Why Cloud Should TERRIFY You in Final Fantasy VII Rebirth | Final Fantasy Theory
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- Опубликовано: 28 дек 2023
- #ffvii #ff7r #theory
Final Fantasy Vii Rebirth is RIGHT AROUND the corner! And with the newest trailer out I say its time to revisit some older ideas on the channel revolving around Sephiroth, Tifa, Cloud, Zack and all things FF7!
Sephiroth Will Target Tifa - • Why Sephiroth Will Tar...
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I didn't want to go too far into speculation or spoilers, buuuuut - you all know what Sephiroth/JENOVA controlling that Sleeping Cloud would mean in the end....
Yeah! Cloud will kill Aerith this time, not Sephiroth!
Nope, my predictions is aerith lives in main timeline, gets killed by possessed cloud in Zacks timeline. but you have to fight cloud (Zacks timeline) Zack VS cloud@@divinesoul1987
Great video. Unfortunately many people still refuse to realize (because of personal bias) how quintessential Tifa is for Cloud's story.
She and Aerith are essential for Clouds character. If somebody doesn't acknowledge that he doesn't undertand the story.
**SPOILERS**
Excellent video, and it's just refreshing to see someone who truly gets the implications of a world without Tifa Lockhart. If Tifa is gone, there is no saving Cloud. He will eventually just b/c Sephiroth's puppet and forever be lost. And we already know he tries to kill Aerith in the "main timeline" for lack of better phrasing. Now he's in the same room as Aerith who is sleeping and can't even defend herself if he wakes up?
I think Remake is gonna hit people harder than ever. The fact of the matter is for several reasons, only Tifa will ever be able to save Cloud. It's not only rooted in their long history, but rooted in his lifelong feelings for her. That mountain incident reshaped a lot of his life and he then wanted to be a SOLDIER so that he could be the kind of man who could keep the ppl he loves safe.
It's all about getting her acceptance of his true self and her forgiveness or at least the forgiveness he thinks he needs from her. It is only after she embraces his true self and shows him kindness and love in the Lifestream scene, that he finally accepts his past for what it is and they're able to escape. And the last trailer just proved once again only she will save Cloud.
That's why the LTD narrative is an illusion, a red herring. Real Cloud has only ever wanted Tifa's acceptance. He knew Aerith three weeks under a false persona. As you mention, Zack knew him but only a few years. And Cloud, REAL Cloud, is not gonna open his heart up to either one of them the way they he did to Tifa in the LS scene.
Anyway excellent video!
Cloud says I killed you with my bare hands in Remake to Spehiroth, the main party cloud is different already. Also, the other characters in Zack's reality, that stuff makes absolutely no sense, if another Cloud and party are in another timeline or whatever it is.
If it's the same Cloud, he wouldn't know what happened in Nibelheim in which he finished Sephiroth off. But in Remake he already knows.
Nah I’m still leaning towards Aerith tbh. Just as cloud knew Aerith in a false persona (which see clearly sees through) Tifa has a false recollection of their childhoods. They weren’t childhood friends and Tifa only fell for him after he made that promise. In light of this Tifa really doesn’t have much of an advantage over Aerith… they both barely know cloud right?
@amosrotimi1 what false recollection does Tifa have? Traces of Two Pasts doesn't show any such thing.
@@StygianStilettosGamer Remember how Tifa says she and cloud used to be close but drifted apart? That’s false. They were never close, she romanticised their childhoods after cloud made the promise on the water tower. She says the same thing in the OG and is proven wrong in the life stream. Traces of two pasta is TIFA’s personal recollection of their childhoods so it’s also subject to this romanticisation.
