To the guy on the left side... US is not refusing to provide modern aircrafts or beyond vision missiles because of human rights violations, it is because US is committed to give the Israelis the upper hand In the middle east specially in this field and that is why they refused to upgrade Egyptian old f16s and refuse to provide sophisticated air to air and air to surface missiles
Well maybe the US can get all the intel on the Chinese fighter, maybe get their hands on one and examine it. But it will be something to see what Prez Trump has to say to Egypt, especially with their joining BRICS.
Exactly, it got to the point where they prevented the return of several helicopters that were undergoing routine maintenance in the United States in the midst of the war on terrorism in Sinai, so Egypt responded by dispensing with the helicopters and obtaining Russian Kamov helicopters. In the end, what did the United States expect to happen when it did that!!
There is also the open technology transfer, that China has with these buyer nations, in the long run it is a better buy especially when your platform has PL-15, PL-17 and the TL-20
I think you guys are missing the point here. Egypt obviously wants to have a military that doesn't come with strings attached from the US. Having equipment from both factions of the new cold war gives them a lot more freedom to act according to their own wishes. If they get in a hot war with Israel China will keep the support coming.
@@jeffk464I suspect the modernized j-10 is also kind of a monkey model, given that the chinese have the j-20 and j-35 in service. But imho, that only strengthens your argument: if you want to keep your independence, and you can only get monkey models, you at least want all the monkey models you can get. Rafales, f-16, j-10,...
Another view: IF Egypt fight against Isreal, the J10 will be a reliable weapon while F16 might be locked by the US and their US missiles will be embargo
I mean if Europe doesn’t want to give Egypt meteors for their rafales & the US doesn’t want to give Egypt Aim-120s but China & Russia are willing to give you FoX 3 capabilities then it’s a no brainer to make the switch. Egypt made a good choice. I would do the same.
Egypt wants to go to war of Ethiopia in both the US and Europe are trying to prevent this from taking place. We’ve seen this pivot before when Egypt and Arab allies attacked Israel.
You should never sell your good stuff to potential enemies. I don’t trust Egypt as far as I can spit. Same with 99% of that region, and It’s all unstable at the best of times.
@@GazzaBoo Don't worry, no one outside of your vassal states trust the US either. And whichever "trust" you have over them, is just subversion and coercion, usually lasts for a couple of decades before their own populations turn against you. Such is the fate of vassal states, enjoy the perceived superiority while it lasts though.
@chillxxx241 If a nation beside you is threatening total control over your only major water supply what would you do? Egypt is only doing what is logical.
Egypt’s F-16s are probably the least capable in the world, apart from perhaps Venezuela. The US has consistently refused to upgrade them, so it’s hardly surprising that Egypt is shopping elsewhere.
because israel commanded the US a "NO" to a US tech capable Egypt air force on their borders. So other nations will step in and Egypt will rightly choose those to acquire such capable air force. We simply need to get rid of Aipac and others like them. It is costing us many billions each and every year...Not even mentioning how we look like fools to the rest of the world.
The older F-16A/B versions total 30 Aircraft in operational service are outdated but Egypt has also F-16C/D block 40 and 52 total 160 Aircraft in operational service.
Beyond the air to air capabilities that J-10 will bring, people are forgetting the significant number of PGMs the J-10 can carry. Supersonic anti ship missiles, long range JDAM type bombs, HARM missiles, air to surface cruise missiles, etc. These are types of munitions the US would never sell to Egypt
The J-10CE is better than the F16 Egypt has in basically every way people need to realize f16 is a decades old plane there is a big difference between a f16A block 10 and F16V block 70 J10CE has Fox 3, HMS, AESA Radar, Modern Material/engine, Modern Ir missile F16A MLU egypt has no Fox 3, no HMS, PD radar not PESA or AESA, Aim9M which are one gen behind and the worst of all Aim7M which has less range than AIm120 or PL15 must maintain Radar lock entire duration of tracking, no datalink so if you lose lock anytime during that launch you lose the missile, can only carry 2 on a F16 like they said a J10CE can carry 4 Pl15
@@MrWhiskers65 this is stupid logic ok what about info for the f16 from who USA ? you must be out of your mind to think a almost 50 year old f16C is as good as a jet built in the last few years
J10 is much better in terms of techs, but most importantly J10 is without political interference but if you get a F16 or anything from America you have to be willing to be a “pet dog” nation .
China does have anything better especially in the military area than the US. All their jets are from stolen US military designs and tech not to mention this could just be Egypt’s was of using this to get what it really wants from the west.
Not trying to "both sides" here, but you would have to be stunningly naive to think anyone could make a long term arms supply agreement - with China of all places - "without political interference."
Do to Israel. Israel opposes Egypt from getting the AIM-120 and the more updated capable missiles. So truth be told no one can blame Egypt, when they requested the more updated/capable version of the system just cause of a fear of your next door neighbor. Side Note: no one would rather have the AIM-7 over the AIM-120.
It's not just that Israel opposes it. The US has passed a law forbidding any military sale that might challenge Israel's qualitative superiority in the region. They couldn't sell missiles that are just as good as the ones Israel has even if they wanted to, unless they got around that law somehow.
Of course the Israel and US would oppose selling AIM-120s and any other capable weapon. What do you expect? Egypt tried to wipe out Israel before. ONe of the birthplace of extreme Islamism is Egypt. The Muslim brotherhood took over the egypt few years back and tried to make egypt and Islamic state. So we just give everything they demand with this kind of history and current behaviour toward Israel ?
It's not just an agreement, Congress has passed legislation against exporting the same technological level of weapons to nearby Arab countries, in order to maintain Israel's qualitative edge.
Sorta. Its an agreement with itself, enshrined in law that Israel must be given a qualitive edge. Bizarre, inherently escalatory and inherently contradictory to the ostensible justification for providing arms to multiple rival states; i.e maintain balance of power to prevent war.
@@Hypernefelos lol they can have what ever they want at the end of the day its the pilot behind the stick that matters…pakistani pilots have shot israelis down in the past with a mig21, without losing any of theirs…so israel can bully its useless arab nations but once they fight someone with the same training and capable pilots they shyt themselves…btw after the pakistanis shot them down they requested US not to bring them in red flag exercises which also involve them or if they do they need the full details of those specific pilots ahahaha
US and Europe refused to allow Egypt to have BVR missiles. It's an obvious choice to go with Chinese or even Russian fighter jets once the West refused upgrade and allow acquisition for BVR missiles
Was wondering if you'd tell the truth. It's not about human rights violations, the US doesn't care about that. They can't allow Egypt to have air superiority over Israel. So the US told France, they can buy the Rafales, but not the Meteor. They have a French fleet of training jets now considering most encounter would be BVR. The US is playing the board. Making sure power is maintained where they want it.
The last time I loaded AIM-7’s was on Eagles in the mid 90’s, in a mixed load with AIM-120’s and AIM-9’s. The last time I saw a Sparrow was on Navy Super Hornets at Key West in 2009. I was surprised they carried them.
Another main reason is getting a fighter jet with BVR missiles - The Egyptian air to air missiles are short ranged, old and in a dogfight as a pilot you need to keep locked on your target till it hits - while your target will fire and AIM-120 fire and forget, which will lead the Egyptian pilot to break the lock to avoid the incoming missile.
It should. Not because the J-10 is better (which it is anyway) but because the U.S. won’t even release AMRAAM or any other advanced weapon for the Egyptian F-16s
As someone who has been doing businesses in China and Asia for many years, the stark contrasts between how US is doing its military businesses and China is all very clear. US is using their military tech leverage to coerce and enforce its will on the buying countries, normally with the “democracy” facades and/or something else in return, in most cases in the realms of geopolitics. While the Chinese negotiations are very different, it’s the opposite of what has been taught in western education negotiation skills courses, actually Japanese is also very similar to the Chinese but I think the influence of Americans in their culture has changed that negotiation tactics.
US would never sell Egypt the good weapons since they are right next to Israel actually the US refuses to sell the good weapons to almost any allies accept Israel. I think all the NATO allies even are limited to the AIM-120 C. Some only ever got the B version. All those F-16's the benelux nations gave to Ukraine were that real old old stuff. That's why they were really nothing more than missile trucks.
Canada, Australia have purchased AIM-120D-3 missiles and 5 days ago Holland's buy was approved. The Ukraine F-16s are old, but have gone through upgrades, but I doubt they'll ever get AIM-120D or D-3 missiles though the export market AIM-120C-8 are possible.
@@hoghogwild that's interesting. the c-7 is pretty damn good too as you know and and I think I read some NATO partners now are scheduled to get them which is much ebtter than what they had.
@@homurseempsone154 Legacy D continues to receive software updates and D3 has future updates scheduled. C-8 apparently is the Export version of the D. Both the C-8 and the D3 feature new components that will make future updates easier and cheaper. Last year Germany priced 969 C-8 units and 12 guidance sections and training aids for $2.9 billion.
