I have now received so many comments on this video that I am struggling to keep up… This is new for me as I have never had a video this popular. Thank you so much to everybody for watching and commenting! It is my goal on this channel to respond to every comment personally to the best of my abilities. If you take the time to comment on my channel, I will do my best to take the time to read it and respond to it. Thank you.
Your title hit a nerve , yes there is a real issue with techs leaving the trade , up here in Canada the issue is getting real bad . I work for GM in Oshawa and at our dealership is like a revolving door of techs , some dealerships are giving out incentives although since the pandemic most are just happy to be working . But the number one reason is money , its always money . When a plumber or an electrician get paid more then there are issues especially when you consider a tech spends on tools in comparison . The real problem in the automotive industry is there is too much overhead . For every dollar the tech brings into the shop has to pay the advisors , the call center , the cashiers . and the managers get their bonus , no wonder there is not enough for the techs which provide the labor and hours for every dollar brought in . Your vid also hit a nerve with me . Thankfully my 40 years is near done ..
Master technician = electrical/computer specialist, mechanical specialist, plumbing specialist, heating and a/c specialist, noise and vibration specialist, materials/ chemicals specialist, research specialist and finally a customer affairs specialist( factory and retail)! Under paid specialist!!!!! 90% of repairs easy, last 10% percent complex. Under paid causes 20% failure in the 90%, and near 90% failure in the last 10%! And that is assuming 100% effective writers, who are more interested in selling a big repair! LOL! Good luck!
I got out of the business almost 14 years ago. Don't miss it at all. Had to deal with stuff like this constantly. Once had an elderly couple bring a Crown Vic to the independent ship I was at after spending almost $2k at the dealership trying to fix an EGR flow code. I fixed it for $50 (probably 1/3 of what I should have charged) and they were mad at me for charging them because they'd already paid the dealership so much money. People are stupid, particularly when it comes to taking care of their cars.
Yep I have experienced that also. They don’t realize you’re rescuing them from their nightmare. EGR systems are usually very easy to diagnose with some system knowledge, unfortunately that is the reality of the industry right now….the dealership techs were just guessing rather than diagnosing and it is a huge time suck for everybody involved. Thanks.
I had the same experience years ago ( with a K car) They'd taken it to an Firestone store for poor running. They had been charged for a carb rebuild, plugs, wires, several modules to the tune of 500+. Firestone told them "It needs a computer module. Take it to the dealer and DEMAND they replace it for free> It's covered under the emissions warranty" Brought it us demanding the "free" computer. The real problem was a worn out distributor shaft (scattering timing) This was a common problem back then. Customer threw a FIT! Raged at ME for trying to screw them over. It got really heated. I finally told them, "Look! Why aren't you mad at the shop that charged you 500 bucks and DIDN'T fix your car? I'm the guy who's charging you 75 bucks and FIXING it!"
My neighbor works privately on vehicles out of his garage. When I hear him screaming obscenities and throwing tools around I’m reminded that I made a great choice leaving the industry. I don’t miss the backbreaking work that doesn’t pay anything. I don’t miss seeing my boss roll up in a 100K$ super car every day while I couldn’t afford an apartment. I don’t miss snap on and Matco tool bills each week. Technicians deserve so much more praise and compensation for their skill set and devotion. Even retail or fast food seems like a more appealing career, and I would encourage any young men or women to stay out of this industry. It’s a good skill to learn and retain for yourself, but going to work for someone else is a waste of your time
One of my big regrets in becoming a mechanic is me and my little brother both really enjoy all things mechanical, it was a hobby when we were kids, I went to tech school, he joined the Navy, when he got out he lived on my couch going to college for his mechanical engineering degree, we both still like mechanical stuff but its hard to get him to understand my job really has ruined the hobby, after 10 plus hours working on machines, the last thing I want to do is come home and work on some pile of junk in the evening.
OMG! I've been out of the industry for many years but I still have a pile of receipts from Snappy, Matco and Cornwell. OP good luck in dealing with people in the future.
COULD YOU CHECK OUT THE POINTS AND CONDENSER WHILE YOU HAVE THE HOOD UP?????? WISH I COULD TURN BACK THE CLOCK......FJB AND THE RAT RINOS....THEY OWN THIS MESS!
45 yr career came to an end when covid hit us. Now I only do side jobs for fun and beer money. I absolutely refuse to take on any new business, especially anything that code reader wont get me to. Wont spend $$$ on equipment for modern car issues, no graphing diagnostic or the like.
I know how you feel. Been turning a wrench since I was 12, and just turned 40 this year. I got burned out working in dealers in my late 20's, and then burned out from working fleet maintenance a few years back. By the time we are done paying for our tools, and all the free hours we work, we make less than minimum wage. Hence why I'm a factory mechanic now.
I'm one of those BURNOUTS. But I missed the challenge of troubleshooting. So I started flipping Basket Cases. You know, the car that wont run after "BUBBA" replaced his own (FILL IN THE BLANK)... I usually bought the car/truck/motorcycle/boat at scrap value. That way, if I lost, I could always get scrap value for what I had. This way, you work on them WHEN you want to, and STOP when you want to. NO PRESSURE. It was FUN to play with toys again. 'Cause remember : Working on cars is FUN, as long as you don't have to ! Just my $.02
I stumbled into one of these myself -- bought a used minivan at a dealership for too low of a price (great deal in my opinion). Everything seemed to work and run great during the test drive. A week later drove over some bumpy railroad tracks and the electrical system started acting crazy -- dash lights and electronics flickering and acting up real bad. Took me a little bit of time to find a wiring harness under the steering wheel area that was coming loose and the block not screwed together to keep it attached. Tightened all that up and the van gave me no trouble after that for the 5 years I owned it. Makes me think previous owner (and/or dealership) knew there was an electrical gremlin and they couldn't figure it out so sold it cheaply...
I'd much rather be doing this kind of work than working on customer cars. 2 problems I have though: no car trailer, and in NY its usually also rotted beyond repair if its a "good deal".
ACTUALLY a long-standing DREAM of mine, and a smart idea! Hell, look for the ones that really just need a good DETAIL job! They're out there, covered with green slime! 🙂
I learned a long time ago - if you don't charge enough money for the work, the customer doesn't respect you. No one discusses the cost with me. NO ONE. I determine the price, they pay it. Mind you I have a business built on a niche type of work that very few people do these days, and I charge accordingly. I quote the price up front. Don't like it, fine, go elsewhere. And there is no elsewhere. The flip side is I stand behind my work, without question, without argument. I will see the job to completion. But yes it's tough out there, and I'm going to hang it up soon. After all of us old guys leave the business people will finally understand the value of experience and skill gained over decades. But it will be too late - I'll have my feet up and taking it easy.
