The Fallout "Drama" Is Getting WEIRD...
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- Опубликовано: 15 апр 2024
- Through the Fallout TV Show, three common arguments have gained traction that have existed since 2015. Finally, they're being brought to light in a manner worth discussing, so let's get into the myths that continue to be spread about Bethesda, Obsidian, and Interplay.
Fallout Season 1 Review: • Fallout Season 1 REVIEW
#Fallout #Xbox #Bethesda 
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Everybody wants to save Fallout, they just disagree on how.
I see what u did there loo
war, war never changes
❤
What’s crazy is, it’s never needed saving. It just feed the masses, for a taste of something needed, regardless of the past.
If my time in the comment section taught me one thing, it’s that the fan base….the fan base never changes
The irony of the fallout community being at war with itself. War truly never changes lmao
There's the fallout community and then there's the new Vegas one, and the new Vegas community is on its very own island of irrelevancy being mad 24/7 about nothing.
Yeah.. People having different opinions is clearly a war. I feel the youtubers are actually the once that elevates it to drama.
@@TheTennesseeFistMachine I am so happy that you like an empty wasteland where the delete buttons keeps being hit on factions. I am sure you would also love to watch grass grow, if it were not for the progress it makes.
Except, there is no war going on. Just a group chads that have standards and a legion of TV Norms that eat up any garbage that is tossed to them.
@@HoratioCanusyou are so weird how do you contradict yourself like that saying RUclipsrs are the actually people elevating drama, but then do it yourself
All imma say, as a Halo fan, the Fallout show was a breath of fresh air. Made me install Fallout 4 for a 2nd playthrough
Honestly the second season of halo wasn’t bad
Ahh which Faction are you going with this time? I went with the Minutemen peace ending because you get the most awesome loot with that faction(in other words, you get a lot of cool stuff & missions from each group). Plus, the commonwealth feels more alive when all groups are kicking.
@@Steel-101 I am running with the Institute this time around, I'd like to see it from their perspective again. Funny thing about Fallout, there is no true "good" faction. Each has their own selfish ambitions, blanketed by false benevolence.
@@jordanclark4635 Master Cheeks
@@jordanclark4635 It wasn't bad until blondie was resurrected, then it was the same abysmal tripe as the last season.
Sinclair didn't work for Big Mt. He contracted their services for Sierra Madre.
That and also, why the hell did they make him look like Harvey Weinstein!?!? Reading his last heartbreaking message to Vera at the end of Dead Money is gonna feel uncomfortable now
I don’t think Todd’s comment was “non-commital” tbh. He basically said, “at the moment we want to handle because we prefer our vision - but hey, if someone at Xbox really blows us away then go for it”. The problem being there that, as you stated, many fans don’t want “fallout 5” they want “fallout new Vegas 2” - and Todd is basically saying that doesn’t interest him at the moment
I like all Fallouts not made by Bethesda, I want them to stop making Fallout games, period. They should stick with Elder Scrolls and let Oblivion handle it. Todd never had a clear vision for Fallout other than $$$. "It just works" (barely)..., should be Bethesda's slogan. Its why FO 3 and 4 were the worst of the franchise. They are beautiful graphically with broken mechanics and shallow RPGs. Lipstick on a pig, both of em. And without the modding community, they would have died long ago.
well todd its not about what you prefer its about what the fans prefer and we want a good fallout game not starfield 2.0
What I like about this is that Microsoft now owns both Bethesda and Obsidian. If there was real interest, Todd doesn't have a say anymore. Microsoft could simply direct Obsidian to make a Fallout New Vegas 2 if they would like to.
@@phillipcurrey6961i disagree.
@@AJG7304We've already had two great Fallout games by Bethesda.
Most Fallout fans suck.
I am a Fallout fan
I think it’s funny that people are pretending that the fallout fandom is somehow uniquely toxic. This is par for the course for pretty much most fandoms that exist.
Nah. Most fans don't voice their opinion at all. Of those that DO.. they say their 2 cents and peace out..! The fans that stick around..? I'd say they're 50/50 - and THEN you have a pocket of increasingly toxic fans.
@@carsonnesbit1178Haven't seen anyone pretending this community is uniquely toxic. Anyone with two eyes can see that communities surrounding anything involving opinion and ideology get extremely toxic. We are talking about humans here after all, what more can you expect?
Idk the 76 community for me is pretty awesome
@@carsonnesbit1178 Yeah, I think it's just a sign of how large the fanbase has gotten overall that it has such a seemingly large number of bitter elitists.
I’ve been a fan of Fallout since 2009. I will never understand this ridiculous Civil War in the fan base. It does get irritating when every time I want to talk about the best parts of the F3 & F4 story, I always get the “but New Vegas does it better” every time in the replies. NV does have it strengths story-wise, but it does have its own set of weaknesses. I’m not saying we should hate NV but for crying out loud I don’t wanna talk about it all the time.
New Vegas is great, but a lot of its fanboys are idiots.
Very fair
@@Vault96 I agree. I actually pre-ordered NV back in 2010. I wanted the vault 13 bundle, the platinum chip, and the comic book. I still remember how the comic did a great job introducing Benny & Chance(Who should’ve been mentioned more in the game). My friends and I played it nonstop but NV didn’t make us hate F3. Actually my favorite was still F3 and my best friend loved NV more but we still didn’t hate each other lol 😂. We would talk about Fallout all day. Now at the age of 31, I still prefer the stories for F3 & F4 but I still do enjoy the John Wayne/Clint Eastwood feel of NV. Sorry for the long text 😅
Totally agree about the dispute/debate being tiresome...all REAL fans know 2 is the best😆
When they don't have anything to say, they'll deflect. Sometimes you can engage with an actual thoughtful person though, it's not all morons in the fallout community.
You know what? It was more likely that Vault-Tec planned to drop the bombs themselves but was caught off-guard when China decided to actually fire their nukes first.
Me personally I also feel like vault tec didn’t straight up drop a nuke on shady more so they lobbied kimball to fuck up the ncr. In the lore it was even that he repealed some of the rules to make it more in line with old America which led to civil unrest and an emerging upper class.
I always thought Vault-Tec had a hand in it, another domineering corporation that got too big for its own head. They probably didn't actually "pull the trigger", but I am certain they nudged China in that direction intentionally.
It is weird that House wasn't ready for bombs he himself was part of dropping.
Agreed. It doesn’t necessarily matter who actually dropped the bombs, honestly. The point is that Vault-Tec was potentially planning and fully willing to drop the bombs for their own purposes. People are totally missing the point why that is important.
Exactly. There are at least 3 vaults unfinished.
I really don't have a problem with Bethesda. My problem is how they handle the setting. They keep civilization from progressing, and they keep it stagnated in the initial rebuilding process even if more than 200 years have passed after the war, people still live in dirty and poorly made shacks and old and dirty beds in kinda unhygienic settlements , compared to how interplay/obsidian handled the setting and civilization advancement where factions such as NCR have working trains, building machinery, restored pre war buildings and newly made ones and quite few people have working cars, I was worried about the show taking place in the west coast because of this and how they would portray the west coast factions.
This is true. They are basically using a cheap technique in which they nuke all established lore in the west so that they can do whatever else afterwards, probably easier for them so that way they don't fumble the lore. They did it with the NCR and we can theorize with the destroyed looking New Vegas that they will also do that for season 2. The weird thing is that they keep everything stagnated but for some reason seem to ignore the established lore of tribals. You can get something that looks like a tribal or can be compared to one but never an actual tribal from them.
Fallout fans are split because the franchise is drastically split. Og fallout vibes from new vegas are about rebuilding civilization in a post-apocalyptic wasteland in an immensely dark yet humorous world. I'm replying new vegas for the first time in like 3 years and I cannot believe how many horrific assaults and cannibal gangs and just depressing stories there are, mixed with tons of dark humor to keep things tolerable. It's also very rpg focused, which is fantastic imo. The best part might be hearing horrible painful stories from people of all walks of life who all have decades of experiences to divulge, and weighing the reality of what you learn with the competing factions and their philosophies, ethics, and goals. New Vegas is for fans who want an extremely in depth and adult experience.
I tried and gave up on replaying fallout 3 but i did complete 4 again (for like the 8th time). Bethesda's fallout is not about rebuilding from the apocalypse (well, 4 kinda is) it's about 50s scifi themes and pulp heroism. Their factions are simplistic and their wastelanders have never endured the things we hear from so many npcs in the ogs and new vegas, they do not have the same absolutely horrific daily life. They are a largely comedic and pg13 (excluding gore) version of fallout, compared to the heavy R-rating style that was the originals and new vegas. If you want a light hearted romp through a retrofuturistic apocalypse where you DONT have to do more than dip your toes into the ethics, philosophy, etc of the civilizations forming, and just want to enjoy some casual shooting and exploring then you'll love Bethesda's games. Doubly so for 4 because it improved greatly on 3's substandard composition.