It’s not just the US refuses to upgrade Egyptian f-16 They block sending spare parts every now and then Also they control the Egyptian f-16 codes Not to mention the price tag Basically there is absolutely no reason for egypt to keep them in service
@ The F-16 typically requires around 2,000 to 3,000 spare parts for routine maintenance and operations. This number can vary based on mission requirements and aircraft age. You only need one missing part to ground the jet
@mfetto yes but also china provide support to produce rest of spears PLUSE we create stock to make aircraft air wealthy until end of life also don't forget f-16 cost much higher than J-10CE
@@rogerthat4545The ones exported to Egypt are without modern avionics and Amrams. The us also denied them the f15 multiple times because of Israeli objections. So now Egypt went to Rafales, mig 29s and j10s, rumors about manufacturing the j35s as well.
@@rogerthat4545 They can carry lower armament in terms of capacity as well as quality than other F16 counterparts. In addition, most likely the same applies for Pakistani F 16s. There are some reports from blogs where Pakistani pilots were commenting that the F16s exported outside the US have technology that allows them to never lock on US aircraft and will always be seen as a friend in the (friend or Foe targeting system). This is something that i couldn't find evidence for, but i personally did not completely dismiss it as it seems likely and possible. For example, no country involved in the F35 program has the source codes for the avionics/radar software that the fighter relies heavily on. Some rumors say Israel and/or Uk are the only exception. Here is a link for the info: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II_procurement
Didnt the Saudi F-16 lose to Pakistani J-10 in training combat scenario not too long ago? Also Egyptians would pick J-10 because they will have latest BVR weaponry which the EU and USA wont approve with their jets so its a no brainer and the best move Egypt can do, respect for that! Correction: it was Qatars Eurofighter Typhoon which lost 0-9 against Pakistani J-10 not F-16 which is also funny because Typhoons are regarded as superior to F-16 and western NAFO bots call the J-10s "Typhoons from TEMU"
I don't think US gave Egypt any other option. They sold them F-16s that were basically engine and airframes and the Egyptians need combat jets and not parade jets. That is why many countries used to by Soviet jets; even if they were not as good as US jets, they were far better than the US jets the US was willing to sell them. Now that Russia is out of the equation unless you want to break appart with the US, China is your only option since all other western countries will follow US directions.
And yet we wonder why the "friendly" countries in the middle east still feel alienated by the US and NATO. Egypt is one Arab nation we should keep super strong relations with. They have had peace for years with Israel and proven to be reliable allies that we should be keeping closer rather than pushing away.
@@larrybremer4930 Bullshit. Morocco, Saudi, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, Oman, Kuwait are much more stable and trusted than Egypt. Egypt is a Iranian and Turkish lap dog willing to bite Israel at any moment.
I would take anything over US things, not because they are bad, but because we would give you the worst things possible and overprice them, for example, the US gave Iraq an F16C block 52 with Aim-9L and no Aim-120, they gave us a missile from the 70s.
Once you read “Viper Pilot” and his experience instructing Egyptian pilots, you’ll care much less about what they fly. The pilots are just connected rich guys who fly for prestige. It’s more of a club than an Air Force.
They are trying to change that, if im not mistaken this purchase is a step towards that. But its still a long process. They will need to change their military culture which takes time.
Connected yes, rich? I highly doubt that unless they come from a rich family, which many of them indeed do, but they are defintely not rich from their government job
Not just that. It's IFF software doesn't allow them engage targets they want, but the ones US allow them. They learned a lesson from Jordanians. Jordanuan AF F-16s can not engage Israeli planes and they can't do anything about it. Egiptians have learned their lesson.
And Gonky The Admin Video Used To Work As Boeing Instructor For RMAF Never Believe,That Malaysia F/A 18 D Are Downgrade Version Compare To Little Israel Singapore Singapore AIM 120 can fire up to 120 Kilometers Malaysia AIM 120 Can Fire Up To 87 Kilometers
I have a friend from Pakistan and is connected to some Pakistani airforce pilots, and they tell him that the J10C is a better aircraft than the F16, and Pakistan has both. Pakistani pilots are good, so I would consider their opinion. At the end of the day, it's all about the electronic warfare systems, avionics and weapons installed on the planes, and in that regard, the US is still ahead of everyone else by miles, the closest in second might be Israel...
Pakistan doesn't have the latest variants of the F-16. The J-10C, while better than the block 52s, is roughly in a spot between the block 60 and block 70 aircraft, where it is better/as capable as the former, but probably worse than the latter.
@@Anony479 There are multiple nations that have the block 70. Taiwan, Greece, South Korea, Bulgaria, Turkey, Bahrain, and Slovakia all use the block 70/72.
I don't blame them. They want to diversify their air fleets and not be entirely dependent on the US alone for all their aircraft. Especially when the US can remotely shut down or brick the systems of all US fighters and US armaments that those US jets are equipped with that are sold to foreign nation buyers. The US also demands near complete control of all your nation's airspace and defense of your own airspace. US also has the most restrictions and condition on military stuff sold to clients, so it's never really yours even if you pay full price for it. US stuff is deliberately design to make clients deeply dependent on US military industrial complex and US govt willingness to sell to you...at heavy cost both in price and conditions.
Yeah and china isn't going to do the same thing... the country that tries to do that with a bunch of consumer electronics. How are so many people harping on the US and just pretends that china is an angel? How are you this thoroughly propagandized?
@dustinandrews3223 I mean, every exporter probably could as well though I don't think the Chinese have much incentive to as they are trying to make their deals sweeter to these countries to cut into the west's customers and regulations. Not to mention, the J-10 is probably not that advanced so there's little bother and that geopolitically, Egypt is no threat to China or its interest.
The overwhleming majority of Egyptian F-16s are Block 40. A bunch of them are Block 50/52. The reason the US isn't willing to give Egyptian AIM-120s is due to the policy dictating israel having a qualitative edge in the region.
Nerdy Viper history: Most of the newer F-16s are capable of using the Sparrow. Its basically all dictated politically. For example, Iraq has Block 52s, and theyre limited to Aim-7 and Aim-9 only. Egypt has a mix of F-16 generations (Theyve been buyers since 1980, around the time they sold some Migs to the US to exploit), including Block 52s, and I think they all are Aim-7 capable. The vipers history with the sparrow is weird. The USAF basically gimped the F-16 on purpose so congress wouldnt axe F-15 orders (There was a big push on cheap fighters in the early 80s, There was drama in this period of us selling Pakistan jets that didnt have BVR capability and look down shoot down radars during the Soviet war in Afghanistan), so up until like 1990 all Vipers were Aim-9 only, including the export models. In the early 1990s National Guard vipers got an update to include the Aim-7, bit this was actually an upgrade that Air Force vipers never got since AMRAAM was on the way. Whats makes this more silly is that all the while the airforce wouldnt put Sparrows on the f-16, they were using the F-16 as a test platform for AMRAAM (The first AMRAAM ever fired was fired by an F-16). but that upgrade then enabled Aim-7 to be a thing for future export deals, so some countries that we refused to sell AMRAAM too could get upgrades to support Sparrow (Egypt and Jordan initially I think. Maybe Taiwan too). Somewhat similarly, a lot of export customers vipers can carry Harpoons, something that to my knowledge US F-16s can't.
In the mid '80s the continental air defense Vipers that replaced the F-106 at Atlantic City (probably all of those assigned to ADC) were AIM-7 capable.
Egypt was handed 20 F16 block 50. Bahrain has F16 block 70. The US proposed to moderniza the F16 without the AIM120 with a price that was the same as a new J10C, so they chose J10C.
Egyptian F-16 fighters are basically less of "fighters" and more of air show demonstrators as they don't carry potent bvr missiles that are absolute necessity for modern air combat. Pakistan basically opened the market for j10c by becoming the first export user to induct it in it's largely western fleet!
Every country must replace F16s US black mailing and their terms and conditions regarding purchases of missles and ammo and most important the gradual modifications of aircraft needs US approvals and US senate and congress .
There is a long range geopolitical reason behind it as well. Pink elephant in the room is that eventually Israel will go after the ancient lands in Egypt, we already know which side we are on. We aren't going to give Egypt enhanced capability for that fight, that will eventually come. Also, Jordan is a strategic partner and also on the land repatriation list...and Saudi Arabia. They are already holding the territory in Lebanon and pushing in Syria.
Egypt understands that aswell, by the time Egypt will be equipped with the latest technology from russia/china and maybe European countries that will be willing to cooperate
China has also been looking to export its 5th gen stealth fighter, the J-35. I've read that Pakistan is in the process of acquiring it and I wouldn't be surprised if Egypt does the same too.
Too much restrictions, nations want to use freely what they buy or atlease get the support with what they buy, not no one foot in one foot out business.
The only reason the US cant sell modern systems to at least 30 nations is Israel. Human rights violations have never been an issue for US foreign policy. No, it’s your bosses that have told you what you can sell.
@ Months now everyone including Mayors and Governor panic about the drones, they should ask Iran for help to bring down the drone safely like they did with the US reapers drone
An ad shows up "Choice" so its their choice and money its not even your money so respect their choice because that's what you get if you sell an outdated ones.
