Get on up! Minotaur build guide: D&D 5e
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- Опубликовано: 14 июл 2024
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Link to the build: ddb.ac/characters/70112937/tj...
If you would like to know how I calculate damage or how baseline damage is determined, I go through it in this video:
• How To Calculate Avera...
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
4:00 Levels 1-5
17:56 Levels 6-10
27:55 Results and higher levels
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Игры
Gonna be that guy and remind that the Horns actually deal piercing, not bludgeoning. Doesn't affect the build much at all though, still a fun build that's doing something a bit different than the "standard" weapons, I dig it!
File those suckers down to blunt nubs. :)
@@migueldelmazo5244 Or put caps on, you could even get enchanted ones.
You are right. But they can also deal 1 Bludgeoning damage (as normal unarmed strikes)
@@Magnushamann Normal unarmed strikes are 1+STR bludgeoning, so he'd be at 5-6 depending on level.
@@Schmeethe88 excactly, depending on str score.
I am SO here for Chris' takes on supposedly underpowered race and/or class concepts. I love the work you do on high-end, pure optimization, but my personal love is taking a concept others say "can't be made viable" and proving them wrong, but so many people in the optimizer community seem to think it only counts as optimization if you're making the best possible choices in every way.
I'd love to see more of this type of video!
Super agree! My favorite classes and races are the ones nobody ever uses, and trying to make them as strong as possible. I know that might not make for the most views, but I know I'd watch. I think a fun way to wrap up the build would be to throw one or two homebrew ideas to help out the underpowered classes to bring them up to par.
I also agree. Take a dumb concept and make it as good as possible. It's really cool and could lead to real variety of options.
Couldn’t have said it better myself
Optimization literally doesn't exist without the opportunity to squeeze every bit of effectiveness out of things that are not inherently powerful.
Same. I love the unique builds that don't always use vuman or the Tasha's one
I'm impressed you found a way to make a viable Minotaur build. I didn't realize that you could push enemies upward with forced movement.
As far as I know every other option in the game doesn’t let you move enemies up. It’s just the weird wording on the crusher feat.
@@jacksonletts3724 Some things say that you move the target horizontally, but some don't. That's the distinction here!
Yeah, but RAI, guys. Seriously, I doubt you're supposed to be able to push things upward. If you can, that would be the default, but I doubt most people will envision that from a reading (and I doubt it's meant to be hidden tech).
If everything was balanced, and wordings were airtight, and the designers didn’t lean heavily on the DM to resolve the times they don’t bother to be clear, sure.
But they don’t, and it’s legitimately a pain to determine RAI or RAW. Ultimately, it’s up to the DM, but you’d have to be pretty hard nosed to deny a player the chance to run their fairly balanced character because of RAI, or RAW. Just give the enemies a check or saving throw, or rule that only melee attacks can knock someone up, maybe slap a harsher size limitation on moving someone upwards or something.
For example, RAI and RAW, a restrained creature can hit their restrainer with advantage. They can’t be silenced, or prevented from attacking their restrainer, or even crippled. Would I allow someone who invested in the grappler feat to do those things for not attacking that round? Of course.
If a Minotaur hit someone of equal or smaller size with a melee attack, and that player took crusher, then it makes sense and is fair for that poor creature to suddenly learn how to high jump.
@@micahiwaasa9304
Much less, realism…. Every time I’ve ever seen a bull hit someone on a charge, they always go straight back… NEVER has a bull flung someone like a rag doll UP in the air…
😑
I always love builds that are focused on using the unique benefits of different race options. These race options often get overlooked in favor of some... more often picked choices... and I think that does the more unique options a disservice. Thanks for showing how the Minotaur can be awesome!
Oh i love this build, it FEELS like a minotaur and having good flavour while still being optimized is hard, i'd even flavour it as a large minotaur cursed to be medium sized and giants might is just them breaking the curse for a limited time
Funny enough you briefly mentioned grappling builds but this rune knight build wouldn't be too bad at it, rune knight lets you grapple bigger creatures and if your dm allows possibly pick up smaller ones, all while giving you good options with the runes, in fact if you were to pick luxodon you'd be able to grapple with two free hands and get extra attacks all without using your bonus action to let you pick polearm master
Luxodon are terrific grapplers!
So...the DPR calculations seem to be assuming that your bonus action is basically always free for a GWM attack or hammering horns.
But a lot of these abilities require a bonus action to activate--giants might needs a bonus action, rage needs a bonus action, rune knight runes require a bonus action. Unless you have a prep round or two and activate these before the fight, that's going to reduce the round 1 damage. This isn't a huge reduction to damage or anything, probably lowers what we expect out of a bonus action from about 7 DPR to about 5 DPR in a four round combat. But I feel it's worth mentioning.
Your mileage may vary by table of course. I've seen lots of 2 round combats at tables I've played at, which is really going to lower that number. I've seen people talk about how at their tables they regularly see 10 round combats, where this will be negligible.
I think it's important to note that the Hammering Horns + Crusher tactic will not work if you are 2 sizes larger (or more) than the target. Being 2 sizes larger and moving the target 5 ft above the ground (crusher) will put the target directly in front of you, then Hammering Horns will not push it further up diagonally, but simply 10 ft horizontally (still 5 ft above the ground) away from you. This situation will seldom happen, but I think it's a relevant information.
