9 months in, close to 10.000 views later this video has seemingly helped many people to understand snowboard waist width. If it changed your world and you want to express your gratitude and support my channel, you can do this here: www.buymeacoffee.com/justaride Thank you so much, and don't forget to check out my other content! ;-)
Lars is single handedly elevating snowboard knowledge in average joes like myself. Truly appreciate the way you explain things w/o making it dry and giving simple ways to understand the nuances of snowboard tech. I’ve learnt so much more from handful of your videos than the hundreds that I watched over the years. If I ever make it out to fernie, beers on me 🤙 Btw, I’ve switched to posi/posi on my t finder and this thing came alive!! As you’ve said before, I was able to put more pressure on my front foot and really drive into turns!
This is exactly the kind of information and thinking that I love. These are the details that I wonder about when things just don’t quite feel right or I notice different people with different preferences.
Example case(for hypothetical average rider)- Foot length 27cm Board waist 25.5cm Board under foot 26.5cm Boot 30.5cm =2cm overhang each side at 0 deg 9 deg reduces overhang by 3-4 mm =17mm overhang each side. Carving guy may want wider board, rail guy narrower board. Good analysis, thanks! Waiting for episode on how to surgically trim a few mm from toes and heal bone.
This is the best info of this kind on YT. Speculation or not, it's great to hear people talking about it. Even if you are buying a board from a shop and not online, it's good to go armed with some ideas and hard numbers.
I've gone down the rabbit hole myself in calculating all of these variables. I've been looking at where I actually apply pressure with the heel and balls of my feet, and centering the bindings based off that measurement vs simply centering the boot. It's an art and a science.
You know it!! That would put me on an insanely wide board, as I have long toes and would have to slide the binding forward by quite a bit to have pressure points in equal distance to the edge... It is indeed a rabbit hole!! :-)
This whole thing is interesting, but I'm not really sure centering your binding like that is the answer. The lever arms are asymmetrical anyways and it is much easier to put pressure on your toe edge even with centered boots (as Lars explained in his boot centering episode).
I’ve been riding since ‘92, and have been dabbling with making my own boards for the past few years. I thought I knew a lot about snowboarding, but making boards made me realize I hardly know a thing! So glad I found your channel, I’ve learned so much essential knowledge just in the few videos I’ve watched so far.
This was an awesome video, so much good information in here. I also was listening to a podcast where Mikey Franco was saying the ideal board width is 1cm overhang on toe and heel.
Thanks so much, I do all this crazy stuff myself, but your rules of thumb are great and simplify everything. Please keep providing this "nerdy" episodes.
Good thing about this video: without saying it, it demonstrates that for big feet (size 13 and up) there aren't many wide enough snowboards on the market.
You’re not wrong…. It has gotten better, but now everything that’s wide enough is too short…. Check out Stranda Pipeliner 2.0. 187 with a 275 waist 🔥🔥🔥
Simply great video Explained in a way that is easy to understand and still very detailed so anyone can use it as reference and adjust some parts if needed based on exact board, shoe and so on Nice to see videos like this, kudos to you
I am shocked at how this channel has so few subscribers.I just started learning to snowboard,and went looking for all sorts of educational videos.Quite frankly,RUclipsrs with most subscribers (on snowboarding topic) are much less informative,and what I feel is that some of them are less passionate about giving actual knowledge unlike this channel.All the best luck to you.We all want to see you grow 🎉🎉🎉
Hey Lars, that was a great video. I think another thing that plays into the equation of ideal board width are what bindings you plan to pair with the board as well. I know you ride Now bindings, as I do, and those really seem to help power wider boards when you have a correspondingly smaller boot. I've got a 280 mondo, but finding myself really happy with 264-267mm waist boards. Maybe my ideal width is 255-260mm or so, but the extra leverage the skatetech gives feels like it may have bought me a few extra mm.
Great video! Just got a 160 hovercraft 1.0 with a waist width of 26,8. I have a size 29,5 foot and roughly looking at the width and my angles (+28/+10) I will have very little overhang...thankfully. I love to do very hard carves on slushy blues for which the old hovercraft is very much equipped to do.
measured my differences, and the difference on the right side is 1-2mm and on the left side 0-1mm, so i'd say that's quite good on my stance, which is 21 and 6. overhang is 1.4 to 1.6 cm
Nice vid! With Adidas you’d add only get 18 mm extra to your mondo, with Burton around 22 mm. It’s also worth to mention that custom insoles supporting the natural arch of the feet really help to downsize/get a performance fit more comfortable.
Great advice. My second board I bought on special was a Dump Truck 163, 258 waist. I've never ridden it because I just know it's too narrow for my size 12s. Guy in shop said I'd be fine - took the sale, but it's about 25-30mm over hang. Just tried turning back foot forward, but that feels so wack, I'm normally 25 front negative 15 back duck. If I didn't/couldn't carve I might get away with it, but it's an aggressive all mountain and if I take it I'll want to lay it down.
Blows my mind how any shop guy would say that the width is fine...... You need a 270mm waist at the very minimum. Sorry to hear that! It's simply the wrong board. Another example for why I started this channel... 😞
You'll see... it's a lot of assumptions and variables.... Such a difficult topic to find any 'general rules'. Interesting, though, I think! 🙂Thanks for the early interest and comment!!
You gave me some great advice already,but I’m sure others will appreciate it and a video demonstration adds a lot. In recent years I’ve looked into the subject after realising my kit choices and boot size weren’t helping, and experimented with angles and home made riser plates out of poly chopping boards to good effect, then a wider board with bindings that have a thicker base, and even bought a cheap angle meter to measure, but recently bought the widest carve-biased board (Korua TF) I could find - just before your Stranda Cheater vid! 😆.
This is all great information and exactly what I have found myself. I have size 8 us (26 cm) feet and most boards at the length I like get fairly wide and are a workout in chop. Boards with a good amount of taper fix this for me. I usually only focus width at back inserts and every company should include this in specs.
i guess if you calculate average (waist width + tail width)/2 : it should be quite the backfoot width. Fortunatly, now some brands give the underfoot width. Very difficult to anticipate the foot drag because it doesn't depend only from the width/boot size, : depending boot sole shape, heel cup shape, heigth of the sole from the snow....Best is to try and adjust. With the time and many trials, i know that i need at list a 27,5cm waist width if the radius is about 9/10m. And then adjusting in width by centering with the disk. Whatever, your advices and observations are always so clever and smart.
Agreed!! Lots of 'just trying'. My goal in this case is a ball park good guess to save people money when buying a new board... But yeah, I completely get your point!
curious how you obtained 27.5 waist? how deep are you carves, and do you have a very large boot? I found myself a half size smaller than normal boot (size 11.5 from 12, boot is 32.4 cm) and i'm calculating that i'd need a width underfoot of like 28/29cm and a waist width of around 26cm.. maybe i did my maths wrong, but i'd love to know.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel That’s what I like to hear! Mine arrives on Saturday. After chatting with Mats a bit about my riding style he recommended the Biru to me.
To make an even more accurate analysis, what is between the boot and the board should also be taken into consideration, the footbed area of the bindings. With same foot length and board width, different results are produced if the footbed is shorter or longer (actually harder or softer to be picky) because it imparts force to more external or internal points of the board so the leverage power changes. Taking the very practical example you give at the beginning of the video, it would be correct to put an additional piece of wood between the 2. What do you think about this ? I know that your was just a practical example to make everyone understand the concept. Mine is just an in-depth, more realistic additional reasoning
You're right. For a video this is way too complicated! My tips are supposed to put people into a good place. If their binding produces slightly different results, then that is something they will learn from that. I can't possibly take binding specifications into account, and to be honest, I wouldn't want to. I want to inspire people to then take it and do their own experiments. There are so many little subjective things, which are fun to find out. I ride a NOW binding that is made from three different bindings............. and there won't be a video about that, hahahaha ;-) Thanks for the comment. It will make people think about it.
Great job. Very informative. I wish manufacturers would just stop giving waist width and start giving widths at reference. Would seem much more useful.
Nidecker do. And the nice people at Korua went and measured the Cafe Racer and TF underfoot widths for me. I agree it would be so much easier just to list it.
@@willakerlund4191The Nidecker Group owns Nidecker, Yes, Jones, Now (Bindings) and Flow. Seem funny to me, I always thought Nidecker is some cheap brand from eastern europe or asia, since mostly noobs ride with that and their stuff is often heavily discounted.
Hey lars, I am in the unfortunate situation of having large feet (My snowboard boots were fitted to size US 14). I am in the process of relearning how to snowbard properly after doing it very casually over the last 10 years. Essentially i was just counter rotateting constantly / doing completly skidded turns down the mountain. I got new gear last year and even got the widest board i could manage to find (170UW board with a 285mm Waist width) but after watching this video and doing the measurement you did I have about 30-32mm overhang on both my toe and heel edge. The issue I am running into while learning to carve / snowboard again is there are times where I feel like I may be booting out while doing carved turns ( on steep runs). I have a feeling a large part of this is due to me not being balanced properly over my edge so i am over enngadging my edge to keep grip. I also know that I pick up to much speed when during my carves which require me to carve more agrressively to keep my edge. I guess what i'm trying to figure out if riding on my current setup is viable at all if my goal is to have a more carving focused riding style. I am fine with my "carving potential" being capped for the time being as I work on teqniue and then in a few seasons modifyng my gear with shorter boots and shorter binding to reduce my overhang. Like if you had this ammount of overhang would you be able to make some kind nice carving work even if you couldn't push it close to what you normaly do. I understand how much I have to learn / practice / improve but i just hate the idea of putting work into it if there is really nothing i can do with this much overhang Also thank you for making this channel, as someone who works in a technical field. Ihe way you describe snowboarding concepts coming from a deep fundenmental understanding of the entire system has been such a breath of fresh air. I swear i have learneu more watching 2 hour of your videos than I have in the previous 50 hours before.
Thanks for the kind words!! I hate to say it, but 285mm for your feet is simply not enough.... There's no board on any shelf that will work for you and the idea of carving. It's a viscous cycle for you!! You aren't able yet to carve crazy high board angles, but your gear also doesn't allow for you to learn it.... There's "a little too narrow" and there is "too narrow". Your board is simply too narrow! I'd say a 310mm waist would be more appropriate, and that's just a guess. The quickest company to make you a board at a reasonable price is Donek. They offer good advice, too. Email Sean Martin at Donek, he'll be able to sort you out. At 20mm overhang on each side I can still just about carve reasonably well while being quite carful. That would be "a little too narrow". You're telling me 30-32mm on each side.... That's not a good start! Sorry! :-(
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Thanks for the response! I was curious if there was anything i could maybe do with my current board to make it work. I just recently watched Jame's video on the snowboard interface and remebered him mentioning how much extra width some bindings can add to your overhang. So i was curious and measured my bindings total width with the boots and then just the boots on there own and the bindings add 25mm in total to the overall width! (these are burton stepons which are a luxury I don't think I can afford in retrospect lol) I think i am going to see if i can rent some bindings that are lower profile and don't add anything to the overhang. If i could get that 25mm back that would put me at roughly 18mm overhang on each side which seems way wary more managable, and that should tied me over for a while till my riding gets alot better and i can invest in a more specialized / custom board.