As now the Egyptian defense ministry said that most f-16s will be for ground support role in the next 5 years and Rafale will carry the air defense with the news types of Russian and Chinese Jets We might actually sell a lot of f-16s for Sudan and Libya like what we did with f-7 and mig-21 when we retired them in the 2000s
@Jade-Roller we learned the hard way that no matter the number of fighters we have, Israel will have the same and the more advanced In 1973, all fighters that's Israel lost to SAMs get replaced from the US inventory within 10 days until we find foreign aircraft that match f-35 we will be in the same circle
@@anubisRN555 Egypt already increase military relation with Chinese and franch for new fighter patches don't forget 54 Rafale even local upgrade for f-16 by 2027 J-35A WILL BE AVAILABLE EVEN J-20 ON CARD
FYI for anyone wondering, Egypt operates 1-2 squadrons of block 50-52 F16s they use as aggressors and in previously performed surgical strike missions all of which as well as several squadrons of 40-42 F16s have to suffer from the outdated weaponry however these f16s wont be replaced due to them being recently acquired its the older models only which will be replaced
Egypt develops old fighters without concern for America's approval, in cooperation with other countries. America is in consideration, and Egypt buys the latest. Egypt has taught the world the diversity of weapons sources.
the egyptian have block 50 as well but the prob is the Egyptian f 16 lack a true bvr capability As the U.S never provided them bvr missilles .......the j 10 comes with long range bvr missiles n easa radar.....so choosing the j10c over a downgraded f 16 is a no brainer
Could it be that it has something to do with the weapon system not willing to arm itself without a code being inserted into it. that needs to be delivered by the United States every time they fly. that's something the Chinese don't request. you can do what you want with that aircraft. Russian aircraft also possessed the same system. as the United States. they will prohibit the aircraft being used against the Russian Federation. lock out code export versions. and the F-35 has the same system the Netherlands is not able to use the aircraft against the United States the interface will lock up automatically.
As far as I have read, some early US F-16As that were used for air defense were fitted to carry sparrows. Their radars had to be modified to provide provide guidance to the missile. This was because they needed to replace the aircraft they were replacing urgently and they were a stop gap .
As an Egyptian pilot (not military), Egyptian Air Force buying the J-10 is more political than a sound buy. Egypt already has Rafael and Mig-29, so we can just buy more of the same fighters. The problem is always avionics, integration within the air defence network, training, and fighting philosophy. Egypt also has Ah-64 fighting next to Ka-52 and a mix of everything. On a side note, you said "USA has more stringent laws that it follow", due to recent events and ICC issuing warrants for certain actors in the region, I would say the US is seen as complicit partner by providing weapons and fighters to the IAF, so this meme that says "are we the badeis" yes yes you are. I always make a difference between the US government and the people, like there are a lot of Americans fighting for human rights, and there is cooperation and government that wants to sell weapons and bring Jesus back.
Egypt is limited by the CAATSA sanctions to buy Russian stuff... All because of a $1.5B yearly grant. The J10c has the PL15 missile, aesa radar... I believe Egypt is wary of greater izreal
Thank you for another wonderful video. Can you please comment on Pak-China made JF-17 fighter planes, especially what you think of Block lll version. Pakistan has started to export their locally built fighter plane JF-17( with china's help), marketing it as 4.5 generation fighter plane and they are finding few buyers. Pakistan is planning to replace their eighty F-16s block 50(upgraded in 2022), with JF-17 and have already added 200 JF-17s to their fleet. Pakistan air force claims that the latest JF-17 Block III can fire BVR PL-15E missiles, with a range of 145 km. How would you rate JF-17?Is it really 4.5 gen plane?
Pakistan is using the JF-17 to replace the Mirage III, Mirage 5 and F-7 (Chinese licensed built MiG-21) and upgrading the JF-17 as needed with AESA radar, avionics & better weapons. Marketing dept can call it Gen 4.5 or Gen 4.5+++ or whatever it wants.
@alikhan-ri5ye 1) Not enough open source data to determine whether JF-17 Block III can replace F -16 Block 50. 2) Pakistan AF will probably replace the F-16s with stealth fighters. 3) Since this jet has Chinese radar & avionics, integration of the PL-15E missile maybe in progress.
@@cheekeongchan6605 Makes sense,Thanks buddy. Pakistan after buying chinese JF-17, and J-10C, are now going to induct atleast one squadron of J-35A into their fleet by 2027. It is unclear when and how many Turkish Kaans will Pakistan buy or when, so.. Is that a good idea to buy all fighter planes from the same country ?
This could have been a one-line sentence. America isn't selling, so Egypt is buying from China and no one can blame them. There. Saved you however many minutes this was.
If I am the Egyptian or Arab, it makes sense to buy the J10 to operate them in parallel with the F16, like Pakistan. They never know if their US made F16 will go off like those Lebanese pagers when they most need them.
@8:17 "Can not sell F16 to Egypt because of their you know human rights violations" From the mouth of American. Is it a joke? After seeing so many human rights are against by U.S. (Double standards?)
Poeple need to realize that arms exports are always also leverage for foreign affairs policy. Everybody who orders F16s are bying into US leverage on own foreign policy. That means if you have a F16 Fleet und you doing something US don't likes , the have leverage over you with spareparts deliverys. Thats true for any country btw. By a Leopard 2 and you basically bound yourself to German foreign policy rules. So they going with a chinese jet is showing that they want for some reason avoid greater US leverage on them.
@@ItsLofty101 Useless money? We're talking about a country that is on the brink of bankruptcy and is willing to sell their ports and land to foreign countries, which in my opinion hurts their sovereignty far more than some monkey model weapon system, so money is everything for Egypt right now.
@@finalzion84 Egypt doesn't receive them in the form of 'money', but rather in training and maintenance of the f-16 planes and such. So yes, it's not that important, especially when Egypt wants to replace these useless planes anyway.
@@ItsLofty101 Thats BS Currently, Egypt receives $1.3 billion per year from US military aid program that allows it to purchase U.S.-produced military hardware and technical assistance. In addition to that, Egypt does not have to pay in advance for US weapons systems, instead it can make financial liabilities that are covered by the future military aid from US. Egypt can ramp up the military aid up to $2.5 billion if it wants to purchase U.S.-produced military hardware. But who knows what's the weapons deal between Egypt and China includes. Aid, agreements and support for political agendas, full excess of the capabilities of the weapon system. Typically you don't buy just a jet. You are for at least for the next 30 years dependent on China to maintaining and updating your weapon system.
@@finalzion84Egypt can buy the crippled US planes because Israel owns its Congress via aipac. Even if given free, most countries won't want the disabled fighter jets with string attached
You know, I find it amusing that Egypt has to buy the Chinese built Israeli fighter because Israel is blocking Egypt from getting the newer versions of the F16.
We have tried to upgrade Egyptian F16's and sell them Block 70's for years. But they wouldn't commit. Boeing was literally briefing them monthly for F18's. I have a feeling the J20 is a result of Belt and Road initiatives. Hopefully, they will let us come and take a look.
Nothing to do with it, they always stay neutral and play the fence sitter. They would always buy from cheapest offer and the countries all take turns taking losses on deals to get sales away from each other. They aren't on a team any more than the Swiss. They really don't care about Brics it's just another store to shop at.
This is perfect... These f-16's will find their way to Ukraine via Romanian upgrade.. The Israeli's will gather GREAT intel regarding the J-10 and it's weaknesses.. win win ..
@@andrewlim7751 The Chinese are flooding the market with these..OK.. that's their economic right.. Our job is to now gather intel on these versions ..and how to defeat them..
I think Egypt is about to find out they get what they pay for. They should have seen if they could get the Gripen if they didn't want to go fully to America for jets. Or the Korean 4.5 or Turk 5th gen.
not a single time you talked about the fact that Egypt is the 2nd country to operate the french Rafale, they had 24, placed a new order of 30, total number 54 and I think the 2nd order is for the "F4 Standard", a version that is totally on the same table of any 5th gen fighter... So when you take this fact in account, it's easy to understand why they have decided to try the chinese version... it's simply because, why not ? they already have one of the best so "it costs nothing" to try the chinese version
@@Simulcrom Ok so I will tell Dassault, the manufacturer, that you know better than him and unlike what he explained to the french people, he failed the main feature of that version. What would we do without you? Thank you for your help ........
@@johndoe-cd9vt No, you should tell Dassault that France, Britain, and the US do not consider the Rafale 5th gen. If the Rafale is 5th gen, than the Eurofighter, Gripen, and F-15EX would also be 5th gen, which is an utter lie. This is nothing but a marketing ploy meant to get to sell aircraft. Clearly, those ignorant about the topic are falling for it...
@@Simulcrom France already have a full 5th gen project it's the NEURON drone (type on youtube). Dassault is working on the 6th gen now... Again, stop this propaganda of invisibility, Dassault doesn't care about what the US+UK consider as "5th gen" because he knows the last version of the Rafale can detect and track any plane with small signature by using different type of sensors (infrared etc). You must understand that when you do a full 5th gen you basically put all your eggs in the same basket "stealth" and for that you have to limit your plane in many aspects.. .there are multiple ways to exploit those weakness.
