I think it's a lot more about how close you are to failure. You can do lots of sets, but if you're not close to failure then you're missing out on hypertrophy. But a mix of high volume close to failure should lead to good hypertrophy
I am not counting sets or reps. I only care about how I feel. If I think I can do one more set, that's nice. If I have the feeling I can't do any quality reps anymore I am done with the exercise.
I dont think volume training is over rated IMHO I need both high/low volume to grow but hey if experience has taught me anything is everybody is diff and I truly believe its all bout nutrition!!!! 💯🇲🇽🇺🇸
I go to failure every time. Last week I almost went to the gym four times, but I failed each time. That’s four days of going to failure. Winner, right here.
Too many people sacrifice effort in the pursuit of reaching an arbitrary number sets, just because they read in a study or somebody said that it was "optimal"... I prefer to keep intensity/effort as high as possible AND THEN adjust the volume
JC FITNESS ACADEMY This is something I've recently discovered for myself, to a "T". I was doing these comparatively low-effort sets just to hit a certain number and think I was training "optimally", then had the audacity to get frustrated at my lack of progress. Just in the past two weeks since I've implemented a lower volume, higher intensity approach I have seen changes in my physique.
Volume can go to the back of the line and stay there The most worthy and honorable chemical reaction of them all.... Metabolic stress Inherits kingship by default Incontestable proclamation Next
Everybody promoted a different style. Mentzer and Yates promoted the one set method, others spent 3 hrs in the gym (Arnold). In the end, everything worked. Bottom line is, make your muscles work, be consistent and pay attention to your nutrition.
cj77 false. John meadows trains like Dorian. With his twist obviously. Mike Mentzer Never got injured by the way. Dorian got injured because at that time he was an innovator. No one walked that path before. He was the first mass monster ever. He took it to the next level with intensity. And he said that he got injured when dieting hard. Instead of slowing down close to competition he kept training super heavy while being depleted of nutrients. That’s how he got injured. His method is the best.
@@Dr_Footbrake The thing is that Dorian's method requires mental fortitude that most people don't have. Yes, going in and lifting weights isn't hard in and of itself, however, that last small extra push is what a lot of people aren't willing to do, but it makes all the difference. Also, Dorian's style of training pretty much required a training partner. However, there are other intensity techniques that you can apply if you don't have a partner and get a similar effect, such as Cluster sets, which John often talks about.
One would actually wonder, however, just truly how many total sets Mentzer might have really done, vice potentially merely claimed to have done to promote his 'Heavy Duty' stuff...
I honestly loved the days when I never knew most of what I know about lifting. When i was young i would just lift the weight without caring about sets and reps. I would just eat and workout. The results were fantastic but now it's all this research this research that.
I like your channel best because you're honest and you don't shout at your viewers in videos. It's nice to learn and hear a fitness industry leader speaking normally to us.
essentially just train according to your instinct like what old school bodybuilders do. If you have problem with recovery and your diet is on point then lower the volume. If you feel like you can push more then increase the volume.
@@jfmorache It's the other way around for me, if I do too many sets I'll lose adherence. But I can do heavy weight low reps and low sets and I will train often.
Keep growing that beard out, John. I think you'll look even more badass when it comes in full. I also totally agree about training to failure with good form... at least on the final set of a given movement, sometimes the final two.
John you are by far my favorite in this industry. So informative and knowledgeable. I watch and listen to you daily and want to thank you. I love seeing you let your son do his yo yo tricks mixed into your clips. You are a Good man. Thank you again
An observation that I have is that most of these videos I have to rewatch periodically, because they will click with me when I am in the right mindset. So I watched this video before, and it was great, but watching it right now again, it really made sense because I am at the right point with my thinking. This is probably my favorite muscle building channel.
This is exactly what I've been doing these last 3 months and I gained 13lbs doing it. My bench press shot up by only doing 1 set to failure (with a spotter!) as opposed to doing 3x5 routines. I can go to failure now and still recover from it, because in the end.. You're only doing 4 hard sets per workout. As John said at the end, on days you're feeling good, add a dropset or an amrap set with 50% of the weight. Works wonders for me. Thanks for another great video, John, this is gold!
I think the HIT is the best, but it's good to sprinkle pump sets sometimes. I also think for people with great genetics, whatever they will do they will grow. hard gainers or when you hit plateaus is when you should start really calculating what you do IMO
In my opinion, your body and muscles don't have a concept of set, reps, volume, etc. etc. All your body knows is whether it is being stressed at this time, and if yes, that it will need time to recover afterwards. I know it is somewhat of a useless advice, but people should just try to get in tune with their bodies, and then push their limits. Great video John. Time and time again you speak sense and convince me that yours is one of the very few youtube channels worth following.
damn! this is the best video about volume and intensity. Your thinking is pretty much the same as mine, at one point i was really concerned about how much volume should i do and i was counting exact weekly volume blablabla, but then i just stopped caring and stopped counting my volume and just started to really focus on that quality hard intense top set and focus on progression
Volume is important, but intensity is way more. People are trying to replace intensity with volume. John I respect you a lot. I have been watching you for years. :)
For years I used to think I had to take every set to failure and would do between 15-20 sets. I’m pretty sure I’ve been overtraining and it finally caught up to me in my 40’s. So I appreciate your videos and have been applying your working up to the heavy 8 reps.
Again my friend you are right on point 👍. Man honestly ppl saying going to failure is too much??? Really?! Sounds like they looking for an excuse because cumon this game is tough. Great tip about neuro fatigue dude, as you say its all about muscle fibres activation not excuses for not having the grit. Love your channel bro 👍
Recently subscribed to this channel after finding it through the Jujimufu collaboration, I have to say its absolutely fantastic especially the exercise index. So much knowledge just a click away Thanks for the great content!
The thing I realized when I did your low-volume workouts is you put tons of volume into warm-up sets. I think they are significant in terms of added volume even though they are not work sets. So I don't think volume is overrated, it's very important.
You should arrive at a minimum of rpe 6 for hypertrophy and complete muscle recruitment so the volume that you think is extra it's not actually but it is good for preparing your snc, muscles and joints for the movement pattern that you are planning to do
I talk about this JUST LIKE,,, Shifting Gears in a Car or On a Bicycle! 2, 3, 4 Warm-Up "Gear Shifting" for the "Momentum" of a GREAT/Heavier/Readied Final Set to Failure,,, IS THE REASON for the 7 to 9 Gears on a Bicycle BELOW the true DRIVE gears! As long as Those Sets ARE Progressing in at least Heavier,, then WHENEVER that Last set comes,, then IT WILL be that much MORE Effective,,, since the WORK Accomplished ahead of time IS ALSO MORE WORK!!!
