I grew up in St Joe in the 90s, but moved to Kansas City in 2018 because I was stuck in a small mindset. I’m so glad to have met you throughout my early adulthood time before moving. You’ve inspired countless people throughout your entrepreneurship and I’m just thankful to have crossed paths with you back at Snap Fitness. Thanks for holding your ground and casting vision for a brighter future for St. Joseph.
I have experienced some of what you’re talking about with building permitting. So difficult, and the barrier to entry is so high. We’re just a couple that want to be part of progress and literally no one with the city will give us an answer. Tons of people have been so helpful to us, but there isn’t progress on our building bc the city inspector won’t answer a simple fire barrier question. Thank you for speaking up - like-minded people are out here working hard to make a change.
Thanks for listening & the input, Ashley. I have a meeting with a couple council members set and then others as well and am hopeful that we can improve the culture & tone which I believe will have a trickle down effect.
Hey bud really enjoyed the video and I believe it is spot on. I am one of the folks that moved out of town, mainly to get back to the school district my wife and I both grew up in (Mid-Buch), but really appreciate the perspective of positive change and how to make it better verse just saying things are in the dump all the time. I think what you have done with your businesses to support the community is outstanding and enjoyed some of the perspectives you don’t get as a non-business owner. We are still close enough for me to want to see the town thriving for my kids sake. The mindshift change is probably the most difficult aspect to progress on given the economic state. I worked at Nestle Purina for years and the majority of my management team started to live in KC just because of the perception of the town when they arrive for the first time. It’s no longer sold as a great place to live, but to avoid being here. That’s one business of 10-15 managers, but extrapolate that across all industry and that is a large number of high income families not supporting a community they work in. Keep pushing forward and keep pressing the buttons, Im seeing things moving the right way it just takes more people like you to initiate a bigger involvement and impact.
Thanks for listening & for good constructive input in your comment! Hopefully we have some progress come from the video. Several leaders and quality council man we have in place have reached out and I have meetings set with them.
Great points. I've always felt the city inspectors should help guide the citizens that are trying to advance or improve their property/properties and work with them rather than stop work orders as part of their duties another thing I know personally that it's been explained to the county how to remedy the lake contrary issue instead of leaving those residents hi and dry the power plant pulls water to cool their plant and then releases it back into the river when something as simple as run piping down the levey to the lake and feed it with the warm water from the plant and fish and wild life would grow and would attack people
I had to move back to near your town for family reasons. I returned after 16 years living in a normal place. I have to go into yuor city to shop, but I stay on the periphery. The town looks like The Bronix, druggies out in the open, people sleeping on the sidewalk, psychos wandering aimlessly, blight and burnt out blocks and burnt up buildings. I'm scared to drive into the place and try to drive near it as little as possible. It's too dangerous. Also, the roads are so bad that they are literally shaking my car apart. Then there is the stench! The cherry on top of it all is those 70 freight trains (maybe more) that blast through the town. I have no idea how anyone can live in the town. I have to live near it and it is a nightmare. Maybe fix some of these problems, and you could have a decent town.