@@johndoe-cd9vt I'm glad that you ignored France despite me deliberately listing them. Frances opinion is similar, and since Dassault is a French manufacturer, you would think that their opinion holds some weight. Additionally, most modern nations have 5th gen drone developments. Australia, Russia, China, the US, Germany, Japan, the UK, and South Korea just to name a few all have similar programs, and many of them are farther along than NEURON. I mean, NEURON hasn't even had a test flight yet. Then their is 6th gen. I hope you realize that of the current 6th gen programs, FCAS is the furthest behind, right? NGAD and F/A-XX are the furthest ahead, followed by GCAP. In the end, the Rafale FR.4 is not demonstrably better than its rivals in the 4.5 gen range like the F-15EX, Tranche 4 Eurofighter, and the Gripen E, let alone a rival for the F-35. And again, you are only showing your limited understanding of this topic. The F-35 has a better radar, a better EW suite, and a better IRST than the Rafale. Heck, almost every single 4.5 gen aircraft has an IRST, those aern't advantages unique to the Rafale, they are commonplace. Then their is your lack of understanding of RCS. Based on Dassault advertising, you would know that they specifically mention the low-observable aspects they used to make the Rafale stealthier. This is a great achievement, with many figures putting at around 1 sqm on a clean configuration. On radar, it would be detected at over 5 times the distance the F-35 would be detected at. This is without factoring how the weapons would boost its RCS even further. There is a reason their 5th gen advertising inst't taken seriously by anybody.
A little interesting thing about Taiwanese viper is that its actually a block 15 fuselage with block 50 wing and horitonzal stabilizer with the avionics equivalent to the NATO MLU standard , and its actually the only nation that has equipped AN/ALQ-184 ECM pod other than the United States
@@anubisRN555 How many out of 200 would be needed for ground support? If 100 are used in that role that leaves 100 for potential sale. That could be quite a money maker for Egypt.
@maestromecanico597 in 2023 when most European countries give there f-16s to Ukraine there is discussion about what If we give ours too Till now Egyptian military said the Rafale will be for air defense and f-16s mostly for ground but not all of them some will be cut for parts as US didn't want to sell parts too to Egypt and some maybe end up for sale We did retired all mig-21 and f-7 in 2010 and most of them been bought by Libya and Sudan so maybe did this again
I'd be worried about China making a sweetheart deal to Egypt, then somehow thru financial trickery forcing Egypt to default on their buy here pay here deal. And instead of repoing them, cut another deal to station Chinese troops in Egypt and thru other shucking and jiving seize control of the Suez canal. They do the same things with building infrastructure in many struggling countries, owning ports and other critical assets to support their naval ambitions.
I mean the US has done the same for generations now. I see no problem with China using the same maneuvers. Atleast third world nations get good infrastructure out of these deals
No question the US hands over the kill switch to Israel for any equipment sold to Muslim countries so it makes a lot of sense to avoid buying from the US or EU.
useing this Logic all US fighter are shit because doller stores are from USA if you want to compare Plane quality you should be using actual companies that makes planes like Boeing
But will it turn into Tofu after a certain amount of time, just like the buildings, bridges, island reclamations, roads and other items we have seen on the news. Is the jet fuel real ? Did they get it out of the gutter like the gutter oil ?
Very true. Like their tofu Tiangong space station. Is it still up there or already broken apart? Are their astronauts stranded in space? I know of one space superpower that is having this problem because of their leaking tofu Starliner spacecraft.
To the guy on the left side... US is not refusing to provide modern aircrafts or beyond vision missiles because of human rights violations, it is because US is committed to give the Israelis the upper hand In the middle east specially in this field and that is why they refused to upgrade Egyptian old f16s and refuse to provide sophisticated air to air and air to surface missiles
You know why he doesn't say it
كنت لسا داخل اكتب كدة والله عشان اتحرق دمي
Well maybe the US can get all the intel on the Chinese fighter, maybe get their hands on one and examine it.
But it will be something to see what Prez Trump has to say to Egypt, especially with their joining BRICS.
The US cant upsad his master israel and his lord Netanyahu.
The j10 design is it self stolen from the us f16 what intel is u talking about
US taught Egypt to do "supply chain resilience".
So Egypt totally learnt that lesson.
Not a good buy when the seller decide how you could use what you buy from them. and they hold the kill switch if you do not obey.
@@oemcargps The United States often uses arms sales to coerce politics.
As do most countries. There is a lot of politics behind all arms sales.
Exactly, it got to the point where they prevented the return of several helicopters that were undergoing routine maintenance in the United States in the midst of the war on terrorism in Sinai, so Egypt responded by dispensing with the helicopters and obtaining Russian Kamov helicopters. In the end, what did the United States expect to happen when it did that!!
There is also the open technology transfer, that China has with these buyer nations, in the long run it is a better buy especially when your platform has PL-15, PL-17 and the TL-20
If Egypt can only have monkey model F-16s and equipped with Sparrow and no AMRAAMs, it's a no-brainer that they will go with the Chinese option.
They've also got 24+ Rafales in service with 54 ordered.
@@hoghogwild Their rafales can only be armed with MICA and not Meteor, which is also a monkey model.
I think you guys are missing the point here. Egypt obviously wants to have a military that doesn't come with strings attached from the US. Having equipment from both factions of the new cold war gives them a lot more freedom to act according to their own wishes. If they get in a hot war with Israel China will keep the support coming.
@@jeffk464 Yeah, this is more of geopolitics than neaty greety tech upgrades.
@@jeffk464I suspect the modernized j-10 is also kind of a monkey model, given that the chinese have the j-20 and j-35 in service.
But imho, that only strengthens your argument: if you want to keep your independence, and you can only get monkey models, you at least want all the monkey models you can get. Rafales, f-16, j-10,...
Cheers from Egypt 🇪🇬 , I can't wait to see it flies in the sky
it already did
The J10 is a great fighter. It gone thru many upgradings.
China supplied some helo's to an African nation, I forget which one, and when they got there they didn't even fly. Now that's quality control.
Another view: IF Egypt fight against Isreal, the J10 will be a reliable weapon while F16 might be locked by the US and their US missiles will be embargo
Like rigged beepers and walkie-talkies, they'll explode in mid air.
F16 could be national security threat 😂
I mean if Europe doesn’t want to give Egypt meteors for their rafales & the US doesn’t want to give Egypt Aim-120s but China & Russia are willing to give you FoX 3 capabilities then it’s a no brainer to make the switch. Egypt made a good choice. I would do the same.
Egypt wants to go to war of Ethiopia in both the US and Europe are trying to prevent this from taking place. We’ve seen this pivot before when Egypt and Arab allies attacked Israel.
You should never sell your good stuff to potential enemies. I don’t trust Egypt as far as I can spit. Same with 99% of that region, and It’s all unstable at the best of times.
@@chillxxx241Egypt needs weapons to defend themselves from is-real. Why by something that you can't use for defensive purposes?
@@GazzaBoo Don't worry, no one outside of your vassal states trust the US either. And whichever "trust" you have over them, is just subversion and coercion, usually lasts for a couple of decades before their own populations turn against you. Such is the fate of vassal states, enjoy the perceived superiority while it lasts though.
@chillxxx241
If a nation beside you is threatening total control over your only major water supply what would you do? Egypt is only doing what is logical.
Egypt’s F-16s are probably the least capable in the world, apart from perhaps Venezuela. The US has consistently refused to upgrade them, so it’s hardly surprising that Egypt is shopping elsewhere.
because israel commanded the US a "NO" to a US tech capable Egypt air force on their borders. So other nations will step in and Egypt will rightly choose those to acquire such capable air force. We simply need to get rid of Aipac and others like them. It is costing us many billions each and every year...Not even mentioning how we look like fools to the rest of the world.
The older F-16A/B versions total 30 Aircraft in operational service are outdated but Egypt has also F-16C/D block 40 and 52 total 160 Aircraft in operational service.
@@DMStaxi none with aesa radars nor bvr missiles.
Yes, but what's interesting is that they're considering the J-10 when they already have a fleet of Rafales.
@@Lexoka f3 rafales with no meteors and half range scalp-egs. might as well be sitting ducks.
Beyond the air to air capabilities that J-10 will bring, people are forgetting the significant number of PGMs the J-10 can carry. Supersonic anti ship missiles, long range JDAM type bombs, HARM missiles, air to surface cruise missiles, etc. These are types of munitions the US would never sell to Egypt
The J-10CE is better than the F16 Egypt has in basically every way people need to realize f16 is a decades old plane there is a big difference between a f16A block 10 and F16V block 70
J10CE has Fox 3, HMS, AESA Radar, Modern Material/engine, Modern Ir missile
F16A MLU egypt has no Fox 3, no HMS, PD radar not PESA or AESA, Aim9M which are one gen behind and the worst of all Aim7M which has less range than AIm120 or PL15 must maintain Radar lock entire duration of tracking, no datalink so if you lose lock anytime during that launch you lose the missile, can only carry 2 on a F16 like they said a J10CE can carry 4 Pl15
According to whom? China?
@@MrWhiskers65 cry harder😢😢😢
@@MrWhiskers65 this is stupid logic ok what about info for the f16 from who USA ? you must be out of your mind to think a almost 50 year old f16C is as good as a jet built in the last few years
@@R3llyman They refuse to accept the fact that China produces anything more capable than an F-4 lol
@@MrWhiskers65
Trust me 😂😂😂
The US is offering outdated F16 to Egypt. No brainer
..for more money too.
