The Joker Psychology | Assessment, Diagnosis, and Treatment of Arthur Fleck
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- Опубликовано: 6 фев 2020
- In this video we explore the psychology related to the Joker. If you've seen Joaquin Phoenix's incredible Oscar winning performance as Arthur Fleck, "Joker", you might be interested in the possible assessment, diagnosis, and psychological treatment of Arthur.
***Watch until the end of the video for a hidden profound message about mental health from Arthur's journal that you may have missed watching Joker.
Comment below! Let me know what symptoms you noticed, diagnosis you considered, and what you would do therapeutically with Arthur.
Assessment: 1:06
Diagnosis: 9:10
Treatment: 14:23
The psychological assessment while watching Joker made me note the following major symptoms:
- Low Mood
- Laughing Episodes
- Psychotic Features; Delusions and Hallucinations
- Social Oddities, Delays
- Outbursts of anger and violence
Other symptoms I noted when assessing Arthur Fleck was his suicidality, being underweight, social isolation, tobacco use, possible anxiety.
The working diagnoses I considered for Arthur were the following:
- Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI); witnessed in film and history of childhood abuse
- Possible CTE
- Pseudobulbar Affect; possibly related to TBI
- Possible Psychotic Disorder due to a Medical Condition
- Schizoaffective Disorder
- PTSD; from abuse history
- Possible Narcissistic Personality Disorder
- Economic, Environmental, and Occupational Difficulties
Therapeutically I recommended Arthur see a Neurologist for head trauma and a Psychiatrist for psychotic symptoms.
Within psychotherapy, I discussed the critical need for Arthur to experience a validating and compassionate relationship. I planned to provide a corrective emotional experience for Arthur by grounding myself in curiosity about his life. Overtime I discussed wanting Arthur to trust me and therapeutic space to express his authentic emotions and move towards his traumatic experiences as long as he is stable (no psychotic symptoms).
Finally, I discuss the need to remember that the Joker is a character and it is not beneficial to assume all individuals with mental disorders are aggressive or violent. Research has shown that only 3-5% of violence is related to a mental disorder.
👋🏼Hey everyone!
My name is Dr. Justin Puder and I'm a licensed Psychologist living is beautiful South Florida. My passion is helping others better manage stress, reduce anxiety & depression, and improve relationships while living more mindfully.
For more information check-out my website at:
🌎www.amoderntherapist.com
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“She always tells me to smile and put on a happy face, she says I was put here to spread joy and laughter”. -Arthur Fleck
awesome video pal, great work
This is a brilliant video I can’t believe this doesn’t have more views
As a school project I'm studying the psychology of Arthur fleck and your video was really helpful. Great job.
Did you choose that? Was it for college?
I have searched out a few videos regarding the mental health diagnosis of Arthur Fleck, and yours was the only video that concentrated on how to treat his symptoms rather than dedicating most of the time labeling. Thanks for your insight on this. I learned a lot, in fact. I wish more therapists displayed as much empathy and professional ethics as you displayed in this video. There would be less vilification of mental health concerns.
Exactly, he himself says he's never had a happy moment, he never deviates, even mixed mania isn't quite there.
He may be a character, but he is relatable. People can be like the joker.
what a fantastic video. Thank you for this assessment. :)
This is a fantastic video! As an LPC (in Texas), you hit on all the points I was thinking about as I watched the video. We should talk sometime about my Batman Theory. Thanks for sharing your knowledge in such an approachable way! Keep up the good work.
loved this!
Thank you Darla! Glad you enjoyed =)
Thanks for helping with my college psychology essay
This is just amazing.
Super interesting video, haven’t seen the movie yet so I’ll be right back after I do! Good job man!
Nikolas Ujueta thanks so much!!! If you watch the movie let me know your thoughts about Arthur. 🙌🏽 I appreciate the feedback. 🙏🏽
Great video! Feel like I’m sitting down talking right next you. I like the points you make on Invalidation. While a completely different context, I see this in the office where people feel their idea or contribution is not acknowledged and this makes them feel invalidated. Even in meetings when I am not talking, i always try to jump in and offer validation to someone if I feel they weren’t initially acknowledged by anyone else in the group. Like you said, then it empowers them. And so true when you talked about the journal, and how the therapist would have been more effective asking him to give an example. Again, I relate this to the office environment. Sometimes employees present work to their boss and the immediately discounts it and says what changes to make. With my team I always let them share first and feel empowered before I give any type of feedback. I guess you could say it makes a significant difference just to acknowledge people - in all situations of life.
Again, enjoyed listening to this, I learned a lot!
