From what you've said about noise being cause by too little light on the sensor, it makes me wander if I would be better off OVER EXPOSING an image, then I could crush the image slightly in post and expect to see much less noise. Am I on the right path here?
@@scillyautomatic yes, if you can overexpose slightly without blowing out the highlights and lowering in post, you will get less noise, in part as read noise goes down with higher iso!
@@simon_dentremont Thanks so much! I spend so much of my time trying not to over expose. This video and the other ISO video completely changed my practical understanding of ISO. Like many, I still think of ISO in terms of film.
@@simon_dentremont According to your graphic image in the video, at 2:56 you show an ISO amplifier after the sensor. The signal to noise ratio is established at the sensor. Starting at 1:40 in the video you said that the aperture and shutter speed are the only way to affect the amount of light on the sensor. If I understand this correctly, then over exposing an image can only be done with a change to the aperture or shutter speed. Is that correct? Once the signal to noise ratio has been established at the sensor, any change to the ISO is not going to improve the image in the camera, right?
I used to be one of those guys that would only shoot at extremely low ISO's. But I missed so many wildlife shots that I knew I had to try something different. So I tried shooting at manual with auto ISO. It was a game-changer. I was surprised to how well those shots shot at 3200, even 6400, cleaned up. I am no longer afraid of high ISO. When I can use base ISO I do. But by loosing my fear of high ISO, I am a much better photographer.
Same with me, I used to fear anything over ISO 100. I don't know if it's the popular photography websites fault (DPreview etc) or my general misunderstanding it. They definitely highlighted cameras noise over ISO 100 and ALWAYS complained.
Adobe Denoise AI has blown my mind. I'm thinking of an ISO 12,000 pic of third graders doing a science demo at the school's science fair. Uh-oh, really, really ugly craquelure skin. Ran it through Denoise and it looked like ISO 100. Let's hope Adobe keeps shortens processing time - I can't justify the cost of an RTX 4070 for these few pics - but wouldn't it be fun to get them done in under 10 seconds!
Simon is an actual goat in the photography world. He explains things in such a clear way and is insanely humble for the level of work he’s done. Thanks Simon.
I agree, and as a photography hobbyist, I feel as though he is helping to elevate my hobby instead of talking down to me because I don't understand all of the technical details or terminology.
Some nice comments here and Simon’s videos are well deserving of them. As an ex-pro I always pick up tons of new info. I had no idea about how camera noise was generated, for example. Not a clue.
I am an electrical engineer working on electronics for spacecraft cameras. I am also a photographer. Simon knows what he is talking about. Great advice and good explanations!
but i did not agree..... because nothing for the man who want to take picture with less noise... show us how to setup camera with each situation hihihihi....it s better than talk too much and do nothing ..... finally..... listioner will not do what they need to do. because..... they did not received anything from your lession ..hihihihihihi
Nobody can show you right settings for each situation, there is so many variables. Every camera is little different, light is allways different, everything is allways little different.
It's not that other pros don't know what you do, it's the fact that you explain it in a way we all can understand. I think it's safe to say that all of us beginners appreciate your videos tremendously. Thank you for all your hard work, and creating these wonderfully helpful videos! 🙏
I love photography, but I do not earn a living from it. I have to work a regular job and then try to find time to learn and practice the art of photography. Since you do this full time I’ll always listen to you and not the comments made by others. Thank you for the explanation about ISO.
Another high signal to noise ratio video! Wildlife photography is about opportunity and the available lighting is what it is. Ignore the iso-phobists who would have you think that ISO is more important than the opportunity. Thank you Simon for being so knowledgeable and practical.
Low ISO at all costs is a massive myth. I've said it before. Simon has improved my photography so much with these videos. I never hear people talk about this type of thing in such comprehensible depth. My photos are way better nowadays. Always worth a watch
As usual, you present very concise and analytic explanations, that if understood by the viewer, can help them better understand the process of capturing images. That’s not to say it steers or limits the creative process, but gives one a better chance for success given the complex technical aspects of digital photography. Well done.
Since the late 70s, I must have exposed tens of thousands of rolls of slide and b&w film under all kinds of conditions, over many genre of photography. Never used any digital technology(including scanning) until taking the plunge a few years back with an iso invariant Fujifilm camera. All of a sudden, variables I had little or no control over, I now have creative freedom and technical means to capture images never possible as my minds eye saw them at the time. Your willingness to share your considerable expertise in such an understandable way keeps a beginner like me glued to your channel. THANK YOU SO MUCH!
I’ve never done photography and just started learning. I had also heard the same quote, “shoot at the lowest ISO”Within two days of chasing bird’s eyes in the viewfinder and trying to perfect sharp images, it immediately became apparent that higher ISO values where needed and improved my images! These are real world facts.
Totally agree. I find it helpful to think of aperture and shutter speed as “controls”, while ISO is an “indicator”. You set the first two as needed to capture the shot, and use ISO (or auto ISO) to enable the desired exposure. If you need a high ISO, that’s an “indicator” that you’re light-starved.
I became a professional photographer in 1969. I have spent much of the time since in and out of the business, returning recently as my career. Your detailed explanation is great and covers the subject thoroughly. I learned several new facts. Thank you for delving so deeply into the subject!
Freeeedom! You have released photographers out of "ISO Prison." Back in "analog days," you chose a film at a certain ISO (or ASA) because of the shooting conditions you expected to encounter. If you needed to compensate for low light, you chose a film with a higher ASA (or ISO), and vice versa. You generally had more ISO range options with black and white film. If the light you encountered didn't match your expectations, you could often end up in trouble. I "solved" this issue by sticking to ISO 400 Tri-X film and keeping a couple of neutral density filters ready if the light was really bright (yeah, grain could be an issue, but not if you weren't shooting wall-sized prints, and photos earmarked for publication would be screened anyway, so it didn't really matter at all!). Color film -- the Kodachrome or Ektachrome slide films I used -- had by today's standards, very low ISO ratings. Modern digital cameras have set us free, but we didn't even know it. Thank you for this outstanding "master key to the cellblock." We won't tell the prison warden. Ssshhh everyone! 😎
Typical amateur post. I was a pro photographer over 50 years, there indeed was no digital photography in my time. I started out as assistent photographer for the world famous Maria Austria (google her), all work was stage, ballet, opera.....the answer was, we used mainly Rolleiflex, no 35., films were Ilford HP3, which we developed at 24 c, and 8 minutes. We had no grain.As this hard working lady, had a modest income, I decided to become an advertising photographer after first also working as an assistent in one of the best paying Stdio's in Amsterdam. Later, when I thought , I learned enough, I started my own studio, smalles size was my Mamiya RZ67, and standard used 4x5" view camera. Most asa film I used was 65 ASA. The answer then was to be found, in the camera size, not the film. One could only succeed, when you educated your self to become a real pro. Not many succeeded, only a few got enough work. There were many amateurs bragging I can do it as well. Until they got a real assignment, the it became a different story. They called me, asked me if they could use my studio, which had 12000 watt per second flash. The were clueless, it made me weep.
So true. Back then if you 'pushed' 200 ASA to 400, that was it for the 20 or 36 shots on the roll. What a luxury to now be able to switch ISO for any shot. Furthermore, the higher grain looked like concrete, besides having limited dynamic range and you couldn't do much to improve things afterwards; post processing didn't exist. Ansel Adams was once asked about modern advances and he said he'd use whatever was available to give him his desired end result. Another photographer who saw great advances was Wm Henry Jackson, who used window panes and his own chemical emulsions to get photos in the 1860's that were pivotal in the establishment of the US National Park system. He lived nearly 100 years and saw the arrival of color cinematography before passing. Amazing.
i didn't know that nd filters were a great work around for film. i've pondered what y'all did for so many situations, it seemed so much more chaotic to shoot film lol
Yes after learning Analog camera, I have a feel the ISO is like a prison. But now I know what exposure I need to shot. In my opinion we should drop the ISO name and just go with gain (in db) because it should work that way, maybe?