I've tried mounting the Now bindings for the first time and there was way too much toe drag. So i tried the second method, where the slots are perpendicular to the board length. It looks much more even. But now one heel hangs over more than the other, even though both bindings are in the equivalent holes. (I think) I don't understand. My board is a mountain twin, so it's not as if one end has some weird taper.
Back again, watching your brilliant videos - no hype or bullshit just solid, useful information 👍 How do these modern, super wide boards ride? The Ride Warpig XL for example ( recommended for my weight and foot size ) has a waist width of 277 but my foot length is 270 🤯🤷♂️
So under foot that board is close to 290, which is 200mm more than foot length.... That makes it much too wide for a daily driver, but possibly fun for advanced carving. Then again, advanced carving needs a larger radius.... So really, if you don't have bigger feet, those boards are somewhat pointless. Fun in deep pow, though!!
How do feel between these two options the width at inserts 276mm and the other 280mm i have cans infuse size 11 seems to measure around 282-284 mm boot length. And will be using jones Orion bindings. Only asking because it seems sizing down can help make it feel more nimble.
In Variable snow conditions I need more width to carve and not boot out. I don't ever really experience the board creating to much force on my ankles. As My edges are high other than jumps, pow and pre season. I Really enjoy wide Volume shifted board in Moguls.
I watched this video so many times but I might need your opinion to determine if this board is right for me. Ride commission 158cm Waist width 257mm Reference under front foot 262mm - under back foot 264mm. My feet are 260mm - US 8. +30 +15 The only drag I would encounter would be from the boots thickness. I like to crave like you do, freeride, blue and black groomers and also go fast all mountain. Note: my weight is only the heaviest end of the recommended.
Thank you for all these informations! I wonder if taper makes back foot overhang.No one talks about it.I have an excavator 158 with 268 waist width and 20mm taper. Doesn't that mean that back boot overhangs like on a non tapered board with 24.8 waist width?
Hi Lars, I was wondering what your opinion was on using risers for snowboards, allows you to down-size for a much narrower board, saves weight, and still allows for the lever mechanic you talk about early in the video. What do you feel are some downsides in using risers? I am also curious about our opinion on using heel risers inside your snowboard boots. To me it feels a lot more comfortable because it allows the ankles to have more room for dorsiflexion which allows me to bend my knees further than I could otherwise, the ankles can only bend so much upwards before either the heels start to lift or toeside. I can forsee it also reducing ankle injuries in choppy terrain as well because there is room to bend here.
Good points on the use of risers. I've never tried that. Yes, risers can work. I'm doing a video on that soon. They definitely cause a very different feel that is not very nice for freestyle stuff. But for carving they can be great!
Great video! ...but what about hight when in binding? Your boot is not flat on the snowboard, it's elevated differently depending on binding cushioning etc.
Great point!! Very difficult to factor in. The better way to approach the whole topic would be to measure edge angle until boot out, but I haven’t found a good way to do this yet. Donek have a template for this to download, I think.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel maybe it doesn't matter though? If your 1cm example works for you, and you carve on extreme angels... I think that would mean most riders should be fine. A mm here or there will not matter. The most important important aspect is your wood block example, we all need a few mm heel and toe overhang while barefoot in our riding stance.
Thanks for the informative video. I’ve been on the hunt for a better performing setup. I had a hunch that possibly I was in too big of a boot. I have ride fuse US11 / mondo29. My foot actually measures 28cm. Good boot but the fit has always been a little off. The wrap liner is a little too large for my slim lower leg. I try not to overtighten, but I still get a little heel lift. I may look into sizing down 1/2. I also took some board and overhang measurements. Board: Lib tech BRD 162w, 265 waist width. Front foot 21 degrees angle with 17mm over on the toes and 15mm on the heel. Back foot angle +3 with 25mm over on both toes and heel. Stance width just under 22in or 56cm. Figure the extra overhang on back foot is due to the 15mm taper of this board along with a mellow binding angle. Any suggestions, feedback?
Yeah, it's due to the taper. You could go to a wider board, for sure. But it's pretty good - depending on your ability level! Boot questions are difficult to answer online.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel I noticed that on the Stranda site the board is only offered as 152 and I saw it one a different site as a 153 is that correct? Or is that just depending on the year of production? I really like the Makrill look and the specs on the Stranda site for the 152 seem like the right fit for me, wheres the 153 stats seems to be for someone a tad bid heavier then I am.
I Love this in depth materials that you make. It is rare in YT snowboard content. May I ask what size is this book and what is the thickness of the liner that you use?
do you have any recommendations for me, i have a 24.4 cm foot and i am a 5’8 male 140 lbs… I can’t find any boards that would actually fit me. should i just compensate by getting a shorter board then usual or is there any boards with an appropriate waist width (23.5) and length for me
That is indeed tough. Ride Berzerker might work. K2 and Ride offer some models that are very old school in width. The Asian brands keep it narrow, too. Gentemstick make some boards around 250 waist that are over 160 long.... I'm sure if you take some time you'll find more. Good luck!
As usual your information is very insightful could you also give the measurements in inches? Question: what size and length board should I have with a size 12 boot 30.O eur size for a all round riding deck? We also always talk about all the variables something many riders don't really understand thanks!
Thanks for the comment!! It's really easy these days to convert to inches (google), and the maths - if you want maths - is all laid out in the video. I hope you can figure this out yourself with my suggestions here. Board length has nothing to do with boot size, so unfortunately I can't recommend anything. Good luck my friend!!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel The reason I asked was because I also have the Apmlid morning glory which is volume shift but a tapered tail which creates more of an offset for the back foot. Like you I’m looking for a more similar side cut though the board without drag!
I am not sure the effect in choppy snow is that strong? I did notice my widest board to strain my feet when riding icy slopes all day having less leverage to dig the edges in. An effect that is somewhat lessened with Skatetech bindings. Last two days anh the night between it almost constantly rained with a bit snow thrown in, resulting in ultimately wet, heavy sticky snow, soon tracked out into bumps that often at some pressure would collapse. To test different structure/wax in these conditions, I happened to be switching between 3 boards each day going down the same slopes. It sure was a workout for the legs absorbing the bumps and dealing jaggedness of the ride, but no issue with the leverage. And worst was the narrowest of the 3, for being the softest (even though the turniness of its hybrid rocker makes good snow moguls less work), stiff volume shifted in the middle and stiff carving board best, but hardly any narrower than the volume shift, rather just a good deal longer. So defenitely stiffness and maybe length being much stronger factors there?
I guess it is also subjective.... maybe someone with strong ankles is fine. I definitely notice when a board is too wide for bumpy/choppy stuff. That 'too wide' is likely subjective. Just putting out the thought there is a 'too wide' and a 'too narrow' and a functional waist width.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Yeah, no doubt about the too wide. Could indeed be the ankle strength, at least if it is innate and not any training for it in my case. Makes sense as far as what I notice in my feet when on icy hardpack with too wide a board is not the ankles, but rather the heel getting sore from the forces trying to pull it out of the heel cup and according friction from vibration.
Random question, just because I notice the logos on your kits... how's Haglöfs compare to Arc'teryx? My general sense is Arc'teryx and Norrøna are in a class of their own for North American-accessible outerwear, even compared to other brands licensed for Goretex Pro. But heard rumblings Haglöfs is in a very similar tier. Just speaking compared Arc'teryx versus say Burton [ak] or high-end Patagonia, I'm struck by how much more dialed in the pattern is and how much tighter the seam allowances are. Although that's pre-Anta acquisition Arc'teryx, not sure these days how things are holding up.
Thanks. That would be what the video is about. Functional waist width. 1.5 cm on each side. Maybe 2, if you don’t carve much with high ish board angles.
This makes buying a snowboard so confusing. So I need to buy for my weight along with the correct size waist so im not draggin my boot. Yet manufacturers wanna know my height? Along with not giving me underfoot width but the waist width so I have to assume its bigger underfoot. Why not just tell me so i dont have to guess. Is having a board with the proper width better or is proper board legnth?
Love this comment!! Yes! Correct!! It’s ridiculous. And so inaccurate. They just go by weight, and that is only a third of the story. Board width is often only included inaccurately and length is often suggested too short. This is why I started this channel…. I really hope I can help…
Very useful information. A friend of mine who is an advanced level rider & can really achieve a high board angle when carving has large feet & usually wear a boot size uk 12. Boot drag has always been an issue for him as he doesn’t like to run a specifically ‘wide’ version of his chosen board (primary board CustomX 162) - runs a fairly high positive front angle & significant negative rear angle which helps minimise drag as you have said - though he still struggles. His method to overcome has been to develop his own binding baseplate risers made from around 1.2cm thick rubber floor tiles to increase the distance between boot & snow when on edge- which really seems to work him without too much compromise on board feel. Have you any experience of this type solution ? I would be interested to know your thoughts. There doesn’t seem to be any products on the market - so either it’s completely nonsense, or my friend needs to get his patent applied for quickly & lead the charge 😂
Hahahaha, funny! You're 20 years too late! :-) The product was called riser plates... Palmer Plates.... Burton had a model, too. It was considered 'silly' when freestyle took over. Now you can't find this anywhere anymore - very difficult! It's a solution, for sure. But it changes how the board feel overall. The higher platform is less ideal for park stuff... Great for carving, though! What is likely to mess with your friend's performance is the substantially negative backfoot angle. Watch my videos (1/2/3) on stances (duck vs. posi). Cheers!
Another great video Lars! Would be interested in how foot bed height affects this. Is there a height you never go over, or even under? The higher the footbed the more leverage you have no?
@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel I've just swapped from Cartel EST's to Unions Forces. Alot higher footbed so I'm excited to try them out. The EST system just seems wrong, too much hard plastic denting my topsheet!
I would love to know how you set your binding angles if you rotate the insert disk to slide back and forth on the board (instead of side to side) to get equal overhang? Im switching to union atlas bindings for my all mountain freestyle board and the closest i can get to center, on the middle heel cup setting (1), is 11/16” toe over hang and 1 1/8” heel overhang w/ a 2” boot clearance. Waist width is 26.1 cm, size 11.5 boot. Ive been carving pretty hard with the cartel x’s (same board) but with 13/16” toe/ 1 1/4” heel overhang so i know its doable, but would love to know what even overhang feels like!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Guess I didnt ask the question the right way. I gotcha, but how do you set the correct binding angle if the 3 degree angle increments are rotated due to you switching the orientation to account for heel and toe drag?
@@STAyTHIrstyMyFREind If you wanted to be 1000% accurate (which I don't think is necessary) you'd set your angles and the play with the fore aft movement of the disc with the boot in the binding until you have even overhang, I guess. I'm still not sure whether I understand you. It might also not be possible to centre the boot perfectly. I'm basically suggesting to aim for a centred boot (not centred binding, btw!) as best as one can.
Hi, in one of your video’s you mentioned a pad underneath you binding to lift the whole binding and avoid heel and toe drag. Can you tell me which pads you use? Thnx! Greetings, Steven.
On some boards for rare occasions I use pads from 'Padride'. They do the job, but there's room for improvement. They're definitely the thickest I've ever seen and give lots of clearance. I'll be uploading a review on those this fall. If you get in touch with them, tell them you've found the product through me. It'll help me next season... Thank you very much!
