The many contradictory accounts of Davros' trial
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- It is established in Doctor Who lore that the Daleks take Davros to trial at some point between Revelation of the Daleks and Remembrance of the Daleks, and that this trial ends with Davros becoming Emperor of the Imperial Dalek faction and driving the Supreme Dalek and his Renegade Daleks off Skaro. But other than that, the details are a bit murky, especially since there are at least four main versions of the trial from various corners of Doctor Who expanded media. In this video, we are going to have a brief look at all of them.
All footage is the property of the BBC. Music by Frank Klepacki and Jason Graves
Maybe the real trial of Davros was the friends we made along the way.
What is it with The Daleks putting people on trial; Davros, The Master. For a group of angry pepperpots they do love a fair trial.
Bold of you to assume their trials are fair.
Yea Would think they would just exterminate people
Trials don't have to be fair and courts often have a lot of angry people. It's like saying the Nazis and KKK never put people on trial, they did. A lot.
You ever seen Transformers The Movie (1986) where we meet the Quintessons doing a “trial” on someone who escaped from Unicron? I picture the Daleks having a court like that.
If you told me only the I, Davros account of the trial and left me completely unaware of the rest of the possibilities for the Trial Of Davros I'd still have doubt on the idea that the Daleks would give him a test to see if he'd be a good leader. The Daleks wouldn't act like children seeking guidance from a parent or an adult. They would simply just try to find a new leader from their own ranks.
I love this topic because it’s so interesting I mean even the juggernauts can be disputed because at the end davros explodes and big finish haven’t really cleaned that one up. My favourite account is probably emperor of the daleks it takes the daleks from one faze to another quite well and I do like it shows us what happened to the original dalek emperor (in my head canon that is the evil of the daleks emperor) and everything is kinda of rapped up quite well though it’s still a matter of contention with the hole war of the daleks book which completely turns the dalek time line on its head, bumps what is your favourite version of the trial
I actually do think that the 4 main tales of Davros' trial can be woven together into a single coherent story and the ones we've been given are just elements of the whole thing taken by historians and exaggerated to ludicrous levels. And while I would enjoy writing it out like I'm writing a book, I doubt anyone here would be willing to read that kind of text-wall, so I'll just list off the events during the trial in what I think is chronological.
*1st:* Davros is captured by The Daleks on Necros for attempting to make his own versions of their race which they found very offensive since he's their creator but not wanting to just destroy such a scientifically gifted being they took Davros to trial to determine whether he's still useful to them or a hindrance that must be thoroughly exterminated.
*2nd:* As the ship transporting Davros to Skaro was flying through the void of space, something happened to the ship which causes it to crash-land on the planet Lethe, killing all but two Daleks and Davros, though Davros barely escaped that crash with his life. A human colony on Lethe found Davros and likely mistaking him as a badly mutilated human they decided to help heal him as best they can, though because Davros' life support chair is such old and is alien tech the humans could only manage a rudimentary repair, *just* only able to preform a rudimentary version of what it normally does. And as for Davros himself, most likely seeing that The Dalek's unlimited hatred extends even to their "father" , he saw the writing on the wall and attempted to make an army of Dalek killers using the frame he used to make The Daleks to keep himself safe from his own "children" .
*3rd:* After The Dalek's recaptured Davros thanks to the aid of the 6th Doctor, he was being carried to Skaro in a more damage resistant ship to make sure that he reaches Skaro and not attempt to make any more impure Daleks on whatever planet he'll crash-land into next and they didn't bother further repairs to his chair since it's still doing what it's suppost to do; but unbeknownst to The Daleks the human colonist had sent one of their own with Dalek Sensor Jamming tech to make sure their comrade is okay, a Thal refugee who was desperate to see if there was any good in the man that created the doom of her people. Meanwhile Davros, quietly and nervously plotting something to keep himself alive, saw an opportunity to prolong his life however much the Thal woman can provide and veined a good side to manipulate her, even going as far as to give her a concentrated sample of The Movelan Virus for what he has in store for her.
Okay I just realized I'm making the text wall I said I didn't want to make, sorry about that, so I'm just going to breeze through the remaining parts of this take of Davros' trial for your sake.
*4th:* Davros arrives at Skaro in front of Dalek High Command for his trial with The Dalek Supreme acting as the judge during the trial, The Golden Emperor there to witness the trial personally to see if the ultimate fate of Davros is fitting, and High Command acting as the jury. The Daleks permitted Davros to speak on his own behave so that they can hear his defense as clearly as possible and at first Davros defended himself by stating what he's sacrificed in their name, a few key points of a narrative lie to make his defense more compelling, and finally tell his life story after The Dalek Supreme angerly interrupted him and sentencing Davros to death for which The Golden Emperor quickly rebuttaled the order since it was done irrationally.