Another superb video, many thanks. I visited Norfolk last week to shoot random churches and put your suggestions to use. Many instances shooting at ISO 400 to 800, my photos came out very clear in dull conditions
Bullseye! Bravo! Best comment of the video: “Let the photographer control the camera, not the camera control the photographer!” Just so much common sense in these two great videos on ISO myths. The images tell the truth. Well done Simon!
Thanks God there's still people like you out there! I'm so fed up of people shouting "if you don't shoot fully manual you're not a profesional photographer" , but when you look at their work, most of the times you just can't stop laughing.
Not only an excellent photographer but an excellent communicator, the seemingly complex is rendered straightforward and within the context of getting a good outcome. Thank you Simon.
Thanks Simon, the last video and this one as well are real eye-openers. It’s better let to the camera use ISO to compensate for lack of light than underexpose and try fixing it in post. If the high ISO photo is noisy, the underexposed photo with lower ISO will suffer even more from it. I have fallen into that trap way too often. Also: There is a too strong emphasis on image quality rather than quality images (and yes, I have stolen this from James Popsys).
Simon, I can honestly say I have watched a lot of videos on the topic of noise and this video is by far the best. I appreciate that it is grounded in science and explained at a level that the average photographer can grasp. Thank you so much for sharing this and keep up the great work!!
"High ISO is revealing that it was noisy, not creating the noise." A subtle nuance, and one that I was not aware of! I am enjoying my time at SDU (Simon d'Entremont University). I am amazed at the depth of knowledge you are sharing. It really is tantamount to attending college level courses in photgraphy. I think it woud be a blast to be a tag-along on one of your shoots to observe the process(es), the patience, compositional aspects, the sheer volume of shots... and the patience it takes to get the images you do! Cheers
Another Master Lesson. Something you said in a previous video has stuck with me. "Edit for Story". It is so much more important than perfect sharpness and perfect photos. I shoot mainly at sunset because the herons I shoot are the most active and most interesting at that time of the day. I generally need to shoot at a higher ISO because the sun diminishes every minute. The story comes first, and then the quality of the photo. And yes, Topaz has been a game-changer. This video was incredible. Thank you so much for being such a great teacher.
I have been slowly raising the max ISO setting the my camera will use over time so I wont miss shots. I normally shoot auto-ISO. Your explanation of the sources of noise was very useful as many don't understand there are several types of noise which are handled differently. And only a couple are important to a photographer in most normal situations.
You have just changed my whole world !!! I will no longer be a copy cat but I’ll be that cat that’s different in the pack ! Knowledge is powerful, so once you know you can’t unknow “ thanks again and keep giving us the best
Thank you, thank you for your clear, concise and easy to understand explanations. I love the ‘visuals’ you add for someone like me who is a visual learner. I might be one of those people who falls in to the category of ‘you are never too old to learn’, and what a treat to understand and improve my photography . Thank you for the time you put in to creating these RUclips videos. They are appreciated.
I love listening to professionals who know their tools and the technical aspects. Amateurs often focus on specs so much that they seem to forget that pros are as good as they are for a reason. And that reason is not only because of the image composition.
Great video and the raindrops explanation sums it up very well. In wildlife photography you're very rarely shooting stopped down, and if your camera is ISO invariant or close-to, most of the time the only real variable is shutter speed, so techniques on how to drop that with the kit you have really become key. Sometimes you just have to accept that you don't have enough light for a shot.
It's so true what you say. Getting the shot is more important than getting ideal image quality. You can sacrifice a little or get no shot at all. Thank you for the information ❤️👍🏻
Your comment at 12:05 time stamp “Get The Shot” that is the difference btwn a professional and an amateur! I’m old, 77, I was in professional analog photography from the 70s to the late 90s which included the processing & printing of b&w and color. Push processing film development and burning & dodging prints. Thanks for correcting my mistaken concept about ISO btwn analog & digital. Having taught a few adult education classes in photography & sailing you are an excellent instructor!
Oh, wow, you literally just posted the video. Superb info. It really cleared a lot of misinformation that I was exposed to about how iso works. I only just started out 4 days ago with wildlife and nature photography and somehow got to your channel and I can't stop watching your videos. I am so lucky that I found you channel, because I started following your guides and I can see myself improving everyday! It's so exciting! Everything from shot composition to exposure and autofocus settings, I started following bit by bit and noticed great improvements in my photography! Thank you!
When I first started shooting film, I learned about the grain in film. I tried shooting the lowest ISO film I could get. I screwed up so much film… slow shutter speeds, blurry images. The critics out there might want to criticize to sound smart, but you were 100% correct. Higher ISOs don’t screw up images. It increases opportunities. Stubbornly sticking at a lower ISO doesn’t make you a better photographer. It makes you frustrated. People who don’t want to learn how their digital cameras work do so at their own peril. Great job explaining the guts of the digital process, Simon.
These two videos were eye opening to me, I've always been so angry with the quality of my night photography, and also am about to go to Africa so this will be huge for me
As always Simon incredibly informative. It’s videos like this that moved me away from lowest ISO shooting a few years back when I thought it was the right thing, now I have my ISO on Auto (shock horror) and use shutter and aperture as my primary adjustments to get the image I want.
There are very few photography channels who dive this deep in the technicalities to better understand what goes on with cameras and lenses and even fewer with clear accessible explanation. Big thanks!
Man! I love how you cut through the BS and tell it like it is. I was so scared of anything over ISO 200 when I started out. I was sold that anything more would lead to crappy images. Sure do wish I had you and your valuable videos way back then! Thanks for being you Simon! You are the best! Congrats on 325,000 subs!
Your Bonus Tip is pure brilliance! Awesome examples of what “should be” terrible photos. What a beautiful way to think of photography-go take photos and make the most of what you get. I will keep that in mind the next time I start feeling angsty about imperfect conditions or equipment.
I'm 81, 56 yrs snappin' pix. Some of the most delicious photos in my memory had noise - Mark Shearman's pix of world-class and Olympic track and cross country in the 1970s. Those photos were ALIVE - the grit of Tri-X dev'd in D76 and printed for the blacks and whites really deepened the story. I was briefly in touch with Mark recently, and I am sad to have to report that those pix are not to be found online. Mark exposed for what mattered, the faces, and let the rest fall where it might.
Native ISO = Unity Gain. The more I learn about digital photography the more similarities I discover between audio engineering. Thanks again for yet another top notch video
No, 'native ISO' does not mean 'unity gain'. In truth, different cameras have different amounts of gain at base ISO, and unless you know your camera internals in detail, you won't ever know what that is. The 'similarity' between photography and audio engineering is misleading, because in audio the input and output are the same kind of thing, sound pressure waves, so you can talk about 'gain' if you want. In photography the input is light energy but the output is a perceptual recipe describing how a human should see it, regardless of the amount of light. You can't have 'gain' between completely different kinds of stimulus.
@@BobN54 Audio signal path... Mic turns sound waves into an electrical signal, goes through a preamp and then A/D converter Digital photography Sensor turns light into electrical signals, goes through a ISO Amp and then through a A/D converter With audio the goal is to increase the signal without the noise... I really can't be bothered to go into this but, you're definitely wrong... The similarities are many.
The more I learn about digital photography, the more I realize how similar the process is to music production. Many of the lessons I learned in music production carry directly to photography: microphone sensitivity(sensor), signal to noise (photographers literally call it noise, like audio noise), preamps, analogue to digital conversion, gain(ISO), post production, etc etc. Fun stuff!
