I wonder, what would actually happen to a human consciousness that lived that long, I assume the first couple months would drive someone to insanity and a catatonic state just like a person in solitary confinement, but in decades, would a mind begin to transcend beyond itself. Would it eventually evolve and become even more than it is, it reminds me of the movie, groundhog day, where a man repeats a day over and over, it gets to the point where he wants to commit suicide, but eventually gains great wisdom from that repetition of the day, granted he wasn't in isolation. Still, just imagine being a million years old, what would it actually do to a human mind.
@@juantorres-fk7bk yeah I was thinking the same! Agree you'd go insane - I think that's unavoidable. I hoped that eventually he'd transcend his human body and escape, or find some sort of glitch that lets him get out...
juan torres interesting thought process, I can tell you’re very smart. I think this would be an interesting experiment to conduct, but it’s definitely screwed up to put someone through that. Maybe if you did it an AI to see if it could become sentient. Bit that’s very far fetched.
The ending of this episode really just highlights a simple truth; that humans will gleefully participate in the most disgusting, heinous acts of torture and cruelty if they're convinced they're doing it 'for the right reasons'.
Really? Compare punishments of criminals in the past, to modern punishments and tell me which is softer I'll answer that: today, we're much less willing to put up with cruel punishments today than we were in the past, we even cancelled the death penalty because we thought it was too inhumane
I just watched this episode last night while high. I just got MIND FUCKED just thinking about the idea while one person is force to spent A LONG time is isolation the other people lives thru that in a minute
@@robinelhermoso525 it doesn't justify cheating, we also have no evidence of abuse. You would think that if he was as abusive as you say, he would have assaulted her when she blocked him since he had quite literally no other way to communicate with her, but he didn't, that actually says so much about his character, that even with all that pain, all that rage, and no other way to even talk to her, he did nothing to hurt her, after everything she did to him. Yes, he was wrong to leave the little girl to die, but by that time he was in so much pain he couldn't think clearly... He had suffered so much by that point because Beth chose to not be honest, and chose to not even communicate her issues, she did nothing, she's the worst kind of person. Let's put it this way, when he was locked in that house for 1000 years per minute for Christmas day, I felt really really sick, but if that happened to Beth, I wouldn't.
Listening to the same song is also a homage and a reference to Kubrick's A Clockwork Orange where in a therapy session, Alex de Large is repeatedly made to hear Beethoven's Symphony number 9 over and over again until he breaks down and becomes a new person and socially withdrawn from the society.
@@BryceEdwardBrown you missed the picture of Ash from the "Be right back" episode saying he was one of the victims of the accident Beth was involved in
IKR - there's an episode of Buffy The Vampire Slayer (S03E01, _'Anne'_ ) where this concept first became apparent to me back in early 2000 - totally spooked me!
@@adamjohnson2914 he also smashed the radio that made it louder, he probably smashed it many times after that from it driving him crazy, making it louder and louder each time.. no sleep, just excruciatingly loud Christmas music, non-stop, all day, every day... it would probably be deafening within days, he couldn't bare it. 1.4 million years of that :s
Beth's dad was horrendous. He kept Joe's letters from Beth. He was dismissive when Joe confronted him, and was clearly an enabler to Beth. During that confrontation scene, he almost killed Joe; Joe just happened to act upon it first.
well if the characters acted more realistically then the whole issue would have been resolved years before and none of the murders would have happened and we wouldnt get this great story :p
@SharkTank no actually. I saw a reddit comment about white Christmas and it had been i while since i watched black mirror. I wanted to remember what it was about so i looked for an summary. ( this video)
I think the idea is that people don't quite comprehend the horrors of AI sentience yet. To them, torturing the cookie is barely any different from killing a SIM character or whatever.
If I'm recalling correctly, it's not the service that was illegal, that was more moral gray area, it was letting someone die and not reporting it or something like that, it's been a while since I saw the actual episode so I may not be right
This is by far the saddest episode I've watch from the show... The poor dude got blocked without a real explanation and beth left him wondering "what he did wrong?" when in reality she was the one who cheated and left him heartbroken... I hate to have sympathy for the dude at the end because he ultimately killed the grandpa and the child...but I always keep wondering if this would of being avoided if Beth just confessed instead of blocking him and dissapearing...
+Ryg Doomed I thought they could have made a cute couple, too. ;_; Then again, loving the actress surely helped endear me to her character early on. I just didn't know that she would turn out to be a total maniac!~!
If "it's just a code", then why do they want to punish it? It's a contradiction. This "code" will still experience it as real, and they know that, why else would they punish it. Also this makes me think of something, they aren't actually punishing the right one here, it's a copy of him but not actually him. He is still in the cell with his own mind. So how exactly does that affect him? As for "it's not real", well real is a very lose definition, all we know is that what we call real is what we experience, and so for a code that would be just as real to them.
exact comment i said to myself when i finished the episode. this is injustice technically. the AI didn't do anything wrong, the actual person did, so technically they're torturing an innocent AI
There's no point in torturing it anyways cuz it doesn't feel anything as it was shown to us in the beginning of the episode,the first AI(the lady) did not need to eat or sleep or anything else humans would need to do for survival so... Think of it like a video game,a very realistic one.
Oh common I totally side with Joe.He might have deserved jailtime but not this hell.Someone should have told him the child isnt his,it wouldnt have led to his crime that on the side note he obviously felt incredibly remorseful of.If Beth blocked him that could have been enough of protection from his possible explosive reaction.I mean even if she felt like he could phyisicaly attack her the police in the whole world of the episode seems to be very strict.Yes he was nasty when he drunk,but he didnt seem to be an abusive person,the way he reacted to her unexpected pregnancy he seemed to be a good man essentialy.Her dad as well,could have coldly responded to him that the child isnt his and that he should keep away,and things would have played out differently.
Well, as much as I didn't like Beth, I disagree that he's not an abusive person. If he did nothing abusive before, he killed an old man and abandoned a little girl in the middle of nowhere on Christmas, just because it wasn't his kid. If it was his kid he would have taken her with him even if he killed the grandpa over some other argument. When things didn't go his way he attacked. When she said she didn't want to keep the baby he intimidated her by smashing the vase, when he found out it wasn't his kid he killed grandpa and eventually the kid. This is just being spoiled or he was abused the same way when he was a kid-who knows. All in all, he deserved a fair punishment and therapy but living hell for thousands of years by just one tap on the screen is inhumane. I bet the police didn't even think it was enough just because they couldn't process the idea of it and emphatize.
HamsterMain That's still scary if someone smashed something into the wall just because they got angry. That means they might hurt you and they're showing you that they can.
Are you forgetting Beth got very drunk despite being pregnant and then blocked Joe for the rest of her life just to hide her shame that she cheated. Mathew even decides Joe is a good person when Mathew tells his two stories.
I find it unfair that he wasnt even informed to at least move on with his life. In his mind, that the daughter he wouldnt never know. To be denied the truth about the situation for years is the real crime. If you want to leave some just tell them and make sure you allow them to move on. The murder would never had happened if he was told that he was someone elses kid at first. Maybe he would have moved to be find a happy relationship and fix his drinking habits up.
I agree that Beth is not the “lesser asshole” out of the two that this video tries to argue. But Matthew saying Joe was a good person means absolutely nothing; the _entire_ heart-to-heart between the two was Matthew manipulating the right response out of Joe.
@@ZhangK71 I was mainly looking at the fact that when you think you have kid and find out you have mislead, that would result it tempory madness to most of us. I guess the lesson of the story is women lie and black mirror is awesome to watch.
This wasn't a horror episode... It was terror, pure terror. The feeling of helplessness and depression after this episode still lingers with me whenever I remember this episode. The writing was brilliant, the acting was also amazing. On another note I'm glad the American actor has come back to do another few episodes, he does a good job selling the black mirror feeling.
Two most terrifying and disturbing things in the episode :- 1. Getting Blocked by the whole planet. 2. Getting sentenced in a personal hell for million years. And both happened to the two main protagonists.
Definitely reminded me of an 80s episode of The Twilight zone I saw last year where the guy had a mark on him and no one was allowed to talk to him on pain of death so the guy was literally being ignored by the entire planet
Beth was 27 when she was pregnant and 32 when she died so the little girl was 5 years old when she died and it was 5 years he was stuck in the house, Beth’s death automatically removed the block so he was able to see his daughter now only to find out it wasn’t his, what a twist that’s more like Twilight Zone 😲
@@johnbrylledomingo6377 I agree. It only makes sense when she was pregnant he couldn’t see the child because the baby was still apart of her. Once she had the child he should have been able to see since it wasn’t his kid, that never made sense to me.
@@johnbrylledomingo6377 not necessarily, offspring could be referring to all of Beth’s offspring. That doesn’t necessarily mean that it has to be both of their offspring.
You talking about Joe & Beth’s relationship reminds me of the _fact_ that the most dangerous time for someone in an abusive relationship, physical or otherwise, is the first 24 hours after they leave their partner. It’s so easy for people to say ‘just go’ but in reality it’s never that simple
Wyntah B it seems like blocking someone one only keeps them from seeing you and speaking to you but doesn’t stop them from physically touching you. Reminds me of a restraining or no-contact order here in North America, it will keep you “safe” to a point but if someone’s mad and wants to hurt you, they will.
He has to speculate and reach hard to justify her actions. If he was actually abusive toward her was just speculation in the end. We haven’t seen it, and he was rightfully angry when he found out that she wanted to abort it, and that the kid wasn’t his.
@@pathetic2399 He shown to been easily angry and explosive at time. I won't be surprise if he was abusive. He is not rightfully angry when she wanted to abort it. It may be their child but she is the one carrying the pregnancy and giving birth.
Beth cheated but there are people who committed worse deeds. Be more forgiving all of us are flaw and we have to accept that. It is not as if Joe was any better.
@@blugaledoh2669 Bro shit the fuck up, dont justify cheating, and a kid is the child of two people not one. The father should at least have a say in It. Fuck off
I am against Beth because whatever happens you give your partner a explanation and what you want. The other person always deserves explanation regardless of his temper. Here Beth left him in full darkness, he supposed to feel that she is blocking him from his own girl. If she told the truth or write a latter, he could move on.
@@kh_qft762 He is wrong indeed. But this wouldn’t have happened if she would have given him an explanation. He deserves to know. Since he has a bad temper she could take him to the police station and then tell him the truth thereby preventing him to turn overly aggressive and harm her or her child. And by blocking him she was not only a coward but also a bad partner. So many lives were destroyed by just lack of communication. She seemed depressed as well on knowing that she’s pregnant with her colleague’s child. If she would have asked for some time and then later decide to let him know that would have worked as well.
@Nonaya Bidness he is in the wrong, but because Beth decided to be a coward her kid is now dead… if she just told him the truth it could’ve ended differently
No absolutely fucking not. You can't predict what he would have done had he known the truth. If your life is in danger you protect yourself. You don't try reason and potentially get yourself killed like Joe did with his father. To everyone who's like like "but this wouldn’t have happened if she would have given him an explanation" YOU DON'T KNOW THAT. It's sad what happened but like said in the video he was the root cause of their troubles in the relationship.
Beth always had the opportunity to tell Joe that she had cheated on him and that the baby was not his, even if it was through a letter, but she did not, because she was a coward, she only made Joe suffer for years. I'm on Joe's side
@@bbytiiaDidn’t Beth literally douse a bunch of wine when she was pregnant and joe didn’t directly kill her, he just killed the pos father who was trying to kill him first.