No they won't- they only understand that Henry Ford was sued under US law to ensure that corporations must always prioritize profits over employees. Put your boots back on and change some laws or we'll come and eat you.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist Arnold Schwarzenegger before he became famous as an actor started a brick laying company in Cali they billed themselves as a low cost alternative, business was not good. He rebranded as an exclusive European bricklaying company and charged above market, business boomed and he still has that company.
This is why it's so important to get a written work order. If you're verbally asked to programme a BCM and then they change their mind and say they said ECM you don't have a leg to stand on. Glad you stood your ground and got paid for their error.
It wasnt verbal it was written. Even so he should have checked to see what had been done before doing any work on the vehicle. That part of the mistake is all on him
@@holmes1956O Don't be silly. If you did that you would be treated with disdain by the writer and management team. "Can't you read dummy?" Do the work as written, write your comment at the end, emphasise that your work as instructed is completed and tested with no codes....and photograph the original works order with all that written on it BEFORE they try to hand write a "correction".... Now who's the "dummy?
As a shop owner I deal with this stuff everyday. It’s always something like. “ you put wiper blades on now my check engine light is on! It wasn’t on before you worked on it” most people always want something for nothing.
Dead on, they have no clue how it works or why and it's always your fault. I have started videoing what I do and photos of the wrecked pieces of junk, they want me to work on( I do motorcycles and the garbage I see is staggering). From buggered up wiring for cool LED underlighting, which sets of security module and bike wont start to I rigged this so it works better etc.
Yes I’ve dealt with similar situations over the years. The customer is a shop owner whom I consider to be competent so I don’t think anybody was trying anything funny in that way. I believe it was just a miscommunication. Thanks.
Fixed my problems 3 years ago by retiring. I started working on other peoples headaches back in 1976 and it has gotten progressively interesting since. A lot of people want something fixed for a little bit of nothing and that grew old very quickly for me because tools and talent does not come cheap anywhere. Time is money and I did not like arguing with people that think they know more than you do. When someone would say" you can do it cheaper! I double the Price"! The last few years I was into this I faced every excuse in the book until I hung it up! This is part why tech's are quitting this field of repair because a lot of folks want something for nothing... So I tell them to buy the books and tools and do it themselves! Even many dealers can't keep mechanics because of money! Nuff Said.
Yes I feel that every day. Customers don’t want to pay what it really takes. Employers don’t want to pay what it really takes. In my experience shops are terrified to charge customers for legitimate repair work so they place the burden on the technician to make up for poor management. Thank you for commenting.
I understand where you’re coming from people don’t realize the education and the skills and. Tool. ( electronics tools cost ) to work on these new vehicles not any Tom, Dick, or Harry can do it anymore in the back yard
@@stashoski2675 electronics tools cost is one time feed you can easily make back the your money you spent on it within the first few months it the programming that cost every time you used it because of the manufactured and there subscription cost, also shop rate ridiculously overrated that is why more and more people end up going somewhere else come on seriously a $150 hour most people don't even make that working all day.
I was a technician for 30 years. I worked in an independent shop and worked on European, Asian, American and everything in between. Every day it was something different, and I had my share of accusations from customers. Everyone thinks mechanics are crooks, and the truth is we could easily be one. Cars are very complex now, and customers have no clue of how things work, or how things fail. Cars break every day, people. If they didn't, you wouldn't need technicians. Many times I replaced a bad injector or coil, or something else that what was also wrong with their car on top of the original complaint, with a good spare part I had laying around, and I did it for free just to keep them happy... I couldn't deal with it anymore and took a maintenance job at a factory. I couldn't be happier now. I know what I will be doing every day, and I don't have anybody treating me like I'm stupid or dishonest. The auto technician careers are fading fast, and I don't blame the techs one bit. Fix your own car, people, if you think it's so easy.
Thank you for sharing! I have done the exact same thing! I’ve fixed a customers vehicle with my own spare part just to not deal with the accusations. I have even seen a fellow coworker break a part on a customers car accidentally… Simple mistake. Coworker pulls out his phone calls the local auto parts store and buys the part with his own money rather than get the shop to cover it.
My "favorite" was when a customer would provide their own part, the work order would read "replace alternator" (or other component) and after I did, the car would be back a few days later as a comeback, still not working as intended, and now they expected me to diagnose the issue for free. Sorry, Nope. Someone higher up on the food chain than myself (customer, service writer, or service manager) diagnosed this, and I was told to replace a part- so I did. If the alternator (or other component) was the problem or not, at that point, was no longer my concern- you asked for a component to be replaced, you got a component replaced. Whether or not that component fixes the problem or was the problem is between you and whomever diagnosed the vehicle. I actually got fired multiple times for BS like this. They wouldn't actually word it that way, it would be more like "you're not being a team player" or something to that effect. I would usually come back with "if being on your team means I have to work for free, I'll find another team".
Well said… Yes, I have experienced those situations as well. I also worked at that kind of shop for a short time….we were not compatible and they played games to try and control you. They ended up firing me for not playing along, and when I called their bluff and had my stuff loaded up and gone in less than one hour, the boss had the writer call me and said it was all just a joke when I arrived in my driveway at home and then tried making me offers several times later and getting me back. I honestly think it was all a game to try and make me beg for my job. I just said “Ok. I’m gonna go load up my stuff and when I come back you’re going to have my final paycheck ready” D-O-N-E Done. Thanks for the comment.
My reply to some of these companies was, I didn’t get dressed up for nothing. PS I remember years ago customers used to come into the shop and want to borrow one of my tools, and I would say no problem. Give me your wallet and he said I’m not give me my wallet and I said I’m not giving you my tools. I don’t know you from Adam.
Your attitude is wrong. If someone brought me a part I would always ask who diagnosed the problem and made sure that there was a good chance the diagnosis was correct. In any case your position is wrong if you did not confirm that your installation of the part resolved the problem.
I worked at a dealer for almost thirty years. And it never stops amazing me how the service writers never ever take responsibility for there screw ups.
My favourite was a customer who complained that the fuel gauge didn't move on their newish car, I asked the service adviser to seek clarification on what the customer meant, To which he replied that the customer must be referring to the gauge not moving when they put fuel in..... instead of just calling the customer to clarify. So I take note of the fuel gauge reading both before replacing the fuel sender unit, and after replacing it.... Surprise, surprise, surprise.......no change..... Come to later find out that in the customers PREVIOUS car the fuel needle would drop when the car was switched off........... So since this DIFFERENT car wasn't doing that... it must have a fault..... The only saving grace was that I could access the fuel sender unit (and top of the fuel tank) by taking out the back seat... instead of having to drop the entire fuel tank.
