Highest Proof, Lowest Price - Who's The Best Value?
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- Опубликовано: 10 мар 2022
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Take the price of a bourbon, divided it by the proof, and you'll get the price per proof, or the P3 as we call it. We thought this was an interesting experiment to test if high proof, low priced bottles are really a deal or if it's more of a "you get what you pay for" type of thing.
We decided for this go around to only consider Bourbons 110 proof and above. You can do our equation on some 100 proof bottles and get some really low P3 ratings, but the whole point of this experiment was trying to find that lowest P3 with the highest proof.
Would you want to see this treatment done with any other bottles? Let us know!
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What do you think of our P3 formula?
I haven’t tried Benchmark Full Proof yet, but you can’t go wrong with OGD 114, Rare Breed or 1792 Full Proof. All bangers!
1792 is one of my go to
Rare Breed - because it's the only cask strength bourbon that's available and somewhat reasonably priced on this side of the pond.
Happy to see y'all mention the comparison bias aspect of all this. I've had great evenings sipping _insert-mid-shelf-here_ and never even given a rip that it wasn't Stagg or EHT, or whatever. Most bourbon (not all, there's definitely horrid stuff out there) is actually pretty good. Don't sell a bourbon short because you didn't have to pay crazy secondary prices or drive 300 miles to find it. A bottle of Wild Turkey 101 (or rare breed), EW BIB, or anything similar is almost guaranteed to give you a good evening. And whether you have a top or mid shelf bottle, trust me, it'll taste better if you're sharing it with friends. Cheers,
Absolutely this.
Exactly. Most of my drinking is in the mid-level range. After 1 or 2 drinks your pallet is muted enough where you can't really appreciate a super complex bourbon. So I save the top shelf for drink 1 or maybe 2 of the night, and only when I have time to really savor, and then move to the B stuff where I can drink happily.
@@lilannalucey you mean you first drink 2 high quality drinks and then continue with lowest quality ones?
@@sowhat... Exactly. If I'm pouring one of my best bottles, I want to really enjoy it. It's why I paid the money and/or hunted for it. Once I'm 4+ drinks in, why waste the best stuff when I can't fully appreciate it? So I move to the next shelf down. The things I still really like, but aren't unicorns or something irreplaceable.
On the P3 metric… I like it, and perhaps one of the missing factors is age. The higher the age on a whiskey, the more expensive the proof point. But I have another theory… call it the Mayfield Added Water Theory. Hear me out.
On proof in general, bourbon lovers obsess over it. It is a proxy for quality… but what we care about is not so much the proof itself, but added water. When it comes to the proof in the bottle, that is a function of two things, barrel entry proof, and angel share (water lost during aging, increasing proof). It is more economic to go into the barrel at a higher proof. Why? Because consumers care so much about proof that the more ethanol you can put in the barrel, the more you get out. Does this lend itself to flavor? Not really.
In 1962, the maximum legal barrel proof changed from 110 to 125. What happened in the industry? Most distillers pushed it to the limit. Jim Beam, Heaven Hill, and Brown-Forman go in at 125 for everything. Buffalo Trace goes in at 125 for its rye-containing mash bills, but interestingly, only 114 for its (highly regarded) wheated mashbills. Four Roses and MGP go in slightly lower at 120. Maker’s Mark is a holdout at 110 proof and Wild Turkey has slowly upped their entry proof from 105 to 107 to 110 to 115. Given their druthers, the Russells would prefer to go in at 105, but they have Campari telling them to pump up the entry proof, so 115 is a compromise.
The reason is pure economics. If you want to make a 90 proof product, you can fit a whole lot more product in a single barrel by going in at a higher proof and watering down after aging. The vast majority of product will eventually get proofed down (a pleasant term for adding water). So there is a drive for higher entry proofs.
Some of those dusty Wild Turkey 101 bottles that sell for a bajillion dollars today are very close to being barrel proof at 101 proof. Now chew on that… less water = more flavor. It is the added water we care about, not the proof (in my humble opinion, of course).