I mean, at that point you could still argue with your GM that the enemy has been “falling” enough to get the 1d6 damage and be knocked prone. Since they still move 15 ft through the air. On top of getting headbutted by a Minotaur 2 or more size categories larger than them.
The target is still moving 15ft. My problem is that I thought crusher was move 5ft into a vacant spot. Up is not vacant. The target is occurring the spot.
6:02 You mention the probable low Charisma affecting the Intimidation ability. This seems like the perfect character for a STR-based Intimidation check. Do you ever use the optional alternate ability modifier rule for skill checks?
I generally do the standard checks, but I'll make exceptions at player request, this is indeed a good example where I would be flexible.
Honestly? I wouldn't. Granted, i came from other systems, with more plentiful feats/powers, so that's not a big deal, but I would require a Feat for that. Why? "But hey, i'm a big guy too, and scary guy too, i wanna do that too!". Obviously, for 5e purposes, i would make a more powerful feat for that, but make it a feat that anyone who wants to intimidate with strenght (and dump Charisma) do. Because, imagine if I said "but he is a minotaur, you are a human, he can do it, you don't", now you are benefitting a character despite another. So, making it a feat, it would level the playing field. "you both can do it, IF you wanna grab that feat". I think it's the most fair, tbh.
Granted, that would screw some builds, because how limited feats are in 5e, but i think it's a fair trade, tbh.
As a DM I allow my players to use optional ability modifiers for skill checks as long as they could explain it or better yet role play it. In this case the player describes what strength based action that would be intimidating. Example: “I rip my shirt off with a mighty roar!” Then I am like, “Great! Roll that strength based intimidation check. BTW - you can’t do that until you get another shirt.”
That poor Goliath Barbarian was always looking for a Big and Tall store - which of coarse did not exist 🤣
The system and the people that made the system designed it to be simple and flexible. They seem to have a mentality geared towards “getting to yes” instead of outright saying no to about player options.
Does a strength based intimidation check from a medium creature targeting a large or larger creature make sense? I’d be inclined to say no myself. If we take size into account would it make sense vs medium or smaller creature, I’d say yes. At least without any other context.
I’m actually a huge fan of being flexible with stats on skills. Like, recalling medical information should be an Int Medicine check and actively treating someone should be a Wis Medicine check due to the fact that it requires you to be aware of what is ailing whoever you are treating.
Chris, this one is great. Most pushing/uppercut builds focus on Eldritch Blast, doing it without spells is just *chef's kiss*
Wow, i'm literally playing this build in our current campaign! Slight difference is that I'm taking Forge Cleric levels instead of barbarian for a bit of flavor and some added utility. So far the smashing is very fun, and keeping a little more engaged tactics wise than other fighter builds I've played.
When i was a middle schooler our DM let his little brother play as a minotaur and ever since then I've always had a fondness for them as a pc. Plus the imagery of a giant minotaur rag dolling enemies around the battlefield is just perfect.
This build looks so much fun, also love the extra support you offer the party with your reactions.
Thank you for always posting these early. So I have one to watch on my lunch break.
I like it that you show how to make a mechanically less powerful race into a strong fun character. Great video as always
Great build! I love forced fall mechanics. Have a Tempest Cleric build that tries to make use of them.
As an alternative, I bet a Minotaur would make for a great armored monk build. Flurry of blows could serve as a bonus action use if Goring Horns failed to proc, and Open Hand Technique could provide as a second chance to push the target into the air.
I am currently playing something very similar as a shadow monk with blind fighting style from fighter 1!
Before I watch the video, here are some of the builds I thought up for minotaur:
1:
>Level 6 bladesinging wizard
>1 attack booming blade
>Other attack with weapon
>Bonus action push away
>Enemy now can’t run back to you without taking damage
2:
>Multiple possible classes
>Take polearm master + sentinel:
>Get within 5ft of enemy
>Hit enemy
>Bonus action push enemy 10ft away with hammering horns
>move a further 5ft from them
>They need to run back to you and eat an attack of opportunity from polearm master
>Sentinel will stop them from reaching you if you land your attack
*This is still alright without sentinel but you may as well use your bonus action for a polearm master attack in that case
*If you aren’t using sentinel, you may consider using a spear and shield instead
*Hammering horns unfortunately does not work with booming blade
3:
>Vengeance paladin
>Use polearm
>Take polearm master
>Hit enemy while within 5ft
>Hit enemy away with bonus action
>run away from them after
>When enemy gets back to you, AOO and run away more.
>Enemy will not be able to reach you unless they have A LOT of movement
The timing for falling is definitely not going to be ruled consistently among all DMs. 5e's just not built for that with precise objective wording, compare to MTG's stack.
Reader, definitely confirm how your DM rules the interaction before commiting to the build.
Keeping your DM informed when you plan a character is always a good idea. It's not good to surprise your DM with a rules interaction they may not be aware of/agree with.
@@TreantmonksTemple I think your reading of applying 2 immediately effects skews to the player, when the words written indicate to me that it is the DM (who is controlling the monster that is both immediately falling and immediately saving vs hammering horns) who would choose which immediate effect applies first. Most DMs will rule 5’ fall then 10’ push unless you really come to an agreement on this build working the way you hope.
@@jeffdybdal656 the rule says that it's the person controlling the creature *whose turn it is*, not which creature is affected, gets to choose the order in which things resolve.
@@jeffdybdal656 RAW states that its the player in this case, essentially if two things happen at once it plays out in the favor of whose ever turn it is.
