The TRUTH Behind the ISO 100 MYTH that the PROS Know!
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- Опубликовано: 2 апр 2024
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In this week’s episode, we discuss the truth behind the ISO 100 myth that professional photographers know. When you're a beginner photographer, there's many techniques and "rules" you hear about. One of the most common misconceptions is the ISO 100 myth, which is the belief that one must always shoot at ISO 100 in order to create the best and cleanest possible photograph. In this video, I'll put this myth to the test to see if you can really even notice the difference between a high ISO image versus the same photograph taken at ISO 100. I guarantee you'll be surprised by the results. I hope you enjoy this week's video and as always thanks so much for watching! - Mark D.
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🔥QUESTION: Do you say "EYE-SOH" or do you say "I.S.O."?
Eye-so
I Say Izzo😂
EYE-SOH
I.S.O. gang checking in.
EYE-SOH" because that how the ISO organization states it should be pronounced.
My question ....... why do the breezes wait until you want to take a photo before they start to blow???????
I know, right!
It's like the breeze saying "cheese."
🤣🤣🤣I thought that only happens to me!
EXACTLY! Easter, we wanted family pics... the girls took position... the breeze had their hair standing straight up. It was just crazy. Not two minutes before , it was dead calm!
😂😂😂 there's always breeze! Try to take a phocus stack, an hdr image or an hdr phocus stack, you will get breeze. I think it's part of our cameras firmware
Ok. Haven't finished the video. But you up close to the monitor looking with one eye up against it made my day. 😂
😁
@@MarkDenneyPhoto a few seconds of it need to be made into a gif.
Yes a GIF from the perspective of the monitor 😳
I am old. It was A.S.A. so I have always said it as I.S.O....I may be wrong but , does is really matter? I have the position that I want my ISO high enough that I can use a decent shutter speed as well as keeping my f-stop kind of in the middle. However, I am just a hobby photographer. No one sees my pictures... rarely are they shared. It is always a dance... trying to balance the triangle to get the picture we are looking for. That's the fun of photography!
Haha, I also thought I’d pronounce ISO the way I do because of the way I used to pronounce ASA back in the film day - except I say eye-son and said ah-sa… there’s enough space on this planet for both versions I hope 😀
Same here, it was always A-S-A, and now it's I-S-O. Oldsters unite!
Iso or asa is important for film to get the other 2 correct. However digital... not sure.
Then there was also DIN in the ASA days.
I work professionally Shutter speed is important to me especially when using flash and ambient light together
Back in the before times, I remember taking my 100 foot rolls of ISO 400 film, loading it into a canister, and then shooting it at 1600 at sporting events because film with a decently high-enough ISO was too expensive for a high school student to afford. I'm just now getting back into photography (now mirrorless, I guess) and people refusing to shoot above 100 is one of the weirdest things I've ever heard.
It's funny listening to you as a landscape photographer talking about going above ISO 100 when as mainly a bird shooter I routinely shoot at anywhere from 1000 - 3200!
Especially with todays brilliant noise reduction software and sensor tech those days of worrying too much are gone.
As the old saying goes "I'd much rather have a noisy sharp shot than and clean blurry one"
But after all, it's not just about the sums. A high ISO entails a whole host of consequences. Is it possible to see your photos smashed at 3200 ISO somewhere?
@@JoannaMalak
The big problem with iso is that it's basically artificial. You're just underexposing and boosting it in the sensor instead of in post. Old cameras improved noise because their DAC didn't capture the whole sensor dynamic range, but since 2012 or so sony sensors have been pretty much iso invariant, 14 bit, and makes little difference between brightening in post vs in camera. When you shoot high iso, reminder that you lose a stop of dynamic range for every doubling of iso. If you like you clouds not clipping and also edit to bring the shadows up.. you want that extra couple stops of dynamic range unless you want it to act like a 20 year old camera in the edit. I use auto ISO. If they're not enough light, there's not enough light, but it's not like the landscape will run away from you.
According to the International Organization for Standardization, the abbreviation for their name is ISO. On their website, they go on to explain that you should pronounce the abbreviation as a word: eye-soh and that the abbreviation and its pronunciation are based on the Greek root word for equal: isos.