@@stevenvanderkaag board becomes tippy! Less effort to get it on edge, which makes it more responsive, so you may dial it back a notch and start edging a little more carefully. Quicker edge to edge. More angulation without booting out. Mellower binding angles become possible, if wanted. Board becomes significantly heavier on chair lifts without foot rests.
In consequential freeride terrain more toe overhang is better. It is easier to self arrest after booting out on your toe edge in an icy couloire than booting out on your heel edge and just slide on your butt into the abyss…. Otherwise I would prefer riding with more heel overhang, because mostly you don’t achieve the same edge angles on your heels that you do in your toes.
Hey man great video! I love your channel and all the in depth info you give, I appreciate all the work that goes into these videos and please keep it up! Quick question, if I’m following you right then with a boot of about 300mm, at a binding angle of 15 degrees for both (15 positive on front 15 negative back) my ideal waist width would be around 275? Does that sound right? I’m not trying to be exact, just trying to get an idea of my ideal width because I’ve been trying to figure out for a while what fits my size 13 US boots!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel a boot itself of 300mm in length from the end at the heel to the farthest end of the boot near the big toe. I’m away and I don’t have my boots nearby to measure so that’s an estimate for now, but wanted to make sure my math is right. I was planning to measure and be exact when I can.
@@cameroncovill6324 If you have size 13 feet, your boot is at least 335mm long - likely longer. I don't understand your 300mm boot length. I'm a US 10 in a short boot, and the boot is still 310mm........ So your 300 make no sense... How long is your foot in mm or cm?
Gotcha, my apologies I had looked it up because I didnt have my boots to measure and some online source I found said a size 13 is 300mm in length generally. So I’ll have to measure when I get a chance and get back to you. Just wanted to say thank you for reading my comments and getting back to me, even though I have not provided you with accurate information for my question lol
Well..... something like 25cm less effective edge are noticeable. It carves extremely well with that very stiff tail. I don't know where all the grip comes from, but it's there. I do simply feel like I'm on a short board, however. You really can't compare the two boards. Makrill s more surfy, Japanese, back foot carving. Shorty is a freeride board at heart. Fast, larger turns, wild amounts of edge grip.
Thank you for the reply! I want something different from the Cheater board and wondering if the shorty is a 'doitall' cheater...like just another 'lesser' cheater to carve. Thank you again for the reply and your time! I will go with the makrill...though the 'back foot' carving is not how I ride...@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel
Hi Lars, Thanks so much for all you do! I’ve learned a lot from your content. I have a question about boot length and overhang. You mentioned that boot length is typically longer than foot length due to the shell and liner, and you suggested adding about 3.5 cm to account for this. I understand that, but I’m still unsure how to apply it to waist width calculations. For example, my foot is 27 cm, but my size 28 boot is closer to 31.5 cm with the outer material. Based on this, wouldn’t my overhang be more significant than just a few millimeters? I’m concerned that if I follow the method in the video, I might end up with too much overhang for all-mountain riding and carving. Could you clarify how this extra boot length should factor into waist width calculations? I’d love to hear your thoughts. Thanks again for all your work!
Some extra points to consider: 1. Back Foot (Toe-Side Drag): The back foot’s toe side often drags because it’s closer to the narrowest part of the board (near the waist), especially with lower angles (like my +12°). 2. Front Foot (Heel-Side Drag): Heel drag on the front foot happens because the heel is positioned near the narrower section of the board, especially with higher angles (like my +24°). 3. Tapered Boards: Directional boards with taper, can exacerbate drag on the back foot due to the narrower tail, though the setback stance helps mitigate this. Just some further thoughts-I’d appreciate your take on this!
@@cybergreen874 yup, absolutely. I think I touch on all this in a video. It’s stuff to consider… there won’t be a perfect RULE. You already have awareness of all these things, so that’s great. That’s my greatest goal with the videos… make people aware that it’s more than just hype and lifestyle…. With your 31.5 cm long boot and an assumed 1 cm overhang on each side at fully set up bindings with your riding angles you’d want a 28cm waist width…. 28+1=29 under the back foot. +1 on each side = 31cm boot. The 0.5 disappear with the binding angle…. However, seems like your boot could be a full size smaller to start with, plus it’s a big foot print for a size 28 boot. If you don’t prioritize ultimate carving freedom, a 27cm waist will be perfectly fine for 90% of your turns. It all depends…… so many factors…… I’m afraid I can’t get more precise than in the video.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Lars, I’ve found that sizing up works better for me to avoid the toe squeeze and discomfort I get with smaller boots, the boots i'm riding are the Nitro team TLS but with other brands, I might be able to stick to my true size. I didn’t actually get a chance measure the boot. I based my estimate on the information you provided, but I mistakenly calculated it off my boot size instead of my foot length. Using your guideline of adding 3.5 cm, my boots should be closer to 30.5 cm rather than 31.5 cm. I’ve also been considering adjusting the heel cup to reduce drag-shifting the back foot more toward the heel side and the front foot toward the toe side. It might create some asymmetry, and I’m curious if you think this could affect balance and edge control during carves. Thanks for the reply and sparking these ideas. The season starts as early as October 1st in Xinjiang, China, so I’m already getting excited to get back on the mountains!
Hi man, great content, finally I have some more reference, thanks. I have a question, I currently have a Salomon HPS with about 270mm under the foot and with a 10.5 boot I have a protrusion of 25mm which is almost too much to be able to do some turns properly. I would like to replace it with a korua Transition finder and I'm undecided between the 157 and the 160, I weigh 73kg and everyone recommends the 157, I know that under the foot it measures 280mm so I would have a protrusion of about 20mm from the edge. With the 160 I would reduce the overhang to 15mm from the edge, but it is really very wide at 278mm in the center and 290mm under the foot. In your opinion, which choice is the most appropriate, I would really like to perform a good carving, but it is also true that it is also a very versatile all-rounder board, so I don't know if it makes sense to exaggerate so much. A thousand thanks sorry for the very long message.
First of all, 32cm boot for a size 10.5 is a pretty big footprint! Bummer! Then, Transition Finder 160 with a 278 waist... hmmmmm.... 290 under foot sounds like more than it can possibly be. The board has 18mm taper and an 8.2m radius... I don't think it grows in width by 12mm from waist to under foot. But I might be wrong!! Anyhow, I think in your case I'd go with the 160. I don't know your riding level, so that's difficult!! If you're not a strong rider maybe the 157 is enough... Too many variables for a stranger to tell you what's best!! Sorry man....
thanks so much for the advice, I looked at a review where the 157 measures 280mm under the foot, but I confused with the front one, the rear one measures 276mm, considering that the TF160 has 10mm more central width, I would say that at the rear foot it could be around 286mm Yes, unfortunately the boot is not very compact, but I have two pairs of boots of practically the same size and external dimensions. in terms of riding I do very well and I have good handling both front and back, I'm not very good at tricks but I ride well in all conditions
Aah!! 286 is literally what I assumed… it all sounds like go for the 160. That’s my opinion. Good luck. They both will be fine. The bigger one gives you the higher limit for carving without being super crazy wide. Depends on boot fit, too. It’s the foot turning the board, not the boot.
Hi Lars, sorry to bother you. returning to this discussion. I managed to get a new boot by going down half a size as I thought I would be able to do. now I have cut 10 with a fairly small size of 31cm, do you think it is possible to opt for the finder 57 transition? Thinking about it, it's a fairly versatile board and I'm afraid that the TF60 is certainly better for going deeper with carving but might limit me in all mountain use. It's a board I would ride all day in almost any terrain condition. A thousand thanks.
Hi! I'm 1,72cm (usually 20' to 21' inch stance width) and I weight 65kg which, generally, puts in a 153 board (most of them with 25cm of waist width). My feet are 27,5cm and going with your initial rule, most boards are 2 to 2,5 cm shorter than my feet at waist width. Would you recommend me going mostly for volume shifted boards to "fix" this? And if so what board would be a good pick for all-mountain freeriding (there aren't many options I'd say) for me?
Don’t be afraid of simply riding a slightly longer board. The idea that rider weight is everything is an overly simplified concept. I’m in a similar boat and have never owned a snowboard where I fall into the weight range. I’m 1,76m with size 28 feet/US10.5 boots and 63kg. I prioritize waist width and before short fats I used to ride 160+ boards only. Now my quiver goes from 153 to 200….
@@coryrita9695 looks great!! 😂 Watch my videos on volume shift and on functional waist width. then make up your mind. It’s an easy decision. You got this.
It’s too much when it’s too much…. Which is when you boot out. If you don’t tilt the board high on edge, you’ll be fine. If you want to work on your carving and higher angles, you’ll need a wider board soon.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for the response , I’ve managed to adjust the it so it’s both about 22mm , unfortunately I think my board is abit too thin, will see how I get on with it Thanks for the help, your video was exactly what I needed, I’ve subbed and liked , keep up the good work !
Im a mondo 27.2 but managed to fit into 8.5 K2 ortons. My daily ride is a K2 Excavator 154 with a 264mm ww andnits never felt overly wide or sluggish to me. I really want to try the K2 Special Effects, but the ww is 284mm and it leaves me with no overhang, the boot essentially lines up with the edge. Am i crazy to try riding this thing? Id consider myself an advanced carver and find myself booting out in softer snow on my other boards. Cheers!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel ya, took it out today for some soft early morning corduroy. Very slow edge transition but surprisingly stable once on edge. Once things softened up it became a really chore. Back to my excavator for the rest of the morning.
If you could help me i would be very grateful!!! 🙏🏼 I have a friend who wants to buy his first board (all mountain, focus on powder ) and he has 29cm foot... We have a good deal to a "k2 excavator" 158 with back insert reference point width about 27,5. Its ok the hung been 2cm each side??? Or we look for a biger board?
Depends on the riding level and riding goal! If he's a hard carver, it's too narrow. If he carves a little bit and not mega aggressively, it will be fine. For all mountain / powder it's fine. Great board!! Quite fun!! Not a beginner board... but fairly easy to ride.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel He just started to snowboarding last year and he is looking more into all mountain but he really is going from powder pocket to powder pocket... We have an alternative wider but its rocker to flat... (We are looking for very good deals because his budget is limited)
Great video. What would be useful, and what I've never seen, is a comparison of BSL across soft boot brands or models given an equal mondo size. That is, which soft boots are the shortest, and most compact?
Couldn't agree more!!! Maybe let's start with getting every brand to actually tell you mondo size... Hahahahaha... :-) It amazes me how far the boot game is behind... (For readers who are wondering what BSL means: Boot Sole Length)
That alone would be irrelevant, tbough. The shape of the sole decides about the angle you can achieve, too. And even if you collected that data, it would still miss the point, the best boot is not the most compact one, but the one that best fits your foot.
@@elho001 You're creating and then attacking a false dichotomy. Nobody suggested looking at compactness "alone" to select a carving soft boot. It's one of many factors that inform choosing a boot. But, also, for me, given size 12s, lack of compactness and long BSL is disqualifying. Even though it's not the single factor by which I *will* choose a boot, it is a single factor by which I *won't* choose a boot. That is, even if all of the other boxes are checked, I won't buy a boot that's too large, long, and prone to drag. The variation in BSL, sole shape, and overall compactness -- as affect drag and boot-out -- is pretty remarkable, even among high performance boots.