You clearly care about what happens to St. Joseph and its community members. I’m thankful for your passion. While I appreciate that this is well-meaning and intended to spur people to action, undercutting all the hard work that is already going on does less good than one might think. "St Joe doesn't take a swing" doesn't really mean anything. Lots of people take lots of swings at great personal risk to themselves and their families. Often without the support of outside investors and rich benefactors. Many of these folks taking swings are met with resounding criticism, bad faith, untrue stigmas, and lack of support from folks who want “the right kind” of people/businesses--a dogwhistle decrying diverse and culture-rich institutions that may or may not align with their worldview. Creative, new, and exciting "swings" are met with big-business-minded naysayers who can't think outside their own opportunistic, profit-minded bubbles. To me, taking a swing is putting oneself out there to bring something special and unique to one's community--committing one's livelihood to that community--not bringing a new racetrack or other gimmicky, pie-in-the sky industry-industries that will also not contribute to local economies and encourage their earners to live and spend elsewhere. You’re not wrong. We’re bleeding good people. But there are other good people that step up. Definitely more than are seen or appreciated. To put the animus of progress on voters-as if these “swings” are supposed to be ballot initiatives with which the whole community is supposed to jump on board-ignores the responsibility of monied corporations and wealthy boosters to pony up the resources. With the staggering divide between the wealthy and the poor (to which St Joe has a much higher discrepancy than the national average), it is unreasonable for one to expect that responsibility to distribute evenly among the population via tax levies-most egregious being flat sales tax increases that disproportionately affects poorer populations. Those with the means should put their money where their mouths are. After all, if I recall correctly, that’s largely how the beloved parkway was funded in the first place-donation and financing from those wealthy early 20th century rich folk with little-to-no tax burden falling to the population. Those with the means should take the larger brunt of that tax burden. That would also go a long way to help the school issue. I agree with you about moving on from the school district debacle. We know what they need. More resources and a change of attitude toward learning and the value of education. Education does not exist to serve businesses and/or the economy. Education is not a business. Government is not a business. Not every aspect of our society should be about profit. That’s how we got in this mess to begin with. If we could turn our attention toward people, care, and community, we would see better results. Precious profits would follow for those interested in them. You’d think with 17 locations, you’d know to get permits. They do exist for public safety. And that’s not about you and your competency regarding load-bearing walls or concrete mixes. It’s about making sure that standards are met so folks don’t get hurt. We should revisit The Towering Inferno for a good foray into why that is. This isn’t to say that the city has its act together-they don’t always. Sometimes the right hand doesn’t know what the left is doing and yes, this can be a problem. A costly problem for investors and institutions. Other times, the city does wonderful things and provides ample opportunity for folks to thrive. Let’s be careful about criticizing historic preservation and promoting storage containers. The penchant to tear down brick works of art and replacing them with pine, plastic, and aluminum is not an economically sound long-term decision. It is largely demonstrable that investing in existing structures, facades, and historic preservation is a boon for towns with as much rich historical culture as St. Joseph. This is a feature we should be leaning into, not demolishing and replacing with plastic. Boiling it down to either “you agree with me or you’re in the way” is also not helpful. There are many things you say that I do agree with. However, there are others I find problematic. Discourse, disagreement, discussion, and compromise is what leads to progress. Denigrating the process for sake of expediency denies the value that slow, methodical processes create. That value being foundations that are harder to crack and more solid good-faith institutions. I find it important to be sure that when one is putting forth an opinion for public consumption, that merely saying, “I don’t have all the answers and this is just my opinion” is not a sufficient excuse for an underdeveloped concept. Having conversations with nebulous, wealthy third parties does not constitute quality research. When one takes the time to find the data, and does so with an objective, or "open mind,” one might have come to some very different conclusions and thus better inform their audience therefore further benefiting the place one’s attempting to stimulate. Not doing so results in ranting with no clear goals, outcomes, or calls to action. Spurring folks into a hornets nest with hopes that the work will just get done by others is not really all that helpful. I would suggest that you expand the circle of folks you’re talking to beyond people with power, money, and clout. You may find some better, less-entrenched perspectives. Perhaps a better use of an hour spent criticizing negativity by adding more negativity isn’t all that constructive. I’d argue a “4 ways st joseph is moving forward” video would be the braver argument to make. You want to start a conversation that generates a lot of flak, demonstrate what’s good and what’s working. Then the trolls will come out of their caves. Though, to be fair the construction of this response also took an hour and probably wasn’t the best use of my time, either. I look forward to seeing how this community conversation unfolds.
Evan, a lot to unpack here in your comment and in the video for sure. I think you interpreted multiple points of what I said, not exactly how I intended. Maybe that’s on me for my delivery - maybe it’s your own takeaways from listening - both of which are fine. The video wasn’t meant to be a lob or attack on individuals, rather to bring attention to things I feel are a major problem and conversations that desperately need to be had. I have a handful of follow up meetings set to try to make progress with culture and certain issues I discussed so by no means did I put this out as a “rant” and then go hide. The video achieved its initial purpose which is let’s have some good, productive conversations. The fact you took the hour to listen (waste of your time or not, that’s up to you) and the time to construct a thoughtful comment (agreeing with my points or not), I have respect for you taking the time and it tells me you give a shit about St. Joseph too, so thank you and I’m glad you’re here.