I'm not saying everyone need to rewatch the movie, "Fight Club" from start to finish but just watch the last scene of the movie where the protagonist/narrator(Sebastian) fought his friend(Tyler). Right after Sebastian killed his friend(Tyler), that's when Sebastian fully comes to term of what's really been going on in his own mind from the start to finish. In comparison, in the OG FF7, we know that Sephiroth has been messing with Cloud's mind. Cloud is not who he is. He pretends to be someone that he's not.. and before Aerith was killed by Sephiroth in the iconic scene from he Temple of the Ancient, Cloud almost killed Aerith himself because Cloud was being controlled by Sephiroth..Cloud is all messed up and confused . Now, who's to say that the FF7 Rebirth devs looked back at the scene where Sephiroth jumped from above and stabbed Aerith through the heart... and go, "you know what, let's shock the fans...instead of having Sephiroth kill Aerith like the OG FF7, let's have Cloud be the one that kill Aerith instead"? At this point, you may say, "that's the stupidest thing..why would Cloud kill Aerith"? On contrary, NO, that's very possible. Keep in mind that Cloud is being manipulated by sephiroth. Cloud is not who he is. he's not right in the head. Now who's to say that because Sephiroth f*cks with Clouds head so much that led Cloud to have a split personality disorder -- all being manipulated by Sephiroth which made Cloud see/think in his own mind that it's Sephiroth that had killed Aerith but in reality, it's Cloud that really killed Aerith. Does any of this make sense?
This makes perfect sense and its something I often wondered myself about that famous scene.
Sephiroth is as much of a psychological enemy as he is a physical one.
Cloud being the one to deliver the final blow os far more possible than people realize
Cloud created his persona right after he met Tifa, specifically to keep their promise of him being a true hero for her and to be strong enough to protect her. The moment in which Tifa finds him at the Sector7 station, is the moment in which he forms his other identity. Therefore without Tifa, Cloud will remain in a comatose state unless either her or Sephiroth do something about it.
If we consider that maybe "Zack's world" could be in the Lifestream after he has died, I think that Cloud isn't gonna wake up, unless Sephiroth manages to make a puppet out of him in the main story, therfore, trapping Cloud in the limbo between life and death (like what we see when Aerith and Zack appear to him in Advent Children).
Sephiroth will take advantage of Cloud's consciousness being trapped in the Lifestream to control his comatose self, while the main Cloud will also be comatose, or something like that.
Puppet Cloud killing Aerith in the Lifestream, would eventually mean defeat and the distruction of humans, therefore that won't happen...also because they won't risk for Cloud to neither become a villain, nor to be too shaken before we get to the Northern Crater, so that Tifa can't confirm his identity and he eventually loses it (and we get a premise for the Lifestreame Sequence).
We're just gonna get a scare probably, a bad one, but since the Remake trilogy still leads to Advent Children at the end, they can't make of Cloud Aerith's killer, because his guilt towards her (and Zack) isn't for something he caused physically, but it's his survival's guilt, therefore something he internalized (remember that Cloud says in AC "I let her die").
Also Zack must still be dead, especially since they said the mystery around him is gonna be resolved in this game and it would be kinda weird to alive him and unalive him after a few chapters. It would also impact his death negatively.
I'm still thinking it's 1 world, not two separate worlds
Though, in a recent interview, they said that the story of the game will happen in a way so that Advent Children is still canon. That can't happen unless both Zack and Aerith die.
He also said that FF7 and FFX share the same universe, which is kind of bs.... idk man.
@@Nu_r0ga I think he meant FF7R and FFX are same universe with the shrina building easter egg, but yeah 100 percent with the person above. Advent Children is hard cannon they have said this. The journey will be different but all roads lead to that sad ending for Aerith and Zack
@@Atom-yb5dy Kitase said FFX and FF7 shared the same universe (because of a guy named Shinra in FFX was probably the ancestor of the founders of Shin-ra Company). But later Nojima and Nomura said that Kitase was only joking around in that interview. That theory alone would open a lot of plot holes in the FF7 timeline.
