I am a saxophonist who teaches improvisation to students of all instruments. I asked my cello student to check out these fingerings, as I believe it will be easier for him to improvise if he has easy to memorize fingering patterns. I also encouraged him to check out Chris Tate who seems to do a great job improvising, and the way he plays scales seems similar to guitar players. He stays often within a specific area of the fingerboard. What's your insight on this issue? Thanks for sharing your fingerings!
I totally get what you are looking for - patterns to use for improv. I have one with jazz scales that has specific cello fingerings (I'm seeing several for all string instruments, but cellists have different fingering needs). I can't see any example pages on this one, but it might be useful: The Complete Scale Book for Cello: Jazz, Modal and Exotic Scales. I'll write again if I find the one I have.
This is so fantastic and….encouraging, as have been trying to establish these finger pattens using closed positions: no open strings!!! Ab and relative minor F are favorites. Getting out of one’s comfort zone while as finding efficient/universal fingers! Thank you!!!
@@CelloRefinery of course, that does necessarily mean that I play them well! But I enjoy improvising in keys that are less common! Do you have any tips on improving intonation in thumb positions where the intervals becoming increasingly close together?!
@lakeninevah Ken, what's cool about your question is that I literally just made and posted a short about how the spacing changes from 1st to 4th position. My plan is to do similar videos for higher positions as well, so I'm on your wavelength! You'll see those later this week, most likely.
Hi again - I just posted a video about working on intonation and adjusting to spacing in the lower thumb positions and just above 4th position. I'm not sure that hits your question exactly, but I'll make one soon about the highest notes and how squished together they are!
I 100% agree, and I'm watching more than one student right now struggle with this concept. It doesn't make sense until you've done it like a zillion times. If only our hands were bigger (or we played the violin) we'd be able to do scales in 1st position without shifting, but the cello is too big so we're stuck with this.
Thank you for this help! I have been dreaming about scales in the upper positions, but it has been unclear for some time..hard to find a book ( Klengel) that does not intimidate.
I'll go look at that again; you are not the only one that has mentioned this. Meanwhile, here's the link: cellochaplin.wixsite.com/cellorefinery/leftarm-refinery
@@CelloRefinery thanks for the reply! Actually I have that page but that's the issue. It only shows vibrato fingers photo link and none of the previous links like the universal scales pdfs etc
@@Dparrey Hmmm, how is that possible? The page opens for me. Try here for the pdf 4fa56794-24a2-4146-8117-665da557d9e5.filesusr.com/ugd/5ded15_4d011b8e91064b4491e430a84085bd52.pdf
@@CelloRefinery I did a little testing and just figured out that it shows like that on mobile for me. Android and on chrome for reference. But on desktop browser mode shows normally. Thanks for your help and amazing content ☺️
@@Dparrey I was wondering if it was an equipment problem - I think there's too much content on that page for mobile, but I'll see if I can edit it so things show. Thanks for the input!
Someone else had this problem recently; I need to make the links more obvious. Here's the page where the pdfs live: cellochaplin.wixsite.com/cellorefinery/leftarm-refinery
I really don't see the point in this. There is nothing wrong with using open position in scales, especially when they are smoother, more likely to be perfectly in tune, and save unnecessary stretching. I get that some scales need to have flexible fingering and for artistic reasons might be better occasionally with no open strings, but this is rare. As you demonstrated, it is much more difficult to keep things in tune when you impose awkward fingerings on yourself.
I agree that many scales become more difficult with these fingerings, and I absolutely do NOT use the universal fingering except when you can't use open strings (scales in 4 or more sharps or flats). But sometimes in repertoire you have to do a passage that lands somewhere odd up in a position, and need fingering patterns to get yourself there. I find that the main use of this one-size-fits-all approach to fingering is for students who have to memorize all the scales for auditions. Some orchestras do a cold call for scales - at the audition they say "play an Ab major scale." If you are really proficient with the universal fingering, you don't have to do the math to figure out that you MUST use universal fingering for that scale, and you don't even have to know the key signature. Just play the pattern. Some teachers actually teach scales this way, without the notes, just the fingering pattern. (I don't)
Do note auditions, exams, and technical assessments require no open strings as playing in higher positions is expected. 1st position is rudimentary. It is also awesome to play more on certain strings of your cello. My G on my C strings sounds so much more satisfying to play than an open G in various passages from the pieces I’ve played.
@@joshuakane6047 Totally agree! And actually, advanced violinists are expected to play scales up in positions and not start in first position. This kind of fingering basically achieves that. And, as to your point, there is a kind of unspoken cello goal of being able to play any note anywhere with any finger on the instrument, and here's one of the ones you develop that freedom.
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Amazing tutorial. Many thanks 🌹
This fingering does make memorizing scales easier.
I am a saxophonist who teaches improvisation to students of all instruments. I asked my cello student to check out these fingerings, as I believe it will be easier for him to improvise if he has easy to memorize fingering patterns. I also encouraged him to check out Chris Tate who seems to do a great job improvising, and the way he plays scales seems similar to guitar players. He stays often within a specific area of the fingerboard. What's your insight on this issue? Thanks for sharing your fingerings!