I know this a bit late but I have a question regarding waist width. My shoe size is 275mm and my boards waist width is 269mm. The actual shoe, a K2 Thraxis, measures 300mm. So even though my foot would be fine on the board, my boot still drags unless I go very steep angles (IE B+27 F+33) when I'm carving hard and my board is on high edge angle. So even if the board waist width is what is recommended, I can still bootout. Can you chime in on this? Are there boots that are closer to the actual foot length or do we just have to accept that the boot is going to be wider in general? Does this affect how we choose boards? Or is my technique wrong in some way?
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Sorry I should have specified. I have a Korua Cafe Racer 159cm. Taper is 28mm and waist under backfoot is 280mm give or take. I ride a narrower stance (52mm) and I drag both front and back foot unless I'm past +27 on both feet. I understand some drag is acceptable but if I'm on firm groomers then it should be minimal. Thanks for your time by the way.
@@cokeacolazzz hmmmm….. what can I say….. according to this you have 1cm overhang on each side of the board at 0° on the back foot…. With 6 to 9° that’ll be 7mm on each side…. I don’t have a board with that little overhang, and I never boot out. So you must be super aggressive on edge with super high board angulation and need a wider board. Brushing through the snow with your boots is different from booting out…… Booting out means edge gone, on your face. I’m really sorry to say this, but there’s not much point in your question, since your experience is all that counts. Who am I to tell you that you’re doing something wrong?! All the measuring means nothing…. If your boots are centred and you’re booting out, well, you need a wider board. My guideline is for people who lack the experience and are tapping completely in the dark. I’m surprised about the width under foot. The board is heavily tapered. I think under back foot it won’t measure more than 276mm.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for your insight. Maybe it's the snow conditions or my form is wrong in some aspect. Only way to figure out is to keep testing it out and if I really keep running into issues then I need a wider board. I appreciate your time. Love the videos, I've learned so much from them. Hopefully I can afford a Stranda Cheater one day
@@cokeacolazzz thank you, too for the comment! Keep playing and observing. I doubt it that it’s your form leading to drag. Hard to say without seeing you and your setup. Take care!
@@GuglielmoMannaia nah! You have options! Easiest is to approach Donek or Winterstick snowboards. They'll both make you an amazing board with a good width at a higher but fair price.
I think I found my functional width limit with the Korua TF 60. At 278 waist it was quite a lot to handle in the lumps, added to by my hacked, on the slope tip and tail detuning with a rock. 😂
My foot measures 265mm and I ride an Orca 153 which has a waist width of 267mm. As an intermediate rider, I’m now thinking this is too much board for me on non pristine conditions. Thoughts anyone?
There are no hard rules for any of this!! If it doesn't bug you, that's great! Had you bought the board from me, I simply would have said "be aware, the waist width is pushing it a little bit for choppy conditions... this and that may happen...". The board is super easy to ride and generally not much board at all, so maybe you're just fine... But yes, it is on the wide side for your feet from the perspective laid out in this video.
I will be making a video about those shapes here very soon! Essentially those boards are too wide for most people, but manufacturers won't tell you that... Wait for my video. I hope it'll explain all the details. :-)
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks. I bought a Gnu gremlin. I don't notice too much of a difference compared to my non volume shifted boards. But can't wait to hear your thoughts.
Lars, Do you know why Jones snowboards recommend women to buy disproportionately wide snowboards compared to men? Check out their recommendations for waist width on the website, Men’s US5-7 = 24-25cm waist. Women’s US5-7 = 23.7-24.5cm. Almost the same width board recommended for a much smaller women’s boot?
One full size difference is 8mm. So recommending 3mm difference is truly incorrect. No idea why they're doing it. I agree with @xavierzax comment below!
This is the first time I have heard anyone talking about shell fit for soft boots. I would run away screaming if someone tried to fit me with ski boots without doing a shell fit.
Yup! And you should! :-) I bet you anything, you'll find 1 out of every 20 board shops that does that. You can consider yourself lucky to get your feet measured... Mostly they ask for your sneaker size and then dish out some boots. This is my personal experience, and I might be wrong on the global scale.
hmm just got a new set up, new boots, board and so now iam a bit scared it wont fit xD i got 3,5 cm at Backfoot, front +12 and back -12 degree got a 155 board midwide is 251mm. Got an 11 Boot.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel hmm this dude would say it fits, im really interested in this topic and why you both have such a different thinking about it :D ruclips.net/video/GNJ70GPmync/видео.html&lc=UgwoLzK1MVoHM3RTEAN4AaABAg.A17Yu3mfO0qA17ZMdxyziE&ab_channel=PeterGlennSki%26Sports
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel im realy interested in the topic, Peter Glenn Ski & Sports - The Truth About Wide Snowboards, You Might Not Need One! would say its good to go today cause there isnt often a carv that makes problems with that. And cause of boots getting smaler and stuff, hows your opinion about that?
Hey bro! Big fan of yours. I am currently encountering trouble when getting a powder board like yours. It would be great to have your input. I’ve been looking to get a gentemstick, but I see that there is quite a variety of length as well as shapes. There are quite a few model of fish tail boards and swallowtail boards. They also released swallowtail boards that are crazy long in length and tail which I don’t think normal all mountain board length logic applies. Could you help out on how to pick one? I’m 175cm 60kg, I have a jones all mountain directional project x board that rides decent in light pow. So my choice is really deep pow specific and I hope it can be maneuvered within the trees as well.
Hi! Thanks for checking in. Do you wanna ride any groomers at all?? If so, what's your boot size? If you're basically looking for a board for cat skiing, aka riding pristine, untouched pow, waist width being too much is not an issue. Then you could go quite wide with lots of taper but short for great maneuverability. If you consider anything not so pristine, waist width needs to be considered much more so... and taper as well... and length, maybe... The longer the board the less nimble, therefore more stable - pick your poision! The Stranda Makrill 153 is perfect for me. I'm almost exactly your build: 176cm / 62kg / size US 10 boot. It's the perfect tree pow board for me, but feels a bit wide when things get choppy. Carving perfect corduroy is also incredible on that board - until it gets bumpy... Lots of variables! Gentem generally is quite specific to deep, perfect pow. They carve well, too. But in the steeps the wild amounts of taper make for a washy tail. If you can tell me more about yourself and tell me your current board options, I might be able to help picking.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Thank you so much for the detailed reply. Definitely a bless to have your wisdom on my pickup!☺️So currently within my rotation I have a Gray Mache which is groomer carving specific board as well as Jones project X which is a directional all mountain board which has float pack and carves well. Therefore, I want something thats more powder specific on a deep snow day! Obviously if it could ride just a little bit of groomer that would be awesome too :D. I recon I am not doing untouched pow since I am visiting a lot commercial places. But japan’s pow is definitely very deep and the primary goal is to ride effortlessly on deep snow. While the secondary goal is a bit of maneuverability, since I will be doing some trees here and there. I have tiny asian feet so my foot measures 250. I am considering any of the big mountain series, alternative series and snowsurf series within the catalog. www.gentemstick.com/newsPerma/id_541/🙏🙏
@@DehNeverBeen ok.... with your boot size you're almost forced to ride Gentemstick!! They still offer some very narrow boards. Stick to something around 250 waist width or less. The flat camber boards are great floaters and awesome in pow. Steer away from the short/fat fish shapes. They're WAY too wide for your little feet.... Spoon Fish 146 and 152 works, TT 165 Classic is great, too. But waist is only one factor....... Big Mountain and Alternative series are not so ideal. Alternatives are super wide, big mountain are very stiff and ask for big mountain speed.... not tree boards!!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thank you so much for the time and your opinion! Will definitely pick accordingly. Looking forward to see your next video!
Hey Bro! Still waiting on that email; let's do that collab this month. We should ride together when conditions improve or maybe do a simultaneous livestream on both channels if they don't? My email address is in the last minute of my Secrets video.
9 months in, close to 10.000 views later this video has seemingly helped many people to understand snowboard waist width.
If it changed your world and you want to express your gratitude and support my channel, you can do this here:
www.buymeacoffee.com/justaride
Thank you so much, and don't forget to check out my other content! ;-)
Lars is single handedly elevating snowboard knowledge in average joes like myself.
Truly appreciate the way you explain things w/o making it dry and giving simple ways to understand the nuances of snowboard tech.
I’ve learnt so much more from handful of your videos than the hundreds that I watched over the years.
If I ever make it out to fernie, beers on me 🤙
Btw, I’ve switched to posi/posi on my t finder and this thing came alive!! As you’ve said before, I was able to put more pressure on my front foot and really drive into turns!
Wow.... this is very nice of you! Thank you so much! I appreciate that comment!
Stoked to hear you're getting something out of my stuff!!
This is exactly the kind of information and thinking that I love. These are the details that I wonder about when things just don’t quite feel right or I notice different people with different preferences.
Thank you!!
Example case(for hypothetical average rider)-
Foot length 27cm
Board waist 25.5cm
Board under foot 26.5cm
Boot 30.5cm
=2cm overhang each side at 0 deg
9 deg reduces overhang by 3-4 mm
=17mm overhang each side.
Carving guy may want wider board, rail guy narrower board.
Good analysis, thanks! Waiting for episode on how to surgically trim a few mm from toes and heal bone.
This is the best info of this kind on YT. Speculation or not, it's great to hear people talking about it. Even if you are buying a board from a shop and not online, it's good to go armed with some ideas and hard numbers.
I've gone down the rabbit hole myself in calculating all of these variables. I've been looking at where I actually apply pressure with the heel and balls of my feet, and centering the bindings based off that measurement vs simply centering the boot.
It's an art and a science.
You know it!! That would put me on an insanely wide board, as I have long toes and would have to slide the binding forward by quite a bit to have pressure points in equal distance to the edge... It is indeed a rabbit hole!! :-)
This whole thing is interesting, but I'm not really sure centering your binding like that is the answer. The lever arms are asymmetrical anyways and it is much easier to put pressure on your toe edge even with centered boots (as Lars explained in his boot centering episode).
I’ve been riding since ‘92, and have been dabbling with making my own boards for the past few years. I thought I knew a lot about snowboarding, but making boards made me realize I hardly know a thing!
So glad I found your channel, I’ve learned so much essential knowledge just in the few videos I’ve watched so far.
This was an awesome video, so much good information in here. I also was listening to a podcast where Mikey Franco was saying the ideal board width is 1cm overhang on toe and heel.
Mikey is such a great guy!! Can you send me the link to that podcast?! That would be amazing! Thank you!!
Thanks so much, I do all this crazy stuff myself, but your rules of thumb are great and simplify everything. Please keep providing this "nerdy" episodes.
Thank you so much!!!
Love your channel cause i am an OCD snowboarder.
Love it!! :-) Thanks!!
Hi, those measurement examples are gold! Thank you!
Awesome! Thanks! Glad it’s helpful. 🙏
Your math checks out when measuring my setup, bravo.
Ha! Epic! 😊🙌🙏
educational, technical and practical, period !
@@honkavana I guess that was the goal! 🙂🙌 Thank you!!🙏
Good thing about this video: without saying it, it demonstrates that for big feet (size 13 and up) there aren't many wide enough snowboards on the market.