The second factor is the aging environment. MGP goes in at 120, but most barrel proof MGP ends up at 115 because of their warehouse construction and humidity. Wild Turkey can drop in proof as well, again depending on where the barrel is stored. Meanwhile, Old Forester is heat cycling their warehouses almost guaranteeing increases in proof with age. I can’t think of a barrel proof Buffalo Trace product that ends up below entry proof. I am sure it happens, but I’d bet it’s rare. Heaven Hill released Elijah Craig Barrel Proof B521 at 118.2 and it was Armageddon. That stuff was guilty until proven innocent. Most ECBP’s clock in near 130.
So basically, a proof point for one distiller does not equal a proof point for another distiller. My two favorite distillers are MGP and Wild Turkey and both go in below max barrel entry proof and both have a tendency to maintain or drop proof with age. Perhaps flavor per proof point is something that bourbon lovers should contemplate?
I like all these that I’ve had(haven’t had the benchmark). I wish old forester 1920 had a price point closer to these! Of these(that I’ve had), I gotta say rare breed takes it for me!!!
I can get 1920 for cheaper than I can get the 1792 full proof, at least by me. They're both expensive. I have never seen the Benchmark 120 proof but the OGD114 goes for $30, The WTRB goes for $43 - $50 or higher, and the 1792 full proof is around $70-$80, if I can even find it. So for me, the OGD 114 and WTRB are the only ones I keep in stock.
Don't worry about not trying benchmark your not missing out on anything. That stuff is terrible.
Seriously! it isn't good at all . Everything shown here is much better.
@@xiamengbaby that’s too bad about the 1792 FP being so high! Just finishing a bottle as I type that I bought for $45. 1920 is better, but is $65 for me. I like Rare Breed slightly better than 1792 but it’s $10 more. I think my “go to” high proof is 1792 at the moment.
Picked up a bottle of Benchmark full proof in Frankfort on the way back from Steamboat to NC. Okay but I don't like it neat, will use for Old Fashions until bottle gone- will not repurchase. 114 is my usual Old Fashion Bourbon but also not crazy about it neat or even on a clear sphere. Love both the 1792 and Rare Breed. Love the Rare Breed on a clear sphere!!! Price difference is not enough from 114 and BM for me to use neat. FYI: Rare Breed now available in NC ABC after being gone for quite awhile. Got two bottles today
With all of the unobtanium out there, it's nice to know something as good as Wild Turkey Rare Breed is affordable and available.
This was perfect for the 'I want to get smashed for cheap, but I'm not quite ready to give up and drink MD 20/20' crowd.
I do love the math part of this. Trying to take the subjective nature out and ranking by a formula. But you may need some additional variables in this. Some higher level math.
Up for suggestions, that is about as high level ad our math goes haha.
Supreme mathematics
wild turkey rare breed just a fantastic bourbon in every aspect!
I've been waiting for a video like this! I have the 114 and 1792, but am looking to get Rare Breed and the Benchmark very soon.
Awesome video! Please keep this P3 series going. Love you guys!!!
Thanks! Will do!
Lookooo
Fun and surprising fact is, that I have just been able to buy exactly this Rare Breed in some Prague e-shop and with current discount the bottle was for 34 dollars. Another fun fact is, that neither of the 3 competitors had never been available in Czech republic. But I am fine with Rare Breed. What is prevalent here is Scotch and then a lot of partially homemade non aged alcohol, but Rare Breed, when anybody tries it here, reactions are awesome.... But please, do not tell anyone... 😉
I picked up Rare Breed for $31.99 at my local chain store. Hard to beat!
32 bucks? Did you buy 7?
I think the real lesson here, and I think most people's experience would bear this out, is that if you are going higher proof, you'll want to spend a little more, because cheap and high proof is going to end up being harsher. High proof needs a little age to mellow it out, and you don't typically get age with cheaper. Of course there is a point of diminishing returns, so more $ does not = better once you get up past the $40-ish range.