More golden nuggets from the bodybuilding jedi. I can't wrap my head around people who train but DON'T go to failure. How else does one expect muscle growth? The way I see it, if you don't do some sets to failure and beyond, you might as well be doing crossfit or HIIT, or some sort of hard cardio. End result probably about the same but with shorter workouts.
Hi John, I really enjoyed hearing your approach to this topic. It's not entirely dissimilar to Wendlers approach in 531 - ramping sets, last set is to form failure. It just validates your approach further. Thank you for putting this content out and sharing your wisdom.
Enjoyed your video. I learned a lot. I am a powelifter but I use bodybuiding to improve my lifts. Thanks a million. You are number 1. Hope yo meet you in the future!😉
Well said John.. i think taking to failure is amazing it helps shock the body to growth.. its the last few reps that make the body grow.. but i feel frequency is still the most impt that..
@@theveteranpress7715 Thats true but do not push yourself over the limit in every workout.. If not you might suffer Adrenal fatigue and that may lead to subpar workouts
I would love to go through a weeks training of what you guys done back in the day. All the raw lifts and real grit your teeth sets that you dont see in the gyms these days.
Ive been involved in fitness for 35 years during my time in the UK military, as a private security contractor and now as a Risk manager, in that time ive also been a fitness advisor on the side. While im not into body building, i do follow Johns videos as he has a lot of relevant knowledge in the industry, albeit more specific to body buoilding.
Agree. Also not everyone is the same. Different body types, age, goals. Form to me is most important. At 65 start an exercise light, work up, then to as close to failure as I mentally can. The mind muscle connection to feel the muscle I am targeting I need to maintain good form.
Really nice video, John! It's funny how one does not find videos on this topic that much and from an experienced lifter like you I might add. 100% fresh!
Funny how this topic comes back on my mind from time to time and it just so happens that all what you mentioned in your video seems as clear and sound to me now as it was 2 months ago when I first watched it!
You’ll never know if you are getting stronger from work out to work out unless you train to failure, it’s the only sure way of knowing you worked to your maximum , no body really knows the least amount of effort you need to put in to gain muscle size , but if you go to failure then you know you can do more than that
True people like to overcomplicate things with the like RPE, RIR, AMRAP, MPS ect. People who are not seeing results simply aren’t training hard enough FACT
Great topic John. I've always seen this myself likewise as it seems so subjective as one person will say "dorian yates trains only one working set per excercise" (with two warm up sets) but then another person will train the exact same and call it three sets. and neither is wrong. When i first started back in the 90s i didnt know as much so just kept it simple and pushed my body to it's limits and pushed every set to failiure. i still do such now just as old habits die hard to the point i feel like im cheating myself if i do not. Funnily enough though this week ive actually started doing progressive sets, (4 sets moving up the weight each time to one last heavy set with an intensity technique at the end) im more used to 4 sets to failure with my heaviest weight i can manage for the amount of reps then maybe add an intensity technique at the end. im really enjoying this week and am really hoping my results do not diminish as a result of not going all out for 4 sets. it feels 'easier' but im not going to let that put me off and am going to stay with it a while to see how my body responds
Progressive sets didn't work for me, in the sense that I just wasn't feeling the muscles were getting enough stress. I gave it a week which i know isn't very long but I really wasn't feeling I was hitting the muscles with maximum effect so have reverted back to 3-4 sets with the heaviest weight i can manage for 6-12 sets to failure for each set. workouts were feeling too easy otherwise. I know its not good given that im 41 now and increasing my risk of injury but am keeping such in mind with my exercise selection at least.
This is such an appropriate video John for how I'm currently trying to track, analyze and apply progressive overload to my workouts. I was hitting a muscle group about every 8 days with about 1000 seconds of TUT per muscle group. I recently realized that I can teach my motor neurons to work more effectively by practicing recruiting the muscles if I train all the muscle groups every day and aim for about 100 seconds of TUT. The beauty of this method is that depending on what I want to prioritize, I can always sacrifice TUT from one muscle group and put it towards another. Today at the gym, I got the craziest pump by doing drops sets for some muscle groups that had my muscles blowing up before the 100 second set ended! I think what is great about this method is that overtime I can just increase TUT-slowly-per muscle group by adding a rest pause or simply another set. This video and your explanation is great because it reminds me that I don't need to constantly increase TUT every day-which would surely plateau after a while- but I can focus on more intensity or the density of the entire workout. Great and timely video as always. p.s tried the bulgarian split squat drop set using the smith machine as the place to let your back leg rest and use your non-weighted hand to stabilize yourself even more. Mind blowing set! I guess the only question is if my reasoning is okay to workout the entire body every day provided I keep volume in check and 80% of the exercises I choose are isolation ones as my focus is purely asthetic & for hypertrophy. Thank you and keep up the good work!!
When I was in my 20s early 30s.. hitting a body part once a week, high volume was perfect. Now it seems it's better at the age of 40 to split the volume and increase the frequency, twice per week.
I train every day, taking 1 day a week only if needed. I train legs 3 times a week - quads, hams, quads, hams etc. Less volume, more often with perfect nutrition is definitely working well with me.
Great content. Thanks! This talk reminds me of the last time I hit a PR in the strict Clean & Press. I used to work up to a top weight and do (typically) 8 hard doubles or triples (usually in the 85-90% range, which means I was hitting technical failure on some of theses sets); instead of that, I decided to train more like what I see from Olympic weightlifters: working up over more lighter sets, and then do a limited amount of heavy sets. Before, I would do something like this: 135 lb x 3 x 2 sets / 155 x 3 / 175 x 3 x 2 sets / 200 x 2 / 205 x 2 x 8 sets (completely in the upper end of Prilepin Table at the 85-89% range) Then, I started to work more like this: 135 lb x 3 x 2 sets / 155 x 3, 165 x 3, 175 x 3, 190 x 2 x 3 sets, 200 x 2 x 2 sets, 210 x 1, 220 x 1 x 2 solid singles (I could have done doubles had I really pushed it) I was doing less, but not that much less. There were lots of lighter sets where I trained at those higher velocities, while I was still touching weights in the 90% plus range, but for very few lifts. In fact, most of my sessions were lighter: I would top it off with just a couple doubles at 200 lb. When I finally attempted those two plates and a dime -- which is 239 lb on the bar I am using -- it felt really heavy as I catched the clean, but I pushed hard and I surprised myself as I felt the bar slowly sailing past the sticking point. Looking back, I'd say that the heavy session I've used here as an example was too much on some days, and too little on some other days. I felt strong on that last single at 220 lb and I could have challenged myself with 230 lb, or go down in weight to 200 lb and see how many good reps I can get. I'll keep this in mind. Thanks!