If I got one in that was High Mileage and needed a ton of work I would make sure to tell them that I AM NOT! Responsible for other things that can burn out or quit working because some of them were about the end of their usefulness. Many agreed with me and spared both of us a lot of headaches. I don't like to put up with Stupid crap.
I have several similar stories through the 37 years as a technician(30 with Honda). Recently retired. It helps to have a service manager that values your work and will support your decisions. It also helps to have some communication skills sufficient to convey why you are not at fault and will not be proceeding until payment method is conveyed. Through the years, I developed the reputation of being very thorough, capable and confident but not a fast high volume tech. Naturally this means you get more weird problems dispatched but not the big service jobs that pay well. The weird ones can be satisfying but harder to pay the bills(especially under warranty) 😉 Fortunately, I had upper management that was able to keep my pay at a reasonable level by having me train. They saw the industry changing and fewer technicians applying for jobs. I spent the last ten years with an apprentice. They would train with me for a year at least before flat rating. I was paid for my labor and theirs. I trained nine techs in that time. Throughout my career, I came across many very good technicians held back by their own attitude or lack of confidence. My guess is you've seen something similar.
Thank you very much for sharing! Yes I’ve experienced similar. A good manager is amazing for shop production. I had also always been thorough and slow….still am sometimes. The haste came with experience. I have trained some apprentices in a similar pay situation… Honestly, some of the most fun I have ever had working in the shop… Renewed my passion for auto repair. I would love to eventually teach… May have possible teaching opportunities opening up at the local college soon. Teaching was also partly the inspiration for this channel, I have literally spent my entire life gathering knowledge… To share knowledge and experience… To record what I have in my head before I am gone.
I am currently a GM tech in Canada . I get where you are coming from . I'm looking at getting out myself because it's gotten bad in the trade as well as I'm getting too old for this .
I'm only 30 , doing this for 10years, the last 2-3 years is just f ing hell.... they block you to do the job, you don't have access to shit, they make the software a pain in the ass just to f with the 3rd repair shops, made everything only accessible online... even a simple adaptation nowadays is a pain in the ass, than comes the cliens who want their cars to be done in 1 day, and for free, when you put in 2-3 days worth of time to find a problem , because you don't have the acces for anything anymore, and at the end you don't get paid what that work was worth, you always get way less than what you put in to find a problem, and these new cars, all have things like this, that looks like is a 10min job, and will become days and weeks because the entire system is made to be bad, and hard to repair. I still have 1-2 years and i';m done with this job for sure, people can cry in 5--6 years not having anyone to repair their car , and i will laught on the side. Repairing cars nowadays became ridiculous, even people who came to learn from me, the first thing i say, if you want a life and money, go and find another job that you want to do, repairing cars became a pain in the ass, there is a big problem with the equipment prices, the amount of things you need for simple things, the access for anything, making online everything, and the amount of things they put in cars just became a major problem, and let's not talk about the people, people want everything done in minutes... on cars that are made in a way for people who repair them to have a heart attack when they see them.
My mom used to threaten me that if i didnt get good marks in school i would wind up a garbage man. I ended up a broke ass auto tech and now union garbage men earn $80 thousand a year and never touch a can.
I was told the same thing except it was a ditch digger. 3 years ago I quit being a master tech and started driving trucks. Making more money and less stress.
@bayoumike544 good for you. I had to retire early because my knees went out. I injured one on a job and the doctors did nothing for me. Later on after the cartlidge disappeared WCB told me it was my fault I didn't follow up. Now I am old and broke with no pension.
That is funny before I was done reading your comment I was going to say exactly that… “waste management specialists” make some dang good money and benefits these days. Honestly, it is possible to make a good living in auto repair… It takes a significant personal investment of time and money compared to other jobs. Thank you.
@@smokeskull I know the feeling. Knees and hips shot and no pension. However I am making more money sitting in a truck with a/c but am out for a week at a time (18 wheeler)
That's one of the reasons i retired after 44 years in the trade as a GM tech. Front office thought they knew best. I had a few run ins when i would not use someone else's diagnosis and then crickets when there diagnosis was incorrect. Life in the country playing with my own toys is so good 😊 In saying that it can be so satisfying to fix someone's long-term problem and get thanked for it (Too rare unfortunately) cheers from Australia 🇦🇺
7:47 38 years in the trade and I agree with every comment on here. I would love to get out of the trade.... My son followed in my footsteps (against my advice) 😢
I worked in a local shop for 4 years. The amount of money losing proposition jobs the owner agreed to undertake was astounding. And he was never in the workshop to do it.
I worked as an auto tech briefly about 25 years ago. I left because as the new guy I was getting all the work that paid 30 minutes for 45+ minutes of work while the long-time guys got all the gravy work that paid 3 hours for 2 hours of work or better. After about a year of essentially minimum wage work (where I had to buy expensive tools out-of-pocket) and seeing that it would be many years before my situation would noticeably improve I left for greener pastures and have no regrets!
Yes, that is very common… The older established techs would quit if the new guy gets all of the good desirable gravy work. It is sad that every time I teach somebody something that I am good at and share knowledge and tips, it cost me and hurts me. I experienced the same thing for many years… Working broke and buying expensive tools while waiting for it to start paying off. It is finally paying off… All of the hours upon hours of free reading material that I invested the time and locked it away in my brain more so than the tools. I am not that old and my body is already starting to kill me from the physical work of auto repair… I am hoping to be able to keep up production using my brain when my body can no longer produce the hours. Thanks for sharing.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist The physical side of auto mechanics is rarely even talked about. I took some auto tech classes & almost every teacher had noticeable scars with stories that they were lucky to survive from.
@@ag4allgood I think we all have some of those stories. I have lots of scars from jobs where I bled to meet and beat flat rate labor times. A couple good burn marks too lol. Thanks.
IT TAKES YEARS TO GET GOOD YOUR BRIEF TIME SHOWS YOU GAVE UP ON WHAT TAKES A LIFE TIMEYOU JUST DONT WALK IN GREEN AND EXPECT GRAVY TRAIN THOSE GUYS DID THE TIME ENOUGH SAID.
I was in the flat rate game, off and on, for too many years. At one dealership I was in the shop 50-60 hours a week and got behind on my mortgage because the service writers had no problem giving work away. I’m doing fleet maintenance now. Servicing and repairing filthy old work trucks isn’t fun but I get paid reasonably well. Only 4 years left until I can retire and I’ll be out
Yes, it gets really old having to work hard and dig deep to make up the difference when everybody is relaxed about giving away your time for free. Glad to hear you are making it work. Thank you for the comment.
