How An Old Legend Overcame An Impossible Matchup
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- Опубликовано: 3 ноя 2023
- Street Fighter Legend Alex Valle takes on Bonchan's Sagat. Hugo is one of the worst characters in the game and Sagat is considered one of the best. Can Valle overcome one of Hugo's hardest matchups?
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He showed him he could hit him with 3 in a row, then hit him with 2 and waited for him to jump back to avoid #3, just like he wanted. Alex wasn't reading Bonchan's mind, he was programming it.
They way he dashes and sits on it after the second hit. Most people would miss it. But for Valle that pause probably felt like an eternity. Both players felt a million emotions in that split second.
Bonchan jumped back because he was afraid of hugo's command grab, something that valle baited out with the forward dash. Still a great mind game but bonchan was not trying to avoid another clap in that specific moment
That's the art of fighting. It's like when boxers faint their punches to sense what their opponent will do
Alex Pereira did this to Sean Strictland in UFC. he kept ducking to throw lower body shots, so when he conditioned dude for this, he dropped his level and threw one high and knocked him silly
The true sign of mastery is the fact he basically didn’t even attempt a grab. He forsook the whole point if hugo. Because he knew the anticipation was more dangerous than anything the 360 could do.
The grabbing would have made him an offensive player.. He played more defensive and rope-a-dope to get him to attack..
7:56 As someone else pointed out, that looked like a grab attempt after the dash but before the ultra
You can say, forsaking the whole point was the point.
This! He took up space in Bonchans mental stack with just the threat of a grab. It's the equlivant of putting your hand in your coat in The Godfather.
this is also a factor in MMA fights. Wrestlers knock out strikes all the time because the striker is always thinking about the takedown.
examples: Kevin Randleman vs Mirko Cro Cop, Travis Lutter vs Marvin Eastman
Its worth noting that Valle had a training session the night prior with Floe.
Yep. 2 hours iirc. RIP floe.
The random select King. The guy. He is missed
Wait Floe past away ?
@@darryuozdark7149yes
@@darryuozdark7149 yeah, unfortunately. Multiple strokes. He was surrounded by loved ones when he passed.
This highlights the fact that top players aren't used to "bad" characters being played really well.
Mostly because they don’t really encounter them often
yeah ppl care so much about tier list that they aren't ready for a good low tier player
There's truth to this - I haven't played SF since Alpha 3 in the arcades, but I would always shock the hell out of people and send them off pissed when I'd roll up with Dan and proceed to maul them, while taunting the shit out of them the entire time which inevitably would break their concentration...
never underestimate pink hoodie lil mac
This is strictly cope. This is a one in a million run. Tiers are there for a reason. Prove me wrong by going to a local and winning with a low tier. 😂😂😂
It's talked about a lot, but one of the biggest strategies used by Valle is never going for Hugo's Moonsault Press, his most "conventional" command grab. He does the run, he does the anti-air, but he never goes for the "main" one, and it's one Bonchan clearly is expecting with his patient gameplay. It's an incredible mind game, and one Valle plays like the expert he was and is.
That Ultra 2 was so sick what a legendary moment.
Will always have love for Alex Valle. Great dude.
Also mad love to Bonchan and his Sagat. He's the reason I picked up and mained Sagat. Praying I don't have to wait years for him to come back in sf6
I played so much Sagat back in SF4, so watching his tools just not work against Valle here was nuts! Like what do you mean he's just walking through the god HK???
You’ll probably have to wait years if the game is gonna stick to 4 chars a year
@DrSwazz I'll probably have quit by then sadly
@@GamingWithMoh Well, playing the game doesn't have to be about quitting or not quitting. Plenty of people just play it whenever they feel like it or hop in whenever a new fighter drops. I'll probably be doing the same for fighters I'm interested in 5 years from now.
I was a Sagat main in Alpha 3 and 4. He sucked in 5. I hope they bring him back with his Alpha vibes for SF6.
This will forever be one of the best sets not just in street fighter, but of fighting games themselves, right up there with stuff like nage vs omito
And Daigo vs. Momochi.
Let's not forget PRBalrog's Balrog vs Infiltration's Hakan. That set was friggin' legendary too.
I will never forget watching this live and telling my brother, right before the match started, "THIS is how you play Sagat".
I've never been so happy to be so wrong.
Epic!
"this is how you play Sagat"
This post bought and paid for by the Ryu Gang ;)
I agree though. Must have been awesome to see it live.
Bro was like "damn, time to main Hugo instead"
Buhahahaha 😂
lmaooooo really
Love these videos. SF4 was a magical time, I don't think we'll ever have anything like it ever again.