J10 is much better in terms of techs, but most importantly J10 is without political interference but if you get a F16 or anything from America you have to be willing to be a “pet dog” nation .
China does have anything better especially in the military area than the US. All their jets are from stolen US military designs and tech not to mention this could just be Egypt’s was of using this to get what it really wants from the west.
ask Pakistan. they know
CCP troll.
@@janremongalura5713he aint wrong
Not trying to "both sides" here, but you would have to be stunningly naive to think anyone could make a long term arms supply agreement - with China of all places - "without political interference."
Do to Israel. Israel opposes Egypt from getting the AIM-120 and the more updated capable missiles. So truth be told no one can blame Egypt, when they requested the more updated/capable version of the system just cause of a fear of your next door neighbor.
Side Note: no one would rather have the AIM-7 over the AIM-120.
It's not just that Israel opposes it. The US has passed a law forbidding any military sale that might challenge Israel's qualitative superiority in the region. They couldn't sell missiles that are just as good as the ones Israel has even if they wanted to, unless they got around that law somehow.
@@Hypernefelos The US continues to be Israel's little B*T&H.
@@HypernefelosNo doubt that law was pushed by the "dual-citizens" that hold office in both cambers of the US Congress.
Of course the Israel and US would oppose selling AIM-120s and any other capable weapon. What do you expect? Egypt tried to wipe out Israel before. ONe of the birthplace of extreme Islamism is Egypt. The Muslim brotherhood took over the egypt few years back and tried to make egypt and Islamic state. So we just give everything they demand with this kind of history and current behaviour toward Israel ?
@@Hypernefelos really shows just how much sway the Israelis have in American politics. AIPAC 666
Doesn't the US have an agreement with Israel not to sell versions of aircraft that are at the same level as Israel to "certain countries".
It's not just an agreement, Congress has passed legislation against exporting the same technological level of weapons to nearby Arab countries, in order to maintain Israel's qualitative edge.
Sorta. Its an agreement with itself, enshrined in law that Israel must be given a qualitive edge. Bizarre, inherently escalatory and inherently contradictory to the ostensible justification for providing arms to multiple rival states; i.e maintain balance of power to prevent war.
@@Hypernefelos lol they can have what ever they want at the end of the day its the pilot behind the stick that matters…pakistani pilots have shot israelis down in the past with a mig21, without losing any of theirs…so israel can bully its useless arab nations but once they fight someone with the same training and capable pilots they shyt themselves…btw after the pakistanis shot them down they requested US not to bring them in red flag exercises which also involve them or if they do they need the full details of those specific pilots ahahaha
Israel demands Congress men to do that for Israel. Otherwise, they won't get funding for re-election
lol! The United Stated Of Izrehell
PL15E was the Game changer
US and Europe refused to allow Egypt to have BVR missiles. It's an obvious choice to go with Chinese or even Russian fighter jets once the West refused upgrade and allow acquisition for BVR missiles
Was wondering if you'd tell the truth. It's not about human rights violations, the US doesn't care about that. They can't allow Egypt to have air superiority over Israel. So the US told France, they can buy the Rafales, but not the Meteor. They have a French fleet of training jets now considering most encounter would be BVR.
The US is playing the board. Making sure power is maintained where they want it.
No worries for Egypt, they are not stupid, and they do have choices, which are obviously equally good if not better than what you have.
Better than what we were prepared to sell...not better than the latest F-16s made for the USAF.
Yeah that's why they are going for the Chinese ones Egypt isn't even allowed to have meteors for their rafale@@markg4459
Pl 15 is said to have superior range then amraam already, later variants will either match or surpass even the best amraam
Are you sure they’re not stupid. 😂
The last time I loaded AIM-7’s was on Eagles in the mid 90’s, in a mixed load with AIM-120’s and AIM-9’s. The last time I saw a Sparrow was on Navy Super Hornets at Key West in 2009. I was surprised they carried them.
Another main reason is getting a fighter jet with BVR missiles - The Egyptian air to air missiles are short ranged, old and in a dogfight as a pilot you need to keep locked on your target till it hits - while your target will fire and AIM-120 fire and forget, which will lead the Egyptian pilot to break the lock to avoid the incoming missile.
It should. Not because the J-10 is better (which it is anyway) but because the U.S. won’t even release AMRAAM or any other advanced weapon for the Egyptian F-16s
As someone who has been doing businesses in China and Asia for many years, the stark contrasts between how US is doing its military businesses and China is all very clear. US is using their military tech leverage to coerce and enforce its will on the buying countries, normally with the “democracy” facades and/or something else in return, in most cases in the realms of geopolitics. While the Chinese negotiations are very different, it’s the opposite of what has been taught in western education negotiation skills courses, actually Japanese is also very similar to the Chinese but I think the influence of Americans in their culture has changed that negotiation tactics.
This is just orientalism.
US would never sell Egypt the good weapons since they are right next to Israel actually the US refuses to sell the good weapons to almost any allies accept Israel. I think all the NATO allies even are limited to the AIM-120 C. Some only ever got the B version. All those F-16's the benelux nations gave to Ukraine were that real old old stuff. That's why they were really nothing more than missile trucks.
Canada, Australia have purchased AIM-120D-3 missiles and 5 days ago Holland's buy was approved. The Ukraine F-16s are old, but have gone through upgrades, but I doubt they'll ever get AIM-120D or D-3 missiles though the export market AIM-120C-8 are possible.
@@hoghogwild whats the difference between the c8 and D models?
@@hoghogwild that's interesting. the c-7 is pretty damn good too as you know and
and I think I read some NATO partners now are scheduled to get them which is much ebtter than what they had.
@@homurseempsone154 Legacy D continues to receive software updates and D3 has future updates scheduled. C-8 apparently is the Export version of the D. Both the C-8 and the D3 feature new components that will make future updates easier and cheaper. Last year Germany priced 969 C-8 units and 12 guidance sections and training aids for $2.9 billion.
@@homurseempsone154range and seeker upgrades
It’s not just the US refuses to upgrade Egyptian f-16
They block sending spare parts every now and then
Also they control the Egyptian f-16 codes
Not to mention the price tag
Basically there is absolutely no reason for egypt to keep them in service
Egypt produce 300 price for f-16 spare parts locally
@ The F-16 typically requires around 2,000 to 3,000 spare parts for routine maintenance and operations. This number can vary based on mission requirements and aircraft age.
You only need one missing part to ground the jet
@mfetto yes but also china provide support to produce rest of spears PLUSE we create stock to make aircraft air wealthy until end of life also don't forget f-16 cost much higher than J-10CE
Better deal than acquiring toothless f-16
Which F-16 is "toothless"?
Base model from 1980s tech
@@rogerthat4545The ones exported to Egypt are without modern avionics and Amrams. The us also denied them the f15 multiple times because of Israeli objections. So now Egypt went to Rafales, mig 29s and j10s, rumors about manufacturing the j35s as well.
@@Ososmd so these aircraft are incapable of deploying weapon systems??
@@rogerthat4545 They can carry lower armament in terms of capacity as well as quality than other F16 counterparts. In addition, most likely the same applies for Pakistani F 16s. There are some reports from blogs where Pakistani pilots were commenting that the F16s exported outside the US have technology that allows them to never lock on US aircraft and will always be seen as a friend in the (friend or Foe targeting system). This is something that i couldn't find evidence for, but i personally did not completely dismiss it as it seems likely and possible. For example, no country involved in the F35 program has the source codes for the avionics/radar software that the fighter relies heavily on. Some rumors say Israel and/or Uk are the only exception. Here is a link for the info:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II_procurement
Didnt the Saudi F-16 lose to Pakistani J-10 in training combat scenario not too long ago? Also Egyptians would pick J-10 because they will have latest BVR weaponry which the EU and USA wont approve with their jets so its a no brainer and the best move Egypt can do, respect for that!
Correction: it was Qatars Eurofighter Typhoon which lost 0-9 against Pakistani J-10 not F-16 which is also funny because Typhoons are regarded as superior to F-16 and western NAFO bots call the J-10s "Typhoons from TEMU"
There’s no such thing as Saudi F-16.
UAE f16
Pakistani pilots are just superior and they have more combat experience then Saudis
Saudi Arabia does not fly the F16.
@@MattyClivingthedream yeah they have F 15s'
I don't think US gave Egypt any other option. They sold them F-16s that were basically engine and airframes and the Egyptians need combat jets and not parade jets. That is why many countries used to by Soviet jets; even if they were not as good as US jets, they were far better than the US jets the US was willing to sell them. Now that Russia is out of the equation unless you want to break appart with the US, China is your only option since all other western countries will follow US directions.
Egypt not accept and new deal for fighter and tanks frigate since 2013 we go away USA weapons in last 10 years
Egypt's going to buy them for sure , it is about time we do!
And yet we wonder why the "friendly" countries in the middle east still feel alienated by the US and NATO. Egypt is one Arab nation we should keep super strong relations with. They have had peace for years with Israel and proven to be reliable allies that we should be keeping closer rather than pushing away.