*5th:* During the intermediary where all present Daleks debated on Davros' fate, it became clear that Davro's speeches have made a crack within Dalek High Command and tensions were rising while The Golden Emperor attempted to keep his most trusted advisors on the same page not wanting his already fractured empire to fragment even more. During their debate Davros revealed the location of the Thal refugee who was holding the canaster of The Movelan Virus he gave her while on the ship and The Daleks seeing the "assassine" exterminated her on the spot, and just before she died she realized all too late what Davros' intentions were and before she could make so much as a sound she met her maker.
*6th:* The attempted Thal assassine and Davros revealing where she was even though his very life was on a razor edge and could've just let the Thal assassinate them to save his own skin was the straw the broke the camel's back, a fire fight broke out between those who heeded the words of Davros and those who heeded the word of The Supreme, during the fight The Golden Emperor was accidentally exterminated by one of the sides but neither knows who killed the emperor which further drove a wedge between the two sides and Davros was once again badly injured during the fire fight. After both sides retreated so that they can continue to fight another day, those loyal to The Supreme elevated him to their new Emperor who became the Dalek City Emperor and his right plunger the new Supreme; and those now loyal to Davros repaired his critically damaged life support chair with The Golden Emperor's casing and elevating Davros as their emperor; and after the news of what happened during the trial reached the Dalek public The Daleks fragmented even more with the younger Daleks siding with Davros and the older Daleks siding with The City Emperor.
*7th:* Faced with overwhelming numbers of Dalek traitors, the now Renegade Daleks was forced to flee their home world to survive, and Davros' first order as Emperor is to enhance the Daleks who're on his side with bio-mechanical attachments to make them more effective warriors if their casings were destroyed, his second order as Emperor is too change the color scheme of those under his command to match his new life support chair further binding the High Command Daleks, their armies and territories, and the common Daleks who sided with him together as a parallel of racial nationalism, Davros' third command as emperor is to further expand their numbers believing that overwhelming numbers can surpass the Renegade's superior battle experience after they've already fled twice from the precise two fights via a two-way method, one is growing now Imperial Daleks from scratch and two is rescuing long abandoned Dalek armies from the countless storage rooms across the fragmented empire which will make these Daleks loyal to Davros for not forgetting them while the previous regime did.
And finally, at long last.
*8th:* The Dalek Civil War was a bitter and violent battle of egos viding for the top spot; the faction of Daleks loyal to The City Emperor were dubbed Renegades as the younger Daleks believed that it was they who killed The Golden Emperor out of spite for not siding with them and believing that The Golden Emperor declared Davros as his successor since the High Command Daleks who rescued him used the former Emperor's casing to show that Davros was in charge, they were also called Renegades as they dogmatically believed that they were now impure Daleks because of the bio-mechanical attachments Davros gave to his followers even though their genome was unaltered and believed that these Daleks were already plotting to usurp the throne from The Golden Emperor for purely selfish reasons since they've elevated their leader to the status of Emperor. Meanwhile The Imperial Daleks were called imperial because of their rapid and successful requiring of Daleks, territory, weapons and resources while The Renegades were struggling to find allies with Dalek Warlords who didn't take part in the trial and assumed that these High Command Daleks were traitors to The Dalek species and opted to be either neutral or sided with The Imperials with only a handful actually siding with The Renegades. And after Davros' prediction that The Daleks will be doomed without him came true after the 2nd Doctor nearly exterminated The Renegade Daleks by infecting their numbers with a human factor and causing The City Emperor's death during the first major fight between the two sub factions many the the Warlords who allied themselves with The Renegades switched sides to simply save their asses which was the pivotal moment in the civil war which gave The Imperials the hovering height they needed to start properly kicking The Renegades' Dalekanium asses. . meanwhile The Renegade Dalek Supreme took what forces he had left and began a desperate search for The Hand of Omega to win the civil war and The Imperial Daleks catching wind of that plot began looking for it too to finally wipe out The Renegades once and for all.
*FINALLY* , I'm done writing this book of a comment, if anyone is mad enough to see this message, thank you SO much for taking the time outta your day to read this mess and I hope it was worth it. And by the way, I can see Davros viewing those who've sided with him as what he described in his personal recounting of his trial. Have a wonderful day everyone.
Fantastic breakdown. Also forgot to mention about The Dalek becoming the Dalek Emperor in across the dark and city.
@@BlindTimeLord Holy moly you actually read that whole thing, I honestly wasn't expecting anyone to do so; thank you for your time and I hope it was worth the time spent.