That’s interesting…eye-soh sounded right to me because of the Greek prefix (as in isomorphic etc.), and when he asked the question I thought of that, but I never would have imagined that’s actually where it came from
Came to find out about the ISO 100 myth I've heard absolutely no one talk about and you didn't disappoint. Great service. 👍
So well put. Using the tools you have available to create the image and/or feeling about the subject in front of you. Thanks for sharing.
Good argument for shooting in manual, and setting ISO to automatic, and letting it float. That is precisely how I shot airshows for years.
Me too works a treat.
Same.
I shoot sports and NEED my shutter speed high (3200 if possible). Shooting in manual with the aperture wide open & shutter set to 3200, the ISO has to "float" on Auto. I also prefer to set the ISO well above 100, so that it has room to "breathe". I achieve this by altering the shutter speed even faster to keep the ISO around 320. That way if it need to dip down to 200 or 100, it can.
Could not agree more!
Requires a small change in how you think about metering since you really manipulate exposure compensation more once you have chosen your shutter or f-stop for conditions, which at an air show are pretty static usually.
Auto iso. Aperture priority
For nature photography, I hate this. I’ll try to meter for a closeup of a flower for example, and I can’t easily tell how far I can go. Because ideally I could take it at native ISO, and if that means I’m shooting 1/30th then so be it (IBIS has my back). But it’ll complain if I try and do that.
Cracked me up that Gavin Hardcastle figured out how to work his way into your video!
I feel lucky sometimes that I started shooting in the film days when using higher ISO film was commonplace, 400 was one of the most common films used, especially amongst landscape photographers like me living in an area which is more famous for being rainy and overcast than sunny, these days I shoot Fujifilm and their lowest native ISO is 200 anyway so I never use 100. Living in Europe I say EYE-SOH as I think that's the norm here, you rarely hear it being pronounced I.S.O over here.
I’m so old I still say “ASA”!
What happend to DIN? lol
OG
How about Gost
I forgot what ASA stands for in DSLR Photography
@@Triplebuc50it stands for American Standards Association in relation to sensitivity of light to film. 😊
Thank you so much for sharing your useful tips. Your landscape work is so beautiful. ❤❤❤
When I got back into photography with Pentax DSLR's, which were fairly good with pushing the ISO. Down the road I switched to Nikon, found that in most cases ISO6400 is as far as I like to push things - so now ISO is maybe the 4th or 5th thing I worry about. Composition, shutter speed, aperture etc. are much more important. So I really like the fact that I can set the other two and just not worry about the ISO. I'll let the camera choose what is needed - today's camera's really do a good job with noise (and we typically have editing tools to reduce noise).
If you want real noise - push Tri-X to 800 or 1600. LOL
Thanks for reminding me I should already know this, good presentation.
Awesome video as always Mark
Great video and advise about ISO...I begin to tremble whenever I push beyond ISO 400. Thanks for a dose of courage to push it!
Cheers Mark, thank you for an awesome video, sometimes we forget how good camera's are now. Love the SSS, will help me greatly in remembering 👍
Beautifil photo samples and great advices on using ISO ! Thanks a lot !
Good video - thanks!!
Brilliant hoodie! Where did you get it from?
Great shirt for this weeks video!
you are such an inspiration i hope to see you out there some day
Good thoughts and definitely going to practice increasing my Eye-S-Oh to increase the shutter to help with increased detail I’m wanting especially when handholding my camera - thanks 📸
I follow your approach as well, well put 👌
Great vid thanks! Subbed.
Good stuff!!!
Eye-so
Great video! Just discovered your channel. Getting back into photography now that I'm retired.
Liked and subbed!
I agree also especially considering the fact that there are very powerful softwares out these days to reduce noise even more without compromising the image quality.
I so happy when you release a new video.
❤️
What a great illustration of the difference. And wow, what a beautiful area to hike around in; love those foggy mountain spots. You can almost smell the air from the video
Wow the details in the water in the waterfall of the Olympic Park are just perfect. Exactly as I like them. Awesome.
