DDR2 vs DDR3 Socket LGA 775
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- Опубликовано: 27 окт 2018
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LGA775 was a very long lived socket from Intel. A lot happened in that timeframe.
Haha true that. I currently have my primary pc with 5600x while secondary has Pentium e5400. Both work great in their own domains
Well at least They had 1(ONE) socket for a few years....not the INTEL we know nowadays....right?
Enjoyed the vid. Thanks for taking the time to dig a bit deeper into this. 👍
Thanks man!
Xeon x5460, 8 GB DDR2 800, GTX 660, that's my beast. And I am quite happy with it. And the whole thing, with a 500W supply cost me... less than 125 €. I don't think that's bad, and I had fun building it.
I was waiting long for a such video.
I live in Hungary, DDR2 modules are generally 1.5 - 2x as expensive as DDR3 modules here. 4 gig DDR2 modules are quite hard to find and crazy expensive.
You can get brand new 4gb 2x2gb ddr2 kits on Aliexpress for 10€, search for Kllisre.
do you hungary? i know t speak hun :D private chat :DD
i have pga 1070 socket
I live in Brazil and it's the opposite for me, 4GB DDR2 800Mhz modules going for R$ 80, which is less than 20 american dollars.
For some reason it does look expensive on the international market, searched there first and was surprised it is far cheaper here.
Not talking about 2x2 kits, actual single 4GB modules.
Single 2GB DDR2 Ram 800Mhz is being sold for about R$30 which is about 7 american dollars. (Checked Facebook Marketplace and MercadoLivre.com)
@@MashupsByMandy tbm moro no brasil trabalho com informatica a mais de 20 anos mesmo com essa Era DDR4 ainda aparece pessoas querendo comprar memorias ddr2 mais e dificil achar ddr2 4gb e pior ainda com frequência maior 1066mhz qual lugar onde encontra essa de ddr2 4gb ha mercado bom visto que comprando fora tem pessoas que ate chega esperar eu fazer pedido visto que realmente essas pessoas que procura fazer esse up usa pc somente para trabalho e querer ter um pouco mais de liberdade enfim abrir mais abas em navegadores e abrir mais programas...
Thanks for the inspiration Phil. Needed a basic Emby streamer for a second viewing room and would never have considered an older machine with ddr2 ram.
Picked up a HP DC7900 with a core 2 E8400 for $25, installed more ddr2 ram for $10, a Gt210 for HDMI ($29 shipped) and a core 2 quad Q8400 for $10. Only unexpected costs were a network card after a win 10 update caused the inbuilt gigabit to stop working (tried everything short of a rollback) and a new fan as the HP original sounded like a Hoover!
Great machine for the money and very satisfying using this 'obsolete' machine. Painted the silver bits black and added BT media remote and it's awesome!
Phil you're a wizard, 3 hours before this video went live I tried to google this thing and only found bad videos from RUclips...
Great video Phil! Thanks for putting some time off to dig into this ^_^
Thank you very much for this comparison! This is a relly interesting topic for me. :)
There's also DDR1 for socket 775 (typically the boards that support AGP and windows 98 such as the one you reviewed a couple of months back)
Pretty sure most of those boards are limited to Netburst architecture CPU's and single-channel RAM though. It'd be interesting to see how it holds up, but I can't think of any conceivable reason why you'd want one of those over a DDR2/PCIe board.
@@MixerVM Those DDR LGA775 boards were the last board of any kind to have a chipset that had guaranteed support for PC/PCI and DDMA, two protocols that let you tunnel ISA IRQs and ISA DMA across the PCI bus. There's some PCI sound cards that take advantage of those to get near 100% Sound Blaster compatibility in DOS. So those boards are desirable for making the fastest possible DOS machines.
@@MixerVM Not all though. I know at least two that allow dual channel DDR1 and allow at least some core 2 cpus, e.g. ASRock 775i65G R3.0 and conroe865PE.
I have a pentium extreme and 2 gigs of ddr @ 400mhz in my system
I had an asrock model which supported q6600 and it was very fast, oddly it was faster than ddr2 despite the bandwidth increase because I had Ddr400 with very tight timings.
The results were as I expected.
Nice video anyhows:)
Your acent is soo cool and your knowledge of computer is amazing! keep up the good work!
I really appreciate yor videos.
Thank you.
Nice, thanks for the video, i was curious about the difference in performance
Very helpful! Thank you Phil!
I have to believe doing this comparison took a bit of time and work, lol. Very nice.
a lot of work on this vid, relevant for me in 2020 ! thanks :)
Very interesting stuff! Some time last year I tested putting a LGA771 x5355 into my GA p35 DS3R, swapped out my E8400, but I never tried using the DDR3 capability of the board while doing the testing. They worked out really similarly with the few video cards I had, in my limited testing scenarios, but ended up using twice the wattage, so I gave up.
Long story short: Thanks! I always wondered if it was strictly frequency / timings dependent.
Great video! Lots of work, i appreciate it! There is an other difference between the p35 and the p43 chipset that might improve results and benchmarks. The P43 supports PCI Express 2.0, where the P35 only supports version 1.1
Yup, well worth mentioning.
but in reality, you won't see any difference, I had few P35-P45 boards, they all have identical performance, I had also one expensive fancy board with nvidia chipset and DDR3 and performance was terrible, it was like -15% compared to intel P chipsets, nvidia chipsets are big NO for me, I never had any MB with nvidia chipset which worked without any problem
@@Pidalin "I had also one expensive fancy board with nvidia chipset"
That was your problem right there. Everyone knew back then knew to avoid those boards and go for the Intel Chipsets as they tended to work much better and had a lot less issues in general.