Beth:Gets pregnant with what Joe assumes to be his kid Hides it from him Drinks alot to try and kill the kid "Blocks" him so that he cant even talk to her or say anything(dodging any responsibility) Joe: Throws vase at wall then sleeps on couch Narrator: I sIdE mOrE wItH bEtH
@@TheBlashMusic ya he shouldn't have sided with her but jeez dude calm down its his opinion and you shouldn't come at him for that if you don't like the video stop wasting your time and go away don't start calling him "a f&cking tool" just for him saying hes taking beths side
Out of all BM episodes, this is the one I have the biggest problem rewatching. This might be the most elaborate, cruellest torture I've seen in film... Brilliant concept, horrifying implications... This episode along with White Bear (would you look at that, the two episodes with "White" in the title..) are definitely the most nightmarish for me. Watching the boundless cruelty humans are capable of due to their ability of depersonalization and dehumanization of their targets... *shudder*
oh my god absolutely. those two episodes made me feel legitimately sick when i saw how much others enjoyed watching these people be tortured. i had to take a break from the show both times
@@darkangel4994 I mean, not far off with reality. People upload videos of people receiving their sentences when in court, the person gets the death penalty or life, and the comments section is pretty brutal. The videos are of the peoples reactions to receiving their sentences. The people in the comments section make fun of their reactions. Honestly, I liked White Bear.
@@Luna-kb3sr Yeah... so? Just because someone acted like a monster, we are suddenly entitled to become monsters too...? Seriously, the ability of people to justify cruelty scares me. The lynching mob we saw in White Bear was truly terrifying to me. It wasn't about punishment. These people were enjoying themselves, it was like a really fucked up theme park for them. It was entertainment. They stopped seeing the woman as a human being, she was completely dehumanized, an object, a toy to them. Her suffering was the source of entertainment. It was inhumane and disgusting - and her crime is irrelevant. Did she deserve punishment? Yes, absolutely. But that doesn't entitle us to cruelty, to act like absolute monsters. That would make us no better. What's the most scary about that is that it happens all the time in real life, especially with the internet and its relative anonymity - maybe not quite to that extreme, but people are very quick to destroy someone's life when the mob decides that person is bad. The internet "justice" is scary.
Compared to Joe's sentence, it's easy to forget how bad Matt's fate is in this. He can only shop at self service checkouts and how could he live long term anyway? He couldn't call a tradesperson if he had issues with his house, plus he couldn't even work or claim benefits. The punishment far outweighed his misdemeanors, they should have just blocked him for a year
skhturner bandersnatch takes place in a time when video games had really poor graphics and the tv had really poor quality based off of that and the way they dressed and their music bandersnatch is set way before the 2000s, while white Christmas is set obviously in the future where our technology gets out of hand
Beth was WRONG in this situation and could have told Joe the truth about her affair and who the father was. This was a tragic episode though. Beth, her father and daughter are all dead.
I find it troubling how easily & quickly we all are to defend & even cheer on female toxicity. Beth was an awful person,no excuse for what she did. Both characters got way too harsh of a sentence I think.
@@MicahiLovethere are many Who tries to justify her actions under peoples comments as replys. They are using that she was abused and thats why she did what she did. I think its bullshit
I've been wondering why you hadn't done White Christmas yet even though you refer to it a lot in your other videos. Just realized you were saving White Christmas...for Christmas 🎄 😂
I think it’s almost impossible for someone to realize just how torturous this would be. Really quite scary if we could ever copy consciousness the things you could do.
@@toptiertech7291 Imagine if your consciousness was trapped in a machine. You think you are you, you feel you are you even though you actually are not. And you are put through this insanity. This is beyond terrifying honestly.
@@IAmTheRealUsopperGoddamnit but it’s not his conscious. It’s a copy. Your conscious stays with you. They just take a carbon copy of it and question it or torture it. That’s like saying you would get in trouble for printing out a picture of the Mona Lisa and drawing on it because the actual Mona Lisa is valuable
this episode haunts me in ways nothing else can. just trying to imagine all that time in a constructed hell is so chilling to me and i can't explain why :(
cat Pretty much the same thing as this episode. Doomed somewhere for eternity. That was the first time I read a story like that so it messed me up for a while, this story is pretty much the same so it didn’t scare me as much.
@@kevray thanks for the recommendation, even though its probably going to haunt me for weeks after reading, i still wanna read it :,) thanks! i'll keep u updated
Can't help but feel sorry for the chap. He really wanted to be a father and his GF just blocks him instead of at least telling him the truth. He still does whatever he can to be with his daughter who isn't even his. He wasnt born a bad person. He snapped for one second after finding out what has been done to him. He should've still been punished yes, but a hell loop for a thousand years is too much
Actually, when Matthew Trent explains things to Greta's digital copy, he said she's a simulated brain stored IN a cookie, she's just the code within...
I was in a situation exactly like Joe. My ex girlfriend cheated on me and got pregnant. She didn’t tell me and she broke up with me. My mom ended up running into her at a store and say that she had a newborn baby, so I called her up. She said it wasn’t mine and I just assumed she was telling the truth. For all I know, that kid could be mine. She also blocked me on social media, so I can’t even see if he looks like me or not. Shit is rough, women really have a lot of power over men with that kind of stuff.
Indeed. A comparatively mild pandemic has exposed the Western world to a mere echo of the horrors of the past, and we've barely been able to cope. It shows how spoilt, entitled and unresiliant we've become.
If I was universally blocked, I'd commit more crimes. You can't identify someone you can't see, and going through all those who are universally blocked would be hard
he will be in record definitely..so if he commits crime ,police can easily catch him as he was registered by the police and all his works were monitored by them..
The whole thing with Beth is made worse, because she blocked him, he can't even have a conversation with her, in real life, this would leave violence as essentially the only option left in that situation, and a lot of people would use violence to get the other person to listen since there is literally no other way. The fact that Joe didn't end up killing her actually says a lot about his character, and says very little good about Beth since rather than being honest and talking things through, she chooses to ignore it completely and betray everyone, even her own kid by not giving her a father (I think its implied she isn't later with the Asian guy).
The other option was to let it go or file a paternity suit. I'm flabbergasted that so many think murder or the stalking Joe did were the only options. And you're giving credit to someone who murdered 2 people, one being a child.
@@Rad200G2B I'm not saying he wasn't in the wrong, I'm more saying that I get it, having a kid that you think could only be yours, you'd most likely want to be there in any capacity. There's also no evidence he could have abused her because if he were going to, it would have been when she blocked him, because he had basically no other option of communication, even my ex at the time said that she couldn't believe he didn't just attack her, because being able to block people like that, effectively leaves violence as the only other option of communication. If they ever do this in real life, domestic violence and violence in general will skyrocket overnight. She is the worst kind of person, all she had to do was tell him that it wasn't his kid, but she chose to be a piece of human garbage. And if that world is akin to real life, filing a paternity test may not have been possible, in a lot of places (France is a big one) the mother has to consent. A woman can literally just say no, and that she knows so and so is the father, and nothing else matters, and in a lot of cases, even when she's caught lying, it doesn't matter, the government will side with her and go after the guy she chooses if he makes more money because "best interest of the child".
@@ZenKrio You think a man that killed an elderly man and a child would've just taken it on the chin that his gf was pregnant by another man. The only reason he didn't kill Beth was because he thought she was the mother of his child. Once he found out he had no connection to that little girl it was fuck her and her granddad. Beth made the right choice. Joe was CLEARLY dangerous.
@@Rad200G2B Nah, it was more like what elderly man said set him off and was the last straw, going through all the pain he did and bottling it up only to have that be the last straw, a lot of people would have reacted in a terrible way, especially with the years of build up he had. I'm not saying Joe wasn't bad, but Beth was worse, she essentially tortured him and made him the monster that he eventually came to be... I can say, having had an ex do something similar to me (except I AM the father), having someone essentially take you kid from you is a torture on a whole other level if you have any sort of empathy, finding out that kid isn't yours after ALL THAT TIME when she could have just told you after say, a few years when you've gotten over the break up but not losing your kid, he likely would have taken it with stride and walked away, but because she took the lie to her grave, he had to find out the terrible way he did. You also have to look at what happened in the end too, Joe was tortured now for what again? 3 Million years for his mistakes (again, caused from the torture of another person), whereas Beth got to live a perfectly happy life for essentially making the biggest cunt move a woman ever could? I would have killed Joe for what he did and put Beth in the house, because she essentially put him in that house for five years before the police did...
@@ZenKrio There's not argument you can make that'll have me sympathize with Joe after he killed that old man and little girl. All of a sudden the child stops being important once he finds out she wasn't his and let her starve to death. Black Mirror's conceit is we're still in our world but tech enhanced. Joe could've gone through legal means to see and verify the kid was or wasn't his kid. Beth cheated and left him without a word. Boo-fucking-hoo. Joe didn't know how to deal with his emotions without violence or drinking. Everything we saw of Joe before and after the breakup makes it understandable why she blocked him.
Being tortured for over 1 million years in solitary confinement has to be the worst outcome any one in black mirror has ever faced. After even 10 years of solitary confinement a person is pretty much garenteed to go insane and become sucidial but after over 1 million years it's likely that person has lost all their memories and even basic human understanding and wants talking, reading, writing or having a need for belongings, safety, achievement and many more things as probably after over 10000 years the tortured soul wouldn't even resemble a human as they had given up on their now meaningless existence.
I could understand the motivation of the 1 million years punishment if his own consciousness was transferred into the simulation but the cookie is a copy of Joe. The 'original' Joe is not suffering this punishment. This seems somewhat akin to creating a clone of a suspect, getting that clone to confess (presuming they have all the same memories) and then torturing the clone and giving the original person a less harsh punishment. Doesn't seem logical unless of course they've just becoming really sadistic.
Creed Bratton it isn't abuse when it's a coping mechanism to another much worse abuse... she cheated because the guy was too much, and she was drinking not because she wanted to abuse the daughter (which, btw, isn't abuse at all) but because of her current emotional state... if the guy was a bit more chill and did not abuse her emotionally, she wouldn't have even done what you said she did...
@@Vekcrazah if the roles were reversed you's say he was abusing her, it's so common for some peopke to justify female's bad behavior, like if for being women they wouldn't be able of harming.
I don't know if it was intentional but the series made me think about how women sometimes take advantage of the fact that they are the ones physically giving birth even though it takes two people to make a child. It was so frustrating to watch Beth blocking her boyfriend from not just her but also the child that could have been his. There was no way of knowing for sure that that child wasn't his but the Z-eye technology put an automatic block on it. And it doesn't seem to matter that he could be (or in Matthews case- WAS) the father of that child. WHAT THE HELL IS UP WITH THAT? A child has two parents- one of them shouldn't be able to singlehandedly block the other out from its life... Do you think that if a husband blocked their wife, his child would also be automatically erased from her view? Probably not. I think it shows that fathers are considered to be lesser parents for some reason.
Imo it's an exaggerated version of what we have in our reality. Women are perceived as those responsible for children, therefore society expects from them to care about kids, often demanding from mothers way more than from fathers. It hurts both sides - guys who can feel alienated from their own kids, and girls who feel overwhelmed with such incredible amount of responsibility. I think black mirror shows us exaggerated version of this, so we can notice how unequal roles our society gives to parents. That women are given more rights over child, but are as well expected to focus their life on offspring, while man's rights and responsibilities can get minimized. If we want to avoid future like in black mirror, we should cope with this problem we have now.
