks for the support :)
Very true comments about this problem! What looks spectacular does not always has substance. It's all about the story, the music, the composition of the images.
Loved this. I've watched a lot of "cinematic" videos recently and they all seem to want to come off as profound but feel shallow and vacuous instead. They're like the video equivalent of a platitude on instagram. The videos also seem to be lacking in personality as they all seem very uniform with their aesthetic. It's also a very narrow concept of the cinematic. I think of the cinematography and lighting in a lot of Kubrick's films, especially Barry Lyndon, and how they're a completely different way of being cinematic in comparison to how its popularly conceived and practised on RUclips.
Yeah I don't think it's that deep - authenticity plus good shot composition and sound design and you're most of the way there. There's no cookie cutter version as you say
Agree 100%, all these "films" i get recommended are just a collage of random clips and b-roll that look pleasing with music. we've all made videos like these in the past cuz they are so fun and easy to make but I think the real art of cinematography comes from the emotion the audience feels when watching your film. You can only show clips of you walking to and from your camera on a tripod so many times in a video before it gets redundant. like yeah the view is nice but i want to feeeeeeelll something from your video. Everyone can create wut they want as long as it makes them happy but when you start impacting how others feel through your medium of art, its incomparable.
I've been feeling the same way mate. So many filmmaking videos just feel like highlight reels these days, which is fine if that's what you wanna do, but it just doesn't interest me anymore. We've all seen nice shots at this point - I want something that has a bit of meaning!
@@tomrenegadefilms I’ll give you that. As a note: an example where action packed special effects actually make for a good experience is Mad Max: Fury Road. The point of those movies is to create the most elaborate car chase sequences possible, and that one did a very good job imo.
In my opinion, being cinematic is about carrying the story in the most immersive way possible. Rather than just looking pretty. A good story, one that has an important philosophical message in it, would make or break your film, not solely how pretty it looks
@@tomrenegadefilms I think the last part can be seen subjectively. I know a lot of people like fantasy and stuff. I personally agree that I like grounded stories, but everyone’s different. For me it’s always about the philosophical message at the end Especially one that isn’t as common like Monsters University’s message about that not everyone is built for their dreams and they have to try another path which as someone who’s medically disqualified from being an airline pilot really hit home with me and made me realise it’s okay to not be built for your dreams. Which is something that not a lot of stories explore In my subjective opinion, stories are a guide to life as top priority, but other stuff matter too :)
I just said this on another channel. They filmed the same sceen with a cellphone and natural lighting as opposed to an Arri and controlled lighting. The cheap shot would have been perfectly acceptable to the average movie goer. There was a stunning difference with the better equipment but it doesn't matter if the story is trash. We had many great storytellers from the 1930's to the 1990's most of the marketing and the accolades were based on the stunning looks of the film. Now anyone can get those looks even on consumer equipment but the stories aren't compelling. They care more about visuals. Not just cinematic but the on screen talent. Story be damned. Then they wonder why, nobody is watching.
Yeah I agree - it's mostly people who are actually interested in filmmaking that notice the subtle differences. I think the big epic trilogies like Star Wars and then Lord of the Rings made people think that spectacle is what matters most - not realizing that we rewatch those films because of how they make us feel, not because of the great vfx...
@@tomrenegadefilms Yep, even if you look at the older classics all the big budget films since technicolor, the accolades have been about "stunning visuals" more than story. Ben Hur, Gone With the Wind, Wizard of Oz, etc. all about the stunning visuals.
On topic of Hollywood, I found more and more Wes Anderson’s movies entraining, the visuals and history are different the usual Hollywoodian blockbuster, and I think youtubers would benefit trying bring own style and stop mimicking big cinema
Yeah I think the broader the pool of influences - the more unique the resulting style is for sure. I definitely wouldn't want to have Hollywood stuff as my only influence either
I agree, if you give a great story, and good audio, I can over look bad visual. As you mentioned mobile phone cameras are becoming amazing, and I have found out first hand a lot of companies that hired video production companies to do short form work for their social platforms, are no longer hiring people. Because they can use their phones to save lots of money, and it looks good enough for them. Chances are, and I have seen it a lot, there is at least one person in the company that likes doing video, and probably even has a small following on their I.G account, and they are given the task, and all content is shot on a phone, and for the most part looks good. Which now knocks out most video production companies, and if that is not bad enough. Being a video production company, I have found I now must compete with a lazy society. Everything now has to filmed in 9x16 because people are to lazy to turn there phones 16x9 to watch videos, and now that format is the norm. So, does this mean those people have their tv sets in their homes, standing on it end so their tv is now a 9x16 ?
