"So uh.... you couldn't save Juhani?" "Nope. Didn't see a way to convince her at all. " "Oh. Uh.... okay then. You can go now. _fuck, that didn't go as planned at all. Did we just commit murder by proxy?_ " " _no . . . No of course not. We are Jedi_ "
It sounds peculiar to hear Vrook Lamar admit that "our failings as teachers" were what caused the downfall of Juhani and Belaya, given his refusal to admit any such culpability in KOTOR II.
@@Asmo_Lay So his ultimate downfall in KOTOR 2 was due to to Revan actually succeeding & thus convincing Lamar that their way of teaching was good? Damn....
Important to note that the player is a lowly padawan to only those outside the council. The council is much aware that the player is Revan, a near unstoppable entity that has touched more aspects of the force than even them.
Yeah, me as well. I don’t think I ever killed Johani, and I definitely don’t remember meeting her lover at Korabine? Maybe I killed Johani once, but never talked to that yelling Jedi afterwards 🤷🏻
I forgot about this mission. The jedi literally lie to you about Juhani killing her master.... just to see what you'd do? Even if you end up killing her? That's pretty messed up for the Jedi
I absolutely know this game inside out and still love to hear your detailed commentary and review of these scenes! You have a way of giving new perspective to good old games i love. I can also tell that like us, you have a great appreciation for these gems! Big up for your content sir, here's to many more.... And may the force, be with you! :)
@@DarkLOREDash I remember my very first time playing through this game. It took a good while figuring it out, such as never finding Zabaar's father and just heading to the next planet instead. When I confronted Juhani, I should have realized that I needed to use the dialogue that used the the Code of the Jedi and instead I killed her and when arrived at Korriban, I did not recognize Belaya myself as there was a lot to remember about this game and who was whom in this game.
Belia: "Juhani served the Jedi Enclave at the cost of her own life. You had her cut down as you ran away. A hero at a thousand paces." 😠 Revan: "I'm sorry. I don't remember any of it." 😐 Belia: "You don't remember?!" 😡 Revan: "For you, the day I graced your Enclave was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Tuesday." 😑 Belia: 😨😭
"Do not give into the same dark urges as she did, or you may suffer a similar fate," he says to Revan, who has just returned from Korriban wearing Revan's old robes and mask.
Too bad the game didn't have characters and NPCs react to you based on your gear worn (at least none that I know of), other than when you were wearing the sith armour on Taris.
My pleasure! I was shocked how much dialogue is contingent on phases of quests & prerequisites. Especially the repeatedly ignored dark side admissions to the council
Considering how often Vrook preaches about the dangers of the dark side, it's pretty ironic that he's the most impatient and rude Jedi Master I've ever seen lol
I'm still constantly amazed that after Playing 20 year old games, dozens of times, with hundreds/thousands of hours, I'm still learning new things and quests I never knew about before
This was ironically my first playthrough. I think I tried to persuade Juhani and failed and the only option left was to kill her. Sadly back then and I really don't know why, but I only used one save slot, and I must have saved after messing up the persuade. I think I thought I needed to speak to the Jedi masters to persuade her and I didn't want to have to fight her again if died going back, so I saved. So because I overwrote my save and couldn't change her mind, I was left with no choice. I then went to Korriban next, as had played Kotor 2 first and was familiar with the planet. (I was like 8/9 and did not care for the order much, just anything star wars was awesome. Ironically it didn't spoil the Kotor 1 twist for me and if anything intrigued me as to who this Revan was and made me really want to own Kotor 1). So anyway I saw all this play out and then went back to Dantooine and got that dialogue. Did eventually many years later do a second playthrough and saved her, just unfortunately it was a dark side playthrough...
@@jlord5078 I can't remember too well so could be mistaken. But I thought after failing the persuade option she wouldn't let me pick another option? And that's why I ended up having to kill her to complete the mission. Anyway at the very least I thought I couldn't progress without killing her and I didn't realise she'd be a companion so just treated it like a mission that didn't go as well as I'd like and moved on 😂
@@PrezLewis She'll let you pick other options, but you have to pick the right ones to keep her alive. Just pick the right non-threatening options, and you should be fine.
Revan: "Look, I'm hurting, too! I thought there would be more Jedi in this game, but with Juhani dead, and Bastila gone, I couldn't fill all my party slots with Jedi and had to bring _Carth_ on this mission! Think about what I'm going through!"
@@aleksapetrovic6519 I think Carth is disliked because of the early game mechanics that push you to engage in dialogue with your companions. The game basically tells you to do it and Carth is dodging questions left and right and gets pissed off whenever you press him on anything.
