Our school piano used to be tuned by this elderly gentleman who was old school and did it all by ear, it was fascinating to watch him work. The piano always sounded amazing when he was finished.
@@bartenderzzz They do. Competent machine tuners still use their ears. And the tuning test is still requires you to tune by ear. The machine gets you close quicker. Think of it as the phrase you cannot tune an out of tune piano. This essentially gets you close enough so that you only need to do fine adjustments and fine adjustments are always done by ear unless you have a bad piano technician. The machines do get you very close where about 80-90% of the piano requires no further tuning, but that 10-20% does require you to use your ears. This is especially true in the base.
When I was a kid, we had an old upright piano out in a barn behind the house (a big old rambling farmhouse which had been in my mom's family for many generations). I had been there as long as I could remember and my parents even had no idea how long it had been there because it was there when my mom was a kid too. A couple of the keys were broken and the wood was starting to rot in places. So it hadn't been tuned at least since my mom was a kid, but at least the notes were recognizable, which is amazing given what I know now about pianos. I took an interest in it all on my own and started practicing on it. I got pretty good and was able to play a whole song by ear (some kid's song) from start to end. So without even asking me, my parents had the piano tuned and sent me to piano lessons. At the time, I didn't think anything odd about that, but I now wonder what the piano tuner must have thought! The teacher was a strict old lady, and that killed my interest in the piano.
TUNE THATPIANO my family has been thinking about it for years, just other things have come up and we put it off becuase the piano needs to be restained too. Actually we might actually try to have the piano worked on this week:)
I cannot answer this without seeing the instrument. In addition it depends on the present pitch, the visual condition of the strings and the firmness of the tuning pins. Are you in the USA? Have you asked "Living Pianos?" If the instrument was completely restored so recently, why is the pitch already incorrect? Twice yearly (at least) is a must !
Will be moving mine to where I’m at now don’t know how long it’s been since it was tuned I would have to guess mabey 60+ years belonged to my great grandfather who played professionally
Pianos have a condition called octave stretching.. this means that if you try to tune every note to perfect pitch then even with high tech gear that tells you every note is perfect, you will find that for example an 'A" in the lower register will be out of tune when played against and 'A" in the upper register..... this is one of the many reasons why piano tuning is a specialist affair... a good piano tuner doesn't require software or high tech equipment...they just have a fabulous ear.... oh and to answer some other questions out there... a piano that hasn't been tuning for a couple of decades will be a major job...the last time i tuned a piano to concert pitch that hadn't been tuned for over 30 years, it took approximately 6 hours to do! no kidding!
About the old saying "you can't tune an out if tune piano", couldn't the tuner just tune first a low note, than a high note? Going from the edges of the piano to the middle. Or I just don't understand the saying :P
well think about it this way. There is a lot of tension. Literally multiple tons of weight. Every string has about somewhere between 75 and 200 pounds of weight which varies from piano to piano as there are some bad pianos with very low tension. But when you increase the tension on 1 string you are bending the physical piano and that actually decreases the weight of all of the other strings in the piano. If you decrease the tension of one string the piano's plate relaxes a bit putting more tension on the other strings. So essentially if you tune 1 note sharper, every other note goes flat. When you are raising the pitch a lot for each string you are going to see a lot of change due to the principle I stated above. So essentially with a pitch raise, the tuners use some math and tune all of the notes sharp (or flat if the piano is way too sharp) so that when they stop the notes have settled in a position where they are close to pitch. Now once you are close while the principle still applies, the difference becomes too little to hear when you are making small fine adjustments. So essentially you need to keep tuning the piano until all of the notes are close enough to the point where you are adjusting the pitch so little that the effect makes no difference to the actual tuning. So essentially the tldr version is you can tune an out of tune piano, but when it is way out of tune, you have no idea where it is going to be after you are done tuning. So you have to tune it until its close to be capable of making fine adjustments without every other note on the piano going out of tune.
Damp Chaser, look a piano hates humidity changes. If you live in the midwest especially where humidity goes up and down radically you need a damp chaser. Ask any tuner, they reduce how many visits are required to maintain your piano. They maintain a constant level of humidity inside your instrument. You just plug it in keep it full of water and close up your instrument while not in use. Also don't keep your piano in a sunny part of the room. Nothing causes a bridge too loose it's crown faster than inconsistent humidity pianos that live in the tropics need a damp chaser. Also tuning at least 3 times a year is like maintaining your car. A piano is like a car engine many moving parts not like a violin that just gets better with age. Also remember humidity changes not tempreture changes so much that damage pianos over time.
However much they cost they always seem to be a lot cheaper than a plumber, electrician or other building tradesperson. I always feel they're undercharging me so I overpay (tip) my tuner/tech. (I have a half decent piano, a Kwai, so its well behaved and relatively easy to keep in tune.)
i have a piano from 1970 that has never been tuned still works and is out of tune, what is a estimate price it would cost to get it tuned? and how many times will it need to be tuned?