I have noticed this, too. Blown out whites is practically like clipping the audio. You won't recover anything beyond the clip even if you turn down after, and it is distorted. Crushed shadows/blacks is similar to having the recorded signal far too low and you have to crank the level to compensate which raises the noise floor and introducing noise into the product. This can sacrifice the quieter nuances of an instrument. Raw files for better dynamic range much like a 24bit wav. While jpeg compression CAN be similar to over-compression on the master bus where you can lose clarity and dynamics OR lower bitrate renders. ISO being the "gain," that which will raise the noise floor also killing dynamic range. Shutter speed and aperture can be similar to mic angle and distance. Get the mic angle/distance wrong and things can get out of focus(pushed back in the mix by adding more room or losing the highs). Very similar to the softness introduced by slow shutter or failure of setting the proper aperture for focus. Still easier than producing metal genres, though. LOL
@@icaanul the analogy goes even further in the 16-bit days - excessive rounds of math due to EQ and compression would create the equivalent of banding (like someone going bananas with the curves control) which resulted in an undefinable yet audible degradation of the sound.
This lecture is so ruthless at busting myths that it put a smile on my face. Oh and gave me so much valuable information that it’s almost hard to keep track of. So well done it hurts 👏
Great technical breakdown versus the analog of film. The analogy of rain in glasses "held water" in explaining sensor saturation. Lastly, worry more about being ready for the opportunity by being confident in your camera basics. Great way to start a Friday!
Hi Simon, excellent video and above all explanation for those who needed to refresh the how and why of the importance of ISO and their adjustment in photography, I've been following you since you started posting videos and I've always been able to learn something new to be able make choices about the shot I wanted to get, sometimes succeeding, sometimes not due to my calculation and evaluation errors. Thanks again and.. see you next video 🤗
I Have watched lots and lots RUclips videos on using different settings on my new camera (Sony ZV-E10) especially for me as beginner and one thing I have learned from this video is GET THE SHOT which ever settings you need to use and do not get so hung up on getting the lowest iso setting which I always tried to do it was frustrating all I herd was get the lowest iso and you are right as a beginner that's what I followed to the letter, this video made me finally understand that having a high iso is fine after setting aperture and shutter speed for the shooting situation if you need to raise the iso then do so. Always learning. THANK YOU.
In my first-year of photography, I was told to use ISO 100. So I stayed on iso100 religiously. For landscapes, it was fine. For portrait photography with flash, it was fine. But for running and gunning doing concerts, events, weddings, wildlife, and bird photography. Especially birds in flight! I only use auto ISO and cap it off at 12800. If I go back to the first-year photography, I had so many images lost due to autofocus not working and getting blurry images from either that or the fact that I had to use to a SLOWER shutter speed. Now that I use auto ISO, I have a very, very, very high success rate. For instance I shoot on the Canon R5 and I have my first wheel for shutter speed, my second wheel for a picture which I really never use because I'm on the lowest setting the majority of the time to get more light, and most importantly my third will because I'm on auto ISO is dedicated to exposure compensation. So the wheel on the back of my R5 is exposure compensation only I can go to stops to the left and make it darker or two stops to the right to make it brighter depending on the bird or the bride to be. Two different worlds but the same settings. Now I just got a Canon R7 and the Canon R8. They only have two dedicated buttons instead of three. One is dedicated to shutter speed, and the second one is dedicated to exposure compensation. ISO 100 is the best ISO by far! But, you don't want to limit yourself being stuck on it all the time and not having good tracking, good autofocus, blurry pictures, and moments where you missed that priced shot. It's better to get the shot with a little bit of iso that you can clean up with Topaz or Lightroom then not have the shot at all. If you disagree, then you're not being professional, and you shouldn't consider yourself a professional because you're limiting yourself. Professionals are Pros because they don't put limitations on their selves. Thank you, Simon, for all the great videos. And everybody every village has its own idiot. And there's no shortages in the RUclips comment section. I used to post in photography groups, and there would always be people with negative comments. There's always that one person who knows everything. But when you go to their wall and look at their pictures, they're usually the most amateur picture of all, or they have no pictures. Just like a lot of people in the comments sections. They know everything , but they don't have a RUclips channel to show and explain. In the end, let them stay on ISO 100, and we can use manual with auto ISO and keep getting all the great shots. 😅😅😅😅😅... because at the end of the day, it's not our comments that speak for us it's our images!!
Excellent. I watched this fairly early in the morning EST and my brain was not quite prepared for the detailed info! I grew up in the days of Kodachrome 25. A time when pushing black and white film to ASA 1600 required all sorts of voodoo chemistry incantations. The selection of ISOs and their quality in today’s digital world is incredible. Thank you for going beyond your duty to explain complex issues in ways that are easy to understand.
Great video. Two things I want to add: 1. It's important to differentiate between full frame cameras and crop sensor cameras. With full frame sensors, you can go on much higher ISO without ruining the shot. Especially with the new denoise AIs, they can't reliably handle for instance ISO 6400 on a micro four-thirds sensor. Textures will look very weird. 2. When turning up ISO, as mentioned in the video, you sacrifice your full well capacity. For instance, look up the astro camera asi 294 mc pro color. You will find some charts on this one for sure (as I am looking at one from the web right now) and you can see that at ISO (or gain) 120, the camera operates at a full well capacity of only 11k down from 64k (!). That means you lose an insane amount of information (82%) your sensor is then able to collect. It's true that you should not let ISO keep you from shooting (as there are fairly noisy images that won prices), but you should be mindful about what you do when increasing ISO. Turn ISO down first thing if you can, and turn it up at last if you need.
I often use higher ISOs on my OM1. I have not done any tests, but the general idea applies to MFT. Perhaps there is one stop of difference, but the physical size of the sensor is just one factor. I find that learning how to use the camera is almost as important as learning photography. :D
Actually I did one test: a shot of black pants in a nearly pitch dark room. Hardly a work of art, but this convinced that noise is not worth any worry.
I am planning to buy my first dslr and still watching youtube for information. I learned and truly understood everything in this video even though I have zero idea about photography, That's how good this video is.
Keeping ISO's low is more important for small sensor cameras. For those cameras high ISO is so destructive, it's worth it to use low iso and the extra effort to protect it (stabilization/tripod/flash/etc) to preserve more dynamic range.
Measured and thoughtful advice from someone who really understands their equipment, and is clearly speaking from deep experience in the real world. I've seen lots of opinions (on Reddit, mainly) from folks who can recite the textbook theory behind photography and videography principles, but who clearly don't actually exercise those theories in real-world situations, and therefore don't fully understand the limitations (or when to bend or break the rules). Thank you for sharing!
I have my camera configured with 3 user profiles - each is aperture priority, auto-iso, but the minimum shutter speed is different (and for one the bitdepth is too to get higher framerate). This way, I have a main profile with 1/1000 minimum shutter speed for 90% of my wildlife work, and a 1/125 profile for when the subject is static and I am willing to go with a lower noise. Leaning to accept noise was an important step in my photography journey and it saddens me how much shots I 'lost' because I was too worried about going away from ISO100, and as a result ended up with a blurry photo because of a moving subject. Especially with the capability of AI noise removal in tools like lightroom and Topaz Labs makes me not worry at all even shooting at ISO25600. Also, Simon, are you by any chance an electrical engineer by trade? There is something about the way that you use gain, SNR, shot noise etc... that only us engineers tend to have.
Great video and explanation! I totally agree - the fear of having reduced dynamic range with higher ISOs does not make any sense because if a scene has a high dynamic range, you don’t need high ISO, since high dynamic range requires always a lot of light in some parts of the image.