You’re not wrong…. It has gotten better, but now everything that’s wide enough is too short…. Check out Stranda Pipeliner 2.0. 187 with a 275 waist 🔥🔥🔥
Simply great video
Explained in a way that is easy to understand and still very detailed so anyone can use it as reference and adjust some parts if needed based on exact board, shoe and so on
Nice to see videos like this, kudos to you
Thank you so much!! 🙏🙏 This is exactly how I wanted this video to be utilized.
I am shocked at how this channel has so few subscribers.I just started learning to snowboard,and went looking for all sorts of educational videos.Quite frankly,RUclipsrs with most subscribers (on snowboarding topic) are much less informative,and what I feel is that some of them are less passionate about giving actual knowledge unlike this channel.All the best luck to you.We all want to see you grow 🎉🎉🎉
Thank you so much! Share the love, and it'll grow faster ;-) I only started in November 2023, that's three months. Not too bad, I think! 🙂
Hey Lars, that was a great video.
I think another thing that plays into the equation of ideal board width are what bindings you plan to pair with the board as well. I know you ride Now bindings, as I do, and those really seem to help power wider boards when you have a correspondingly smaller boot. I've got a 280 mondo, but finding myself really happy with 264-267mm waist boards. Maybe my ideal width is 255-260mm or so, but the extra leverage the skatetech gives feels like it may have bought me a few extra mm.
@@ataft85 same here!! 28 mondo and ideal waist is 268 to 272. Love the bindings! ✌️
Great video! Just got a 160 hovercraft 1.0 with a waist width of 26,8. I have a size 29,5 foot and roughly looking at the width and my angles (+28/+10) I will have very little overhang...thankfully.
I love to do very hard carves on slushy blues for which the old hovercraft is very much equipped to do.
measured my differences, and the difference on the right side is 1-2mm and on the left side 0-1mm, so i'd say that's quite good on my stance, which is 21 and 6.
overhang is 1.4 to 1.6 cm
Nice vid! With Adidas you’d add only get 18 mm extra to your mondo, with Burton around 22 mm. It’s also worth to mention that custom insoles supporting the natural arch of the feet really help to downsize/get a performance fit more comfortable.
Yup! Talking about all of this in my boot episodes! Cheers!!
Great advice. My second board I bought on special was a Dump Truck 163, 258 waist. I've never ridden it because I just know it's too narrow for my size 12s. Guy in shop said I'd be fine - took the sale, but it's about 25-30mm over hang. Just tried turning back foot forward, but that feels so wack, I'm normally 25 front negative 15 back duck. If I didn't/couldn't carve I might get away with it, but it's an aggressive all mountain and if I take it I'll want to lay it down.
Blows my mind how any shop guy would say that the width is fine...... You need a 270mm waist at the very minimum. Sorry to hear that! It's simply the wrong board. Another example for why I started this channel... 😞
I have size 7.5 feet. This topic is very important to me. Thanks!
Great subject, looking forward to your detailed advice 👍
You'll see... it's a lot of assumptions and variables.... Such a difficult topic to find any 'general rules'. Interesting, though, I think! 🙂Thanks for the early interest and comment!!
You gave me some great advice already,but I’m sure others will appreciate it and a video demonstration adds a lot. In recent years I’ve looked into the subject after realising my kit choices and boot size weren’t helping, and experimented with angles and home made riser plates out of poly chopping boards to good effect, then a wider board with bindings that have a thicker base, and even bought a cheap angle meter to measure, but recently bought the widest carve-biased board (Korua TF) I could find - just before your Stranda Cheater vid! 😆.
This is all great information and exactly what I have found myself. I have size 8 us (26 cm) feet and most boards at the length I like get fairly wide and are a workout in chop. Boards with a good amount of taper fix this for me. I usually only focus width at back inserts and every company should include this in specs.
As always an awesome video. I like your approach. Learning so much. Thank you!
Thank you so much!!
i guess if you calculate average (waist width + tail width)/2 : it should be quite the backfoot width. Fortunatly, now some brands give the underfoot width.
Very difficult to anticipate the foot drag because it doesn't depend only from the width/boot size, : depending boot sole shape, heel cup shape, heigth of the sole from the snow....Best is to try and adjust.
With the time and many trials, i know that i need at list a 27,5cm waist width if the radius is about 9/10m. And then adjusting in width by centering with the disk.
Whatever, your advices and observations are always so clever and smart.
Agreed!! Lots of 'just trying'. My goal in this case is a ball park good guess to save people money when buying a new board... But yeah, I completely get your point!
Where do you find boards that wide?
@@marksanchez0918 custom made... Donek or Coiler...
curious how you obtained 27.5 waist? how deep are you carves, and do you have a very large boot? I found myself a half size smaller than normal boot (size 11.5 from 12, boot is 32.4 cm) and i'm calculating that i'd need a width underfoot of like 28/29cm and a waist width of around 26cm.. maybe i did my maths wrong, but i'd love to know.
@@marksanchez0918 Your underfoot calculation is roughly correct. Rather 29 than 28.
If UF is 29, waist will be around 28.
Always surprises me manufacturers quote waist, tip and tail width and its very rare they ever provide board width at the insert area
That was extremely insightful, thank you.
I’d love to see you carve the Biru! I know that’s not its primary use but I think it would be awesome to see you on it!
Follow Malcolm Moore’s channel. We just did an episode together, both on the Biru. Gonna drop soon, I guess.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-ChannelThat sounds sick! I’ll keep an eye out for it!
@@mitche2176 Biru holds an edge like no other short fat all mountain board I’ve ever tried. Really good. Filled with typical Stranda DNA.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel That’s what I like to hear! Mine arrives on Saturday. After chatting with Mats a bit about my riding style he recommended the Biru to me.
Very informative, spectacular content. Thanks a lot for this.
Thank you so much!! 🙏
To make an even more accurate analysis, what is between the boot and the board should also be taken into consideration, the footbed area of the bindings. With same foot length and board width, different results are produced if the footbed is shorter or longer (actually harder or softer to be picky) because it imparts force to more external or internal points of the board so the leverage power changes. Taking the very practical example you give at the beginning of the video, it would be correct to put an additional piece of wood between the 2.
What do you think about this ? I know that your was just a practical example to make everyone understand the concept. Mine is just an in-depth, more realistic additional reasoning
You're right. For a video this is way too complicated! My tips are supposed to put people into a good place. If their binding produces slightly different results, then that is something they will learn from that. I can't possibly take binding specifications into account, and to be honest, I wouldn't want to. I want to inspire people to then take it and do their own experiments. There are so many little subjective things, which are fun to find out. I ride a NOW binding that is made from three different bindings............. and there won't be a video about that, hahahaha ;-)
Thanks for the comment. It will make people think about it.
Great job. Very informative. I wish manufacturers would just stop giving waist width and start giving widths at reference. Would seem much more useful.
Nidecker do. And the nice people at Korua went and measured the Cafe Racer and TF underfoot widths for me.
I agree it would be so much easier just to list it.
YES. also does that, but again YES. is Nidecker somehow.@@jerryb63
Jones do that too
Nidecker, Jones and Yes all do. Same owner, I believe
@@willakerlund4191The Nidecker Group owns Nidecker, Yes, Jones, Now (Bindings) and Flow. Seem funny to me, I always thought Nidecker is some cheap brand from eastern europe or asia, since mostly noobs ride with that and their stuff is often heavily discounted.
Hey lars, I am in the unfortunate situation of having large feet (My snowboard boots were fitted to size US 14). I am in the process of relearning how to snowbard properly after doing it very casually over the last 10 years. Essentially i was just counter rotateting constantly / doing completly skidded turns down the mountain.
I got new gear last year and even got the widest board i could manage to find (170UW board with a 285mm Waist width) but after watching this video and doing the measurement you did I have about 30-32mm overhang on both my toe and heel edge.
The issue I am running into while learning to carve / snowboard again is there are times where I feel like I may be booting out while doing carved turns ( on steep runs). I have a feeling a large part of this is due to me not being balanced properly over my edge so i am over enngadging my edge to keep grip. I also know that I pick up to much speed when during my carves which require me to carve more agrressively to keep my edge.
I guess what i'm trying to figure out if riding on my current setup is viable at all if my goal is to have a more carving focused riding style. I am fine with my "carving potential" being capped for the time being as I work on teqniue and then in a few seasons modifyng my gear with shorter boots and shorter binding to reduce my overhang.
Like if you had this ammount of overhang would you be able to make some kind nice carving work even if you couldn't push it close to what you normaly do. I understand how much I have to learn / practice / improve but i just hate the idea of putting work into it if there is really nothing i can do with this much overhang
Also thank you for making this channel, as someone who works in a technical field. Ihe way you describe snowboarding concepts coming from a deep fundenmental understanding of the entire system has been such a breath of fresh air. I swear i have learneu more watching 2 hour of your videos than I have in the previous 50 hours before.
Thanks for the kind words!!
I hate to say it, but 285mm for your feet is simply not enough....
There's no board on any shelf that will work for you and the idea of carving. It's a viscous cycle for you!! You aren't able yet to carve crazy high board angles, but your gear also doesn't allow for you to learn it.... There's "a little too narrow" and there is "too narrow". Your board is simply too narrow! I'd say a 310mm waist would be more appropriate, and that's just a guess. The quickest company to make you a board at a reasonable price is Donek. They offer good advice, too. Email Sean Martin at Donek, he'll be able to sort you out. At 20mm overhang on each side I can still just about carve reasonably well while being quite carful. That would be "a little too narrow". You're telling me 30-32mm on each side.... That's not a good start! Sorry! :-(
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Thanks for the response!
I was curious if there was anything i could maybe do with my current board to make it work. I just recently watched Jame's video on the snowboard interface and remebered him mentioning how much extra width some bindings can add to your overhang.
So i was curious and measured my bindings total width with the boots and then just the boots on there own and the bindings add 25mm in total to the overall width! (these are burton stepons which are a luxury I don't think I can afford in retrospect lol)
I think i am going to see if i can rent some bindings that are lower profile and don't add anything to the overhang. If i could get that 25mm back that would put me at roughly 18mm overhang on each side which seems way wary more managable, and that should tied me over for a while till my riding gets alot better and i can invest in a more specialized / custom board.
If your curious my measurements were 36.5cm for boots in bindings, and then 34cm even for just the boots
@@Fyyro You could use riser plates to get higher on the board!
Hey Lars, that is great info 👍 Should be in the school books ;D
Nice job on a complex topic, Lars
Thank you so much!!
I've tried mounting the
Now bindings for the first time and there was way too much toe drag.
So i tried the second method, where the slots are perpendicular to the board length.
It looks much more even. But now one heel hangs over more than the other, even though both bindings are in the equivalent holes. (I think)
I don't understand. My board is a mountain twin, so it's not as if one end has some weird taper.
The holes in the disc are not centred. Pay close attention to the orientation of the disc.
Excellent explanations as always!
Thank you!
I would take this snowboarding semester course
Hahaha.... :-)
Back again, watching your brilliant videos - no hype or bullshit just solid, useful information 👍 How do these modern, super wide boards ride? The Ride Warpig XL for example ( recommended for my weight and foot size ) has a waist width of 277 but my foot length is 270 🤯🤷♂️
So under foot that board is close to 290, which is 200mm more than foot length.... That makes it much too wide for a daily driver, but possibly fun for advanced carving. Then again, advanced carving needs a larger radius.... So really, if you don't have bigger feet, those boards are somewhat pointless. Fun in deep pow, though!!