It will depend on how far from standard pitch it is. It will also depend on what area you're in as tuning costs vary from one area to another. You should probably figure on 1.25 to 1.5 times the normal tuning rate. So if a normal tuning rate in your area is $100, then the cost with a pitch adjustment and normal tuning would be $125 to $150.
Its JayBoi make sure the pedals work!! I can't tell you how many times I've gone to see a piano and all the keys worked but the pedals didn't do anything.
I got a Baldwin upright piano (not a spinet) for 50 dollars from some college kid who needed to move. All the keys work, however, one key in the bass sticks a little, but that's about it. One key is slightly chipped at the end, but I have a replacement veneer I can put on it. Also all the pedals work (including the sostenuto). It holds its tune well. I tell you what, craigslist can get you some real bargains if you are patient enough.
I recently bought a 1913 Ivers & Pond upright in decent condition. The tuner (whom I'd hired before to assess another piano I was considering) charged $107.17 including tax and told us we'll likely be able to get away with one tune per annum. Given how expensive the Austin area has become I thought this was quite a good deal!
I have a question. I have a square grand piano from the 1860's. It has been COMEPLETELTY restored in the 90's, and it has a very good sound. I've never heard anything like it (comparing it to other square grands from youtube and real life). It has a custom made action that looks like a normal grand piano's action. But because it has custom made parts, and the fact that it is an old instrument, is it still possible to "concert tune" it?
You may break a few strings in the process. Restringing is the answer. You need a wire guage to ensure you use correct guages. I am assuming that it was restrung by the guy up above who may have used incorrect guages. There are lotss of cowboys about!
@@ronaldware1239 It could have been the air conditioning also. If you are not paying attention to the vents, that can throw a piano completely out of tune. It also could be an armature piano tuner, or obviously damage is another thing.
Just get the biggest Kawai CA series...regular concert keyboard..it's got an actual wood soundboard, sound is initially produced by an amp+speakers hidden inside, then it propagates through the soundboard. It's 95% close to a real pian without the pains. At around 3-4k $
I have a piano at school really bad out of tune, missing 2 pedals, and I think strings. Its wood is also in bad condition. Band directors dont want it. What should we do?
My collegue & I were llooking at a square grand that was a beautiful pice of furniture. Exquisite! The owner asked for an opinion. Kenneth got in first much to my pleasure. "It's wonderful to behold," he said. "alright unless you actually want to play it"
WHY NOT - tune a few basses, then a few trebles, then some mid-range, etc? There's got to be a way to use some variation of this method that minimizes the flex/detune problem.
Its about the literal flex of the wood and the plate. When you put tension on the piano, that bends the plate more and therefore drops the tension of the other strings around it. Usually you will accounting for the fact that the strings will change. You don't know exactly where they will end up, but that's why you tune it 2-3 times when the pitch is way off. The closer you are to pitch, the less the rest of the piano will go out of tune. So you essentially you use math to figure out where the pitch will drop or raise to and then you do a fine tuning to get it perfect.
Is there a kind of Piano Tuner/Technician Guild, or some other professional piano association that exists that the qualified tuners/technicians belong to that might offer some assurances when shopping for a tuner?
In my 40+ years of experience as a piano tech, I can say that string breakage by a tuner is almost invariably due to the tuner being absent minded(which of course includes my having been guilty of this "infraction"). However, if a truly competent tuner breaks a string due to the string being afflicted with rust, THAT is understandable because the string has lost its elasticity. And if most if not all the strings are quite rusty I'd suggest getting the instrument restrung.
Hey I live in Tennessee and at my school we have a piano out of tune badly, missing strings and 2 pedals (middle and far left). Band directors done want it anymore and want to rid it. If you want you can come pick it up and try to refurb it or use parts
Hi Robert! I have a question you could make a video about: Do you need to renew the strings on a piano, and if so, when? Would love to have this question answered :D
+MCMeru Not really. Old strings do loose some sustain, especially if they are rusty, otherwise if the piano is good brand (i.e. made with decent strings) it's pretty much not necessary. Bass strings do go dead and if they are (and the piano is in good shape, no soundboard cracks e.t.c.) then replacing them is a good idea provided the replacement set is of good quality. Sometimes loosening the bass strings, one at a time, releasing each at the hitch pin end and putting in a half turn in the direction of the copper wind to tighten the copper helps.
i think that steinway should make a piano that has a system like spirio, but that tunes the piano. a computer like operator in the pinblock that tunes it. that you would be amazing
That would be neat. 2 issues. 1 is the tension is actually very high. It would require both a motor with high torque and high precision since you are moving the tuning pin fractions of a millimeter. I don't know of anything that is small enough to be built into the piano, but that's not to say that we will not develop that. The other one is sound. So we do have electronic tuning devices that listen to the piano and tune them, but the issue is they aren't always right. They will get you close, but with all of the compromises that are in place to make a piano under 36 feet long you have inharmonicity which means you cannot use pitch to tune the piano. what you use is the beating between the notes so that the notes all sound good when played together. If you tune it to pitch, you will play a cord that sounds like complete trash. So essentially that needs to be custom for every piano. We also have come a long way as far as tuning devices have come so they may eventually get to the point where they are as good as a good piano technicians ear, but they are not there yet. That being said, they are close enough to the point where the average person would not be able to tell. I mean most people only hear when the unisons are out of tune which is the easy part of tuning. So essentially if you aren't that picky or are tone def, you can just get a cheap guy with a machine to tune your piano.