@@mariame9838 cool, so if a girl got pregnant and wanted to keep the kid and the guy didn't, he could just up and left because according to you, it's an individual decision made only by women. seems fine to me.
mariame if the two parents are in a Serious long term relationship, or maybe even married, the husband AT LEAST deserves an explanation as to why the women isn’t keeping the baby, Beth didn’t even explain to joe why she didn’t want to keep the baby, even if it’s a “women decision only” what Beth ddI was wrong, and she was terrible for what she did to him with no explanation.
Felt bad for Joe. Beth cheated on him, didn’t tell him what was up and made him believe he had a daughter and so his actions were understandable that he didn’t move on. Then although it’s not right that he killed her father, you can understand thinking you’ve had a daughter for 5 years and then suddenly it’s taken away from you just like that for you just to explode in confusion and anger.
The analysis is amazing but I can't believe the narrator sides with Beth when she's the one who originally caused every tragedy. She cheated on him, refused to communicate even a word with him, blocked him. Joe threw a vase into the wall and slept on the couch - now he's reckless ??? Could she just break up with him when she was actually in love with someone else, instead of cheating on him for a long time and staying fucking silent about her kid, not their kid ? If she could just be honest and not that of a cold bitch, her father and her kid would've never died
True sometimes you have to tell the truth no matter what! My ex was crazy and wanted to treaten my brother with a gun. I told a neighbor and called the police and told them he was mentally ill. Cause he is and I'm glad I did it, I have no regrets. We ended up breaking up a few days later. It was for the best he reckless and crazy. But sometimes even when things get crazy you have to allow it to happen so you can move on in your life.
I disagree with Mathew's punishment, I feel like they should've made it also he can't access the eye link anymore and probably gave him community service for next few years. The fact he is blocked by everyone is insane, that'll drive him into insanity and probably do drastic things. It's not justice, it's cruel
The saddest and unwatchable moment for me was when the little girl had to survive and left in a blizzard .. I love this episide and as such all of Black Mirror but this moment just disturbs me .. anyone else who agrees?
Anyone else realize that the little girl probably didn't freeze to death in the snow? I missed it until just now! I just re=watched "White Christmas" again for the first time in a couple years and something I'd totally missed before clicked! Only the grandfather had been murdered - not the little girl! He only knew what they had told him about here - that she had stayed in the house until Boxing Day (Dec 26) then went out for help and froze to death. Yet when they leave the simulation on it's "over Christmas" - and she wishes him a Merry Christmas in his cell. Telling him the little girl had died was part of getting him to confess, but it's quite possible that she was simply found at the house. I had never noticed the this previously, but they really stressed that he only knew what they had told him when it came to what had happened to the little girl!
No, part of joe's narration was that after he murdered the father and left the house, he spent "months sleeping on the streets" before someone found him and brought him to the police station. Which means its been basically a year since the crime happened. So the little girl died in Dec 26 and Joe's cookie confessed around Dec 24 one year later.
Beth is the true villain of this episode. No justification for her whatsoever. She took the childish route and wouldn’t tell him that the child wasn’t his. It wasn’t about abuse, she dropped him from her life because he threw a vase, she would’ve dropped him earlier if there was abuse towards her. She left because she couldn’t own up to her mistake of cheating on him. Imagine misleading a person for years that they have a child and not even telling them. Be an adult.
@@corrinaamato8805 yes, really. i thought it was clear without even needing to watch this weird video explanation that sided with beth, when in truth beth was ultimately the one who caused all of this. what's not to understand?
@@panduadikara9078 Beth did not cause this, joe isn't animal who lacks self control. Is she culpable of being a terrible person yes but is she the cause of a crime no.
No, his impulsiveness got them killed. I hate Beth for what she did, but you're acting like he had no other choice because of her behaviour. She is not responsible for his actions.
@@DwynTwo she is though in so many ways. Think about your most beloved person in the world blocking you and never spoke to you again and after sometime, died and you found out that person hid something very important from you. Do not underestimate a person snapping.
@@eugenetorres4975 It was still HIS doing, not hers. She didn't make that decision, he did. It's 100% his fault. People being shitty to you doesn't justify shitty actions.
@@DwynTwo no one's saying that what Joe did at the end was right. But it was clearly pushed to that direction cause of what Beth did. You can blame him for what he did with Beth's father and daughter but I can also blame Beth for what she did to him. Cause and effect
@@eugenetorres4975 Still disagree. He caused it. The perpetrator always causes it with his unstable mind. You can literally use this logic on anything. Woman bumps into man who has a bunch of mental issues and doesn't say sorry, so he stabs her 20 times- cause and effect? Joe didn't kill the dad because she pushed his buttons. Plenty of people get pushed, and they don't end up killers. He killed him because that's his character; losing self control and murdering a person because of lots of stress. That's him reacting to the situation this way. You could argue that Beth caused it a little bit if she literally saw the future and knew this would happen, but still behaved that way, and even then the main blame would still be on him for being a person who kills people when he's being treated bad.
@@ethandonaldson4306 What the F are talking about. NO. She was plain wrong. I hope a man you love goes through this so you can see how evil woman can be.
Beth cheated, had another man's baby and blocked a life of her partner instead of telling him the truth and allowing him to move on. Not sure how I can side with that especially since on the other side we have a man who shown nothing but love for her throughout the episode, drunk too much at a party I guess and showed no signs of abuse towards Beth.
@@martinaskupin9549 Apologies, I shouldn't post comments if I haven't properly woken up, I forgot I'd even said that; What nationality are you, just out of interest?
@@BookieKillah I don´t think, that not using "a" is such a crime. You understand, what I wrote, right? I am Czech. And I never studied english language on university.
@@martinaskupin9549 I did say sorry... (...and it's 'IN university'... :P) Czech, you say - coincidence, I was just listening to the 2nd part of New World Symphony by Dvořák just this morning...
To me this is the worst form of cruelty, torture in an extreme way. The fact that people would do that to someone, even if to deal punishment, speaks to a lack of humanity, empathy and being worse than those you are trying to punish, essentially making it sort of a contradiction. Just because you do it in the name of punishment doesn't make it right. It's sad that we aren't aware enough to see this shadow aspect of ourselves, because we justify it. Just like there is evil in wrong-doers, there is evil in you, and when you punish these people like that you are expressing that same evil capacity. That's why it's ironic, and just as wrong. We definitely need punishment of some form, if not to make them learn then at least to make sure they can't keep doing it, but there is no need to be excessively cruel. Cruelty will just make more of us lose our humanity and lack of empathy, and ultimately won't do anything to right the wrong done by the guilty. You could argue they need to feel the pain they caused, and the affected of the victims need justice, but this will just be something to feed our egos to feel better, it won't actually change what was done or even make those who did it do better. Yes, I'm very against torture, or when punishment gets more cruel than necessary. The important part is really to keep them from doing it again, and the second part is teaching a lesson. But what is the point of that part if they don't actually learn it and get to ever do better? Then we are just teaching a lesson to teach one, it's so we can feel "That will show him", much like parents smacking their kids as punishment, and not actually teaching a lesson for those people to do better- ultimately benefiting the wrong-doer (growth, be better) and us (no more wrong-doer, maybe even good-doer, a plus for society).
Your right, I have a hard time with what your saying but really I admire you wanting to take the high road. It's hard not want to see someone punished if they nearly destoryed you. However I'm learning to not let the memories of tragic events in my life affect me so severely. I think it's the aftermath of someone who has been wronged that does the most long term damage. I try these days to not give it power or life because when I see it manifesting it scares me. It's hard not to fantasize on getting revenge but I do understand that this isn't the way. I know I need therapy and I feel that will help move past it. I want to never be as curel as those that wronged me. Being good is sometimes the hardest thing but it's the smarter thing to do in the long run.
7:32 Nah beth was awful and “being afraid” is not a good enough excuse to then drive someone insane and to accidentally kill people- she’s responsible for his craziness cause she can’t just communicate with him
i dont side with beth at all for one simple fact, why let him think this is his child and block him, she is rational when it comes to leaving her fiancee but to lead him on then randomly dump him is definitly what lead to the tragedies that came later, as she could have simply broke up with him and told him the kid wasnt his and he would havr lost interest instead of being lead on and to people blaming the guy she cheated with saying he kept her silent, she still chose to keep the baby
I rewatched this ep yesterday to celebrate 🎄 with some peace & quiet for an hour. This review was the perfect surprise today! Spot on as always. Thanks!
your black mirror explained videos are so entertaining! I usually cant watch these kinda shows on my own so listening to the behind of it with you explaining it is my cup of tea haha!! feels like im not alone and helps me comprehend. i appreciate all your work and effort!!!! 😊😊
My only thing that I’m wondering is why was the kid blocked from Joe. They said you can’t see your offspring which is why he went crazy and pretty much caused his downfall. But since it wasn’t his genetic offspring shouldn’t he have been able to see her?
@@AdiCruise207 I just thought about it. Probably since she gave birth to it, it doesn't matter who the father was. He probably still couldn't see it since it was her baby idk tho
I just wanted the episode, but I can't remember if they said you can't see your offspring or their offspring. Either way, I don't think the Z-eyes tech uses DNA to determine who to block. I assume the child's birth certificate says they are Beth's child, and possibly Joe's as well, but I doubt that. I assume the Z-eyes technology looks at some registry to determine who Beth's children are and blocks them from Joe as well, at least that is what seems most logical to me.
@@MrHawkeye41what I assume is whoever the mother blocks her child will also see the same person as blocked doesn't matter if it's the biological father or any other person. Either way it was a great episode. Probably the best
@GrassCannibalshe didn't murder a kid 💀, are you good? He murdered the dad, by accident by the way, who also deserved it. And he doesn't deserve a million years in hell. In your own words, "be responsible for your actions", beth shouldve taken accountabilty she was selfish and deserving of a worse punishment than real joe. Society and the government just sided witn her because they thought joe was abusive. They didnt see the full picture. It's feminine toxicity.
out of all the episodes black mirror has done this is the only episode that actually gave me sleepless nights. its been 5 days now and all i can still think about is this episode. I've never felt so profoundly disturbed by a single episode ever. i hope it subsides soon,
You missed one thing, Bryce... Tim, quite oddly, said that "no one knows where she is..." even though the question was not asked. He's manipulating the situation. He knows what's up, and he wants Joe to run into a wall in his search...
I would love a White Christmas 2! Only if it revisits Joe’s fate though.. would he still be sane? Would he be some omnipotent-being content with his ongoing situation after how many years?? Would Matt see Joe as useful and break him/ his consciousness out somehow?
To be honest he could watch movies and listen to music from people who died because the block would be canceled and we know this takes place in the future he could watch some movies and songs from today
@@denetria2329 Oh please, she was a terrible person for not telling him the truth. No wonder he went crazy. If she had woman'd up and just told him that the baby wasn't his instead of blocking him out and making him believe he had a child with her all those years.
@dedede feedldee dee he was not abusive to her. So he threw a fucking vase lol. He never touched her. Beth is a terrible person for doing what she did without an ounce of guilt. She not only cheated but she also gave him no answers as she fled like a coward.
@@denetria2329 yeah because you know joe told her to get piss drunk and fuck her friends bf at the same house. Its a shitty thing to do how she went about it. Had a female friend do this to someone had her back mind you however i straight told her she's shit for it. Its nothing to be real and honest.
I would never hurt a fly, but if my significant other blocked me or muted me in an argument I think I would go on a killing spree 😂 it just seems so extremely frustrating.