Yes this is exactly what is so difficult to explain to some people. Not all volume is the same! You can't just say "I can do 10 sets of chest per week.." really? how do you know that? What if you change the exercise, maybe you can do more (or less) sets per week with different exercises for example machine bench press for sets of 12 reps vs heavy bench press for sets of 4 reps. Also, another point is that people simply don't do quality work in the gym. Quality work is different than just working hard. You want to ensure that you perform optimally with good form before you push it hard, and for that you need to properly warm up and "get in the groove" with technique. Volume simply isn't just volume...
Thank the bodybuilding culture originally in magazines and fuelled by drug abuse. "These guys are doing crazy volumes! That's why they're jacked!" This video is spot on but the reason for the confusion is ego and greed.
@@mountaindog1 You and Eric are the only guys I follow.Did your low rep to failure chest routine this morning but slightly altered.Started with incline Smith then incline db's then incline Hammer Strength and finished with the double dips (love these)...bro I am nice and sore thanks man and I'll be watching!
This is my go-to all time favorite result producing routine: Upper / Lower split 2-3 x week. Each muscle hit 1 x 4-7 days. *UPPER* - Bench Press - Rows - Inc Bench - Chins - Lateral Raises - Pullover - Chest Flys - Rear Delt Fly - Tricep Extension - Preacher Curls - Military Press/ Tricep Extension (Alternate every other workout) - Curls/ Upright Rows (Alternate every other workout) - Grip Squeeze - Face Pulls (Rotator Cuff) *LOWER* - Squats - Calf Press - Zercher Squats - Donkey Calf - Glute Ham Raise - Leg Extension - Romanian Deadlift / Good mornings (Alternate every other workout) - Calf Raises - Leg Curl - F/B Neck Raise - Ab Sit Up - R/L Neck Raises - Cable Ab Crunch ** Each exercise is performed 2 x 8-20 reps to positive failure ** Rest 2-4 min Between sets depending on Exercises. * Warm up 5 min Elliptical * 50% x 8 / 75% x 4 of working weight.
For me, 4-6 sets with perfect form, the mind muscle connection is there, the tempo is good, I concentrate the motion, I go to failure with my life flashing before my eyes - and I’m done. In contrast, I used to waste months in the gym going moderate intensity, just doing set after set - and not progressing at all with my strength.
@@wholesomet3930 Per session. If I’m cutting I need to get 20-30 sets per week to see progress. If bulking I don’t need to go so crazy 16-20 sets per week. Can’t do that for every body group per week so some muscle groups get left on maintenance but others will see improvement.
Great stuff as always!! Funny i was listening as eating dinner and my wife came into the room and I thought " No worries of John saying anything rude or lewd with wife listening ' Dont get me wrong rude / lewd doesn't bother me I'm no angel but Mountain Dog always keeps it family friendly and professional which is very respectable too ,, Also always tons of knowledge being shared !! Thx Mountain Dog
More is not always better. I'd rather do one set to failure, using proper form and resisting on the negative part of the movement...than do 100 reps with no control.
Looking at training volume by itself without knowing how hard those sets are is just overrated. If you standardize them like RPE 7-9 or something then ok it's pretty good since you take them close to failure and then try to get your body to handle more of that same RPE scale training. But if you really do sets to failure I've noticed that you really can't do more than probably 4-6 per workout depending on a muscle group and it's size. And depending on how advanced you are. When I was a beginner I thought I took things to failure and did like 10 sets but now that more of an intermediate I take some sets to failure and it's like 4 sets for chest the most in a workout and I'm fucking spent. Some might say it's like a 15 set workout but there might be 4 sets that are really to failure and others have more in tank. Of course if it's like RPE 7-9 it's gonna stimulate hypertrophy and they kinda should be counted but how important it is to count them if your goal is to increase the weight and get stronger muscles. Those sets are gonna increase over time 'cause it only takes like 2 warm ups to bench like 135 for a beginner but it takes like 6 warm ups for a guy benching 315 or more. Definitely overrated.
Man, I just found your channel, and love this, I've heard volumen is the main driven of hypertrophy, but with this video I see that the quality sets could be better. Great job, greetings!
also going to true "failure" is something you have to work up to gradually over years of training - if a training partner pushed you to do that in every working set after 2 month in the gym you would sleep for half a day afterwards:)
Hi John, I know that this video is a tad older. I LOVE YOUR VIDEOS. Down to earth, logical and inspirational. I heard what you're saying about Nuero fatigue and it makes sense to some degree. As always, you've sparked my interest in this topic. I can't seem to find any references that define it. I'd love if you do another video to talk more about this topic and it's fundamentals or link to some other reference. Is there a way to overcome or enhance /streamline this process.
All sets leading to one big set are just feeler sets. Warming up the body to the movement. Those weights don't place any necessary stress for growth. Therefore I agree with John thats its not really 3 or 4 sets, its 1 set to failure that makes the difference. Its prepping the body for that growth set that forces the body to change.
I think it is very simple. You have to give the body a reason to adapt (i.e. add muscle ) Your body is looking for every possible way to make something easier. That's where really having the mind muscle connection so the vast majority of the work is being done by the muscle you are trying to work. That coupled with actual high intensity/failure
I have been using the exact same model, never learnt it anywhere but I believe it's about the effort and I do feeder sets to prevent injury. Thanks for this video though
Hi John. Thank you for the information on volume. It is something I have agonised over for years. I train as you said you do. I use 3 sets to build up to the main one, then I do a couple of drop sets to make sure I have hit the muscle hard enough. But this style of training has only been relatively new for me. Thanks again.
I always figured that if I'm crawling out of the gym at the end of my session then it was a good session. This neural fatigue information has me rethinking that approach.