How do feel between these two options the width at inserts 276mm and the other 280mm i have cans infuse size 11 seems to measure around 282-284 mm boot length. And will be using jones Orion bindings. Only asking because it seems sizing down can help make it feel more nimble.
Are you asking about two different boards??
Your Vans boot in a size 11 is at least 31cm long on the outside. Not sure what you've measured.
In Variable snow conditions I need more width to carve and not boot out. I don't ever really experience the board creating to much force on my ankles. As My edges are high other than jumps, pow and pre season. I Really enjoy wide Volume shifted board in Moguls.
I watched this video so many times but I might need your opinion to determine if this board is right for me.
Ride commission 158cm
Waist width 257mm
Reference under front foot 262mm - under back foot 264mm.
My feet are 260mm - US 8.
+30 +15
The only drag I would encounter would be from the boots thickness. I like to crave like you do, freeride, blue and black groomers and also go fast all mountain.
Note: my weight is only the heaviest end of the recommended.
@@THANHHA-95 Sounds like a good match. You could also go K2 Alchemist in the longest non wide length. Great carver/freerider.
Thank you for all these informations! I wonder if taper makes back foot overhang.No one talks about it.I have an excavator 158 with 268 waist width and 20mm taper. Doesn't that mean that back boot overhangs like on a non tapered board with 24.8 waist width?
@@ΚωνσταντίνοςΦουντής-φ2χ yes, for sure. Maybe not quite to that extent. But you’re right. I think I mention that in the video.
Hi Lars, I was wondering what your opinion was on using risers for snowboards, allows you to down-size for a much narrower board, saves weight, and still allows for the lever mechanic you talk about early in the video. What do you feel are some downsides in using risers?
I am also curious about our opinion on using heel risers inside your snowboard boots. To me it feels a lot more comfortable because it allows the ankles to have more room for dorsiflexion which allows me to bend my knees further than I could otherwise, the ankles can only bend so much upwards before either the heels start to lift or toeside. I can forsee it also reducing ankle injuries in choppy terrain as well because there is room to bend here.
Good points on the use of risers. I've never tried that.
Yes, risers can work. I'm doing a video on that soon. They definitely cause a very different feel that is not very nice for freestyle stuff. But for carving they can be great!
Great video! ...but what about hight when in binding? Your boot is not flat on the snowboard, it's elevated differently depending on binding cushioning etc.
Great point!! Very difficult to factor in. The better way to approach the whole topic would be to measure edge angle until boot out, but I haven’t found a good way to do this yet. Donek have a template for this to download, I think.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel maybe it doesn't matter though? If your 1cm example works for you, and you carve on extreme angels... I think that would mean most riders should be fine. A mm here or there will not matter. The most important important aspect is your wood block example, we all need a few mm heel and toe overhang while barefoot in our riding stance.
@@TT-lg7ip I thought that was exactly what I was saying in the video, no?! Thanks for the comment. I agree.
Thanks for the informative video. I’ve been on the hunt for a better performing setup. I had a hunch that possibly I was in too big of a boot. I have ride fuse US11 / mondo29. My foot actually measures 28cm. Good boot but the fit has always been a little off. The wrap liner is a little too large for my slim lower leg. I try not to overtighten, but I still get a little heel lift. I may look into sizing down 1/2. I also took some board and overhang measurements.
Board: Lib tech BRD 162w, 265 waist width. Front foot 21 degrees angle with 17mm over on the toes and 15mm on the heel. Back foot angle +3 with 25mm over on both toes and heel. Stance width just under 22in or 56cm. Figure the extra overhang on back foot is due to the 15mm taper of this board along with a mellow binding angle. Any suggestions, feedback?
Yeah, it's due to the taper. You could go to a wider board, for sure. But it's pretty good - depending on your ability level! Boot questions are difficult to answer online.
Awesome breakdown. Thanks so much.
Much appreciated!! Thanks!
I like and comment on the video before watching it. :)
P.S. That Makrill looks sooo nice!
Hahaha, love it!! 😊🙏
That Makrill also rides so well… It’s so much more board than just a little 153 powder fish!!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel I noticed that on the Stranda site the board is only offered as 152 and I saw it one a different site as a 153 is that correct? Or is that just depending on the year of production? I really like the Makrill look and the specs on the Stranda site for the 152 seem like the right fit for me, wheres the 153 stats seems to be for someone a tad bid heavier then I am.
@@nemaemanema3940 It's a 153. No idea what's up there about a 152... Sorry about the confusion! It won't matter much that 1cm...
I Love this in depth materials that you make. It is rare in YT snowboard content. May I ask what size is this book and what is the thickness of the liner that you use?
Thanks!! 🙏😊 Boot is US 10 / mondo 28. Liner is mondo 28 low volume tongue liner in dual density. Intuition OG.
Thank you!@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel
do you have any recommendations for me, i have a 24.4 cm foot and i am a 5’8 male 140 lbs… I can’t find any boards that would actually fit me. should i just compensate by getting a shorter board then usual or is there any boards with an appropriate waist width (23.5) and length for me
That is indeed tough. Ride Berzerker might work. K2 and Ride offer some models that are very old school in width. The Asian brands keep it narrow, too. Gentemstick make some boards around 250 waist that are over 160 long.... I'm sure if you take some time you'll find more. Good luck!
As usual your information is very insightful could you also give the measurements in inches? Question: what size and length board should I have with a size 12 boot 30.O eur size for a all round riding deck? We also always talk about all the variables something many riders don't really understand thanks!
Thanks for the comment!! It's really easy these days to convert to inches (google), and the maths - if you want maths - is all laid out in the video. I hope you can figure this out yourself with my suggestions here.
Board length has nothing to do with boot size, so unfortunately I can't recommend anything.
Good luck my friend!!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel The reason I asked was because I also have the Apmlid morning glory which is volume shift but a tapered tail which creates more of an offset for the back foot. Like you I’m looking for a more similar side cut though the board without drag!
I am not sure the effect in choppy snow is that strong?
I did notice my widest board to strain my feet when riding icy slopes all day having less leverage to dig the edges in. An effect that is somewhat lessened with Skatetech bindings.
Last two days anh the night between it almost constantly rained with a bit snow thrown in, resulting in ultimately wet, heavy sticky snow, soon tracked out into bumps that often at some pressure would collapse. To test different structure/wax in these conditions, I happened to be switching between 3 boards each day going down the same slopes. It sure was a workout for the legs absorbing the bumps and dealing jaggedness of the ride, but no issue with the leverage. And worst was the narrowest of the 3, for being the softest (even though the turniness of its hybrid rocker makes good snow moguls less work), stiff volume shifted in the middle and stiff carving board best, but hardly any narrower than the volume shift, rather just a good deal longer.
So defenitely stiffness and maybe length being much stronger factors there?
I guess it is also subjective.... maybe someone with strong ankles is fine. I definitely notice when a board is too wide for bumpy/choppy stuff. That 'too wide' is likely subjective. Just putting out the thought there is a 'too wide' and a 'too narrow' and a functional waist width.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Yeah, no doubt about the too wide. Could indeed be the ankle strength, at least if it is innate and not any training for it in my case.
Makes sense as far as what I notice in my feet when on icy hardpack with too wide a board is not the ankles, but rather the heel getting sore from the forces trying to pull it out of the heel cup and according friction from vibration.
Random question, just because I notice the logos on your kits... how's Haglöfs compare to Arc'teryx? My general sense is Arc'teryx and Norrøna are in a class of their own for North American-accessible outerwear, even compared to other brands licensed for Goretex Pro. But heard rumblings Haglöfs is in a very similar tier.
Just speaking compared Arc'teryx versus say Burton [ak] or high-end Patagonia, I'm struck by how much more dialed in the pattern is and how much tighter the seam allowances are. Although that's pre-Anta acquisition Arc'teryx, not sure these days how things are holding up.
Haglöfs is right up there with the two! Fantastic quality. Depends on the fit of course whether it’s good for you.
Very helpful video. Do you have any recommendation on the minimum overhang on both heel and toe side for all mountain/freeride？
Thanks. That would be what the video is about. Functional waist width. 1.5 cm on each side. Maybe 2, if you don’t carve much with high ish board angles.
This makes buying a snowboard so confusing. So I need to buy for my weight along with the correct size waist so im not draggin my boot. Yet manufacturers wanna know my height? Along with not giving me underfoot width but the waist width so I have to assume its bigger underfoot. Why not just tell me so i dont have to guess. Is having a board with the proper width better or is proper board legnth?
Love this comment!! Yes! Correct!! It’s ridiculous. And so inaccurate. They just go by weight, and that is only a third of the story. Board width is often only included inaccurately and length is often suggested too short. This is why I started this channel…. I really hope I can help…
Very useful information. A friend of mine who is an advanced level rider & can really achieve a high board angle when carving has large feet & usually wear a boot size uk 12. Boot drag has always been an issue for him as he doesn’t like to run a specifically ‘wide’ version of his chosen board (primary board CustomX 162) - runs a fairly high positive front angle & significant negative rear angle which helps minimise drag as you have said - though he still struggles. His method to overcome has been to develop his own binding baseplate risers made from around 1.2cm thick rubber floor tiles to increase the distance between boot & snow when on edge- which really seems to work him without too much compromise on board feel. Have you any experience of this type solution ? I would be interested to know your thoughts. There doesn’t seem to be any products on the market - so either it’s completely nonsense, or my friend needs to get his patent applied for quickly & lead the charge 😂
Hahahaha, funny! You're 20 years too late! :-)
The product was called riser plates... Palmer Plates.... Burton had a model, too. It was considered 'silly' when freestyle took over. Now you can't find this anywhere anymore - very difficult! It's a solution, for sure. But it changes how the board feel overall. The higher platform is less ideal for park stuff... Great for carving, though! What is likely to mess with your friend's performance is the substantially negative backfoot angle. Watch my videos (1/2/3) on stances (duck vs. posi). Cheers!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Haha - my mates so far behind the curve he's in front of it! 🤣
Another great video Lars! Would be interested in how foot bed height affects this. Is there a height you never go over, or even under? The higher the footbed the more leverage you have no?
Correct! I'd always appreciate a higher footbed, but I feel like companies are all fairly similar with a few minor exceptions.
@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel I've just swapped from Cartel EST's to Unions Forces. Alot higher footbed so I'm excited to try them out. The EST system just seems wrong, too much hard plastic denting my topsheet!
I would love to know how you set your binding angles if you rotate the insert disk to slide back and forth on the board (instead of side to side) to get equal overhang?
Im switching to union atlas bindings for my all mountain freestyle board and the closest i can get to center, on the middle heel cup setting (1), is 11/16” toe over hang and 1 1/8” heel overhang w/ a 2” boot clearance. Waist width is 26.1 cm, size 11.5 boot. Ive been carving pretty hard with the cartel x’s (same board) but with 13/16” toe/ 1 1/4” heel overhang so i know its doable, but would love to know what even overhang feels like!
Yes, I run the disk tie to heel rather than tip to tail. Centred is pretty nice….
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Guess I didnt ask the question the right way. I gotcha, but how do you set the correct binding angle if the 3 degree angle increments are rotated due to you switching the orientation to account for heel and toe drag?