Wow, Simon, you ought to be in the diplomatic service. Never in my life (mid-70s) have I seen anyone tell a ragtag collection of pseudo-experts to "go pound sand" (and why they should) as patiently and kindly as you have here. Your videos continue to be a wealth of accurate information and concise explanations, all seasoned with confidence-building affirmations for photographers at all levels. Thank you!
Absolutely spot-on - agree with everything you say. These days, with such good noise-reduction software available, I almost always use auto-ISO on my R5 - getting the shutter speed and aperture right is far and away more important. Get the shot, then deal with any noise afterwards - otherwise, you don't have the shot.
This video make me realized that im stuck following people's opinion that using low ISO is the better. Which I am indeed a newb in this photography thingy, it has been causing me hard time to take a good photos while keeping the ISO low. Big great thanks for the advice.
Simon I completely agree with you on letting the camera determine ISO in Auto ISO mode. At the 16 minute mark of your video you said to underexpose for a dark contrasty look with a flat looking subject. Well I had this situation two weeks ago. I was watching and photographing at Great Blue Heron sitting on a railing at a pond in Scarborough Ontario. I underexposed by 1 stop to avoid overexposure on the Heron. But when it took off and flew the lighting completely changed. He flew low across the water that was dark against a dark background of reflected trees way out of focus. All it took was a small bit of lightening in editing to produce some of the best images I have ever taken. So going for a darker image is what made all the difference.
Love your focus on the practical aspects. The bit about tempering “the lowest ISO possible” advice to put necessary shutter and aperture settings first is perfect. So often an almost proper rule gets misinterpreted due to insufficient understanding or misplaced emphasis. Your effective communication is a joy to hear.
You have THE ONLY RUclips opening intro worth watching and worth watching again! Thank for making it immediately informative and beautiful to watch. OK, guess I better go watch the rest of the video.
I used to parrot so many of these things back when I was first starting my digital photography journey, and especially when I come from the film/TV world where there's an obsession about getting as technically perfect an image as possible, it was VERY hard to knock that out of my head. I've had a bit of a rebirth with my photography this year and have been learning to embrace the 'imperfections', and shoot how I want to, not how I think other people say I should. Loving your videos, Simon, and I find myself actually enthused about learning from your videos rather than skipping through like I do so many other photographers trying to teach things (you've managed to subvert my ADHD!). You keep it simple and explanations are wonderful. The gist of this video lines up perfectly with how I'm now approaching my photography work; just get the shot, and don't sweat the details.
As someone with a background in research in (military) electro-optic sensing, your explanations of the sources and significance of image noise are perfectly clear and perfectly correct. This would be a good video for 3rd year electrical engineering students. Well done Simon!
A model of how to deal with various critical comments, some just wrong and some only partly correct. Simply an opportunity to give further information. Not defensive. Just a masterly demonstration of expertise.
I love that Simon communicates so effectively in a way that applies to simple amateur folk like me, yet opens a window onto expert level understanding. I'm a techie and had never really understood digital ISO before this video, and that lovely explanation of shot noise. This is an absolutely brilliant explanation of noise.
I started photography with an old Canon 80D... always on auto-ISO. I continued for a few years with a Canon 6D Mk2... always on auto-ISO. Now I'm using my dream camera, an old 1Dx Mk3... and guess what... I've set it to auto-ISO from day one. And it's always beautiful. THANK YOU / MERCI BIEN!!! 👍🏼 ... 🇨🇵🤝🏻🇨🇦
Your explanations are the best-clear, concise, and practical! As an intermediate amateur whose “wildlife” is my only grandchild, all I really care about is getting the shot.
You have to be the best photography teacher on the Net. Absolutely brilliant. Simple and to the point with truth and madd skills to back it up. Thank you.
I dont think you steared anyone wrong, I think MANY have a size of the knoggin problem. Photography is one of the few hobbies/paid work ive done where ive seen this A LOT. I enjoy passing my photography knowledge on and I think your passing on great knowlege. Keep up the good work. I enjoy your videos.
This is exactly the kind of video I needed as a beginner who’s trying to take photography more seriously. It makes complete sense, thanks for the lesson!
This video is so true. Not just for camera but for anything, too many people just care too much about the numbers, the theoretic sciences, and the "best settings" so they forgot some basic facts: the machines are made for suit your needs, not otherwise. Get the shot, use whatever the settings that fit the moment. The story behind the photo matters, not the details of how many stop of dynamic range or low noises after 200% zooms.
Exactly! Everything you said I proved at my biggest event of the year. I had a media team of 5 photographers. I had myself as the lead photographer (media team lead) 2 absolute amateurs, 1 intermediate, and another that bordered on professional. I have embraced the, "just get the shot" and the results were staggering. Out of the over 1000 photos from that weekend that were used, over 50% I shot. I will be passing this information to my team next time as I didn't realize just how much of a difference it would make. It's drastic. I stand by this information you put out there.
This was a brilliant way to address the comments. What better way to respond to the comments claiming you don't know what you're talking about than to flex how much you actually know? You did it in terms simple enough that I, a budding photographer, can understand. I'm a videographer and documentary filmmaker and I'm recently getting into photography. Everything you said in this video and others I've watched from you has been gold. Thanks for passing on the knowledge.
Perfect response Simon. We should not forget the following: Getting a usable shot is the most important factor. With the advance and state of tools like Topaz etc. it is a breeze to clean up higher noise photos. Great video. 👌🏼
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From what you've said about noise being cause by too little light on the sensor, it makes me wander if I would be better off OVER EXPOSING an image, then I could crush the image slightly in post and expect to see much less noise. Am I on the right path here?
@@scillyautomatic yes, if you can overexpose slightly without blowing out the highlights and lowering in post, you will get less noise, in part as read noise goes down with higher iso!
@@simon_dentremont Thanks so much! I spend so much of my time trying not to over expose. This video and the other ISO video completely changed my practical understanding of ISO. Like many, I still think of ISO in terms of film.
@@simon_dentremont
According to your graphic image in the video, at 2:56 you show an ISO amplifier after the sensor.
The signal to noise ratio is established at the sensor. Starting at 1:40 in the video you said that the aperture and shutter speed are the only way to affect the amount of light on the sensor.
If I understand this correctly, then over exposing an image can only be done with a change to the aperture or shutter speed. Is that correct?
Once the signal to noise ratio has been established at the sensor, any change to the ISO is not going to improve the image in the camera, right?
You're a great teacher
I used to be one of those guys that would only shoot at extremely low ISO's. But I missed so many wildlife shots that I knew I had to try something different. So I tried shooting at manual with auto ISO. It was a game-changer. I was surprised to how well those shots shot at 3200, even 6400, cleaned up. I am no longer afraid of high ISO. When I can use base ISO I do. But by loosing my fear of high ISO, I am a much better photographer.
Excellent!!
I was so guilty of this and would freak out when it got passed like 500 had so much to learn
Same with me. DON'T FEAR HIGH ISO.
Same with me, I used to fear anything over ISO 100. I don't know if it's the popular photography websites fault (DPreview etc) or my general misunderstanding it. They definitely highlighted cameras noise over ISO 100 and ALWAYS complained.
Adobe Denoise AI has blown my mind. I'm thinking of an ISO 12,000 pic of third graders doing a science demo at the school's science fair. Uh-oh, really, really ugly craquelure skin. Ran it through Denoise and it looked like ISO 100. Let's hope Adobe keeps shortens processing time - I can't justify the cost of an RTX 4070 for these few pics - but wouldn't it be fun to get them done in under 10 seconds!