About FF7R, the same Kitase said it would LINK UP AND ADD UP to Advent Children, NOT lead up to AC. Advent Children can still be canon if it's treated as a prequel to the current FF7R events. Sephiroth's original plan in AC was to fuse Loz, Kadaj, Yazoo and Jenova to recover his complete body. And it's kinda what happened with Loz + Kadaj + Yazoo fusing with the Arbiter of Fate inside Sephiroth in FF7R.
Don't get me wrong, Zack might be dead and what we see in trailers might just be the lifestream. About Aerith's fate, I kinda understand that it probably will happen again....But to have EVERYTHING lead to the exact same movie, after Sephiroth absorbed the arbiter of fate and the party "defied destiny"... idk man. It would be a harder backpedaling than Star Wars Episode 9 was.
I’m really hesitant to share my speculation about this game (Rebirth) publicly. But I’m really grateful for the way you articulated Tifa’s role in FFVII. You did that exceptionally well and I thank you for it. It shows me you are an informed fan and not a clout chaser.
Sorry, but 25 years in this fandom has made me really cynical.
My thoughts exactly Kupo ❤️
Couple of notes here. Developers juggled it but Tifa also is not a realiable narrator. While rebirth may make it different, in og they get the truth by confronting memories of each other. Tifa had a false image of Cloud. Og Tifa wasn't confonting Cloud about Nibelheim because he made her doubt hers. While the supplement material seems to change it, Nojima said og lifestream segment IS cannon. Example - in lifestream Tifa says was it the first time you where in my room. Cloud says no. I was never there. Later in on a way to a smile we read that as neighbours they constantly visited each other.
My first though is that this could click. Just make it Tifas fake memories.
Cloud about to lose his mind like sephiroth did. Prolly gain his dark wing too
Reunion Cloud is coming. The planet needs big hero Zack to save the day
I don't think Zacks time line exists, because that rift in the sky doesn't exist, it's Jenova messing with Clouds head, because he's the only one who can see the rift, and Aerith. So neither one actually exists.
except Sephiroth explains they do and shows multiple worlds with Zack due to his choices.
Top video❤
Iam a fan now😊
Welcome aboard!
The scene where cloud is sleeping looks like he is in a wheel chair. It's probably the part after he fell in mako and Tifa saves him but this time maybe Zack saves him.
I think as long as Zach's around Cloud isn't in too much danger. He's looking out for him, and didn't Cloud tell him he was from Nibelheim in Crisis Core?
What are there’s gonna be two versions of cloud I would, if there’s gonna be the good version from Final Fantasy seven remake, and what if there’s going to be an evil cloud in Zack’s world if you’re right, then Zacks world’s cloud is going to become evil, and then he hast to fight the good version of himself
Isn't areirth still in the zack timeline?, maybe aerith could go into the lifestream with cloud gathering the memories of the planet from tifas memories of cloud and peice him back together, maybe even sephiroth and the despair he brought upon cloud and his friends will make him remember what is real and what is fiction?
Cool
tifa is not dead she is unconscious in zack timeline.
I hope so
There’s no guarantee, though. She could be dead.
Maybe…Zach’s death was crucial to clouds taking of his persona. So who knows what the coma cloud will be like with Zach being alive.
But really who knows what’s going on with the Zach stuff.
This is an amazing point I havent even thought of....
Ok hear me out... haha
I wasn't huge into ff7 untill late in life. My first FF gane was when I got X2 with my new ps2 on Christmas. So FFX was kind of my entry, which is probably why I love KH so much. That was the world I lived in back then ya know? Haha
That being said, as someone who rather recently experienced FF7, Crisis Core, Remake, and currently Ever Crisis... Cloud kinda sucks.
Everything cool about him is Zack. Remake did a good job of really trying to flesh Cloud out but I wasn't sold. Think about it, his two most popular weapons belong to other people.
Maybe this is the final step into letting Zack be Zack and making Cloud a real character of his own 🤷
What's even crazier is my first introduction to Cloud was a AMV Mashup of advent children and master of puppets by metallica so maybe he was always doomed to fail to live up to that sheer hype lol
I get what you mean. However, gauging the character by the level of "coolness" is less than half the story.