So you have games basically made for entirely different fanbases. Og/NV fans want a deep rpg with complex cultures or in the ncr/legions case, entire factions, either of which are well into rebuilding civilization and are butting heads with the rival forces of civilization being brought to the wasteland. They want this dark but still darkly humorous experience that is not fulfilled at all by 3 and only partially in 4. Whereas Bethesda fans don't want to waste time figuring out stats and having to talk to people for long, theyd prefer a trimmed down experience that gets them sent somewhere cool and apocalyptic to go shoot up monsters in. They dont want to rebuild civilization (well, settlement builders in 4 do) because that means too much focus on securing stuff like metal and water, squabbling over shoddy huts and fighting normal humans with guns or swords. That's not the fallout experience most Bethesda fans are here for (although 4 sure did a good job forcing them into it)
Its the diference between choosing the nature of the civilization that will rebuild the wasteland and having the wasteland permanently broken being just a sandbox for the player. It drove me nuts in Fallout 4 to come to a settlement spot and think "Nobody even trying to clean this up in 200 years? Really? There are no brooms and shovels in the post apocalipse?"
@RafaelSantos-pi8py tbh, I think the show actually cut a decent middle path between bethesda and og fallout. Civilization is more like fallout 1/2 level, not as fresh as bethesdas. The average wastelander actually has suffered quite a bit, and theres plenty of organ harvesting, slavery, they even had fiends, etc.
Do people forget Todd Howard made Morrowind? That was his baby he says. And that game although flawed today is so insanely immersive in roleplaying and has so so much depth and work building. I highly doubt Todd Howard wouldn't love new Vegas just as much as us.
Edit: y'all act like I just said Todd is our God and we must never criticize him again. I just feel like he'd probably have no issues with NV , it's really not that deep. Please take a nap or something
Yes but remember how the descriptions on books about the imperial city mentioned it being surrounded by jungles. Then Oblivion comes out and they gave us temperate forests. I'm not the biggest Elder Scrolls fan but I do know that they retcon it every entry and the only reason that you don't see such big complaints as in Fallout is because of the "magic and gods" excuse. I'm more surprised that people are shocked or in denial of a 20 year old fact: Bethesda are retcon enjoyers.
@@glez13gt yea and worst part is the retcon was out of the fact todd had seens a movie and wanted to copy it
@@glez13gt well actually the reason why Oblivion looked the way it did was technical limitations. Just like in New Vegas the strip isn't like 20 steps away from shady sands irl. It would be a long long walk. It's game design. They couldn't give us an entire map filled with lush jungle because it was the early 2000s . Morrowind could have been a MUCH better bog but it couldn't be. Or raven rock in the DLC was also supposed to be an alpine Forrest of Skyrim.
I wouldn't get upset over stuff like that because it's engine limitations, not lore
@@Fairenough642 what are you talking about
@@grimmick9446 they where going to do it as they had written into the lore but todd changed it cause he saw a movie and wanted too make it look like that, if thats not childish idk what is
I loved Fallout 3. loved Fallout New Vegas. Loved fallout 4. Loved season 1 of Fallout. What’s the big deal??? Enjoy the games. Enjoy the show.
Consoom product and wait for next product.
nah, just look at your first reply, people on the internet has become more insane than conspiracy theorists. if they had more than 1 intelligence you'd get a fanbase like Touhou, where everyone is happy and respects other's opinions.
@@BrettCaton gimme a break.
@@BrettCaton Exactly! Fallout has always been great
Brett isn't wrong tbh, I too played all games in the series and liked them all, but I'd be lying if I said I enjoyed Bethesda's Fallouts as much as the originals.
Gotta keep those standards high or game companies get sloppy.
I still don't understand how anyone can claim New Vegas is destroyed by that final image of the show. Lights being off doesn't equal destroyed, and I certainly don't count the concept art from the credits making it look "empty"
That's maybe cause of the ending artworks.
The end credits literally show dead bodies, no lights on, a crashed NCR vertibird, destroyed securitrons, and the walls breached.
The Strip is straight up shown as having gone through some sort of conflict, you see Securitrons that look like they were taken down by Deathclaws.
Honestly, it don't matter if it's been destroyed.
Shit happens man, time still moves forward when we aren't playing the games.
People expecting things to be exactly the same as when we last saw them literally a decade plus ago (both in real life and in the lore).
@@shanenonwolfe4109 If New Vegas is destroyed, then it might mean Courier Six got control of it
It's because of the CGI ending and with the way Nolan handled the NCR.
Okay, but Sinclair being in that meeting as a representative of Big MT doesn't actually make sense within the lore of Dead Money. First of all, he really doesn't look like the few illustrations there are of him in the game. But okay, there aren't that many illustrations, I can accept that. But much more important... Sinclair didn't work for Big MT! And he sure as hell wasn't a manager/CEO/whatever! He was a _client!_ The Sierra Madre disaster happened because he cut a deal with Big MT that allowed them to test their inventions there, and in return, he'd get their tech for cheap! Why would he need to do that if he's their boss?
I think he was representing them. Like how The two were representing vault tec. Plus Sinclair might been donating large amounts of money to mt
The problem with the writer of Fallout 4 is there short sighted. look at the guy who tweeted saying that Fallout protagonists is a war crimal because he was the guy in a video laughing at a canadian being killed. And the community found that totally random and out of context. Like why? Cause the writer didn’t think of longterm and consequences, he taught it would just be cool saying that…
I disagree. I think Emil actually injected some much need complexity into the alleged "hero" Nate presented at the start of FO4. He becomes a flawed hero - a more "normal" hero Consider that, IRL, there are so many heroes we praise that turn out to have such darker sides when we start to scrutinize them more closely. Not to dimiss it lightly, but abuse of prisoners has been a recurring war crime throughout every conflict known to history. Unfortunately, it is one way in which war has never changed. I would have actually been surprised if Nate had never done anything wrong during the course of his service.
Also, for most players, even the "good" guy protagonist winds up killing ghouls (who are merely human victims of radiation) and super mutants (the victims of scientific experimentation) and countless creatures that are merely the hapless victims of the bomb and are "just trying to survive out here, like everyone else." A completely pacifist playthrough of Fallout 4 is almost impossible and part of the story is clearly about the protagonist coming to grips with the darker sides of heroism through the various journeys the NPC characters go through during the game.
@@j.m.2022shut up
Giving too much of a backstory to a Fallout playable character is a huge mistake. They are supposed to be almost-blank RPG archetypes. I don't care what Nate did before the war because in the next 200hours he is going to shoot down ghouls and get drunk.
@@Thesavagesouls I agree. The kid from 101 was a much better blank slate, however as i grew Nate, and realised he had a medal of honor, I found that his backstory makes becoming the unkillable general of the minutemen much more logical and attainable. I do resent being given a son to prioritise over discovering the landscape though F4 remains my all time favourite game.
I should start by saying that first and foremost, I am a Fallout fan. All of Fallout. For years and years now. Bethesda's Fallout 3 was my introduction to the franchise and I look back at the game very fondly. My personal favorite Fallout game is Fallout 2, despite Fallout 3 being my first and most nostalgic title. Even Fallout 4 is also very special to me, and I poured tons of time into it despite it's obvious issues. All that being said, I think it's a loud minority of people with the "us vs them" mindset. I think at the end of the day we are all Fallout fans and the series and Bethesda at large has been in a downward trend. The problem is we as a fandom can't agree on why. Reducing this argument to the New Vegas fans versus Bethesda fans is pretty reductive, although I understand why it is viewed this way. I also don't think that Bethesda is jealous of New Vegas or hates New Vegas. I think it's more that Bethesda genuinely doesn't understand the original vision for what Fallout games were meant to be. New Vegas isn't hated, it's more likely ignored or not understood. I think the main reason for this divide is that New Vegas proves that you can have a Bethesda style Fallout without sacrificing great characters, narrative, depth, mechanics and more that make old CRPGs so special. Then the fans of Bethesda titles see this criticism of something they find enjoyment in as an attack, when it is meant to be constructive toward the franchise, not malicious toward it or any fans. As a huge New Vegas fan, I know for certain without a doubt that Fallout 3 and 4 would drastically improve if even 10% of the design philosophy of New Vegas was properly implemented into those games. There are ways to improve things you already enjoy such that everyone would get more enjoyment out of them. Making Bethesda's Fallouts more like New Vegas would not inherently ruin the games. There are absolutely things Bethesda should be considering and implementing that they just don't. I cannot even begin to speculate as to why they haven't done so. It is okay to love any and all of these games for any number of reasons. I myself consider myself a fan of each and every one of them for different reasons. However, I also totally agree with the "New Vegas mindset" that the franchise has taken a sharp turn away from what genuinely made it special. Fallout was originally a very deep RPG experience about the post-post apocalypse. The rebuilding of an already destroyed world and what the people, settlements, morals, politics, conflicts, and so much more would look like. It was an extremely deep and thought provoking experience. Once again, I began in Fallout 3, then returned later to Fallout, Fallout 2, then continued once New Vegas released. Fallout and Fallout 2 are much more similar to New Vegas than any of the other games. Bethesda's games are seriously lacking when it comes to the things I previously listed. That doesn't inherently make them terrible games, but a huge part of the magic within the universe is missing when the world is so much less thought out. I'm not saying there aren't good narratives or characters in Bethesda's Fallout, but there is a clear shift in priorities away from it in favor of other things that I think have led to this divide as well as the decline in quality within the series that I feel all of us fans feel regardless of which games we love most.
fallout 2 is clearly the best, anyone who disagrees is just wrong
I don't think I have ever read or heard a better explanation of my own thoughts of these games. Thanks for sharing
@@jookya2lol it’s a video game, it comes down to people’s opinions, a game isn’t just better because you announced it. I find fallout 1 superior because it’s a much more focused experience with every settlement being memorable, and the master being 10x more interesting than Horrigan/Enclave. Not to mention the dialogue is more serious, there isn’t a tryhard pop culture or third person break every other conversation.