I dont think it is a stable country...see what happend after the "arab spring"
@@jamjinn786 Of all the Arab countries they don't get much more stable than Egypt.
@@larrybremer4930 Bullshit. Morocco, Saudi, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, Oman, Kuwait are much more stable and trusted than Egypt. Egypt is a Iranian and Turkish lap dog willing to bite Israel at any moment.
@@shmeckle666 good. they don't want to be erdogan's lapdog.
egypt is not an arab country. it is not in arabia.
According to PAF pilots the J10C is noticeably superior to the Block 52+ F16s.
Yap in every metric J10C variant is superior to F16Blk52 .
F16Blk60+ will be comparable to J10C (both AESA )
I would take anything over US things, not because they are bad, but because we would give you the worst things possible and overprice them, for example, the US gave Iraq an F16C block 52 with Aim-9L and no Aim-120, they gave us a missile from the 70s.
We don’t give Egypt long range engagement ability, that is the only reason
Once you read “Viper Pilot” and his experience instructing Egyptian pilots, you’ll care much less about what they fly. The pilots are just connected rich guys who fly for prestige. It’s more of a club than an Air Force.
That describes a lot of middle range countries. Used to live in Thailand and their pilot corps gave off those vibes immensely.
They are trying to change that, if im not mistaken this purchase is a step towards that. But its still a long process. They will need to change their military culture which takes time.
I also taught pilots in Egypt, and they were good people, but poorly funded. They struggled is the nicest thing I can say.
@@Blackbirdz2000 does Egypt still run off a Soviet doctrine when it comes to their military?
Connected yes, rich? I highly doubt that unless they come from a rich family, which many of them indeed do, but they are defintely not rich from their government job
It seems that no one will talk about it - so here I go; the reason why US will not sell modern planes and missiles to Egypt is because of Israel...
Egypt has block 15's, 32's, 40's, and 52's. I would imagine they were limited to the AIM-7's.
Not just that. It's IFF software doesn't allow them engage targets they want, but the ones US allow them. They learned a lesson from Jordanians. Jordanuan AF F-16s can not engage Israeli planes and they can't do anything about it.
Egiptians have learned their lesson.
@@fifi23o5I would definitely go with China based on that alone.
That's the peoblem with having external lobby controlling US foreign policy. Their interest is never aligned with US.
@@fifi23o5 source or you just pulled it out of your ass?
And Gonky The Admin Video Used To Work As Boeing Instructor For RMAF Never Believe,That Malaysia F/A 18 D Are Downgrade Version Compare To Little Israel Singapore
Singapore AIM 120 can fire up to 120 Kilometers
Malaysia AIM 120 Can Fire Up To 87 Kilometers
I have a friend from Pakistan and is connected to some Pakistani airforce pilots, and they tell him that the J10C is a better aircraft than the F16, and Pakistan has both. Pakistani pilots are good, so I would consider their opinion. At the end of the day, it's all about the electronic warfare systems, avionics and weapons installed on the planes, and in that regard, the US is still ahead of everyone else by miles, the closest in second might be Israel...
Pakistan doesn't have the latest variants of the F-16. The J-10C, while better than the block 52s, is roughly in a spot between the block 60 and block 70 aircraft, where it is better/as capable as the former, but probably worse than the latter.
@@SimulcromNobody has the latest which is Blk 70 in service. Blk 60 of the UAEAF is only marginally better than Blk-52 that Pakistan has.
@@Anony479 There are multiple nations that have the block 70. Taiwan, Greece, South Korea, Bulgaria, Turkey, Bahrain, and Slovakia all use the block 70/72.
I don't blame them. They want to diversify their air fleets and not be entirely dependent on the US alone for all their aircraft. Especially when the US can remotely shut down or brick the systems of all US fighters and US armaments that those US jets are equipped with that are sold to foreign nation buyers. The US also demands near complete control of all your nation's airspace and defense of your own airspace. US also has the most restrictions and condition on military stuff sold to clients, so it's never really yours even if you pay full price for it. US stuff is deliberately design to make clients deeply dependent on US military industrial complex and US govt willingness to sell to you...at heavy cost both in price and conditions.
The Chinese operate the same. Dont be naive.
Also, it is not required for the US to use your airspace. Thats literally just a lie
Sooooo, it's like Microsoft and Windows?
I'm positive the Chinese can do the exact same thing to these J-10s.
Yeah and china isn't going to do the same thing... the country that tries to do that with a bunch of consumer electronics. How are so many people harping on the US and just pretends that china is an angel? How are you this thoroughly propagandized?
@dustinandrews3223
I mean, every exporter probably could as well though I don't think the Chinese have much incentive to as they are trying to make their deals sweeter to these countries to cut into the west's customers and regulations.
Not to mention, the J-10 is probably not that advanced so there's little bother and that geopolitically, Egypt is no threat to China or its interest.
The overwhleming majority of Egyptian F-16s are Block 40. A bunch of them are Block 50/52.
The reason the US isn't willing to give Egyptian AIM-120s is due to the policy dictating israel having a qualitative edge in the region.
Nerdy Viper history: Most of the newer F-16s are capable of using the Sparrow. Its basically all dictated politically. For example, Iraq has Block 52s, and theyre limited to Aim-7 and Aim-9 only. Egypt has a mix of F-16 generations (Theyve been buyers since 1980, around the time they sold some Migs to the US to exploit), including Block 52s, and I think they all are Aim-7 capable.
The vipers history with the sparrow is weird. The USAF basically gimped the F-16 on purpose so congress wouldnt axe F-15 orders (There was a big push on cheap fighters in the early 80s, There was drama in this period of us selling Pakistan jets that didnt have BVR capability and look down shoot down radars during the Soviet war in Afghanistan), so up until like 1990 all Vipers were Aim-9 only, including the export models. In the early 1990s National Guard vipers got an update to include the Aim-7, bit this was actually an upgrade that Air Force vipers never got since AMRAAM was on the way. Whats makes this more silly is that all the while the airforce wouldnt put Sparrows on the f-16, they were using the F-16 as a test platform for AMRAAM (The first AMRAAM ever fired was fired by an F-16).
but that upgrade then enabled Aim-7 to be a thing for future export deals, so some countries that we refused to sell AMRAAM too could get upgrades to support Sparrow (Egypt and Jordan initially I think. Maybe Taiwan too). Somewhat similarly, a lot of export customers vipers can carry Harpoons, something that to my knowledge US F-16s can't.
this was an interesting read, appreciate your write up
In the mid '80s the continental air defense Vipers that replaced the F-106 at Atlantic City (probably all of those assigned to ADC) were AIM-7 capable.
Being AIM-7 capable doesn’t mean they were carried. What F-16s actually carried the AIM-7 operationally? US and foreign?
The US Nat’l Guard carried the Sparrow on the ADF variant. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_F-16_Fighting_Falcon_variants
@ … 270 Block 15 ADF variants? All for the Air Guard?
Egypt was handed 20 F16 block 50. Bahrain has F16 block 70. The US proposed to moderniza the F16 without the AIM120 with a price that was the same as a new J10C, so they chose J10C.
Egyptian F-16 fighters are basically less of "fighters" and more of air show demonstrators as they don't carry potent bvr missiles that are absolute necessity for modern air combat.
Pakistan basically opened the market for j10c by becoming the first export user to induct it in it's largely western fleet!
Every country must replace F16s US black mailing and their terms and conditions regarding purchases of missles and ammo and most important the gradual modifications of aircraft needs US approvals and US senate and congress .
Much better and of course not Overpriced..like all American..
Please share your thoughts on the Chinese-Pakistani JF-17.
Maintenance is crap and the Pakistanis were mad that the Chinese radars didn’t pick up missiles fired in the last round of BS.
@@nsatodaythanks for posting bs
Great project for Pakistan to learn to develop capability and lays the groundwork’s for the PF-X
@@nsatodaywhen did that happened?😂 never heard about it before
@@Ncs-Charlie guess you don’t read the news. 😂
There is a long range geopolitical reason behind it as well.
Pink elephant in the room is that eventually Israel will go after the ancient lands in Egypt, we already know which side we are on. We aren't going to give Egypt enhanced capability for that fight, that will eventually come. Also, Jordan is a strategic partner and also on the land repatriation list...and Saudi Arabia. They are already holding the territory in Lebanon and pushing in Syria.
Egypt understands that aswell, by the time Egypt will be equipped with the latest technology from russia/china and maybe European countries that will be willing to cooperate
Not a choice. A must.
Biggest problem with USA is the attached strings and political pressures
Biggest problem is the dual citizen with its lobby that owns Congress
What is the use of F16 without BVRs? Egypt doesn't have any other option .
I think Egypt are entitled to buy what they want and its not anyone problem
I think the main reason is to replace F16 with J10 American not providing them with BVR
China has also been looking to export its 5th gen stealth fighter, the J-35. I've read that Pakistan is in the process of acquiring it and I wouldn't be surprised if Egypt does the same too.
Too much restrictions, nations want to use freely what they buy or atlease get the support with what they buy, not no one foot in one foot out business.