Strategic implementation of failure... last week of a mesocycle being a great spot given it being before a deload week. Linearly more gains but exponentially more fatigue generating. Advanced lifters likely won't be able to progress through productive working sets RIR 4-failure (RPE 6-10) and get enough stimulus for any growth. Novice and intermediates certainly can to great success and progress 👌
John this is great information very informative BUT it would be best to have a white board to illustrate this, just a thought, thanks for your insight.
Your approach is pretty similar to mine, only difference is you are doubling the volume by doing everything twice a week. I would do that as well, if I would have the time... but having a full time job and a family, I can only hit the gym 3 times a week for about one hour. You can make good gains with the same approach once a week for every muscle, not optimal result though. I think what counts is effort. The muscle doesn’t know how many sets you did, it knows if it was stresses beyound it’s capacity or not.
Very well said, thanks! I think people differ greatly in their ability to push themselves. How hard something feels is very subjective, and people have varying ability to focus. So when one person says he went to failure, maybe he actually has three more good reps to go. I experienced the negative side of this, because I didn't realize how strong my focus ability was, so I was constantly going to failure in every set because I enjoyed the feeling of it. It was only when I did cardio with a heart rate monitor that I first realized that I am way to close to my max HR. It didn't feel like I was doing any work unless I was at 80% or more of HRmax, which is really counter productive for long cardio sessions. So I frequently got over trained with injuries, and now I have backed down in intensity with better results. It so happens that I follow your principles in this video, exactly as you outlined them. So you can add one more testimony that you are correct! I think gym training is first and foremost a mental exercise that happens to be performed on our bodies, the same way ashtanga yoga is not really a physical exercise - it is a mental exercise to learn to tolerate pain.
Another drawback to the high volume is that you wear down your joints or it is repetitive strain. Then again, it would be lighter weight. I know that the hypertrophy kicks in, but i dont feel like doing tons of reps and sets.
for nattys frequency is more important that volume. thats why the typical bro split is useless for nattys and full body,upperlower split or PPL is way more effective. that is why the silver era bodybuilders all did full body every other day. volume is effective til a certain point then it just becomes pointless and ur jut fatiguing the muscle, of course unless ur on gear. long live the silver era methods! any opinion on that john? thx alot for this vid!
Great video John! I've been doing too much volume over the course of the last 12-15 months, but I've noticed less quality gains with this approach compared to less sets with heavier weight when I was used to do.... instead 5 to 6 hard sets per session and I was done, completely dead. These days I do 12-15+ sets with less weight and less rest in between those sets and my gains are stalled for a couple of months now. Switching back to the approach you recommend would benefit me for sure!
Hey John im 60 been working out on and off most of my life what would you say would be a good workout routine and how many days a week for us elderly gentleman LOL. Keep up the great work on your videos you're awesome
Sounds similar to JP, does as many warm ups as he needs, dropping reps as he goes, up to singles just to fire the muscle, the. A heavy load and a back off set
Everyone trains the same really. Some will count the 1st 2-3 sets as "working sets" other's will call them warm ups towards the last set. People get too wrapped up in the numbers but as long as you take your last set to failure then you're good.
you dont need to ever go to failure to make gains. That is only an optional tool. In fact, if you use it too much it'll hinder your progress. You need longer periods of time to recover from hitting failure. And you won't be sore the next day.
Great video John. What’s your opinion on Mike Isratels theory on volume periodisation? Starting at the minimum and Increasing number of sets week on week until you reached the so called maximum recoverable volume.
Do you think training volume is overrated for building muscle?
I think it's a lot more about how close you are to failure. You can do lots of sets, but if you're not close to failure then you're missing out on hypertrophy. But a mix of high volume close to failure should lead to good hypertrophy
I find low volume strength training be best for me... 🤓 I barely ever grow under volume at all... I agree on effort!!! 😎👍🏻
I am not counting sets or reps. I only care about how I feel. If I think I can do one more set, that's nice. If I have the feeling I can't do any quality reps anymore I am done with the exercise.
Since I reduced the sets and the of exercises I've started seeing a new lease of growth ✔️
I dont think volume training is over rated IMHO I need both high/low volume to grow but hey if experience has taught me anything is everybody is diff and I truly believe its all bout nutrition!!!! 💯🇲🇽🇺🇸
I go to failure every time. Last week I almost went to the gym four times, but I failed each time. That’s four days of going to failure. Winner, right here.
LOL....true failure!
Fail to win 💪
Ha ha ha, I tried to get out of bed this week 7 times. But I failed!!! 😀
google Central Nervous System fatigue... it is possible to overtrain and I've done it before but it was combined with my type of work I do.
how cna you recover if you go to max failure in every set?
RIP John.
You still manage to help us, and be an inspiration even in passing. They don’t build em like you anymore.
True!
He was the chillest fitness youtuber to listen to. Still watch him all the time.
Shutup
my failure to hit the gym creates more volume around the waist....just kidding....great video!
Too many people sacrifice effort in the pursuit of reaching an arbitrary number sets, just because they read in a study or somebody said that it was "optimal"... I prefer to keep intensity/effort as high as possible AND THEN adjust the volume
JC FITNESS ACADEMY This is something I've recently discovered for myself, to a "T". I was doing these comparatively low-effort sets just to hit a certain number and think I was training "optimally", then had the audacity to get frustrated at my lack of progress. Just in the past two weeks since I've implemented a lower volume, higher intensity approach I have seen changes in my physique.
Volume can go to the back of the line and stay there
The most worthy and honorable chemical reaction of them all....
Metabolic stress
Inherits kingship by default
Incontestable proclamation
Next
Everybody promoted a different style. Mentzer and Yates promoted the one set method, others spent 3 hrs in the gym (Arnold). In the end, everything worked. Bottom line is, make your muscles work, be consistent and pay attention to your nutrition.
cj77 false. John meadows trains like Dorian. With his twist obviously. Mike Mentzer Never got injured by the way. Dorian got injured because at that time he was an innovator. No one walked that path before. He was the first mass monster ever. He took it to the next level with intensity. And he said that he got injured when dieting hard. Instead of slowing down close to competition he kept training super heavy while being depleted of nutrients. That’s how he got injured. His method is the best.
lacrahuntington if his method was the best then everyone with a brain bigger than a peanut would be doing it
@@Dr_Footbrake The thing is that Dorian's method requires mental fortitude that most people don't have. Yes, going in and lifting weights isn't hard in and of itself, however, that last small extra push is what a lot of people aren't willing to do, but it makes all the difference.