Amen
The best comment I’ve ever read since joining RUclips in 2006
Fallout, Fallout never changes.
76 .....
@@prastagus3 *Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel*
I hope someone could put my mind at ease. I want to love the franchise moving forward. Just answer my questions
1) How come the NCR have the gull to have a Mojave campaign when their capital got nuked 4 years prior? A bit too fast ain't it for an expansion?
2) What are the lore reasons could it been that no one referencing the nuked of SS in any way in FNV itself?
because it wasnt nuked yet they messed up the portrayal of the timeline on the show a bit. They probably did so because they hadnt decided what year exactly to place the nuke. But if you look at the timeline in the chalkboard in the show "fall of shady sands" is before the nuke which is signified by the arrow leading off of it. The fall could be anything and the fragility of the ncr is heavily implied in new vegas. Now if im wrong they they done messed up but i dont think they would do anything that dumb honestly
Nuke drops year-2 after NV, NV it is mentioned that the Rancher’s have more power now in the government than the government does. Signifying a failing state. Multiple people say such in NV. NCR captial gets nuked and the faction fractures into multiple “NCR” factions all filling a power gap for the next 10 years. No one is going to retake shady sands because it is a hole in the ground.
They didn't nuke Shady Sands in 2277 or whatever the date is, they just didn't put a date on the nuclear explosion illustration and thats whats making all the ruckus now. Did they fucked up? Partially, but people need to realize a pattern of the arrow-flow info chart that there are dates with their own boxes of description, and the "fall of Shady Sands" in 2277 doesn't include the nuclear explosion..
It could be also the kids that are learning the lore are simply learning the lies. If you played early fallouts 1 and 2 a lot of NPC were "vaguely remembering" historical facts and usually messing up the years
@@Kazaanh NV has lines about Ranch Barons and Caravan groups having more control than the actual NCR government does.
Imagine giving the fallout franchise to a different developer
could go horribly wrong or have a good game after waiting long time. lol 😂
Imagine giving any Bethesda franchise to a different team. It would be a better game than whatever mediocre slop Bethesda would churns out.
if microsoft wants someone else to make it bethesda don't have much choice since microsoft owns them now. They should have another studio do it since bethesda is not going to get to it anytime soon.
To be fair it could be that Mr. House was lying and downplaying his role in kicking things off. Telling the player he had a role in destroying the world would make him pretty repellent to the average player.
Read a comment that mentioned House didn’t give any ideas during the vault tech meeting. House cares about money and Vegas. So it could explain how his prediction for the Great War was a day off
I found that House was actually very consistent. Both in the show and in the game he disapproves of different factions fighting each other for control. Everything he does is to try and bring people together under a single leadship.
This could explain how House was so certain to build his securitron army and missile defenses to keep nukes off his doorstep. Because he heard people planning to nuke the world and thought forward to save himself and his empire.
To add, House’s claim to calculations predicting nuclear war could just be him upselling his own talent where it sounds better and smarter to say “ahh yes I predicted this.” Instead of “well actually i overheard people planning to start nuclear war in a secret meeting if it didn’t happen.” That just sounds kinda lame for him. Lying and stretching the story for his sake wouldn’t be beyond a cut throat business man like House
or maybe Mr. House ultimately decided to do things his own way and split with vault tec in the end, then vault tec (or china) dropped the bombs a little to early than what he was told. if he chose to stay with vault tec he wouldve been cryo frozen like everyone else in vault 31, but since he went off to do his on thing in the strip, he had to use his own tech to keep himself alive all those years
Nah, I think it's just narrative inconsistency, or the writers making a decision for what they need for their story.
Because, let's face it, people are going to do what's best for their project.
Gonna be honest, I absolutely hate how Shady Sands (Why was the town even in Los Angeles? Where is Boneyard?) fell not because of NCR's hubris but due to a creepy stalker having baby mama issues. Bruh wat
Also with that, now the West has become the East. Losing a huge foundational faction and series theme (War never changes, but people do) just to make it more like Bethesda Fallout games. So what's the point of playing the series when Bethesda insists that the end must be lawless, Brotherhood everywhere, and illogical narratives?
idk, with the show i was hoping it"d get me to want to replay the series again. Instead just feels pointless.
Bethesda has always loved the "survival" aspect of Fallout, more then ideologies of complex factions. Which is a shame, because for me, that is what Fallout is. If they keep burning everything down, and I have to watch the empty desert forever, then it is gonna bore me. I think the tv show feels the same way to, because Pre-war has been a huge part of the show.
Shady Sands was supposed to be in the Owens Valley.
The Boneyard was in Los Angeles Basin and The Hub was in the San Fernando Valley.
I don't see why The Boneyard couldn't have been nuked. The NCR still exists, but were driven out of the Los Angeles area.
Shady sands FELL BEFORE it was blown up. Chalkboard drawing is kinda obvious about that.
huge city gets nuked by a vault dweller after only a month out of the vault? sounds like the a mainline fallout game vault dweller story
Idk in a way it not entirely surprising it reflects human nature. It took 1945 AC Years to make the nuclear bomb that for the last 50+ years has more or less grid locked countries from conquering each other.
In the case of fallout it cavemen some with nukes and factions of modern "smart" people fighting it out with other factions of modern "smart" people, with whats left of hoarded massive power.
So i guess it just to say total war will last probably another 800yrs minimum lol
Mini rant coming up. The problem New Vegas fans have with Bethesda isnt them touching,changing, retconning F1,F2, FNV. It's that it's only specifically done to those games. To date ever since the release of Fallout 4 we have no idea what state the Capital Wasteland is in. None of the locations are ever really mentioned, no events other than the "brotherhood" curb stomping the enclave, is hard canon. F-ing Macready is a companion that 100% canonically meets the Lone Wanderer and NEVER MENTIONS IT. Dont know the state of the Commonwealth either. It honestly feels like Bethesda is extremely protective of their canon whilst going out of their way to destroy anyone else's. Why did they specifically pick California, Vegas and the surrounding areas that already had lore? Why didn't they just pick a new, vague area like the midwest? Why did they go FAR out of their way to completely and utterly destroy the NCR, which is the strongest faction in the franchise to date? How is the f-ing Brotherhood still on the west coast when in NV they specifically have a quest where their isolation and reclusiveness is causing their numbers to dwindle, add on getting curb stomped by the NCR with sheer numbers too. I enjoyed the show but there is crystal clear bias here in regards to how the franchise is treated by the "owner".
They are not really using the story of the west coast aswell.. Everything in the tv show could happend anywhere.. We have seen nothing new, and just being told that everything is gone feels lazy. The only new is cold fusion... Which is a weird item to be honest. Yeah, the GECK was incredible too, but atleast it was limited to an area. This thing is the easiest good ending I have ever seen.
Wowee a lot to unpack here, alrighty.
Yes we know the state of the capital wasteland and the commonwealth. The reason why Macready leaves DC is because the BoS has full control of the land, so mercenaries were made pretty redundant. To add to that, Elder Cleric Quintus states "Our mission comes from the highest clerics in the Commonwealth", so pretty evident that either the mm or BoS ending is now canonised.
NCR being the "strongest faction to date" sure maybe in Fallout 2, but even by new vegas the cracks were definitely starting to show. And (my opinion) a majave defeat and presidential assassination would have been a huge blow to them, years before shady sands was blown up. I also believe the NCR hasn't been destroyed, because of their expansion I think there are other outposts out and around Cali. (The Hub has yet to be seen)
As for the BoS, I feel that the East Coast had pretty much saved the faction from extinction. It's highly likely that the East Coast reconnected with the west, and bought along plenty of resources and Maxson's reformed ideals (considering he's the last descendant of Roger Maxson, his name would be held in high regard)
And regarding the bias? I mean, sure... but the BoS are definitely not depicted as the "heroes", which the show pretty much states that both factions have their good and bad sides. And from a narrative perspective, it's a lot more exciting to see factions / societies rise and fall (eg Shady Sands is destroyed, yet some of their people then thrived in Vault 4). I can see the fractured NCR coming back to fight Brotherhood in season 2 as a big possibility
Bethesda's Fallouts are always about the wasteland being destroyed and never rebuilt. In 3 and 4 its been 200 years and what passes for civilization are small shanty towns that can be destroyed at a whim of the player. The wasteland is always broken , has no future and serves no purpose than to be a sandbox for the player.