I could never do a dark side playthrough, I've grown far too attached to Revan's band of misfits. Thank you for this, everytime I play this game I find something new. Especially after the restoration mod on PC.
I didn’t even know u could kill both padawans and get away unpunished. It seems the council don’t care about the low rank Jedi unless they have an ability that is rare.
@@robertharris6092 Not sure if you are just talking about KOTOR 1 but the next game was under a completely different studio and the lead writer (Drew Karpyshyn) who wrote some other novels and did work on SWTOR for the main Jedi story (despite how underwhelming that one was) had nothing to do with it. I think his best work was probably as lead writer for KOTOR 1 and his Darth Bane trilogy of novels. He also was a lead writer for the first two Mass Effect games. I love KOTOR 2 as well but I think if Karpyshyn was involved it would have been better in terms of the story/lore.
@@hajsh67 im talking about the fact you can kill 2 padawans and face no punishment is main character syndrome. Esp considering who your character is and the fact the council would be on guard for any shit like that.
@@robertharris6092 Yeah I get where you are coming from with that. Probably one of the most sketchy situations lorewise if you are doing a DS playthrough. I have a feeling that Karpyshyn wrote the "canonical" LS playthrough story and others filled in the gaps for the DS playthrough options. As Karpyshyn wrote the Darth Bane trilogy fairly well, it would be hard for me to believe he would leave plot holes that large lol. Then again, KOTOR was earlier in his career so maybe he overlooked it.
Wow! I have played this game countless times fully through and have never gotten these dialogue trees. This voice actress did an amazing job conveying the pain of someone broken over the loss of someone she loved. Thank you for sharing this
More like failing since their inception and just a fun fact the origin of the sith order started with some jedi knights leaving the order due to experiments involving the dark side and after being banished they found the sith species on korriban and together they founded the sith order so if the jedi order had never existed neither would have the the sith.
@@KratosisGod Very interesting to note that in the Star Wars Universe the "Light Side" was the first to be explored and developed into a fully fleshed religion while the "Dark Side" would only evolve into the Sith Order as an "extension" of the Jedi teachings. First came Light then Dark possibly because the Force had already intended for it to be that way as part of it's predetermined quest for "balance".
I learned about this when I did a complete murder playthrough ( killing everyone, that I am allowed to). And this is the hardest run to do as there are parts you can't do solo, like double betrayal on the swoop gangs is so much fun, but murder dia hits different because free upgrade.
On the Star Forge if Female Revan says the right dialogue throughout the journey, Juhani can profess her feelings for Revan. Only happened once for me and it was a challenge to make it happen.
Very interesting. I also notice an interesting parallel to Anakin's fall to the dark side in the prologue movies. It's the cold, emotionless control of the Jedi that leads to him not being able to check on his mother until he has the ability to go to Tatooine unsupervised, which leads to his first rampage against the Tuskan Raiders. Its their cold, emotionless response to the prospect of Padme's death that makes him seek out alternative sources of wisdom. And it's the contrast between that coldness and Palpatine's feigned warmth that makes him a serious option for that source of wisdom in the first place. (Granted, the movies aren't as good at presenting it in a neat and tidily written story; nobody ever claimed George Lucas was a particularly good scriptwriter)
This is great commentary. The one about the box was a little harder because I’m just listening to it on my phone and had to squint to read the subtitles but this one is really top tier. Glad I clicked! And subbing! Looking forward to more vids!
Thank you! Yeah, unfortunately the Text is hard baked in the UI. So the higher resolution = smaller text. I should have voiced the Rakatan or made a work around.
All of this flew over my head as a kid when I played this game. Always thought you had to kill them as I always thought that is what the council was telling me to do and it always seemed off they asked if she could be saved.
I just realized youre the voice over back in the days of CURSE esports channel, and just recently stumbled on your videos! Great work! Always love the voiceovers, keep it up my friend!
Can you make more videos about the storylines in Kotor? You narrate and pace them really well! There are so many cool quests/parts of the game that would be perfect to use.
I did a full darkest Sith play through once, that end with an epic saved screenshot of Juhani and Jo Lee laying dead each in front of the two statues that is just behind us when we encountered Bastila. From then on I could only play full light side Jedi play throughs, I like the Juhani character.
@@AdmiralBison true, but I played both roles before. Perhaps I’m neither, I’ve learned it’s best to keep options open and boy did I have plenty of options, one can’t stick to one thing lest they become rigid & stale, that’s just my take.
I actually did this during my initial play through. I had no clue the option to save her would lead to her joining my party. I figured that out during my 2nd play through 6 years later lol. I've never used a strategy guide on KOTOR, so the 7 or so times I've played it all the way through have been organic. As most of you know Juhani becomes a valued member of the crew, so killing her was never a choice I made again.