Also, Dorian's style of training pretty much required a training partner. However, there are other intensity techniques that you can apply if you don't have a partner and get a similar effect, such as Cluster sets, which John often talks about.
One would actually wonder, however, just truly how many total sets Mentzer might have really done, vice potentially merely claimed to have done to promote his 'Heavy Duty' stuff...
@@mdd1963 has it been proven ineffective in the last 40 years?
I honestly loved the days when I never knew most of what I know about lifting. When i was young i would just lift the weight without caring about sets and reps. I would just eat and workout. The results were fantastic but now it's all this research this research that.
Bhatr Halkno dude I dirty bulked and felt like crap lol when I was younger
usually kids dont see any gains if they just life something without a routine
Oh no, thinkin hard, me no thinky
@@mrdune5479 what? excuse me
@@bestboy007 I'm not responding to you lol
You look like a strong Luke Skywalker with that Yoda shirt. Lol
😂😂😂
Luke Swollewalker.
Hah, 100% correttamente!
Would need to let the hair grow, but yeah.
I like your channel best because you're honest and you don't shout at your viewers in videos. It's nice to learn and hear a fitness industry leader speaking normally to us.
Shots fired at Dr Greg xD
@@53Memati53 I personally like Coach Greg but I have to agree. Dude needs to take a chill pill sometimes.
essentially just train according to your instinct like what old school bodybuilders do. If you have problem with recovery and your diet is on point then lower the volume. If you feel like you can push more then increase the volume.
I find higher intensity burn me out wayyyy quicker than higher volume ( and a lower intensity )
@@jfmorache It's the other way around for me, if I do too many sets I'll lose adherence. But I can do heavy weight low reps and low sets and I will train often.
Keep growing that beard out, John. I think you'll look even more badass when it comes in full.
I also totally agree about training to failure with good form... at least on the final set of a given movement, sometimes the final two.
You are the best !!! You have reconfirmed my conviction and my belief in Mike Mentzers principles.
John you are by far my favorite in this industry. So informative and knowledgeable. I watch and listen to you daily and want to thank you. I love seeing you let your son do his yo yo tricks mixed into your clips. You are a Good man. Thank you again
Great video John, I believe in failure training too. I do last 1-2 sets to failure of each exercise.
An observation that I have is that most of these videos I have to rewatch periodically, because they will click with me when I am in the right mindset. So I watched this video before, and it was great, but watching it right now again, it really made sense because I am at the right point with my thinking. This is probably my favorite muscle building channel.
thank you!
This is exactly what I've been doing these last 3 months and I gained 13lbs doing it. My bench press shot up by only doing 1 set to failure (with a spotter!) as opposed to doing 3x5 routines. I can go to failure now and still recover from it, because in the end.. You're only doing 4 hard sets per workout. As John said at the end, on days you're feeling good, add a dropset or an amrap set with 50% of the weight. Works wonders for me. Thanks for another great video, John, this is gold!
ty my friend!
I think the HIT is the best, but it's good to sprinkle pump sets sometimes. I also think for people with great genetics, whatever they will do they will grow. hard gainers or when you hit plateaus is when you should start really calculating what you do IMO
In my opinion, your body and muscles don't have a concept of set, reps, volume, etc. etc. All your body knows is whether it is being stressed at this time, and if yes, that it will need time to recover afterwards. I know it is somewhat of a useless advice, but people should just try to get in tune with their bodies, and then push their limits.
Great video John. Time and time again you speak sense and convince me that yours is one of the very few youtube channels worth following.
excellent post!
false. some people are non responders to low volume. they need more volume.
damn! this is the best video about volume and intensity. Your thinking is pretty much the same as mine, at one point i was really concerned about how much volume should i do and i was counting exact weekly volume blablabla, but then i just stopped caring and stopped counting my volume and just started to really focus on that quality hard intense top set and focus on progression
Volume is important, but intensity is way more. People are trying to replace intensity with volume.
John I respect you a lot. I have been watching you for years. :)
I appreciate that
For years I used to think I had to take every set to failure and would do between 15-20 sets. I’m pretty sure I’ve been overtraining and it finally caught up to me in my 40’s. So I appreciate your videos and have been applying your working up to the heavy 8 reps.
“Fear is the path to the dark side…fear leads to anger…anger leads to hate…hate leads to suffering.”
I've been training 3 years now and have tried so many different styles and volumes. The working up to one top set is definitely my favorite.
Again my friend you are right on point 👍.
Man honestly ppl saying going to failure is too much??? Really?! Sounds like they looking for an excuse because cumon this game is tough.
Great tip about neuro fatigue dude, as you say its all about muscle fibres activation not excuses for not having the grit.
Love your channel bro 👍
I love that sabertooth Action figure
Recently subscribed to this channel after finding it through the Jujimufu collaboration, I have to say its absolutely fantastic especially the exercise index. So much knowledge just a click away Thanks for the great content!
thank you!
The thing I realized when I did your low-volume workouts is you put tons of volume into warm-up sets. I think they are significant in terms of added volume even though they are not work sets. So I don't think volume is overrated, it's very important.
Even Wendler said the asorted sets before the last heavy AMRAP set were very much needed, and a critical part of the total work/volume equation....
You should arrive at a minimum of rpe 6 for hypertrophy and complete muscle recruitment so the volume that you think is extra it's not actually but it is good for preparing your snc, muscles and joints for the movement pattern that you are planning to do
i would agree....but you know how hard that last set was...I dont think most people take any sets that far..
Not enough RUclips fitness channels discuss this topic, bc it is incredibly important in making progress and gaining confidence in your gym work.
I talk about this JUST LIKE,,, Shifting Gears in a Car or On a Bicycle!
2, 3, 4 Warm-Up "Gear Shifting" for the "Momentum" of a GREAT/Heavier/Readied Final Set to Failure,,, IS THE REASON for the 7 to 9 Gears on a Bicycle BELOW the true DRIVE gears!
As long as Those Sets ARE Progressing in at least Heavier,, then WHENEVER that Last set comes,, then IT WILL be that much MORE Effective,,, since the WORK Accomplished ahead of time IS ALSO MORE WORK!!!
After searching and going through many, many videos, I FINALLY found the one that explains the whole "volume" question the best. A+ Sir!
More golden nuggets from the bodybuilding jedi.