Earthling I would be so fuckin pissed. Like imagine getting pregnant and then blocking someone and legally being able to take away the baby. I m surprised he didn’t kill that bitch
Beth is the reason all of that shit happened, she led her daughter and father to their death and led him to where he is. If she just broke up with him and told him that the kid wasn’t his! She literally just let him believe he had a kid and let him develop strong emotions for a piece of him that didn’t even exist!!! That’s harsh. And about the block thing, I hated the idea that the block covers the offsprings as even if it’s the father! Like wtf those are his kids! What if he blocks the wife, does the block cover the kids from her too or it only works that way for the fathers!!?
Did anyone notice oona chaplin(the girl whose cookie was made to make her do chores for her real self) she is charlie Chaplin's granddaughter and also played the role of rob Stark's wife in game of thrones
This episode did an amazing job of seamlessly working in multiple different technologies into an incredible story with complex characters and doing it all in less time than a typical movie
Explanation is pretty stupid considering that Beth's actions led to his escalating behaviour. After all, he thought she stole his kid and never told him about it. From his prespective he had every right to be angry regardless of his other character flaws.
The scene where Joe, actually cookie joe says its barbaric the way they treated Gerta's cookie and he (the cookie) had to suffer a much worser fate. It's just very amusing and disturbing at the same time.
This episode proves that plain and simple communication is SO important. Tim was a true asshole for just letting him go after he was looking for Beth knowing something was wrong. Had this reality be true, I would have gone straight to therapy.
Man, i completely disagree with you about Joe in the 3rd story. Joe was good to her, and even though, he was characterized as drinking too much or not being able go hold his liquor, he loved and cared for her. And its not fair to judge Joe because he threw a pot! He was angry that she wanted to abort “their” baby with no explanation, and then block him for seemingly no reason. Even though Joe ended up in prison for thousands of years, Bethany is the one that died, the ultimate payment for sins.
I love how Jon's character is talking to Oona's Cookie as if she's a real human, using gestures, conversational and informative; just as he told her she's not real, just a copy of a real person. It's like deep down he knows her Cookie is a human no matter if she's stuck in a plastic egg. He's knowingly torturing these simulated bits of data, knowing that they think they're real, and behave like a real person would if they knew they were imprisoned; not wanting to obey their captor, trying to escape, then resigning to the fact they're stuck, after they've experienced the harsh punishments given by their captor. Also, how it's shown that being a disembodied voice isn't what the Cookie wants, they want to be as human as they were in the real world. If they weren't real, they wouldn't care about being in a cage. Just like how Siri doesn't care (that we know of).
This is my absolute favourite episode and I’m so, so excited to watch this! I only just realized last week you hadn’t actually done a video for this episode yet, it just ties in to so many other episodes it’s impossible not to bring it up when talking about the rest of the series. Enough babbling, now to watch, nod along and most likely learn something new Edited to add: Great video!!
15:51 This made me realize something. At a certain age, would the block automatically be removed for their child? Or would the child never be able to see the blocked parent again? What if the child wants to see their blocked parent before they reach that age? I could see lots of potential future episodes if the child can't remove their parent's block.
Arkangel goes into that problem. Kid has some stuff that blocks anything stressful. Starts to get weird for her when she can walk herself to school but a barking dog is a silent, blurry shape.
3:56-Alao when told about Greta, Joe says something like “that’s terrible” and Matthew says something like, “interesting”. I just think it’s neat that Joe “empathizes” with Greta’s situation and Matthew notices it. It also goes to show that maybe Joe isn’t as bad as one would think.
I mean, yeah. He’s just a regular dude. He’s abusive ex and a mean drunk but that doesn’t mean he’s okay with slavery and torture. He needs therapy and AA.
@@DeathnoteBB he wasn’t abusive to Beth in the slightest. Considering she’d basically told him that she was going to kill their child (which wasn’t even his) and block him, thereby not even giving him a say in a matter this serious (and a matter which should be a joint decision between a couple under the circumstances they found themselves in), he was completely within his right to be furious and smash the vase, but he still didn’t lay a finger on Beth. It’s unfair to say he was abusive towards her, especially considering how emotionally abusive and malicious she was towards him.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
The most horrifying aspect of this episode is that, regardless of when you're reading this, Cookie Joe is still trapped in his personal hell
I wonder, what would actually happen to a human consciousness that lived that long, I assume the first couple months would drive someone to insanity and a catatonic state just like a person in solitary confinement, but in decades, would a mind begin to transcend beyond itself. Would it eventually evolve and become even more than it is, it reminds me of the movie, groundhog day, where a man repeats a day over and over, it gets to the point where he wants to commit suicide, but eventually gains great wisdom from that repetition of the day, granted he wasn't in isolation. Still, just imagine being a million years old, what would it actually do to a human mind.
@@juantorres-fk7bk yeah I was thinking the same! Agree you'd go insane - I think that's unavoidable. I hoped that eventually he'd transcend his human body and escape, or find some sort of glitch that lets him get out...
@@juantorres-fk7bk Read Junji Ito's "Long Dream". Cookie Joe reminds me of this one shot
juan torres that niggas mind would transcend space and time bruh...
juan torres interesting thought process, I can tell you’re very smart. I think this would be an interesting experiment to conduct, but it’s definitely screwed up to put someone through that. Maybe if you did it an AI to see if it could become sentient. Bit that’s very far fetched.
The ending of this episode really just highlights a simple truth; that humans will gleefully participate in the most disgusting, heinous acts of torture and cruelty if they're convinced they're doing it 'for the right reasons'.
That's pretty much 50% of all Black Mirror episodes.
Agreed, there was something about this episode that hit differently for me, though.
We are simply creatures. We all want to preserve ourselves, unless we are a god...
Really? Compare punishments of criminals in the past, to modern punishments and tell me which is softer
I'll answer that: today, we're much less willing to put up with cruel punishments today than we were in the past, we even cancelled the death penalty because we thought it was too inhumane
Stanford experiment
Just being forced to listen to non-stop Christmas music for 1,000,000 years is one of the most nightmarish things I have ever heard of.
I just watched this episode last night while high. I just got MIND FUCKED just thinking about the idea while one person is force to spent A LONG time is isolation the other people lives thru that in a minute
@Future Caucasian Politician no hell below us and above us only sky.
@Future Caucasian Politician that's a reference from "Imagine" ofcourse I know how far Heaven and Hell.
Lino Kalayil same here on earth in the higher dimension are life is literally like watching a movie that’s why they say life is a movie
@@iamgreatness6649 honestly, my life feels like a movie.
The fact beth never admitted her cheating
and always playing victim card
is what sickens me most
I want to slap her
Soumyajyoti Sarkar her ex partner was a violent alcoholic jackass and she was indeed a victim of abuse but okay. She was de villain for “cheating”
@@robinelhermoso525 victim of abuse doesn't justify chelating
@@soumyajyotisarkar Have you ever been a victim of abuse or are you saying that because you are an Incel?
@@robinelhermoso525 it doesn't justify cheating, we also have no evidence of abuse. You would think that if he was as abusive as you say, he would have assaulted her when she blocked him since he had quite literally no other way to communicate with her, but he didn't, that actually says so much about his character, that even with all that pain, all that rage, and no other way to even talk to her, he did nothing to hurt her, after everything she did to him. Yes, he was wrong to leave the little girl to die, but by that time he was in so much pain he couldn't think clearly... He had suffered so much by that point because Beth chose to not be honest, and chose to not even communicate her issues, she did nothing, she's the worst kind of person.
Let's put it this way, when he was locked in that house for 1000 years per minute for Christmas day, I felt really really sick, but if that happened to Beth, I wouldn't.
Silence is one of the most cruel things you could do to a person.
Or force someone to listen to the same song forever. Honestly, that's why I hate the silent treatment.
Listening to the same song is also a homage and a reference to Kubrick's A Clockwork Orange where in a therapy session, Alex de Large is repeatedly made to hear Beethoven's Symphony number 9 over and over again until he breaks down and becomes a new person and socially withdrawn from the society.
Yes just like after a bad relationship... You have to answer the questions for yourself... Thats the lesson - fkin the hardest... :/
I believe “Stonewalling” is one of the four horseman of divorce. Pushing others away almost guarantees broken relationships.
ITS THE WORST THING EVER
This particular episode is terrifying.
Right?!
Bryce Edward Brown But it is my favorite, although I’ve watched USS Callister about a ba-gjillion times!
Believe it or not. I had a vicarious experience of cookie Joe when I was High on shrooms while asleep. It was mental
Its too good
@@BryceEdwardBrown you missed the picture of Ash from the "Be right back" episode saying he was one of the victims of the accident Beth was involved in
The ending scene where they adjust the time to 1000yrs per min is SEARED into my mind! Such a terrifying concept..
Just in the 10 second scene where it showed the cookie wizzing by, he had already done more than 150 years.
IKR - there's an episode of Buffy The Vampire Slayer (S03E01, _'Anne'_ ) where this concept first became apparent to me back in early 2000 - totally spooked me!
@@adamjohnson2914 he also smashed the radio that made it louder, he probably smashed it many times after that from it driving him crazy, making it louder and louder each time.. no sleep, just excruciatingly loud Christmas music, non-stop, all day, every day... it would probably be deafening within days, he couldn't bare it. 1.4 million years of that :s
Wouldn't he just kill himself though
@@dionath He can't, you can't kill yourself in there, the code makes sure of that
Beth's dad was horrendous. He kept Joe's letters from Beth. He was dismissive when Joe confronted him, and was clearly an enabler to Beth. During that confrontation scene, he almost killed Joe; Joe just happened to act upon it first.
well if the characters acted more realistically then the whole issue would have been resolved years before and none of the murders would have happened and we wouldnt get this great story :p
@@zankfrappa93 so women don’t lie about the father of their children?
@@zankfrappa93 it is realistic. Many many women are like this
Joe doesnt deserve to be put in a facility like White Bear, I believe people like him should be helped not tortured.
@@zankfrappa93 I wouldn't call this episode great. 😂
Im still confused how that service Matthew used was “illegal” but its not illegal to send someone 1440000 years in a cookie
@SharkTank no actually. I saw a reddit comment about white Christmas and it had been i while since i watched black mirror. I wanted to remember what it was about so i looked for an summary. ( this video)
I think the idea is that people don't quite comprehend the horrors of AI sentience yet. To them, torturing the cookie is barely any different from killing a SIM character or whatever.
@@larsbertje9608 "an summary"
Same way any given criminal treatment won't apply to certain organizations.
If I'm recalling correctly, it's not the service that was illegal, that was more moral gray area, it was letting someone die and not reporting it or something like that, it's been a while since I saw the actual episode so I may not be right
What was the point of punishing the guys cookie for 1.4m years tho? The cookie didn’t do it lol
qbanz lol
Poor cookie lol
This is why they gave the cookies human rights, but unfortunately too late to prevent Cookie Joe's hell/purgatory.
Actually he did. Cookie joe is just another exact copy of Joe and unfortunately that makes him just as guilty
eyy same profile pic
This is by far the saddest episode I've watch from the show... The poor dude got blocked without a real explanation and beth left him wondering "what he did wrong?" when in reality she was the one who cheated and left him heartbroken... I hate to have sympathy for the dude at the end because he ultimately killed the grandpa and the child...but I always keep wondering if this would of being avoided if Beth just confessed instead of blocking him and dissapearing...
😂😂😂Women and their ways!