@@STAyTHIrstyMyFREind If you wanted to be 1000% accurate (which I don't think is necessary) you'd set your angles and the play with the fore aft movement of the disc with the boot in the binding until you have even overhang, I guess. I'm still not sure whether I understand you. It might also not be possible to centre the boot perfectly. I'm basically suggesting to aim for a centred boot (not centred binding, btw!) as best as one can.
Hi, in one of your video’s you mentioned a pad underneath you binding to lift the whole binding and avoid heel and toe drag. Can you tell me which pads you use? Thnx! Greetings, Steven.
On some boards for rare occasions I use pads from 'Padride'. They do the job, but there's room for improvement. They're definitely the thickest I've ever seen and give lots of clearance. I'll be uploading a review on those this fall. If you get in touch with them, tell them you've found the product through me. It'll help me next season... Thank you very much!
I will. Thanks!!!
What are your first thoughts about the improvements, can you share these please?
@@stevenvanderkaag board becomes tippy! Less effort to get it on edge, which makes it more responsive, so you may dial it back a notch and start edging a little more carefully.
Quicker edge to edge.
More angulation without booting out. Mellower binding angles become possible, if wanted. Board becomes significantly heavier on chair lifts without foot rests.
What in case you cannot make toe and heel overhang even? is it better to have more overhang on toes or heels?
In consequential freeride terrain more toe overhang is better. It is easier to self arrest after booting out on your toe edge in an icy couloire than booting out on your heel edge and just slide on your butt into the abyss…. Otherwise I would prefer riding with more heel overhang, because mostly you don’t achieve the same edge angles on your heels that you do in your toes.
Hey man great video! I love your channel and all the in depth info you give, I appreciate all the work that goes into these videos and please keep it up! Quick question, if I’m following you right then with a boot of about 300mm, at a binding angle of 15 degrees for both (15 positive on front 15 negative back) my ideal waist width would be around 275? Does that sound right? I’m not trying to be exact, just trying to get an idea of my ideal width because I’ve been trying to figure out for a while what fits my size 13 US boots!
....you mean foot of about 300mm???
Thanks for the kind words!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel a boot itself of 300mm in length from the end at the heel to the farthest end of the boot near the big toe. I’m away and I don’t have my boots nearby to measure so that’s an estimate for now, but wanted to make sure my math is right. I was planning to measure and be exact when I can.
@@cameroncovill6324 If you have size 13 feet, your boot is at least 335mm long - likely longer. I don't understand your 300mm boot length. I'm a US 10 in a short boot, and the boot is still 310mm........ So your 300 make no sense... How long is your foot in mm or cm?
Gotcha, my apologies I had looked it up because I didnt have my boots to measure and some online source I found said a size 13 is 300mm in length generally. So I’ll have to measure when I get a chance and get back to you. Just wanted to say thank you for reading my comments and getting back to me, even though I have not provided you with accurate information for my question lol
@@cameroncovill6324 yes, the 300mm are talking about the foot length at size 13. Your boot is likely about 330mm long. Possibly more.
How does the makrill ride on groomers vs the shorty 64W?
and...great channel!!
Well..... something like 25cm less effective edge are noticeable.
It carves extremely well with that very stiff tail. I don't know where all the grip comes from, but it's there. I do simply feel like I'm on a short board, however. You really can't compare the two boards. Makrill s more surfy, Japanese, back foot carving. Shorty is a freeride board at heart. Fast, larger turns, wild amounts of edge grip.
Thank you for the reply! I want something different from the Cheater board and wondering if the shorty is a 'doitall' cheater...like just another 'lesser' cheater to carve. Thank you again for the reply and your time! I will go with the makrill...though the 'back foot' carving is not how I ride...@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel
Hi Lars,
Thanks so much for all you do! I’ve learned a lot from your content.
I have a question about boot length and overhang. You mentioned that boot length is typically longer than foot length due to the shell and liner, and you suggested adding about 3.5 cm to account for this. I understand that, but I’m still unsure how to apply it to waist width calculations.
For example, my foot is 27 cm, but my size 28 boot is closer to 31.5 cm with the outer material. Based on this, wouldn’t my overhang be more significant than just a few millimeters? I’m concerned that if I follow the method in the video, I might end up with too much overhang for all-mountain riding and carving.
Could you clarify how this extra boot length should factor into waist width calculations? I’d love to hear your thoughts. Thanks again for all your work!
Some extra points to consider:
1. Back Foot (Toe-Side Drag): The back foot’s toe side often drags because it’s closer to the narrowest part of the board (near the waist), especially with lower angles (like my +12°).
2. Front Foot (Heel-Side Drag): Heel drag on the front foot happens because the heel is positioned near the narrower section of the board, especially with higher angles (like my +24°).
3. Tapered Boards: Directional boards with taper, can exacerbate drag on the back foot due to the narrower tail, though the setback stance helps mitigate this.
Just some further thoughts-I’d appreciate your take on this!
@@cybergreen874 yup, absolutely. I think I touch on all this in a video. It’s stuff to consider… there won’t be a perfect RULE. You already have awareness of all these things, so that’s great. That’s my greatest goal with the videos… make people aware that it’s more than just hype and lifestyle….
With your 31.5 cm long boot and an assumed 1 cm overhang on each side at fully set up bindings with your riding angles you’d want a 28cm waist width…. 28+1=29 under the back foot. +1 on each side = 31cm boot. The 0.5 disappear with the binding angle….
However, seems like your boot could be a full size smaller to start with, plus it’s a big foot print for a size 28 boot.
If you don’t prioritize ultimate carving freedom, a 27cm waist will be perfectly fine for 90% of your turns.
It all depends…… so many factors…… I’m afraid I can’t get more precise than in the video.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Lars, I’ve found that sizing up works better for me to avoid the toe squeeze and discomfort I get with smaller boots, the boots i'm riding are the Nitro team TLS but with other brands, I might be able to stick to my true size.
I didn’t actually get a chance measure the boot. I based my estimate on the information you provided, but I mistakenly calculated it off my boot size instead of my foot length. Using your guideline of adding 3.5 cm, my boots should be closer to 30.5 cm rather than 31.5 cm.
I’ve also been considering adjusting the heel cup to reduce drag-shifting the back foot more toward the heel side and the front foot toward the toe side. It might create some asymmetry, and I’m curious if you think this could affect balance and edge control during carves.
Thanks for the reply and sparking these ideas. The season starts as early as October 1st in Xinjiang, China, so I’m already getting excited to get back on the mountains!
@@cybergreen874 keep playing with it! You're on the right path!! 🙂
Hi man, great content, finally I have some more reference, thanks.
I have a question,
I currently have a Salomon HPS with about 270mm under the foot and with a 10.5 boot I have a protrusion of 25mm which is almost too much to be able to do some turns properly.
I would like to replace it with a korua Transition finder and I'm undecided between the 157 and the 160, I weigh 73kg and everyone recommends the 157, I know that under the foot it measures 280mm
so I would have a protrusion of about 20mm from the edge.
With the 160 I would reduce the overhang to 15mm from the edge, but it is really very wide at 278mm in the center and 290mm under the foot.
In your opinion, which choice is the most appropriate, I would really like to perform a good carving, but it is also true that it is also a very versatile all-rounder board, so I don't know if it makes sense to exaggerate so much.
A thousand thanks
sorry for the very long message.
First of all, 32cm boot for a size 10.5 is a pretty big footprint! Bummer!
Then, Transition Finder 160 with a 278 waist... hmmmmm.... 290 under foot sounds like more than it can possibly be. The board has 18mm taper and an 8.2m radius... I don't think it grows in width by 12mm from waist to under foot. But I might be wrong!!
Anyhow, I think in your case I'd go with the 160. I don't know your riding level, so that's difficult!! If you're not a strong rider maybe the 157 is enough... Too many variables for a stranger to tell you what's best!! Sorry man....
thanks so much for the advice,
I looked at a review where the 157 measures 280mm under the foot, but I confused with the front one, the rear one measures 276mm, considering that the TF160 has 10mm more central width, I would say that at the rear foot it could be around 286mm
Yes, unfortunately the boot is not very compact, but I have two pairs of boots of practically the same size and external dimensions.
in terms of riding I do very well and I have good handling both front and back, I'm not very good at tricks but I ride well in all conditions
Aah!! 286 is literally what I assumed… it all sounds like go for the 160. That’s my opinion. Good luck. They both will be fine. The bigger one gives you the higher limit for carving without being super crazy wide. Depends on boot fit, too. It’s the foot turning the board, not the boot.
Hi Lars, sorry to bother you.
returning to this discussion.
I managed to get a new boot by going down half a size as I thought I would be able to do.
now I have cut 10 with a fairly small size of 31cm, do you think it is possible to opt for the finder 57 transition? Thinking about it, it's a fairly versatile board and I'm afraid that the TF60 is certainly better for going deeper with carving but might limit me in all mountain use. It's a board I would ride all day in almost any terrain condition.
A thousand thanks.
@@oscarbonini97 Your reasoning seems solid. They'd both be fine. Don't overthink this. The 57 is probably great.
Hi!
I'm 1,72cm (usually 20' to 21' inch stance width) and I weight 65kg which, generally, puts in a 153 board (most of them with 25cm of waist width).
My feet are 27,5cm and going with your initial rule, most boards are 2 to 2,5 cm shorter than my feet at waist width.
Would you recommend me going mostly for volume shifted boards to "fix" this?
And if so what board would be a good pick for all-mountain freeriding (there aren't many options I'd say) for me?
Don’t be afraid of simply riding a slightly longer board. The idea that rider weight is everything is an overly simplified concept. I’m in a similar boat and have never owned a snowboard where I fall into the weight range. I’m 1,76m with size 28 feet/US10.5 boots and 63kg. I prioritize waist width and before short fats I used to ride 160+ boards only. Now my quiver goes from 153 to 200….
Great, thanks for the reply!@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel
How does a size 10 boot look on that makrill you’re showing?
@@coryrita9695 looks great!! 😂 Watch my videos on volume shift and on functional waist width. then make up your mind. It’s an easy decision. You got this.
Hi I’m running -15 + 15
Toe I have 25mm and heal is 20mm is this too much
Thanks for advice
It’s too much when it’s too much…. Which is when you boot out. If you don’t tilt the board high on edge, you’ll be fine. If you want to work on your carving and higher angles, you’ll need a wider board soon.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for the response , I’ve managed to adjust the it so it’s both about 22mm , unfortunately I think my board is abit too thin, will see how I get on with it
Thanks for the help, your video was exactly what I needed, I’ve subbed and liked , keep up the good work !
@@deanSidlow awesome to hear that!! Thanks for the support!!
Im a mondo 27.2 but managed to fit into 8.5 K2 ortons. My daily ride is a K2 Excavator 154 with a 264mm ww andnits never felt overly wide or sluggish to me. I really want to try the K2 Special Effects, but the ww is 284mm and it leaves me with no overhang, the boot essentially lines up with the edge. Am i crazy to try riding this thing? Id consider myself an advanced carver and find myself booting out in softer snow on my other boards. Cheers!
Yeah, that’s pushing it. It’ll work on perfect corduroy. But it’s more than you need.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel ya, took it out today for some soft early morning corduroy. Very slow edge transition but surprisingly stable once on edge. Once things softened up it became a really chore. Back to my excavator for the rest of the morning.