I can't wrap my head around people who train but DON'T go to failure. How else does one expect muscle growth? The way I see it, if you don't do some sets to failure and beyond, you might as well be doing crossfit or HIIT, or some sort of hard cardio. End result probably about the same but with shorter workouts.
I think that’s a rule posted on the wall at planet fitness : “No sets shall be taken to failure” .... 😝
LOL
"Because if you choose to be here, you're already a failure" 😝
This has been by far the most informative video on lifting ever done. This finally makes sense.
Hi John, I really enjoyed hearing your approach to this topic.
It's not entirely dissimilar to Wendlers approach in 531 - ramping sets, last set is to form failure. It just validates your approach further.
Thank you for putting this content out and sharing your wisdom.
I don't think there's a magic number of sets I think it has to do with the intensity. Also with the total poundage.
One of the best video I have seen in the whole bodybuilding scene!
Really good point about neural fatigue vs motor units
Enjoyed your video. I learned a lot. I am a powelifter but I use bodybuiding to improve my lifts. Thanks a million. You are number 1. Hope yo meet you in the future!😉
thank you!
Well said John.. i think taking to failure is amazing it helps shock the body to growth.. its the last few reps that make the body grow.. but i feel frequency is still the most impt that..
I've always had the mindset that if you don't push yourself to failure, your body won't know that it needs to go beyond that point.
@@theveteranpress7715 Thats true but do not push yourself over the limit in every workout.. If not you might suffer Adrenal fatigue and that may lead to subpar workouts
@@theveteranpress7715 if Adrenal fatigue sets in.. just take a couple of days to a week off from training.. You should be good as new after that break
@@HulkyTrapz Bingo
Hands down, best and simplest clarification on sets, volume, intensity(failure)...period! John is the truth!
U always have cool t-shirt 💪😎
I think today's gym goers would be very surprised how much hard work we did back in the day.
and how hard each set was
I would love to go through a weeks training of what you guys done back in the day. All the raw lifts and real grit your teeth sets that you dont see in the gyms these days.
@@SPGH1991
Ez pz.
As many reps as possible, all sets.
Thank you for confirming what years of lifting has taught me as well. My "preferred" training method is very similar to what you are discussing here.
I think it's all about how you feel that day and listening to the body. You're right. Smart thinking
Ive been involved in fitness for 35 years during my time in the UK military, as a private security contractor and now as a Risk manager, in that time ive also been a fitness advisor on the side. While im not into body building, i do follow Johns videos as he has a lot of relevant knowledge in the industry, albeit more specific to body buoilding.
The start of this video is truly amazing. Most people overlook so much when looking at programs.
Quality vs. quantity.
I'm sincerely surprised that people are afraid of reaching failure on every exercise they do at gym, that's always have been a no-brainer to me
Agree. Also not everyone is the same. Different body types, age, goals. Form to me is most important. At 65 start an exercise light, work up, then to as close to failure as I mentally can. The mind muscle connection to feel the muscle I am targeting I need to maintain good form.
Really nice video, John! It's funny how one does not find videos on this topic that much and from an experienced lifter like you I might add. 100% fresh!
Funny how this topic comes back on my mind from time to time and it just so happens that all what you mentioned in your video seems as clear and sound to me now as it was 2 months ago when I first watched it!
One of the only ‘celebrities’ I have ever shed a tear over.
RIP John, god bless you and thank you inspiring me to start bodybuilding years ago.
You’ll never know if you are getting stronger from work out to work out unless you train to failure, it’s the only sure way of knowing you worked to your maximum , no body really knows the least amount of effort you need to put in to gain muscle size , but if you go to failure then you know you can do more than that
True people like to overcomplicate things with the like RPE, RIR, AMRAP, MPS ect.
People who are not seeing results simply aren’t training hard enough FACT
Great topic John. I've always seen this myself likewise as it seems so subjective as one person will say "dorian yates trains only one working set per excercise" (with two warm up sets) but then another person will train the exact same and call it three sets. and neither is wrong. When i first started back in the 90s i didnt know as much so just kept it simple and pushed my body to it's limits and pushed every set to failiure. i still do such now just as old habits die hard to the point i feel like im cheating myself if i do not. Funnily enough though this week ive actually started doing progressive sets, (4 sets moving up the weight each time to one last heavy set with an intensity technique at the end) im more used to 4 sets to failure with my heaviest weight i can manage for the amount of reps then maybe add an intensity technique at the end. im really enjoying this week and am really hoping my results do not diminish as a result of not going all out for 4 sets. it feels 'easier' but im not going to let that put me off and am going to stay with it a while to see how my body responds
Progressive sets didn't work for me, in the sense that I just wasn't feeling the muscles were getting enough stress. I gave it a week which i know isn't very long but I really wasn't feeling I was hitting the muscles with maximum effect so have reverted back to 3-4 sets with the heaviest weight i can manage for 6-12 sets to failure for each set. workouts were feeling too easy otherwise. I know its not good given that im 41 now and increasing my risk of injury but am keeping such in mind with my exercise selection at least.
This is such an appropriate video John for how I'm currently trying to track, analyze and apply progressive overload to my workouts.
I was hitting a muscle group about every 8 days with about 1000 seconds of TUT per muscle group. I recently realized that I can teach my motor neurons to work more effectively by practicing recruiting the muscles if I train all the muscle groups every day and aim for about 100 seconds of TUT.
The beauty of this method is that depending on what I want to prioritize, I can always sacrifice TUT from one muscle group and put it towards another.
Today at the gym, I got the craziest pump by doing drops sets for some muscle groups that had my muscles blowing up before the 100 second set ended!
I think what is great about this method is that overtime I can just increase TUT-slowly-per muscle group by adding a rest pause or simply another set.
This video and your explanation is great because it reminds me that I don't need to constantly increase TUT every day-which would surely plateau after a while- but I can focus on more intensity or the density of the entire workout.
Great and timely video as always.
p.s tried the bulgarian split squat drop set using the smith machine as the place to let your back leg rest and use your non-weighted hand to stabilize yourself even more. Mind blowing set!
I guess the only question is if my reasoning is okay to workout the entire body every day provided I keep volume in check and 80% of the exercises I choose are isolation ones as my focus is purely asthetic & for hypertrophy.
Thank you and keep up the good work!!
Great info. Also the neural fatigue is something new I learned.