Also, truth be told, I just mostly said what was shown in the video for the sake of my exhausted head with a little bit of my own personal lore to spice things up.
@@tommyfox854 I mean it works :-) and sure I did, screen readers can be really handy. I guess that’s one advantage to being blind you can speed things up and read paragraph of texts a lot quicker when needed.
I like this, I think it's a good shot at making a coherent whole out of everything
@@Idran I'm glad you like it Idran. =)
Let’s goo, Davros lore!
What I find interesting is that Davros' deteriorating mental state can be believable when you consider how anti-social the Daleks are, even among themselves. As Humans, we need other Human Beings like ourselves to grow and develop. But Davros didn't account for that, and the result is that he can't cope for long. I can only imagine how isolating it is for him, even among his own creations.
That is just extrovert and stupid.
Davros better come back in dr who soon
had there been a tv series on the the trial of davros it would have lead to far less speculation, going someway to answer once and for all what happened to davros, and how he became leader
Fun fact. Lareen was played by Miranda Raisin who you may know as Tallulah with three Ls and an H. Both DiM and Davros Mission were made in 07. So, it does make sense. It's like Rory Jennings (or Jenkins, sorry, been a while) was in the Idiot's Lantern and say what you will about it, it got him cast in I DAVROS P1 (Source: Davros Collection: Bonus Disk)
@@Just-Plain-Potential interesting! Miranda Raison also plays Sixth Doctor companion Constance Clarke in several other Big Finish audios, including Order of the Daleks - one of my personal favourites :)
@@dalekbumps Really? Wow. I had no idea. I know people didn't like Tallulah (I did but whatever), but I'm glad she got a character who is loved.
I saw Manny abimations Of Davros Trial, I wish it became more than official animation, só we could see how Davros escaped, thus I wisj We also saw the Trial Daleks and that these daleks got their screentime
Wasn't expecting to hear Frank Klepacki music in a Doctor Who video, love it!
Personally i always liked the version from the DWM comics, probably because i read that as a kid but stuck in my head as a good bridge between two tv stories.
Plus the artwork.
Juggernauts could be staged as part of the prosecution... They create a duplicate Davros & crash in onto the colony under observation to see what he would do if left free. He sets about creating another threat to the Daleks, proving he's still dangerous, so the Doctor is recruited & sent in to stop him. That would explain the real Davros' survival when the one in the story is blown up.
Even the Big Finish audios contradict each other, with 'The Juggernauts' and 'The Davros Mission' giving two completely different accounts of what happened to Davros after Necros! 😆
@@iancotterill2286 yeah, despite the commonly held belief that Big Finish has a consistent canon, there are actually a lot of contradictions between different audios, especially when it comes to the chronology of Classic Who villains like Davros, the Master, the Valeyard and the Cybermen. Even the Daleks have some odd outliers in their timeline established by Big Finish, like the strange case of Imperial Daleks with a non-Davros Emperor from We Are The Daleks, the unresolved cul-de-sac that is Dalek Empire, or whatever was going on in Daleks Among Us
@@dalekbumps Yes, 'Doctor Who' is full of contradictions in continuity, which I tend to attribute to things like the Time War or the Toymaker messing around with history. Hasn't stopped Russell T Davies from acknowledging stories like 'Scream of the Shalka'! 😆
Where Davros is concerned, I tend to hold the theory that after 'The Juggernauts', Davros gets taken to Skaro and is then tested, as heard in 'I, Davros', whereupon the Dalek Emperor decides to establish Davros as puppet ruler of the Imperial Daleks, as hinted in the Doctor Who 2006 annual.
Of course, that doesn't stop me from enjoying other versions like 'The Davros Mission' and 'Emperor of the Daleks'! 😁
You can't really have trials without some sort of justice system. When the supreme exterminated the ill fated Dalek Commander on Spiridon there wasn't much of a judicial process.
I would chalk it to writers which includes Terry Nation forgetting that the earlier Dalek stories of the 1960’s showed Daleks that behaved differently from their later selves with their debut serial as a prime example and if they had known they’d be around past the 60’s, I reckon they’d have one of the other Daleks comment about that but what do I know about the Dalek Chain of Command?
I've been binging your whole channel, the shorter videos makes it easier to absorb all the niche information!
yeah I won't lie this video was tough to make, in terms of scripting, recording, and editing 😂
It was a subscriber request to cover all the versions of Davros' trial in one video, so I decided to attempt it for better or worse - even so I feel like making 4 shorter videos on the different accounts of Davros' trial might have ended up being even more confusing...
“Your honour! My defendant Davros did not destroy the moon with laser urine and his forklift certification is 100% legit.” - Dalek Lawyer in The Daleks of Skaro v Davros.