I highly recommend you watch a YT video entitled "Final Fantasy Series Mental Health Themes EXPLAINED" to find out why.
It's full of spoilers, fair warning.
😎
The thing people will never understand is:
1- Cloud was never Zack
2- Cloud IS a character of his own, with his own personality (infact even in his fake persona he's not Zack, but an idealized version of himself).
But his point as a character is to go forward when other people can't. To live on for those who have died and to protect those who are fighting beside him.
His final goal is to accept himself for who he is and finally be himself, to be vulnerable and to speak out, to learn how to trust his team, to be a leader and to accept people's help without feeling ashamed. Cloud was always his own character, it's people who never understood him and mischaracterized him.
Cloud was never a shadow of anyone and that's what the game has always tried to tell people
If anything is Zack that gains from being someone who has died for Cloud, because aside of that he has only Aerith who makes him a character in the main game at all.
I think people tend to like Zack more because he's a straightforward presence in the game, he also knows his own role in the story, while Cloud is much more complex and is meant to be questioned as a character, because he himself still has to find his identity and his place in the world.
Zack is the idealized version of a hero, Cloud is the realistic one.
The Buster sword isn't just something that "has been used by two people already", it's a symbol that Cloud carries with himself, it's friendship, but also failure. It's Cloud's sword, the way it was Zack's when it was in his hands and when it carried Angeal's will.
Cloud is one of the best protagonists in gaming history exactly because of how much depth and weight he carries with himself and I'd die a billion times on this hill.
You saying "let Zack be Zack and let Cloud be a character of his own", demonstrates you didn't understand anything of what you've played.
@@psi.dayanamoore dope reccomendation. Thank you 🫡
@lauragiancotti1261 "People will never understand"
Yes, exactly my point.
I have to now watch a whole YT mental illness playlist just to justify why people even like Cloud in the first place. Bahahaha
I should have to do all this extra work. I'm going to anyway but damn.. Just write a good character IN GAME lol
Hi. Breathe air. To life. God made everything. His son, Jesus, pardoned everything.
Tifa literally said it at the end of that scene that Cloud found himself .. The whole idea is Cloud sinking in that lifestream full of memories which might be controlled by Aerith .. Tifa, despite her doubts, but she kept it to herself without discussing it from the beginning or trying to understand Cloud … she was quite the whole time until then
So basically that lifestream scene, she was there yes .. BUT AS SHE SAID CLOUD FOUND HIMSELF
Better wait for Rebirth .. all characters will have valuable roles .. we will understand them better
Hey there you missed the part before Tifa says Cloud found himself She told him to remember his childhood and if she remembered it as well then it would be a memory that Tifa could use to help Cloud find the real him again and break Sephiroths hold on him. An example is Cloud himself has said” I forget things everyone remembers just fine and know things I’ve got no right knowing” meaning Cloud can’t tell which memories are real and which are false so Tifa the only one who truly knows him repairs his mind by helping him put the pieces back together so he can quote “Find himself”.
@@seiryukanninja that was within the lifestream where both can see their memories. She supports, but she was not the main reason especially it was in one of official ultiminias that she heard voices forced her to tell the truth to Cloud. Moreover, you are talking about the new events in rebirth that is totally different from the OG. Note to mention, It’s new that Tifa fell in lifestream without Cloud this time. We have Zack as well and he was asked to help Cloud.
We are still waiting for part 3 to clear all misinterpretations that most of us have.
@@S.V-22 you’re right about Tifa going in the LS on her own this time so this is purely a guess; I think that Cloud and Tifa both go into the LS together later in part 3 where Cloud is completely broken mentally and Tifa has to save him by piecing his memories back together and having gone in herself that one time she may have an understanding of how to repair Clouds memory so he can return to her just as how she learned of how he helped her from the mountain when they were kids.