Compare this to FNV or even 2, where you do have whole states (Legion, NCR, etc) or city states (Vault City, New Vegas strip, New Reno,etc) existing with complex political, economic , legal and military structures. Even the Legion has a plan , altough very flawed, for the future of civilization. They're stories about what happens after the post apocalipse and make the player think hard about what is the best option\faction for the future.
These are two very diferent views on Fallout and its lore, and with this show Bethesda nuked all non Bethesda Fallout lore and stories.
@@RafaelSantos-pi8pythis is how I know people don't actually play the games, know the lore and have watched the show. Fo4 has a major mechanic where you are rebuilding the wasteland. Fo2 settlements are far more isolated and the NCR faction largely exists off the map. It's not even required that you interact with the NCR in fo2.
@@tyrrollins You do not rebuild the wasteland in F4, you might fix up a dozen settlements and have the minutemen in the end manning checkpoints, that's it
There is no state, stable political system, law enforcement other than Preston nagging you about another settlement that needs your help. The economy is basically farming tatos or caravans carrying junk around a couple of shanty towns.
Everything remains broken, raider and supermutants everywhere. That is a very far cry from the NCR at Fallout 2 or Fallout New Vegas.
I think Matty overplays the fallout/ New Vegas hate because he runs a channel and got a lot of hate mail.
Frankly, people still held Bethesda in high regards after Fallout 3 AND New Vegas. Skyrim came out a year later.... don't remember a lot of people hating on Bethesda then. The divide is wayyyy more recent than people remember. It's with the diminishing quality of Bethesda products in general. Fallout 4 was fine, it was still a great playground to have fun in and it's still modded to shit to this day. It's a success any way you look at it, but I think it was the last time people would accept the 'Bethesda formula'. And that's when the comparisons to New Vegas start to get... unflattering.
The amount of innovation Bethesda has produced since Fallout 3 is asinine. This has to be said. They are re-releasing the same game and the brunt of the Starfield backlash exposes this (add to that that Starfield isn't a fun playground to mod and enjoy and... oof). New Vegas was a deeper game than Skyrim, F4 and Starfield..... So it's not how good New Vegas is that's the problem, it's how stale something like Starfield is (hasn't even had any significant content added yet smh). This means people don't have faith in Bethesda to bring them a good Fallout 5. Or Elder Scrolls 6. That's how you end up with people clamoring for Obsidian... Since they have the last great example. I frankly believe that if ANY Bethesda game since New Vegas had the same level of depth or innovation, there would be no Bethesda hate, because people would have faith in them. But instead we've watched them make the same game with the same mistakes with the same engine and heck, even their usage of the exact same voice actors doing the exact same voices is getting on my nerves. Not to shit on voice actors, they need work too but god damn am I tired of hearing Jarl Balgruuf in every game.
I'm kinda with you on this
Starfield is fun tho
@@schnitzelman93 Out of curiosity, is this one of your first Bethesda games or have you played them a lot?
@@schnitzelman93 lol it's the worst rpg i've played in years bro it feels like a 360 game
Bethesda didn't make New Vegas and are eternally salty that the only actually good 3D entry was made by Obsidian.
This is not just a Fallout fan issue. It's happening everywhere, in politics, music, other game fandoms, sports teams, OS users, even smartphone brands. People these days, they're just obsessed with hating and being negative on social media to flex their identity. It's a human health issue in this era. Look at the comments on any video, they're pathetic.
Even arguments about "argument" itself
Exactly
Exactly why they pulling the plug on this ish
It's all based around IP and corporation loyalty.
It all centers around, "No, I'm the more loyal and bigger fan."
There's all this discourse over New Vegas, but every time I bring up issues with the writing, characters, and creative decisions I'm always met with "Well I'M a big Fallout fan..." followed by a illogical excuse for it and how I must not be a fan of the series.
But you can insert any IP into that and it remains the same.
Seriously. Online internet discourse is so toxic. I have peaceful conversations with people I strongly agree with IRL, but the internet? Oh no.
I admit that i prefer black isle/obsidian fallout to Bethesda but thats because in my personal opinion i feel the story and writing is executed better and they remember that fallout should be a post apocalypse and not building simulator. I personally dislike the writing of Emil Pegliarulo and have often felt games like Fallout 3 and 4 (while they are built on great ideas that i do like) focus on a...very short linear story without much room to branch out. Like traveling to the institute and for some reason being completely incapable of pointing out how much is wrong with it to shaun, instead you kinda just have to let him win the argument because you cant bring up a million good reasons why they're evil and he is a brainwashed old man. I also dislike Bethesda's habit of nonstop radiant quests that go on forever, they want you playing the same character for eternity so they don't really focus on more well written faction quests. The BoS for example barely have any other than the main story so you dont really get to soak in being a knight or paladin it just zooms by. I like new vegas because its designed to be replayable with a lot of variety and every expansion it has goes into a single overarching story (i.e Ulysses being brought up in literally every dlc until you reach lonesome road.) are some characters annoying? Yes. Is the meat riding that the fans do for New Vegas annoying? Yes. I dont doubt that there are obnoxious annoying fans that just shit all over other opinions but im at least trying to explain my point of view. Bethesda on the other hand (in regards to dlcs) kinda just puts out random stuff or whatever they think is a fun idea rather than maybe expand more on a character like the lone wanderer or sole survivor (like the nuka world dlc which makes no sense, pre-war protagonist who can join 4 civilized factions even if their philosophies differ suddenly becomes a raider? Especially when youre forced into the role of Minuteman general? Doesnt make a whole lot of sense to me.)
This is already long enough but ill leave it at saying i dont mind anyone's preferences. I have a bad habit of being too passionate about many games but i understand that people have different opinions and other things they prefer in fallout to myself. Just my two cents on the matter.
I just try to drown the fandom out and enjoy the the games, wish I didn't have to do that, but thats how it is here.
@@Xemvii at the end of the day, your personal enjoyment is what matters. If you like it, you like it.
Well said, I don't like the main stories of Bethesda games. I'll spend 200 hours fucking around and downloading mods before I even think about doing it just once. Bethesda makes better open world sandboxes than they do interesting narratives in my opinion.
Found the guy we’re talking about 😂
@@lennysmileyface That's because they live in a BGS bubble 25+ years sticking feathers in each other butts how awesome they are including Emil who thinks he is the best writer the fallout world has ever seen. I wish BGS would hire some real writers especially for the new Elder scrolls.
Let Obsidian cook again
Then you get The outer worlds but fallout skin
fr new vegas is top
Obsidian fallout > Bethesda fallout
@@maofria1452 yuuuuuuh
@@maofria1452 why do you need to repeat that so much ? Most people already prefer New Vegas to Bethesda fallout
@@maofria1452 Obsidian had better writing but Bethesda made better games.
@@ni9274 I think its cope because he knows that Fallout belongs to Bethesda and not Obsidian.
Arbitor Ian had a video about an analogous "controversy" in the 40k community, and noted that people get riled up when a product is tied to their identity (e.g., "I'm not a video game player, I'm a Fallout 3/New vegas/whatever fan") for the sake of building a fanbase among RUclipsrs. It sounds like perhaps that's what's going on with Fallout.
You know what I want, I would love to see a remake of Fallout 1 and 2, bring them into the modern age, don't change the story or fuck with it, just new engine, quality of life game features, etc. I think that would sell really well.
Tim Cain has said if they did that he would mostly hope for redoing all of the original models just with more detail because of new recourses to add in things they could not in the original games due to limitations.
The Master with current day graphics? How horrifying...
IIRC, there was someone remaking Fallout 1 and 2, as a mod for either Fallout 4 or New Vegas (I forget which they were making it on, I think 4.). They brought modern gameplay into it, but kept old features like how travelling between areas worked. Dunno the status on the mods though, last I heard about them was years ago.
@DeffinatelyNotHim that's cool, I did like the old games overhead camera style, though.
Fair criticism is okay! Lack of criticism is why mediocre games like 76 and starfield exist.
Where did he say that it wasnt, lol.
@@GoatBoat22 How am I a betheseda fanboy when no where in the video mentioned criticism being bad in general, lol
me personally FNV is Mediocre
i agree. but the problem is i don't see proper criticisms that actually right towards the show from anyone yet. most of it are just senseless nitpickings.
Lack of criticism is why mediocre games like Oblivion, Fallout 3, Skyrim and Fallout 4 exist*
Can new vegas just get an updat for current gen consoles already!? Give us the patch Tobb! >:(
Tobb? 💀
Not if you spell his name that way, lol.
@@charlie7mason tobb howarb
Gob: “Hello this is my third cousin, Tobb”
Tubb Howartts
I dont necessarily believe in any of those notions, I just hate the direction they took the NCR and Shady Sands. They literally don’t exist anywhere in the material except vault 4 and for some reason at the Glow… A nation that existed from the Hub up to Vault City… After Lucy travelled from Santa Barbra, to Shady Sands, to LA/ The Glow.
the glow is a different thing and does not appear in the show
@@ciaacho1 my b, always get the boneyard and the glow mixed up. Then how do you miss walking to the Hub?
