Camping here is ILLEGAL? | Don't Trespass Kayak or Canoeing
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- Don't ruin a great trip by trespassing while camping on a river bank. Use this video as a guide on finding campsites and legal places to camp.
American Whitewater Navigability Guide to Missouri
www.americanwh...
Missouri Conservation info on trespassing
mdc.mo.gov/fis...
Info on Meramec incident
www.columbiatr...
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Speaking as a land owner along a scenic waterway in WA state, and a life long camper.
This is all correct and good advice.
Good to know! Every state is a little different.
When in doubt, have more guns than the land owner 😂 (that's a joke for those who didn't get that). Great video!
🤦♂️
I learned this many years ago when I use to be a member of the LDS church. We would go camping all over the USA. I agree it is important to know the law and they can sometimes change from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. For instance, I have been speaking a lot at my local preparedness classes about the importance of understanding River Rights. Whether you are kayaking or fishing from a kayak on a river that may be adjacent to private property, the law in some cases state you need the permission from the land owner, but that was cleared up in the supreme court that Rivers, Lakes or coastal waters that are owned by the government is next to private land that may run underwater, than the government effectively has an easement to it. In some cases tidal areas are also treated this way.
Again, thank you for your very informative content. Your channel I believe will get the attention of many outdoor enthusiast that love kayak, small boating along the river. And be equally important for those that may from time to time have to portage certain land areas to get to the next waterways. Thank you OMC
Hope it helps even one person avoid a conflict or trespassing ticket
This is a very good explanation that I myself was not exactly clear on. I am a land owner myself (don't live on it full time) in Missouri that has not only river front access but also is adjacent to a conservation area. Fortunately it is not on one of those more famous rivers that receives alot of floating/kayaking and the bank of the river is a bit too steep and a large cliff on parts of it and overgrown w vegetation for anyone to really camp there. The only problem w trespassers I have had is with the conservation itself doing controlled burns that sometimes burns a few acres of my land wo notifying me beforehand. Thankful for that but it does seem a bit "rude". Looking forward to more of your informative videos
Glad it was helpful! More videos incoming for sure.
I have seen this issue from both points of view. People spend a lot of money on river front properties and they dont want piles of trash left behind and people camping on their land. And I have seen it as a paddler looking for a last ditch place to camp. On the more popular rivers you can expect property owners have heard every plea and excuse under the sun of why paddlers are on their property so asking for forgiveness over permission will likely not work here. Some of the more isolated stretches with minimal traffic a property owner may be a bit more willing to work with you for a night or emergency stop.
From the paddlers perspective it can be hard to find a "great spot". All too often paddlers are looking for that 5 star experience of view, level ground, water adjacent etc. People will pass up perfectly good spots in hopes of something better aka the perfect spot. If you find yourself pushing darkness and need to stop there are a couple things you can do to minimize exposure. Check gps maps to see if there are any houses near by. Dont set up your tent until after dark and dont start a fire. Keep any lights very low or use red lights. Make minimal noise and be prepared to leave first thing in the morning. This is also known as Stealth Camping and is not always legal.
Finally, if a property owner is being aggressive its best to leave. You wont sleep well knowing they are angry with you and can reappear at anytime. They may make your night awful on purpose. Property owners can have a lot of past frustration built up from trespassers and you dont want to be the one they finally snap on.
Planning is key!
good topic, dont see a lot of people discussing this important issue
😁
I live in Oregon, and for the most part, the state government
has protected peoples rights to be on the water and on land adjacent to the water.
Also luckily, we have several large rivers that we can navigate and camp along, including a 137 miles River trail.
All that being said, if confronted by a land owner, I would personally leave and avoid the conflict. Contact the authorities later and file a complaint.
Not a bad suggestion at all.
Most counties have a GIS Parcel Viewer online where you can determine fairly accurately where public lands are. Those waypoints in a handheld GPS are really handy.
Facts.
I love the Current River and have stopped at that exact gravel bar several times.
The Current is amazing isn't it? That gravel bar is magic, but not a great campsite unless you like trash pandas and paying $200/night for a group site...