Your point still stands completely though, the other DM in my play group (we trade off this responsibility on a schedule) would 100% not allow this and would say it feels too gamey. I would as I love clever use of game mechanics especially if its not the same munchkin cheese you see 1000x.
@@FormerRuling On the contrary, I think it's way more cinematic and kinetic than just *I wack the guy*
You're a minotaur launching people is your whole racial identity I think lauching them in the air is just added awesome.
I always liked the Minotaur, thematically.
Yeah, I wish it was mechanically more interesting. Its abilities are basically: you have horns, you still have horns, and also, you have horns. Great theme though. I like the Labyrinthine Recall change.
@@lrioje1 I think the only thing missing is powerful build and darkvison (makes no sense y they wouldn’t have either of these especially powerful build).
Hello again Chris! About half way thru before I had a chance to comment here!
LOL, I actually built this 2 days ago with a swarmkeeper ranger dip ( 3 levels), because I saw exactly the same thing in the race. Going to watch and see what you did differently. Thanks!
26:03
Activate Storm Rune = Bonus Action
Use Hammering Horns = Bonus Action
2x Bonus actions on same turn 😮
I really wished this worked though
This is one of my favorite vids for its content! Thx!!
Storm rune lasts for 1min. He's saying turn 1 active it, turn 2 start knock ups
This is a super fun build. I love the mental image of a Minotaur hurling enemies across the battlefield.
Once again a fun and efficient build, thank you.
There is something visceral, satisfying about this concept.
This is very close to a build I threw together for fun just the other day, except this is of course noticeably better. :)
Currently playing a Str based Fighter1/Shadow Monk 7 with heavy armor and a great sword I took blind fighting as my fighting style and cast darkness on myself. I use great weapon master but can also flurry of blows with my horns because heavy armor does not restrict ki only martial arts. Greatsword stunning strike works RAW. Focused aim also gives a bonus action for one unarmed strike through ki fueled attack. Stealth proficiency and pass without trace means +13 is still one sneaky Boi even in Plate.
Edit: After thinking about the build Chris presented there is no reason I could not add crusher, a maul, and rune knight to take advantage of hammering horns as fighter was the planned next steps anyway. The 10ft away also makes darkness less of an issue for allies as one 5ft step in the opposite direction of the shove would mean the enemy is no longer in darkness. One more level in monk for an ASI unlocks the combo when I run out of ki. Str was at (15+2 from race) 17 so it rounds it out to an even score.
When I first read this I thought, "There's no way that all works. Monk restrictions prevent anything functional or effective."
I read each part of the Monk rules, and I think it all works. That's pretty amazing!
I do think you're going to run out of Ki a lot, but that's kind of standard for a Monk.
I just checked your work as well, as far as I can tell it all holds up! Well done! I also love the new image I have of Slow Fall where instead of the graceful manipulation of gravity, you can just drop to the ground and watch the cobblestones shatter beneath your weight. Then pull out your sword and slowly advance as darkness snakes around your form, with the tip of your greatsword being the last thing visible. Your target knows you're coming, and knows they'll never see you arrive.
Thank you for allowing my little fan fiction. Have fun with your awesome character!
Thank you for this. I was looking for a cool handbook only build as a backup character and this is it I think.
Also had to go over it to make sure it worked and lol it does. Although it would require more multiclassing you can even do this with other races as well. Like 1 fighter unarmed fighting (style) , 2 ranger blind fighting (style) and x shadow monk, this could be fun on a dwarf with dwarven fortitude and if you want to be MAD add 3 levels of warlock for pact of the chain with gift of the ever living one invocation.
@@jugglejunk I was thinking dwarf to be honest.
This build comes at an eerily good time! I've been trying to make a Minotaur character for the last week and ended up writing a reason to make him Reborn into the backstory just to avoid actually being a Minotaur on paper. But this build sounds incredibly fun!
this build is interesting and powerfull, great job!
Thank you!
That bonus action dance is brutal. BA is used for; rage, storm rune(activation), hamering horns, GWM attack, and Giants might. The epic battle needed to get to the promise land of tossing enemies like salad would take at the very least 2-3 turns. But after that.... Start up the yeet cannon
The softening factor of this admittedly real problem is you don't always have to be running at max capacity. You can choose the one or two options that are the most useful in a given encounter. Especially if you think this fight isn't going to last long. You might not need to activate rage, Might, or any runes at all. Sometimes hammering the bad guy over the edge of a cliff will be everything you need.
But you are right. When you want all cylinders firing, you want an encounter that's gonna last at least 5-6 rounds.
I'd love to see a series on optimizing your low or lowest ranked races/classes!
Loved the build.
Minotaur monstrosity I’m designing works off glory Paladin and battle master. Round 1 buffs, haste and channel divinity move up and use hasted action to start a grapple. Round 2 they take bludgeoning damage right off the bat from unarmed fighting style which activates crusher to move them 5’ up. Standing high jump while maintaining grapple. Divinity and boots of springing make this a 45’ jump but can only use 40’ of it since speed is 80 and you’re dragging foe along. At this point make attacks and take advantage of Minotaur push and pushing battle master maneuver to send another 25’ in the air. Should get about 70’ of fall damage added to your hits.
If you're going to use 2 decimal places for everything else then rounding crit chance on advantage up to 10% makes a small difference.