I did this thinking it would be inconsuquential on my first playthrough, got confused when I got to the endgame and didn't have the last companion lmao
On my current playthough, I saw that option and picked it under the assumption that the game would prevent it as she's a companion... never mind. 14:28 "Do not give into the same dark urges she did." *Stares at Revan in his full Sith armour and mask*
2:52 - 3:00 When you're an introvert trying to walk up to your friends to start a conversation, but they haven't finished their own yet, so you walk around awkwardly waiting for your moment to say hi
So the Jedi mislead one Padawan turning them to the Dark side and instead of trying to fix their mistake send you out there to take care of her one way or the other. That is cold, the Jedi call the Sith evil but at least the Sith don't pretend to be righteous.
I agree the Jedi are just as the sixth but dress it up in a nice way to make people think they are the good guys while the sith just kill outright. I would have a bad guy in broad day light rather a fake hero
When you see you're first name (witcher 3) or second name (kotor 1) you get such a surreal feel and you instantly get attached to the char even if she is not you're type i respected Juhani's force powers so she and Jolee were always in my group And i dont hate russians or something like that but i have my tastes i like maybe the swedish females accent most I must say i love this channel too you make things so interesting and you got the voice
I am currently doing a playthrough of this game. Absolutely love watching others playing this game and seeing how they make choices and such. Compared to most of you guys, I feel almost basic in game play, lol.
I love Juhani, she’s one of my favs! If he killed Juhani in Canon, I would be depressed, but if he just killed Belaya, it would be sad, but not as sad, tbh.
I had no idea this quest line was possible. It's great to learn new things about this game after 20 years. I don't know about others but I think it's aged like a fine wine.
Yeah I'm not going to lie it took me a long time to figure out that you could save her. After so many years that was a complete shot that you could save her.
I feel her anger and hatred in Belaya the way she's talking about the Jedi council really concerns me way too emotional about juhani I could see her going sith
On my evil play through, I definitely didn't head back to Dantooine after killing Belaya. Crazy, I guess if the game tells you to report back on anything it will let you do it.
I feel that Juhani's fall can be compared to Job's failure of God's test of piety in the Book of Job. However Revan saving her from her darkness can be seen as God's infinite love and how he will always forgive our sins if we are truly remorseful.
Still learning new things after probably hundreds of play throughs. I always save before killing Juhani and never leave her dead. Even on dark side play throughs. Some of the dark side dialog options between Revan and Juhani are just to enticing for me to play the game without her.
@@allanbard6048 DS Bastilla with Mantle of Force & Canderous in Cassus Fett Armor w/Ajunta Pall’s blade. Me leading the charge with my character in Mando Assault Armor I have The H.O.G. single-hilt with Upari and Krayt-Dragon Pearl. Together they are my Dark-Forge Squad. We cut through EVERYTHING.
When I first played KOTOR, I was Dark Side, and as any kid who'd play as a Sith, I was relentlessly evil, killing anyone and everyone at the first chance I could. This of course meant that I was not only missing a lot of plot information because I wouldn't give anyone the chance to talk, but I played on wondering when the last party member would join, not realizing I had already killed her: Juhani. So from then on whenever I've replayed, I always kept her alive, good or bad. With that said, I recently replayed as a dark side character, and this time willingly and knowingly killing her. It's because I've realize Juhani doesn't really add much value to the story. Her character honestly isn't all that interesting it feels like she's literally only there just to be another Lightsaber and Force User in the party. I kinda wish they'd have offered an alternative to Juhani so that you're not down a party member, I know there are mods to replace her with Ajunta Paul or so on. Hell, I was actually expecting a Selkath to join the party in that sixth slot. It would make sense; they're a new species introduced to the came. And there's one on the cover of the game, so you'd think one would be a main character, but no, it was just advertising what was new about this new version of Star Wars we'd never seen before.
I killed her only twice andd only on full dark side playthroughts. I always liked every companion and for some reason Juhani always seemed stronger than most of them.
You have to give this game credit. It proved it was possible to have a highly diverse cast and still be a great game. The devs were ahead of their time.
Lol. I loved the ability to kill them both. They had dark side written all over them. That's why the council secretly wanted you to slaughter them both. They knew Revan could do what they could not.
I remember it being pretty difficult to get the full story casually, the full drama was very easy to miss. I remember it wasn't probably until my third playthrough or so that I learnt enough to put the pieces together and when it dawned on me they were/had been lovers I was floored. Probably would've been better in retrospect if they hadn't beaten around the bush about her being a gay character, but never the less the story was pretty engrossing. Juhani's always been a fav of mine since then.