Seeing that Tim Cain approved was all I needed. I enjoyed the show and i like fallouts 1, 3, and NV. To me, knowing the creators also enjoyed it and were treated with respect is enough. So many shows like Halo or the Last Airbender cash grabs dont respect the original creators, we shouldnt be attacking the ones that do. Honestly shouldnt be attacking at all over entertainment, but thats the law of the wasteland.
Tim has seen two episodes, and says he have to see those again, as he didn't follow the story, because he got absorbed in the scenery. So let's not put is stamp of apporaval of the whole thing on his behalf. Don't get me wrong. I like the tv show. But I don't like us to put words in someones mouth.
@@HoratioCanusAgreed, he’s only seen two episodes, and a majority of these retcon gripes begin towards the end of the season.
Nothing against Tim. But he only worked on Fallout 1. NV was made by a different staff.
@@ZoddGuts Tim Cain has said he prefared New Vegas to Fallout 3 dp. But he like choices.
why leave fallout 2 out?
Honestly, you make a really good point about the Mr. House/Sinclair scene. There were a few moments in the show similar to this where I was like "OHHH okay so they ACTUALLY play the fucking games." LOL the hate that some of this fandom is showing is just a refusal to be happy. I never in a million years thought that the show would depict all the New Vegas & Classic Fallout elements let alone Frederick fucking Sinclair?? The show rocks.
This is a perfect case of people refusing to be happy
so true. media rn is like "ur fav artist is a predator" "iran just attacked israel" "two old white guys will run for pres again" and then this fallout show. and theyre like BOOO!!!!
People these days seem to enjoy being enraged by something rather than getting involved in actual enjoyment
I think it’s a perfect case of people just having different preferences and opinions. I think you are being rather uncharitable, some people are just not pleased with the direction they’ve taken the west coast storyline. There’s nothing wrong with that.
exactly it was well done like thevlast of us.
@@carsonnesbit1178 Brother people have told me Maximus being Black in the show is "Woke" and that the main character is a "Marry sue" none of this is organic.
''Tim Cain liked the tv show''. To be clear he liked what he saw at the premiere, so the first episode. He did not comment on ther whole serie yet.
First two episodes**
he liked first and second episodes and honestly to my opinion, later episode is much better than first and second episode. So if you like them you'll gonna like the series
Looks like you want him to hate the tv show so bad, it's honestly sad lol
@@nickytijtgat4936 Meanwhile it looks like you want him to love the tv show so bad
@@nickytijtgat4936 I don't think that was what he said
Respectfully Matty, don't tell people what opinions they're entitled to. You're not the authority on fallout because you have a youtube channel.
Never suggested nor said that lmfao
@@MrMattyPlaysYour hinting at it. Simply making a video about this and labeling peoples opinions “weird” is toxic. You are apart of the problem. Fallout aint gonna get better unless we start having standards again
And you don’t see this as problematic? Your opinion on what makes a good game are being equated to “having standards”
@@andrewmoluf4299 yea. silencing criticism is an issue and problematic. Criticism makes our games better. Having standards is a good thing. Calling people out for having different opinions is child like behavior. Your opinion on what a good game is differs from mine and many others. Cope
You hit the nail on the head, pretty much the thoughts I have but actually expressed coherently.
I feel it would make more sense if at the very least Shady Sands was nuked in 2281, because it is suggested in Lonesome Road when you fire the nukes that you are hitting the heart of the NCR if fired at them, and if at the Legion that they are fired deep into Legion territory. You only see the results in the two closest areas in game in New Vegas, but the Courier 6 is hinted to have the ability to wipe Shady Sands off the map.
It probably was nuked closer to that time. I assumed that the arrow pointing to the bomb was additional time from the “fall” of shady sands.
The extent of Todd hating NV is probably along the lines of Todd in his shower saying “damn New Vegas was a good game” that’s it. There’s no actual hatred imo other than weirdo fans who think there are.
Yeah why would he care when fallout 4 is the best selling game in the series. Do they honestly think he cares about the reception from a group of older fans? Or selling more game copies.
No he definately does, he only pays lipservice to the og games because he knows he'd loose all of those fans.
Yh he literally said jn a interview that fnv is good or smth like ghat
@@Based_Stuhlingeryou’re just creating a whole personality of someone in your head, who you’ve never even met before.
I think it's more just creative differences between Obsidian and Bethesda. To Bethesda Fallout is about the post apocalypse, a perpetual state of anarchy with no organising and chaos. Where as Obsidian is more about the post-post apocalypse. There's organisation, post-war towns, and cities becoming civilised again, but with outside forces not agreeing on how the now world will be.
They are continuing the story not erasing it, I personally like the direction the story is going.
And I personally dislike the direction the story is going, but I think the show still has its merits even thought it’s not for me.
I wish people were able to share their differing opinions without immediately jumping to being hostile with one another. I actually really enjoy having those sorts of discussions, but for whatever reason, it’s almost as though many people feel threatened by others who have different preferences.
So many folks just have this strange “you’re either with me, or you’re against me” mentality, and I will never understand it.
@@carsonnesbit1178 Emotions defy logic and understanding.
It feels like they’re going for the “Fall of Rome” style for the NCR. If that’s the case, then I’m all for it. The NCR did accomplish a lot of good, but at the same time they were letting the problems(political corruption, High taxes, too much military brute force on settlements, etc) grow way too fast. On top of that they were stretching out way too thin. They were making the same exact mistakes as the old world, and eventually it was going to crack. Same thing for the BOS. Acting more & more similar to the crusaders/templars(and we know how that all turned out). The only strong groups that were doing a lot of good was Joshua Graham’s group, Lyons Pride, Nate’s Minutemen, the 76 Rhamani BOS, the 76 first responders, and of course Roger Maxson.
Must’ve made you feel tingly inside huh
But they did erase pieces of the story so what's your point?
Tim Cain nails it on the head that people on the internet are disturbingly aggressive negatively towards creators, or try to push stories because X popular person said so, even though he or she can be immediately discredited.
Matty really working for that cameo spot in S2
Fallout has been going in a different direction for like a decade now. Some people don’t like that direction, some of those people are toxic. Then on the other side you have people meeting toxicity with toxicity. It is just how internet fandoms are.
I am personally just tired of countless franchises getting worse. This feels exactly like what happened to Star Wars with the sequel trilogy. (Although not as extreme.)
its been changin ever since the second game
Man I really hope Tim Cain has a full series review, I would love to know what he thinks of the more important lore additions the show did
When Tim Cain made his video, he only saw the first 2-3 episodes. Not really a valid point to make when most people have a problem with the 2nd half of the season
The "retcons" I didn't like were all the things he listed, to include all the corporations behind the testing, under the government's nose.
And the motive of the corporations doesn't make sense. They are going to unify to test on humans by destroying the economy....what? The Brotherhood of Steel made little sense.
Too many things in the show just felt like a bunch of ideas just strung together without much thought as to why or if it made sense.
Like how they go from desert wasteland to lush hardwood forest back to desert wasteland without the other insight.
There's all this discourse over New Vegas, and I'm like, "yeah...but the writing is bad...the plot twists don't make sense...things happen without reason just to force a situation....Max is a bad character..."
Graham Wagner, lead writer on the series, has played all the Fallout games and we can feel that.
Did he do that for research? I don't think his partner did though. Can't remember.
@Robert-yt9pq I'm pretty sure he said he played Fallout 1 at launch
@@Robert-yt9pq From what I've gathered, he's a regular fan and played all the games throughout his life long before this show. Geneva Robertson-Dworet, AFAIK, played FO3 and FO4. I haven't heard anything that indicates either of them only played them for research, so I assume both of them are "natural" fans of the franchise.
@@Robert-yt9pq no, he was a Fallout fan and even Nolan played Fallout 3 when it came out, so he was familiar with the universe. Honestly, the surprise was Ella Purnell, when asked by a normie celebrity interviewer on the premiere carpet, if she had played the games as research in a joking manner, Ella seriously stated, yes she did and was very excited when she finally got to try on her vault suit; absolute gem actress.
@@EnragedTofu See you say that about Ella but I just watched one of those group interviews with her and the cast on YT and she said she only played the first "level" of fallout 4. Seemingly the pre-war intro sequence and maybe a bit after.
The show was great, loved it. It was disrespectful what they did to the NCR. Sorry for being a divisive FNV Fan I guess
MrMattyPlays, I love your channel so much, I just had to subscribe!
Nah I got beef with Bethesda for alot of reasons, but not inviting tk-mantis was where I draw the line. Bethesda is 100% nervous of obsidian stealing their thunder.