It should be 1-0.95^2 or 9.75%
Expressed as a decimal that would be 0.0975, rounded to 2 decimal places, 0.10.
Fantastic build because sometimes optimizing means optimizing for flavor, too.
I also attempted a minotaur build, but it's so hard to make it work, I just gave up... Glad to see your take!
Go vengeance Paladin and multiclass into fighter to get the unarmed fighting style or u can just get the feat to get a fighting style (this buffs your unarmed attacks to a d8 which includes your horns). And since your horns r considered both unarmed attacks and a weapon attack u can divine smite with them as well since natural weapons r considered weapons. U could also go 2 lvs into Artificer (or have an ally who is) and make your horns magical with an infusion. And then finally as a vengeance Paladin u get haste at lv 9 and with that u can dash and therefore get that extra bonus action attack and then get the charger feat (this feat while not the greatest just fits too well with a Minotaur.
Also get sentinel and u can get a good use out of your reaction if they attack an ally and can divine smite with it again and with vengeance Paladin at lv 7 u get an ability to disengage after u make an attack of opp as apart of the same reaction so u can then dash again at them on your turn. U could also get Warcaster so u can apply a spell on top of this like booming blade. Which with booming blade they can certainly chase after u but they take the additional dmg from booming blade.
If the one DnD Barbarian and the Giant path subclass becomes the standard, this build for minotaurs will be terrific.
The horns r considered both unarmed attacks and natural weapon attacks so u can get the unarmed fighting style from Tasha’s to buff them up to d8 and also u can go into Paladin to divine smite with them. Also since they r technically weapons u can go into artificer (or have an ally be one) and make them magical that way with an infusion.
My brother played a lvl 18 Minotaur wild magic barb. He was one of Arkhan’s cronies from Descent into avernus. The only way I killed him was by the dragon they were fighting tossing him off at 300 ft in the air after he jumped on its back… seemed like a fun ball of aggression
For me, Minotaur was meant to be Hunter - both his abilities synergize perfectly with Horde Breaker ability!
And maybe even Swords Bard, because Slashing flurry works great with Hammering horns as well.
@@JuckiCZ Slashing Flourish doesn't transfer anything about an attack except a tiny bit of damage. It's why 99% of the time Sword's Bards only use Defensive Flourish. Horde Breaker only affects weapon attacks, Hammering horns doesn't involve an attack roll so it is not a weapon attack and Horde Breaker doesn't apply. Hammering horns is basically just half of Shield Master for free and not tied to holding a shield. Plus you only ever have 1 bonus action, so you cannot ever use Hammering Horns more than 1/round.
@@agilemind6241 You don't get it. After you get Extra Attack, you can use Hammering Horns feature immediately after weapon hit to push that enemy closer to his friend. After that you can move in and attack both (either with Slashing Flourish, or Horde Breaker). So you basically increase range those abilities work on. Normally, to use Horde Breaker, enemies need to be 5ft from each other, but with Hammering Horns, it is enough for you if they are 15 ft from each other to still get 3 attacks. With Slashing Flourish, the distance changes from 10 ft to 20 ft.
In my experience from actual play, it makes those abilities work much more often, which is excellent for Horde Breaker and advantageous for Slashing Flourish (you mention, that it does almost nothing, except tiny bit of extra dmg - I wouldn't call extra 3d8 - 5d12 per short rest a tiny bit, especially considering the fact, that it is doubled on crits, but I respect that opinion. AC for whole round is great, but killing enemy 1 round sooner is mostly much better and with my Swords Bard, base AC 21 is usually enough).
And your statement about 1/2 of Shield Master is also quite wrong. Hammering Horns push further (5 vs 10 ft), can be used after just one attack (Shield Master can be used after you finish Attack Action - if you play by Crawford's rules - so it cannot be used to push enemies together and profit from it the same turn) and has different saves - STR saves of HH are much more efficient on agile enemies and I would say that STR saves are more reliable, that Skill contest (especially when enemy can choose from two skills - one DEX and one STR based). So Shield Master shove part really differs from HH ability.
@@JuckiCZ Slashing Flourish is only better that Defensive Flourish if you are confident that the secondary target will die as a result of the 1d8-1d10 extra damage. The number of situations where (1) this is the case and (2) you as the player know it is the case, is absolutely miniscule - unless your DM has imported the 4e minion rules.
Horde Breaker is marginally better - an extra 1d8+Dex isn't negligible but it's really not much either. Collossus Slayer is just so, so, so much better that even with Minotaur increasing the probability of triggering Horde Breaker, I'd argue Collossus Slayer is still better: an extra 1d8 that you have 2-3 chances to trigger every round regardless of whether you're fighting in melee or at range is just going to deal so much more damage over the course of an adventuring day.
Maybe if you did a STR-ranger, and got GWM on the extra Horde Breaker attack and had Hammering Horns it would be close to Collossus Slayer in terms of total extra damage dealt per adventuring day. But STR-ranger is pretty MAD so you have to give up a lot of your spellcasting and likely give up on any MC aspirations to make it work.
@@agilemind6241Just to mention, that Slashing Flourish can also help your friends to kill those enemies sooner - in case when they play after you and before your enemies.