This was my very first playthorugh of the game ever. I had always been stuck on Taris for years and when I finally got here, I killed her and was none the wiser. I then realized once I got my last companion that I didn't have all of them and I found out it was her.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Jedi: Allows the fall and mental torture of one Padawan to set up a lesson for another Jedi.
Sith: "Damn, that's evil".
Malik: And you didn't think you had it in you to be a supervillain... this is the most deliciously evil thing I've ever seen!
Reven: “So not only did they ignore the people suffering but hurt their own”.
"So uh.... you couldn't save Juhani?"
"Nope. Didn't see a way to convince her at all. "
"Oh. Uh.... okay then. You can go now.
_fuck, that didn't go as planned at all. Did we just commit murder by proxy?_ "
" _no . . . No of course not. We are Jedi_ "
@@alexanderrahl7034 sure..
@@davididiart5934 I understood that reference
Belia: *You took everything from me!*
Revan: *I don’t even know who you are.*
Perfect summary👍
Players: Just another npc
Something about accusing the accuser of killing your whole family?
Mans amnesia acting up again
For you, the day Revan graced your village was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Tuesday.
It sounds peculiar to hear Vrook Lamar admit that "our failings as teachers" were what caused the downfall of Juhani and Belaya, given his refusal to admit any such culpability in KOTOR II.
Great insight
Well, canonically he never had a chance to find out about _these_ circumstances, so... Continuity.)
@@Asmo_Lay So his ultimate downfall in KOTOR 2 was due to to Revan actually succeeding & thus convincing Lamar that their way of teaching was good? Damn....
@@ShadowZeroFlame Convincing that Jedi Council supposed to be right. Unfortunately, Jedi Order supposed to be _left_ instead.)
@@ShadowZeroFlame yeah….
Indeed… what secrets would the Jedi Council hide from a “lowly” Padawan…
Or a council member who is a knight. 😉😉
@@darthsquid2107 HOW MANY MOORE LIES HAVE I BEEEN TOLD BY THE COUNCIL
@@Silver4Hire so many
Important to note that the player is a lowly padawan to only those outside the council. The council is much aware that the player is Revan, a near unstoppable entity that has touched more aspects of the force than even them.
Belia: "You took everything from me!!"
DS Revan: "Do you have any idea how little that narrows it down?"
Belaya*😊
Juhani was an expert in the ancient force scissoring techniques…but that’s not a tale a jedi would tell you…
🤣
Is it possible to learn this power?
@@Ancaneon
Not from a privileged, white, cis-het male patriarchal figure ✂️
@@Ancaneon the Jedi consider such powers…unnatural.
@@Ancaneonindeed. Come, this kitten will teach you
I’ve played through this game dozens of times, and still never seen this outcome. Bioware’s outstanding writing is still so impressive.
Old Bioware. Current Bioware(Andromeda, Anthem) seems... subpar.
got this dialogue first time playing the game
Impressive most impressive.
Yeah, me as well. I don’t think I ever killed Johani, and I definitely don’t remember meeting her lover at Korabine?
Maybe I killed Johani once, but never talked to that yelling Jedi afterwards 🤷🏻
Yea I stumbled across it my 4th play through it was a shock for sure
I forgot about this mission. The jedi literally lie to you about Juhani killing her master.... just to see what you'd do? Even if you end up killing her? That's pretty messed up for the Jedi
I played as a light sider but had no points in persuasion. I tried so hard to save Juhani. So when Belaya berated me it actually hurt.
There is a way to do it without persuasion, but it is mostly hopeful dialouge, not something you might notice first time though.
You can save her by remembering the Jedi Code and using the speech options the most closely match it.
Wow, someone played kotor without persuasion
@@alexas5260 yeah, not everyone who plays the game is a hardcore star wars fan or invests too much of their time into rpgs.
@@alexas5260 I did as well I always hated using it early on i waited for the mind trick instead.
I absolutely know this game inside out and still love to hear your detailed commentary and review of these scenes!
You have a way of giving new perspective to good old games i love.
I can also tell that like us, you have a great appreciation for these gems!
Big up for your content sir, here's to many more....
And may the force, be with you! :)
Thanks Vlad! I definitely know a few people who put my knowledge to shame, but love to do my part as well 😄
@@DarkLOREDash I remember my very first time playing through this game. It took a good while figuring it out, such as never finding Zabaar's father and just heading to the next planet instead. When I confronted Juhani, I should have realized that I needed to use the dialogue that used the the Code of the Jedi and instead I killed her and when arrived at Korriban, I did not recognize Belaya myself as there was a lot to remember about this game and who was whom in this game.