Thanks for the video Phil, i know a lot of work went into it.I Think either Memory system will make a good XP Machine if the price is right.
Phil, I am quite new to your channel...I just love your real world comparisons, would love to see comparisons between old socketed board LGA 775 vs 1150 vs etc....Thank you so much, I am certainly going to enjoy wading through your back catalogue of videos!!
Welcome 😁
Well... At least where i live, the 775 ddr3 boards are really expensive, sometimes even more than some cheapo 1155 boards, no kidding.
So basically doesnt worth it.
Ddr2 775 board have some really hood deals tho, so if you really dont have the budget for a 1155, its a good option
Yea in that case it's not worth it!
Ismael Espínola Villalobos Yes, these 775 ddr3 boards never actually came here officially in general, they are pretty rare and expensive. Until the first core i series basically we were stuck at ddr2 ram.
But yes really wierd
probably lga1155 from hp, dell.... is cheaper than any good gaming lga775
BootlegScarce Actually if i compare to some biostar low end ryzen boards its basically the same price. But those biostars randomlly appear and dissapear from the market, and i really dont know how good they are.
But yeah, really abusive price for such old hardware
@@eduardoavila646 based on what you said about these boards, I think we might live on the same country...
Great video Phil, Thank you. 👍
DDR2 still going strong , playin new games easily :D
@The king Charged I did back then :)
@@Complextro93kg RIP DDR2. It was the GOAT for cheapo pc builds back in 2015-2018
@@keith8225 still good to use in a cheap build for younger kids as their first PC since if they fuck it up it isn't hard to replace parts aka the ram :)
@@zk0rned agree im building cheap 775s for my kids and cctvs/office pcs they still quite robust and cheap still does the job
Hi Phil these LGA775 motherboards still have their place in the world. I have a Q6600 with 8GB Ram and 2 1GB PCI add in cards 120GB SSD 2 floppy drives 1 3/5 1.44mb, 5 1/4 double density plus a 16x DVD+-RW running LFS "Linux From Scratch" I compiled using the 6600 CPU which was slow took a few days to build the base system and I run my own IP tables router/firewall for my home network with AV and SNORT setup with my own home VPN for when i am out and about. Plus self hosted private webserver/mail and it doesn't use much ram approx 5GB after several weeks running non stop and CPU usage under full load is about 70% utilization and the DDR3 is mix and match I have to double check what Gigabyte MB I am using. But Love the content mate I am thinking of building one for backwards compatible retro gaming sick of using emulation etc and VM's. Keep up the good content I know this vid is couple years old but for all us IT guru's we do find ways of using old hardware for Games and more saving e-waste. Cheers
I finished my 775/AGP build and it was the most fun I've had putting a computer together.
Asrock 4core dual-data2
Q6700
X1950 pro agp
Corsair xms2 DDR2 @667
never clicked a video so fast i have so many lga775 mobos with ddr3 compatibility laying around
Here I am in 2021 with Q6600, Asus P5Q Pro, and GT 1030 as my secondary rig, and guess what, it still works just fine. OC to 3 Ghz, SSD, 8 gigs of RAM and it is usable for any day to day task. Running Windows 10 20H2 with no issues.
Interesting results. I had contemplated going with a more modern memory standard on an older build (DDR3 as opposed to DDR2), but for a retro build it really doesn't seem like there's a drastic difference.
Ah man you reminded me my Intel core 2 quad and cod mw2 days... Beautiful years passed by......
I've used that p35 board with a Xeon x5460 over clocked to 3.8ghz and a gtx 960 combo. Solid performance.
I have a similar build not a xeon but the slightly weaker by like 1% 9550 with 8 ddr (high end like 1,333 or what ever the max is) , and a gtx 770 (sli when my psu is upgraded).
Great video, in the current health and economic problems, your videos on super budget PC upgrades are on the spot. If possible please add Cinebench R15 and R20 benchmarks.
I was given a G41 ASUS board and I was really surprised it was DDR3. I've been rocking that board ever since I abandoned trying to run an eGPU through an Express card slot. It worked ok, but it just seemed off.
Phil, I have a E5450 coming for my LGA 775, and a RX 580 is coming back to me from RMA. I ended up getting a Firepro V5800 to hold me through when my RX 580 was off for RMA. It did pretty well for a 1 GB card based on the HD 5770.
I'm excited to see how well the E5450 and RX 580 do together. Depending on the game, my current Q8400 wasn't even a bottleneck for the RX 580.
Anyways, thanks for doing all of this testing Phil!
Ah, good ole' Q8400, I'm running the same proc, got it for $5 at a thrift store... (In a dead system, lol)
It's surprisingly fast for only a 2.66ghz chip. Haven't had a single CPU bottleneck with my Radeon HD 7950... Which I got for $15 at the same thrift store...(OC'd into a R9 280... Same card, new model number... silly AMD. Blew my mind to find out my $15 card was Vulkan and DX12 capable.)
I am using 8gb ddr2 with q8400 on a librebootable gigbyte board with a 1030 gt
Michael Zander Currently I have e5450 @ 3ghz, 8gb dd3, 650w psu. Im thinking to put gtx 1060 6gb, is this an optimal choice for this processor. If non, can you recommend me proper video card.