Horde Breaker is not 1d8+DEX, but in this case either 2d6+STR, or 1d8+2+STR, so we are talking about average 11 DMG per hit (2.5x Colosus slayer). If you consider Hunter's Mark, or Guardian of Nature then +3.5 more, with magical weapon, this attack can reach numbers like 3d6+8, 1d8+1d6+10 or even 3d6+18 with GWM feat (and advantage), so that 1d8 extra is really pathetic. Don't forget, that Horde Breaker aso works on every mounted enemy and that it is also better on melee than ranged character - if enemies have higher initiative (which is likely with low DEX), they usually gang around you or your friend, so you can use HB usually right away.
And for Minotaur Ranger is STR really the only option - Hammering Horns use saving throw based on your STR. I have such character and it is not MAD as you say. I started with 17/8/16/8/15/8 and took Hevily Armored feat at lvl 4, so my AC was 21 and STR 18 at lvl 4 (with enough place for STR, GWM, Resilient CON and CON/WIS upgrades).
33:10 I was thinking of making a rune knight grappler build (probably for level 5 play), and combining it with the minotaur sounds like it's perfect. I was planning to get creatures prone and grappled just to make myself hard to hit and them easy to hit, but was still wondering on how to easiest get prone. I think the attack-horns-fall prone-grapple could be really effective. And if there are any cliffs nearby... ;)
Having an angry minotaur just whacking you all directions sounds... fitting.
Played this build a few times this month, including yesterday. We were in the water and a shark came up to me, was able to do the trick to knock it on to dry land. The DM just decided it was dead.
@@TreantmonksTemple where I am from we have a proverb that translates to "like a fish on dry land". It means 'to be in a situation where you are completely not at home/adapted to'.
You however, literally whacked that fish on dry land, putting it in its proverbial situation.
@@TreantmonksTemple I'm surprised he didn't use the suffocating rules. That's basically what they're for, if a bit of a reversal
10:53 Tell that to the wizard who is now actively coming after my blood
LOL, I've now played this character 3 times and killed a familiar in every session ;)
I've been laughing about Get On Up for days now
I've played this build 3 times now, I always say "Get on up!" when I do the combo.
This sounds like a fun mini boss or a tough random encounter to keep players on thier toes. The maul is my second favorite weapon very uncommonly picked.
What's also great is you could fairly reliably force two creatures into AoE effects. Such as spirit Guardians, would be easy to coordinate with.
Only thing I question with this build is the interpretation of "push". To me, to push something it has to be in contact with a surface. So you can push something along the ground or push something up a wall, but you can't push something into the air. You can throw something into the air, but not push. But I guess this is a discussion to have with a player's DM.
I'm messing with making a Lizardfolk Path of the Beast Barbarian as a back up character, and I love the idea of him being very primal and ripping enemies apart with his claws and starting to eat them while they are alive with the racial bite or PotB bite. I'm fine playing a build that is not optimal for flavor can cool factor but I have a limit on the cost of effectiveness to do so. And from what I can tell PotB is lacking for dmg compared to any other path that is just using a great axe and GWM. I wouldn't mind seeing if you can make a Path of the Beast build more viable. Also this is for a Mad Mage campaign.
Issue with synergy between Extra Attack and Hammering Horns- you'll need to declare whether you use HH immediately after hitting (obviously). So, if you're fishing to see if you kill an enemy or get a critical, and your second attack misses, you've also missed your opportunity to get your extra d6 fall damage in from the first attack. So, you'll either be hammering them directly away or just not using your bonus action that turn.
At higher levels that may not be so bad because of the amount of bonus actions this character has, and at lower levels we don't get great weapon master. Also, we can sometimes use an action surge to maybe proc the GWM attack.
@@Chrokosaur also true, though I'd argue (at least level 5 forward) that action surge would be more appropriate after doing a knock and slam so your extra two attacks are against a prone opponent. Once you have reckless attack though, may as well reckless two swings, action surge, and fish for that bonus action attack that way.
I didn't mean it was some kind of critical flaw or anything, rather minor in the grand scheme of things, but something to consider.
@@Schmeethe88 Yeah, that's fair enough. The way the horns work is rather weird, and although it's very cool that the wording allows this build to work it's probably a little unfair to the average player.
Concept builds are the best builds.
Had been theory crafting a Minotaur gladiator greco-Roman style build for our Midgard campaign. Their (Kobold Press) race abilities are slightly different again, but also under-powered as well. All about the flavour, though I like going less beast, more labyrinthine gladiator stalker, nets and tridents too!
I've been wanting to play a Minotaur PC for a while now. I was more focused on utilizing the Charge racial though. I like this more.
What amuses me the most about this is that it feels like a juggle combo out of a fighting or character action video game. Something I'd seen in like Soul Calibur or Devil May Cry. Very over the top.
Don't worry about that low int score, if you ever get mazed you'll be out to gore the wizard next round :D
This is great because I'm about to play a Minotaur in a campaign I'm in.
dual heavy crossbows
Consider Minotaur Hunter - the synergy with Horde Breaker is huge for both Minotaur abilities ;-).
@@JuckiCZ Honestly I'm pumped because I planned to go Beast Barbarian and my DM allowed me to change the claws option to basically be bone knuckles that do bludgeoning damage instead. So I'm taking the Crusher feat, and then later I'll multiclass into Rune Knight.
I love this character.
We're obviously going to skin the runes as maze shapes, and call them Labyrinthine runes.
Instead of giants, the runes all get their power from places that people can get lost and never come back from.
The cloud rune is now the Mist rune.
The fire rune is now the Hell rune.
The hill rune is now the Barrow rune.
The storm rune is now the Mind rune.