I miss Ibuki. She was so good.
Why don't you think that?
yes we WILL ! relax friend we got u
@@erdood3235 A lot of reasons. SF4 existed in a time before the CFN existed, and before everyone was a streamer and content creator. That resulted in more hidden tech, more unique individual play styles, etc. Now a days, information spreads so fast. When one person figures out tech or something optimal, the rest of the world knows it 24-48 hours later. The incredible hype that used to exist is gone, especially when you factor in things like Modern controls. Everyone plays their characters exactly the same with the same flowchart.
Another reason is the new pro tour format. All tournaments are basically region locked now. You never see best on best until Capcom Cup, or for very rare super majors like Evo. In SF4 and early SF5, anyone could travel anywhere to try to earn points. The Pro Tour was almost kind of like the WWE, in the sense that you had the same group of competitors travelling to the same places, so you'd see amazing matches between all the godlike players every other weekend. Now we never get to see any of the big Japanese personalities until CC or Evo. I understand why Capcom adjusted the rules, I really do. But it has made the tour far less interesting to me now. I used to watch every tournament, and clear my schedule for it. Now I couldn't care any less, I only watch Evo and CC. Let's not even talk about the fact that most tournaments are online now, where cheating is possible and probably rampant.
The prize money has also reached a point where many pro gamers who don't even care about fighting games are being attracted to the e-sport. The only reason they're here is the dollaz. In the SF4 days the prize money was miniscule. Again, I do agree that bigger prize money is a good thing overall, but you can't deny that in the SF4 days those guys were grinding for nothing other than pride, competition, and a pure love of fighting games no matter how unpopular they were. The passion has been diluted.
The FGC in the SF4 era was still underground and grassroots. The outside world didn't care about it, but everyone who was involved knew how special it was. Whether you were a competitor, a casual, or a spectator, we were all in on a secret that the rest of the world wasn't in on, and it felt cool.
It was also a time that existed before cancel culture and white knighting. Everyone had thicker skin, and the world overall was just less fucked.
@@VFXShawnI miss elena and rose. As well as dudley and Rufus. :(
This was 8 years ago and Infiltration currently looks younger than he did in this video.
Small correction:
Sagat’s high tiger shot is only tied for the 3rd fastest fireball at 11f (low tiger is 12f)
Guile LP/MP/HP Boom = 9F
Poison EX FB = 9f
Chun HP/EX FB = 10F
There are a couple other 11Fs but they require meter (Ryu/Guile EX) or prep (Juri release)
🙄
one thing of note: I think it helped Valle sitting right next to Bonchan. Valle is an old school arcade player, he plays mindgames outside of the game. He's constantly banging his stick, doing empty motions, pressing buttons etc, if that affects you it's really annoying.
That's not mindgames if that's true, that's just directly bothering the opponent if on purpose dude. As much as is allowed by the rules, if the rules allowed punching in fact not just punching but kicking because of society wasn't more orderly and it just "didn't hamper people's ability to play games". -_- Friendly bro fist bro smashes your kneecap -_-. Don't glorify bothering others on purpose.
@@ambiguous8661 🤓 moment.
For some empty motions help ppl like me with the rhythm of the game I do the same as well since I started video games in arcades.....I swear ppl cry for dumb shit
@@ambiguous8661that's scrub quote 4 sho
@@ambiguous8661 Listening in on your opponent's inputs to try and predict reversals and other moves with loud motions is a common tactic that many players employ, and muddling the information someone can get from your audio with false motions is a completely natural and legitimate counter to that. You're actually a moron if you think it's in the same vein as yelling at an opponent or physically assaulting them.
SF4 was the game I played ranked in the most of the series. Had an above average Dan. Only won like 46% of the time, but that was in thousands of matches. And people HATE losing to him. It was so much fun back then.
I had a casual-decent Dan in Alpha 3. Yahoo!
I used to beast with Dan on Ranked and in my local meetups. The rage fueled me thru college. It helps that no one, and I mean know one, knew how to consistently deal with lk. Dankyaku pressure 😆
I dont know why I enjoyed that game as a kid, maybe the cover intro. But it definitely was some great memories
Sagat wasnt S-tier at that time, hed been through several nerfs at that point. The matchup however was a 7-3, arguably 6-4 matchup in sagats favor.
Agreed. Guy is talking like this is vanilla Sagat or something
@@josephshin9297Yeah...you can tell who played back then and who didn't. You can't ignore the 5 versions of the game and how some characters were very different each version.