@@BroniranEnotBG So the RX 580 is equalish to the GTX 1060. It really depends on the games you plan to play. CPU intense games like Battlefield and Battlefront II the CPU has a hard time and I could only at those games on low @ 720p War Thunder, however, I was playing Airplanes at 2k @ 45 - 55 fps. I currently have a Firepro V5800 1 GB, like HD Radeon 5770, and have to play 1080p on low to get the same FPS.
I have a Q9505s with a GT 1030 upstairs and my son somehow plays No Man's Sky with some studdering, I assume on low settings.
If you plan on upgrading from your CPU to a Ryzen or I5 or something, then I would get the GTX 1060. If you are sticking with the Q8400 I would look at maybe a GTX 1050 or something on the used market with 2 or more GB of RAM and that is at least directx11 capable. I, myself, eventually want to upgrade my computer because I feel that my RX 580 is bottlenecked by my CPU.
@@FiLiMa_ rx580 betteris than 1060..
It's always the same story about RAM performance. When new standart is presented it's always slower then predecessor on the same clock (eg 800MHz). But new RAM is capable to work on higher frequency, so their performance is the same on next clock step (eg DDR2-800 vs DDR3-1066).
Thank you for your videos!
Really the only increase is efficiency.
Excellent video! You've just saved me a lot of time and money.
🙂 thanks, i never knew how close they were in performance ✌️😏
Very interesting video ! I've had my P5B with 8Gb DDR2 for a long time and thought about switching (not anymore when I saw the prices for DDR2 (cheaper) vs ddr3 on AliExpress for 4*2 ) and I'm glad I kept my DDR2 ! The investment isn't worth it for me with my e5450. I have many old systems still on DDR2 (family) and prices are so low on Ali that it's not worth upgrading for just ddr3. A bigger step is needed for our uses (like X79 jumps)
Im still using my P5B DDR2 7 GB is my primary pc. Old school but mainly use it everyday tasks. Nice to see you have had it as well
I remember my old P3-UD3L most solid board. I bet it works. Should do a throwback build with it. Feels like I'm looking back at PIII bard from the early 2000s how the times have changed.
This really answered my questions :) I'm am late here lol, but I got one of those crazy high end ASUS boards with a Q9300 for $35NZD from a junk shop lol. It's running really well with windows 7 and a GTS250 :) I'm making a second system around a Q6600 but only have high end 775 boards left. It's good to see its not going to make much of a difference :)
Also, @PhilsComputerLab - you should mention about max. capacity limitation on all DDR3 memory for LGA 775.
Those boards WILL NOT support single sided 4GB memory (or high dense DRAM chips).
Regardless of chipset you are using.
No Intel board supports that type of ram outside of perhaps enterprise (server/workstation) AMD consumer boards do though.
And forget about any 8GB sticks. They never post
Dual Sided Low density DDR3 ram modules of 4 GB work. Tested personally. DDR2 ram works too in dual sided version. 4x2GB gives you 8GB ram on DDR2. Its very good for Xeons.
@@harbinger200 where did you get the 4gb ddr2 low density memory?
This also applies on lga1156 variations. Until lga1155, single sided 4gb ram cannot be used.
Learned it kinda hard way.
Basically, I owned HP Z200, wanted to upgrade it from 4gb to 8gb. Went online, bought second hand RAM, 2 stick of 4gb. One was dual sided, another one is single sided. It's working until I installed single sided 4gb. Bsod irql not equal.
Then I thought the ram is faulty, sent back to seller. It turns out that seller actually said it's working. Replacement were sent, and single sided 4gb. Same deal. Seller suggested me to repair shop to test it. And it's working. Repair shop mobo used h61 chipset.
The RAM now has been swapped to somebody else (aunt's pc), originally uses 2gb single sided. It uses h61.
Great vid. Surprised I didn't come across this one from you sooner in my feed.
I have 3 different systems just for the Windows XP era alone!
One is a socket 478.
Two of them are socket 775!
For Early-Era XP:
Socket 478. Abit IC7 Max3
P4 3Ghz 1MB Cache
I have a 3.4EE, but I prefer above for higher FSB OCing.
Thermalright SP120 cooler.
267fsb x 15 = 4ghz.
1066Mhz FSB.
428Mhz Ram with divider.
2 x 1GB Corsair LED Pro DDR 438.
BFG 6800 Ultra OC AGP
4 x 36GB SATAI WD Raptor 10k RPM in Raid0.
Antec TrueControl 550w
She chews up anything early XP I throw at it.
For Mid-Era XP
(First Socket 775. DDR2)
EVGA 780i SLI
Core2Duo E8600 3.33Ghz @ 4Ghz
(400 x 10)
1600Mhz FSB!
Zalman copper led flower cooler.
2 x 2GB OCZ Platinum Edition DDR2
1066Mhz 5-5-5-15 2T
2 x 8800 Ultra SLI
256GB OCZ Vertex SSD
2 x WD VelociRaptor 150GB 10k RPM SATAII in RAID0
OCZ EliteXtreme 1000w PSU
Plays Crysis like a CHAMP.
May look into alternative C2D chips to try to achieve 4.2Ghz or more...