Yeah I'm seeing this a lot. I think when it comes to sales, unfortunately the low hanging fruit is just churning out as much content as possible and treating it as art just becomes a secondary objective (if it's an objective at all). I do think in time people will realize that putting time and effort into doing something well gets better results, but I don't think we're quite there yet - audiences need to get more sick of the generic stuff first I think.
Thanks dude! The aspect ratio is 4:3 which in HD equates to 1440 x 1080. I don't use it much but it's great for making stuff feel a bit more 20th century...
Love this. Ive had very similar thoughts. I 100% agree with the AI talk in this. Cinematic broll can be spit out on Runway Gen3 right now with very decent results. It will come down to the stories and characters.
Great video up to 5:32. Then the advert kind of ruined it dude. Fade to black on 5:32, great video. Fade to black 6:46, not so much (in my subjective opinion obviously). You had a story...and then. Anyway, thanks for sharing and as I said, up to 5:32 you had me.
That's cool dude, I get that not everyone likes promos but then I'm looking to treat this channel as part of my business so I'll be plugging stuff I think is good from time to time I'm sure 👌🏼 cheers for the feedback though
Honestly mate, iPhone cameras are awesome - Peter Mckinnon did a video a while back with the new Pro and I honestly wouldn't have known it wasn't a Mirrorless camera. No need for a lot of the flashy gear these days for most stuff
why recommend epidemic sound. it’s what all of those people trying to be “cinematic” are using it’s so overused. followed by artlist. you hear the same songs over and over again and you can already tell which plattform they got the song from. better to get your audio from one of the more unknown ones that are more expensive and are not already used by the entirety of youtube
Very simple answer mate - because I really like it, and I think for a lot of people something good and affordable is a better option than something rare and expensive 👌🏼
Nobody can even agree on what "cinematic" means. Its not even about quality. Weave, grain and all other imperfections are actually the opposite of quality. Super 16mm is cinematic as is super 8mm film. There are studies and tests that put the resolution of s35mm film at about 3,600 pixels wide. That's for a good film stock. Some can look worse and by the time we see a reprint copy in a theater its likely even worse. We have had 4k cameras for many years now and many are pushing past that up to 8k. Ironically some Hollywood films are shot on 65mm film to have very fine to no grain and really fine detail. Just like a digital sensor would have... Then there is grading. An art field that 100% ignores the tastes of those that consume the medium. Its one of the most arrogant art fields in history. Colorists just make up what they assume people want to see. They never seek input or feedback. They just grade it and tell everyone to suck it up and accept it. That's fine in fine art but is cinema really fine art? Its not. Its commercial art meant to make money off widespread acceptance. Its an art form that is purely commercial but being treated like its fine art by an elite select few. We have actually reached the point now where digital has way surpassed what film can do. A FF 8k Canon R5 resolves as much detail and acutance as 65mm film does and likely has less noise if shot well. Converting digital to film emulation now involves dumbing down the quality and adding imperfections and flaws. The term is misused because its a sexy term. Cinematic sounds hip and trendy vs saying high production value. Thing is a really well 4k produced talk show with good lighting can also have high production value. It will look the complete opposite to cinematic, whatever the heck that even means, but its still high production value. Video was always supposed to be about reality. I guess because my background was more from a broadcast perspective I always valued realism vs fantasy. I love and appreciate both but I know there is a time and place for both.
I get what you're saying. I think in my mind "Cinematic" is more of a vibe than a look - but everyone associates it with appearance for the reasons you pointed out. A less sexy way to say it might be "well produced and moody" 🤷🏼♂️
You're so handsome, lad! ❤️🥰 I'm Yusaku from Philippines, nice to meet you mate. New subscriber, would love to see you grow as filmmaker RUclipsr. Let's go together to grow our RUclips channel. Haha!
This is the type of guy who didn't manage to get a cinematic look, then he makes a video about it that it doesn't matter at all and to hide it all he makes his video in 4:3 💀
![Shenseea - Dating Szn (Options) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eUePmZFIXUg/mqdefault.jpg)
Nerdy filmmaking videos incoming...