I get so mental around this topic! Thanks John for bringing the subject in focus. RIP
When I was in my 20s early 30s.. hitting a body part once a week, high volume was perfect. Now it seems it's better at the age of 40 to split the volume and increase the frequency, twice per week.
I honestly truly believe 2X a week full body for naturals is the very best. Monday and Friday. Gives the best recovery, thus making most progress.
I train every day, taking 1 day a week only if needed. I train legs 3 times a week - quads, hams, quads, hams etc. Less volume, more often with perfect nutrition is definitely working well with me.
Great content. Thanks! This talk reminds me of the last time I hit a PR in the strict Clean & Press. I used to work up to a top weight and do (typically) 8 hard doubles or triples (usually in the 85-90% range, which means I was hitting technical failure on some of theses sets); instead of that, I decided to train more like what I see from Olympic weightlifters: working up over more lighter sets, and then do a limited amount of heavy sets.
Before, I would do something like this: 135 lb x 3 x 2 sets / 155 x 3 / 175 x 3 x 2 sets / 200 x 2 / 205 x 2 x 8 sets (completely in the upper end of Prilepin Table at the 85-89% range)
Then, I started to work more like this: 135 lb x 3 x 2 sets / 155 x 3, 165 x 3, 175 x 3, 190 x 2 x 3 sets, 200 x 2 x 2 sets, 210 x 1, 220 x 1 x 2 solid singles (I could have done doubles had I really pushed it)
I was doing less, but not that much less. There were lots of lighter sets where I trained at those higher velocities, while I was still touching weights in the 90% plus range, but for very few lifts. In fact, most of my sessions were lighter: I would top it off with just a couple doubles at 200 lb.
When I finally attempted those two plates and a dime -- which is 239 lb on the bar I am using -- it felt really heavy as I catched the clean, but I pushed hard and I surprised myself as I felt the bar slowly sailing past the sticking point.
Looking back, I'd say that the heavy session I've used here as an example was too much on some days, and too little on some other days. I felt strong on that last single at 220 lb and I could have challenged myself with 230 lb, or go down in weight to 200 lb and see how many good reps I can get. I'll keep this in mind. Thanks!
you bet!
I love these talks, they really makes me think.
I really like your style of doing things when I am focusing on hypertrophy.
Props for the Sabertooth. This was good to hear as this is what ive been doing. Ill ramp up to my working sets just for my own safety
Yes this is exactly what is so difficult to explain to some people. Not all volume is the same! You can't just say "I can do 10 sets of chest per week.." really? how do you know that? What if you change the exercise, maybe you can do more (or less) sets per week with different exercises for example machine bench press for sets of 12 reps vs heavy bench press for sets of 4 reps.
Also, another point is that people simply don't do quality work in the gym. Quality work is different than just working hard. You want to ensure that you perform optimally with good form before you push it hard, and for that you need to properly warm up and "get in the groove" with technique.
Volume simply isn't just volume...
Thank the bodybuilding culture originally in magazines and fuelled by drug abuse. "These guys are doing crazy volumes! That's why they're jacked!" This video is spot on but the reason for the confusion is ego and greed.
Perfect. Can’t agree more. This is what’s worked for me. No ones explained it this way but my exact method too
Just sending you a huge thanks for putting this awesome video out there
I asked Eric Broser basically the same question last week and his answer was identical to yours thanks John I'll definitely be watching...
oh cool, Eric is very talented and smart...
@@mountaindog1 You and Eric are the only guys I follow.Did your low rep to failure chest routine this morning but slightly altered.Started with incline Smith then incline db's then incline Hammer Strength and finished with the double dips (love these)...bro I am nice and sore thanks man and I'll be watching!
This is my go-to all time favorite result producing routine:
Upper / Lower split 2-3 x week. Each muscle hit 1 x 4-7 days.
*UPPER*
- Bench Press
- Rows
- Inc Bench
- Chins
- Lateral Raises
- Pullover
- Chest Flys
- Rear Delt Fly
- Tricep Extension
- Preacher Curls
- Military Press/ Tricep Extension (Alternate every other workout)
- Curls/ Upright Rows (Alternate every other workout)
- Grip Squeeze
- Face Pulls (Rotator Cuff)
*LOWER*
- Squats
- Calf Press
- Zercher Squats
- Donkey Calf
- Glute Ham Raise
- Leg Extension
- Romanian Deadlift / Good mornings (Alternate every other workout)
- Calf Raises
- Leg Curl
- F/B Neck Raise
- Ab Sit Up
- R/L Neck Raises
- Cable Ab Crunch
** Each exercise is performed 2 x 8-20 reps to positive failure
** Rest 2-4 min Between sets depending on Exercises.
* Warm up 5 min Elliptical
* 50% x 8 / 75% x 4 of working weight.
idk but its crazy. how can you effectively do 14 excercises in a workout sesison? are you workouts 3 hours or sth
really cleared some things up for me thank you! great video
For me, 4-6 sets with perfect form, the mind muscle connection is there, the tempo is good, I concentrate the motion, I go to failure with my life flashing before my eyes - and I’m done. In contrast, I used to waste months in the gym going moderate intensity, just doing set after set - and not progressing at all with my strength.
4-6 sets per muscle group a week?
@@wholesomet3930 Per session. If I’m cutting I need to get 20-30 sets per week to see progress. If bulking I don’t need to go so crazy 16-20 sets per week. Can’t do that for every body group per week so some muscle groups get left on maintenance but others will see improvement.
10:15 you will never your potential if you never push yourselves sir mountain john the legend 🙏RIP😢
Great stuff as always!! Funny i was listening as eating dinner and my wife came into the room and I thought " No worries of John saying anything rude or lewd with wife listening ' Dont get me wrong rude / lewd doesn't bother me I'm no angel but Mountain Dog always keeps it family friendly and professional which is very respectable too ,, Also always tons of knowledge being shared !! Thx Mountain Dog
thank you for listening!
More is not always better. I'd rather do one set to failure, using proper form and resisting on the negative part of the movement...than do 100 reps with no control.