And we're obviously going to shout "C-C-C-COMBO!" every single time we headbutt someone 15 feet into the air.
Oh sht, I played this on a one-shot a few days ago, but I never thought about launching them upward
yeah :D i've been playing a bladsong wizard/fighter multiclass (I understand its a mess but its a fun mess), its been fun pushing people into the parties aoe effects alongside pushing attacks :D
you mention the rule of "things that happen simultaniously, happen in the order the controller of the character wants them to happen"
Is it a reasonable asumption that I land a hit, trigger fire rune and crusher at the same time, then hammering horns, then the fall, ending with the enemy restrained and prone on the ground?
Yeah?
Sounds like it would work fine
I think so
if you are prone you need to use half of your speed to get up, but a restrained creature speed is 0, therefore, cannot stand up, wich means that is also prone until it stops being restrained.
@@afasdfasafd314 Now it's questionable if adding the prone condition to restrained is going to be a benefit at all. You remove advantage to attack for any attack from more than 5' away while they are both restrained and prone.
Coolness level 9000.
It would be nice to also see dpr calculations based on 4 combats and one short rest to see how much that actually affects the dpr versus 8 combats and one short rest.
Let’s get you to 50k subscribers!
I’m playing a Minotaur bear totem barbarian/battle master build and it’s fucking awesome. So much utility and out of turn shenanigans.
Yes! Minotaur! Maybe not the most optimised as written but damn is it fun!
Fully agree. I've played this build 3 times now, and had a blast every time.
I like that the other race from Ravnica got published in a non-setting book and it's a centaur! Being a mount for a Mounted Combatant Paladin is amazing
Won't work unless that paladin is small sized.
@@joelsasmad Just be a Rune fighter
@@joelsasmad that's fine. Most of their damage comes from smite
Saw an awesome build from D4 that had a centaur rogue and a Cavalier fighter mount
You could argue that because Crusher's trigger is "when you hit" and Hammering Horns' is "immediately after you hit", the target drops to the ground in that timeframe since falling is instantaneous.
So this definitely requires DM fiat.
Open Hand Monk and Battle Master Fighter don't have this problem since their pushing effects have the same trigger as Crusher, so no time passes and they decide the order of operations since it's their turn.
The DM could argue that yes - it wouldn't be RAW but DMs are allowed (and encouraged) to rule against RAW when they like.
RAW general rule is if an effect requires a trigger, it takes place after that triggering event. Specific effect text can cause it to take effect before its trigger (ala Shield spell) following the specific beats general principle.
A DM could say that the push happens first preventing this interaction, but also hilariously allowing someone to inadvertently push a creature out of their range canceling their attack lol.
"Tier II is where this character /really takes off/."
I see what you did there.
I did a mash up with the minotaur with the cheese locker and rune knight mix... If you haven't watched the other videos my weapon was pole arm with pull arm feat. Fun build.....Lacks in the skill department but that's not the main use of the character.
When you click on a minotaur video and the ad is one of those evony "fake puzzle ads," with a Minotaur boss
MOOve lich, get out the way!
If this doesn’t become a top comment…That’s just Ludacris…
@@shanelilly9673 :p
With an amazing 2 likes, it sadly it turned out to not be a very good joke at all.
Do more level ten builds need more of them on RUclips
Plan the world before you pick the race. This is why there are Krynn-Born Minotaur. This creature can't get lost, and with the Alert feat it can not get surprised. This race can hold heavy crossbows as hand held items. Pair the shove action of the horns with a shield and great weapon. So an unseen gloom stalker wandering the labyrinth with duel heavy repeating crossbows. Yikes! I promise I can create a Minotaur that is either a Krynn-worthy dragon rider, or the ultra scary underground sniper. Every Minotaur should get rope of entanglement and a net of ensnarement. oh... give psionics too
The new UA for Barbarian “Path of the GIant” made tossing people (and things) viable for any race. It’s hard to believe no one at WotC looked at this and said to themselves. “You know what?” XD
I was expecting a DaoLock Minotaur because of that picture XD
It's a fun concept, however I doubt many GM would allow you to lift creatures with Crusher. It says "Move" not "Lift"/"Displace"/"Throw"/Teleport". Any ruling with the word "move" in the game doesn't allow verticality unless specifically mentioned. To "move" on the vertical plane you need to be levitating, flying or climbing. Crusher feat doesn't send someone flying. I don't think this is a correct interpretation of the rule.
Otherwise you can argue the normal move action allows you to move up in the air too...
The shove action can instead knock the target prone if you don't want to push them! Shoving is more than just forced movement!
idea for background: a minotaur who was smaller and weaker than the other minotaurs in his village, annoyed by this, decides to run away from home, getting lost in the mountains he is taken in by the giants who teach him their magic, happy to finally be able to be as big as the rest he returns to his home only to find it destroyed, he swears revenge against those who hurt his village.
0:37 "MOO!"
I keep thinking of the movie, “Your Highness”. 😱😂
Minotaur Monk builds are kinda funny. Not the best at anything other than lower level, but Flurry of Blows them all being headbutts is fucking hilarious. Like just visualize a Minotaur hitting someone in the face with their face like 4-5 times in an ~6 second period. Love it lol.
Now with the giant barbarian you dont have to choose between giants might or rage and if you hit with an attack you can just throw people
I will point out if you take Battle Master instead you can move large creatures up to 30, 20, 15, or 5 ft in the air. Alternatively you can take the superior technique fighting style with this build to still get the 30 ft (but still only large and only once)
reminder that your hammering horns are a save; so you can debuff that with the storm rune!