The town has a few cultural attractions. I used to go to the Missouri Theater years ago. But I will not go now. I'm afraid to drive in there. I'm afraid to park my care and leave it. I'm afraid to get out of my car. If I have to leave a place after dark and walk to my car, I would be scared. Maybe my car won't even be there. Or maybe another one of your find drunks hit it while I was inside the theater. Also, the town is not cheap to live in. It's much more expensive than where I came from in southern MO, where we had theater downtown and I had none of those worries when I attended.
I have lived and worked in many different cities across the U.S., including NYC, where I lived for five years. St. Joe is one of the worst places I've ever been. It's just a fact. If you want to fix it, you will have to do a lot more than just think positively. There are real problems and pretending they don't exist and downplaying them isn't going to get you where you want to go. I hope the town improves--believe me! I'm stuck living near there and I am miserable because I have to live in such close proximity to it. I am scared of your town. I am scared of St. Joe people. I hope you can fix it. I just don't think a fix exists because you've got a people problem. Decent people don't want to live there. Having a St. Joe address is an embarrassment. The town has a reputation for being rude, stupid, corrupt, dirty, smelly, and dangerous. A whole lot of voices telling you that aren't just stupid "boomers" for whom you have no respect. Lack of respect is one of the problems with people in St. Joe. So, you might want to fix that.
Look you’re prolly right but like man dude you’re an angry person lmao. Maybe people are rude to you cuz you have a breakdown when someone looks at you the wrong way. Idk dawg u seem to fit right in with the rest of the population of screaming crazy people downtown
Although I spent most of my youth in Kansas City, I did spend 1960-61 living with my brother and his family in St. Joseph graduating from Central H.S. there. From videos of driving around town the place is barely recognizable. When I lived there St. Joseph had vibrant retail downtown. Now all that's left is a bunch of 4-way stop signed intersections. In 2008 while driving from Florida to northern California I had lunch in the Taco Bell at 9th & Francis and it seemed be the only business that was open. From your comments what seems lacking is a sense for the whole community. On other videos it is very apparent that St. Joseph is divided by the haves north of Frederick Ave. and the have nots to the south. In the early 20th Century St. Joseph had the "movers and shakers" or people of means who built it into the great city that it was. Where are such people now? Are they just sitting there in their homes in the nice part of town and could care less about the rest of the community or are they actually concerned for all of its citizens. You are correct in decrying the two levels of government, but it takes an aroused citizenry to get the politicians off the gravy train. If there aren't enough persons of means and influence who are upset, then nothing will happen. And if you expect everyone else to foot the bill by voting to increase taxes that isn't going to happen either. St. Joseph does have some great tourist attractions, but are there convenient places where visitors can stay or are they all adjacent to Interstate 29 east of town? You say that St. Joseph needs to be more pro-business. Does that just mean greater opportunity to make more money or does it also mean enhancing the community where you live. It is sad what has happened to St. Joseph because 63 years later there are still fond memories of when I lived there. Of course, St. Joseph is not unique in this regard, it's happening all over the U.S. It is going to take more people working together than ever before to make this place better for everyone. It's not only true for St. Joseph but for all of our country.
I knew Dan. He was a fall guy. A lot of the problem remained in place in the District after his conviction. It is a systemic problem of corruption. Things have not improved in the SJSD. They have gotten worse. The SJSD does not derserve to exist. The town and the District have no standards. They let drunks run things and so you get a school district that is failing, can't keep students, and is on the verge of losing accreditation. You can't just fix things by saying the magical words, "It's behind us," because it isn't. Your town's educational system is in a death spiral. And there are more problems I could tell you about because I know teachers who work in those schools.
I just checked the crime rates for St. Joe compared to Manhattan, NY at Best Places and your violent crime rate and your property crime rate are higher. So... yeah. Your property crime rate is roughly 3 times higher than NYCs. And your violent crime rate is only slightly higher, 31.1 in St. Joe to 28.2 and a national average of around 22. Have you tried reporting a crime in St. Joe? My guess is the crime rate in the town is much higher than the figures are telling because crime reporting in the town is nearly impossible.
I grew up in St Joe in the 90s, but moved to Kansas City in 2018 because I was stuck in a small mindset. I’m so glad to have met you throughout my early adulthood time before moving. You’ve inspired countless people throughout your entrepreneurship and I’m just thankful to have crossed paths with you back at Snap Fitness. Thanks for holding your ground and casting vision for a brighter future for St. Joseph.