I believe Georgia has very different laws.
My brother and sister in law were on that float
Oh, no! I hope they're well and weren't in danger from that.
Good advice!
Glad it was helpful!
I actually I no idea about this. Thank you
I have a CPL and carry a handgun specifically for kayaking/fishing. I also carry pepper spray. Boat ramps and over zealous land owners are a "thing." Pre trip planning and common sense needs to be a "thing" too. You poop on my sandbar, I might get more than sh3,#y. 😂
Where's your sandbar? 🤔jk jk 😂😂
If they pull a gun, I move on.
1956 State versus elderly v law Missouri look it up
Huh?
"I do have extensive experience when it comes to trespassing" LOL
My wife and I cringed when we listened to that! I was unwilling to re-record it. My day job has had me planning/implementing security at army corps of engineers campgrounds in high tourism areas.
@@OzarkMediaCo That's OK, I, too, am well experienced in "Tresspassing". It turns out that in WY, Land Owners OWN the ground under the "Water", which is the opposite of in WI. In WI, if you keep your feet wet, you're 99% of the time, "good to go".
That's exactly what an easement is, right? It belongs to the landowner, but is accessible or usable for certain reasons to the public when so big something lawful, typically travelling.
@@OzarkMediaCo I don't think it's the same as an Easement, but I'm no lawyer.
It depends on the Jurisdiction, but An "Easement" would suggest that the Land Owner OWNS the land under the water (not the case in WI) but accepts that as long as the "Traveler" stays IN the water, they're allowed free use, as long as it's "Navigable".
I guess you're just best off taking your Atty with you when you go. AND make sure that He's well versed in the Law and well armed for your Protection, LOL.
Living and having been kayaking. The current in jacks fork River in southern Missouri for almost my entire life. I highly discourage you from camping on an island in the middle of the river because you never know when the water level will rise
This is a video about where it's legal to camp, not selecting an ideal campsite. If you're weather aware, you can easily camp an island on the Jack's, Current, Eleven Point, Buffalo, etc.
Look up the Riparian Rights Act of Missouri. It says navigable rivers are public property up to the normal high water mark. Many gravel bars are clearly within that range, and are public property. I agree there is some grey area there, where gravel bars that only get wet during large floods and are further up the bank, are probably not public because they are above that normal high water mark, but neither Missouri nor Arkansas have western water law (land owners own stream bottom and the water flowing over it). So, be careful what you say here. Yes I know there have been incidents, and many Ozark landowners make their own laws anyways, but people who leave litter and make too much noise have spoiled things in recent years.
Thanks! I quoted it in this video. I didn't mention any laws by statute or name to avoid jargon/mystifying the viewer.
I grew up in Missouri and got spoiled with high water marks and national scenic and wild rivers. I now live in Georgia where they also do land owners own the riverbed to the center line of the river. So if you can float it you're legal, but wading and getting out and stopping is illegal. I wish Georgia would switch to high water mark laws.
You live in one of the fun states for these purposes, lucky.
In Ohio, land owners on either side of the river bank have property rights to the center of the river.🥺
There are still places on given rivers where one can get away with camping somewhat discretely but you're always operating cautiously in grey areas.😩
Great video, really enjoying your content so far.👍
MO generally has laws I find quite agreeable.
good way to get buried by the river
What is?
Private property is Private property!! Everything else is free to use. There is no such thing as State or Federal property.
Tell the state and Feds that...
I 'think' (/hope) I know what you intend to mean here, government-owned property being 'privately owned by the government', but for all intents and purposes (including legally, I believe), 'private property' is only property that is NOT owned by the government and is instead owned by an individual or corporation.
I'd bet there is NO land (at least in the US) that is 'everything else' as you call it, that is, not owned by someone.
That being said, not all government property is publicly free to use (ie, military installations, etc), but parks definitely are--tho even those are subject to closure sometimes.
I knew there would be at least one of these here. 🙄
@NotALizardPerson81 according to the Constitution the government shall own no more than 10 square miles of land
@@oo7-ro6bu again 🙄