For Late-Era 64-Bit XP:
(Second Socket 775. DDR3)
Asus ROG Rampage Extreme
Core2Extreme QX9770 3.2Ghz @ 4.2Ghz (400 x 10.5) 4c / 8t
1600Mhz FSB!
Cooler Master Hyper212 LED
2 x 4GB Corsair Dominator GT CL9 DDR3 2000Mhz
2 x Radeon HD5870 Eyefinity CrossFire
256GB OCZ VertexII SSD
2 x WD VelociRaptor 150GB 10k RPM SATAII in Raid0
CoolerMaster SilentPro 1000w
This baby can run Crysis2 like no ones biz.
775 was a great era of computing!
Those are some nice systems, very thoughtful choice of parts! Even Raptor drives, nice...
Wow, this was a cool idea. Never really thought about this variable! Great video as always! Thanks Phil!
Very interesting video. When i got my LGA 775 rig I had a DDR3 motherboard that was capable of 16GB of RAM being a P45 chipset but it didn't want to boot with 16GB for whatever reason maybe I needed to flash the BIOS in order for it to work properly or I was using memory that was too fast for it or something. Anyway when I upgraded from a Core 2 duo E8400 to a Core 2 Quad Q6600 I had to downclock my RAM 1333mhz RAM to 1066mhz due to the FSB on the Q6600 and I didn't notice that much of a performance drop and besides It made the RAM last longer. When you mentioned the chipsets running warmer it reminds me of the newer motherboards like for 4th generation core i series CPUs I had to increase the voltage of my RAM because I went from 2 stick of memory to 4 and it made Windows unstable to the point where I was getting blue screens.
Just do bsel mod to q6600 and get back to 1333 mem bus. Im getting a couple old cpus and 775 mb to try just for fun.
Amazing , muito obrigado pela comparação, eu estava pensando em pegar um LGA775 DDR3 , But com este video pude ver que o investimento não compensa(ao menos por enquanto) . Não pretendo sair do LGA775
This was interesting thanks Lga 775 was alot of fun. I've still got my old Q9650 on Gigabyte a EP45T-UD3LR mobo, oc'd to 4.06ghz with 16GB ddr3 oc'd to 1804mhz with a gtx 1660 running on my TV in my bedroom for rpg/survival games in bed with a wireless mouse and keyboard setup
Had the P43-UD3L Loved that Motherboard.
I had a decent 775 rig some time ago but I managed to ruin my ASUS P5K-V motherboard in an accident and I couldn't continue upgrading it sadly, then the PSU gave up some time after as well. If I still had the board I'd bet I would still be using it but with everything maxed out by now.
Great video
Great vid also had this motherboard
My gaming pc for many years (purchased used) was a ddr3 Intel motherboard with an X3370 3.0 GHz quad core CPU. It performed so strong I kept it through several GPU upgrades.
brilliant m8, im just about to start a referb for a 775 board for my son and its suprising to find that ddr2 can be faster than ddr3, although i think dd3 is more stable in the long run pending on what cpu you use. either way thanks for the heads up
My preferred board, when I can find it, is the P5KC. has both DDR2 & DDR3 slots. Using the DDR3 slots on a Vista build & getting maximum performance from period Dominator sticks with manual timings
Hey man I really love your Channel keep up the hard work but I'd like to point out that newer generation budget options really are probably better for longevity I'm sure you that you know that too but I got to admit I love seeing old Hardware at its maximum potential showing that it's still useful I really appreciate this I'm going to build a computer based on everything that you talked about in your videos I really appreciate your hard work and the time you take to make these videos I have a GTX 680 super overclock card if you'd like I would let you borrow it just to see what it's capable of and pair it with an equal processor if you're interested make sure to hit me up I also have an Intel Larrabee prototype that displays picture if you want to take a look at that too
I have a Q9650 and I'm planning on buying 16Gb of DDR3 RAM with much tighter timings. Should be fun to see the improvements even if slight
I have same CPU with a GA-EP45T-USB3P board and 16GB Ram F3-1600C8Q-16GAB
can you tell me some of your results? I have a Q9550 and E5450 and still have 2x8GB Crucial Ballistix Sport DDR3 1600 in my 2nd system with 4790k. Thank you in advance :)
I still have a Q6600 system on a locked board, Did the Bsel mod with a piece of tape to make it run at 3ghz which helped for some games that the family plays on it.
Very interesting outcome! I would have expected there to be a slight bump but nothing too noticeable DDR2 to DDR3, but didn't expect DDR2 to edge out the later. Is this mostly due to timings? Looks like the DDR2 memory had lower latency? If I remember correctly I think Linus (Linus Tech Tips) did a similar comparison with DDR3 to DDR4 and noticed a slight but rather insignificant advantage on the DDR4 memory. Nothing that would warrant the extra cost though.
Nice to know information
You should try the am3+ platform one of these days. It would make an interesting video.
Athlon K7 slot
I have a AM2+ with a Phenom II x6 1090t, and for modern games it is frustrating to use. It is missing the SSE4.1instruction set and it quickly becoming obsolete. I replaced it with a LGA 775 that I was given. I'm going to rebuild it again soon for fun.
@@FiLiMa_ My Gigabyte 785 baord supports those X6 Phenom II chips but all it has in it is a Athlon II x4 645 (3.1GHz) clocked to 3.87GHz, it's not really that horrible and I haven't ran into any games it couldn't run sure it's a lot slower than a Core i rig because of faster PCIe and higher bandwidth on stuff but it still played everything.