I'm there with my service writers, and for over 3 years I've been trying to beat into their heads that we don't give labor away! Just because it took 15 minutes to write a customer up (as half assed as possible) doesn't mean that the mechanic will fix it so easily. I asked for a raise, but was told we're not making the money, meanwhile they service writers aren't wasting time to even look up job times. I'm just glad in less then two years I'm done. I'm retiring early and will set myself up to do some jobs on my own and of what I want to work on.
@@Oldbmwr100rs it’s why I gave up working at dealerships and went back into contract security. Didn’t want to change industries but I didn’t see any other way to get ahead. Security pays a consistent hourly rate for way less headaches. Spent 7 months trying to find a good paying dealership position ( know what a service advisor does btw). I had 15 interviews for dealership positions and I never got a call back. 7 months and 15 interviews. Went back to security work cause they actually did call me back
There once was a time when service writer's were knowledgeable now, last week they were a fill clerk just out of high school now they're writing tickets and your having to explain that the right side of the car is always the right side no mater where you are standing After 40 years of being a technician I was fired for telling a service writer that I was not looking for keys on a miss tagged car which had happened many times before. The manager said that I had hurt all the writers feelings at one time or the other and had to go
I get the feeling that service writers will be one of the jobs AI will replace once it gets up to speed. The people with manual labour skills will have AI as assistants to book jobs, find parts, repair manual specs etc. Those who can't do actual work, will get replaced.
I worked as a mechanic for a municipality and had the Public Works director tell me essentially the same thing. He told me everybody was afraid of me, and that I'd hurt a lot of people's feelings. My reply to him was that he hired me to service and repair the cities vehicles, not as a social worker or psychiatrist to worry about other employees' "feelings". He and I did not get along very well.
Number 1 reason I retired from wrenching TECHNOLOGY HAS BECOME TO DAMN STUPID. I LOVE THE OLD MECHANICS RULE, KISS RULE KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID. AS FOR THE ENGINEERS AND DESIGNERS, THEY DON'T HAVE TO WORK ON NEW POS'S.
For years as an Automotive mechanic aka technician this very event has happened to me sooo many times. I have always used three main (there's more I'm sure) statements that might help. 1)No ticket, no laundry! 1a) I do donate to charities when I want, not when I'm told to! For the involuntary free work. 2) Poor planning and diligence on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part! For the incorrect R/O line description entered.
I was a mechanic in the military, got out in 1969 and lasted 3 years working on flat rate.....until I couldnt pay rent and started working in Industry.....regular work, regular pay, retirement, health care etc. only worked on cars for fun and beer money after that....still working on my own, and friends vehicles in retirement.
As an hourly telephone tech, I would sometimes get tickets where the problem described on the ticket was nothing related to what the customer was experiencing. I learned quick to always doubt what was written and confirm with the individual that was having the problem before wasting a bunch of time "fixing" something that wasn't broken....
Sometimes I will intercept the customer and have a quick chat with them just to get a feel for the situation and gather vital information. Depends on the customer, because that can turn into a big time suck all by itself. Thanks for sharing. That sounds like a fun job.
On the other hand I had a water pump swapped on an Ecotec and they let the cam timing slip. It made the engine run poorly and vibrate. We retimed the cam chain and all was well. First shop still insists a vibrating dash is normal and that changing the cam timing would not cause vibration anyway. I think people on both sides can be right, sometimes simultaneously.
Yes sometimes it goes that way. The other shop just didn’t want to take accountability and kicked the customer down the road which is the absolute worst thing to happen to a customer. Thank you.
I was a tech for 46 years and a shop owner for 40 years of that and shut it down in April and took a job with the railroad. Glad to be out of the business. No qualified techs out there to hire, parts are hard to find now and overhead is now too high to make it profitable. Like working on my race stuff but will never go back to being a technician for a living. I’m done.
While I was never a tech, I wore many hats in a dealership environment for most of my career (parts counter/manager, IT guy, warranty admin). Made a change and went to the railroad 14 years ago......and never looked back. I feel for my brothers and sisters still in the game.
Used to be a German & GM drivability tech way back and the more I see of this 'techno-depend on the computer stuff today, I love my 1980 SR5 even more. 19 years and going.
I love it when you go into a dealership or independent shop and the service advisor is a girl in her 20s. Hire the most unqualified people to cut your payroll costs. Can bus is nothing but problematic, its a daisy chain and if its not a bad module and its a wiring problem GOOD LUCK ! New vehicles with less that 10k on the odometer at the dealerships for a month and still not repaired !
Men and women working as service advisors completely lack automotive knowledge so I wouldn’t really blame it on this or that. Yes usually they are hired at a minimum to be a people handler. I kind of enjoy network diagnostics it is fairly easy to understand and is clean work. I believe many dealerships are lacking skilled personnel, and also there have been significant parts delays across-the-board. Thanks.
If the service advisor is generally a person with little mechanical skills then why is hiring a 20 y/o girl as a service advisor a problem? I would assume this position is more about communication and customer service. I don't work in the auto industry, just someone that DIYs my own cars, so maybe I misunderstand, but definitely open to being corrected.
@@donaldlee6760 The main reason why I started doing my own service was so called service advisors. Looked at the repair bill on my mom's car and they charged her for 6 quarts of oil on a 350 V8 ! When I was working and took my Honda in for service = car was 3 years old and air conditioner compressor went out. Spent 6 hours working on my car and called me up and the parts guy ordered the wrong part ! Sitting in the waiting room waiting for my car I see a tech drain the differential oil on another car and then lower it down like it was done, talked to the cute little girl and she was to scared to talk to the tech. I went out and told the dumb ass to do his job and he said thanks man ! Went to Les Swab for tires and drive home and they put the wrong size tire on one side of my vehicle and the correct size on the other ! Had some brake work done and start driving and the steering wheel was moving back and forth without me touching it so get out of the car and lug nuts were loose on both front tires. The average cost of car repairs today is $4500 bucks according to CNBC . SCREW SERVICE WRITERS AND GREASE MONKEY'S WHO CHARGE UP THE KAZOO AND RIP PEOPLE OFF ! I GUESS YOU BUY A NEW CAR EVERY 2 YEARS AND HAVE NEVER EXPERIENCED BEING SCREWED !
I get where you are coming from, but as a customer I have had my share of ineptitude and crooked service departments in the past. Dealerships nowadays seem to just throw my money and their parts at the problem till I trade it for another one.
Unfortunately, you are right… The problem is incompetent technicians that do not put any effort into diagnostics and just throw parts at a problem… Usually at the customers expense and a huge waste of time. Thanks.