I'm from Egypt and I love the video and respect to the point of view
The only reason the US cant sell modern systems to at least 30 nations is Israel. Human rights violations have never been an issue for US foreign policy. No, it’s your bosses that have told you what you can sell.
Egypt doesn't have and can't get AIM-120 and that is the main problem. If China gives them J-10, they can count on longer range fox-1
It’s a good and capable choice for Egypt, they should move away from watching too much Hollywood movies and research the real scenario
Where did you do your "research"?
@ CNN,MSBC
@ Months now everyone including Mayors and Governor panic about the drones, they should ask Iran for help to bring down the drone safely like they did with the US reapers drone
@@achekholbeckal889 wtf are you babbling about???
An ad shows up "Choice" so its their choice and money its not even your money so respect their choice because that's what you get if you sell an outdated ones.
As now the Egyptian defense ministry said that most f-16s will be for ground support role in the next 5 years and Rafale will carry the air defense with the news types of Russian and Chinese Jets
We might actually sell a lot of f-16s for Sudan and Libya like what we did with f-7 and mig-21 when we retired them in the 2000s
Egypt have MIG-29M ARMED WITH R--77 ALSO FOR AIR DEFENSE ROLE
Egypt need new air fighters if they really want to stand equally at least against Israel, they need fighters like su 57 or su 35 or J 35
@Jade-Roller we learned the hard way that no matter the number of fighters we have, Israel will have the same and the more advanced
In 1973, all fighters that's Israel lost to SAMs get replaced from the US inventory within 10 days until we find foreign aircraft that match f-35 we will be in the same circle
@@anubisRN555 Egypt already increase military relation with Chinese and franch for new fighter patches don't forget 54 Rafale even local upgrade for f-16 by 2027 J-35A WILL BE AVAILABLE EVEN J-20 ON CARD
FYI for anyone wondering, Egypt operates 1-2 squadrons of block 50-52 F16s they use as aggressors and in previously performed surgical strike missions all of which as well as several squadrons of 40-42 F16s have to suffer from the outdated weaponry however these f16s wont be replaced due to them being recently acquired its the older models only which will be replaced
Egypt develops old fighters without concern for America's approval, in cooperation with other countries. America is in consideration, and Egypt buys the latest. Egypt has taught the world the diversity of weapons sources.
That begs the question what version/block model has been given to Ukraine?
Buying U.S. weapons means, it comes with a backlash. That's range is also depends on U.S.
the egyptian have block 50 as well but the prob is the Egyptian f 16 lack a true bvr capability As the U.S never provided them bvr missilles .......the j 10 comes with long range bvr missiles n easa radar.....so choosing the j10c over a downgraded f 16 is a no brainer
even a 3rd gen with fox 3 missiles would be better for air-air than something with only semi active missiles
All Americans equipment came with "back door" feature free. 😂😂
Could it be that it has something to do with the weapon system not willing to arm itself without a code being inserted into it. that needs to be delivered by the United States every time they fly. that's something the Chinese don't request. you can do what you want with that aircraft. Russian aircraft also possessed the same system. as the United States. they will prohibit the aircraft being used against the Russian Federation. lock out code export versions. and the F-35 has the same system the Netherlands is not able to use the aircraft against the United States the interface will lock up automatically.
How doesn't the maneuverability of the J-10 compare to the current F-16?
Better even new engine WS-10G HAVE 35000 LB TRUST
Do those come with Prime shipping?
Egypt only opted for Prime so they can watch Thursday Night Football.
As far as I have read, some early US F-16As that were used for air defense were fitted to carry sparrows. Their radars had to be modified to provide provide guidance to the missile. This was because they needed to replace the aircraft they were replacing urgently and they were a stop gap .
As an Egyptian pilot (not military), Egyptian Air Force buying the J-10 is more political than a sound buy.
Egypt already has Rafael and Mig-29, so we can just buy more of the same fighters. The problem is always avionics, integration within the air defence network, training, and fighting philosophy.
Egypt also has Ah-64 fighting next to Ka-52 and a mix of everything.
On a side note, you said "USA has more stringent laws that it follow", due to recent events and ICC issuing warrants for certain actors in the region, I would say the US is seen as complicit partner by providing weapons and fighters to the IAF, so this meme that says "are we the badeis" yes yes you are.
I always make a difference between the US government and the people, like there are a lot of Americans fighting for human rights, and there is cooperation and government that wants to sell weapons and bring Jesus back.
You mean the Ka-52?
Egypt is limited by the CAATSA sanctions to buy Russian stuff... All because of a $1.5B yearly grant. The J10c has the PL15 missile, aesa radar... I believe Egypt is wary of greater izreal
@bird.9346 Sorry ka-52 Nile crocodile, I was too lazy to go back and edit.
We also have the Hind and Gazelle 😁
@@WarWithInegypt with j10c then j35a and rafales will be a badass airforce
The Rafale is a good purchase, but without BVR missiles, it's usefulness is limited.
The US is governed by Israel so those planes can always be used as a bargaining tool for Israelis.
Thank you for another wonderful video.
Can you please comment on Pak-China made JF-17 fighter planes, especially what you think of Block lll version.
Pakistan has started to export their locally built fighter plane JF-17( with china's help), marketing it as 4.5 generation fighter plane and they are finding few buyers.
Pakistan is planning to replace their eighty F-16s block 50(upgraded in 2022), with JF-17 and have already added 200 JF-17s to their fleet.
Pakistan air force claims that the latest JF-17 Block III can fire BVR PL-15E missiles, with a range of 145 km.
How would you rate JF-17?Is it really 4.5 gen plane?
Pakistan is using the JF-17 to replace the Mirage III, Mirage 5 and F-7 (Chinese licensed built MiG-21) and upgrading the JF-17 as needed with AESA radar, avionics & better weapons. Marketing dept can call it Gen 4.5 or Gen 4.5+++ or whatever it wants.
@@cheekeongchan6605 Is JF-17 block lll, capable of replacing F-16 block 50?Can it really fire PL-15E?
@alikhan-ri5ye 1) Not enough open source data to determine whether JF-17 Block III can replace F -16 Block 50. 2) Pakistan AF will probably replace the F-16s with stealth fighters. 3) Since this jet has Chinese radar & avionics, integration of the PL-15E missile maybe in progress.
@@cheekeongchan6605
Makes sense,Thanks buddy.
Pakistan after buying chinese JF-17, and J-10C, are now going to induct atleast one squadron of J-35A into their fleet by 2027.
It is unclear when and how many Turkish Kaans will Pakistan buy or when, so..
Is that a good idea to buy all fighter planes from the same country ?
@@alikhan-ri5ye Does Turkey have its own engines and long-range air-to-air missiles, gallium nitride radars, and other important parts.
J-10 is not bad jet. Its very good jet .. from India
They are
This could have been a one-line sentence.
America isn't selling, so Egypt is buying from China and no one can blame them.
There. Saved you however many minutes this was.
If I am the Egyptian or Arab, it makes sense to buy the J10 to operate them in parallel with the F16, like Pakistan.
They never know if their US made F16 will go off like those Lebanese pagers when they most need them.
@8:17 "Can not sell F16 to Egypt because of their you know human rights violations" From the mouth of American. Is it a joke? After seeing so many human rights are against by U.S. (Double standards?)
Well said! Greetings
Poeple need to realize that arms exports are always also leverage for foreign affairs policy.
Everybody who orders F16s are bying into US leverage on own foreign policy.
That means if you have a F16 Fleet und you doing something US don't likes , the have leverage over you with spareparts deliverys.
Thats true for any country btw. By a Leopard 2 and you basically bound yourself to German foreign policy rules.
So they going with a chinese jet is showing that they want for some reason avoid greater US leverage on them.
It's also because the US and France don't give them long range missiles. All their F-16s are stuck using Sparrows and early block AIM-9s.
@8:15 To guarantee the US’s 51st “state of Israel”’s air superiority in the region. Nothing more and nothing less.
Good job Egypt ❤❤ Carry on ❤❤
There goes over 1 billion dollar annually from the US for military aid to Egypt.
Useless money that does nothing.
@@ItsLofty101 Useless money?
We're talking about a country that is on the brink of bankruptcy and is willing to sell their ports and land to foreign countries, which in my opinion hurts their sovereignty far more than some monkey model weapon system, so money is everything for Egypt right now.
@@finalzion84 Egypt doesn't receive them in the form of 'money', but rather in training and maintenance of the f-16 planes and such. So yes, it's not that important, especially when Egypt wants to replace these useless planes anyway.
@@ItsLofty101 Thats BS
Currently, Egypt receives $1.3 billion per year from US military aid program that allows it to purchase U.S.-produced military hardware and technical assistance.
In addition to that, Egypt does not have to pay in advance for US weapons systems, instead it can make financial liabilities that are covered by the future military aid from US. Egypt can ramp up the military aid up to $2.5 billion if it wants to purchase U.S.-produced military hardware.
But who knows what's the weapons deal between Egypt and China includes. Aid, agreements and support for political agendas, full excess of the capabilities of the weapon system.
Typically you don't buy just a jet.
You are for at least for the next 30 years dependent on China to maintaining and updating your weapon system.
@@finalzion84Egypt can buy the crippled US planes because Israel owns its Congress via aipac.