So if I am going to spend $25-ish, I would not be looking for a high proof - I'd stick to not much more than about...101.
If I want high proof, I am going to spend probably $40 or more.
I am not surprised that Rare Breed topped this flight, and I LOVE RB, but I think the 1792 Full Proof is a fantastic pour. I've been enjoying the hell out of it lately (though maybe because I am out of Rare Breed?), along with the 1792 12 year. I also like the 1792 Sweet Wheat, but dislike the Small Batch, so go figure.
RB is hard to beat, but the 1792 FP store picks can really be phenomenal. Great vid!
Let’s go OGD 114!
🤢
Love it when the winner is on my shelf. And the runner-up too. Nice!
Thanks for the review 🥃
Before watching...Benchmark Full Proof is the best value in bourbon. Let's see if Chad & Sara agree.
haven't tried it, the OGD has always been my go to budget bourbon. If your saying this is better, than I'll have to try it
@@thomasbuck303 I really like OGD, but I get a butterscotch note off the Benchmark that I love. I haven't had OGD in a while, though, so I need to revisit. I'm about to open a bottle to mix up some Poor Man's Four Grain, so that will be a good opportunity.
‘Define nougat, Chad’ haha! That was awesome
Hit that "LIKE" button! That was a fun one. Love me some Kirkland. Also love those side by sides. ( I need to do more blinds though.) We lined up 7 Booker's last Tuesday and had a blast. Cheers!
Great review. My exact same order. Also I really like the P3 rating.
Yes on the blind and yes on more mini flights with the specific parameters. I think comping producer whiskey vs the whiskey it sends to ndp’s is a big opportunity.
Even though you ranked it third, this still shows (to me at least) that OGD 114 is the best bang for the buck out there. If you've got more coin to spend then Rare Breed offers premium quality at a still reasonable price.
I have all 4 of these and am a huge fan!
Benchmark is perfect when sitting around the campfire. I like the P3 concept. That Barton Costco vs the 1792 taste-off sounds like a great idea.
Picked up a bottle of rare breed today and now I'm even more stoked to crack it open!
Yes, I'd like to see a "drink this or that" episode like you mentioned in the video. Sounds like fun! Cheers, Andy
Yes do the Kirkland comparison!
Fun show, thanks! I'll ask that you blind any and all Kirkland bourbons and Tennessee whiskies. I always wonder how they stack of. I always feel like the blinds are the best review/comparisons of the various whiskies you get into. Keep it up.
Really enjoyed this. It’s 1792 for me with RB a very close 2nd.
I have blinded the Kirkland SiB against Smokewagon UCUF and Ezra Cask Strength and it came out on top (for me) twice. Maybe my store got a great barrel. Haven't seen Benchmark FP here in CA but would like to try it.
For me it's definitely OGD 114 and Rare Breed. Cheers 🥃
Evan Williams BiB is 100 proof and a handle is $27 in my area. That's high enough proof for me and value can't be beat.
Thank you for another great segment. Please do more of these and stop the live shows. Most of us are two busy to listen to an hour show
1792 full proof has great flavor, but it is a bit hard to find in my area (Oregon). I buy whenever I find it.
Yeah, would be interesting to see a blind with the Costco and the 1792 Full Proof. I only had the Costco version and sadly, went through it pretty quickly...and missed getting a 2nd bottle. Also just got back from a trip to parts of the Bourbon Trail and 1792 was a disappointment. They need to ramp up their tasting experience and get out of that double wide...just saying. Thanks for the content and cheers!
Cannot beat OGD for the price. Case closed. Next
That stuff is terrible. I don't get the hype at all.
We also didn't like it when we first tried it. Took a few years before we tried it again and by then we were really liking it.
@@ItsBourbonNight Yeah I heard so much about it I wanted to like it but all I got was redhots and ethanol. Maybe I will try again sometime. 👍
We've had all but the Benchmark and don't think you can go wrong with any of them. Definitely yes to the drink this or that blind.