Hugo was also largely underrated by the japanese at that point, they were saying Hugo was the worst character in the game. (A bit like how they got surprised by luffy's rose)
Came here to say this. Sagat was maybe top-mid tier if we are being generous. There was really nothing he was 'good' at in this era of the game.
I was wondering bout that lol.
I remember watching that live. One of the hypest matches i saw. I sometimes miss SF4.
I was lucky to be there at Evo 2015
Yeah. SF6 is really great, exspecially after shitty SF5 but nothing beats watching SF4 tournaments for me
SF4 really came out at the right time. Fighting games had been niche for a while, and SF4 came back with the full nostalgia of SF2, while still being able to draw in a lot of new players.
I still remember launching the game and hearing that cheesy "Indestructible" song, and desperately trying to learn those FADC combos that now feels like second nature.
Also Capcom: BRING BACK MAKOTO DAMMIT, IT'S TIME! :D
ALWAYS looking forward to new videos from you documenting competitive fighting game history.
Hey papalobster, thank you for what you do for the fighting game community. These commentaries and retelling of stories is always so quality.
you are the standard for fighting game content to me
Good narration, well researched the content is solid man. Hope the channel grows!
I watch that match everytime it pops into my mind every few months, legendary moment in FGC history.
Deadass bro, any excuse to rewatch this match. This and KBR vs Fchump, everytime someone does a new story its insta-watch.
I remember watching this on twitch and how exciting it was. Glad to see you covering this!
I absolutely love your video analysis of the FGC momments!
I've been wondering when you were gonna cover this!
I really enjoyed your breakdown of the rounds and how each character fights and moves.
Great video.
This match was so hype to watch live
He may be rough but seeing my favorite SF character masterfully played is always a joy
All these years later and Tio Valle’s performance is still mesmerizing. Actual work of art in motion the way this man’s brain was working there
Love stories like this, I hope youd do more. Subscribed!
You explained everything so well...thank you for this exciting breakdown!
Thanks for covering one of my favorite SF4 matches😊
Valle's continued ability to show up and crush top players outside of top 60 is inspiring
I like how Valle makes Hugo look kind of like a movie monste with the incredibly slow creeping towards the wall.
7:58 a classic to tell children lol !
Even the weakest character in the right hands can be a devastating foe. Great job! Subbed!
Love how you combine the story AND the technical aspects…
One of the best clips thx bro 🙏
One of my newer friends who's now one of my best friends introduced me to fighters the last couple of years and he gave me a crash course of some legendary moments in the FGC around the start of this year. He's a little older than me, but he and his friends (also now mine) were in the audience when this set happened. They're definitely one of the sets of pumping hands or jumping heads in the background behind the front audience lol. But this is his favorite FGC set of all time or one of his favorites. Hearing him talk about watching something legendary like thus unfold is one of the main reasons I'm so into fighters now. He sounded so passionate and I imagine it's such a thrill to see moments like this happen right before your eyes. Makes me jealous I'm so late to the party lol.
But I hope I can say I've seen one of these myself someday, hopefully with these new friends of mine. They've been in the community for a long time and say now is a new age of fighters, theres plenty of opportunity to see FGC history unfold and make memories like he did with this one. And I hope so.
Man, i remember watching this match live and absolutely losing my mind. Kinda got my competitive spirit kick started tbh
As someone who barely payed attention to the FGC, this match is one I still remember fondly. A true testament to the power of fundamentals, that long-time competitors can still give the newer players a run for their money.
What was crazy to me was that Bonchan played as if he was trying to avoid the moonsault and not get hit by it. Valle didn't even go for moonsault the entire set.
Ngl Valle makes Hugo look like an S tier, great video by the way!
This is my favorite match of all time. Watched it countless times and still love it.
you should put the full fight in the comments or description
FUCKING AMAZING BREAKDOWN!! i've never seen this match before and i FELT THE HYPE. I think it would help for the casual noob FGC viewer to point out hugo's ultra punishes jump back, and a scared opponent tends to do that. then the viewer can see AND recognize the panic in bonchan's movements
Great vid man
Loved the upload, USF is life!!
Thankful the algorithm showed me this. I don’t love street fighter as much as other fighting game franchises but seeing an underdog win is always a treat!
You can see Bonchan wants to destroy his joystick and game rage but he holds himself together
That’s a great idea I hope this project is like the old days of the Excellent Adventures!!
I have waited oh so patiently for you to cover this specific moment!!! 😊😊😊
This a match that I come back to every once in a while.
dude i remember watching this match bro such a treat
This was so damn hype live.
Absolutely love Uncle Valle. Thanks for doing this video.