Awesome video sir
I am just at a little over six minute and I already learned something that is very useful. Thank you, Mark 😊
Hi Mark, freezing the video for a few seconds I quickly decided the one on the right was the one shot at ISO 100, from the superior clarity and resolution of the rock face to the lower right of the image. I have to say, though, I would not have put money on my assessment!!! Still, I was blown away when you said the image on the left was shot at 12,800. The largest ISO I ever shot was at 2,000 and that showed minimal grain, but the "trick"/technique I learnt is letting in enough light from what was a relatively stationary scene to illuminate the sensor, thus preventing excessive grain. It's not necessarily your high ISO that produces the grain but how you "marry" shutter speed with aperture value!. Enjoyed your video, as usual. Cheers, Frederick Jansohn
I like your statement very much. Too many photographers are fainthearted and poorly educated when it comes to higher ISO values, but it depends: point&shoot cameras with small sensors are not the best choice to crank up ISO. Your GFX will produce cleaner images just because of the bigger sensor. I also like to mention: As good as IBIS has become, it‘s no cure for moving objects, only to reduce my own motion - which is plenty to achieve.
Great video! I also of the opinion that the shutter speed is the most important, more than ISO. Great video!
Thanks Mark 👍
Hey Mark, If I may blow some smoke. Your channel is one of the few of hundreds I follow and learn from but I'll never miss one of your videos. You do a great job. I wanted to ask you this. I use micro 4 3.. GH5, GH6 and now g9ii. If I am using my 100mm to 400mm lens and I am zoomed in all the way in at 400mm (800mm equivalent) would I double the 400 or the 800 for my rule of thumb regarding shutter speed. ???? Also I was watching a bunch of solar eclipse videos. The one pro felt we should stick to the base iso so to get all the dynamic range possible. What do you think about that? I suppose it's true but not sure. Thanks again.
thanks for the info....I see that fototripper photobombed your video at 7:04.... 🙂
I say eyeso. Great discussion today on a subject that I haven't commonly heard! Thank you Mark!
I recall the Northrups covering this topic some years ago. We often hear people say "high ISO causes noise". But in truth it is poor "signal to gain ratio" that causes noise, or in other words low light. Do that picture comparison you're talking about with a very well lit scene (one high, one low ISO), then do it with a very dimly lit scene and compare those results. You will see a dramatic difference. The truth though is that today's cameras just have better sensors and can compensate for low light with higher ISO much more effectively than old gear did. I think maybe people just getting into photography might not be as fussed as us older guys by this topic.
This was a great video. Coming from the portrait world, where most of us use ISO 100 to 200, this helps me to see why I need to adjust my thinking when going out shooting in landscape. Question, do you have a formula that you use to calculate what to set your ISO to when shooting at different settings?
Camera, lenses, you need to know your equipment. I just shot a baptism in a church, no flash was allowed. Having a good lense with low aperture is a must. I don't like grainy pictures so I set my ISO range and I know well my lenses. Every situation is different. How good is your camera's stabilization system. Bottom line. Your technical knowledge is crucial. Great video. I always appreciate them.
Hi Mark, great video. I typically say eye-soo. For the longest time I insisted on staying below ISO 400, and subsequently missed a lot of opportunities because I could not get the right settings. Now I set it to what it needs to be so that I get the shot. Maybe it is not portfolio worthy, but it is a reminder of what is possible if the conditions are different. When hand holding I often will set it to auto ISO. You mention IBIS, and how it has improved. My camera does not have IBIS, but if it did, could the lenses with image stabilization be used with IS turned on along side of the IBIS? I have never heard anyone talk about this. Thanks again.
I've found recently that I really enjoy manual mode with auto ISO. I still get the creative control over SS & aperture, but without an additional setting to worry about. In the best case scenario the scene isn't noisy at all, but if it is, I can either use the newer denoising techniques or just embrace the photo with a bit of noise!
More and more people need to understand about ISO I came from the film days I had no idea you could use higher IS0. No no problem bumping it up now.
Great video and good advice. Actually Mark I'm so old I sometimes catch myself still saying ASA from the old film days. You are correct , go ahead and use the higher ISO. I was reluctant to do so but it made a noticable improvement in my photos. The high end I use is 3200. The technology is much better now so use it!