Looking at training volume by itself without knowing how hard those sets are is just overrated. If you standardize them like RPE 7-9 or something then ok it's pretty good since you take them close to failure and then try to get your body to handle more of that same RPE scale training. But if you really do sets to failure I've noticed that you really can't do more than probably 4-6 per workout depending on a muscle group and it's size. And depending on how advanced you are. When I was a beginner I thought I took things to failure and did like 10 sets but now that more of an intermediate I take some sets to failure and it's like 4 sets for chest the most in a workout and I'm fucking spent. Some might say it's like a 15 set workout but there might be 4 sets that are really to failure and others have more in tank. Of course if it's like RPE 7-9 it's gonna stimulate hypertrophy and they kinda should be counted but how important it is to count them if your goal is to increase the weight and get stronger muscles. Those sets are gonna increase over time 'cause it only takes like 2 warm ups to bench like 135 for a beginner but it takes like 6 warm ups for a guy benching 315 or more. Definitely overrated.
Man, I just found your channel, and love this, I've heard volumen is the main driven of hypertrophy, but with this video I see that the quality sets could be better. Great job, greetings!
also going to true "failure" is something you have to work up to gradually over years of training - if a training partner pushed you to do that in every working set after 2 month in the gym you would sleep for half a day afterwards:)
Hi John, I know that this video is a tad older. I LOVE YOUR VIDEOS. Down to earth, logical and inspirational.
I heard what you're saying about Nuero fatigue and it makes sense to some degree. As always, you've sparked my interest in this topic. I can't seem to find any references that define it. I'd love if you do another video to talk more about this topic and it's fundamentals or link to some other reference. Is there a way to overcome or enhance /streamline this process.
All sets leading to one big set are just feeler sets. Warming up the body to the movement. Those weights don't place any necessary stress for growth. Therefore I agree with John thats its not really 3 or 4 sets, its 1 set to failure that makes the difference. Its prepping the body for that growth set that forces the body to change.
I think it is very simple. You have to give the body a reason to adapt (i.e. add muscle )
Your body is looking for every possible way to make something easier.
That's where really having the mind muscle connection so the vast majority of the work is being done by the muscle you are trying to work. That coupled with actual high intensity/failure
I have been using the exact same model, never learnt it anywhere but I believe it's about the effort and I do feeder sets to prevent injury. Thanks for this video though
Hi John. Thank you for the information on volume. It is something I have agonised over for years. I train as you said you do. I use 3 sets to build up to the main one, then I do a couple of drop sets to make sure I have hit the muscle hard enough. But this style of training has only been relatively new for me. Thanks again.
I always figured that if I'm crawling out of the gym at the end of my session then it was a good session. This neural fatigue information has me rethinking that approach.
Good tips, I apply same tactics and have seen optimal results.
Workout
1x1 Squat
1x1 bench
1x0.5 deadlift
Cardio: 50 meters walk
Repeat this one time a month, otherwise is overtraining!!!!!!!!!
Strategic implementation of failure... last week of a mesocycle being a great spot given it being before a deload week. Linearly more gains but exponentially more fatigue generating. Advanced lifters likely won't be able to progress through productive working sets RIR 4-failure (RPE 6-10) and get enough stimulus for any growth. Novice and intermediates certainly can to great success and progress 👌
John this is great information very informative BUT it would be best to have a white board to illustrate this, just a thought, thanks for your insight.
Your approach is pretty similar to mine, only difference is you are doubling the volume by doing everything twice a week. I would do that as well, if I would have the time... but having a full time job and a family, I can only hit the gym 3 times a week for about one hour. You can make good gains with the same approach once a week for every muscle, not optimal result though. I think what counts is effort. The muscle doesn’t know how many sets you did, it knows if it was stresses beyound it’s capacity or not.
Very well said, thanks! I think people differ greatly in their ability to push themselves. How hard something feels is very subjective, and people have varying ability to focus. So when one person says he went to failure, maybe he actually has three more good reps to go. I experienced the negative side of this, because I didn't realize how strong my focus ability was, so I was constantly going to failure in every set because I enjoyed the feeling of it. It was only when I did cardio with a heart rate monitor that I first realized that I am way to close to my max HR. It didn't feel like I was doing any work unless I was at 80% or more of HRmax, which is really counter productive for long cardio sessions. So I frequently got over trained with injuries, and now I have backed down in intensity with better results. It so happens that I follow your principles in this video, exactly as you outlined them. So you can add one more testimony that you are correct! I think gym training is first and foremost a mental exercise that happens to be performed on our bodies, the same way ashtanga yoga is not really a physical exercise - it is a mental exercise to learn to tolerate pain.
good points!!
I really liked to hear your view on this. This is something I've struggled with for a while.
Another drawback to the high volume is that you wear down your joints or it is repetitive strain. Then again, it would be lighter weight. I know that the hypertrophy kicks in, but i dont feel like doing tons of reps and sets.
for nattys frequency is more important that volume. thats why the typical bro split is useless for nattys and full body,upperlower split or PPL is way more effective. that is why the silver era bodybuilders all did full body every other day. volume is effective til a certain point then it just becomes pointless and ur jut fatiguing the muscle, of course unless ur on gear. long live the silver era methods!
any opinion on that john? thx alot for this vid!
They should play this message in the gym..So many egolifters and cell addicts thinking theyre actualy training their hardest.
Great video John!
I've been doing too much volume over the course of the last 12-15 months, but I've noticed less quality gains with this approach compared to less sets with heavier weight when I was used to do.... instead 5 to 6 hard sets per session and I was done, completely dead.
These days I do 12-15+ sets with less weight and less rest in between those sets and my gains are stalled for a couple of months now. Switching back to the approach you recommend would benefit me for sure!
I fully agree, a good workout is all about the full context.
Hey John im 60 been working out on and off most of my life what would you say would be a good workout routine and how many days a week for us elderly gentleman LOL. Keep up the great work on your videos you're awesome
Sounds similar to JP, does as many warm ups as he needs, dropping reps as he goes, up to singles just to fire the muscle, the. A heavy load and a back off set
My parents said i will always be a failure... because is didnt train to failure🙁
For fucks sakes man , I miss this guy
Everyone trains the same really. Some will count the 1st 2-3 sets as "working sets" other's will call them warm ups towards the last set. People get too wrapped up in the numbers but as long as you take your last set to failure then you're good.
you dont need to ever go to failure to make gains. That is only an optional tool. In fact, if you use it too much it'll hinder your progress. You need longer periods of time to recover from hitting failure. And you won't be sore the next day.
No, everyone doesn't train the same. That is just not true.
Great video John. What’s your opinion on Mike Isratels theory on volume periodisation? Starting at the minimum and Increasing number of sets week on week until you reached the so called maximum recoverable volume.
Solid theory...
Thanks for explaining that! Makes a lot of sense 😊