Simon is an actual goat in the photography world. He explains things in such a clear way and is insanely humble for the level of work he’s done. Thanks Simon.
I agree, and as a photography hobbyist, I feel as though he is helping to elevate my hobby instead of talking down to me because I don't understand all of the technical details or terminology.
goats are sometimes nice yes but they are odd sometimes just depends on the times.
Some nice comments here and Simon’s videos are well deserving of them. As an ex-pro I always pick up tons of new info. I had no idea about how camera noise was generated, for example. Not a clue.
@@AlanLavender You might have been on the "need to know" program haha :)
@@AlanLavender Same here!
I am an electrical engineer working on electronics for spacecraft cameras. I am also a photographer. Simon knows what he is talking about. Great advice and good explanations!
That actually menas alot to me. thanks.
but i did not agree..... because nothing for the man who want to take picture with less noise... show us how to setup camera with each situation hihihihi....it s better than talk too much and do nothing ..... finally..... listioner will not do what they need to do. because..... they did not received anything from your lession ..hihihihihihi
Yes sir ✅
Nobody can show you right settings for each situation, there is so many variables. Every camera is little different, light is allways different, everything is allways little different.
@@khanhchu11 Skill issue if you can't understand high level concepts. Some people really want every single thing spoon fed to them.
It's not that other pros don't know what you do, it's the fact that you explain it in a way we all can understand. I think it's safe to say that all of us beginners appreciate your videos tremendously. Thank you for all your hard work, and creating these wonderfully helpful videos! 🙏
Glad to help!
I love photography, but I do not earn a living from it. I have to work a regular job and then try to find time to learn and practice the art of photography. Since you do this full time I’ll always listen to you and not the comments made by others. Thank you for the explanation about ISO.
Words of wisdom.
Amen🙏
Word.
Same with me!
Another high signal to noise ratio video! Wildlife photography is about opportunity and the available lighting is what it is. Ignore the iso-phobists who would have you think that ISO is more important than the opportunity. Thank you Simon for being so knowledgeable and practical.
Thanks for sharing!
Easily the best photography channel on RUclips that I have come across...
Wow, thanks!
Low ISO at all costs is a massive myth. I've said it before. Simon has improved my photography so much with these videos. I never hear people talk about this type of thing in such comprehensible depth. My photos are way better nowadays. Always worth a watch
Great to hear!
As usual, you present very concise and analytic explanations, that if understood by the viewer, can help them better understand the process of capturing images. That’s not to say it steers or limits the creative process, but gives one a better chance for success given the complex technical aspects of digital photography. Well done.
Many thanks!
Since the late 70s, I must have exposed tens of thousands of rolls of slide and b&w film under all kinds of conditions, over many genre of photography. Never used any digital technology(including scanning) until taking the plunge a few years back with an iso invariant Fujifilm camera. All of a sudden, variables I had little or no control over, I now have creative freedom and technical means to capture images never possible as my minds eye saw them at the time. Your willingness to share your considerable expertise in such an understandable way keeps a beginner like me glued to your channel. THANK YOU SO MUCH!
I’ve never done photography and just started learning. I had also heard the same quote, “shoot at the lowest ISO”Within two days of chasing bird’s eyes in the viewfinder and trying to perfect sharp images, it immediately became apparent that higher ISO values where needed and improved my images! These are real world facts.
The raindrop analogy was pure gold, not to be forgotten. Thanks a lot.
Totally agree. I find it helpful to think of aperture and shutter speed as “controls”, while ISO is an “indicator”. You set the first two as needed to capture the shot, and use ISO (or auto ISO) to enable the desired exposure. If you need a high ISO, that’s an “indicator” that you’re light-starved.
100 pct
I became a professional photographer in 1969. I have spent much of the time since in and out of the business, returning recently as my career.
Your detailed explanation is great and covers the subject thoroughly. I learned several new facts. Thank you for delving so deeply into the subject!
Freeeedom! You have released photographers out of "ISO Prison." Back in "analog days," you chose a film at a certain ISO (or ASA) because of the shooting conditions you expected to encounter. If you needed to compensate for low light, you chose a film with a higher ASA (or ISO), and vice versa. You generally had more ISO range options with black and white film. If the light you encountered didn't match your expectations, you could often end up in trouble. I "solved" this issue by sticking to ISO 400 Tri-X film and keeping a couple of neutral density filters ready if the light was really bright (yeah, grain could be an issue, but not if you weren't shooting wall-sized prints, and photos earmarked for publication would be screened anyway, so it didn't really matter at all!). Color film -- the Kodachrome or Ektachrome slide films I used -- had by today's standards, very low ISO ratings. Modern digital cameras have set us free, but we didn't even know it. Thank you for this outstanding "master key to the cellblock." We won't tell the prison warden. Ssshhh everyone! 😎
Typical amateur post. I was a pro photographer over 50 years, there indeed was no digital photography in my time. I started out as assistent photographer for the world famous Maria Austria (google her), all work was stage, ballet, opera.....the answer was, we used mainly Rolleiflex, no 35., films were Ilford HP3, which we developed at 24 c, and 8 minutes. We had no grain.As this hard working lady, had a modest income, I decided to become an advertising photographer after first also working as an assistent in one of the best paying Stdio's in Amsterdam. Later, when I thought , I learned enough, I started my own studio, smalles size was my Mamiya RZ67, and standard used 4x5" view camera. Most asa film I used was 65 ASA. The answer then was to be found, in the camera size, not the film. One could only succeed, when you educated your self to become a real pro. Not many succeeded, only a few got enough work. There were many amateurs bragging I can do it as well. Until they got a real assignment, the it became a different story. They called me, asked me if they could use my studio, which had 12000 watt per second flash. The were clueless, it made me weep.
So true. Back then if you 'pushed' 200 ASA to 400, that was it for the 20 or 36 shots on the roll. What a luxury to now be able to switch ISO for any shot. Furthermore, the higher grain looked like concrete, besides having limited dynamic range and you couldn't do much to improve things afterwards; post processing didn't exist. Ansel Adams was once asked about modern advances and he said he'd use whatever was available to give him his desired end result. Another photographer who saw great advances was Wm Henry Jackson, who used window panes and his own chemical emulsions to get photos in the 1860's that were pivotal in the establishment of the US National Park system. He lived nearly 100 years and saw the arrival of color cinematography before passing. Amazing.
i didn't know that nd filters were a great work around for film. i've pondered what y'all did for so many situations, it seemed so much more chaotic to shoot film lol
Yes after learning Analog camera, I have a feel the ISO is like a prison. But now I know what exposure I need to shot. In my opinion we should drop the ISO name and just go with gain (in db) because it should work that way, maybe?
I still can't believe how good a teacher you are - your knowledge and easy way of describing complex material is beyond amazing.
Wow, thank you!
Another superb video, many thanks.
I visited Norfolk last week to shoot random churches and put your suggestions to use. Many instances shooting at ISO 400 to 800, my photos came out very clear in dull conditions
Bullseye! Bravo! Best comment of the video: “Let the photographer control the camera, not the camera control the photographer!” Just so much common sense in these two great videos on ISO myths. The images tell the truth. Well done Simon!
Totally did not expect physics and electrical engineer lessons here. I love your channel.
Edit: also the bonus tip deserves a video on its own.
Thanks God there's still people like you out there! I'm so fed up of people shouting "if you don't shoot fully manual you're not a profesional photographer" , but when you look at their work, most of the times you just can't stop laughing.
Not only an excellent photographer but an excellent communicator, the seemingly complex is rendered straightforward and within the context of getting a good outcome. Thank you Simon.
I agree with everything you are saying! In wildlife you only have one chance to capture a moment! “GET THE SHOT!” Thanks for taking me along!