Belia: "Juhani served the Jedi Enclave at the cost of her own life. You had her cut down as you ran away. A hero at a thousand paces." 😠
Revan: "I'm sorry. I don't remember any of it." 😐
Belia: "You don't remember?!" 😡
Revan: "For you, the day I graced your Enclave was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Tuesday." 😑
Belia: 😨😭
Beautiful M.Bison tribute
LOL, this is perfect
Sweet 😆
"Do not give into the same dark urges as she did, or you may suffer a similar fate," he says to Revan, who has just returned from Korriban wearing Revan's old robes and mask.
Too bad the game didn't have characters and NPCs react to you based on your gear worn (at least none that I know of), other than when you were wearing the sith armour on Taris.
I didnt recall the dialouges with Belaya like at all, so this was kind of neat to get it fully fleshed out!
My pleasure! I was shocked how much dialogue is contingent on phases of quests & prerequisites. Especially the repeatedly ignored dark side admissions to the council
Considering how often Vrook preaches about the dangers of the dark side, it's pretty ironic that he's the most impatient and rude Jedi Master I've ever seen lol
I'm still constantly amazed that after Playing 20 year old games, dozens of times, with hundreds/thousands of hours, I'm still learning new things and quests I never knew about before
Lmao, standing in front of Vrook in full Revan garb and Vrook thinks nothing of it. It felt great to finally end Vrook in KOTOR 2.
he is perceptive in Kotor two though, he can sense your DS alignment .
@@kronoscamron7412 because he is finally starting to understand his own fails granted its to little too late
Vrook in KOTOR 2: NO NO YOU ARE SITH SHUT UP!
This was ironically my first playthrough. I think I tried to persuade Juhani and failed and the only option left was to kill her. Sadly back then and I really don't know why, but I only used one save slot, and I must have saved after messing up the persuade. I think I thought I needed to speak to the Jedi masters to persuade her and I didn't want to have to fight her again if died going back, so I saved. So because I overwrote my save and couldn't change her mind, I was left with no choice. I then went to Korriban next, as had played Kotor 2 first and was familiar with the planet. (I was like 8/9 and did not care for the order much, just anything star wars was awesome. Ironically it didn't spoil the Kotor 1 twist for me and if anything intrigued me as to who this Revan was and made me really want to own Kotor 1). So anyway I saw all this play out and then went back to Dantooine and got that dialogue. Did eventually many years later do a second playthrough and saved her, just unfortunately it was a dark side playthrough...
There is actually a way to save her without using the "persuade" prompts. Just pick the options that sound nice.
@@jlord5078 I can't remember too well so could be mistaken. But I thought after failing the persuade option she wouldn't let me pick another option? And that's why I ended up having to kill her to complete the mission. Anyway at the very least I thought I couldn't progress without killing her and I didn't realise she'd be a companion so just treated it like a mission that didn't go as well as I'd like and moved on 😂
@@PrezLewis She'll let you pick other options, but you have to pick the right ones to keep her alive. Just pick the right non-threatening options, and you should be fine.
@@jlord5078 Ah fair enough. Must have kept picking the wrong ones then and gave up!
Same
Revan: "Look, I'm hurting, too! I thought there would be more Jedi in this game, but with Juhani dead, and Bastila gone, I couldn't fill all my party slots with Jedi and had to bring _Carth_ on this mission! Think about what I'm going through!"
I don’t know if that’s an ouch or a yikes 😬
Why Carth seems to be so disliked? Frankly he is drastically less annoying then Bastila.
@@aleksapetrovic6519 I think Carth is disliked because of the early game mechanics that push you to engage in dialogue with your companions. The game basically tells you to do it and Carth is dodging questions left and right and gets pissed off whenever you press him on anything.
I could never do a dark side playthrough, I've grown far too attached to Revan's band of misfits. Thank you for this, everytime I play this game I find something new. Especially after the restoration mod on PC.
I am much the same & my pleasure!
I know there was a restoration mod for KotOR 2. Was there a restoration mod for the original KotOR?
@@christopherbibber964 yeah it took me by surprise as well. Unreal cinema who's working on a Kotor 1 mini series showed me it on one of his streams.
I have been playing KOTOR for 10 years and I've only done DS 3 or 4 times and always near the end.
The fact that they are misfits is the reason why I did not care too much about them.
I didn’t even know u could kill both padawans and get away unpunished. It seems the council don’t care about the low rank Jedi unless they have an ability that is rare.
Yeah, really sheds some light on how the Jedi was losing the war, doesn't it?
@@dragonknightleader1 sheds some light on how bioware wrote themselves into a corner.