1792 FP store picks are a must on my shelf. Luckily they pop up often in my area of KY
I'm drinkin' WT Rare Breed for months and will continue, I love it.
Rare Breed best value in fine bourbon. Getting hard to find in my area of Mn.
YES! Do that thing you said!
Rare breed all day, every day!!!
^^^THIS^^^
Sara really has an excellent discerning palate. Actually, you both do. I'm just really impressed by what you manage to find in these whiskeys.
Recently I picked up at Binny's, a Jeppson single barrel barrel proof straight bourbon 120.6 proof. The bourbon came from Indiana, so it's probably MGP. It's NAS, so I assume the minimum 4 years of a straight bourbon. The PS on it is 0.290. The OGD 114 has a P3 of 0.263 by me. The Old Grand Dad takes the win between those two. But right now as I watch your video, I am just roughing it with some OGD BIB.
We had that Jeppson's Bourbon in our last episode of Flight Fights. It's not bad.
@@ItsBourbonNight yeah, I meant to say that the Jeppsons was pretty good, but definitely drank a bit hotter than some other high proofers which was a bit of a turn-off. But that's the price you pay when drinking a $35 barrel proof vs a $50-$60 or more barrel proof like an Elijah Craig or Knob Creek Single Barrel which drink easier than you'd expect from their respective 120 to 130+ proof. I think you had a 107 proof Jeppsons. That might actually be a better proof point for that caliber of bourbon. I'll have to try this 120 proof bottle with a little water and see if my opinion might not get a little more positive.
Great video! I would have loved one step further with a rating out of 10, then combine with the p3 to get an "objective" best value/price single number. Full disclosure OG114 is my go to for value/price, I like Rare Breed more, but not ($47/$30)*100=56% better.
In Michigan, you can buy Kirkland Spirits at your local corner liquor store if they order it from the state distributor. But 1792 and Rare Breed would be my choices
In central Indiana I can get Old Fo signature 100 for a p3 of .18-.19
It doesn't meet your proof threshold, but worth a mention.
Evan Williams BiB in our area has a p3 of .17. Amazing P3, just not exactly what we would call "high proof", still what a value.
Of these 1792 full proof is my favorite by far.
Yes. Please do the blind this or that with 1792.
Good to know they are priced accordingly, at keast with regard to ranking. Value I guess is a different story possibly.
I like the benchmark full proof, which is not going to go toe to toe with any of these. But it makes a hell of an old fashioned.
Yes to the "this or that" blind!
Yes on the Drink This or That blind please!
P3...love that concept. You guy's are awesome. #drinkmorebourbon
For me it’s Rare Breed then 1792 Full Proof.
Can't find Benchmark Full Proof around here in Dallas Fort Worth, only Benchmark 8. Never saw it in New Mexico, Arizona or Nevada when I was out there last month. Is it something only available in Kentucky?
Not sure when they’re going to widen the distribution of it, but no it’s not KY only.
Awesome video
Thank you
I think that P3 score is going places. I wouldn't be surprised if other whiskeytube channels started adopting that. Or even distilleries at some point
Great channel, man you look like buffalo Qb Josh Allen 😆
I think knob creek 9 yr 120 proof would have been a great one to throw in too
It was in the longer list for sure, but the P3 wasn't as good as the ones we ended up going with.
Definitely need to do the blind this or that.
Haven't seen Rare Breed in my area for at least 3 months. Some say its a bottle shortage but I'm not buying that excuse. I'm afraid its now allocated.
I wish my costco had that one. Costco Bourbon goes fast.
Team OGD114 checking in pre video
So, you get what you pay for. Exactly.
2:23 - yeah no shit- what area would that be...
1792 is still the best.
I’ve been drinking bourbon fire over a year. A lot of bourbon. Whiskey in general is unique to each person that’s it’s hard to grade one against another. Personally for the price point I would prefer Old Grand Dad bonded over any of the bourbons in this video.