Yeah, I had a buddy who was Chrysler trained and employed. Their M.O. was just throw parts at it until the code goes away. He was notorious for doing shi**y trans rebuilds and whatnot, but he's still employed there.
@@notmyname3883 I worked with a guy that everything he touched came back… Literally for years after he left also they were still coming back. “But he’s sooo fast” I was told lol.
People would stay in the industry, if it paid. It just doesn't pay anymore, as the house takes 80% of Labor cut. You've got shop owners that want to run their business like a McDonald's, with similar overhead. I2 stayed in the business too long, multiple decades and the only time my income was respectable was one Ike quit working for somebody else. I went from $75,000 a year, to $165,000 a year and I work Less hours. Something to think about.
Started working on car’s in an old full service gas station in 1983, went off to a technical school to learn to be a mechanic in 1987 after my father an ex army mechanic taught me how to work on cars. In that time I had customers rip the station off for car batteries at $5 per battery, dropped out of the trade school that later became an accredited college over the funky monkey BS the school was pulling. And have since worked in another service station, where I saw a bunch of funny business going on by the owners son and customers. I still work on car’s, but refuse to do it for the general public or for an employer. The reason there is a shortage of mechanics is 4 fold, poor education, unethical employers, unethical customers and corrupt/incompetent mechanics. Only takes one bad mechanic, to cause a shop to develop a bad reputation that shuts a shop down.
Well said. Thanks for sharing. That one bad mechanic in the shop can really ruin it for everybody else you are absolutely right….I’ve worked with “that guy”.
As a owner of a shop Jr's Auto these people have gotten me to the point that I want the bill paid in full before I begin work I'm tired of getting screwed and f*****the way I see it and dr. Bob agrees there's no reason to take half now and half later give me at all now up front!!!!💰💰💰💯🚩
got one better! Crook customer comes in, gets everything repaired correctly,pays with credit card,then declines payment because not satisfied with repairs! 🤥
Customer came to pick it up after paying and it wouldn’t start. So fingers were getting pointed and it was alluded that I should diagnose and fix it for free because it had of been my fault. Happens every day in the industry and employers would rather place the burden on the employee than take the loss. I’ve experienced this at every shop I’ve ever worked for. Thank you for commenting.
Sooooo you didn't watch the video?@rob1248996 Dude-man says he started it up and it sounded like dog water only running on four cylinders. But at that point, it still wasn't his problem because he was only supposed to "reprogram the PCM" as per the work order.
it's never their fault it's the Mechanic's ! same BS i went through, i am so happy that i am retired now the whole system just got worse and worse every year with the new technology. the fights for pays increased and the pays dropped
Quit back in 2006 as dealer hr rate was $ 105.00 an hour, and only paid tech $18 an hour + fix other techs comebacks for free, after they got fired!!! @@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist
I got blamed for bending a clutch disc in a Camaro. It wasn't bent, and I knew it wasn't. Was chattering when it came in, and they wanted me to give it back in that condition (ostensibly to collect the bill). I refused, told them the customer would not take delivery with poor operation. I finally won out. pulled it apart and handed the disc to the service manager and said, show me the bent disc! It had 2 marcel plates stacked, so a thick spot in one section of the disc. Manufacturing defect.
And I bet they wiggled and squirmed on paying you for your time? That’s been my experience at least…it takes quite a bit of time to take the transmission out to prove your innocence. Thanks for commenting.
I was the used car tech at a busy dealership and they blamed me for over looking a missing spare tire after the customer bought it. I had to educate them that there is no spare tire! Only a bottle of fix a flat and a factory compressor. Did I get an apology. NO
I recently bought some parts from a shop that i thought was also a mechanical workshop, when i commented that i thought he was a mechanic he said "I am but i have closed that side of the business because i got sick and tired of people blaming me for things that i didn't do, or pressuring me to do things for free whilst i had the vehicle in for repair, or just arguing about the price when they came to pick up there vehicle. So i just sell parts now, i make just as much money, i don't get stressed, and when it gets to 5pm i am out the door". Its a real shame as he did some work on my mums car years ago, and was so genuine and nice, its totally crap that people have burnt him out ...
People in other industries are saying "One reason people are quitting........." Its not just the automotive industry. Business has become so much more complicated and frustrating. There are too many specifics to list. However, if you take general issues in one industry, there will often be general similarities in another industry.
I think it is a culture of being way too comfortable giving away somebody else’s time to appease a customer at the lowest rate. Race to the bottom business model. Thank you.
Lol on the service and repair side of things when somebody comes in with a concern right after they left the body shop, the body shop is the first to get blamed. Sometimes it’s true sometimes it’s not… But they are always the first to take the blame because they touched it last. There have been times on diagnosis where I found a simple ground nut left, loose or some thing from a good body shop, and I explain to the customer it was just a simple mistake, and to not hold it against them too much. On the flipside, I have also seen lots of bad body shops do some nasty work and cause some new problems. Now days we have to take full walk around photos of the car inside and out to avoid being blamed for pre-existing damage. I can usually sniff out a customer who is hunting for a victim… I always take good notes also. Thanks.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist yes I know all about bad body shops. Thankfully the last 3 over 15 years all have been the top shops in my state for quality . But I know of a song you can relate to. Hold on I'll link it in a Second
Its the same all over the world.. I was a multi brand master tech and a Automotive engineer, the blame game gets old quick as does the lack of trust. i have seen this problem from both sides of the fence and decided working on cars is better a hobby than a trade. The lack of understanding of the motortrade is bad.
That’s the same old story. Sounds like you are the exact kind of highly skilled, talented individual that this industry needed and failed. Thanks for sharing.
I feel your pain..GM Saab owner here..Never before have i purchased a car, then had to get a Tech 2 or any other diagnostic scanner to keep it running..A spare used ECU, then a laptop etc for security access so i can clone the ECU in the vehicle for when it eventually fails. .I think i spend more time looking out for warning lights on the dashboard than i do looking at the road..
It’s getting to be difficult to find the old Saab cartridges for the Tech 2 too. The Saab version of the Tech 2 can be emulated via Tech2Win with a subscription and a J2534 device. I remember working on Saabs in the independent repair world before they shut down and then overnight they became difficult to source parts and tools, etc. then nobody wanted to own them or work on them. Thanks for the comment.
I’m in Hvac. A lock shop trued to switch all their techs from per hour pay to commission only 10-99 contractors. 23 out of 25 tech quit on the spot. The company went out of business 2 weeks later. The owner tryed blaming it on some increasing you profits summoner he went to. He know he was shifting all his liability’s onto his employees. And they where having none of that crap
Yep they know what they are doing. If the employee is paid by the hour… Suddenly the burden of management and production is on the shoulders of… Management. I see that from time to time in the auto industry also… Boss comes back from the big seminar, put on by somebody who has never even spent a day in the trade and wants to make all sorts of big changes. Totally out of touch… I blame that on ownership and management that does not come from the tradespeople that it manages. Thank you.