I totally get what you are looking for - patterns to use for improv. I have one with jazz scales that has specific cello fingerings (I'm seeing several for all string instruments, but cellists have different fingering needs). I can't see any example pages on this one, but it might be useful: The Complete Scale Book for Cello: Jazz, Modal and Exotic Scales. I'll write again if I find the one I have.
This is so fantastic and….encouraging, as have been trying to establish these finger pattens using closed positions: no open strings!!! Ab and relative minor F are favorites. Getting out of one’s comfort zone while as finding efficient/universal fingers! Thank you!!!
I'm super impressed that those 4-flats keys are your favorites - they are tough!!
@@CelloRefinery of course, that does necessarily mean that I play them well! But I enjoy improvising in keys that are less common! Do you have any tips on improving intonation in thumb positions where the intervals becoming increasingly close together?!
@lakeninevah Ken, what's cool about your question is that I literally just made and posted a short about how the spacing changes from 1st to 4th position. My plan is to do similar videos for higher positions as well, so I'm on your wavelength! You'll see those later this week, most likely.
Hi again - I just posted a video about working on intonation and adjusting to spacing in the lower thumb positions and just above 4th position. I'm not sure that hits your question exactly, but I'll make one soon about the highest notes and how squished together they are!
Counterintuitive that you have to shift to lower positions as you go up a scale.
I 100% agree, and I'm watching more than one student right now struggle with this concept. It doesn't make sense until you've done it like a zillion times. If only our hands were bigger (or we played the violin) we'd be able to do scales in 1st position without shifting, but the cello is too big so we're stuck with this.
Thanks, that’s more advanced scales, but still interesting 😊
Right, but always interesting to see what's ahead!
This is wonderful! Where can I get the PDF?
Go here cellochaplin.wixsite.com/cellorefinery/leftarm-refinery
Thank you for this help! I have been dreaming about scales in the upper positions, but it has been unclear for some time..hard to find a book ( Klengel) that does not intimidate.
Glad it was helpful!
Thank you
You're welcome
Seems like the links are missing from the page now sadly.
I'll go look at that again; you are not the only one that has mentioned this. Meanwhile, here's the link: cellochaplin.wixsite.com/cellorefinery/leftarm-refinery
@@CelloRefinery thanks for the reply! Actually I have that page but that's the issue. It only shows vibrato fingers photo link and none of the previous links like the universal scales pdfs etc
@@Dparrey Hmmm, how is that possible? The page opens for me. Try here for the pdf
4fa56794-24a2-4146-8117-665da557d9e5.filesusr.com/ugd/5ded15_4d011b8e91064b4491e430a84085bd52.pdf
@@CelloRefinery I did a little testing and just figured out that it shows like that on mobile for me. Android and on chrome for reference. But on desktop browser mode shows normally. Thanks for your help and amazing content ☺️
@@Dparrey I was wondering if it was an equipment problem - I think there's too much content on that page for mobile, but I'll see if I can edit it so things show. Thanks for the input!
I can't find the pdf, someone help?
Someone else had this problem recently; I need to make the links more obvious. Here's the page where the pdfs live: cellochaplin.wixsite.com/cellorefinery/leftarm-refinery
@@CelloRefinery thank you so much, for the video and for your reply!
I really don't see the point in this. There is nothing wrong with using open position in scales, especially when they are smoother, more likely to be perfectly in tune, and save unnecessary stretching. I get that some scales need to have flexible fingering and for artistic reasons might be better occasionally with no open strings, but this is rare. As you demonstrated, it is much more difficult to keep things in tune when you impose awkward fingerings on yourself.
I agree that many scales become more difficult with these fingerings, and I absolutely do NOT use the universal fingering except when you can't use open strings (scales in 4 or more sharps or flats). But sometimes in repertoire you have to do a passage that lands somewhere odd up in a position, and need fingering patterns to get yourself there. I find that the main use of this one-size-fits-all approach to fingering is for students who have to memorize all the scales for auditions. Some orchestras do a cold call for scales - at the audition they say "play an Ab major scale." If you are really proficient with the universal fingering, you don't have to do the math to figure out that you MUST use universal fingering for that scale, and you don't even have to know the key signature. Just play the pattern. Some teachers actually teach scales this way, without the notes, just the fingering pattern. (I don't)
Do note auditions, exams, and technical assessments require no open strings as playing in higher positions is expected. 1st position is rudimentary. It is also awesome to play more on certain strings of your cello.
My G on my C strings sounds so much more satisfying to play than an open G in various passages from the pieces I’ve played.
@@joshuakane6047 Totally agree! And actually, advanced violinists are expected to play scales up in positions and not start in first position. This kind of fingering basically achieves that. And, as to your point, there is a kind of unspoken cello goal of being able to play any note anywhere with any finger on the instrument, and here's one of the ones you develop that freedom.