Greg, I appreciate the support & kind words. Thanks for listening man. I’m optimistic that some change will be sparked from this video.
I have experienced some of what you’re talking about with building permitting. So difficult, and the barrier to entry is so high. We’re just a couple that want to be part of progress and literally no one with the city will give us an answer. Tons of people have been so helpful to us, but there isn’t progress on our building bc the city inspector won’t answer a simple fire barrier question. Thank you for speaking up - like-minded people are out here working hard to make a change.
Thanks for listening & the input, Ashley. I have a meeting with a couple council members set and then others as well and am hopeful that we can improve the culture & tone which I believe will have a trickle down effect.
Just bought a house in St Joe by Krug Park. They did just pass the improvements there . I love the history and architecture. Praying it turns around.
Hey bud really enjoyed the video and I believe it is spot on. I am one of the folks that moved out of town, mainly to get back to the school district my wife and I both grew up in (Mid-Buch), but really appreciate the perspective of positive change and how to make it better verse just saying things are in the dump all the time. I think what you have done with your businesses to support the community is outstanding and enjoyed some of the perspectives you don’t get as a non-business owner. We are still close enough for me to want to see the town thriving for my kids sake. The mindshift change is probably the most difficult aspect to progress on given the economic state. I worked at Nestle Purina for years and the majority of my management team started to live in KC just because of the perception of the town when they arrive for the first time. It’s no longer sold as a great place to live, but to avoid being here. That’s one business of 10-15 managers, but extrapolate that across all industry and that is a large number of high income families not supporting a community they work in. Keep pushing forward and keep pressing the buttons, Im seeing things moving the right way it just takes more people like you to initiate a bigger involvement and impact.
Thanks for listening & for good constructive input in your comment!
Hopefully we have some progress come from the video. Several leaders and quality council man we have in place have reached out and I have meetings set with them.
Great points. I've always felt the city inspectors should help guide the citizens that are trying to advance or improve their property/properties and work with them rather than stop work orders as part of their duties another thing I know personally that it's been explained to the county how to remedy the lake contrary issue instead of leaving those residents hi and dry the power plant pulls water to cool their plant and then releases it back into the river when something as simple as run piping down the levey to the lake and feed it with the warm water from the plant and fish and wild life would grow and would attack people
Thanks for taking the time to listen & give some input, Derek!
I had to move back to near your town for family reasons. I returned after 16 years living in a normal place. I have to go into yuor city to shop, but I stay on the periphery. The town looks like The Bronix, druggies out in the open, people sleeping on the sidewalk, psychos wandering aimlessly, blight and burnt out blocks and burnt up buildings. I'm scared to drive into the place and try to drive near it as little as possible. It's too dangerous. Also, the roads are so bad that they are literally shaking my car apart. Then there is the stench! The cherry on top of it all is those 70 freight trains (maybe more) that blast through the town. I have no idea how anyone can live in the town. I have to live near it and it is a nightmare. Maybe fix some of these problems, and you could have a decent town.
You clearly care about what happens to St. Joseph and its community members. I’m thankful for your passion. While I appreciate that this is well-meaning and intended to spur people to action, undercutting all the hard work that is already going on does less good than one might think. "St Joe doesn't take a swing" doesn't really mean anything. Lots of people take lots of swings at great personal risk to themselves and their families. Often without the support of outside investors and rich benefactors. Many of these folks taking swings are met with resounding criticism, bad faith, untrue stigmas, and lack of support from folks who want “the right kind” of people/businesses--a dogwhistle decrying diverse and culture-rich institutions that may or may not align with their worldview.
Creative, new, and exciting "swings" are met with big-business-minded naysayers who can't think outside their own opportunistic, profit-minded bubbles. To me, taking a swing is putting oneself out there to bring something special and unique to one's community--committing one's livelihood to that community--not bringing a new racetrack or other gimmicky, pie-in-the sky industry-industries that will also not contribute to local economies and encourage their earners to live and spend elsewhere. You’re not wrong. We’re bleeding good people. But there are other good people that step up. Definitely more than are seen or appreciated.