If you're going to be 1099, you might as well just be self-employed or start your own HVAC business with a couple of other guys. All you're doing is taking all the liability while the boss gets rich.
I’m a medical Xray/Device Technition and I’m telling ya, it not just your industry! I’ve actually gotten the “he was in the building and now X does not work” get it all the time, blamed for things I had absolutely nothing to do with. It’s really bad especially with salesmen making impossible promises to make sales. I’m looking to get out of this Industry, I’m a burnout aswell.
I used to install A/V equipment for a local shop in the evenings and people would bring in stuff to be installed that wouldn't work and then either not want to pay or blame us for the non-working component. I eventually started having them pay to have the item bench tested upfront and then would take the testing fee off the install fee if I did the work.
Take your custom built, $5,000 gaming computer, bolt it to a commercial paint can shaker, wire the on switch such that when you start the computer it also starts the paint shaker as well. This is basically the environment that you have with all the electronics in a modern vehicle. It's bloody insane.
Working in a field dealing with the public sucks to begin with, and if you're in an industry in which the mfg's are constantly changing stuff to be less serviceable, but require more service, you cannot avoid frustration. I'm not a tech, I just work on my own stuff, and I cringe at the thought of working on a newer car when I have to buy one. Driving an '05 Taurus right now and plan to keep her alive for a long long time.
Yes it is hard to own a fancy modern car if you want to do your own work because you usually need to also own multiple special tools for common repairs. Every part and piece also seems to be expensive and fragile. Keeping the 05 Taurus is a good plan. They are solid cars and they’re cheap/easy to keep on the road. Thanks for commenting.
Not your fault...and refused to repair until paid. Proper thing to do! I rebuilt a carb for another shop. 2 months later it needed it again.Full of guck the first time...filled with guck again. I told them guck is not covered,when they picked it up the first time. Replace whats causing the guck! Ive been retired for a couple of years...now only work on race cars or teach high speed driving...best time of my life..:)
I hate modern cars with their computerised operation! Give me the good ol' days of timing chains, carburettors, coils, distributors, condensers and sports aircleaners!
Miscommunication is happening in all industries, especially when sales people try to circumvent having the customers talk directly to the tech doing the work.
If any customer has had an issue with having to sign a verification of work to be done by the shop, this is an explicit reason why....CYA. This will be a memory grabber if another scenario like this rolls in, glad you had a good handle on what the issue was.
Normally things go smoothly for this customer. I program for other shops fairly often. It was just a simple miscommunication, I wasn’t willing to take the blame and remedy the situation for free. Thank you, everything worked out ok and all is well.
Same here. When I walked up to it I was told “the old module is on the seat” it wasn’t there. This program was for a shop owner whom I consider competent so I didn’t question what he did. It was a simple miscommunication, it all worked out in the end. Thanks.
Always dreamed of getting the your level , Thank you for talking us through your thought process , busted them and got paid , And did it with gentlemanly style , Congratulations on mad skills
Thank you very much! I’m what your average technician should be, I just fake it till I make it. Jokes aside I learned everything I know from somebody else at some point over the years, I’ve also made plenty of costly mistakes which were good lessons. So I’m trying to return the favor here on RUclips and share the knowledge and experience with anybody hungry to learn.
Glad they didn't stick you with it. Getting people to take responsibility for their work is hard these days. Good to see there are still competent technicians out there.
The comments do not address the real issues. The absurd and unecessary compexity of modern vehicles. Because of emissions and economy dictates from government bureaucrats. A carburettor that is matched to a perticular engine is nearly as good as EFI with none of the peripheral sensors, computers and software. Why dont ECM's come already programmed for a particular vehicle? They self learn anyway, why do they need programming? None of the chips and relays that control lights, windows, wipers, door locks etc are necessary. Mechanical switches and window cranks work fine. My '57 vw has 3 switches: ignition, lights and wipers. Windows go up and down with a manually operated crank. Goes anywhere a new car does and gets nearly the same MPG.
True a well tuned carburetor can have excellent low emissions. The problem is that a carburetor cannot really self adjust the way fuel injected vehicle can when you are driving in mixed conditions, changing altitude, temperature, etc.. There are a few reasons the module needs to programmed….. back in the day when modules could be swapped between vehicles, they were a hot item to be stolen so making the module locked to the Vin number of the vehicle was a antitheft measure. Also the module may be being built in such a way that it physically will fit into multiple vehicles… Some of the pins on the computer may be used or not used depending where it is installed. So we program the module to essentially tell it “you’re installed in a car equipped with a 4 cylinder, so don’t set codes for cylinders 5-8 because they don’t exist”. In a lot of cases in the Volkswagen world, the module is actually pre-programmed, and simply requires “coding”…. The same thing is being accomplished, we are simply telling the module what it’s job is. Thanks.
I was gas engine repair at a ford dealer replacing cam phasers and short blocks, day in and day out. Got tired of the grind, busting ass for insufficient pay. Got hired on with local utility, best move ever.
I was a tech for almost 30 years. Am so glad to be retired. Autos are nothing more than rolling computers these days. So much useless technology. I miss the good old days. I feel this guys pain.
Sometimes I will intercept the customer and talk to them real quick to feel out the situation, sometimes the customer concern is completely different then it was written. I make a point to go and visit with some of my best customers because it is a good working relationship we have built, and they trust me to take care of them as best as possible. I find that customers appreciate, brutal honesty when it comes to their car… Tell them everything that it needs and advise them. Talking with customers can be time consuming, though… And a flat rate technician does not necessarily get paid to stand there and talk so it’s something that is best avoided. Thank you.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist good way to be. I knew most of my customers names and watched their children grow. Trust is one of the biggest ways to improve business.
This always sucks when something like this happens. I'm not an auto tech, but I am a PC tech and the same thing happens. Customer always looks for someone else to blame when something goes wrong with their poorly maintained equipment and you are expected to foot the bill for it.
Asking a few questions, popping the hood and taking a look around before you start might’ve proved beneficial in this and will in future endeavors. Trust but verify.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist That's called assuming. When we break down the word assume we find that when we do it we make an Ass of U and Me. I understand your frustration, but the fact is that you could have avoided this waste of time by not assuming. Mechanics should understand that the reason the vehicle was in the shop was because the owner didn't know how to fix it. The person writing up the order was probably just writing down what the customer told them.
@@richardlanders5300 so then for that 30 seconds of your unpaid time of checking that what they say is real, is in fact real. I get to charge an additional 1hour diagnostic and verification fee?