@@seiryukanninja this yet to be seen in part III. We got a lot of new concepts especially with Zack now. We are shown different worlds. The ending itself has lots of questions to be answered. A lot of hints that Cloud is somehow aware of what’s going on especially his dialogues while fighting Jenova after the critical scene and then Sephiroth at the end with Aerith.
We still have no idea how it would go for part III.
I am fine with anything given and decided by devs. We have to respect and appreciate their hard work. FFVII is a great game and its story is amazing.
I think Aerith is the real Jenova, and Sephiroth is the original inhabitants of the earth. He even mentions everyone born into the world is bound by her. Then, Aerith says, if you do beat him you will be free and nothing is more terrifying than boundless freedom. As in she had everything fixed to a predictable outcome. Even Sephiroth was being used to motivate cloud to not question her and get her to the heart of the planet, and as you see her wish still was activated it turned green. Then, you get geostigma, then all life seems to die in the future and plants and animals take over again.
Which Barret's questions when that pops up, and Red 13 says, "That is the tomorrow to come if we lose this battle here today."
Aerith carrys the will of Jenova, the real Jenova. So people will be shocked when they learn this. XD
This is obsessing the same point over and over.
This video terrifies me. I’m shaking my head, like Aerith, over this dodgy content.
Two Clouds in one timeline is problematic- the way the camera pans to the comatose Cloud in the background and is suggesting it could be Jenova/Sephiroth waiting for Aerith to wake, based on what Marlene says.
(Spoilers) However, In Traces of Two Pasts, Tifa didn’t know Cloud because her father blamed him for Tifa’s fall at the Nibelheim mountains and refused her to hang around Cloud.
Cloud and Tifa did not play together as children, as Tifa was part of the “four fiends”- not friends.
The other boys didn’t like Cloud, but Tifa chose them over him.
Tifa only began to show interest in him once he left to join SOLDIER.
As for a love interest- sitting a barstool apart after being gone for a decade isn’t what I call a romantic love interest.
I have played both OG and Remake with both choices of interest in Aerith and Tifa. In OTWTAS- Cloud leaves Tifa page 51. (Both novels written by Nojima).
The situation isn’t dire because of Tifa. You say that Tifa is the only one who truly knows Cloud. Aerith says on the Gold Saucer date that she wants to meet the real Cloud, so what are you talking about? Aerith is the key and is very perceptive.
In The Maiden that Travels the Planet, Zack and Aerith are trying to figure out a way to reach Cloud in the Lifestream. It is Zack who has the idea to go through Tifa. Aerith is the one who guides Tifa to reach Cloud’s conscience.
It is irritating that a lot of these “so-called fans” post this commentary based on opinion and didn’t do their research properly.
And people wonder why they market the gold saucer date with Aerith as important, it’s because it’s the only one that’s relevant to the story since it touches a very important info for both Aerith and Cloud.
The two of you have completely lost the plot here.....
When Aerith says something along the lines of "Cloud, I want to meet the REAL you" its an acknowledgement that the Cloud shes spending time with isnt being his authentic self.
Tifa is the only one who knows that Authentic Cloud no matter how brief or limited their interactions may have been as kids.
This doesnt invalidate Cloud and Aerith by any means, but if you cant acknowledge Clouds identity crisis that only resolves with Tifas help then youre just blantantly ignoring key details
@@HyruleFalconi I didn’t disregard Cloud’s identity crisis.
"Identity Crisis that only resolves with Tifas help"
Its the second half of that statement that you are ignoring
@@TheLandiLodge You asked for peoples opinions so here is mine- you should read the novels instead of just playing the games.
It will give you more insight on the depth of the characters and fill-in the plot holes instead of making this content all about Tifa- which you cannot deny that you have.
Yes, Cloud has an identity crisis. With the help of Zack and Aerith GOING THROUGH TIFA, it was resolved.