As someone who's first and favorite Bethesda game is fallout 3, I can sympathize with the new vegas fans. I was very devastated when I saw all the retcons while playing fallout 4 and how they drastically changed the story. That being said, i am a Bethesda fanboy to the core and I enjoyed fallout 4 regardless. Replayed it a couple times, although not as many as fallout 3, new vegas, or skyrim. If the vegas sequel is anything like the original and they step away from the cartoonyness of 4 and the random generation from starfield it will still be a fun and enjoyable Game I will play several times.
" i am a Bethesda fanboy to the core" what is wrong with you?
@thomgizziz are you in the right RUclips channel? Most of us are, even matty
@@thomgizzizThe same way many are FNV fanboys to the core but they dont say it out loud. Instead, they mask it as being true fans of the series.
@@TheSimguy007 Or by playing other Obsidian masterpieces like Tyrannny and Pillars of Eternity.
Oh right, they only played New Vegas and Outer worlds.
@@KnowPEINamp Being a fan of a company that is there to extract money from you is an insane thing to do. You don't have a personal relationship with anybody there. Why would you be a fan of the company that also probably does some pretty shitty things to people? You can just be a fan of their games.
Why is no one talking about the show making it so ghouls have to drink radaway to not become feral when the games never once hint at that. When becoming a ghoul you either become feral or not. Not once showing a ghoul turning feral in the games
Did it get called radaway?
see now this is a debate worth having! not crybullying people about enjoying fallout 3/4/76 😂
@@Krondon-SSR i think it’s just an unnamed serum as of now. i can’t remember them ever giving a name to it. i also want more info on how that snake oil salesman giving Thaddeus a shot turned him into a ghoul and how he’s suddenly immortal? like where the explanation on that?
They are adding lore. That's why. Filling in the blanks. Have you ever seen your pc take radaway. Lucy was on an I.V. That's filling in the blanks the game left out, or never explained. I also don't think the Ghoul was drinking radaway. He filled his thermos will rad water and drank it. He would not have done that if it hurts him. Scaring lucy/hardening her? No.
@@HannahRenaeee It's likely based on Hancock's backstory from FO4, where he found and used a pre-war chem that turns its user into a ghoul. I don't remember if he says how long it takes to begin looking like a ghoul, but in Thaddeus' case it appears that the ghoulified tissue grows in over dead tissue--so he will probably appear human for now, but over time will look more like a ghoul.
One of my concerns is, Unless they move NCR Shady Sands, their going to have to figure out how to explain how the NCR could Exsist in NV with SS nuked. No matter when it happened.
Damn I love you!! Telling it like it is! Instantly subbed.
After reading plenty of comments, while I do believe there’s a strong disconnect from hardcore fans and casuals with a passing interest, I think the bigger overall problem that’s causing all this infighting is the same thing as many other fandoms of many other IP’s, especially in Gaming; Corporations aiming for the lowest common denominator, prioritizing profits over literally everything else, people who are trained to be nothing more than consumers purchasing a service simply because it exists, buy product then wait for next product. Look at what’s happening to Ubisoft’s The Crew, and the people defending it. Gaming culture don’t exist within a vacuum- problematic individuals who don’t belong can and often cause irritability, especially when Corporations shift focus from longtime fans to newcomers through content-drift by making the IP identity do a 180°.
Funny how even the one of the original creators like the show and people will still argue
They're even calling him a "sellout" for the fact that he has a personal opinion that does not correlate with their obsessive "Bethesda bad" agenda. It's honestly pathetic.
@@youarealwayscorrect honestly at that point I wouldn’t even consider those who say that a fan
@@BallPlayer17127 Most people who carry opinions like that are jobless idiots with nothing better to do than complain
He has seen two episodes, and says he have to see those again, as he didn't follow the story, because he got absorbed in the scenery. So let's not put is stamp of apporaval of the whole thing on his behalf. Don't get me wrong. I like the tv show. But I don't like us to put words in someones mouth.
"He simply doesn't understand fallout" - NV fan probably.
Respectfully, as someone who loves the show, and all the games save 4 or 76. I just dont enjoy the direction they took the NCR and it feels like we are being told to blindly enjoy something or leave.
If the brotherhood of steel suddenly got wiped out off screen by a plot mcguffin people would likely take issue with that as well.
iirc pam in fo4 railroad also suggested vault tech either fired the first shot or tipped the first domino.
Was less of a retcon and more of confirmation of something that had been speculated
Based on all the endings of New Vegas, who the fuck thought New Vegas would continue to thrive years on? Especially when you consider the themes of FONV. No matter what ending you go with it, it spells the beginning of the end for New Vegas.
right even house and yes mans ending leads to war eventually
What do you mean? Either it becomes a capitalism tourist dream with NCR as customers. A capital equal to Rome for the Legion. A couriers private dicatorship. Or NCR's new state. Vegas lives in all of them.
@@HoratioCanus
NCR and Legion are doomed to fail, sure they have their victory in the moment but they have their decline. Especially Legion, it's been constantly hammered into our heads in FONV that without Caesar THERE IS NO LEGION, Caesar is dying, if the cancer don't get him his advanced old age will. And Lanius Legate is not a good replacement and the Legion falls apart quicker.
The Courier's Private dictatorship? The Courier leaves in all the endings, Yesman is left to manage New Vegas as best as he can and with a clear power vacuum it descends into chaos.
With more power, Mr. House became tyrannical in the Mojave. He treated people in Freeside the worst, monitoring other settlements, extorting them with heavy taxes, New Vegas isn't able to survive in this direction.
The biggest theme about New Vegas that everyone forgets about is that everyone has their old world blues. They have their own ideas on how to make the world better. For them. And along the way they hurt and exploit anyone that comes their way. When it finally comes time to deal with someone that has opposing ideals, it's all about dominating and destroying each other, creating war and getting everyone caught in the middle of it. In the end because no one could resolve their issues peacefully, no one gets anything, and all are punished.
New Vegas wouldn't have been a shell of it's former self in a couple years, but it was inevitable that the good days after your victory were fleeting.
You guys keep talking about "fan" this and "fan" that, as if knowing the insignificant minutiae from the series means anything. What matters are the stories that get told, how they're told, and the player's experience in exploring those stories. Fallout from the beginning has been an anti-American polemic. Our avarice and insatiable drive towards consumption ended the entire world by going too far in a resource war with China, but this retcon makes it so that it wasn't actually really a "war" at all. Turns out it was a shadow conspiracy of corporate cabals who were all so dissatisfied with not literally owning everything that they blow up everything they DO own so they can go live in a hole in the ground.
Shady Sands being blown up by some guy we've never seen before off screen isn't a "war" it's just a unilateral mass murder. The show is pure costume. It doesn't really understand Fallout at all. All of those details are literally reduced to set dressing so they can tell a story that's not about history or the inexorable drive of human culture towards war, but a story about workplace grievance politics.
I'd disagree. First of all, it's not reallly a retcon. It doesn't change lore, it adds to it. Why? The war was real: China and the US did launch nukes at one another, but it's possible (NOT certain mind you, you didn't see them do it, it's clear they were considering doing it and had reasons to do it) Vault-Tec and the others had their reasons to ALSO launch nukes they apparently owned. Now, let's ignore the show and see if it makes sense. And I think it makes a lot of sense: the vaults were built and had experiments designed for many of the vaults. We know this from the games. BUT what's the point in desigining experiments without test subjects? You needed the test subjects in the vaults and only a nuclear war could have made them go there. No one was going to live in a vault without that happening. So, I'd say you already have evidence in the games Vault-Tec needed a nuclear exchange. I don't think the scenes in the series prove Vault-Tec did it, only that Vault-Tec intended to do it. And you have confirmation in Fallout 4 that the Chinese at least also used their nukes when you meet the Captain of the Yangtze, so there was a real war happening. In his dialogue he confirms he launched his weapons.
I'd say the story does address history and the drive of human culture towards war: the idea of the War to End all Wars, as WW1 was expected to be. One final confrontation to end that human drive towards war, a war so terrible that people will never do it again. This is the logic Vault-Tec is using. It's not just about: we don't own everything, it's more than that, it's: look at the mess people have done, we know better, we know what needs to be done to give humanity a brighter future. And humanity needs to be taught a lesson. Yes, lives will be lost, but the people emerging from the vaults (their people) would inherit the Earth and start over with a blank slate, to shape the world as they saw fit, because they knew best. Basically, they're saying: instead of having all these geopolitical games and arguments over who gets the last drops of resources, let's just get it over with and start over.
Yeah the reason for them starting this makes less and less sense the more you think about it.
Your points are valid
But your forgetting a major fact, vault tec (vaults 31 32 and 33) employees (buds buds) were consistently trained to ensure *Vault Tecs* survival over all. They want to make sure they are the ones that come on top. Bud believed that a way to out live your enemies goes down to time and management. So Hank finding out about shady sands legit put a wrench in buds plans of out living everything. This wasn't a martial issue, this was a corporate issue. With this piece of the puzzle, it makes sense why Hank pushed the button. This whole thing is Buds fault because before the bombs fell, he never considered the reality of the other vaults and considered them destroyed by the time bud thinks their done. Hence vault making civilization, making vault city, making shady sands and where we are now.