To put the animus of progress on voters-as if these “swings” are supposed to be ballot initiatives with which the whole community is supposed to jump on board-ignores the responsibility of monied corporations and wealthy boosters to pony up the resources. With the staggering divide between the wealthy and the poor (to which St Joe has a much higher discrepancy than the national average), it is unreasonable for one to expect that responsibility to distribute evenly among the population via tax levies-most egregious being flat sales tax increases that disproportionately affects poorer populations. Those with the means should put their money where their mouths are. After all, if I recall correctly, that’s largely how the beloved parkway was funded in the first place-donation and financing from those wealthy early 20th century rich folk with little-to-no tax burden falling to the population. Those with the means should take the larger brunt of that tax burden. That would also go a long way to help the school issue.
I agree with you about moving on from the school district debacle. We know what they need. More resources and a change of attitude toward learning and the value of education. Education does not exist to serve businesses and/or the economy. Education is not a business. Government is not a business. Not every aspect of our society should be about profit. That’s how we got in this mess to begin with. If we could turn our attention toward people, care, and community, we would see better results. Precious profits would follow for those interested in them.
You’d think with 17 locations, you’d know to get permits. They do exist for public safety. And that’s not about you and your competency regarding load-bearing walls or concrete mixes. It’s about making sure that standards are met so folks don’t get hurt. We should revisit The Towering Inferno for a good foray into why that is. This isn’t to say that the city has its act together-they don’t always. Sometimes the right hand doesn’t know what the left is doing and yes, this can be a problem. A costly problem for investors and institutions. Other times, the city does wonderful things and provides ample opportunity for folks to thrive.
Let’s be careful about criticizing historic preservation and promoting storage containers. The penchant to tear down brick works of art and replacing them with pine, plastic, and aluminum is not an economically sound long-term decision. It is largely demonstrable that investing in existing structures, facades, and historic preservation is a boon for towns with as much rich historical culture as St. Joseph. This is a feature we should be leaning into, not demolishing and replacing with plastic.
Boiling it down to either “you agree with me or you’re in the way” is also not helpful. There are many things you say that I do agree with. However, there are others I find problematic. Discourse, disagreement, discussion, and compromise is what leads to progress. Denigrating the process for sake of expediency denies the value that slow, methodical processes create. That value being foundations that are harder to crack and more solid good-faith institutions.
I find it important to be sure that when one is putting forth an opinion for public consumption, that merely saying, “I don’t have all the answers and this is just my opinion” is not a sufficient excuse for an underdeveloped concept. Having conversations with nebulous, wealthy third parties does not constitute quality research. When one takes the time to find the data, and does so with an objective, or "open mind,” one might have come to some very different conclusions and thus better inform their audience therefore further benefiting the place one’s attempting to stimulate. Not doing so results in ranting with no clear goals, outcomes, or calls to action. Spurring folks into a hornets nest with hopes that the work will just get done by others is not really all that helpful. I would suggest that you expand the circle of folks you’re talking to beyond people with power, money, and clout. You may find some better, less-entrenched perspectives.
Perhaps a better use of an hour spent criticizing negativity by adding more negativity isn’t all that constructive. I’d argue a “4 ways st joseph is moving forward” video would be the braver argument to make. You want to start a conversation that generates a lot of flak, demonstrate what’s good and what’s working. Then the trolls will come out of their caves.
Though, to be fair the construction of this response also took an hour and probably wasn’t the best use of my time, either. I look forward to seeing how this community conversation unfolds.
Evan, a lot to unpack here in your comment and in the video for sure. I think you interpreted multiple points of what I said, not exactly how I intended. Maybe that’s on me for my delivery - maybe it’s your own takeaways from listening - both of which are fine. The video wasn’t meant to be a lob or attack on individuals, rather to bring attention to things I feel are a major problem and conversations that desperately need to be had.
I have a handful of follow up meetings set to try to make progress with culture and certain issues I discussed so by no means did I put this out as a “rant” and then go hide. The video achieved its initial purpose which is let’s have some good, productive conversations.
The fact you took the hour to listen (waste of your time or not, that’s up to you) and the time to construct a thoughtful comment (agreeing with my points or not), I have respect for you taking the time and it tells me you give a shit about St. Joseph too, so thank you and I’m glad you’re here.