Very good information. I also believe that most keep low ISO for safety/security/snobbery/vanity reasons. Best Regards, Jay
Thanks for alleviating my fear.
I.S.O. Thanks so much Mark for your efforts in making us better photographers, you are so good at making a point that I understand.
Great stuff Mark. I'm an Eye Soh guy.
This idea is very much an example of the Dunning Kruger effect, eventually you realise that you should be prioritising the lowest ISO possible and finding other solutions to get the right exposure (longer exposures, better stabilisation, image stacking, adding light, tilt shift lenses enabling wider apertures)
The bit depth allowing gradients without banding starts becoming more important when you're doing higher end work, if you are truly content with high ISOs you shouldn't be using large sensor cameras, you are throwing away the one advantage they have which is signal to noise ratio.
I will often add grain in post, but have the colours and detail of base ISO.
In the examples in the video you can shoot multiple exposures that total the longer exposure you should be using, and mask in just the moving sections into the stacked image.
Also most high end sensors are quite invariant, meaning you can shoot at base and bump exposure in post without penalty, but with the highlight preserving advantage. Don't be afraid of shooting for the edit, your in camera shots don't have to be the exposure you want to end up with
i did a media photography/videography internship with a college when i got my first camera and i learned quickly not to be scared of higher iso (especially shooting apsc) as most of it was indoors with no extra lighting
it’s been a while since then and i’ve started to forget that, especially with a modern sony camera, i need not be shy with my iso lol
Those Greenland iceberg images are just stunning, bravo!
Thanks a lot. Very inspiring. take care! Göran in Latvia
Nice and informative video....i think modern day camera today manage the noise way better now but in the past It was signitificaly visible at highter ISO .
The main issue I'm finding with ISO atm (pretty new to photography) is the dynamic range impact. It can be a struggle to not just be blowing out the sky and I know bumping the ISO up makes the dynamic range worse! Mainly shooting things where I want a good Shutter Speed (like sport or wildlife) so it's pretty much the most extreme circumstances possible, must have high shutter speed and can't just bracket the shots!
Thanks so much for this, I’ve been under the ISO (and previously ASA) 100 delusion in so many circumstances for 4+ decades.
I probably say "EYE-SOH" most of the time, but I also remember when my film boxes had ASA/DIN on them! :) When shooting action (birds in flight) I'm still using 9-10 year old Nikons so I'm not shooting with the latest and greatest but those cameras are way ahead the 20 year old Nikons I used to shoot when it comes to usable higher ISO.
Great video. How fast is your shutter speed typically to keep the leaves sharp in the forest? Also, what do you normally have your aperture set to? Definitely eye so.
Great video! I remember when I first started I was terrified of raising the ISO super high but now Im so free with it.😂 btw, love the hoodie. got one myself and its one of my favs
Yeah, you make good points. Have had many shots that seemed fine on the LCD. But then i get home, look at them on the computer, and realize i didn’t raise my SS high enough. Lots of great shots!
Thanks!
Very good video
Great video! It would be nice if you would give the shutter speed and aperture during your narration.
Yea I believe a lot of photographers are still shell shocked from the DLSR world when if we went over 400 👀👀😬😬 things got scary quick!!!
I'm still suffering film range anxiety, 10, 12, 24 or 36 shots, and I've been using digital cameras for over 25 years.
@@geoffc1862 I’ve started my career digital but I’ve never been spray and pray. A large Majority of my shots are well thought out. I’ve also learned more to edit money work in front of the computer less time shooting.
I started buying and using digital cameras back in 1994 (Apple Quicktake 100) and analog to digital processing in today’s camera do a much better job of eliminating noise in the shadows at higher ISOs and todays sensors have greater dynamic range. 12 and 14 bit sensors also do a better job of dealing with noise than the 8 bit sensors of earlier cameras did. Earlier cameras just didn’t have fast enough processors to deal with noise whist shooting at high frame rates.