Thanks for the feedback Jeff! The fact that you try to acknowledge and validate your co-workers says a lot about your compassion. We all want to feel heard and included, especially at work. Repeated episodes of invalidation can make any of us withdraw. I'm grateful you are creating an environment where people feel their ideas and contributions matter.
Thank you for sharing this video. This will be big help on my case study😊😊👍👍
I hope you're not picking traumatized people to be part of your case study. I'm sick of that shit.
I'm here because I noticed that whatever Arthur Fleck has, be it depression or whatever, he doesn't really seem to be a psychopath lacking empathy like the Joker typically is.
It’s a more realistic depiction of how the joker would be created in a more realistic setting.
i had read somewhere he was meant to be a male representation of borderline personality disorder. I don’t know how true that is to the creators, but personally as someone with bpd his character always resonated with me. could be bpd with narcissistic tendencies. that’s what i have. could explain his grandiosity. hallucinating and delusions defo aren’t uncommon with bpd as well.
21:23 I think I have said that to my PMHNP and a therapist before. Diagnosed with BPD and Bipolar II
It's the same with chronic physical pain. You're expected to grin and bear it. Sometimes, that's easier said than done.
I like your diagnosis because other RUclips mental health specialists were focusing on the murders and his lack of remorse and thinking he was a sociopath and coming up with antisocial personality disorder and NPD. I see some empathy as he tries to connect with others and build relationships, especially with children, and his attempt to connect with his neighbor and Gary.
I was thinking schizoaffective, bipolar type because of the insomnia (odd refrigerator scene was explained as insomnia by Phoenix), irritability, anger, emotional dysregulation as a bit of mania. But all that is complicated by his TBI and childhood abuse and trauma. I saw it in theaters so I'm trying to remember the exact physical harm he had as a child. I remember he was abused by his mother's boyfriend per the report, but I keep forgetting he was adopted. His history is also skewed based on the note he found between his mother and Thomas Wayne, unless that is another delusion.
The problem with his mental health treatment is the lack of funding in Gotham, first with the burnout with his therapist at the program closing. He is losing access to medication, the therapist is also working with a therapy treatment that is not appropriate for him, but she may be stuck with what she can provide in the time she has (depending on the timeline I'm also not seeing DBT as a potential option). I also question the support offered at Arkham, it appears that he is left alone with the therapist, may have murdered her, and is chased by male staff. What were the safety protocols in place for both staff and Arthur at Arkham? How is Arthur really being helped at Arkham? Is it a forensic unit? If so, how can he work on rehabilitation if he is set up to fail? If he struggles with violent outbursts and homicidal actions, how is keeping him in scenarios where he will be able to act on those impulses helping him?
We also never saw him eat in the movie. Not once. Malnourishment growing up doesn’t seem to be explored in this, though.
There is this other channel that watched Joker called cinema therapy. They diagnosed Arthur with Bipolar 1 depression and anti social behavior. One of the guys on the channel is actually a therapist and he thinks that Arthur needs a male therapist because he's looking for a father figure and he needs to experience something called transference. Does that make sense?
I am an aspiring psychologist and i've been doing my own diagnosis of Joaquin Phoenix's Joker. I believe he has Munchausen Syndrome by proxy of Pseudobulbar Affect (because we hear Arthur tell his mom shortly before killing her that she made up his disorder), CTE caused by a TBI brought on by childhood trauma (which would explain his social awkwardness and his lack of empathy when fantasizing about murdering people), Grandiose Delusional Disorder (which explains his hallucinations and his delusions of grandeur at the end of the movie), and Depression which we see throughout the movie except when he is hallucinating as a result of his Grandiose Delusional Disorder. I would love any input from more knowledgeable psychologists if you see any flaws in my diagnosis (i'm only 17 so i likely screwed up somewhere)
I don't agree with the idea that Arthur is suffering from grandiose delusions, it is more of a fantasy or a daydream. People often dream or fantasise about what they desire. In the first scene when he is seen pulling on his shoes it portrays the difference between what he desires emotionally and his physical state. He is starved emotionally, he is starved for appreciation.
a revolver only have 6 shots.
Was he hallucinating those things or was he fantasising?
Arthur is not mentally ill.He is a mirror of "society"He just can't get those emotions out.He constantly recall past emotional experienceis.Actualy people like you "doctor" who claim to be psychologists are psychopats.You are nothing but a manipulator.I'm pretty sure that individuals like you don't know what jungian psychology is.People like you just copy meaningless terminology and stick it to people.Arthur says:nobody thinks what is like to be the other guy.He is absolutely right.people like you don't know what empathy is.You just smile and spit words,but you don't UNDERSTAND say nothing
This was very positive useful information