@@robertharris6092 Not sure if you are just talking about KOTOR 1 but the next game was under a completely different studio and the lead writer (Drew Karpyshyn) who wrote some other novels and did work on SWTOR for the main Jedi story (despite how underwhelming that one was) had nothing to do with it. I think his best work was probably as lead writer for KOTOR 1 and his Darth Bane trilogy of novels. He also was a lead writer for the first two Mass Effect games. I love KOTOR 2 as well but I think if Karpyshyn was involved it would have been better in terms of the story/lore.
@@hajsh67 im talking about the fact you can kill 2 padawans and face no punishment is main character syndrome. Esp considering who your character is and the fact the council would be on guard for any shit like that.
@@robertharris6092 Yeah I get where you are coming from with that. Probably one of the most sketchy situations lorewise if you are doing a DS playthrough. I have a feeling that Karpyshyn wrote the "canonical" LS playthrough story and others filled in the gaps for the DS playthrough options. As Karpyshyn wrote the Darth Bane trilogy fairly well, it would be hard for me to believe he would leave plot holes that large lol. Then again, KOTOR was earlier in his career so maybe he overlooked it.
Almost 20 years later and im still learning new things about this game and its characters!
Wow! I have played this game countless times fully through and have never gotten these dialogue trees. This voice actress did an amazing job conveying the pain of someone broken over the loss of someone she loved. Thank you for sharing this
The Jedi Council, failing for a thousand generations.
Only a thousand? Feels like more
More like failing since their inception and just a fun fact the origin of the sith order started with some jedi knights leaving the order due to experiments involving the dark side and after being banished they found the sith species on korriban and together they founded the sith order so if the jedi order had never existed neither would have the the sith.
@@KratosisGod Very interesting to note that in the Star Wars Universe the "Light Side" was the first to be explored and developed into a fully fleshed religion while the "Dark Side" would only evolve into the Sith Order as an "extension" of the Jedi teachings. First came Light then Dark possibly because the Force had already intended for it to be that way as part of it's predetermined quest for "balance".
I love this guys voice.
His normal naration sounds like a british Carth, and his evil voice sounds like an annoyed Kyle Katarn
THANK YOU! My Revan voice is an imitation of Revan from SWTOR the same voice actor as Kyle. I am Aussie but will take the first compliment too 😂
I learned about this when I did a complete murder playthrough ( killing everyone, that I am allowed to). And this is the hardest run to do as there are parts you can't do solo, like double betrayal on the swoop gangs is so much fun, but murder dia hits different because free upgrade.
Some of the best side quests ever, great video, I didn't know the belaya story played out so much
On the Star Forge if Female Revan says the right dialogue throughout the journey, Juhani can profess her feelings for Revan. Only happened once for me and it was a challenge to make it happen.
I always played as Male Revan, so I would never have seen this
I think that's the only instance in which Vrook actually wishes you well in Kotor 1, after Belaya dies and you tell him :P
Cool, so Vrook isn't all bad then.
The voice acting in Kotor is top tier
Belaya: "You murdered my lover"
Revan: "The day Revan graced your temple was the most important day of your life, but for me... it was Tuesday"
What?
This needs to be a small dialogue mod. 😏
The seriousness at 3:00 despite that one girl despatetelt trying to get around y’all made me bust out laughing
Very interesting.
I also notice an interesting parallel to Anakin's fall to the dark side in the prologue movies. It's the cold, emotionless control of the Jedi that leads to him not being able to check on his mother until he has the ability to go to Tatooine unsupervised, which leads to his first rampage against the Tuskan Raiders. Its their cold, emotionless response to the prospect of Padme's death that makes him seek out alternative sources of wisdom. And it's the contrast between that coldness and Palpatine's feigned warmth that makes him a serious option for that source of wisdom in the first place. (Granted, the movies aren't as good at presenting it in a neat and tidily written story; nobody ever claimed George Lucas was a particularly good scriptwriter)
This is great commentary. The one about the box was a little harder because I’m just listening to it on my phone and had to squint to read the subtitles but this one is really top tier. Glad I clicked! And subbing! Looking forward to more vids!
Thank you! Yeah, unfortunately the Text is hard baked in the UI. So the higher resolution = smaller text. I should have voiced the Rakatan or made a work around.
All of this flew over my head as a kid when I played this game. Always thought you had to kill them as I always thought that is what the council was telling me to do and it always seemed off they asked if she could be saved.
I just realized youre the voice over back in the days of CURSE esports channel, and just recently stumbled on your videos!
Great work! Always love the voiceovers, keep it up my friend!