You could get it tuned to a semi-tone flat if the pin-block is cracked. If the pin-block isn't cracked then you should be able to get it tuned to concert pitch.
I have seen pianos go 110 years since their last tuning. Now the tuning was not stable, several strings broke and needed replacement, but it was done. I do not know the cost nor can I make that judgment since it depends on where you live. Ultimately you can look at your strings. If they are rusty then there is the risk of strings braking if they are too far out of tune. The next thing you test is you take a guitar tuner and you play the A string. IF its more than 2 steps flat ( F#/G) or sharp (B/C) then you do run the risk of breaking strings (if rusty) and cracks forming in the sound board. Cracks in sound boards are normal with old pianos and most of the time have very little effect on sound. What you can do is tune it sharp of flat so you don't have to shift the entire pitch if you are worried about damage. so I can tell you that there is likely hope. Other pianos that are 80-90 years since their last tuning are usually tuned flat if the customer is worried about damage. It may sound flat, but remember that A is currently 440, in 1920s a was 432. And bach tuned a to 415. Some Russian composers tuned a to 460. So overall pitch isn't necessarily the most important thing in the world. What matters most is ensuring that the notes are equally spaced apart so that you can have musicality as well as ensuring that the unisons are in tune (each of the 3 strings per note being exactly the same)
i have a piano from the 1970s never been tuned before it does sount kinda in tune but doesn't sound good. any estimate for how many tuning and what the cost it is to tune it to stay in tune???
+DogeOnAZipline The problem is finding a tech who actually knows how to do this. The process involves pushing a 3 pin needle tool into each hammer in several places to open up the wool. Also, if it has been played a lot, the hammers will have compacted and flattened a bit, so reshaping followed by needling may be needed. In the case of reshaping, let off regulation may be necessary to compensate for the slightly reduced hammer height. What he says is right, find somebody who tunes concert pianos.
Mini_Moose-27 voicing a piano is highly skilled work. however, on many bright pianos the brightness is caused by the hardening of the tip of the hammer felt - the point at which the hammer strikes the string. using a needle, LIGHTLY stroke the tip of the offending hammers with the needle tip. DO NOT push the needle into the hammer. this is often a very good solution to the problem. I have been a tuner for 25 years and have used this fix many times. don't try to VOICE the piano yourself. it'll end in tears.
Actually reshaping can follow the needling because I use a technique whereby a motor driven cylindrical shaped device has a single needle to "tenderize" the hammers followed by the shaping. It does a superb job so long as I'm careful enough not to overdue it with the needling.
***** Did you have help by a Software or did you tune just with your ears? My thought is, when I would have a Software, it could be easier... but thanks for sharing your experiences :)
My upright console piano was a whole step down. I spent like 3 days tuning it but it sounds pretty good now. It was my first time tuning a piano, but I have a very good ear as well as a tuner. I got every note on that sucker perfect. It sucked tuning it though, because on the upper set of keys, I'd spend about 15 minutes per key tuning because even the slightest movement would change the tuning so much. If you're willing to tune it yourself, you can get it done fairly quickly. I say tune it about a quarter of a step up for the first half of the keys, because when you tune the rest, those strings kinda flatten a little. Then you can go back and mess with any that are a little off. It may take 2 or 3 rounds to get them all in tune as well as make them hold the tune, but it'll be worth it. I would probably never tune a piano that out of tune ever again if I could help it, unless I'm getting paid for it. Lol. It is time consuming and very tiring.
ARE...YOU...CRAZY???!!! DID YOU WATCH THIS VIDEO OR NOT?!!! HE JUST WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH IT COSTS TO TUNE A PIANO AND YOU ASK IF YOU CAN...TUNE...A...PIANO?????!!!!!
That current rate is hard to believe. My friend and I, as teemagers in the late 40's and early 50's, would eagerly await the tuner in Chicago because he was a wisend bird with many stories. And it was about $!00 then. It was an M&H 9-ft.