I would’ve been a much nicer story, fuck Beth I wanna message the actor and say hey Great acting in black mirror. But ngl I really hate Beth
Well I know he’s wrong for killing ole gramps but that guy was mean asf he had it coming
Had too much of big balls
Not being able to see humans would make me kill myself
Honestly this is the best episode. I love the cookie concept and all the other concepts that this deals with
It's seriously such a groundbreaking show
My favorite one too
Riley Bacak watching it the first time was the best too, all the twists and turns
Yeah definitely among the best, it far outshines the vastly overrated USS Callister.
my favorite concepts in this show are the ones that deal with the ethics of artificial consciousness
My phone is about to die and I don’t have my charger. I’m risking it all to watch this video
You're really brave😊😊
Me too. it is 1 in the morning. what am I doing with my life
It's a Bunnay 💀🤣🤣🤣
Jasss “I’m about to risk it all!”
Jasss I’m on 4%
I found it terrifying when the girl stuffed the tube down the guys throat forcing him to drink the poison hikes
+Ryg Doomed I thought they could have made a cute couple, too. ;_;
Then again, loving the actress surely helped endear me to her character early on. I just didn't know that she would turn out to be a total maniac!~!
@@KindredKeepsake It was kinda like "aw man... she's killing him...".
@@neonmajora8454 get out! 😂 😆
@@vaultdweller123 lol
Huh? What episode?
If "it's just a code", then why do they want to punish it? It's a contradiction. This "code" will still experience it as real, and they know that, why else would they punish it. Also this makes me think of something, they aren't actually punishing the right one here, it's a copy of him but not actually him. He is still in the cell with his own mind. So how exactly does that affect him? As for "it's not real", well real is a very lose definition, all we know is that what we call real is what we experience, and so for a code that would be just as real to them.
exact comment i said to myself when i finished the episode. this is injustice technically. the AI didn't do anything wrong, the actual person did, so technically they're torturing an innocent AI
@@joeman123964 The actual person and the AI are the same person and same consciousness.
A code can not be a real person,its just AI, which means advanced coding,it doesn't have feelings it just reacts in a very similar way to humans.
There's no point in torturing it anyways cuz it doesn't feel anything as it was shown to us in the beginning of the episode,the first AI(the lady) did not need to eat or sleep or anything else humans would need to do for survival so...
Think of it like a video game,a very realistic one.
@@geekysnak5436 We are a result of advanced coding technically.
Oh common I totally side with Joe.He might have deserved jailtime but not this hell.Someone should have told him the child isnt his,it wouldnt have led to his crime that on the side note he obviously felt incredibly remorseful of.If Beth blocked him that could have been enough of protection from his possible explosive reaction.I mean even if she felt like he could phyisicaly attack her the police in the whole world of the episode seems to be very strict.Yes he was nasty when he drunk,but he didnt seem to be an abusive person,the way he reacted to her unexpected pregnancy he seemed to be a good man essentialy.Her dad as well,could have coldly responded to him that the child isnt his and that he should keep away,and things would have played out differently.
Well, as much as I didn't like Beth, I disagree that he's not an abusive person. If he did nothing abusive before, he killed an old man and abandoned a little girl in the middle of nowhere on Christmas, just because it wasn't his kid. If it was his kid he would have taken her with him even if he killed the grandpa over some other argument. When things didn't go his way he attacked. When she said she didn't want to keep the baby he intimidated her by smashing the vase, when he found out it wasn't his kid he killed grandpa and eventually the kid. This is just being spoiled or he was abused the same way when he was a kid-who knows. All in all, he deserved a fair punishment and therapy but living hell for thousands of years by just one tap on the screen is inhumane. I bet the police didn't even think it was enough just because they couldn't process the idea of it and emphatize.
rumu dinc
He smashed the vase after she blocked him
HamsterMain It doesn't matter he still doesn't have the right to scare her like that. He could still hurt her.
rumu dinc
He throw it away from her at a wall, it wouldn’t have hurt her.
HamsterMain That's still scary if someone smashed something into the wall just because they got angry. That means they might hurt you and they're showing you that they can.
Are you forgetting Beth got very drunk despite being pregnant and then blocked Joe for the rest of her life just to hide her shame that she cheated.
Mathew even decides Joe is a good person when Mathew tells his two stories.
F Beth
I find it unfair that he wasnt even informed to at least move on with his life. In his mind, that the daughter he wouldnt never know. To be denied the truth about the situation for years is the real crime. If you want to leave some just tell them and make sure you allow them to move on. The murder would never had happened if he was told that he was someone elses kid at first. Maybe he would have moved to be find a happy relationship and fix his drinking habits up.
I agree that Beth is not the “lesser asshole” out of the two that this video tries to argue. But Matthew saying Joe was a good person means absolutely nothing; the _entire_ heart-to-heart between the two was Matthew manipulating the right response out of Joe.
@@ZhangK71 I was mainly looking at the fact that when you think you have kid and find out you have mislead, that would result it tempory madness to most of us. I guess the lesson of the story is women lie and black mirror is awesome to watch.
she got drunk despite being pregnant because she wanted to abort it anyway are you dense
This wasn't a horror episode... It was terror, pure terror. The feeling of helplessness and depression after this episode still lingers with me whenever I remember this episode. The writing was brilliant, the acting was also amazing.
On another note I'm glad the American actor has come back to do another few episodes, he does a good job selling the black mirror feeling.
Jon Hamm has only done one episode for Black Mirror?
Two most terrifying and disturbing things in the episode :-
1. Getting Blocked by the whole planet.
2. Getting sentenced in a personal hell for million years.
And both happened to the two main protagonists.
Neither of which deserved it...
Was just his cookie dw
@@zk2741the guy who got bloked by everyone kinda did deserve it
@@89kilemalwhich is just as worse since cookies are essentially just human beings but they are in a controlled environment
Definitely reminded me of an 80s episode of The Twilight zone I saw last year where the guy had a mark on him and no one was allowed to talk to him on pain of death so the guy was literally being ignored by the entire planet
Beth was 27 when she was pregnant and 32 when she died so the little girl was 5 years old when she died and it was 5 years he was stuck in the house, Beth’s death automatically removed the block so he was able to see his daughter now only to find out it wasn’t his, what a twist that’s more like Twilight Zone 😲
You forgot about the gestation period, but yeh OK...
Twilight Zone has NOTHING on this stuff, though!
@@BookieKillah i wanna read more...
that's not a twist ... that' a giant gaping plot hole ! . if the kid wasn't his , then there would be 100% no block and he would see .....
@@johnbrylledomingo6377 I agree. It only makes sense when she was pregnant he couldn’t see the child because the baby was still apart of her. Once she had the child he should have been able to see since it wasn’t his kid, that never made sense to me.
@@johnbrylledomingo6377 not necessarily, offspring could be referring to all of Beth’s offspring. That doesn’t necessarily mean that it has to be both of their offspring.
The concept of this made me think about it for quite a while. This is hell for everyone involved.
What you mean? Are you just talking about Mathew and Joe or?
You talking about Joe & Beth’s relationship reminds me of the _fact_ that the most dangerous time for someone in an abusive relationship, physical or otherwise, is the first 24 hours after they leave their partner. It’s so easy for people to say ‘just go’ but in reality it’s never that simple
If it was easy for her to block him an just go when she got pregnant by someone else than it should of been just as easy to leave if she wasnt happy
@@wyntahb3968 That's exactly what I was thinking.
Wyntah B it seems like blocking someone one only keeps them from seeing you and speaking to you but doesn’t stop them from physically touching you. Reminds me of a restraining or no-contact order here in North America, it will keep you “safe” to a point but if someone’s mad and wants to hurt you, they will.
Ashley Tupper That’s why I believe in lethal and non lethal self defense options.... like getting a cc for a gun or pepper spray among other things.
In a world where you can literally completely block someone from your life, there is absolutely no excuse for the shit she did. Fuck Beth to the moon.
Beth was a horrible person!
Come on bro. Don't defend her
He has to speculate and reach hard to justify her actions. If he was actually abusive toward her was just speculation in the end. We haven’t seen it, and he was rightfully angry when he found out that she wanted to abort it, and that the kid wasn’t his.
@@pathetic2399 He shown to been easily angry and explosive at time. I won't be surprise if he was abusive.
He is not rightfully angry when she wanted to abort it. It may be their child but she is the one carrying the pregnancy and giving birth.
Beth cheated but there are people who committed worse deeds. Be more forgiving all of us are flaw and we have to accept that. It is not as if Joe was any better.
All of those people could have done better but we are all flawed.
@@blugaledoh2669 Bro shit the fuck up, dont justify cheating, and a kid is the child of two people not one. The father should at least have a say in It. Fuck off
I'm bored even in 20 years of life, so I can't imagine living 1440000 years with non-stop annoying music. This was scarest thing ever I watched.
@Callum Booth nope, nothing is
Well, I would say he would go insane within a few hundred years so there's that to look forward to
Jennyfisch more like a week! Literally. They use music to torture people. You break fast
Straight up NIGHTMARE!!!!!
You're right..if this is hell, I'll go whatever religion there is that can prevent this from happening to me lol
I am against Beth because whatever happens you give your partner a explanation and what you want.
The other person always deserves explanation regardless of his temper. Here Beth left him in full darkness, he supposed to feel that she is blocking him from his own girl. If she told the truth or write a latter, he could move on.
learn how to spell
Exactly. The fact this video says he was the one in the wrong is revolting.
@@kh_qft762 He is wrong indeed. But this wouldn’t have happened if she would have given him an explanation. He deserves to know. Since he has a bad temper she could take him to the police station and then tell him the truth thereby preventing him to turn overly aggressive and harm her or her child. And by blocking him she was not only a coward but also a bad partner. So many lives were destroyed by just lack of communication. She seemed depressed as well on knowing that she’s pregnant with her colleague’s child. If she would have asked for some time and then later decide to let him know that would have worked as well.
@Nonaya Bidness he is in the wrong, but because Beth decided to be a coward her kid is now dead… if she just told him the truth it could’ve ended differently
No absolutely fucking not. You can't predict what he would have done had he known the truth. If your life is in danger you protect yourself. You don't try reason and potentially get yourself killed like Joe did with his father.
To everyone who's like like "but this wouldn’t have happened if she would have given him an explanation" YOU DON'T KNOW THAT.
It's sad what happened but like said in the video he was the root cause of their troubles in the relationship.
Beth always had the opportunity to tell Joe that she had cheated on him and that the baby was not his, even if it was through a letter, but she did not, because she was a coward, she only made Joe suffer for years. I'm on Joe's side
He killed a child
@@bbytiiayep, he sucks.
But she is still a pos regardless.
@@bbytiia are you hearing yourself ?
I agree with you Beth is a terrible person
@@bbytiiaDidn’t Beth literally douse a bunch of wine when she was pregnant and joe didn’t directly kill her, he just killed the pos father who was trying to kill him first.
Beth:Gets pregnant with what Joe assumes to be his kid
Hides it from him
Drinks alot to try and kill the kid
"Blocks" him so that he cant even talk to her or say anything(dodging any responsibility)
Joe: Throws vase at wall then sleeps on couch
Narrator: I sIdE mOrE wItH bEtH
Knight Reaper IKR, the guy who made this video is a f&cking tool
Narrator chooses Beth because he doesn't want to insult any snowflake feminazi or simp who spam #boycot on twitter when someone disagrees with them
and then everyone tries to convince themselves joe is abusive to beth when he’s clearly not🙄
@@TheBlashMusic ya he shouldn't have sided with her but jeez dude calm down its his opinion and you shouldn't come at him for that if you don't like the video stop wasting your time and go away don't start calling him "a f&cking tool" just for him saying hes taking beths side
@@foxyfox2252 you're right everyone's has an opinion. In my opinion, this guy is a f*cking tool. He even defended Fi on another video. What a knob!
Out of all BM episodes, this is the one I have the biggest problem rewatching. This might be the most elaborate, cruellest torture I've seen in film... Brilliant concept, horrifying implications...