Great comment, Itsuhtrap42. 👍
The town has a few cultural attractions. I used to go to the Missouri Theater years ago. But I will not go now. I'm afraid to drive in there. I'm afraid to park my care and leave it. I'm afraid to get out of my car. If I have to leave a place after dark and walk to my car, I would be scared. Maybe my car won't even be there. Or maybe another one of your find drunks hit it while I was inside the theater. Also, the town is not cheap to live in. It's much more expensive than where I came from in southern MO, where we had theater downtown and I had none of those worries when I attended.
Regarding the power of positive thinking, I wish you luck, Don Quixote. But reality is pervasive.
I have lived and worked in many different cities across the U.S., including NYC, where I lived for five years. St. Joe is one of the worst places I've ever been. It's just a fact. If you want to fix it, you will have to do a lot more than just think positively. There are real problems and pretending they don't exist and downplaying them isn't going to get you where you want to go. I hope the town improves--believe me! I'm stuck living near there and I am miserable because I have to live in such close proximity to it. I am scared of your town. I am scared of St. Joe people. I hope you can fix it. I just don't think a fix exists because you've got a people problem. Decent people don't want to live there. Having a St. Joe address is an embarrassment. The town has a reputation for being rude, stupid, corrupt, dirty, smelly, and dangerous. A whole lot of voices telling you that aren't just stupid "boomers" for whom you have no respect. Lack of respect is one of the problems with people in St. Joe. So, you might want to fix that.
Look you’re prolly right but like man dude you’re an angry person lmao. Maybe people are rude to you cuz you have a breakdown when someone looks at you the wrong way. Idk dawg u seem to fit right in with the rest of the population of screaming crazy people downtown
Although I spent most of my youth in Kansas City, I did spend 1960-61 living with my brother and his family in St. Joseph graduating from Central H.S. there. From videos of driving around town the place is barely recognizable. When I lived there St. Joseph had vibrant retail downtown. Now all that's left is a bunch of 4-way stop signed intersections. In 2008 while driving from Florida to northern California I had lunch in the Taco Bell at 9th & Francis and it seemed be the only business that was open.
From your comments what seems lacking is a sense for the whole community. On other videos it is very apparent that St. Joseph is divided by the haves north of Frederick Ave. and the have nots to the south. In the early 20th Century St. Joseph had the "movers and shakers" or people of means who built it into the great city that it was. Where are such people now? Are they just sitting there in their homes in the nice part of town and could care less about the rest of the community or are they actually concerned for all of its citizens.
You are correct in decrying the two levels of government, but it takes an aroused citizenry to get the politicians off the gravy train. If there aren't enough persons of means and influence who are upset, then nothing will happen. And if you expect everyone else to foot the bill by voting to increase taxes that isn't going to happen either.
St. Joseph does have some great tourist attractions, but are there convenient places where visitors can stay or are they all adjacent to Interstate 29 east of town? You say that St. Joseph needs to be more pro-business. Does that just mean greater opportunity to make more money or does it also mean enhancing the community where you live.
It is sad what has happened to St. Joseph because 63 years later there are still fond memories of when I lived there. Of course, St. Joseph is not unique in this regard, it's happening all over the U.S. It is going to take more people working together than ever before to make this place better for everyone. It's not only true for St. Joseph but for all of our country.
I knew Dan. He was a fall guy. A lot of the problem remained in place in the District after his conviction. It is a systemic problem of corruption. Things have not improved in the SJSD. They have gotten worse. The SJSD does not derserve to exist. The town and the District have no standards. They let drunks run things and so you get a school district that is failing, can't keep students, and is on the verge of losing accreditation. You can't just fix things by saying the magical words, "It's behind us," because it isn't. Your town's educational system is in a death spiral. And there are more problems I could tell you about because I know teachers who work in those schools.
St. Joseph MO has ZERO progression I agree.
I'm heading to the Carolinas
I just checked the crime rates for St. Joe compared to Manhattan, NY at Best Places and your violent crime rate and your property crime rate are higher. So... yeah. Your property crime rate is roughly 3 times higher than NYCs. And your violent crime rate is only slightly higher, 31.1 in St. Joe to 28.2 and a national average of around 22. Have you tried reporting a crime in St. Joe? My guess is the crime rate in the town is much higher than the figures are telling because crime reporting in the town is nearly impossible.