Hey Allan, yeah I got to do a lot of fun Fallout & Elder Scrolls vids back in the day
I played this game the first three times and didn't get my last party member. It was the fourth time through I realized it was juhani
You never thought about the icon? Because it looks a lot like her
Can you make more videos about the storylines in Kotor? You narrate and pace them really well! There are so many cool quests/parts of the game that would be perfect to use.
Happily!
So Juhani was the initial warning sign of what Star Wars would become, got it.
I did a full darkest Sith play through once, that end with an epic saved screenshot of Juhani and Jo Lee laying dead each in front of the two statues that is just behind us when we encountered Bastila.
From then on I could only play full light side Jedi play throughs, I like the Juhani character.
I killed Juhani first then took her lightsaber, then I killed Belaya on Korriban, and finally the rest of the loose ends. It’s just fun for me 😈
@@jeriel4149 a true Sith takes advantage of people first and then disposes of them once they become no longer useful.
@@AdmiralBison true, but I played both roles before. Perhaps I’m neither, I’ve learned it’s best to keep options open and boy did I have plenty of options, one can’t stick to one thing lest they become rigid & stale, that’s just my take.
Even after 20 years I'm still finding new sub plots in this game! Simply amazing!
I actually did this during my initial play through. I had no clue the option to save her would lead to her joining my party. I figured that out during my 2nd play through 6 years later lol. I've never used a strategy guide on KOTOR, so the 7 or so times I've played it all the way through have been organic. As most of you know Juhani becomes a valued member of the crew, so killing her was never a choice I made again.
I love these videos, they make me want to play this game again.
There are still many things I don't know about this game. Great video!
2:51 "Excuse me, sir, you are on my way!"
I did this thinking it would be inconsuquential on my first playthrough, got confused when I got to the endgame and didn't have the last companion lmao
Same. I decided my first run was complete darkside. Was definitely an interesting realization.
I see you have Revan Dressed up like his Son
I appreciate you reading the player text as an audio listener!
My pleasure, thank you!
On my current playthough, I saw that option and picked it under the assumption that the game would prevent it as she's a companion... never mind.
14:28 "Do not give into the same dark urges she did." *Stares at Revan in his full Sith armour and mask*
You make excellent content, i am fully confident that you will gain subscribers in mass.
Noted, I'll make sure to purge them both in every playthrough from now on.
>when your stupidity gets a padawan killed and another padawan to run away and join your enemies
“Guess it was the dark side.”
2:52 - 3:00 When you're an introvert trying to walk up to your friends to start a conversation, but they haven't finished their own yet, so you walk around awkwardly waiting for your moment to say hi
So the Jedi mislead one Padawan turning them to the Dark side and instead of trying to fix their mistake send you out there to take care of her one way or the other. That is cold, the Jedi call the Sith evil but at least the Sith don't pretend to be righteous.
I agree the Jedi are just as the sixth but dress it up in a nice way to make people think they are the good guys while the sith just kill outright. I would have a bad guy in broad day light rather a fake hero
8:28 The snooty voice you use for the poor or dark choices kills me man! Hilarious!
When you see you're first name (witcher 3) or second name (kotor 1) you get such a surreal feel and you instantly get attached to the char even if she is not you're type i respected Juhani's force powers so she and Jolee were always in my group And i dont hate russians or something like that but i have my tastes i like maybe the swedish females accent most I must say i love this channel too you make things so interesting and you got the voice
I'm assuming you get banned from Twitch for a hate crime?
Well this was a good elseworlds story, good thing Revan remains my favorite Jedi in Star Wars. He would never fall again.
I first learned this killing Juhani then being surprised on Korabain by Belia.
I am currently doing a playthrough of this game.
Absolutely love watching others playing this game and seeing how they make choices and such. Compared to most of you guys, I feel almost basic in game play, lol.
Lol at the end, talking with Vrook in full Revan robes
One of the many reasons why I love this game.
I love Juhani, she’s one of my favs! If he killed Juhani in Canon, I would be depressed, but if he just killed Belaya, it would be sad, but not as sad, tbh.
I had no idea this quest line was possible. It's great to learn new things about this game after 20 years. I don't know about others but I think it's aged like a fine wine.
Agreed! I can't wait to delve deeper
i played this game twice before realizing i could let her live lmao
I can’t help but think of Jack when she screams “l will be your doom!”
Yeah I'm not going to lie it took me a long time to figure out that you could save her. After so many years that was a complete shot that you could save her.
Love this mate!
Thank you!
I feel her anger and hatred in Belaya the way she's talking about the Jedi council really concerns me way too emotional about juhani I could see her going sith
THIS TAKES ME BACK-
“For you, the day Padawan Reven graced your presents it was the most important day of your life, but to me, it was Tuesday.”