This episode along with White Bear (would you look at that, the two episodes with "White" in the title..) are definitely the most nightmarish for me. Watching the boundless cruelty humans are capable of due to their ability of depersonalization and dehumanization of their targets... *shudder*
oh my god absolutely. those two episodes made me feel legitimately sick when i saw how much others enjoyed watching these people be tortured. i had to take a break from the show both times
@@darkangel4994 I mean, not far off with reality. People upload videos of people receiving their sentences when in court, the person gets the death penalty or life, and the comments section is pretty brutal. The videos are of the peoples reactions to receiving their sentences. The people in the comments section make fun of their reactions. Honestly, I liked White Bear.
@@rhojwayne6586 they all kind of disturbed me but Crocodile, Metal Head, and Black Museum.
But they killed children.
@@Luna-kb3sr Yeah... so? Just because someone acted like a monster, we are suddenly entitled to become monsters too...?
Seriously, the ability of people to justify cruelty scares me. The lynching mob we saw in White Bear was truly terrifying to me. It wasn't about punishment. These people were enjoying themselves, it was like a really fucked up theme park for them. It was entertainment. They stopped seeing the woman as a human being, she was completely dehumanized, an object, a toy to them. Her suffering was the source of entertainment. It was inhumane and disgusting - and her crime is irrelevant. Did she deserve punishment? Yes, absolutely. But that doesn't entitle us to cruelty, to act like absolute monsters. That would make us no better.
What's the most scary about that is that it happens all the time in real life, especially with the internet and its relative anonymity - maybe not quite to that extreme, but people are very quick to destroy someone's life when the mob decides that person is bad. The internet "justice" is scary.
The world building in Black Mirror is amazing, every story is different yet has all the same tech and references the same characters.
I really liked the dark futuristic episodes of Black Mirror
So you like all of them?
PowerOfTheC
Yeah lol
but there were some that were light hearted
I prefer the darker ones too!
5th season is only libturd propaganda
Creed Bratton smithereens was pretty good tho
Compared to Joe's sentence, it's easy to forget how bad Matt's fate is in this. He can only shop at self service checkouts and how could he live long term anyway? He couldn't call a tradesperson if he had issues with his house, plus he couldn't even work or claim benefits. The punishment far outweighed his misdemeanors, they should have just blocked him for a year
Now extrapolate that to the real world. Real sex offenders are effectively black listed from working.
My brother just died and we buried him today and I am drunk and your videos are helping me thank u rly and godblesd the internet and my brother
Im drunk too and i’m so sorry💜💜
I am sorry for your loss
I'm sorry for your loss, it has been a year i hope you're happy right now😊
I'm not drunk but I'm also sorry
but was she killed in the tragic train accident that happened in bandersnatch
OH SHIT
😱
No wth bandersnatch happened wayyy before
@@Otoskire how do you know? Haven't watched in ages and can't remember the details
skhturner bandersnatch takes place in a time when video games had really poor graphics and the tv had really poor quality based off of that and the way they dressed and their music bandersnatch is set way before the 2000s, while white Christmas is set obviously in the future where our technology gets out of hand
Bruh that last part is tortuuuuuuuure OMG
Taking the phrase "blocking you out of my life" quite literally
Beth was WRONG in this situation and could have told Joe the truth about her affair and who the father was. This was a tragic episode though. Beth, her father and daughter are all dead.
@Thawne yes i did uwu, how did u know😲😲😲
Her daughter was dead as well ? I thought Joe only killed the grand dad, and the little girl hid 😅😅😅😅😅
The little girl did not die. They used her as a way to get him to confess.
No, the daughter walked outside into the cold and froze to death@@sparklingfashion6276
I find it troubling how easily & quickly we all are to defend & even cheer on female toxicity. Beth was an awful person,no excuse for what she did. Both characters got way too harsh of a sentence I think.
THANK YOU. Simps like the narrator are stupid af
I will never defend such a thing, hail the patriarchy 🍷
Lmao she was abused u moron
I haven't found one comment that is on Beth's side.
She is the villain and her cowardice ruined lives.
@@MicahiLovethere are many Who tries to justify her actions under peoples comments as replys. They are using that she was abused and thats why she did what she did. I think its bullshit
I've been wondering why you hadn't done White Christmas yet even though you refer to it a lot in your other videos. Just realized you were saving White Christmas...for Christmas 🎄 😂
Smart😂
I think it’s almost impossible for someone to realize just how torturous this would be. Really quite scary if we could ever copy consciousness the things you could do.
But who cares if an AI thinks it’s real? It’s an AI. It’s not like a person
@@toptiertech7291 and that’s the ethical debate, this is why those ‘cookies’ are illegal now in season 4 premiere episode
@@toptiertech7291 Imagine if your consciousness was trapped in a machine. You think you are you, you feel you are you even though you actually are not. And you are put through this insanity. This is beyond terrifying honestly.
@@toptiertech7291if it’s sentient torturing it is immoral.
@@IAmTheRealUsopperGoddamnit but it’s not his conscious. It’s a copy. Your conscious stays with you. They just take a carbon copy of it and question it or torture it. That’s like saying you would get in trouble for printing out a picture of the Mona Lisa and drawing on it because the actual Mona Lisa is valuable
this episode haunts me in ways nothing else can. just trying to imagine all that time in a constructed hell is so chilling to me and i can't explain why :(
@Christopher Norris oh is it similar or something
Don’t read “I have no mouth but I must scream”
@@kevray damn now i want to, is it scary?
cat Pretty much the same thing as this episode. Doomed somewhere for eternity. That was the first time I read a story like that so it messed me up for a while, this story is pretty much the same so it didn’t scare me as much.
@@kevray thanks for the recommendation, even though its probably going to haunt me for weeks after reading, i still wanna read it :,) thanks! i'll keep u updated
Can't help but feel sorry for the chap.
He really wanted to be a father and his GF just blocks him instead of at least telling him the truth.
He still does whatever he can to be with his daughter who isn't even his.
He wasnt born a bad person. He snapped for one second after finding out what has been done to him.
He should've still been punished yes, but a hell loop for a thousand years is too much
This episode wasn't an eye-for-an-eye scenario, it was more like an everything-but-the-eyes scenario.
If the digital consciousness is called a "Cookie", could the physical device be referred to as a "Cookie Jar"?
Actually, when Matthew Trent explains things to Greta's digital copy, he said she's a simulated brain stored IN a cookie, she's just the code within...
the cookie is the chip not the device the chip is stored in.
@@daifudo8931 Yeh, the egg is just the container...
I was in a situation exactly like Joe. My ex girlfriend cheated on me and got pregnant. She didn’t tell me and she broke up with me. My mom ended up running into her at a store and say that she had a newborn baby, so I called her up. She said it wasn’t mine and I just assumed she was telling the truth. For all I know, that kid could be mine. She also blocked me on social media, so I can’t even see if he looks like me or not. Shit is rough, women really have a lot of power over men with that kind of stuff.
lol who cares
@@idrk3707 you commented on a post from over a year again. So obviously, you care. Dick.
@@idrk3707 ???
You deserve to find a better women beside dealing with that crap treatment from her.
Also try to get someone else from your family to follow her to truly know if that's your child.
2020 has become its own real life Black Mirror.
Indeed. A comparatively mild pandemic has exposed the Western world to a mere echo of the horrors of the past, and we've barely been able to cope. It shows how spoilt, entitled and unresiliant we've become.
If I was universally blocked, I'd commit more crimes. You can't identify someone you can't see, and going through all those who are universally blocked would be hard
I assume the police could see him without the block, but there wouldnt be any witnesses, thats for sure
With zed eyes I think it’s safe to assume that if the police needed to they could unblock the footage of a person
he will be in record definitely..so if he commits crime ,police can easily catch him as he was registered by the police and all his works were monitored by them..
Menace to society. Kinda dig it lol
The whole thing with Beth is made worse, because she blocked him, he can't even have a conversation with her, in real life, this would leave violence as essentially the only option left in that situation, and a lot of people would use violence to get the other person to listen since there is literally no other way. The fact that Joe didn't end up killing her actually says a lot about his character, and says very little good about Beth since rather than being honest and talking things through, she chooses to ignore it completely and betray everyone, even her own kid by not giving her a father (I think its implied she isn't later with the Asian guy).
The other option was to let it go or file a paternity suit. I'm flabbergasted that so many think murder or the stalking Joe did were the only options. And you're giving credit to someone who murdered 2 people, one being a child.
@@Rad200G2B I'm not saying he wasn't in the wrong, I'm more saying that I get it, having a kid that you think could only be yours, you'd most likely want to be there in any capacity. There's also no evidence he could have abused her because if he were going to, it would have been when she blocked him, because he had basically no other option of communication, even my ex at the time said that she couldn't believe he didn't just attack her, because being able to block people like that, effectively leaves violence as the only other option of communication. If they ever do this in real life, domestic violence and violence in general will skyrocket overnight.
She is the worst kind of person, all she had to do was tell him that it wasn't his kid, but she chose to be a piece of human garbage. And if that world is akin to real life, filing a paternity test may not have been possible, in a lot of places (France is a big one) the mother has to consent. A woman can literally just say no, and that she knows so and so is the father, and nothing else matters, and in a lot of cases, even when she's caught lying, it doesn't matter, the government will side with her and go after the guy she chooses if he makes more money because "best interest of the child".
@@ZenKrio You think a man that killed an elderly man and a child would've just taken it on the chin that his gf was pregnant by another man. The only reason he didn't kill Beth was because he thought she was the mother of his child. Once he found out he had no connection to that little girl it was fuck her and her granddad. Beth made the right choice. Joe was CLEARLY dangerous.
@@Rad200G2B Nah, it was more like what elderly man said set him off and was the last straw, going through all the pain he did and bottling it up only to have that be the last straw, a lot of people would have reacted in a terrible way, especially with the years of build up he had. I'm not saying Joe wasn't bad, but Beth was worse, she essentially tortured him and made him the monster that he eventually came to be...
I can say, having had an ex do something similar to me (except I AM the father), having someone essentially take you kid from you is a torture on a whole other level if you have any sort of empathy, finding out that kid isn't yours after ALL THAT TIME when she could have just told you after say, a few years when you've gotten over the break up but not losing your kid, he likely would have taken it with stride and walked away, but because she took the lie to her grave, he had to find out the terrible way he did. You also have to look at what happened in the end too, Joe was tortured now for what again? 3 Million years for his mistakes (again, caused from the torture of another person), whereas Beth got to live a perfectly happy life for essentially making the biggest cunt move a woman ever could? I would have killed Joe for what he did and put Beth in the house, because she essentially put him in that house for five years before the police did...
@@ZenKrio There's not argument you can make that'll have me sympathize with Joe after he killed that old man and little girl. All of a sudden the child stops being important once he finds out she wasn't his and let her starve to death. Black Mirror's conceit is we're still in our world but tech enhanced. Joe could've gone through legal means to see and verify the kid was or wasn't his kid. Beth cheated and left him without a word. Boo-fucking-hoo. Joe didn't know how to deal with his emotions without violence or drinking. Everything we saw of Joe before and after the breakup makes it understandable why she blocked him.
Better than Black Christmas was this year...
Congrats on 100K!!
CZsWorld
@@EE-jo5ptnobody cares😊
Being tortured for over 1 million years in solitary confinement has to be the worst outcome any one in black mirror has ever faced. After even 10 years of solitary confinement a person is pretty much garenteed to go insane and become sucidial but after over 1 million years it's likely that person has lost all their memories and even basic human understanding and wants talking, reading, writing or having a need for belongings, safety, achievement and many more things as probably after over 10000 years the tortured soul wouldn't even resemble a human as they had given up on their now meaningless existence.