Exactly, the money spent doesn't necessarily equate the service rendered to anything we buy nor try to maintain. Unfortunately, in every aspect of life, there are always those who have an over-inflated opinion of themselves, or those who use rhetoric and persuasion to con the public into that for which they truly do not need nor deserve. The resulting factors: mistrust, skepticism, and eventual financial hardship for those who do have the value and skills for which they work so hard. Dishonesty, hyperbole, and downright lies takes a toll on the truly skilled artisan, the consumer, and eventually any country that falls into such abuses. Look around at the current affairs and the state of financial ruin of these United States . . . only a blind person can miss the abuse, the dishonesty, and the results this country has suffered due to the greed and dishonesty of so many opportunists.
russmaleartist I'm a professional piano tuner. one 'trick' you can use to ensure the tuner you have hired is legitimate is to tell him/her that your piano needs to be at concert pitch because it is going to be used to accompany an excellent violinist. if the piano is a good one this should not be a problem for him. if he gives you ANY excuse as to why he can't do this THERE AND THEN..he's a bad piano tuner. if the piano is not so good perhaps ask him to explain 'equal temperament'. again, if he is a good tuner this should not present any problem.
Know someone who bought a used piano a church was getting rid of. The instrument was too far out of tune and the tuner recommended a second tuning session. The first was basically to get the tuning close-enough to the ideal without breaking the strings. A lady whose son is a musician with a good ear used to tune her piano with a tool that looks like a screwdriver to turn the nut for each piano key individually. May not be a professional job but sufficient to avoid paying for a technician.
*Dad:* Buys new Upright Piano. *Me (2009):* Lol a piano... Ok, back to Pokemon... *Me (2016, no experience):* I want to play the piano we have. *Me 2017, a bit of experience):* I am starting to notice that our piano sounds bad compared to RUclips videos I listen to. *Me:* Dad, When did you last tune the piano. *Dad:* What is tuning? *Me:* .-. Okay... (Our Piano was never tuned, even after receiving it). I tuned it Spring 2018 and after we moved, it sounded horrible again, I'm not willing to pay 100 Euros every tuning so I am going to do it myself, patience and practice.
“It’s not the tuners fault if a string breaks” - uh yeah it is. If you hire painters and they spill a bucket of paint on the floor, they better be paying for it. If you take your car for an oil change and it comes back with huge dents, the mechanic better be paying for it. If I hire a professional to fix my piano and they do more damage to it, they’re sure as hell paying for it
You should watch some piano tuning tutorials. You can get a piano tuning kit real cheap ($11) on Amazon (great reviews and the only complaint was that the tuning hammer is a little short but you can slip a piece of pipe over the handle to increase the torque). As for the tuner, I recommend AP Tuner free software.
I can’t believe I just watched a five minute video called “how much does it cost to tune a piano” and I still don’t know how much it costs to tune a piano.
Our school piano used to be tuned by this elderly gentleman who was old school and did it all by ear, it was fascinating to watch him work. The piano always sounded amazing when he was finished.
Yeah they dont make them like that anymore.
@@bartenderzzz They do. Competent machine tuners still use their ears. And the tuning test is still requires you to tune by ear. The machine gets you close quicker. Think of it as the phrase you cannot tune an out of tune piano. This essentially gets you close enough so that you only need to do fine adjustments and fine adjustments are always done by ear unless you have a bad piano technician. The machines do get you very close where about 80-90% of the piano requires no further tuning, but that 10-20% does require you to use your ears. This is especially true in the base.
When I was a kid, we had an old upright piano out in a barn behind the house (a big old rambling farmhouse which had been in my mom's family for many generations). I had been there as long as I could remember and my parents even had no idea how long it had been there because it was there when my mom was a kid too. A couple of the keys were broken and the wood was starting to rot in places. So it hadn't been tuned at least since my mom was a kid, but at least the notes were recognizable, which is amazing given what I know now about pianos. I took an interest in it all on my own and started practicing on it. I got pretty good and was able to play a whole song by ear (some kid's song) from start to end. So without even asking me, my parents had the piano tuned and sent me to piano lessons. At the time, I didn't think anything odd about that, but I now wonder what the piano tuner must have thought! The teacher was a strict old lady, and that killed my interest in the piano.
My piano hasn't been tuned in over 50 years... It was my great great grandmothers
i know, same...
does it sound somewhere near in tune ?
Nicolas Labra yes, it's playable for practice. Definitely doesn't sound good though
Why don't you get it tuned?
TUNE THATPIANO my family has been thinking about it for years, just other things have come up and we put it off becuase the piano needs to be restained too. Actually we might actually try to have the piano worked on this week:)
I cannot answer this without seeing the instrument. In addition it depends on the present pitch, the visual condition of the strings and the firmness of the tuning pins.
Are you in the USA? Have you asked "Living Pianos?"
If the instrument was completely restored so recently, why is the pitch already incorrect?
Twice yearly (at least) is a must !
Thank you. You have good energy my friend.