I like the higher proof when mixing. But when drinking meat or over ice I like no more than a 100 proof
Benchmark not available in my area. Rare Breed for me though
Would you ever do a benchmark stagg jr flight since benchmark full proof is the poor man’s stagg?
For a Flight we would need a couple more things to throw in there, but maybe a Drink This or That?
@@ItsBourbonNight sounds like a great idea/alternative!
best price per value is early times bib but its 100 so cant compete on the p3
WT Rare Breed is the only whiskey I've found that tastes as good on ice as it does neat
#Science y’all … my engineer brain is so happy right now lol.
I could have guessed these results without watching video
Is Costco available again?
Non-Bourbon Trivia. What TV show had a Bar/Club named P3?
Hummm, we don't know this one!
@@ItsBourbonNight Charmed
@@jimidrammer4187 Ohhhh. Never watched much of Charmed.
@@ItsBourbonNight Yeah y'all were like toddlers when it came out.
@@jimidrammer4187 Prue, Phoebe and Piper! I wish you hadn't given it away so quickly before I come across it and that was the first and only thing in my head as soon as I heard him say P³ lol. I grew up with Charmed and I wasn't a toddler though obviously and I'm probably around their age. Maybe we should sue them for plagiarizing a classic 😆. I'm assuming that was the original. But they're doing a new version of Charmed right now too, you know? I've never watched though and idk if they still have a P3 in it. There's also this show Emergence which I suspect is some sort of spin off of Charmed cuz there's this little girl Piper and she has powers so I guess that can't be a coincidence.
OGD 114 is the shizzzznit!
Price per mL of ethanol but p3 sounds better
I’ve always gotten banana nut bread with chocolate chips from the 1792 FP.
Wooo
You guys are more than welcome to go back to being on the correct side of the screen. I had to watch it upside down lol jk
Hahaha why are people saying this so often now? This is how we’ve stood for Flight Fights since 2016! Haha
Please listen to me!:
One whiskey in three minutes...
You have a lot of whiskey, do a short clips in 3 minutes each...
People looking for, just trust me and try...
Im enjoying your long videos also but we need the butter of milk...
Have a great day
Yum!
opening song sounds like lord of the rings or stormwind city...
Please make that blind This Or That happen!! 🙏🏾
Not to be this guy, but I will anyways… had you done proof per price, you could have multiplied that value by a score/100, and the highest overall score would theoretically be the best whisky for the money.
Interesting. Can you give an example? Just wanna see the math so we can understand it better.
@@ItsBourbonNight Sure! So as it stands, multiplying your p^3 value by a score out of 100 would be meaningless because “higher value” p^3 scores are actually lower. However if you inverted your p^3 system, you could multiply by a score out of 100 to give an overall value assessment per proof.
For example a 100 proof, $100 whiskey that you scored a 90/100 would end up being a 0.9 on this scale (Proof divided by price, multiplied by the score you gave it).
An 100 proof, $50 bottle that you scored a 95/100 would be a 1.9 on this scale ((100/50)*.95), and would thus be “better”.
At some point it would likely be so analytical that it became boring, but I just thought I would throw the idea out there!
Should have included Chattanooga 111.
OGD 114 hands down
Do the side by side, we have a new Costco in town.
“I was told there would be no math”
WHISKEY CHEERS 😎😎😎😎
Rare Breed so tasty
Thanks and yes to the blind.
Put the Benchmark up against others in its price range
Rare Breed is GONE on the shelves in NC
What a great show! Thanks. I never looked at it this way. Among the group you reviewed I would take the OGD 114 as the best proof per value. Yes, WT Rare Breed is “better” but it also costs $$45 here (in Florida) where the OGD is $30 here. Is there THAT much of a difference between the two to validate the $15 price difference? Nope, not at all (in my opinion). If money were no object (I wish!), I would buy the WT Rare Breed over the OGD 114. However, here in the real world, it’s OGD 114 all day.