The biggest problem with noise is in cross-lit or back lit sunny scenes outdoors which are exposed for accurate highlights with solid white around 245-250 and only specular reflections allowed to ‘clip’ at 255. When exposure is biased for the highlights the darkest shadows don’t reflect enough photons to register any voltage in sensor sites and what gets amplified is any residual noise from previous exposures. The problem of shadow noise would increase with prolonged shooting due to the sensor heating up and that also doesn’t seem to be as much of an issue with new cameras.
So true. The tools in post help me use my camera at higher iso values to make the images I want. Cameras are far better than most people acknowledge at high iso.
I need that hoodie!
Thanks Mark, excellent video you explained everything is easy to understand English for the pro or novice.
ISO is in fact an acronym or abbreviation for the International Organization for Standards. I know they are not in the correct order, but it wasn't my idea.
Looking forward to more of your videos.
Great insights to give me confidence in "taking the shot" regardless of ISO. I'd like to know more about how you process high ISO shots and your thoughts on ETTR.
Basically always ETTR when you can. Boosting iso on modern (~2012+ Sony) sensors is just as good as boosting in post, short of hitting second base iso. You lose a stop of fynamic range per ISO stop because you throw away the brightest stop on the sensor. Cinema style cameras do better and shoot at ASA 800, really just 100 but underexposed by 3 stops so that you get 7-8 stops of highlights above middle grey instead of ~4 of stills cameras. Most noise in photos is individual light photons, so the more of those you have, the more tonality you have to work with for editing or such.
Great video, I think too you can pump up those numbers to get the right image.
I know in photography we shouldnt tell each other what to do, but what stood out to me in most of your photos is that the perspective tilts down a little too much in my opinion. Maybe you should look up a bit more, for more comforting photos.
That’s interesting, I immediately saw which was the better image before you even zoomed in and I’m only viewing this on my phone. The more detailed areas of the image on the left seemed to be lacking something. When it comes to analog photography film speed makes a massive difference, but developer does too. That left image looked like it could have been developed in Rodinal. 😃 I live in the U.K. where our cloud cover calls for 400 most of the time but 100 speed film looks a lot better when you can make it work.
Great video, Mark! I have two questions:
When you say that you're raising your ISO (pronounced I.S.O. lol), do you use Auto ISO? I'm on the fence with that myself, as I am using an 11 year-old Nikon d5200 that I've had since new and the ISO performance often peaks out around 1000. Also, not necessarily related, but you mentioned it...while my setup doesn't have IBIS, but a few lenses I have, do have VR, would the IBIS fight against the lens VR or would they help each other?
-Rick
I was out shooting spring flowers this week and had to bump up my iso to get a shutter speed that would prevent the flowers blurring in the breeze. Especially tough with close-up shots. By the way, eye so is correct.
I tend to select my aperture and shutter speed for whatever artistic effect I am trying to achieve. I then treat ISO(eye-so) as a support of brightness control to get my desired exposure level
I don't care how you say it, you are so on the mark, Mark! ISO saves me trying to capture moving insects and flowers in the breeze. It's also so beneficial when I can't hold steady with a macro lens - too much spinal issues and arthritis in my hands. And, my ON1 software can clean it up, no problem.
Informative video once again. To your pronunciation of ISO question - I say I.S.O. Probably because i used to say A.S.A in the film days so the cadence was the same.
I think ISO is a misnomer. We should call it SNR for signal to noise ratio. The best way to ensure noise in your photo is to not feed your sensor enough signal. Great video,Mark.
Great video!!!' I'll refer to the surf photos as an example. When you are presented with a situation where shutter speed is a key factor it would seem shutter priority (or manually set shutter and aperture) would be used. So, do you actually "bump up" the ISO or to you allow auto ISO to do its thing? Yep, I'm still in a learning phase.
EYE-SOH - Great video. I regularly shoot at ISO 800-1600.
I totally agree about shutter speed. Some other Shutter Speed/ISO considerations would be, dynamic range and subject sharpness. For an example, if you were photographing a propeller airplane in flight you would want the propeller to show motion and the airplane to be sharp.