Thanks Simon, the last video and this one as well are real eye-openers. It’s better let to the camera use ISO to compensate for lack of light than underexpose and try fixing it in post. If the high ISO photo is noisy, the underexposed photo with lower ISO will suffer even more from it. I have fallen into that trap way too often.
Also: There is a too strong emphasis on image quality rather than quality images (and yes, I have stolen this from James Popsys).
Great saying! James has a great channel!
James has another one about 'Not being micro-lazy', you are there, brought the gear you need but won't get it out of the bag.
Haha I was thinking about James’ saying too. Some of the best image quality photos I have are actually my worst.
1000% My photography shifted when I stopped listening to the myths of shooting with ISO. Fantastic video. Thank you.
Simon, I can honestly say I have watched a lot of videos on the topic of noise and this video is by far the best. I appreciate that it is grounded in science and explained at a level that the average photographer can grasp. Thank you so much for sharing this and keep up the great work!!
Glad it was helpful!
"High ISO is revealing that it was noisy, not creating the noise." A subtle nuance, and one that I was not aware of! I am enjoying my time at SDU (Simon d'Entremont University). I am amazed at the depth of knowledge you are sharing. It really is tantamount to attending college level courses in photgraphy.
I think it woud be a blast to be a tag-along on one of your shoots to observe the process(es), the patience, compositional aspects, the sheer volume of shots... and the patience it takes to get the images you do!
Cheers
Another Master Lesson. Something you said in a previous video has stuck with me. "Edit for Story". It is so much more important than perfect sharpness and perfect photos. I shoot mainly at sunset because the herons I shoot are the most active and most interesting at that time of the day. I generally need to shoot at a higher ISO because the sun diminishes every minute. The story comes first, and then the quality of the photo. And yes, Topaz has been a game-changer. This video was incredible. Thank you so much for being such a great teacher.
Man is so immensely knowledgeable, and well spoken, that it's hard to imagine that he gets much, if any, negative feedback on these videos.
There are always a few…some decent, critical thinkers (which I actually appreciate) and some are trolls, who I don’t waste energy on.
I have been slowly raising the max ISO setting the my camera will use over time so I wont miss shots. I normally shoot auto-ISO.
Your explanation of the sources of noise was very useful as many don't understand there are several types of noise which are handled differently. And only a couple are important to a photographer in most normal situations.
senpai simon teaching science today. you never fail to educate. much thanks
You have just changed my whole world !!! I will no longer be a copy cat but I’ll be that cat that’s different in the pack ! Knowledge is powerful, so once you know you can’t unknow “ thanks again and keep giving us the best
Thank you, thank you for your clear, concise and easy to understand explanations. I love the ‘visuals’ you add for someone like me who is a visual learner. I might be one of those people who falls in to the category of ‘you are never too old to learn’, and what a treat to understand and improve my photography . Thank you for the time you put in to creating these RUclips videos. They are appreciated.
Awesome, thank you!
I love listening to professionals who know their tools and the technical aspects.
Amateurs often focus on specs so much that they seem to forget that pros are as good as they are for a reason. And that reason is not only because of the image composition.
Great video and the raindrops explanation sums it up very well.
In wildlife photography you're very rarely shooting stopped down, and if your camera is ISO invariant or close-to, most of the time the only real variable is shutter speed, so techniques on how to drop that with the kit you have really become key.
Sometimes you just have to accept that you don't have enough light for a shot.
Don't let these comments by noobs get to you Simon, you are very knowledgeable and I learned a lot from you, even after owning dslrs for 15 years.
It's so true what you say. Getting the shot is more important than getting ideal image quality. You can sacrifice a little or get no shot at all. Thank you for the information ❤️👍🏻
Your comment at 12:05 time stamp “Get The Shot” that is the difference btwn a professional and an amateur! I’m old, 77, I was in professional analog photography from the 70s to the late 90s which included the processing & printing of b&w and color. Push processing film development and burning & dodging prints. Thanks for correcting my mistaken concept about ISO btwn analog & digital. Having taught a few adult education classes in photography & sailing you are an excellent instructor!
Oh, wow, you literally just posted the video. Superb info. It really cleared a lot of misinformation that I was exposed to about how iso works. I only just started out 4 days ago with wildlife and nature photography and somehow got to your channel and I can't stop watching your videos. I am so lucky that I found you channel, because I started following your guides and I can see myself improving everyday! It's so exciting! Everything from shot composition to exposure and autofocus settings, I started following bit by bit and noticed great improvements in my photography! Thank you!
Welcome to the club!
@@simon_dentremont Thank you! I feel welcome!
When I first started shooting film, I learned about the grain in film. I tried shooting the lowest ISO film I could get. I screwed up so much film… slow shutter speeds, blurry images.
The critics out there might want to criticize to sound smart, but you were 100% correct. Higher ISOs don’t screw up images. It increases opportunities. Stubbornly sticking at a lower ISO doesn’t make you a better photographer. It makes you frustrated. People who don’t want to learn how their digital cameras work do so at their own peril.
Great job explaining the guts of the digital process, Simon.
These two videos were eye opening to me, I've always been so angry with the quality of my night photography, and also am about to go to Africa so this will be huge for me
The lessons you get here is so much better than you get from anywhere else.
As always Simon incredibly informative. It’s videos like this that moved me away from lowest ISO shooting a few years back when I thought it was the right thing, now I have my ISO on Auto (shock horror) and use shutter and aperture as my primary adjustments to get the image I want.
There are very few photography channels who dive this deep in the technicalities to better understand what goes on with cameras and lenses and even fewer with clear accessible explanation. Big thanks!
Wow, thanks!
Man! I love how you cut through the BS and tell it like it is. I was so scared of anything over ISO 200 when I started out. I was sold that anything more would lead to crappy images. Sure do wish I had you and your valuable videos way back then! Thanks for being you Simon! You are the best! Congrats on 325,000 subs!
I appreciate that!
Every photographer needs to see this video.
Your Bonus Tip is pure brilliance! Awesome examples of what “should be” terrible photos. What a beautiful way to think of photography-go take photos and make the most of what you get. I will keep that in mind the next time I start feeling angsty about imperfect conditions or equipment.
I've never seen such an easy-to-understand and cogent explanation of what causes the noise.
I'm 81, 56 yrs snappin' pix. Some of the most delicious photos in my memory had noise - Mark Shearman's pix of world-class and Olympic track and cross country in the 1970s. Those photos were ALIVE - the grit of Tri-X dev'd in D76 and printed for the blacks and whites really deepened the story. I was briefly in touch with Mark recently, and I am sad to have to report that those pix are not to be found online. Mark exposed for what mattered, the faces, and let the rest fall where it might.
56 years of photographing. Australian nature and you, sir, are a breath of fresh air!
Native ISO = Unity Gain. The more I learn about digital photography the more similarities I discover between audio engineering. Thanks again for yet another top notch video
For sure!
No, 'native ISO' does not mean 'unity gain'. In truth, different cameras have different amounts of gain at base ISO, and unless you know your camera internals in detail, you won't ever know what that is. The 'similarity' between photography and audio engineering is misleading, because in audio the input and output are the same kind of thing, sound pressure waves, so you can talk about 'gain' if you want. In photography the input is light energy but the output is a perceptual recipe describing how a human should see it, regardless of the amount of light. You can't have 'gain' between completely different kinds of stimulus.
@@BobN54 you're wrong.
End of....
@@BobN54
Audio signal path...
Mic turns sound waves into an electrical signal, goes through a preamp and then A/D converter
Digital photography
Sensor turns light into electrical signals, goes through a ISO Amp and then through a A/D converter
With audio the goal is to increase the signal without the noise...