@Dalle Smalhals I know, I need the SSE4.1 to get over a 2 GB limitation in War Thunder, my main game ATM. Plus, now newer EA games are also requiring SSE4.1 Hell, it played the Battlefield 1 beta a lot better than my Q8400 can play it now. When playing Cities Skylines the extra cores are appreciated. Also, my Firestrike score is also boosted by the 6 cores. It's kinda broke my heart when Timespy required SSE4.1.
My 1090t tops out at 3.6 GHz, but the single core performance is still lacking and the instruction set limitations have pushed me away. I'll see when I rebuild it if I am wrong.
@@FiLiMa_ Yes. But I was talking about the am3+ platform (the infamous fx lineup), I think it would be cool to test some retro and modern games on that.
I always found the C2D and C2Q processors to perform best with 800MHz DDR2.
Could you further elaborate? I'm also planning a C2Q build with 800Mhz DDR2 with the lowest latency I can find.
One thing I would definitely recommend is lots and lots of cooling you don't necessarily have to go with the loudest fan but one thing is is you want to work on your air flow typically a push-pull configuration there is an abundance of low blowing fans or what you would want to call High CFM fans with low noise around 25 decibels to 30 but 30 decibels is a little bit loud it all depends on your van configurations each computer case is different but if there is any way to put extra fans I would definitely recommend it and I would definitely recommend checking into pci slot coolers
In US on ebay i often find 9,99$ optiplex 380 boards with ddr3 and quad support, but they are Dell BTX form factor, and take some tinkering to use outside of a dell case
I have Q6600 on an Asus P35 mb with both DDR2 and DDR3. Used it with 8GB DDR2, then moved to 8GB DDR3 (obviously not both DDR2 and 3 at the same time). DDR3 did not amaze me, was faster but only in synthetic benchmarks and by a little bit. Took me quite a while to figure out why P35 could not run 16GB DDR3, but apparently you need P45
I had also such MB (P35 platinum combo) and it just didn't work at all with DDR3, I tested like 4 diffrent rams, everything unstable, then I realized you need rams with no XMP profiles, frequency and CL must be native on that sticks, not thru XMP which these MBs don't support. But as you said, difference in performance is close to zero, DDR2 800 MHz vs DDR3 1333 MHz is the same, sometimes it's even better in some tests for DDR3. Socket 775 boards were not ready for DDR3 yet, DDR3 started to make since with 1600+ MHz with later sockets. Combination of socket 775 and DDR3 brings you just problems.
@@Pidalin yes, I also later found that native CL must be supported and no XMP support in the mobo means extreme profiles don't kick in. I had bought some overclocker DDR3 only to find out it does not boot due to XMP missing and the RAM could not initiate at the DDR3 timings it expected. So that went into a Dell OEM mb, which booted it fine (newer chipset)
Interesting findings with DDR2 vs DDR3
the issue with using DDR3 based LGA775 board is the price of these boards are pretty steep
I got a X48 Asus board but it cost me over 200 USD
I used the Q9650 CPU with the X48 chipset board, although the board supports 1600MHz RAM and above.
it failed to boot with 4x2GB sticks of DDR3 1600MHz Samsung chip RAM which were taken out from HP OEM PCs
I dont have 2x4GB sticks to confirm but will one day test it out with either a higher end CPU like the Xeon CPUs are try OCing the FSB
pairing my Q9650 and 8GB of DDR3 with a GTX 960 4GB for some retro gaming
Great video! Got much in it really! Wonder if the x38/x48 chipset brings any difference. Expensive boards though most likely these days.
From reviews at the time, I don't think X38/X48 really made that much of a difference compared to P35/P45. I'm not sure how they would perform and if there would be any difference between ddr2/ddr3 though. A bad thing about the X38/X48 motherboards if you want one though is that they are not compatible with Xeon 5xxx series cpus. I currently have a Xeon X5460 in my old Gigabyte P35 board and was looking at trying to get an X48 one, but according to delidded.com others who have tested them say they aren't compatible. Not a problem if you are using a standard Core2 cpu though.
www.delidded.com/lga-771-to-775-adapter/2/
@@smbu Cheers man! Love tinkering with this old gear 🙂
I have quite a rare bird. The Gigabyte EP35C-DS3R with 4xDDR2 slots AND 2xDDR3 slots. Was my first ATX board off eBay in 2015. It is showing its age with the slightest vibration crashing the system.
As a game dev I wasnt expecting much of a differnece at all and I was correct. Look folks, a game loads its assets into the GRAPHIC CARD memory for future access lol the main memory is only used once or twice while loading assets from your drive.
i just reassembled my old, first pc i ever built. lian li pc-a05, asus p5q-em, go q6600, ocz vendetta air cooler, 8 gigs of corsair xmw2 ddr2 800, western digital caviar 640gb, and a radeon hd7850.
it originally had 4 gigs of ocz vengeance(?) 800 and a 9600gt, which i still have packed away in their original packaging. i was going to use those and just do a 32 bit xp build. but then i got it into my head to do a 64 bit vista experiment. perpetual upgraditis.
Hi Phil,
Thanks for doing all that work on some old hardware and software. Actually in your brain you have certainly a big database of knowledge about that stuff :-).
Speaking about DDR2, i have a HP DC7900 SFF with an E8400 C2D. The motherboard has 4 DDR2 slots with one 2Gb stick for now.