I would consider giff slightly more imposing only in that minotaurs are not known for blowing literally everything up around them as much as possible.
Just watched your Eldritch Knight subclass ranking video, are you assuming level 20 in that video?
The only thing is that I think that you can't really break your attack action to use a bonus action ( hammering horns) and then make your second attack, you kinda have to use both attacks and finish your action before using your bonus action. I may be wrong though.
Still, if an ally grapples or attacks the target, ir still works, they're gonna have the advantage or are going to Lin the target down.
I stand corrected, I was thinking of the shield master combo, but that one is triggered by the attack action, you actually can do it if the trigger is not the action itself, but a hit or an attack.
With the -5/+10 of GWM or Sharpshooter, is it more efficient (in terms of to hit vs. damage) to only use that ability when you have advantage on the attack?
Enemy AC = or < 12 + Attack Mod = Swing/Shoot hard.
Dis/Advantage = -/+ 5 to Attack Mod.
If, however, in a position where only a Nat 20 will hit anyway, may as well swing for the fences.
the thumbnail reminds me of Uncle Phil throwing Jazz out of his house on Fresh Prince of Bel Air lol
What about getting Ranger (3) for swarm-keeper instead (/on top) of the barbarian levels??? to further push 5ft up? So, they fall 10-20ft? We want them to fall prone?
That'd require significant investment into wisdom, something this build cannot afford
The swarm is worded differently from the hammering horns trait. So you could horns a creature 10 feet away from you, and then your swarm would move the target another 15 feet in any horizontal direction. You could reflavor both those movements as hitting so hard you send them flying.
Getting the Wis up might be difficult, but you can ignore most of this build and go in other directions. Focus on str and wis, get dex to the 13 minimum, put any spare points in Con. Or just use standard array or roll real good
Edit: or you could take the druidic warrior fighting style on ranger, focus Wis over str, and cast shillelagh on a quarterstaff at the start of every fight.
Wasn’t there a Minotaur race option in SCAG? Did that one just not have hammering horns.
nope no race option for Minotaur in SCAG
I am surprised, that you haven't mentioned Hunter Ranger.
Horde Breaker has huge synergy with both Minotaur's abilities (works with Goring Rush enabling you to attack 2 adjacent targets after dash and can be used to push enemies together to get third attack after lvl 5), gives expertise (Athletics obviously), improves movement speed, gives non-BA dmg boost (Favoured Foe), it really seems like Hunter is the ideal Minotaur subclass.
And BTW, you would have Fog Cloud, Spike Growth or similar AoE spells in your own spellbook.
The problem with Hunter is that it helps the wrong parts of the Minotaurs kit. The charge thing is a gimmick, and making it marginally better (for the case that you both have to dash to get to an enemy and then have another one right next to them) doesn’t really outclass the ability to hit both your important feats by level 6 (crusher for flavor and tactics, GWM for damage), and Ranger overall is still one of the weakest classes out there (alongside monks), especially if you compare it to a fighter on a melee build.
You can absolutely make it work, sure. And it’s probably gonna go decent. But it does lack the shenanigans this build can get up to.
@@zerg0s Goring Rush is awesome ability - especially at lvls 1-4! You loose no attacks and are still able to Dash to get to enemy (which is sometimes difference of no dmg vs. decent dmg). And from lvl 3 it also works with Horde Breaker. So at lvls 3-4, it is no-brainer to use it, you just need 2 enemies adjacent to each other that are at least 60ft away from you (which is huge distance).
Orc’s ability to Dash as BA is even better, but it is the only thing Orcs get, Minotaur has Hammering Horns on top (which is useful at all levels).
Crusher can be good, but not necessarily needed for melee combatant. It also limits your weapon selection (no reach weapons and bad thrown weapons deal Bludgeoning). GWM is good, but only if you can get advantage from something. Samurai can solve this (with BA collision of abilities), Ranger solves this from lvl 10 on, Fighter not necessarily…
@@JuckiCZ Sure, but you have goring rush as any class with Minotaur. So the only thing hunter adds specifically is an extra attack if there's two enemies next to each other far away. After level 3. Which narrows down the fringe usefulness of Goring Rush even more. On top of the fact that you have to use your horns for both attacks, and they're... well, a 1d6 weapon. It's absolutely useful when it applies, yes! ...but how often is it gonna apply? Once per day, maybe, if we're being generous?
At the same time, Rune Knights have 2 rune uses per adventuring day, 1 per rune. One of them being the Cloud Rune. Which allows you to transfer an attack hitting someone within 30 feet of your onto someone else within 30 feet of you as a reaction. Cheesy things like hitting yourself aside, it's pretty trivial to provoke an attack of opportunity. At which point you get the "2 attacks and dash" thing as well, at the additional cost of your reaction but with way more applications outside of that small window.