I really can't be bothered to go into this but, you're definitely wrong... The similarities are many.
@@AetherScout Sorry, you're wrong to say I'm wrong. Is that wrong squared?
I aspire to be this humble. My favorite photography tip channel on the internet. This guy is so good at presenting information
Wow, thanks!
The more I learn about digital photography, the more I realize how similar the process is to music production. Many of the lessons I learned in music production carry directly to photography: microphone sensitivity(sensor), signal to noise (photographers literally call it noise, like audio noise), preamps, analogue to digital conversion, gain(ISO), post production, etc etc. Fun stuff!
same!
Levels adjustments, colour adjustments etc in image editing software have many parallels too.
I have noticed this, too. Blown out whites is practically like clipping the audio. You won't recover anything beyond the clip even if you turn down after, and it is distorted. Crushed shadows/blacks is similar to having the recorded signal far too low and you have to crank the level to compensate which raises the noise floor and introducing noise into the product. This can sacrifice the quieter nuances of an instrument. Raw files for better dynamic range much like a 24bit wav. While jpeg compression CAN be similar to over-compression on the master bus where you can lose clarity and dynamics OR lower bitrate renders. ISO being the "gain," that which will raise the noise floor also killing dynamic range. Shutter speed and aperture can be similar to mic angle and distance. Get the mic angle/distance wrong and things can get out of focus(pushed back in the mix by adding more room or losing the highs). Very similar to the softness introduced by slow shutter or failure of setting the proper aperture for focus.
Still easier than producing metal genres, though. LOL
@@icaanul the analogy goes even further in the 16-bit days - excessive rounds of math due to EQ and compression would create the equivalent of banding (like someone going bananas with the curves control) which resulted in an undefinable yet audible degradation of the sound.
This lecture is so ruthless at busting myths that it put a smile on my face. Oh and gave me so much valuable information that it’s almost hard to keep track of. So well done it hurts 👏
Set the shutter speed and aperture and let the camera select the correct ISO is THE Golden Tip for me!!! Tjs a lot 🎉
Thanks for sharing!!
Great technical breakdown versus the analog of film. The analogy of rain in glasses "held water" in explaining sensor saturation. Lastly, worry more about being ready for the opportunity by being confident in your camera basics. Great way to start a Friday!
Hi Simon, excellent video and above all explanation for those who needed to refresh the how and why of the importance of ISO and their adjustment in photography, I've been following you since you started posting videos and I've always been able to learn something new to be able make choices about the shot I wanted to get, sometimes succeeding, sometimes not due to my calculation and evaluation errors. Thanks again and.. see you next video 🤗
I Have watched lots and lots RUclips videos on using different settings on my new camera (Sony ZV-E10) especially for me as beginner and one thing I have learned from this video is GET THE SHOT which ever settings you need to use and do not get so hung up on getting the lowest iso setting which I always tried to do it was frustrating all I herd was get the lowest iso and you are right as a beginner that's what I followed to the letter, this video made me finally understand that having a high iso is fine after setting aperture and shutter speed for the shooting situation if you need to raise the iso then do so. Always learning. THANK YOU.
In my first-year of photography, I was told to use ISO 100. So I stayed on iso100 religiously. For landscapes, it was fine. For portrait photography with flash, it was fine. But for running and gunning doing concerts, events, weddings, wildlife, and bird photography. Especially birds in flight! I only use auto ISO and cap it off at 12800. If I go back to the first-year photography, I had so many images lost due to autofocus not working and getting blurry images from either that or the fact that I had to use to a SLOWER shutter speed. Now that I use auto ISO, I have a very, very, very high success rate. For instance I shoot on the Canon R5 and I have my first wheel for shutter speed, my second wheel for a picture which I really never use because I'm on the lowest setting the majority of the time to get more light, and most importantly my third will because I'm on auto ISO is dedicated to exposure compensation. So the wheel on the back of my R5 is exposure compensation only I can go to stops to the left and make it darker or two stops to the right to make it brighter depending on the bird or the bride to be. Two different worlds but the same settings. Now I just got a Canon R7 and the Canon R8. They only have two dedicated buttons instead of three. One is dedicated to shutter speed, and the second one is dedicated to exposure compensation. ISO 100 is the best ISO by far! But, you don't want to limit yourself being stuck on it all the time and not having good tracking, good autofocus, blurry pictures, and moments where you missed that priced shot. It's better to get the shot with a little bit of iso that you can clean up with Topaz or Lightroom then not have the shot at all. If you disagree, then you're not being professional, and you shouldn't consider yourself a professional because you're limiting yourself. Professionals are Pros because they don't put limitations on their selves. Thank you, Simon, for all the great videos. And everybody every village has its own idiot. And there's no shortages in the RUclips comment section. I used to post in photography groups, and there would always be people with negative comments. There's always that one person who knows everything. But when you go to their wall and look at their pictures, they're usually the most amateur picture of all, or they have no pictures. Just like a lot of people in the comments sections. They know everything , but they don't have a RUclips channel to show and explain. In the end, let them stay on ISO 100, and we can use manual with auto ISO and keep getting all the great shots. 😅😅😅😅😅... because at the end of the day, it's not our comments that speak for us it's our images!!
Righto!
Thank you for all the GREAT content and being an Inspiration to another of us!
Excellent. I watched this fairly early in the morning EST and my brain was not quite prepared for the detailed info!
I grew up in the days of Kodachrome 25. A time when pushing black and white film to ASA 1600 required all sorts of voodoo chemistry incantations.
The selection of ISOs and their quality in today’s digital world is incredible. Thank you for going beyond your duty to explain complex issues in ways that are easy to understand.
Thanks for all the consistent content. As a new photographer I love your insights!
Glad you like them!
So refreshing to find a real pro photographer sharing knowledge-not trying sell photo equipment for their sponsors. Great videos, sir. 👏
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great video. Two things I want to add:
1. It's important to differentiate between full frame cameras and crop sensor cameras. With full frame sensors, you can go on much higher ISO without ruining the shot. Especially with the new denoise AIs, they can't reliably handle for instance ISO 6400 on a micro four-thirds sensor. Textures will look very weird.
2. When turning up ISO, as mentioned in the video, you sacrifice your full well capacity. For instance, look up the astro camera asi 294 mc pro color. You will find some charts on this one for sure (as I am looking at one from the web right now) and you can see that at ISO (or gain) 120, the camera operates at a full well capacity of only 11k down from 64k (!). That means you lose an insane amount of information (82%) your sensor is then able to collect. It's true that you should not let ISO keep you from shooting (as there are fairly noisy images that won prices), but you should be mindful about what you do when increasing ISO. Turn ISO down first thing if you can, and turn it up at last if you need.
I often use higher ISOs on my OM1. I have not done any tests, but the general idea applies to MFT. Perhaps there is one stop of difference, but the physical size of the sensor is just one factor. I find that learning how to use the camera is almost as important as learning photography. :D
Actually I did one test: a shot of black pants in a nearly pitch dark room. Hardly a work of art, but this convinced that noise is not worth any worry.
Agree, with my sony aps-c if I need to boost ISO higher than 1600 then better to not do any photo because its a waste of time and space :)
Addressing criticism with kindness…always a classy pro, you are! Wonderful video once again.
Thanks again!
I am planning to buy my first dslr and still watching youtube for information. I learned and truly understood everything in this video even though I have zero idea about photography, That's how good this video is.
Keeping ISO's low is more important for small sensor cameras. For those cameras high ISO is so destructive, it's worth it to use low iso and the extra effort to protect it (stabilization/tripod/flash/etc) to preserve more dynamic range.
Outstanding video. This should be required watching by anyone who calls themselves a photographer.
As always, it depends on the situation.