@@scotttiller4660 I miss the old days when someone took pride in getting the job done and not worrying about if they get paid for an extra thirty seconds of time. You made a seven-minute video about people wasting your time... how much did you get paid for doing that?
I'm 60 and if I last 5 more yrs to retire Itll be a miracle. I was in a dealership but went to a small independent shop to do light duty work but the service writers do so much BS parking lot diag its borderline criminal because i do what they tell me but 70% of the time it's wrong so ill have to trll them if they want it fixed i need to diag it.. I also keep telling them to get more info on the service orders they seem not to care and just put...check car...for a hvac issue or something like that. Problem is they have the owner convinced they know it all....what bullshit we techs deal with is unbearable.
When the truck ran rough when you fixed it the first time you should of known something was wrong. The bad thing is that probably the customer was charged twice.
i worked 25 years as an auto tech, mostly in new car dealerships. My opinion is that the flat rate system is the underlying problem in the industry it promotes fraud and encourages fast sloppy work. I got out in my mid 40s and have never regretted leaving.
Yes, I agree. The flat rate pay system is no longer compatible with the highly technological safety systems and electrical systems of today. Thank you for commenting.
A few months ago I got out of the business. People were an issue time to time but incompetence was my biggest gripe. Someone somewhere did something and I was fixing their fuck up. Sometimes even being blamed for other people's fuck up. I'm glad and doing better after I got out.
Great episode. It made me think as, I've been on both sides as a mechanic and as a customer. It really depends on who you are dealing with and who you are. You just got to know when to hold em and when to fold em. Knowing that the stakes are high and eventually something will go wrong is a good mind set. Ethical and competent people are a joy to work with. That's not what you get, sometimes. Desperate numbskulls are a nightmare. CYA. Cover your ass.
Working at the dealership….if it’s not free they’re not interested. Even if something is out of warranty, they squawk and cry until it gets covered under “goodwill” warranty literally at the technicians expense. Thank you for commenting.
This is why it’s better to be on your own without the craziness of a service department/ service writer always on your case. You can’t have pride in your work without the proper information.
Us consumers see the shortage as well. Slipped a pad in one of my work vans. Pads and rotors were changed 42k ago on this van, paid the dealership to do it. I take it here because this van is never in my hands and this particular employee is known for ignoring obvious signs. I told the manager why i bring it to them for oil changes, so they can do the inspection and keep my van ready for work. Well they couldn't fit the van in for a week so i did the pads and rotors myself(used to work as a mechanic a lifetime ago). Upon removal i discover the caliper pin/bolts have never been greased since factory installation. Dust caps are full of exactly that, dust. So the caliper slides are completely frozen, needs new calipers as well. Then i noticed the passenger strut is toast, boot detached and leaking fluid. Asked my employee how long has the van been pulling? He says for a while now and i told the dealership. Why didn't you tell me? Dealership does the tire rotations as well with the oil changes so how did they not notice the strut? I think they are just so understaffed that either they dont have time to fix identified problems at the time of discovery. Or they are so understaffed that inexperienced mechanics are forced to do jobs they haven't been properly trained to do. I used to do all this myself but we are in the same boat, no time. Looks like i will be making time in the future because i cannot afford to have a van down for maintenance and then for dealing with improper maintenance. FYI, I paid one of our local shops to do struts and shocks. I just don't have the time or facilities for the struts. It seems we are understaffed in every field thanks to Joe and crew. FJB
Lasting 42k isn’t too bad for brakes on a work van. Caliper slide pins do get hot and dry out more often on work vans too, but yeah it’s likely they didn’t even clean and grease them. For some reason in this industry the most important operation of doing oil changes, inspections, and other maintenance services are regarded very lowly and given to the lowest skilled and inexperienced “technician”…..usually right off the street with little to no training similar to a quick lube. The opposite should be true… a car comes in for an oil change it should have skilled eyes doing a thorough inspection to recommend repair and upkeep because the customer isn’t even aware of problems until they become bad enough. In reality “lubrication specialists” are incentivized with extra money to upsell filters and flushes so that’s all they end up caring about on top of not even knowing what they’re doing. Thank you.
The food and hospitality industry is hurting in that same way also. It's so bad some places are forced to hire ppl with known drug habits and other issues. Or you can't fire shit workers because a shitty worker is better than no worker in many cases. It's unreal. And now C19 stuff coming again making it all so much harder and ppl are going to quit and we're going to lose all the places that didn't close during the last lockdowns etc.
@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist I have 5 of these promaster 2500. Typically they make it about 80k on front pads. Bought all of them new so we keep a maintenance log on all of them, that's the only reason I know this. It's crazy times for skilled trades. An over abundance of work and a lot of Americans don't want to work. Our government handed out a lot of money during covid which worsened thst issue. I wish we could get through to some of these people that college isn't the only path. You cannot learn my trade in a classroom, only the technical portions of it. But it won't make much sense without learning the application of that knowledge in the field. Skilled trades are a dying breed and one can make 6 figures easily if they are highly motivated. Best of luck out there my friend 👍
@@knuckledragger2412 brake life varies widely around here because we have a lot of hilly terrain outside of the cities. If I can help it I’d like this channel to be a resource pool for anybody seeking knowledge and experience. I would like to give somebody the gift of learning a skilled trade to be able to better themselves. I have a lot of fun teaching any of the apprentices that are interested in learning which is rare.
I went to college for automotive. I began my career and immediately became frustrated with the flat rate system. I left industry for a time and then returned as a shop owner. My guys get paid good money on straight time. And I could easily hire techs away from dealerships; however, even the dealerships are abandoning the flat rate system in order to keep technicians.
I hear you, that old adage ' The customer is always right' doesn't fly. I've seen it time and time again, other existing faults now become new faults that we caused. The industry is stuffed, mainly due to customers dishonesty and attitudes.
I had my BCM replaced at my Honda dealership for a 2017 Honda pilot. Paid $1.3k just to find out that wasn't the issue with my dash going crazy, lights, and car alarm going off. They wanted me to go back but they'll have to charge me for another diagnosis which is $150. I decided to trade it instead of wasting time and money. The car only had 53k miles.
I see that situation from time to time. The $150 diagnostic would have been a good investment to find out the actual problem and be done with it. What you described is common though…. A customer may spend so much time and energy trying to get a certain vehicle fixed that they no longer enjoy the vehicle and would rather just get it out of their lives and that is ok too. Ultimately the goal is peace of mind with your transportation. Thank you.
When I was a mechanic the same bs. Counter people making mistakes. Walked off from one shop for constantly having to fix things that was not on work order because customer said it wasn’t like that when they brought it in. Things not even related to the original job.