The Technical Reference Guide tells about some ways of populating those slots. In particular it says that four 4Gb sticks can be used for a total of 16Gb. When i look at Aliexpress portal for buying 4Gb DDR2 PC2-6400 sticks, one says that the 4Gb are only for AMD and not INTEL, but according to the guide it seems that i could use 4 Gb sticks. Please, would you tell me what do you think about this ? And do you think that four 2Gb sticks which are not listed in the guide are OK ?
Best regards
Main culprit is the memory controller itself and the additional latency since the memory controller is in the chipset. Anandtech also tested this back in the day and there is A LOT of performance to be gained is you tune the performance level. I had a 8GB DDR2 OCZ memory kit that was rated for 1150MHz CAS5 combined with a P45 chipset (DFI Lanparty motherboard) and a 333FSB strap (running 492FSB with a Q9650 @ 4.43GHz watercooled) with a very low performance level (read: very aggressive timings between the memory and the memory controller). It was about 1,5x faster than a motherboard running auto settings and some cheap DDR2 800 memory...
That sounds impressive. The best memory I have is rated for 1066 with 5-5-5-18 timings, but needs a bit extra voltage.
you should of said " 1,5x faster " in synthetic tests ;-)
on non memory starved platforms its at most 5-10% FPS in games
Good video as always!
The two uses for DDR3 on LGA775 platform are:
1. High BCLK OC
2. 16GB of RAM achievable
The first one is quite obvious,as going over 500BCLK(or even higher) is really hard with DDR2,high frequency DDR2 modules are way too expensive and too demanding for cheap motherboards. Even DDR2 1200MHz cost an arm and a leg back in the day,not to mention their scarcty in 2018. With DDR3,1200MHz isn't a big problem as 1333MHz modules are everywhere. One of the highest BCLK record was done on Rampage Extreme with 710MHz BCLK(at 2:3 ratio means 2133MHz DRAM frequency). And the best BCLK record is also done on DDR3 board,it's the EP45T-Extreme with 750MHz BCLK.
The latter is doable on DDR2 but requires very expensive and ridiculously rare DDR2 4GB DIMMs(and very picky with motherboards),with DDR3 it's easier with double side 4GB modules.
Other than those two,using DDR3 will give you a little bit more headaches as DDR2 is cheaper and easier to find(the compatible ones). Also,if you want to fine tune the absolute best performance,timing is everything and high end DDR2 modules will get you covered.
At those points, I don't think worth spending that amount of Money in LGA 775.
I have 64GB of Ram on DDR2...
1: Highest BCLk was not on the legendary rampage extreme but on a gigabyte ep45T-Extreme, 750Mhz...
2: The problem with DDR2 high freq is a: the good stuff only comes on 1GB modules and b: the MC doesn't like high clocks with 4 modules so in practice you're limited to 2GB at 600+ FSB :)
@@KitKatFresse - You are right about EP45T-Extreme but that MB had so loose internal timings on the NB that a DFI P45T2RS Plus at FSB 400 could easily beat with the same memory on SuperPi or Wprime the EP45T-Extreme at 420mhz just tightening the latencies on the DFI. I have a friend who had that MB and I was beating the crap out of him on SuperPi and WPrime with the same CPUs and OS.
The second one was I thing the Biostar IP45 which could reach crazy FSB speeds.
The best kits with DDR2 were the one with Micron D9GMH IC's. I've had two kits on my hands back in the day.
One was the A-Data Vitesta Extreme 800mhz (the red ones) and the second one was the Team Group Xtreem 2x1GB PC9600 (tall radiators).
The second one wast one of the best kits on air I've seen. I could reach on cold air (-5 ambient) and a Delta blowing on them 1333mhz 5-5-5-5 @2.45v or 1200mhz 4-4-4-8@2.45mhz, all of those on the DFI LP P45T2RS Plus and an E8400 C0. From what I've heard that kit could do 1500mhz with looser timings and sub zero, and that was DDR2...
I really loved that MB, to fully understand the BIOS you needed to play with settings a few weeks at least 4h/day. A monster of a BIOS on the DFI boards and very good on air overclocking.
@@eEnzo0 The EP45T-Extreme just has a buggy BIOS, with some attention you can get about the same effi in SPI out of it as any other P45 board, the REX still is king because it has X48 and thus 1T timings :) BTW wprime doesn't care about timings :D Allso i bet the 1200 CL4 weren't 32m stable :D In my experience the kits you want for D9GMH are crucials, they did something with their PCBs noone else has... I have yet to get my hands on a DFI board, so far i have allways just used the EP45-UD3R/P because they are cheaper and better for quadcores :) I have yet to see any non giga board do more than 540MHz on quadcores(except SF3Ds REX but that board deserves a whole category on it's own)... hwbot.org/submission/3879827_tagg_cpu_frequency_xeon_x5470_5727.27_mhz
Hello @PhilsComputerLab have you ever tried a high density ddr2 ram on high end mainstream lga 775 motherboard to check if Intel or motherboard manufacturers ever supported them? This is one of your best video that interest me building home pc using old lga 775 xeon!
No and I don't think I will to be honest, I will do a few more 775 videos, but the value for modern usage is not there anymore. And for retro gaming, 4GB RAM is perfectly fine!