I'm so glad to have been there to see SF4 in its heyday. Those were some of the best tournaments I've ever seen.
I remember a quote or something from back in 2003 about one dude who mained KOF with a weird low tier team. He didn't win often, but this is what he said:
"If I win with Iori, K' and Adelheid I'm just another good player. If I win with Maxima, Chang and Shingo, I'll be a legend."
"Make it clap make it applause. These haters on my body shake them off." - Young M.A
That Folsom B4 footage... Nostalgia
Alex the OG. Great vid bro
Infiltration looks so happy in the background
I dont think Bonchan was trying to specifically avoid the grab, Sagat's got a really bad backdash, so one of his safest ways to make space is to jump backwards, especially vs Hugo who's going to have to commit to a very risky option to chase him down or just slowly attempt to get in again where Sagat's in his element. You can see once he gets hit with an ex backbreaker he starts using the backdash to make space more, since EX is the only one that reliably catches backdashes and will whiff on both options at that range. Also Sagat's roundhouse is 2 hits which breaks st.hp armor and while the second hit usually whiffs on crouching opponents it can often times still tag Hugo crouching.
This was brutal. Pure timing pressure and perfect distance measurements.
for melee players, this is like a bowser beating Cody
8:02 Sagat: OH SHIT
coolest part is how valle went for 0 SPDs. if the strikes keep working there is no reason to risk a throw
Sagat was not S tier in this version, but this is a bad match up for Hugo
I love it when they confront these clever old men xD
I like this Brazilian guy Alex Valle playing for Hugo, he even looks like him a little bit. As the saying goes, "Brazil, where women look like men, and men look like monsters."
Where is that said? Argentina?!
@@lukemclellan2141 Venezuela
@@lukemclellan2141 i'm from argentina and i never heard that quote from anyone, tbh.
ah i love vids like this- especially w/ Valle and the other old heads cause I feel less ancient xD I miss this game so much, its still the most hype game ever
Alex had everyone going nuts 😂 ngl dis was ah impressive match
Always calls to mind Rangchu's Panda. Sick
Granada hills CA Family Fun .. was the place to play 3rd strike when I was in the scene .. Hugo was my main .. I would always clap whiff,universal overhead to reclaim spot to standing 360 grab.. always caught them
God damn! That was incredible!
That was a display of raw skill. The gap is immense.
We love to see someone say "fuck the matchup, fuck the tier list, we BALL"
Valle was on a tear that year with Hugo. The stuff of legend.
You can’t teach composure, that’s just a textbook display of experience.
Awesome, really great work from Vale
sf4 was a beautiful time man. So many memories i have
Great story telling 🤙
Such a good match. I wish I was around in the fgc when sf4 was pmat its peak
Skill can beat any tier list. Great call.
Classic battle of wills. "I know what you want to do. You know what I want to do."
I remember watching this match and just laughing the entire time hahahha
This legend was playing a city away from me while I was still an ankle-biter. That IS some lore I'd like to hear!
All these years later, still popped off when Vale hit the ultra to end it
Alex Valle, as far as I know, has always been a class act and he's witnessed the many ups and downs of the FGC. He was present during the world-famous Daigo parry. He was right in the middle between Lowtiergod and Viscant during their legendary beef. I would describe Valle as an aggressive "natural" with instincts that supercede his technique and methodology. A successful and flashy risk-taker.
Appreciate any videos that include AV
Man, what a weird coincidence. Had a dream last night that I was playing Alex Valle, who in the dream was a legendary Smash Bros. player for some reason, and also like a college freshman who looked completely different. I hadn't thought about this guy for months, but I had that dream and then today saw this vid. I'm sure it means less than nothing, but it's a funny story.
Zoners when their opponent approaches them 😳🤯
New PapaLobster lets go
"It doesn't MATTER what you notes say!!"
The legend says that Infiltration still clapping till this day.
What a match btw, I miss SF4 so much.
a true master of his game, love to see it !
Awesome video
This reminds me of the victory of Vegapatch using FANG against Kawano using Luke in SFV latest Capcom Cup.
The literal bottom tier character against the literal TOP tier one. It was SO hype.
I think way back in the day he came through las vegas and i played him at mary k's. It was like part of his world tour. We had some very good players. My friends Akuma actually beat him a few times. He trashed me but i frustrated him because i would not do a combo. I was scared of the custom Vism and i knew the first 2 3 hits in 3rd strike do the most damage. He was scary good very technical
Now I want to see a video about the infiltration vs snake eyez in puerto rico 2015. Now that's some real grappler action.
“Old legend” Alex catching the biggest stray of his career right here
Great video