It seems to me that the rise of "cinematic" being something that comes exclusively from the look of an image follows pretty much in line with the rise of higher fidelity visuals on RUclips and Instagram, but misses the point that what makes an image feel cinematic has very little to do with the dynamic range, the contrast, the depth of field, the color grade, or camera movement. Rather, it has everything to do with whether or not the way those things are used support the storytelling and give the audience a deeper understanding of the storytelling. Which is why the AI won't be taking cinematographers' jobs any time soon, either.
I agree completely - but that said I definitely see people forgetting your point and only focusing on the visual side, and I dare say those jobs might be at risk if changes aren't made. Thanks for watching!
AI SHOULDNT take the jobs of cinematographers, but this makes the assumption that the person hiring the cinematographer understands story instead of simply wanting cinematic visuals.
The keywords in your comment is "any time soon." AI will eventually take over those jobs. I see the advancement it is making and am just shocked at how well it is imitating us humans. The video talks about the writing in Hollywood movies hurting them and this is where AI will shine. Not only will it make a good script, but it will add the videos and FX to a degree that will surpass us.
"do my videos actually have substance or do they just look good." that's a stomach punch, but perhaps a good one. i agree with you tom. being a filmmaker, the space is crowded enough with people making cinematic shots with no substance. the way to stand out is with great stories, with well worked out ideas and original concepts. having watched your videos for over a year now (jeez) i can really see you improving your craft both visually and substance wise. keep up the great work :)
Thanks for your comment mate, much appreciated. I sucker punch myself as well talking on some of these topics, but it's good to mull this stuff over and keep improving eh! Thanks for the support :)
Very true comments about this problem! What looks spectacular does not always has substance. It's all about the story, the music, the composition of the images.
Couldn’t agree more mate! great films are always story first, “cinematic” visuals second. Love the first date analogy 😂
Cheers lads! Flipping glad I'm married now, so much less hassle!
Loved this. I've watched a lot of "cinematic" videos recently and they all seem to want to come off as profound but feel shallow and vacuous instead. They're like the video equivalent of a platitude on instagram. The videos also seem to be lacking in personality as they all seem very uniform with their aesthetic. It's also a very narrow concept of the cinematic. I think of the cinematography and lighting in a lot of Kubrick's films, especially Barry Lyndon, and how they're a completely different way of being cinematic in comparison to how its popularly conceived and practised on RUclips.
Yeah I don't think it's that deep - authenticity plus good shot composition and sound design and you're most of the way there. There's no cookie cutter version as you say
Agree 100%, all these "films" i get recommended are just a collage of random clips and b-roll that look pleasing with music. we've all made videos like these in the past cuz they are so fun and easy to make but I think the real art of cinematography comes from the emotion the audience feels when watching your film. You can only show clips of you walking to and from your camera on a tripod so many times in a video before it gets redundant. like yeah the view is nice but i want to feeeeeeelll something from your video. Everyone can create wut they want as long as it makes them happy but when you start impacting how others feel through your medium of art, its incomparable.
I've been feeling the same way mate. So many filmmaking videos just feel like highlight reels these days, which is fine if that's what you wanna do, but it just doesn't interest me anymore. We've all seen nice shots at this point - I want something that has a bit of meaning!
The bit about Ai hit the nail on head
Great video! Your storytelling deserves a lot more views. Good luck, man!
Thanks dude, much appreciated!
Incredibly well expressed. Still trying to become a better story teller!
Thanks, I think it's the topic that I really want to dial in on, so I'll be sharing what I learn myself as I go!
Very well done. Damn well done. Damn well done.
I’m glad someone else is saying that modern movies are boring.
There's still some good ones coming out, just less than I'd like I guess...
@@tomrenegadefilms I’ll give you that. As a note: an example where action packed special effects actually make for a good experience is Mad Max: Fury Road. The point of those movies is to create the most elaborate car chase sequences possible, and that one did a very good job imo.
@nate_thenotso_great Mad max was a great watch - and I believe a lot the effects were practical which is cool too
True detective 4 - amazing shots qnd coloring. About the essence and the story I betternot comment
So common with films and TV now...
Very nice video mate and I hope I see your success!
Thanks mate!
In my opinion, being cinematic is about carrying the story in the most immersive way possible. Rather than just looking pretty. A good story, one that has an important philosophical message in it, would make or break your film, not solely how pretty it looks
I agree. Though I'd say relatability in story is the most important thing, otherwise people lose interest and stop caring.