@@philscomputerlabah I see, well I guess I'll be putting it on normal core 2 quad cpus just so I can easily mod my Playstation 2 HDD that still use IDE connection. Maybe I'm gonna wait for better valued used ryzen for my next gaming pc.
I got a 8gb ddr2 1200mhz kit and a 16gb ddr2 1066 kit, both worked Good on my p5q pro. Switched to the x58 Platform now, its a Huge difference.
good job )
I went with a P5K Premium Black Pearl Edition as thats the board I had back in the day, 8GB of Corsair Dominator DDR2 1066 (5-5-5-15) as that was my original ram. I would have prefered the P5Q Premium as I have plenty of spare 1600 DDR3 sticks spare but they were stupid price and to be honest, I would rather use my old haswell system for XP than pay over the odds in that case. The P5K and 1066 DDR2 seems to work fine with the X5460. One thing I have learned though is keep the hardware for old OS support if your newer hardware no longer supports it, saves a small fortune in the long term and like my old Voodoo 5 5500 PCI, can be a bit of a cash cow as well if needed.
Remember that DDR3 at it's start was worse than many DDR2 dimms.
around here 2GB of DDR2 ram costs the same as 4GB of DDR3 ram and 2Gb of DDR3 ram are half the price of them in the used market so it all depends on availability, motherboards costs pretty much the same but DDR3 ones are a little hard to find these days... anyway for me it was time to say goodbye to the LGA 775 platform and embrace the 1155 greatness for W7 and XP era games
So I got a Asus p5q-e Motherboard plus a q9650 from Work, bought 8 GB of RAM DDR2-800mhz for 20 Euro and added my old HD 5750 aswell as an ssd
it actually runs windows 10 pretty snappy and its great for some lightweight gaming (Csgo at fhd, Witcher 3 at 720p low)
Of cause DDR3 would be a nice Upgrade, but If you use this platform, you are probably on a budget and DDR2 RAM is way cheaper
Btw nice video :)
Ddr2? I pity you
I remember my first "Good" system. It was an GA-945GCM-S2P with 2x2GB DDR2 800 and an Pentium Dual Core E2180 that was oced to 3GHz I remember using the 1:1 divider and the memory runnin at theoretical DDR 1200. I the updated to an G41MT-S2P same processor running at the same 3GHz but with 4GB DDR3 1333 the system was way faster in Windows than the DDR2 system but the same performance in games. At the time I had an oced ECS GF 9400GT
lol i just got a free g945gcm s2l motherboard which is similar to this one with the same cpu and ram....
oh man, color schemes on motherboards from these days were crazy. blue board, green and black IDE connectors, red RAM slots, orange SATA connectors, light blue pci-e connector, purple parallel port...
Perfect test bro,
Bizide gör karşim memtest serimiz var.😀
@@ensatekcozumler aha gökte ararken yerde buldum seni reyiz e5450 işlemci var elimde Türkçe güncel oyun testi çok sıkıntı 😂sana şey sorsam e5450 9800gt steam ets 2 de 30 40 fps alıyor ama crack li yapınca 70 80 sebebi nedir bilrimsini
Emin değilim fikir yürütücem. Kırıkta internet eşitlemesi yoksa ve sürüm daha eski ise işlemci yükü daha az olabilir.
Recently picked up a used PC for $25 AUD which had a Gigabyte G31M Combo motherboard which supports BOTH DDR3 and DDR2 (albeit they can't be mixed). Pretty interesting board.
I enjoyed this video, don't be so hard on yourself. You produce quality over quantity. That's something I admire. That's a pretty good deal on ram, I have 16 in my Dell XPS 8700. So, 8 isnt too shabby. But, I would have thought ddr2 would outperform ddr3 because of the lower clocks. It's not huge and yes you can overclock it but the gains are very minimal. The advantage of going with DDR3 on C2D based systems should be capacity, not so much speed and my memory served me correct. The higher clocked ddr2 is faster in most cases if by a hair. Again, this could be easily tweaked but for us prebuilt systems, it's good to know the facts before a plunge.
I'd be interested in seeing this same test with an AM2+ DDR2 board and a AM3 DDR3 board.
I have a spare pc with a Phenom II X6 1055t running on the AM2+ board with 8gb ddr2. Was curious what performance improvement it would have with ddr3 ram.
The Phenom 2 and AM3 boards should have been far better designed to use DDR3 ram
Personally I'd just go with a DDR2 system in this case, the boards are much easier to find. That being said, the reduced power consumption of DDR3 modules is especially noticeable in laptops - ones with DDR2 tend to get very warm around the memory area!
10:22 that GPU usage...
*N I C E*
Nice
0:12 too. 0% GPU usage WTF?!?!?!?!
@@starline7228 Afterburner tends to be pretty flaky when reporting usage of AMD GPUs. When I had an RX 580 it'd often bounce back and forth between 0% and 100% if the card wasn't under full load (which it likely wasn't here, since these CPUs will always bottleneck an RX 570).
I am curious about the results of the benchmark when you did DDR3 1600 vs DDR 800? This is a question that would be interesting. And also if there is any difference in brands in any of these era's RAM sticks to find a general pattern for example in types of performances on specific tasks. Thanks Phil
With socket 775, you would need Core 2 Extreme with 1600 MHz FSB to have compatibility with 1600 MHz DDR3 and these CPUs are very rare and expensive. Ofcourse you can take 1600 MHz sticks and overclock it to that 1600 MHz with standard Core 2 CPU, but I have very bad experiences with OC on socket 775 boards with DDR3 rams, it's just not stable.