Will be moving mine to where I’m at now don’t know how long it’s been since it was tuned I would have to guess mabey 60+ years belonged to my great grandfather who played professionally
Pianos have a condition called octave stretching.. this means that if you try to tune every note to perfect pitch then even with high tech gear that tells you every note is perfect, you will find that for example an 'A" in the lower register will be out of tune when played against and 'A" in the upper register..... this is one of the many reasons why piano tuning is a specialist affair... a good piano tuner doesn't require software or high tech equipment...they just have a fabulous ear.... oh and to answer some other questions out there... a piano that hasn't been tuning for a couple of decades will be a major job...the last time i tuned a piano to concert pitch that hadn't been tuned for over 30 years, it took approximately 6 hours to do! no kidding!
Another great and informative video. Thank you!
Indeed you are powerful as the emperor has foreseen
What?
Meesa Jar Jar Binks!
About the old saying "you can't tune an out if tune piano", couldn't the tuner just tune first a low note, than a high note? Going from the edges of the piano to the middle.
Or I just don't understand the saying :P
well think about it this way. There is a lot of tension. Literally multiple tons of weight. Every string has about somewhere between 75 and 200 pounds of weight which varies from piano to piano as there are some bad pianos with very low tension. But when you increase the tension on 1 string you are bending the physical piano and that actually decreases the weight of all of the other strings in the piano. If you decrease the tension of one string the piano's plate relaxes a bit putting more tension on the other strings. So essentially if you tune 1 note sharper, every other note goes flat. When you are raising the pitch a lot for each string you are going to see a lot of change due to the principle I stated above. So essentially with a pitch raise, the tuners use some math and tune all of the notes sharp (or flat if the piano is way too sharp) so that when they stop the notes have settled in a position where they are close to pitch. Now once you are close while the principle still applies, the difference becomes too little to hear when you are making small fine adjustments. So essentially you need to keep tuning the piano until all of the notes are close enough to the point where you are adjusting the pitch so little that the effect makes no difference to the actual tuning.
So essentially the tldr version is you can tune an out of tune piano, but when it is way out of tune, you have no idea where it is going to be after you are done tuning. So you have to tune it until its close to be capable of making fine adjustments without every other note on the piano going out of tune.
I love the explanation provided. Spot on!
Wonderful, informative video.
Bill Larson
Thank you for the great video!...
Damp Chaser, look a piano hates humidity changes. If you live in the midwest especially where humidity goes up and down radically you need a damp chaser. Ask any tuner, they reduce how many visits are required to maintain your piano. They maintain a constant level of humidity inside your instrument. You just plug it in keep it full of water and close up your instrument while not in use. Also don't keep your piano in a sunny part of the room. Nothing causes a bridge too loose it's crown faster than inconsistent humidity pianos that live in the tropics need a damp chaser. Also tuning at least 3 times a year is like maintaining your car. A piano is like a car engine many moving parts not like a violin that just gets better with age. Also remember humidity changes not tempreture changes so much that damage pianos over time.
$170 for my grand piano
Thanks for posting how much it actually cost you.
@@notafanboy250 Dude he literally said "for MY grand piano"
Great info. Thanks!
However much they cost they always seem to be a lot cheaper than a plumber, electrician or other building tradesperson. I always feel they're undercharging me so I overpay (tip) my tuner/tech. (I have a half decent piano, a Kwai, so its well behaved and relatively easy to keep in tune.)
i have a piano from 1970 that has never been tuned
still works and is out of tune, what is a estimate price it would cost to get it tuned? and how many times will it need to be tuned?
At least 100 to 150 $
It will depend on how far from standard pitch it is. It will also depend on what area you're in as tuning costs vary from one area to another. You should probably figure on 1.25 to 1.5 times the normal tuning rate. So if a normal tuning rate in your area is $100, then the cost with a pitch adjustment and normal tuning would be $125 to $150.
found an upright piano for 70 dollars... badly out of tune but all keys work.Should i buy?
yes you should
Its JayBoi probably not, odds are it will not stay in tune
Its JayBoi I say it's a steal
Its JayBoi make sure the pedals work!! I can't tell you how many times I've gone to see a piano and all the keys worked but the pedals didn't do anything.
I got a Baldwin upright piano (not a spinet) for 50 dollars from some college kid who needed to move. All the keys work, however, one key in the bass sticks a little, but that's about it. One key is slightly chipped at the end, but I have a replacement veneer I can put on it. Also all the pedals work (including the sostenuto). It holds its tune well. I tell you what, craigslist can get you some real bargains if you are patient enough.
I recently bought a 1913 Ivers & Pond upright in decent condition. The tuner (whom I'd hired before to assess another piano I was considering) charged $107.17 including tax and told us we'll likely be able to get away with one tune per annum. Given how expensive the Austin area has become I thought this was quite a good deal!
I have a question. I have a square grand piano from the 1860's. It has been COMEPLETELTY restored in the 90's, and it has a very good sound. I've never heard anything like it (comparing it to other square grands from youtube and real life). It has a custom made action that looks like a normal grand piano's action. But because it has custom made parts, and the fact that it is an old instrument, is it still possible to "concert tune" it?