Scarier thought, since it’s a computer program, there won’t be any degradation of mental capacity.
Yeah the program doesn’t sleep and retains all memories
I could understand the motivation of the 1 million years punishment if his own consciousness was transferred into the simulation but the cookie is a copy of Joe. The 'original' Joe is not suffering this punishment. This seems somewhat akin to creating a clone of a suspect, getting that clone to confess (presuming they have all the same memories) and then torturing the clone and giving the original person a less harsh punishment. Doesn't seem logical unless of course they've just becoming really sadistic.
Honestly sounds like they wanted to inflict pain on someone in any legal way that they could or something.
But even then 1 million+ years of punishment is beyond overkill and cruel, don't ya think?
@Zachary Ham yes you can its literally just 1 year times million 😐
Sadistic is the answer
@@kingkai2800 😂
When abuse is involved, leaving without a word is completely okay. (Not addressing the punishment....just the notion of blocking an abuser).
Like when she abused him by cheating and lying or abused her daughter by drinking while pregnant?
Creed Bratton it isn't abuse when it's a coping mechanism to another much worse abuse... she cheated because the guy was too much, and she was drinking not because she wanted to abuse the daughter (which, btw, isn't abuse at all) but because of her current emotional state... if the guy was a bit more chill and did not abuse her emotionally, she wouldn't have even done what you said she did...
@@Vekcrazah if the roles were reversed you's say he was abusing her, it's so common for some peopke to justify female's bad behavior, like if for being women they wouldn't be able of harming.
@@Vekcrazah Cheating on someone is far worse than getting a bit too drunk sometimes lol
Creed Bratton if the roles are reversed, i'd see the same thing... what are you on about?
I don't know if it was intentional but the series made me think about how women sometimes take advantage of the fact that they are the ones physically giving birth even though it takes two people to make a child. It was so frustrating to watch Beth blocking her boyfriend from not just her but also the child that could have been his. There was no way of knowing for sure that that child wasn't his but the Z-eye technology put an automatic block on it. And it doesn't seem to matter that he could be (or in Matthews case- WAS) the father of that child. WHAT THE HELL IS UP WITH THAT? A child has two parents- one of them shouldn't be able to singlehandedly block the other out from its life... Do you think that if a husband blocked their wife, his child would also be automatically erased from her view? Probably not.
I think it shows that fathers are considered to be lesser parents for some reason.
Imo it's an exaggerated version of what we have in our reality. Women are perceived as those responsible for children, therefore society expects from them to care about kids, often demanding from mothers way more than from fathers. It hurts both sides - guys who can feel alienated from their own kids, and girls who feel overwhelmed with such incredible amount of responsibility. I think black mirror shows us exaggerated version of this, so we can notice how unequal roles our society gives to parents. That women are given more rights over child, but are as well expected to focus their life on offspring, while man's rights and responsibilities can get minimized. If we want to avoid future like in black mirror, we should cope with this problem we have now.
it's women decision only, period
@@mariame9838 cool, so if a girl got pregnant and wanted to keep the kid and the guy didn't, he could just up and left because according to you, it's an individual decision made only by women. seems fine to me.
mariame if the two parents are in a Serious long term relationship, or maybe even married, the husband AT LEAST deserves an explanation as to why the women isn’t keeping the baby, Beth didn’t even explain to joe why she didn’t want to keep the baby, even if it’s a “women decision only” what Beth ddI was wrong, and she was terrible for what she did to him with no explanation.
Also, when he tried to contact her with the block thing, she got it enforced by the courts.
The cookie concept is terrifying and intresting at the same time
Felt bad for Joe. Beth cheated on him, didn’t tell him what was up and made him believe he had a daughter and so his actions were understandable that he didn’t move on. Then although it’s not right that he killed her father, you can understand thinking you’ve had a daughter for 5 years and then suddenly it’s taken away from you just like that for you just to explode in confusion and anger.
This was def 100% the best episode
Nope. Black museum is!😏
Ye this episode, white bear, shut and dance and sun junipero are the best episodes
The analysis is amazing but I can't believe the narrator sides with Beth when she's the one who originally caused every tragedy. She cheated on him, refused to communicate even a word with him, blocked him. Joe threw a vase into the wall and slept on the couch - now he's reckless ??? Could she just break up with him when she was actually in love with someone else, instead of cheating on him for a long time and staying fucking silent about her kid, not their kid ? If she could just be honest and not that of a cold bitch, her father and her kid would've never died
He's just simping. He even said that the guy she cheated with was "probably" the reason why she kept quiet, with no evidence as to why they would be
She blocked him ffs, a lot of people would act like that
True sometimes you have to tell the truth no matter what! My ex was crazy and wanted to treaten my brother with a gun. I told a neighbor and called the police and told them he was mentally ill. Cause he is and I'm glad I did it, I have no regrets. We ended up breaking up a few days later. It was for the best he reckless and crazy. But sometimes even when things get crazy you have to allow it to happen so you can move on in your life.
Cope, incels.
@@paradice6470 Where did he get a gun from? How did a mental I'll man get his hands on a gun?
I disagree with Mathew's punishment, I feel like they should've made it also he can't access the eye link anymore and probably gave him community service for next few years.
The fact he is blocked by everyone is insane, that'll drive him into insanity and probably do drastic things.
It's not justice, it's cruel
The saddest and unwatchable moment for me was when the little girl had to survive and left in a blizzard .. I love this episide and as such all of Black Mirror but this moment just disturbs me .. anyone else who agrees?
yes that broke my heart
Anyone else realize that the little girl probably didn't freeze to death in the snow? I missed it until just now!
I just re=watched "White Christmas" again for the first time in a couple years and something I'd totally missed before clicked! Only the grandfather had been murdered - not the little girl! He only knew what they had told him about here - that she had stayed in the house until Boxing Day (Dec 26) then went out for help and froze to death. Yet when they leave the simulation on it's "over Christmas" - and she wishes him a Merry Christmas in his cell. Telling him the little girl had died was part of getting him to confess, but it's quite possible that she was simply found at the house.
I had never noticed the this previously, but they really stressed that he only knew what they had told him when it came to what had happened to the little girl!
That’s so true! Why hadn’t i thought of that!
No, part of joe's narration was that after he murdered the father and left the house, he spent "months sleeping on the streets" before someone found him and brought him to the police station. Which means its been basically a year since the crime happened. So the little girl died in Dec 26 and Joe's cookie confessed around Dec 24 one year later.
They said they’ve been questioning Joe for 2 years
If you dont like someone anymore, then leave. Nothing justifies cheating behavior. Cheating person is always on the wrong side
Made Ari she was scared of him. He’s definitely the wronger side lol
@@cbb3480 No. Break up with him first then. Like he said, nothing justifies cheating
Naqi Zariz Not the point I was making. I didn’t say it was okay, but then again, I also wasn’t talking to you 😂
Fay Rasmuson That’s actually what I just said I wasn’t saying I don’t get where it looks like I said that 😂😂
@@cbb3480 i see now
one of the best episodes in the entire series
Beth is the true villain of this episode. No justification for her whatsoever.
She took the childish route and wouldn’t tell him that the child wasn’t his. It wasn’t about abuse, she dropped him from her life because he threw a vase, she would’ve dropped him earlier if there was abuse towards her. She left because she couldn’t own up to her mistake of cheating on him.
Imagine misleading a person for years that they have a child and not even telling them. Be an adult.
Yeah which is why communication is important I hated her so much she took childish route
Yea that was some bullshit
really???
@@corrinaamato8805 yes, really. i thought it was clear without even needing to watch this weird video explanation that sided with beth, when in truth beth was ultimately the one who caused all of this. what's not to understand?
@@panduadikara9078 Beth did not cause this, joe isn't animal who lacks self control. Is she culpable of being a terrible person yes but is she the cause of a crime no.
Her lack of communication had them killed
No, his impulsiveness got them killed. I hate Beth for what she did, but you're acting like he had no other choice because of her behaviour. She is not responsible for his actions.
@@DwynTwo she is though in so many ways. Think about your most beloved person in the world blocking you and never spoke to you again and after sometime, died and you found out that person hid something very important from you. Do not underestimate a person snapping.
@@eugenetorres4975 It was still HIS doing, not hers. She didn't make that decision, he did. It's 100% his fault. People being shitty to you doesn't justify shitty actions.
@@DwynTwo no one's saying that what Joe did at the end was right. But it was clearly pushed to that direction cause of what Beth did. You can blame him for what he did with Beth's father and daughter but I can also blame Beth for what she did to him. Cause and effect
@@eugenetorres4975 Still disagree. He caused it. The perpetrator always causes it with his unstable mind. You can literally use this logic on anything. Woman bumps into man who has a bunch of mental issues and doesn't say sorry, so he stabs her 20 times- cause and effect?
Joe didn't kill the dad because she pushed his buttons. Plenty of people get pushed, and they don't end up killers. He killed him because that's his character; losing self control and murdering a person because of lots of stress. That's him reacting to the situation this way. You could argue that Beth caused it a little bit if she literally saw the future and knew this would happen, but still behaved that way, and even then the main blame would still be on him for being a person who kills people when he's being treated bad.
Beth is the true villian here. She cheated on him and run away like a coward and blocked him.
Didn't you listen to what the guy just said?
@@haraldsemmellauchcheating on your partner isn’t a good thing. His logic is flawed
@@harmankang6883 yes but the guy did far worse things
Yeah and he's mostly wrong@@haraldsemmellauch
@@ethandonaldson4306 What the F are talking about. NO. She was plain wrong. I hope a man you love goes through this so you can see how evil woman can be.
Beth cheated, had another man's baby and blocked a life of her partner instead of telling him the truth and allowing him to move on. Not sure how I can side with that especially since on the other side we have a man who shown nothing but love for her throughout the episode, drunk too much at a party I guess and showed no signs of abuse towards Beth.
no excuse for murder you incel
@@justinhamilton8647 You idiot. Thank god you dont matter and if anyone woman did this to me trust me I would get my revenge
After this episode, I need psychiatrist.
You also need the word 'a'...
@@BookieKillah I forgot, everyone on our planet is native english speaker.
@@martinaskupin9549 Apologies, I shouldn't post comments if I haven't properly woken up, I forgot I'd even said that;
What nationality are you, just out of interest?
@@BookieKillah I don´t think, that not using "a" is such a crime. You understand, what I wrote, right? I am Czech. And I never studied english language on university.
@@martinaskupin9549 I did say sorry...
(...and it's 'IN university'... :P)
Czech, you say - coincidence, I was just listening to the 2nd part of New World Symphony by Dvořák just this morning...
To me this is the worst form of cruelty, torture in an extreme way. The fact that people would do that to someone, even if to deal punishment, speaks to a lack of humanity, empathy and being worse than those you are trying to punish, essentially making it sort of a contradiction. Just because you do it in the name of punishment doesn't make it right. It's sad that we aren't aware enough to see this shadow aspect of ourselves, because we justify it. Just like there is evil in wrong-doers, there is evil in you, and when you punish these people like that you are expressing that same evil capacity. That's why it's ironic, and just as wrong. We definitely need punishment of some form, if not to make them learn then at least to make sure they can't keep doing it, but there is no need to be excessively cruel.