I think it you’d see a much larger difference with a heavily overclocked E8600 and fast DDR3 matched to the FSB speed. You could demonstrate difference by just lowering the ram speed in bios on one system . Pair with fastest graphics card to show bottleneck.
I use ASUS P5Q Pro with DDR2 at 840 MHz and Xeon 5440 at 3570 MHz. Chip is also undervolted and cold. Not my main PC, just for fun.
Running a p5q dlx with q9550 @ 3.78 445x8.5, 4 x 2GB ocz Reapers @ 533. CPU:RAM = 5:6
Running P5 deluxe with q6600 ( bsel mod 3 ghz ) and 4gb of ddr2 839mhz
i've used 40mm 3pins fans on nothbridge heatsinks for many years from daily use pc to gaming rigs
Like this: G41MT-S2P + south bridge fan mod imgur.com/gallery/6hSggXy this was the only way to achieve 3.8GHZ on my old E7500
My man! I've done the same on my countless gaming rigs, just to make things a bit safer
that's the north bridge that your fan is fitted, the south bridge is the other heatsink below to the right
@@GzeeBRII
i have fitted a fan to the southbridge in the past aswell usually a motherboard like the idot/via pc2500
www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjP2bSqzaneAhUPfMAKHWwfCJ8QjRx6BAgBEAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fbuscasdriverss.blogspot.com%2F2013%2F08%2Fdrivers-placa-mae-pc2500e-id-pcm7e-v10c.html&psig=AOvVaw3a1AgrzDGYKSfu9OBNeCbn&ust=1540832156007648
as i added a heatsink to the southbridge with a drop of superglue
if anyone get one of these motherboard here is the link for the xp drivers
www.viatech.com/en/support/eol/pc-1-platforms/
@@sootycollier5400 my bad. sometimes i forget that these old motherboards have south and north (actual motherboards have the northbridge integrated in CPU)
Now I'm glad I bought a new motherboard and DDR 3 to go with the Q9650 I bought.
@islam I don't play GTA.
Using an Asus P5QL-CM board with the G43 chipset. Uses DDR2 and is capable of supporting up to 8GB ram. I have a Q8300 in it and it works just fine. In fact I am typing on it just now while watching youtube.
Its been my experience that on those old boards running the CORE2 processors that DDR3 performance difference was negligible at best. Partly because the CPU simply could not handle the additional bandwidth.
FSB is heavy bottleneck and you really can't increase it that much. To match just bandwidth of 1066MHz dualchannel memory, FSB needs to hit 533. Only handful of boards could do that. Moving memory controller into CPU gave massive performance boost in memory sensitive applications like games. I got double framerate in witcher 3 going from 3.8GHz C2Q to 3.8GHz 1st gen Core(both xeons). Xeon 34xx 4c8t make really good ultra-budget cpu when overclocked. You can pair it with something like GTX970/1060 and have solid 60fps at 1080p in most of the games, even newest ones.
@@kognak6640 Try Watchdogs with that setup. It'll tank hard.
@@Gamevet Looks like OCed X3440 can do 60+ fps in that game. Notice E5450 which is same as Core2Quad.
ruclips.net/video/J7_yhFCab38/видео.html
Phil how about the E8000 series? They are dual cores with 1333 FSB. Do they benefit from DDR3 or no?
@@ND22M Actual clockspeed is 333 because FSB is quadbumped(4bits per clock). Dualchannel DDR2-667 can provide same bandwidth. FSB is 64bit so it can transfer 8bytes per cycle, 1333 x 8 is 10664MB/s. A DDR memory channel is also 64bit but since there's two of them, it can transfer 16bytes. 667 x 16 = 10672MB/s. Higher clockspeed however can lower latency if timings are increased relatively less so it's possible to make some gains with ddr3 if overall latency is better.
Ive been told by a couple of PC techs (builders/IT services) that ASUS boards are pretty much garbage these days. I do not know this from personal experience, but just observations from others. Excellent channel!
I have a p5q deluxe and am currently running 8GB of ram(2x4). The motherboard supports up to 16, but finding 4GB ddr2 compatible dimm's has been impossible. It would be interesting how a pc with 16gbddr2 would perform
your mobo looks so clean... you should do asmr videos with it
Phil where did you get that asus from , i have a pile of P5G41t-mlx ddr3 asus motherboards and have had real good luck with them overall, in fact i call them the Best Half GHZ overclocker board, vs other micro atx boards in the catagory .
Came from AliExpress.
I got a lot of 775 boards for free some dead some not but i picked out a gigabyte g31m-es2c which are a gem in the rough as most of the boards didn't work with the e6700.This one does and it's running on 4gb ddr2 800 mhz with 6-6-6-18.I use to run games on this pc with her 9800gt but i turned her into a storage server and she's working like a baws.
Thanks for the tip, I keep that model in mind.
I've got a Core 2 Quad Q9650 with a G45 chipset (imo the best LGA 775 chipset there is), and with 16 GB of RAM. It still holds up today with an SSD and Windows 10. :D
Nice :)
the Q6600 is a blast if you use the G0 stepping. I pushed mine with watercooling from 2.4Ghz to 4.0Ghz rockstable.
Muito obrigado , eu estava mesmo com essa duvida de qual era melhor. 🇧🇷 MITO775