I remember trying to come up with a complete davros timeline a couple of years ago, and I think I remember coming out with the idea that davros had two trials at two separate times, and that these different accounts all fitted into either of the two. Might be remembering wrong but I think the idea was that dav had a trial after Revelation, then had another trial at some point between remembrance and Terror Firma. Would need to revisit that though haha. Timelines eh? 😄
excellent video, thanks
Quick I was yes
Just waiting for big finish to make a boxset called trial of davros, where they try to make all the different versions work together in one massive story, while probably aps0 throwing in something new to add to a story or try to unify it. Maybe make the timelords or daleks interfere with events, which is why it's such a mess.
Or the different accounts are what people not involved with the trial thought had occurred while the true accounts are kept classified.
This might sound pedantic. But Honestly i really dislike the idea that the daleks have a legal system and will put their enemies on trial. If a dalek isn’t shooting to kill they should have some form of plan or intent behind doing so. A “Fair trial” like is sometimes depicted with the trial of Davros where he’s found not guilty simply shouldn’t be possible. If I was to redo the ending of revelation i would say that the Black Dalek supreme wanted Davros sent back to Skaro for a public extermination.
It shouldn't be possible to exterminate Davros. A major design flaw in creating the Daleks was not making himself invincible to their weapons.
He ought to have created a Ready Brek forcefield round himself.
And a lot of good the electric finger did him either 🙄.
He was a pretty crap scientist tbh😂
I think the Daleks’ legal system is like the G1 Quintessons where it’s merely theatre disguised as a trial since the outcome’s predetermined. On the other hand, it could also be consistent with the earlier Pre-70’s Dalek depictions where they were showing characteristics not seen since including their taste for art.
So, in my opinion, it is possible (with a little judicial ignoring of minor details) to beat most of these into some kind of consistency. I say "most." Let's just take it as read thst we're ignoring John Peel's garbage.
So, Davros is captured on Necros and crashes on Lethe to bugger about with some Mechonoids. So far, so uncontroversial.
He's then recovered and brought back to Skaro, but is contacted by Lareen en route (we need to ignore one line of dialogue about "leaving Necros" here, and assume that the surgery he is undergoing on the Dalek transporter is to repair the damage from the Juggernaut attack rather thsn just getting his hand shot off). The Dalek Supreme is ready to crown itself Emperor at the end of a show trial, but Davros' betrayal of Lareen garners unecpected support from *some* of the Daleks [The Davros Mission].
Some of the Daleks, maybe a fence sitting faction of council members, arrange their own clandestine "trial" to see if he really is a better candidate to rule [I, Davros].
Meanwhile, the Dalek Supreme - panicked by the unforeseen show of support for Davros - moves to crown himself Emperor immediately, and arranges a "trial" that is essentially just to publicly execute Davros and weed out any Davros loyalists and exterminate them. At which point the Doctor arrives and spirits Davros away to Spirodon where he uses the frozen army to build a force to return and conquer the empire [Emperor of the Daleks].
Thats how I work it out anyway.
As a sidenote, I'm glad they simply retconned it so that the Doctor was just wrong about the Nemesis Emperor. It just makes more sense. Also, Nemesis is set about 2000 years before any of the Davros stories, and whilst the Daleks do have time travel technology, I'm inclined to just go with Occam's razor and say those Daleks were contemporary to the setting.
Are we going to see the trial of Russel T Davros, the man who finally managed to kill off The Doctor?
How was the Emperor from Nemesis of the Daleks disproven to be not davros? I always believed it to be Davros fighting between himself and the emperor dalek persona.
@@ghostman5269 I believe Emperor of the Daleks was written specifically to retcon Nemesis of the Daleks, it certainly 'undid' a lot of the plot revelations of Nemesis, and basically curtailed the story Nemesis was trying to tell and moved on to something completely different. Personally I prefer Emperor of the Daleks over Nemesis of the Daleks, but it has to be said that it was a bit of a sly move on the part of the writer of Emperor of the Daleks to not only undo Abslom Daak's death, but also completely rewrite the backstory of the Emperor from Nemesis as well
Now that is a nightmare.
Dave Ross never went to trial probably.
My guess is that he had Saul Goodman to help him out of this tricky situation
Davros ran a TF2 Bot program and the Daleks tried charging him for it. Source: Trust me bro.
I choose account 2 because I think it’s more accurate.
Why no mention of the davris mission which takes place directly after revelation.?
@@paulure861 I do mention the Davros Mission, that's the fourth account
Though whether or not it is actually placed after Revelation is up for debate, because that contradicts almost every other Big Finish audio related to Davros' timeline
🐙
Those comic scans yours?
Davros!!!!