As photographers we don’t always take photos for the average, “normal ” person to see it. Many of us actually take photos for themselves, only to enjoy the technology in the camera. As an astrophotographer, resolution is quite important, if possible I want to see the smallest galaxies deep in my image.
Thanks
Great video Mark! I think the idea that high ISOs will degrade your image somewhat is a leftover truism from the "old" film photography days. Shooting with an ISO 1000 film would make your images look like they were shot through a screen door. Modern digital cameras ( and software) do a great job with higher ISOs. That and increasingly better dynamic range is where I'd like to see camera manufacturers put their emphasis when releasing new models.
Thanks for sharing the I.S.O. info. I used Nikon DSLR cameras for as long as I can remember and always tried to keep the ISO as low as possible. Now using a high MP count mirrorless camera I have been able to shoot with a much higher ISO but rarely in the past have I went as high as 500. I thought the more MP in the sensor the more noise? Thanks Mark.
Nowdays the main reason I’m reaching to get down to iso 100 (160 for Fuji) is to actually preserve some shadows and blacks in the image., while still showing some motion or keeping up with flash sync. Which, you nailed it, it’s a shutter speed manager more than anything else
For my part it’s something like “eyessoh,” no acronym, full slur but all the phonemes present and distinct.
Noticed what looked like Gavin Hardcastle in some of the footage. Did you do a trip with him?
Mark, coud you comment on how you adapt EYE-SOH when using filters?
Do you work with manual settings for everything?
where did you get your hoodie?
I think for landscape work, you’re right. It’s hard to see the difference but for portrait work I can see the difference.
Thanks for the education. Would the type of camera one is using impact the ISO choice / quality of images at higher ISOs? Say a mirrorless vis a vis medium format? What would you advise? Thanks and keep it going...
That is one thing not really talked about here. I had three crop sensor Nikons and three FF Nikons over the years and each one was different and required experience to see what level I was happy going with. Megapixel level, sensor size and the sensor performance all make a difference. You take a medium format image and it requires less scaling to fill a particular workspace. Any perceived grain will appear smaller compared to the image size. Another assumption I see in comments is that people all always underexpose and crank exposure in post, but in many cases you still have room in aperture/ss to avoid raising iso. But I think the biggest takeaway of this video is that when you hit that wall, don’t be afraid to go higher when compromising on the other settings would negatively affect your image. There’s a juggling act to all of the points of the exposure triangle. It wasn’t directly addressed in the video but your use of the image makes a big difference. I have some early images and 35mm film scans that look fine on a small screen or print but wouldn’t work printed large unless the image itself is strong compositionally or thematically that makes technical excellence not really matter (think photojournalism). Just some food for thought.
how do these high iso photos turn out when printed on big canvas? are they still sharp or is the noise more noticeable when printed vs digital?
when I take photos around dusk, I select a minimum shutter speed of 125 to eliminate motion blur. You might be able to do something about noisy high ISO photos but you can do nothing about motion blur.
When I take bird photos with my Canon 5D mk III, birds flying around a tree, birds in the shade had artifacts as the ISO moved up for the higher shutter speed. This effect was less noticable with the Canon R5.
Thanks Mark! If possible, could you discuss EV Compensation: what it is; how to use it; and situations where it maybe required? Thanks in advance.
I’m not a photographer, I do cinematography (where you absolutely want to be more careful with your ISO) but I did a wedding back in November where I did offer to do pictures aswell and where they wanted the pictures done wasn’t ideal on terms of lighting. Although, it was cloudy which I was happy about because the lighting was very diffused. But even shooting wide open on a Sony 50mm f1.8, I had to crank up my ISO…quite a bit. Came home to put them in light room and after I applied my color grading, I did notice such a SMALL amount of noise. I’m talking SOO small. But after the color grade…it looked…good? The wedding was a rustic vibe wedding and this almost looked like film grain so…I kept it. Let’s just say that customer was so happy they sent me way more clients
The other thing is that even if you have to boost the ISO to a high value and you notice the grain like I do on my camera, Lightroom's denoise tool is brilliant. I've started doing a lot of my underground shots handheld (unless I have to lightpaint) as the results are now essentially the same as they would be on a tripod with ISO 100.