Even if given free, most countries won't want the disabled fighter jets with string attached
You know, I find it amusing that Egypt has to buy the Chinese built Israeli fighter because Israel is blocking Egypt from getting the newer versions of the F16.
That's like having the ability to buy the Beretta 92F, yet choosing a Tarus instead.
Egypt just got the Lavi! Smooth move Israel!
We have tried to upgrade Egyptian F16's and sell them Block 70's for years. But they wouldn't commit. Boeing was literally briefing them monthly for F18's. I have a feeling the J20 is a result of Belt and Road initiatives. Hopefully, they will let us come and take a look.
We can all thank Israel for selling China the Lavi!
But no thank you from Israel for the billions in aid. Keep sending
Egypt is now a BRICS Plus country, so it makes sense that they plan on switching to the J-10.
Nothing to do with it, they always stay neutral and play the fence sitter. They would always buy from cheapest offer and the countries all take turns taking losses on deals to get sales away from each other. They aren't on a team any more than the Swiss. They really don't care about Brics it's just another store to shop at.
Looking at Iran and the F14 I can see why
America overpriced junk is facing competition....this is what it is...
This is perfect... These f-16's will find their way to Ukraine via Romanian upgrade.. The Israeli's will gather GREAT intel regarding the J-10 and it's weaknesses.. win win ..
They Israel doesn't NEED intel on the J-10. They DESIGNED the fucking thing.
Nice 😊
The Chinese called it "Export" version, they're meant for the Americans, probably another Gordon Chang fool you moment. 😂😂
@@andrewlim7751 The Chinese are flooding the market with these..OK.. that's their economic right.. Our job is to now gather intel on these versions ..and how to defeat them..
This is all a part of the aligning of prophecy for the Gog-Magog war.
I think Egypt is about to find out they get what they pay for. They should have seen if they could get the Gripen if they didn't want to go fully to America for jets. Or the Korean 4.5 or Turk 5th gen.
They've got 24 Rafales with over 50 ordered.
Turkey offered last summer to Egypt to take part in their 5th Gen aircraft
All western products came with "back door" feature free, just check out the walkie talkie and pager of the Lebanons. 😂😂
American licensed engines and Egypt's human rights violations makes the deal with Sweden absolutely impossible.
@KolyanKolyanitch and the Swedish plane used a copy of American missiles so like south Africa, before Sweden, won't do a deal without US approval
not a single time you talked about the fact that Egypt is the 2nd country to operate the french Rafale, they had 24, placed a new order of 30, total number 54 and I think the 2nd order is for the "F4 Standard", a version that is totally on the same table of any 5th gen fighter... So when you take this fact in account, it's easy to understand why they have decided to try the chinese version... it's simply because, why not ? they already have one of the best so "it costs nothing" to try the chinese version
The F4 standard is not on par with 5th gen aircraft.
@@Simulcrom Ok so I will tell Dassault, the manufacturer, that you know better than him and unlike what he explained to the french people, he failed the main feature of that version. What would we do without you? Thank you for your help ........
@@johndoe-cd9vt No, you should tell Dassault that France, Britain, and the US do not consider the Rafale 5th gen. If the Rafale is 5th gen, than the Eurofighter, Gripen, and F-15EX would also be 5th gen, which is an utter lie. This is nothing but a marketing ploy meant to get to sell aircraft. Clearly, those ignorant about the topic are falling for it...
@@Simulcrom France already have a full 5th gen project it's the NEURON drone (type on youtube). Dassault is working on the 6th gen now... Again, stop this propaganda of invisibility, Dassault doesn't care about what the US+UK consider as "5th gen" because he knows the last version of the Rafale can detect and track any plane with small signature by using different type of sensors (infrared etc). You must understand that when you do a full 5th gen you basically put all your eggs in the same basket "stealth" and for that you have to limit your plane in many aspects.. .there are multiple ways to exploit those weakness.
@@johndoe-cd9vt I'm glad that you ignored France despite me deliberately listing them. Frances opinion is similar, and since Dassault is a French manufacturer, you would think that their opinion holds some weight.
Additionally, most modern nations have 5th gen drone developments. Australia, Russia, China, the US, Germany, Japan, the UK, and South Korea just to name a few all have similar programs, and many of them are farther along than NEURON. I mean, NEURON hasn't even had a test flight yet.
Then their is 6th gen. I hope you realize that of the current 6th gen programs, FCAS is the furthest behind, right? NGAD and F/A-XX are the furthest ahead, followed by GCAP.
In the end, the Rafale FR.4 is not demonstrably better than its rivals in the 4.5 gen range like the F-15EX, Tranche 4 Eurofighter, and the Gripen E, let alone a rival for the F-35.
And again, you are only showing your limited understanding of this topic. The F-35 has a better radar, a better EW suite, and a better IRST than the Rafale. Heck, almost every single 4.5 gen aircraft has an IRST, those aern't advantages unique to the Rafale, they are commonplace.
Then their is your lack of understanding of RCS. Based on Dassault advertising, you would know that they specifically mention the low-observable aspects they used to make the Rafale stealthier. This is a great achievement, with many figures putting at around 1 sqm on a clean configuration. On radar, it would be detected at over 5 times the distance the F-35 would be detected at. This is without factoring how the weapons would boost its RCS even further.
There is a reason their 5th gen advertising inst't taken seriously by anybody.
A little interesting thing about Taiwanese viper is that its actually a block 15 fuselage with block 50 wing and horitonzal stabilizer with the avionics equivalent to the NATO MLU standard , and its actually the only nation that has equipped AN/ALQ-184 ECM pod other than the United States
Egypt has over 200 F-16s. If they are replaced they could be sold to a party that can get upgrades.
Looks like I need to save uh 1 million
Most f-16 will be go to ground support role as our ministry of defense said before
@@anubisRN555 How many out of 200 would be needed for ground support? If 100 are used in that role that leaves 100 for potential sale. That could be quite a money maker for Egypt.
@maestromecanico597 in 2023 when most European countries give there f-16s to Ukraine there is discussion about what If we give ours too
Till now Egyptian military said the Rafale will be for air defense and f-16s mostly for ground but not all of them some will be cut for parts as US didn't want to sell parts too to Egypt and some maybe end up for sale
We did retired all mig-21 and f-7 in 2010 and most of them been bought by Libya and Sudan so maybe did this again
Sell to Argentina, Miller likes American antiques
I’m gonna have Panda Express for dinner
One should ALWAYS replace US equipment.
All this debate is pointless when your prized viper can't even fire further than pea shooters
I'd be worried about China making a sweetheart deal to Egypt, then somehow thru financial trickery forcing Egypt to default on their buy here pay here deal. And instead of repoing them, cut another deal to station Chinese troops in Egypt and thru other shucking and jiving seize control of the Suez canal. They do the same things with building infrastructure in many struggling countries, owning ports and other critical assets to support their naval ambitions.
You mean literally what America been doing/wants to do with every nation? buy my stuff, be my puppet.
I mean the US has done the same for generations now. I see no problem with China using the same maneuvers. Atleast third world nations get good infrastructure out of these deals
You mean like Syria?
Don't worry Egypt never accepts foreign troops on its land
The US tried and it didn't happen
@@abdallhmohamed6442
Did they forget to tell the USSR?
F-16 without AIM-120 means nothing.
US will make an offer Egypt can't refuse
Yeah we always bow down to izraeeeeeeeeeeeeel
How much more betrayal can the Egyptians take????
@Mike-bc7xv sissi owes everything to izraeeeeeeeeeeeeel
No question the US hands over the kill switch to Israel for any equipment sold to Muslim countries so it makes a lot of sense to avoid buying from the US or EU.
Great! Guess Egypt doesn't US foreign aid... Anymore.
Never buy your Air Force from Temu….
That's hilarious and true!!!
Better than having jets from usa with no bvr missiles.
Oh, sure, because buying from Amazon is a masterstroke of genius. Same factories, just a different price tag. Brilliant, really.
useing this Logic all US fighter are shit because doller stores are from USA if you want to compare Plane quality you should be using actual companies that makes planes like Boeing
Don't you know Amazon, AliExpress and Temu all came from the same place? 😂😂
Can't get over the irony of the J-10 being based on the Israeli Lavi design from the 1980s
Based on the pretty loose wording. The only similarity is that they are both single engine delta canard aircraft.
@@voidtempering8700People just like to downplay Chinese tech. They'll find ways to deny Chinese original designs and capabilities
I thought the Israelis sold the Lavi data to China.@@voidtempering8700
But will it turn into Tofu after a certain amount of time, just like the buildings, bridges, island reclamations, roads and other items we have seen on the news. Is the jet fuel real ? Did they get it out of the gutter like the gutter oil ?
Very true. Like their tofu Tiangong space station. Is it still up there or already broken apart? Are their astronauts stranded in space? I know of one space superpower that is having this problem because of their leaking tofu Starliner spacecraft.
What a genius😅
@@kamsunleong6648 savage 🤣
Yes, two American astronauts are eating Tofu in the ISS, go get them home 😂😂😂😂😂
it is the only option left for egypt in order to gain bvr missiles. egypt is behind all her eastern neighbors in this crucial weapon.