Cruelty will just make more of us lose our humanity and lack of empathy, and ultimately won't do anything to right the wrong done by the guilty. You could argue they need to feel the pain they caused, and the affected of the victims need justice, but this will just be something to feed our egos to feel better, it won't actually change what was done or even make those who did it do better. Yes, I'm very against torture, or when punishment gets more cruel than necessary. The important part is really to keep them from doing it again, and the second part is teaching a lesson. But what is the point of that part if they don't actually learn it and get to ever do better? Then we are just teaching a lesson to teach one, it's so we can feel "That will show him", much like parents smacking their kids as punishment, and not actually teaching a lesson for those people to do better- ultimately benefiting the wrong-doer (growth, be better) and us (no more wrong-doer, maybe even good-doer, a plus for society).
Your right, I have a hard time with what your saying but really I admire you wanting to take the high road. It's hard not want to see someone punished if they nearly destoryed you. However I'm learning to not let the memories of tragic events in my life affect me so severely. I think it's the aftermath of someone who has been wronged that does the most long term damage. I try these days to not give it power or life because when I see it manifesting it scares me. It's hard not to fantasize on getting revenge but I do understand that this isn't the way. I know I need therapy and I feel that will help move past it. I want to never be as curel as those that wronged me. Being good is sometimes the hardest thing but it's the smarter thing to do in the long run.
This episode is so unfair to me, he did not deserve this hell. Beth plays the victim but she CHEATED and then leave
7:32 Nah beth was awful and “being afraid” is not a good enough excuse to then drive someone insane and to accidentally kill people- she’s responsible for his craziness cause she can’t just communicate with him
Bro not being able to see or talk to anyone at all would be terrifying
My question is how would he be able to order food or buy stuff if he's always blocked out
I think the punishment for not reporting a murder is death by starvation. I would took 5-10 years in jail instead of that.
supermarket?
Self serve checkouts
i dont side with beth at all for one simple fact, why let him think this is his child and block him, she is rational when it comes to leaving her fiancee but to lead him on then randomly dump him is definitly what lead to the tragedies that came later, as she could have simply broke up with him and told him the kid wasnt his and he would havr lost interest instead of being lead on
and to people blaming the guy she cheated with saying he kept her silent, she still chose to keep the baby
I rewatched this ep yesterday to celebrate 🎄 with some peace & quiet for an hour. This review was the perfect surprise today! Spot on as always. Thanks!
I liked this episode but one question. He said you can't see your offspring right? The baby wasn't even his then how was he blocked from her?
Adnan Ahmad I think he meant her offspring
9:50 had to listen to that a few times just to make sure I heard it right 😅
your black mirror explained videos are so entertaining! I usually cant watch these kinda shows on my own so listening to the behind of it with you explaining it is my cup of tea haha!! feels like im not alone and helps me comprehend. i appreciate all your work and effort!!!! 😊😊
My only thing that I’m wondering is why was the kid blocked from Joe. They said you can’t see your offspring which is why he went crazy and pretty much caused his downfall. But since it wasn’t his genetic offspring shouldn’t he have been able to see her?
Damn never realized that! Plot hole?
@@AdiCruise207 I just thought about it. Probably since she gave birth to it, it doesn't matter who the father was. He probably still couldn't see it since it was her baby idk tho
I just wanted the episode, but I can't remember if they said you can't see your offspring or their offspring. Either way, I don't think the Z-eyes tech uses DNA to determine who to block. I assume the child's birth certificate says they are Beth's child, and possibly Joe's as well, but I doubt that. I assume the Z-eyes technology looks at some registry to determine who Beth's children are and blocks them from Joe as well, at least that is what seems most logical to me.
@@MrHawkeye41what I assume is whoever the mother blocks her child will also see the same person as blocked doesn't matter if it's the biological father or any other person. Either way it was a great episode. Probably the best
Correct. And Joe can’t see HER kid
If Beth had just confessed to Joe then her father and daughter would likely still be alive. That decision was rooted in cowardice and selfishness.
Um no, the one at fault is Joe. HE was the one who murdered her father and left the child to die.
@dance 100 no doubt he should spend years in prison! But 1 million years. That’s an immeasurable degree of cruelty.
@GrassCannibalshe didn't murder a kid 💀, are you good? He murdered the dad, by accident by the way, who also deserved it. And he doesn't deserve a million years in hell. In your own words, "be responsible for your actions", beth shouldve taken accountabilty she was selfish and deserving of a worse punishment than real joe. Society and the government just sided witn her because they thought joe was abusive. They didnt see the full picture. It's feminine toxicity.
out of all the episodes black mirror has done this is the only episode that actually gave me sleepless nights. its been 5 days now and all i can still think about is this episode. I've never felt so profoundly disturbed by a single episode ever. i hope it subsides soon,
Yeh, some TV programmes should have some kind of warning right at the beginning, or something...
@@BookieKillah most shows do. My comment is an observation on how the episode made me feel. Nothing to do with warning regulations. Move on idiot.
You missed one thing, Bryce... Tim, quite oddly, said that "no one knows where she is..." even though the question was not asked. He's manipulating the situation. He knows what's up, and he wants Joe to run into a wall in his search...
8:40 that "something melancholy" is also a call-back to 15 Million Merits. it's the same song Abi Khan sang on Hot Shot
Sumair Bawa song is also in Crocodile
Song is also in Men Against Fire
I would love a White Christmas 2!
Only if it revisits Joe’s fate though.. would he still be sane? Would he be some omnipotent-being content with his ongoing situation after how many years??
Would Matt see Joe as useful and break him/ his consciousness out somehow?
To be honest he could watch movies and listen to music from people who died because the block would be canceled and we know this takes place in the future he could watch some movies and songs from today
But it is a horrible fate
Plot twist: Joe discovers unified field theory and Matthew has to try to get it out of him. xD
white christmas was easily my favorite episode of the entire show. it gets you really thinking about the extent of technology
If Beth had never done what she did, Joe would never have had the opportunity to do what he did.
yeah fuck beth lol
some blaming women for men’s mistakes
@@denetria2329 Oh please, she was a terrible person for not telling him the truth. No wonder he went crazy. If she had woman'd up and just told him that the baby wasn't his instead of blocking him out and making him believe he had a child with her all those years.
@dedede feedldee dee he was not abusive to her. So he threw a fucking vase lol. He never touched her. Beth is a terrible person for doing what she did without an ounce of guilt. She not only cheated but she also gave him no answers as she fled like a coward.
@@denetria2329 yeah because you know joe told her to get piss drunk and fuck her friends bf at the same house. Its a shitty thing to do how she went about it. Had a female friend do this to someone had her back mind you however i straight told her she's shit for it. Its nothing to be real and honest.
Matthew's punishment for his crimes is too much considering the only intentional thing he did was not reporting a murder, that's just crazy to me
I would never hurt a fly, but if my significant other blocked me or muted me in an argument I think I would go on a killing spree 😂 it just seems so extremely frustrating.
Earthling I would be so fuckin pissed. Like imagine getting pregnant and then blocking someone and legally being able to take away the baby. I m surprised he didn’t kill that bitch
Hannah X exactly
So its all humans no flies?
@@hannahx9322 yes, and the her dad was also at fault because he didn't let beth see his letters
I don't think you have the right to say you "wouldn't hurt a fly" anymore
Beth is the reason all of that shit happened, she led her daughter and father to their death and led him to where he is. If she just broke up with him and told him that the kid wasn’t his! She literally just let him believe he had a kid and let him develop strong emotions for a piece of him that didn’t even exist!!! That’s harsh.
And about the block thing, I hated the idea that the block covers the offsprings as even if it’s the father! Like wtf those are his kids! What if he blocks the wife, does the block cover the kids from her too or it only works that way for the fathers!!?
Did anyone notice oona chaplin(the girl whose cookie was made to make her do chores for her real self) she is charlie Chaplin's granddaughter and also played the role of rob Stark's wife in game of thrones
She’s very lovely ❤
This is one of my top 3 favorite Black Mirror episodes.
This episode did an amazing job of seamlessly working in multiple different technologies into an incredible story with complex characters and doing it all in less time than a typical movie
Explanation is pretty stupid considering that Beth's actions led to his escalating behaviour.
After all, he thought she stole his kid and never told him about it. From his prespective he had every right to be angry regardless of his other character flaws.
The scene where Joe, actually cookie joe says its barbaric the way they treated Gerta's cookie and he (the cookie) had to suffer a much worser fate. It's just very amusing and disturbing at the same time.
This episode proves that plain and simple communication is SO important. Tim was a true asshole for just letting him go after he was looking for Beth knowing something was wrong. Had this reality be true, I would have gone straight to therapy.
Man, i completely disagree with you about Joe in the 3rd story.
Joe was good to her, and even though, he was characterized as drinking too much or not being able go hold his liquor, he loved and cared for her.
And its not fair to judge Joe because he threw a pot! He was angry that she wanted to abort “their” baby with no explanation, and then block him for seemingly no reason.
Even though Joe ended up in prison for thousands of years, Bethany is the one that died, the ultimate payment for sins.
I am so curious to see what Joe's cookie would look like after spending 1.4 million years in complete isolation with that playlist on repeat
I love how Jon's character is talking to Oona's Cookie as if she's a real human, using gestures, conversational and informative; just as he told her she's not real, just a copy of a real person. It's like deep down he knows her Cookie is a human no matter if she's stuck in a plastic egg.
He's knowingly torturing these simulated bits of data, knowing that they think they're real, and behave like a real person would if they knew they were imprisoned; not wanting to obey their captor, trying to escape, then resigning to the fact they're stuck, after they've experienced the harsh punishments given by their captor.
Also, how it's shown that being a disembodied voice isn't what the Cookie wants, they want to be as human as they were in the real world. If they weren't real, they wouldn't care about being in a cage. Just like how Siri doesn't care (that we know of).
This is my absolute favourite episode and I’m so, so excited to watch this! I only just realized last week you hadn’t actually done a video for this episode yet, it just ties in to so many other episodes it’s impossible not to bring it up when talking about the rest of the series. Enough babbling, now to watch, nod along and most likely learn something new
Edited to add: Great video!!
Everybody here talking about Joe but Mathew's punishment was waaay more serious than his crimes
well, 3 months of independent quarantine drives me a little crazy. I can't imagine being Joe
15:51 This made me realize something. At a certain age, would the block automatically be removed for their child? Or would the child never be able to see the blocked parent again? What if the child wants to see their blocked parent before they reach that age? I could see lots of potential future episodes if the child can't remove their parent's block.
Arkangel goes into that problem. Kid has some stuff that blocks anything stressful. Starts to get weird for her when she can walk herself to school but a barking dog is a silent, blurry shape.
3:56-Alao when told about Greta, Joe says something like “that’s terrible” and Matthew says something like, “interesting”.
I just think it’s neat that Joe “empathizes” with Greta’s situation and Matthew notices it.
It also goes to show that maybe Joe isn’t as bad as one would think.
I mean, yeah. He’s just a regular dude. He’s abusive ex and a mean drunk but that doesn’t mean he’s okay with slavery and torture. He needs therapy and AA.
@@DeathnoteBB he was NOT abusive
@@Milk88488 I mean he kind of was?
@@DeathnoteBB he wasn’t abusive to Beth in the slightest. Considering she’d basically told him that she was going to kill their child (which wasn’t even his) and block him, thereby not even giving him a say in a matter this serious (and a matter which should be a joint decision between a couple under the circumstances they found themselves in), he was completely within his right to be furious and smash the vase, but he still didn’t lay a finger on Beth. It’s unfair to say he was abusive towards her, especially considering how emotionally abusive and malicious she was towards him.
@@jamespoole3531 ...by kill their child do you mean get an abortion?