@@tomrenegadefilms I think the last part can be seen subjectively. I know a lot of people like fantasy and stuff. I personally agree that I like grounded stories, but everyone’s different. For me it’s always about the philosophical message at the end
Especially one that isn’t as common like Monsters University’s message about that not everyone is built for their dreams and they have to try another path which as someone who’s medically disqualified from being an airline pilot really hit home with me and made me realise it’s okay to not be built for your dreams. Which is something that not a lot of stories explore
In my subjective opinion, stories are a guide to life as top priority, but other stuff matter too :)
@@SimPilotMika Yeah nice point. I do think those films are the best kind - just every now and then I like a bit of Dumb and Dumber too haha
Being cinematic isn't about the camera, it's your skill of how to control a scene. You can be cinematic with a phone
Very true
I just said this on another channel. They filmed the same sceen with a cellphone and natural lighting as opposed to an Arri and controlled lighting. The cheap shot would have been perfectly acceptable to the average movie goer. There was a stunning difference with the better equipment but it doesn't matter if the story is trash.
We had many great storytellers from the 1930's to the 1990's most of the marketing and the accolades were based on the stunning looks of the film.
Now anyone can get those looks even on consumer equipment but the stories aren't compelling. They care more about visuals. Not just cinematic but the on screen talent. Story be damned. Then they wonder why, nobody is watching.
Yeah I agree - it's mostly people who are actually interested in filmmaking that notice the subtle differences. I think the big epic trilogies like Star Wars and then Lord of the Rings made people think that spectacle is what matters most - not realizing that we rewatch those films because of how they make us feel, not because of the great vfx...
@@tomrenegadefilms Yep, even if you look at the older classics all the big budget films since technicolor, the accolades have been about "stunning visuals" more than story. Ben Hur, Gone With the Wind, Wizard of Oz, etc. all about the stunning visuals.
Some great points - subbed!
Thank you sir!
On topic of Hollywood, I found more and more Wes Anderson’s movies entraining, the visuals and history are different the usual Hollywoodian blockbuster, and I think youtubers would benefit trying bring own style and stop mimicking big cinema
Yeah I think the broader the pool of influences - the more unique the resulting style is for sure. I definitely wouldn't want to have Hollywood stuff as my only influence either
Tom this is so good!!! Looking forward to more of it!
Thanks Tobi! Got lots of ideas churning around currently! 💡
To be cinematic you need bokeh in every single shot. Story, dialogue..nobody really notices. Buy 1.2 anamorphic and get ready for the WOW!
I do love bokeh... but no 😂
I agree, if you give a great story, and good audio, I can over look bad visual. As you mentioned mobile phone cameras are becoming amazing, and I have found out first hand a lot of companies that hired video production companies to do short form work for their social platforms, are no longer hiring people. Because they can use their phones to save lots of money, and it looks good enough for them. Chances are, and I have seen it a lot, there is at least one person in the company that likes doing video, and probably even has a small following on their I.G account, and they are given the task, and all content is shot on a phone, and for the most part looks good. Which now knocks out most video production companies, and if that is not bad enough. Being a video production company, I have found I now must compete with a lazy society. Everything now has to filmed in 9x16 because people are to lazy to turn there phones 16x9 to watch videos, and now that format is the norm. So, does this mean those people have their tv sets in their homes, standing on it end so their tv is now a 9x16 ?
Yeah I'm seeing this a lot. I think when it comes to sales, unfortunately the low hanging fruit is just churning out as much content as possible and treating it as art just becomes a secondary objective (if it's an objective at all). I do think in time people will realize that putting time and effort into doing something well gets better results, but I don't think we're quite there yet - audiences need to get more sick of the generic stuff first I think.
Totally agree, any resources, books, courses you can recommend to learn storytelling for video creators?
I've been watching a lot of a channel called Studiobinder which I think is really good for how storytelling works - specifically in TV and Cinema...
@@tomrenegadefilms thanks, will check them out!
New subscriber🤗 Good points!
what is this aspect ratio, i dig it! and your color grade in the first scene!
Thanks dude! The aspect ratio is 4:3 which in HD equates to 1440 x 1080. I don't use it much but it's great for making stuff feel a bit more 20th century...
This video was worth a subscription all by itself.
Gut punches!!!!