My very first time I played KOTOR I killed Juhani. I didn't realize until my second playthrough she could be a companion.
On my evil play through, I definitely didn't head back to Dantooine after killing Belaya. Crazy, I guess if the game tells you to report back on anything it will let you do it.
i like the outfit juhuni had shown while she was in the grove
That was my first play though killing her in dantoone and then wondering who the last party member was supposed to be
I feel that Juhani's fall can be compared to Job's failure of God's test of piety in the Book of Job. However Revan saving her from her darkness can be seen as God's infinite love and how he will always forgive our sins if we are truly remorseful.
I remember doing this back in 5th grade like 2008, and felt so bad for killing juhani. I had to load such an early save lol
Still learning new things after probably hundreds of play throughs. I always save before killing Juhani and never leave her dead. Even on dark side play throughs. Some of the dark side dialog options between Revan and Juhani are just to enticing for me to play the game without her.
I did her in once, and got whatever armor Belaya was wearing. No tradeoff, as Juhani and full Mando Ordo are my Star Forge posse.
@@allanbard6048 DS Bastilla with Mantle of Force & Canderous in Cassus Fett Armor w/Ajunta Pall’s blade. Me leading the charge with my character in Mando Assault Armor I have The H.O.G. single-hilt with Upari and Krayt-Dragon Pearl. Together they are my Dark-Forge Squad. We cut through EVERYTHING.
Loving the video lore dash
The Jedi counsel sounds more and more like our own Government!
Funny enough I did this in my first playthrough. Always wondered who the last character was:))
I hope the remake doesn't kill it.
I played this game about 30 times, and never knew that something like this existed. I will make some changes for next DS walkthrough.
Ah, I never took that path. Great video!
When I first played KOTOR, I was Dark Side, and as any kid who'd play as a Sith, I was relentlessly evil, killing anyone and everyone at the first chance I could. This of course meant that I was not only missing a lot of plot information because I wouldn't give anyone the chance to talk, but I played on wondering when the last party member would join, not realizing I had already killed her: Juhani. So from then on whenever I've replayed, I always kept her alive, good or bad.
With that said, I recently replayed as a dark side character, and this time willingly and knowingly killing her. It's because I've realize Juhani doesn't really add much value to the story. Her character honestly isn't all that interesting it feels like she's literally only there just to be another Lightsaber and Force User in the party. I kinda wish they'd have offered an alternative to Juhani so that you're not down a party member, I know there are mods to replace her with Ajunta Paul or so on.
Hell, I was actually expecting a Selkath to join the party in that sixth slot. It would make sense; they're a new species introduced to the came. And there's one on the cover of the game, so you'd think one would be a main character, but no, it was just advertising what was new about this new version of Star Wars we'd never seen before.
Can you imagine a Selkath tearing up KOTOR? 🤣
I didn’t know you could redeem her for a long time
I love the fact that Revan can reappear in his full Sith Lord robes and mask in front of the council and they don't even comment.
It's a mod
@@ddsjgvkha! I know you can't wear them 😂
watching the NPC freak out because of pathing issues makes me laugh a little.
Its so bad on Taris uppercity
Dang I played this game start to finish over 50 times and I was today years old when I realized juhani prefers ladies..
I killed her only twice andd only on full dark side playthroughts. I always liked every companion and for some reason Juhani always seemed stronger than most of them.
You have to give this game credit. It proved it was possible to have a highly diverse cast and still be a great game. The devs were ahead of their time.
I did this on my first playthrough a couple weeks ago. I kept wondering who the last companion slot belongs to before I realised it.
Lol. I loved the ability to kill them both. They had dark side written all over them. That's why the council secretly wanted you to slaughter them both. They knew Revan could do what they could not.
I did that on my first playthrough without a second thought
Kotor is a fucking banger I still play it on my phone and I've played it as a kid as the nostalgia never dies
Wow, interesting! I always save Korriban for last so of course I wouldn't know this
I remember it being pretty difficult to get the full story casually, the full drama was very easy to miss. I remember it wasn't probably until my third playthrough or so that I learnt enough to put the pieces together and when it dawned on me they were/had been lovers I was floored.
Probably would've been better in retrospect if they hadn't beaten around the bush about her being a gay character, but never the less the story was pretty engrossing. Juhani's always been a fav of mine since then.
Your Revan looks exactly like a younger Valkorion
This was my very first playthorugh of the game ever. I had always been stuck on Taris for years and when I finally got here, I killed her and was none the wiser. I then realized once I got my last companion that I didn't have all of them and I found out it was her.
That musics got me wanting to play another playthrough
How you managed to get this game working on PC without constantly crashing is impressive
Damn I miss obliterating fools with force storm... Good times