Measured and thoughtful advice from someone who really understands their equipment, and is clearly speaking from deep experience in the real world. I've seen lots of opinions (on Reddit, mainly) from folks who can recite the textbook theory behind photography and videography principles, but who clearly don't actually exercise those theories in real-world situations, and therefore don't fully understand the limitations (or when to bend or break the rules). Thank you for sharing!
I have my camera configured with 3 user profiles - each is aperture priority, auto-iso, but the minimum shutter speed is different (and for one the bitdepth is too to get higher framerate). This way, I have a main profile with 1/1000 minimum shutter speed for 90% of my wildlife work, and a 1/125 profile for when the subject is static and I am willing to go with a lower noise.
Leaning to accept noise was an important step in my photography journey and it saddens me how much shots I 'lost' because I was too worried about going away from ISO100, and as a result ended up with a blurry photo because of a moving subject. Especially with the capability of AI noise removal in tools like lightroom and Topaz Labs makes me not worry at all even shooting at ISO25600.
Also, Simon, are you by any chance an electrical engineer by trade? There is something about the way that you use gain, SNR, shot noise etc... that only us engineers tend to have.
Thanks! Not an engineer, but this knowledge is mandatory in astrophotography, where SNR is king.
This is the best explanation of ISO and how to use it as a tool and not a rule. Thanks.
*That ain't gangsta!* 😂
Great video and explanation! I totally agree - the fear of having reduced dynamic range with higher ISOs does not make any sense because if a scene has a high dynamic range, you don’t need high ISO, since high dynamic range requires always a lot of light in some parts of the image.
auto iso is your friend
Wow, Simon, you ought to be in the diplomatic service. Never in my life (mid-70s) have I seen anyone tell a ragtag collection of pseudo-experts to "go pound sand" (and why they should) as patiently and kindly as you have here. Your videos continue to be a wealth of accurate information and concise explanations, all seasoned with confidence-building affirmations for photographers at all levels. Thank you!
Absolutely spot-on - agree with everything you say. These days, with such good noise-reduction software available, I almost always use auto-ISO on my R5 - getting the shutter speed and aperture right is far and away more important. Get the shot, then deal with any noise afterwards - otherwise, you don't have the shot.
I love how this guy spread acknowledge on every single word
This video make me realized that im stuck following people's opinion that using low ISO is the better. Which I am indeed a newb in this photography thingy, it has been causing me hard time to take a good photos while keeping the ISO low.
Big great thanks for the advice.
Simon I completely agree with you on letting the camera determine ISO in Auto ISO mode. At the 16 minute mark of your video you said to underexpose for a dark contrasty look with a flat looking subject. Well I had this situation two weeks ago. I was watching and photographing at Great Blue Heron sitting on a railing at a pond in Scarborough Ontario. I underexposed by 1 stop to avoid overexposure on the Heron. But when it took off and flew the lighting completely changed. He flew low across the water that was dark against a dark background of reflected trees way out of focus. All it took was a small bit of lightening in editing to produce some of the best images I have ever taken. So going for a darker image is what made all the difference.
Shooting with auto iso has had the single largest impact on my photography this summer. Thanks for all the great tips Simon.
Love your focus on the practical aspects. The bit about tempering “the lowest ISO possible” advice to put necessary shutter and aperture settings first is perfect. So often an almost proper rule gets misinterpreted due to insufficient understanding or misplaced emphasis. Your effective communication is a joy to hear.
Glad it was helpful!
You have THE ONLY RUclips opening intro worth watching and worth watching again! Thank for making it immediately informative and beautiful to watch.
OK, guess I better go watch the rest of the video.
Wow, thanks!
I used to parrot so many of these things back when I was first starting my digital photography journey, and especially when I come from the film/TV world where there's an obsession about getting as technically perfect an image as possible, it was VERY hard to knock that out of my head. I've had a bit of a rebirth with my photography this year and have been learning to embrace the 'imperfections', and shoot how I want to, not how I think other people say I should.
Loving your videos, Simon, and I find myself actually enthused about learning from your videos rather than skipping through like I do so many other photographers trying to teach things (you've managed to subvert my ADHD!). You keep it simple and explanations are wonderful. The gist of this video lines up perfectly with how I'm now approaching my photography work; just get the shot, and don't sweat the details.
As someone with a background in research in (military) electro-optic sensing, your explanations of the sources and significance of image noise are perfectly clear and perfectly correct. This would be a good video for 3rd year electrical engineering students. Well done Simon!
Means alot coming from someone with your experience!
A model of how to deal with various critical comments, some just wrong and some only partly correct. Simply an opportunity to give further information. Not defensive. Just a masterly demonstration of expertise.
I love that Simon communicates so effectively in a way that applies to simple amateur folk like me, yet opens a window onto expert level understanding. I'm a techie and had never really understood digital ISO before this video, and that lovely explanation of shot noise. This is an absolutely brilliant explanation of noise.
I’m looking for the button to give this video 37 million thumbs up. Bang on Simon. Well said.
Thanks. 37 million times.
I started photography with an old Canon 80D... always on auto-ISO.
I continued for a few years with a Canon 6D Mk2... always on auto-ISO.
Now I'm using my dream camera, an old 1Dx Mk3... and guess what...
I've set it to auto-ISO from day one.
And it's always beautiful.
THANK YOU / MERCI BIEN!!!
👍🏼 ... 🇨🇵🤝🏻🇨🇦
Your explanations are the best-clear, concise, and practical! As an intermediate amateur whose “wildlife” is my only grandchild, all I really care about is getting the shot.
You have to be the best photography teacher on the Net. Absolutely brilliant. Simple and to the point with truth and madd skills to back it up. Thank you.
Wow, thank you!
I dont think you steared anyone wrong, I think MANY have a size of the knoggin problem. Photography is one of the few hobbies/paid work ive done where ive seen this A LOT. I enjoy passing my photography knowledge on and I think your passing on great knowlege. Keep up the good work. I enjoy your videos.
This is exactly the kind of video I needed as a beginner who’s trying to take photography more seriously. It makes complete sense, thanks for the lesson!
Like your humble approach in responding to the comment section.
This video is so true. Not just for camera but for anything, too many people just care too much about the numbers, the theoretic sciences, and the "best settings" so they forgot some basic facts: the machines are made for suit your needs, not otherwise. Get the shot, use whatever the settings that fit the moment. The story behind the photo matters, not the details of how many stop of dynamic range or low noises after 200% zooms.
Exactly! Everything you said I proved at my biggest event of the year. I had a media team of 5 photographers. I had myself as the lead photographer (media team lead) 2 absolute amateurs, 1 intermediate, and another that bordered on professional. I have embraced the, "just get the shot" and the results were staggering. Out of the over 1000 photos from that weekend that were used, over 50% I shot. I will be passing this information to my team next time as I didn't realize just how much of a difference it would make. It's drastic. I stand by this information you put out there.
Thanks!
just excellent. Wish I saw this 3 years ago. Recently have been less concerned about ISO and have been happier for it.
Calming, knowledgeable and straight talking. Perfect.
This was a brilliant way to address the comments. What better way to respond to the comments claiming you don't know what you're talking about than to flex how much you actually know? You did it in terms simple enough that I, a budding photographer, can understand. I'm a videographer and documentary filmmaker and I'm recently getting into photography. Everything you said in this video and others I've watched from you has been gold. Thanks for passing on the knowledge.
Wow! You have taken this topic on twice! You are a brave man! This is a terrific discussion on the technicals!
Perfect response Simon. We should not forget the following: Getting a usable shot is the most important factor. With the advance and state of tools like Topaz etc. it is a breeze to clean up higher noise photos.
Great video. 👌🏼