You may break a few strings in the process. Restringing is the answer. You need a wire guage to ensure you use correct guages. I am assuming that it was restrung by the guy up above who may have used incorrect guages. There are lotss of cowboys about!
+RONALD WARE So the string will completely snap?
If the piano has standard size tuning pins then you should be fine with tuning it.
My tuner is coming back tomorrow went way out of tune Had it tuned last week
but went out of tune right away. Hope for the best tomorrow.
HAVE YOU GOT SOME LOOSE TUNING PINS?
@@ronaldware1239 It could have been the air conditioning also. If you are not paying attention to the vents, that can throw a piano completely out of tune. It also could be an armature piano tuner, or obviously damage is another thing.
Just get the biggest Kawai CA series...regular concert keyboard..it's got an actual wood soundboard, sound is initially produced by an amp+speakers hidden inside, then it propagates through the soundboard.
It's 95% close to a real pian without the pains. At around 3-4k $
I have a piano at school really bad out of tune, missing 2 pedals, and I think strings. Its wood is also in bad condition. Band directors dont want it. What should we do?
@Elliot Rodger That is the DUMBEST answer ever.
Send it to The Antique Piano Shop for restoration. They can also install a PNOMation system in it to make it play by itself.
My collegue & I were llooking at a square grand that was a beautiful pice of furniture. Exquisite! The owner asked for an opinion. Kenneth got in first much to my pleasure. "It's wonderful to behold," he said. "alright unless you actually want to play it"
They are not good instruments and a decent grand or upright is better to play and easier to maintain or tune.
How do you ensure that a used piano that you buy does not have bedbugs or cockroaches? (Serious question!)
How many times a year should you tune your piano ????
WHY NOT - tune a few basses, then a few trebles, then some mid-range, etc? There's got to be a way to use some variation of this method that minimizes the flex/detune problem.
Its about the literal flex of the wood and the plate. When you put tension on the piano, that bends the plate more and therefore drops the tension of the other strings around it. Usually you will accounting for the fact that the strings will change. You don't know exactly where they will end up, but that's why you tune it 2-3 times when the pitch is way off. The closer you are to pitch, the less the rest of the piano will go out of tune. So you essentially you use math to figure out where the pitch will drop or raise to and then you do a fine tuning to get it perfect.
Is there a kind of Piano Tuner/Technician Guild, or some other professional piano association that exists that the qualified tuners/technicians belong to that might offer some assurances when shopping for a tuner?
PTG piano technicians guild. Just go to their home page and they got a list of active tuners. You can search by area.
you covered all the bases, good job
And the trebles.
In my 40+ years of experience as a piano tech, I can say that string breakage by a tuner is almost invariably due to the tuner being absent minded(which of course includes my having been guilty of this "infraction"). However, if a truly competent tuner breaks a string due to the string being afflicted with rust, THAT is understandable because the string has lost its elasticity. And if most if not all the strings are quite rusty I'd suggest getting the instrument restrung.
Hey I live in Tennessee and at my school we have a piano out of tune badly, missing strings and 2 pedals (middle and far left). Band directors done want it anymore and want to rid it. If you want you can come pick it up and try to refurb it or use parts
Hi Robert! I have a question you could make a video about: Do you need to renew the strings on a piano, and if so, when?
Would love to have this question answered :D
+MCMeru Not really. Old strings do loose some sustain, especially if they are rusty, otherwise if the piano is good brand (i.e. made with decent strings) it's pretty much not necessary. Bass strings do go dead and if they are (and the piano is in good shape, no soundboard cracks e.t.c.) then replacing them is a good idea provided the replacement set is of good quality. Sometimes loosening the bass strings, one at a time, releasing each at the hitch pin end and putting in a half turn in the direction of the copper wind to tighten the copper helps.
After 50 years or more. Can you wait that long?
i think that steinway should make a piano that has a system like spirio, but that tunes the piano. a computer like operator in the pinblock that tunes it. that you would be amazing
That would be neat. 2 issues. 1 is the tension is actually very high. It would require both a motor with high torque and high precision since you are moving the tuning pin fractions of a millimeter. I don't know of anything that is small enough to be built into the piano, but that's not to say that we will not develop that. The other one is sound. So we do have electronic tuning devices that listen to the piano and tune them, but the issue is they aren't always right. They will get you close, but with all of the compromises that are in place to make a piano under 36 feet long you have inharmonicity which means you cannot use pitch to tune the piano. what you use is the beating between the notes so that the notes all sound good when played together. If you tune it to pitch, you will play a cord that sounds like complete trash. So essentially that needs to be custom for every piano. We also have come a long way as far as tuning devices have come so they may eventually get to the point where they are as good as a good piano technicians ear, but they are not there yet. That being said, they are close enough to the point where the average person would not be able to tell. I mean most people only hear when the unisons are out of tune which is the easy part of tuning. So essentially if you aren't that picky or are tone def, you can just get a cheap guy with a machine to tune your piano.
thanks for posting this
Concert level ?