Love this. Ive had very similar thoughts. I 100% agree with the AI talk in this. Cinematic broll can be spit out on Runway Gen3 right now with very decent results. It will come down to the stories and characters.
Definitely, characters are complex in a way that AI doesn't seem to understand or mimic very well at all... human skills over technical skills!
Great video up to 5:32. Then the advert kind of ruined it dude. Fade to black on 5:32, great video. Fade to black 6:46, not so much (in my subjective opinion obviously). You had a story...and then. Anyway, thanks for sharing and as I said, up to 5:32 you had me.
That's cool dude, I get that not everyone likes promos but then I'm looking to treat this channel as part of my business so I'll be plugging stuff I think is good from time to time I'm sure 👌🏼 cheers for the feedback though
@@tomrenegadefilms Fair enough dude
story first 😊
Another very well thought out video, Tom.
Thanks mate!
This was so helpful 😮
Glad to hear it!
this is why i'm still sticking to my iPhone for videos; no amount of gear could improve my bad storytelling lol.
Honestly mate, iPhone cameras are awesome - Peter Mckinnon did a video a while back with the new Pro and I honestly wouldn't have known it wasn't a Mirrorless camera. No need for a lot of the flashy gear these days for most stuff
Great
Great content!
Couldn’t agree more, cut out the bs and tell a good story. That’s one thing I’m working on with my channel anyway
Same mate. I really want to explore the storytelling side of filmmaking rather than just visual stuff, so many channels are already doing that.
you earned a subscriber
Thanks mate, glad to have you here 👌🏼
why recommend epidemic sound. it’s what all of those people trying to be “cinematic” are using it’s so overused. followed by artlist. you hear the same songs over and over again and you can already tell which plattform they got the song from. better to get your audio from one of the more unknown ones that are more expensive and are not already used by the entirety of youtube
Very simple answer mate - because I really like it, and I think for a lot of people something good and affordable is a better option than something rare and expensive 👌🏼
Nobody can even agree on what "cinematic" means. Its not even about quality. Weave, grain and all other imperfections are actually the opposite of quality. Super 16mm is cinematic as is super 8mm film. There are studies and tests that put the resolution of s35mm film at about 3,600 pixels wide. That's for a good film stock. Some can look worse and by the time we see a reprint copy in a theater its likely even worse. We have had 4k cameras for many years now and many are pushing past that up to 8k.
Ironically some Hollywood films are shot on 65mm film to have very fine to no grain and really fine detail. Just like a digital sensor would have...
Then there is grading. An art field that 100% ignores the tastes of those that consume the medium. Its one of the most arrogant art fields in history. Colorists just make up what they assume people want to see. They never seek input or feedback. They just grade it and tell everyone to suck it up and accept it. That's fine in fine art but is cinema really fine art? Its not. Its commercial art meant to make money off widespread acceptance. Its an art form that is purely commercial but being treated like its fine art by an elite select few.
We have actually reached the point now where digital has way surpassed what film can do. A FF 8k Canon R5 resolves as much detail and acutance as 65mm film does and likely has less noise if shot well. Converting digital to film emulation now involves dumbing down the quality and adding imperfections and flaws.
The term is misused because its a sexy term. Cinematic sounds hip and trendy vs saying high production value. Thing is a really well 4k produced talk show with good lighting can also have high production value. It will look the complete opposite to cinematic, whatever the heck that even means, but its still high production value.
Video was always supposed to be about reality. I guess because my background was more from a broadcast perspective I always valued realism vs fantasy. I love and appreciate both but I know there is a time and place for both.
I get what you're saying. I think in my mind "Cinematic" is more of a vibe than a look - but everyone associates it with appearance for the reasons you pointed out. A less sexy way to say it might be "well produced and moody" 🤷🏼♂️
Why is this video not in 16:9 format?
Thought I'd make one in 4:3 for a change
Love it dude. This is such valuable information.
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it :)
Surprised by how low views this has
Thanks dude, hopefully it'll get a little traction as time ticks on... we'll see!
You're so handsome, lad! ❤️🥰 I'm Yusaku from Philippines, nice to meet you mate. New subscriber, would love to see you grow as filmmaker RUclipsr. Let's go together to grow our RUclips channel. Haha!
Thanks mate! All the best to you with your channel too!
This is the type of guy who didn't manage to get a cinematic look, then he makes a video about it that it doesn't matter at all and to hide it all he makes his video in 4:3 💀