Crusher might limit your selections, but the maul is pretty much the best melee weapon when you want raw damage and aren't a high level barbarian (looking at you, reckless crit). It doesn't get better than 2d6, and bludgeoning is overall less resisted than the slashing of a greatsword. The worst thrown weapons thing is true, but how often is 1d4 vs 1d6 going to make much of a difference? Especially considering you're unlikely to use them outside of fringe cases. if something is out of range for you to dash to and goring rush (so you start your next turn in melee range), it's either also out of range of your thrown weapon, or up on some platform or something where being able to push it off that platform would be much more helpful than just throwing spears at it. ...especially since crusher allows you to move it into any direction. Including forward. Off the platform. (flavoured as knocking its feet back having it fall over forward or something). And then, of course, there's the fact that if you crit, all your fellow party members have advantage against whatever you just crit'd for the rest of the turn. Which is pretty huge.
Speaking of advantage! Ranger solves it at lvl 10, Samurai at level 3. This build has an answer at lvl 5 (with the knock up fall down and extra attack) and solves it at lvl 8 with the 2 level barbarian dip. Sure, reckless attacks means you also get attacked with advantage, but you do still have that cloud rune if you get hit by a nasty crit.
Minotaur works with Ranger, but it doesn't really play into the race's strengths all that much outside of that one fringe interaction. While a Crusher fighter capitalizes on it quicker than anyone else.
@@zerg0s Agreed, with few exceptions:
That thrown weapon is not only about dmg, but also range 20/60 vs 30/120.
Yes, you can dash the same distance that Javelin can be thrown without disadvantage, but only in scenarios without difficult terrain and obstacles. So you can encounter problem when you either Dash and still don’t reach enemy, or move +throw light hammer with disadvantage, or move +throw javelin without dosadvantage and with something like Lightning Arrow or Ensnaring Strike.
And don’t get me wrong, I am not saying that this build is worse than Minotaur Hunter Ranger, I am just wondering, that he didn’t even mention Horde Breaker ability which is one of the few that work well with both Minotaur’s signature racial abilities and encourages Minotaur player to use them frequently.
Pythagoras would tell you that you moved the Drider more than 10 feet though.
Hm, would you build this with the new giant path barb? If so, what would the build look like in terms of class combos?
Just wait for my minotaur bladesong wizard to throw people around the battlefield after setting booming blades using the attack action from the back of my phantom steed.
You could do this also with only hammering horns? as it still knocks the drider 10 ft up? (I mean - this will work whether you hit the target with the maul first or not?)
The push is away from you. So if the enemy is not in the air, they won't really move up. Even if they do, they will be at 5 feet above you, not necessarily 10.
You can't choose direction with hammering horns, so you need crusher to lift them 5' so that pushing them directly away from you also pushes them upward.
@@TreantmonksTemple Could you potentially grapple someone and lift them over your head before the attack? I could see it needing some clear description, but shouldn't that put them in the right direction?
@@TreantmonksTemple But... why does away from you have to be along the ground? according to the rules, moving at a 45° angle upwards away from you still satisfy as moving directly away from you?
When you target a large creature (and you are medium - as in your drider example), you can even target a square that is "above yourself" just as with a creature raised 5ft into the air?
The rules for cover (and I know that this is a bit speculative) state how you must chose a corner to attack from, and corners of the other creature to target. If you use the corners near your own feet and track a "direction" towards the corners "above" the other creature, it would seem that while being right in front of each other, it is possible (most of the time, unless there is some kind of cover/small wall) blocking the groud, your could attack in an upward direction? Sending the creature upwards? (much like you can fill up the space of a thunderwave, target it upwards and send creatures around you flying and then falling:
^^^
^^^
cyc
- c representing other creatures hit by your thunder wave
- you representing you, left out of the thunder wave
- ^ representing additional squares above you, also hit by the thunderwave.
all of the above "drawing" naturally in 3d - if it makes any sense?
I just notice that "away from you" is not "horizontally" - as is stated in some monster stat blocks...
The question I do have to ask is: can you make a bonus action in between your attack and extra attack?
RAI, yes. Jeremy Crawford has said that Bonus Actions with no trigger can be used at any point in your turn - even disrupting a multiple attack action. Bonus Actions with triggers can interupt the attacks if their trigger is satisfied in the middle of the attacks.
So Hammering Horns "immediately after you hit" trigger is satisfied and allows it to insert before your second attack, while for example Shield Master feats "If you take an attack action" trigger isn't satisfied until all attacks are complete so cannot be inserted between the attacks of a single action.
You should make a Dhampir build
how does the char use Giant Smite if they don't dip paladin???
A quick question - if the baseline is a Warlock with hex, fighting 8 combats per day with one short rest, wouldn't it be lower due to hex running out for at least 2-3 of those combats?
Good point. However by level 5 Hex lasts 8 hours so at that point I dont think it should matter. Unless you assume concentration will get broken.
I killed a Boss, with Hammering Horns once. By pushing him off a cliff, where the fall damage was enough to kill him.
Isn’t the DC for Rune Knight based on CON not STR?
My issue with martial character is that you need a gigantic investment for 1 cool thing to do, while a spellcaster just picks a spell that works out the box.
My group is starting a new pirate campaign soon, I wanted to be a minotaur. DM said the hooves on the deck would be too slippery.
the minotaurs in Midgard campaign world are corsairs, oxen have incredible traction, which is why they pull heavy logging carts not horses.
That's really lame. Let folks have fun
Is the multi-class really necessary? We don't want to spend more of our bonus actions not Hammering Horns than we already do and at just one more level in Fighter we get to Storm Rune that let's us get that advantage on the first hit without the downside of Reckless Attack. Besides, the Hammering Horns wouldn't give us much of a mechanical bonus if we Reckless Attacked since we no longer need the advantage from prone.