I inherited an upright from around 1900, but it's out of tune... the whole thing is flat by a whole step
You could get it tuned to a semi-tone flat if the pin-block is cracked. If the pin-block isn't cracked then you should be able to get it tuned to concert pitch.
Whats the longest time since someones tuned their piano and if tuned how much did it cost?
I want to see if theres a hope lol..
I have seen pianos go 110 years since their last tuning. Now the tuning was not stable, several strings broke and needed replacement, but it was done. I do not know the cost nor can I make that judgment since it depends on where you live. Ultimately you can look at your strings. If they are rusty then there is the risk of strings braking if they are too far out of tune. The next thing you test is you take a guitar tuner and you play the A string. IF its more than 2 steps flat ( F#/G) or sharp (B/C) then you do run the risk of breaking strings (if rusty) and cracks forming in the sound board. Cracks in sound boards are normal with old pianos and most of the time have very little effect on sound.
What you can do is tune it sharp of flat so you don't have to shift the entire pitch if you are worried about damage. so I can tell you that there is likely hope. Other pianos that are 80-90 years since their last tuning are usually tuned flat if the customer is worried about damage. It may sound flat, but remember that A is currently 440, in 1920s a was 432. And bach tuned a to 415. Some Russian composers tuned a to 460. So overall pitch isn't necessarily the most important thing in the world. What matters most is ensuring that the notes are equally spaced apart so that you can have musicality as well as ensuring that the unisons are in tune (each of the 3 strings per note being exactly the same)
Great video
i have a piano from the 1970s never been tuned before it does sount kinda in tune but doesn't sound good. any estimate for how many tuning and what the cost it is to tune it to stay in tune???
I understand that some concert pianists travel with their own personal piano tuner for concerts.
what is the piano soundfont at intro of the video? or was that recorded by a real one?
It's Estrin playing on the piano he's sitting at.
how do you voice a piano? my piano is pretty bright and I want to make it softer. any help?
+DogeOnAZipline The problem is finding a tech who actually knows how to do this. The process involves pushing a 3 pin needle tool into each hammer in several places to open up the wool. Also, if it has been played a lot, the hammers will have compacted and flattened a bit, so reshaping followed by needling may be needed. In the case of reshaping, let off regulation may be necessary to compensate for the slightly reduced hammer height. What he says is right, find somebody who tunes concert pianos.
Leave it alone, it is a job for an expert.
Mini_Moose-27
voicing a piano is highly skilled work. however, on many bright pianos the brightness is caused by the hardening of the tip of the hammer felt - the point at which the hammer strikes the string. using a needle, LIGHTLY stroke the tip of the offending hammers with the needle tip. DO NOT push the needle into the hammer. this is often a very good solution to the problem. I have been a tuner for 25 years and have used this fix many times. don't try to VOICE the piano yourself. it'll end in tears.
Actually reshaping can follow the needling because I use a technique whereby a motor driven cylindrical shaped device has a single needle to "tenderize" the hammers followed by the shaping. It does a superb job so long as I'm careful enough not to overdue it with the needling.
Great Video!!
But is it hard to tune on his own? Maybe with a Software?
Greetings from Germany :)
***** Did you have help by a Software or did you tune just with your ears? My thought is, when I would have a Software, it could be easier...
but thanks for sharing your experiences :)
***** Maybe you're right :) thank for protecting from a big mistake :)
+LeafAlike Absolutely.
AP Tuner is a great free software for tuning anything from pianos to guitars.
Glad to see you taking this channel to a higher level, Bob!
My piano is so out of tune its not tuned to middle c anymore. It's shifted half a step down.
My upright console piano was a whole step down. I spent like 3 days tuning it but it sounds pretty good now. It was my first time tuning a piano, but I have a very good ear as well as a tuner. I got every note on that sucker perfect. It sucked tuning it though, because on the upper set of keys, I'd spend about 15 minutes per key tuning because even the slightest movement would change the tuning so much.
If you're willing to tune it yourself, you can get it done fairly quickly. I say tune it about a quarter of a step up for the first half of the keys, because when you tune the rest, those strings kinda flatten a little. Then you can go back and mess with any that are a little off. It may take 2 or 3 rounds to get them all in tune as well as make them hold the tune, but it'll be worth it. I would probably never tune a piano that out of tune ever again if I could help it, unless I'm getting paid for it. Lol. It is time consuming and very tiring.
Can a piano be tuned?
ARE...YOU...CRAZY???!!! DID YOU WATCH THIS VIDEO OR NOT?!!! HE JUST WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH IT COSTS TO TUNE A PIANO AND YOU ASK IF YOU CAN...TUNE...A...PIANO?????!!!!!