And that is an indisputable fact we can't undermine
@@robertf.atrozskin3596 Shady Sands was founded by vault dwellers. They're descendents of refugees from Vault 15. Bud thinking the other vaults were destroyed is something you made up. The show doesn't say that. The conspiracy was also hatched well before the bombs dropped so Bud would know about the other vaults.
This whole idea of New Vegas being destroyed from that momentary glimpse we got of it in the ending of the season, i think is totally wrong. I'm thinking more of it alike the prison being foreshadowed in the ending of season 2 of the walking dead. It didn't look exactly like the final prison we got. And just because the lights aren't on, it was like sunset on the Mojave. Not dark enough for the lights to be so bright or even on at all. Wait until season 2 comes along and see.
I'm playing through fallout 3 and new vegas with Tale of Two Wastelands right now with many other mods and all dlc. Best of both worlds. I love fallout and I love Bethesda, I'm hoping that starfield and F76 will be fully learned lessons for TES6 and future fallout games. But I'm still going to be very sceptical of future releases.
To be fair matt Todd ruined his own Persona and all the good Faith people had towards him with 76 and that "16 times the detail!" quote. They now view him as just another cooperate Suit who is faking his enthusiasm towards his own products to sell more copies like a snake salesman.
@@GoatBoat22 Brother He can Like Bethesda, I do too. I just dislike their Choices with 76 and Fallout 4 becoming more casual like. Just like Skyrim too Oblivion.
Fallout 4 did not try to build on the success of New Vegas at all the game needed a dlc just so you could have some form of genuine roleplaying and even then then they stripped the durability mechanics gave you a voiced protagonist who is always backstory wise a veteran with a wife and a son named shaun plus the god awful infatuation with a half baked settlement system it is a travesty to say fallout 4 was building off New Vegas at all New Vegas IS successful for it's roleplaying and outstanding world building and writing the setting is the story in Fallout 4 they just improved on the shallow aspects of fallout such as the gameplay but in every other regard the game is a great looter shooter at best and even then the shooting has dated badly and that just isn't enough for it to hold a candle to an actual genuine rpg and even another point is that Tim Cain was even disappointed that Bethesda just reused super mutants, the Brotherhood, and enclave because he wanted to see something more original they cant even create a gigachad original faction like obsidian did with the Legion....
I read these comments and feel like im the only one who actually loved the Settlement system (just not Preston quest giving lol honestly I was hoping it was improved upon in starfield (it was worse).
eh, idk about you, New Vegas was a huge disappointment for me, this is the game that everyone hypes up a lot, and its just visual novel with guns, Dishonored is a lot better than NV.
Paragraphs, my boy.
@DaemonWolf Use punctuations.
@@BubbleGum566No your not a reddit moderator lol typing poorly for the sake of brevity go outside.
Witcher show Dejavu. I will bet any amount of money something along this basic template will occur….
Season 1: General acceptance. Show has lore issues and some woke stuff but majority overlook it because it’s “nit picking”. Hardcore/ Long time fans of old games not impressed; are called jerks for not liking it (Honestly you should see some of the unbridled anger/hate I have received for simply pointing out lore issues, retcons, and woke stuff).
Season 2: Rug pull, show goes way more woke in effort to widen audience; screw up lore to point that even you general fans get pissed. Hardcore fans vindicated (No apology is given by the rest of the fanbase who was bamboozled by current year movie/show bait&switch strategy YET AGAIN).
Season 3: Show goes full on dumpster fire. There is no semblance of the underlying lore. All fans, even the most casual are gone. Casuals/ non-fallout fans begin to check out because they don’t have the capacity to stay focused on a thing for longer than 2 seasons (hence the world casual. Literally the locust swarm of the escapism medium. With this IP now destroyed they will move on to the next thing).
Season 4: If there is one, the show craters, nobody watches, it’s cancelled. Men are immediately blamed.
You ever considered becoming a psychic? I think you've got a gift for seeing the future.
@@hochiminh590 i mean he is just re counting what happend with the new star wars trilogy so its entirely possible it does go this way.
@@vangrant0019 SW Sequel Trilogy, Witcher, Mando, Some would argue GoT, there are others but they escape my mind right now, but all of these examples have followed this exact pattern.
I guess the other pattern which doesn’t appear to apply in this case is the show skips all of that and is woke AF/ blatantly disrespectful outright and it’s just DOA. See RoP, Halo, etc for examples of that.
lol….woke….no wonder you got pushback you know this doesn’t come from a place of decency
If a Publisher or Development team make a decision that I'm not on board with I think to myself " oh well that's not the direction I would've taken, it's their IP not mine" and I either keep playing or I move on. Getting genuinely angry over these things is immature.
Yeah people gatekeeping the lore in a video game series they didn’t create, I really don’t get.
I’m old and played the first game on a 486 PC. The show while not an exact adaptation was fine. I enjoyed the show as its own thing. Don’t get all the drama but after stuff like Wheel of Time and the Rings of dookie made me leery of “modern adaptaions” for modern audience. Fallout above all didn’t suck for me.
I've always preferred New Vegas (even back in the early days when it was hated) and have grown to realize I'm specifically a New Vegas fan, and not a Fallout fan. And even if a lot of stuff they do in regards to New Vegas doesn't sit well with me. But I find the weird amount of vitriol and aggression from the super fans to be way to excessive.
I feel like the drama goes deeper than that going back to the Early 2000's with the forum No Mutant's Allowed. The second Bethesda got the IP the divide started.
That is so true. I remember those days.
Which was obviously going to happen when GOAT RPG series was bought up by a studio that can't write for shit and spend their time trying to ruin other studios so they can poach their staff.
The show was good. It wasn't woke garbage like people insist. I hate the woke shit but this show didn't push an agenda. It respected the franchise.
As someone who has seen several videos from that circle, and from what I know of the show... How exactly is it even woke? What, just because the main character is female? I don't get it.
What is woke garbage exactly?
a FEW hints at almost going woke but it defo doesnt go woke which is a pleasant change.
Agreed
Don't you know the new word their sprouting now is dei.
If I could be an extra in the show, I want to be the pool cue raider going against a guy in t-60 power armor. We know the result
I was literally saying that to my husband when watching. "It really puts a hilarious thought of a raider using pool cue against power armor" easy to over look in a game, but imagining it put into the show would be so funny
@@baileybland4497 haha it’d be a funny comical release to add in the show
I really enjoyed the show, thanks for covering it Matty. I wouldn't have known about it without your vids, I appreciate you
When your video popped up and i saw the word "Drama", 1st person i thought of was Oxhorn lol.
Yeah I find it insufferable to just whine or hear people whine about something all the time. oxhorn seems to be prime candidate there.
@@mechkatana2173 You know, it is optional to watch videoes right? Oxhorn didn't come to your house, and forced you to hear him out.
@@HoratioCanus I don’t watch their stuff but thank you for letting me know , you have a good day.
I think more people should follow Tim Cain, his content is gold! Wholesome and really educational, and oddly calming
Agreed!!!
You know, I never understood why there was so much backlash with the voiced protagonist in Fallout 4, I LOVED THE VOICED PROTAGONIST, I WISH ALL GAMES HAD VOICED PROTAGONIST!!!!!! We Do Not Live In the "Silent Era of Movies of the 1920's".....I Do Not Like Silent Protagonist....hahaha....I Still Think the Problem With Bethesda IS THERE TOO DAMN SMALL OF A COMPANY WITH THE FACT THAT THEY GOT THREE MAJOR GAME FRANCHISES, THE TOO DAMN SMALL ALL STEMS FROM THE FACT THE GAMES CAN NOT BE MADE CONCURRENTLY, Like right now, Elder Scrolls VI and Fallout 5 should be produced CONCURRENTLY CONCURRENTLY CONCURRENTLY, but they can't, because Bethesda is too small!!!!!!
I think it’s crazy how to many people, Todd Howard isn’t an inspirational creative, but a man who isn’t allowed to enjoy his successes. His works are revered by many, his video games are some of the only video games in the world to reach global popularity. Skyrim is a game that is up there with games like GTA, Call of Duty, Mario, the games that non gamers know about. Games your dad would say “I remember when that first one came out” as if it’s like a parallel to a popular album being relevant across many generations. Todd Howard found out how to make millions of dollars doing the one thing he said he was going to do, make video games. And guess what. Everyone played them. And to actually be so humble, and inspire young talent to get out there and start creating, how could anyone see that as a bad thing? Does it make me a shill that I think Todd Howard is actually an inspiration to me? And has inspired me to pursue the more creative aspects of my life, like any artists would? I wrote a report about him in high school that’s how big of an impact his philosophy on gaming has affected me and I’m not alone in my feelings. Only problem is once you share those feelings to others in a community who engaged with the same thing you did, you would be lit on fire. It makes it hard to want to participate in discussions because that’s part of enjoying any art that makes it all worth it. Talking about it! What good is it to engage with something if you aren’t gonna talk and think about how it made you feel? What’s the point?