If you could help me i would be very grateful!!! 🙏🏼
I have a friend who wants to buy his first board (all mountain, focus on powder ) and he has 29cm foot...
We have a good deal to a "k2 excavator" 158 with back insert reference point width about 27,5.
Its ok the hung been 2cm each side??? Or we look for a biger board?
Depends on the riding level and riding goal! If he's a hard carver, it's too narrow. If he carves a little bit and not mega aggressively, it will be fine.
For all mountain / powder it's fine.
Great board!! Quite fun!! Not a beginner board... but fairly easy to ride.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel He just started to snowboarding last year and he is looking more into all mountain but he really is going from powder pocket to powder pocket... We have an alternative wider but its rocker to flat... (We are looking for very good deals because his budget is limited)
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for replying anyway.... keep going with the videos... I have learned snowboard from you!!!
@@ΕυάγγελοςΠλεξίδας if you want, you can support the channel here with a tip! 😊🙏 buymeacoffee.com/justaride
Great video. What would be useful, and what I've never seen, is a comparison of BSL across soft boot brands or models given an equal mondo size. That is, which soft boots are the shortest, and most compact?
Couldn't agree more!!! Maybe let's start with getting every brand to actually tell you mondo size... Hahahahaha... :-) It amazes me how far the boot game is behind...
(For readers who are wondering what BSL means: Boot Sole Length)
That alone would be irrelevant, tbough. The shape of the sole decides about the angle you can achieve, too.
And even if you collected that data, it would still miss the point, the best boot is not the most compact one, but the one that best fits your foot.
@@elho001 You're creating and then attacking a false dichotomy. Nobody suggested looking at compactness "alone" to select a carving soft boot. It's one of many factors that inform choosing a boot. But, also, for me, given size 12s, lack of compactness and long BSL is disqualifying. Even though it's not the single factor by which I *will* choose a boot, it is a single factor by which I *won't* choose a boot. That is, even if all of the other boxes are checked, I won't buy a boot that's too large, long, and prone to drag. The variation in BSL, sole shape, and overall compactness -- as affect drag and boot-out -- is pretty remarkable, even among high performance boots.
@@sugarplumflyjelly Glad you can afford disqualifying boots on that matter, as opposed to being happy to find one that fits at all. Fair enough then.
I know this a bit late but I have a question regarding waist width. My shoe size is 275mm and my boards waist width is 269mm. The actual shoe, a K2 Thraxis, measures 300mm. So even though my foot would be fine on the board, my boot still drags unless I go very steep angles (IE B+27 F+33) when I'm carving hard and my board is on high edge angle. So even if the board waist width is what is recommended, I can still bootout. Can you chime in on this? Are there boots that are closer to the actual foot length or do we just have to accept that the boot is going to be wider in general? Does this affect how we choose boards? Or is my technique wrong in some way?
What board? How much taper? What's the waist under the backfoot?
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Sorry I should have specified. I have a Korua Cafe Racer 159cm. Taper is 28mm and waist under backfoot is 280mm give or take. I ride a narrower stance (52mm) and I drag both front and back foot unless I'm past +27 on both feet. I understand some drag is acceptable but if I'm on firm groomers then it should be minimal. Thanks for your time by the way.
@@cokeacolazzz hmmmm….. what can I say….. according to this you have 1cm overhang on each side of the board at 0° on the back foot…. With 6 to 9° that’ll be 7mm on each side…. I don’t have a board with that little overhang, and I never boot out. So you must be super aggressive on edge with super high board angulation and need a wider board.
Brushing through the snow with your boots is different from booting out…… Booting out means edge gone, on your face.
I’m really sorry to say this, but there’s not much point in your question, since your experience is all that counts. Who am I to tell you that you’re doing something wrong?! All the measuring means nothing…. If your boots are centred and you’re booting out, well, you need a wider board. My guideline is for people who lack the experience and are tapping completely in the dark.
I’m surprised about the width under foot. The board is heavily tapered. I think under back foot it won’t measure more than 276mm.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for your insight. Maybe it's the snow conditions or my form is wrong in some aspect. Only way to figure out is to keep testing it out and if I really keep running into issues then I need a wider board. I appreciate your time. Love the videos, I've learned so much from them. Hopefully I can afford a Stranda Cheater one day
@@cokeacolazzz thank you, too for the comment! Keep playing and observing. I doubt it that it’s your form leading to drag. Hard to say without seeing you and your setup. Take care!
My foot is 29.5cm long. My snowboard options are very limited 😕
Unfortunately true! :-(
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel I guess I'll try skiing
@@GuglielmoMannaia nah! You have options! Easiest is to approach Donek or Winterstick snowboards. They'll both make you an amazing board with a good width at a higher but fair price.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel that sounds good! But I live in Italy, do you know of a Europe based company making custom snowboards?
@@GuglielmoMannaia maybe Zen Snowboards?!
I think I found my functional width limit with the Korua TF 60. At 278 waist it was quite a lot to handle in the lumps, added to by my hacked, on the slope tip and tail detuning with a rock. 😂
Hello, what about plates or risers ? Thank you
Video coming soon! Stay tuned.
My foot measures 265mm and I ride an Orca 153 which has a waist width of 267mm. As an intermediate rider, I’m now thinking this is too much board for me on non pristine conditions. Thoughts anyone?
There are no hard rules for any of this!! If it doesn't bug you, that's great! Had you bought the board from me, I simply would have said "be aware, the waist width is pushing it a little bit for choppy conditions... this and that may happen...". The board is super easy to ride and generally not much board at all, so maybe you're just fine... But yes, it is on the wide side for your feet from the perspective laid out in this video.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks for the in depth video! Love geeking out on all things. 🫡
How does that work with volume shifted boards?
I will be making a video about those shapes here very soon! Essentially those boards are too wide for most people, but manufacturers won't tell you that... Wait for my video. I hope it'll explain all the details. :-)
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thanks. I bought a Gnu gremlin. I don't notice too much of a difference compared to my non volume shifted boards. But can't wait to hear your thoughts.
Lars, Do you know why Jones snowboards recommend women to buy disproportionately wide snowboards compared to men? Check out their recommendations for waist width on the website, Men’s US5-7 = 24-25cm waist. Women’s US5-7 = 23.7-24.5cm. Almost the same width board recommended for a much smaller women’s boot?
The men's/women's boot sizes shouldn't be that different. A women's 6 should be a men's 5, roughly, and so on up the chart.
Good observation : girls have often too wide boards and men too narrow boards....
One full size difference is 8mm. So recommending 3mm difference is truly incorrect. No idea why they're doing it. I agree with @xavierzax comment below!
This is the first time I have heard anyone talking about shell fit for soft boots. I would run away screaming if someone tried to fit me with ski boots without doing a shell fit.
Yup! And you should! :-)
I bet you anything, you'll find 1 out of every 20 board shops that does that. You can consider yourself lucky to get your feet measured... Mostly they ask for your sneaker size and then dish out some boots. This is my personal experience, and I might be wrong on the global scale.
hmm just got a new set up, new boots, board and so now iam a bit scared it wont fit xD i got 3,5 cm at Backfoot, front +12 and back -12 degree got a 155 board midwide is 251mm. Got an 11 Boot.
That is certainly way too narrow. 265 waist would be more accurate….
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel hmm this dude would say it fits, im really interested in this topic and why you both have such a different thinking about it :D ruclips.net/video/GNJ70GPmync/видео.html&lc=UgwoLzK1MVoHM3RTEAN4AaABAg.A17Yu3mfO0qA17ZMdxyziE&ab_channel=PeterGlennSki%26Sports
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel im realy interested in the topic,
Peter Glenn Ski & Sports - The Truth About Wide Snowboards, You Might Not Need One! would say its good to go today cause there isnt often a carv that makes problems with that. And cause of boots getting smaler and stuff, hows your opinion about that?
@@Shizuia I'm just now uploading a new video on this. Check it out!! ruclips.net/video/XrSl6OgBkpI/видео.html
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Thanks :D
Size 13 shoes. Size 11 Burton boots.
Hey bro! Big fan of yours. I am currently encountering trouble when getting a powder board like yours. It would be great to have your input. I’ve been looking to get a gentemstick, but I see that there is quite a variety of length as well as shapes. There are quite a few model of fish tail boards and swallowtail boards. They also released swallowtail boards that are crazy long in length and tail which I don’t think normal all mountain board length logic applies. Could you help out on how to pick one? I’m 175cm 60kg, I have a jones all mountain directional project x board that rides decent in light pow. So my choice is really deep pow specific and I hope it can be maneuvered within the trees as well.
Looking forward to hear back!
Hi! Thanks for checking in. Do you wanna ride any groomers at all?? If so, what's your boot size? If you're basically looking for a board for cat skiing, aka riding pristine, untouched pow, waist width being too much is not an issue. Then you could go quite wide with lots of taper but short for great maneuverability. If you consider anything not so pristine, waist width needs to be considered much more so... and taper as well... and length, maybe... The longer the board the less nimble, therefore more stable - pick your poision! The Stranda Makrill 153 is perfect for me. I'm almost exactly your build: 176cm / 62kg / size US 10 boot. It's the perfect tree pow board for me, but feels a bit wide when things get choppy. Carving perfect corduroy is also incredible on that board - until it gets bumpy...
Lots of variables! Gentem generally is quite specific to deep, perfect pow. They carve well, too. But in the steeps the wild amounts of taper make for a washy tail. If you can tell me more about yourself and tell me your current board options, I might be able to help picking.
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel Thank you so much for the detailed reply. Definitely a bless to have your wisdom on my pickup!☺️So currently within my rotation I have a Gray Mache which is groomer carving specific board as well as Jones project X which is a directional all mountain board which has float pack and carves well. Therefore, I want something thats more powder specific on a deep snow day! Obviously if it could ride just a little bit of groomer that would be awesome too :D. I recon I am not doing untouched pow since I am visiting a lot commercial places. But japan’s pow is definitely very deep and the primary goal is to ride effortlessly on deep snow. While the secondary goal is a bit of maneuverability, since I will be doing some trees here and there. I have tiny asian feet so my foot measures 250. I am considering any of the big mountain series, alternative series and snowsurf series within the catalog. www.gentemstick.com/newsPerma/id_541/🙏🙏
@@DehNeverBeen ok.... with your boot size you're almost forced to ride Gentemstick!! They still offer some very narrow boards. Stick to something around 250 waist width or less. The flat camber boards are great floaters and awesome in pow. Steer away from the short/fat fish shapes. They're WAY too wide for your little feet.... Spoon Fish 146 and 152 works, TT 165 Classic is great, too. But waist is only one factor.......
Big Mountain and Alternative series are not so ideal. Alternatives are super wide, big mountain are very stiff and ask for big mountain speed.... not tree boards!!
@@Justaride-Snowboard-Channel thank you so much for the time and your opinion! Will definitely pick accordingly. Looking forward to see your next video!
Thanks lars
super. really great !!!
Thank you 🙏!!
Smashed it!
Thank you!!!🙏
Great job as ever Lars. 🏂👍
Thank you!!🙏😊
Hey Bro! Still waiting on that email; let's do that collab this month. We should ride together when conditions improve or maybe do a simultaneous livestream on both channels if they don't? My email address is in the last minute of my Secrets video.
Still in Europe.