Mine hasn't been tuned since 1908 😶
That current rate is hard to believe. My friend and I, as teemagers in the late 40's and early 50's, would eagerly await the tuner in Chicago because he was a wisend bird with many stories. And it was about $!00 then. It was an M&H 9-ft.
Exactly, the money spent doesn't necessarily equate the service rendered to anything we buy nor try to maintain. Unfortunately, in every aspect of life, there are always those who have an over-inflated opinion of themselves, or those who use rhetoric and persuasion to con the public into that for which they truly do not need nor deserve. The resulting factors: mistrust, skepticism, and eventual financial hardship for those who do have the value and skills for which they work so hard. Dishonesty, hyperbole, and downright lies takes a toll on the truly skilled artisan, the consumer, and eventually any country that falls into such abuses. Look around at the current affairs and the state of financial ruin of these United States . . . only a blind person can miss the abuse, the dishonesty, and the results this country has suffered due to the greed and dishonesty of so many opportunists.
You have hit the nail right on the head!
russmaleartist
I'm a professional piano tuner. one 'trick' you can use to ensure the tuner you have hired is legitimate is to tell him/her that your piano needs to be at concert pitch because it is going to be used to accompany an excellent violinist. if the piano is a good one this should not be a problem for him. if he gives you ANY excuse as to why he can't do this THERE AND THEN..he's a bad piano tuner. if the piano is not so good perhaps ask him to explain 'equal temperament'. again, if he is a good tuner this should not present any problem.
Tari mano,????
100$ per hour Canada.
Know someone who bought a used piano a church was getting rid of. The instrument was too far out of tune and the tuner recommended a second tuning session. The first was basically to get the tuning close-enough to the ideal without breaking the strings. A lady whose son is a musician with a good ear used to tune her piano with a tool that looks like a screwdriver to turn the nut for each piano key individually. May not be a professional job but sufficient to avoid paying for a technician.
If you begrudge paying a few pounds it cannot be much of a piano.
how long s a piano string? :D
+PinkPonyOfPrey depends on the note and the size of the piano!!! How long is a piece of string?
Long enough. Depends on the piano.
*Dad:* Buys new Upright Piano.
*Me (2009):* Lol a piano... Ok, back to Pokemon...
*Me (2016, no experience):* I want to play the piano we have.
*Me 2017, a bit of experience):* I am starting to notice that our piano sounds bad compared to RUclips videos I listen to.
*Me:* Dad, When did you last tune the piano.
*Dad:* What is tuning?
*Me:* .-. Okay... (Our Piano was never tuned, even after receiving it).
I tuned it Spring 2018 and after we moved, it sounded horrible again, I'm not willing to pay 100 Euros every tuning so I am going to do it myself, patience and practice.
I tune mine every year
Tina is the tuner who tunes.
It's been 20 years and I'd say this piano is about 600 bucks....how much? Should I?
It will probably cost you between 120 usd and 180 usd since it likely needs a pitch raise. Depends on the quality of tuning and the location you live.
Can you tune a skin flute
I have a 100 year paino, was first tuned 1 year ago. Hahahaha. Whoops.
“It’s not the tuners fault if a string breaks” - uh yeah it is. If you hire painters and they spill a bucket of paint on the floor, they better be paying for it. If you take your car for an oil change and it comes back with huge dents, the mechanic better be paying for it. If I hire a professional to fix my piano and they do more damage to it, they’re sure as hell paying for it
You look kind of like Mark Hamill.
skidude9800 I was thinking the late comedian Jerry Lewis!
My piano is a whole step out of tune and I don't have enough money to pay for it😭
You should watch some piano tuning tutorials. You can get a piano tuning kit real cheap ($11) on Amazon (great reviews and the only complaint was that the tuning hammer is a little short but you can slip a piece of pipe over the handle to increase the torque). As for the tuner, I recommend AP Tuner free software.
The way he says "pitch"...
Too much, it seems.
It just cost me AU$210.00
I am pied off
And remember you can't tune a fish.
I don't get it.
I wonder how much it would cost to actually build your own piano... If you knew how lol.
A tech in Europe who aspires to get an advance degree requires three years and likely spending time in a factory.
$21,521.23 exactly...
Thomas 17701827 much much more. Keep in mind it needs a cast iron plate, special strings, high quality laminated wood, The brass...
I actually looked that up and got no results.
I can’t believe I just watched a five minute video called “how much does it cost to tune a piano” and I still don’t know how much it costs to tune a piano.
He said $100-150 if you listened
He mentioned it : " it depends ".
@Hawker75 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Could have made a way shorter video by just saying, “it depends “.
My piano hasn’t been tuned in 40 years, i realized that it would cost less to buy another piano.
First to comment
My piano hasn't been tuned in over 50 years... It was my great great grandmothers
Probably needs a pitch raise - Are you in eastern NC? $145 plus mileage. kingsfriendmusic.com