2:39 Matty I don't know why you keep saying that New Vegas is destroyed... The shot is in daytime & buildings normally don't keep their exterior lights on during the day & The buildings look decrepit because it's Fallout & All buildings look like that... I don't think that the show was going to put big neon lights that says "WELCOME TO NEW VEGAS" to convey to us NV isn't destroyed
Yeah, it's definitely not destroyed. There is smoke coming up from a few buildings, and the credits only show one street which could technically be outside of the strip.
I’m basing it off the credits shot where it’s panning through the strip all destroyed. I think the distanced shot also shows it’s not what it once was.
i mean it looks destroyed soooo
@@dr_mercio I don't think that street from the panning shot is outside the strip just because all the casino signs are on it as well as the New Vegas sign being there and the cam going through the gate
Season 2 is about to reveal what ending in New Vegas they decided to make canon. I predict.
I do agree that this NV versus Bethesda mentality needs to go at this point. It’s been here ever since I first became a fan and I just want Fallout to be an awesome franchise we can all continue to love going forward.
@@GoatBoat22 If Bethesda is so mediocre then maybe you should find a different game franchise because it ain’t changing. Also my bad, I forgot NV was perfect in every aspect. Very embarrassing for me :(
Was really just curious on the timeline. Show was great! It’s mad me go back and replay 3,NV & 4. Hell might even give 76 a try again just good to see fallout content.
It shouldn't be canon.
damn fallout fanbase are worse than from software fanbase, atleast those people hate other games, fallout fanbase hate their own franchise
Is it not okay to have issues with the show? Its not the worst video game adaptation but it still leaves a lot to be desired. The whole tone of the show just feels goofy. Yeah yeah i get it “fallout has always had silly moments “ which is true. But every moment in the show is someone making a Quip. NV an fallout 3 both had a great dark vibe and bleak world. On top of that the writing for some of the characters is awful, especially maximus
Same, i love all fallouts to one degree or another and am a fan of the west coast more but i do like some of the expansion bethesda did here and there but the way they handled ghouls not needing food or water was dumb, the iron man rocket thrusters were dumb, and the possibility that vault tech did the nuking is dumb along with a plethora of other issues i have including the BOS in 76. I accept modipheus’s campaign book from Fallout: Wasteland Warfare as canon when dealing with Fallout 4 because it explains really well why nobody had civilization in 4 and even expands on the children if atom in a really cthulu-ish and cool way.
I just want a good fusion between the east and west coast with more expansion of lore than changes or retcons personally. That and im tired of the BOS in general they need to sit out a couple of games with maybe only a minor appearance on a body or npc.
How is Muldover over 200 yo? She's not Vault Tech, nor a ghoul. Cyrostasis is rare. Which isn't her field of study.
Todd has always made it a point to invite Tim Cain to Fallout events.
Dude fallout 76 really sucks, bethesda really ruined the lore with that one. Just shoving shit that everybody knows in a timeline where it doesn't really make sense does not make for a good story. The community is great but that can't really save the game.
Couldn't get into it, fallout has always been about good story's or good atmo in the case of fallout 3. Bethesda is unable to produce a good story and f04 was just fun to play but nothing really special.
If everybody is just happy with the slop being served then bethesda won't get the message, i think that's why a lot of fans don't like this toxic positivity of "everything fallout is good".
New vegas is objectively better than anything bethesda cooked up and even though i'm not into isometric rpg's from the 90's the atmosphere and grim tone of the first fallout is iconic. The story was fucking amazing too,
Emil is aware of this too because he just announced that Nate was the soldier laughing as another executed a civilian...he's so bad at writing that he has to include Nate in f01 just to seem like he was ever part of writing a good story.
I don't see anything but facts
@@fathermozgus3315 Thx man, it doesn't really give me much joy to say it and after starfield i don't think bethesda is going to make another great fallout.
They should really give obsidian another go.
FUCKING PREACH GOOD GOD
@@True_Perfection Weird, normally when i speak the truth people send me death threats.
I can't tell if the final shot of New Vevas has it in ruins or if it's just bad lighting and cgi.
Even though Fallout 1 is my favorite of the series, I've found something to love in each and every Fallout game! Grateful for creators like you, Matty, for being a positive voice in the Fallout community and spreading overall good vibes around it! I wish we could all get along and enjoy the franchise together instead of fighting! I thought the show was something we could all enjoy and bring us all together as fans to celebrate the series we love but I see so many arguments and negativity online :( nothing wrong with different opinions and constructive criticism BUT some people take things way too far and I think it makes it harder to enjoy being apart of the fandom as a whole. Also thanks for pointing people to Tim Cain's channel. Some great stuff over there, love that guy!
Vault-tec setting off everything and lying about it by saying china fired the first bomb actually makes sense. And in fallout 3 the megaton nuke has a vault-tec logo on it so it’s not REALLY a retcon it’s hidden lore.
Or possible that vault tec built American nukes, there is no proof the megaton nuke is supposed to be Chinese, could be a downed planed carrying a nuke similar designs by USA explains it’s lack of detonation because it was not armed yet.
Bethesda lore lmfao
The logo in Megaton's bomb is not Vault Tec but US airforce. And even if Vault Tec had reasons to start the war its inexplicable why the other corporations went along with it when they'd lose everything.
@@RafaelSantos-pi8py it’s definitely not the Air Force logo but good try. If you watched the show or even played the games you would see they didn’t “lose everything”. new Vegas mr house is still around and kicking and the other corporations management were most likely still in cryo freeze in their vaults like vault-tecs were in vault 31. Their plan was to save themselves bomb the rest and wake up at a later date to rule their own parts of the world. Which again makes sense for the greedy people we know they are. In new Vegas Mr house had advanced notice of when the bombs were coming and made sure the strip was protected. Again it all falls in line with what is shown in the games.
@@kidd1790 "You never played the games" Lmfao says the guys that have only played the fake Fallout titles.
I don’t think New Vegas is destroyed. The surrounding area has settlements it seems. I also don’t think we should take anything in those artistic credits shots as canon/real. There was another one showing the radio station destroyed but that’s not the case
People are seriously reading too much into the 3 seconds of screen time we saw the city.
It is actually destroyed, you see the entire strip with broken ncr vertibirds scattered across with debris everywhere, in the credits
The whole point of the comment you're replying to is that the art in the credits should not be considered canon because it previously showed the radio station in disarray when it really wasn't.@@leonchristou1702
There is no light meaning no power so Hoover Dam is destroyed or lost. The streets have no people and there's debris and broken buildings. That's much worse than what the courier finds when visits New Vegas forthe first time.
@@RafaelSantos-pi8py So? I mean, it depends on what happened, why that is. New Vegas may or may not stand depending on who wins at the end of FNV and what happened in between. The very fact that that's where the character qoes (don't want to say which character so I don't spoil it too much) means there's something/someone important there. Maybe the city was damaged, but there are still people. Honestly, I hope we see that Caesar or Lanius won at Hoover Dam. I'd be curious to see his Legion.
I think people are reading way too much into every pixel of 3 seconds of screen time. And this isn't the first time I notice this: people dissecting every detail and speculating over it. I see it every time with trailers and a lot of predictions are just wrong. So, let's be more... moderate in making predictions and speculating. Let's be patient and see what happens.
New Vegas was the high water mark. People just want Fallout to be Great Again but patrolling the Mojave almost makes you wish for a nuclear winter.
So is this set before or after vagus ?
I freaking loved the show and can not wait for the second season.
Anyone who does not worship New Vegas as the one true game belongs on a cross tbh.
Well. You know. 1 and 2 exist
@@butteater8748 exactly.
Or stop pushing your 'opinion' on other people. People can like what they like and that's all good.
Arrogant gamers annoy me.
I agree with you brother
@@butteater8748 And? New Vegas is objectively better than 1 - fallout 2 was always trash.
Thank you for covering this topic
The issue here is we the people want need and deserve New Vegas 2
It wouldn't be a new Vegas 2. Obsidian would probably set it in Colorado or texas
They’d hate it and blame BGS for the “engine” just as they did when new Vegas was a new game. People don’t know what they want tbh
Bethesda would have to do it and they're not competent enough for New Vegas 2. Its beyond their abilities.
@@RafaelSantos-pi8pynice assassins creed profile picture if you can tolerate ubisoft’s smelly shits I’m sure you’ll be fine with bethesda
@@grimey666 Well i haven't bought a AC game since Syndicate but i do play For Honor.
I think the showrunner was right when he said you can never fully satisfy fans
Luckily the creatives here were also fans of Fallout so they knew what they were doing
the fans proved his point
New Vegas is my fav game all time…fallout is my fav franchise. I love Bethesda and their visions for stuff. Just because you love NV doesn’t mean you have to hate every Bethesda thing, when I saw new Vegas in the show I didn’t care at all that it was destroyed, I’m just glad we got to see it
The Fallout tvshow, gave me the idea of playing Tale of Two Wastelands again.
Some people have way too much of their sense of self-worth wrapped up in being "experts" on Fallout. Changes disrupt this.