Not sure about your shop but our process for reprogramming a module always ends with checking DTCs. This is the exact reason why we don’t sign off on a WO without verifying the repair. To be fair to you, we also would never accept “reprogram BCM” as the only information on a work order. We would also have the customer sign after verifying the correct information was on the ticket, prior to sending it back. This seems like something a couple processes would solve very easily.
You are right there is a lot of room for improvement and some lessons to be learned here. Normally I would do all of that… This customer was a shop owner whom I consider to be competent so I didn’t really question what he wanted… I must have gotten too comfortable with the process because I program for him from time to time and he always just says what he wants. Especially did not question it when the engine started and ran…. At that point, body functions were all working OK and my part was done. Thanks.
I've read several comments here, what these guys forget is how many shops screwed over customers with inflated prices and recommending repairs that aren't need, not to mention the car not being ready on time. Most shops had the same level of respect as car dealerships. I dread hiring any type of contractor my experience has been most over charge and under perform. All that being said I agree many customers are as bad if not worse than the shops. I guess it's like everything else in today's world no one trusts anyone and always blames the other person for their problems.
I have worked with some fellow technicians that had very little personal accountability, and they had very little regard for the quality of work that they were out putting. Also the pay system incentivizes people to sell work that is not needed…. no personal integrity. I am sure my colleagues agree that none of us like to work with that person in the shop… It brings the entire shop down with a damaged reputation. The rest of us professionals take our job seriously… We advise the customer on their repair needs and do not sell unnecessary work. I’ve always been broke just like most of my customers, so I’ve already looked out for their best interests as much as I could. Thanks for commenting.
I was getting hounded for a couple months about a lady that needed a washer fix that we sold her. I finally I had time to get to her. It happened to be her hot and cold were mixed up so I changed them on the washer started working fine. She then proceeded to tell me to change it back. Buyers remorse is a hell of a drug.
I miss the days where you just needed a carb rebuild kit or something simple like that. Now everything is so complicated you can't fix things yourself as easy.
The problem with the industry is you dont know who is bullshitting you and who isnt, i had my car in the shop and they try to tell me the cabin filter should be replaced, i laughed and said it’s a k&n filter it and it was just washed, so this just tells me they didnt even look at it just trying to sell you shit
That is possible yes. You have to find a shop that you trust and build a relationship with them. Some cabin filters can be difficult to access and replace so not all shops will inspect them for free before trying to sell one....best practice is to check the service history before recommending the filter....if the customer has no idea when the last time it's been replaced, its usually way overdue....from that point on we've established service history for future recommendations without having to inspect it. It's expected to be replaced yearly or every 15,000miles - 30,000 miles. Thanks.
Yup had done a rear brake repair on a Buick Riviera, customer came back stating has engine fumes in cabin after,,car was covered in snow at the windshield base and hood, still had check out for an exhaust leak and also the brake job for CYA,,,it happens but is so obvious when the car has winter issues. Keep the customer happy and build a trust relations,,they will be back if you are polite. If you are angry at the customer in front of other customers you made a bad situation worse so be the man and get free lunch from the service advisor and a good customer pay job from the tower to make up from the time lost instead of being a deva. ASE MASTER TECH. Thanks for making this video ! peace on earth and ocean
Hi guys yes me too I worked with engine development last 30 odd years electronics was my major, it's gotten insane how much time and equipment needed to work independently on car electronics, 57 years old Every day is a grind ,sometimes it takes days To work out a problem no information and schematics or coding information, it's dammed hard and no one cares ,very little money in it now what do we do??
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist Yes no worries, today I am 3 days in on a Peugeot 207 will it be pay day today? The customer is a lady Who is sure she knows what the problem is, loose keys !! I tried to explain can bus communication is nothing related to loose keys 😉
I worked in the forklift service industry for 21 years after 9 in the RAF and 11 in a coal mine (electrician). The best job ever ,with a company service truck that saved me commute expenses . Most of the guys were ex auto mechanics. Same story, low pay crap cars, frustrating procedures. Get into electric forklift work guys , you'll love it.
I wrenched for 30 years, once a lady blamed that after I changed her oil, her radio stopped working and demanded I replace it! Customers are never right!
I’ve had the same thing happen…. I turned the volume knob down when it came in the door and then turned the volume knob back up in front of her eyes. Convertible Mercedes… Nice older one. Thanks for sharing.
Modern cars have too much electronic garbage on them. You don't need any of that crap. You need air, fuel, spark, and a clutch to connect to the transmission. You don't need electronics for any of it. You need a carb, spark plugs, headers... You don't need any of that other stuff. Mechanical fuel pumps were always fine until they wanted to charge you more money for electric ones. A car should be a car, not a robot. I've always changed my own oil, changed my own plugs, rebuilt my own carbs, changed my own clutch, changed my own gear oil... Kids today don't even know how to change a tire.
Sadly, you are correct… I see full grown men standing on the side of the road with their arms crossed looking like a B, having the tow truck driver put the spare tire on for them. We have put ourselves in this situation… Consumers want all the bells and whistles while… also the emissions laws is what drives the need for computerized controls on engines. Thanks.
I used to really enjoy doing whatever the service writer said after he diagnosed the problem. Then I would go up and tell him I did what he said, do you want me to fix it now? Pretty sure they didn't like me sometimes.
I worked as a mechanic in the 80's and early 90's and this is been going on before cars went computerized. I used to get that all the time, lucky for me the shop owner didn't take no shit from anyone and he would tell them off. God I miss Sam he was the best, most honest and coolest boss. Women were always the ones that pulled that crap.
After 30+ years as a GM dealership tech, I left to work on inner city transit bus's, mostly just maintenance. Hourly, no flat rate, much better pay, insurance and easier work. Retired now, but If I were still working, nothing could get me to go back working in a flat rate dealership ever again.
Woman's kid smokes a Lincoln SUV engine, someone pulled engine in a driveway and crushed the PCM pinout. They approched me to get it running from a pile of parts with used engine and PCM. They expected to pay $600. I would need $500 to pull it into the garage to cover fluids and filters with cushion for missing parts/ specialty hardware. They had no idea the PCM needed programmed. I passed. The person they took it to can't find a half shaft.
Enjoyed watching your video. I'm a truck driver and worked for over two years for a company that paid by the load. I know guys who are perfectly happy doing this, but I will never do it again. We were supposed to get demurrage pay, but had to give one hour of wait time on the loading end and one hour of wait time on the unloading end....regardless of how long we waited, two, three, four hours on the front and/or on the back end, we never got demurrage pay. So, if you hit a traffic jam, got a flat tire, there was bad weather, an accident, were delayed by the customer or the vendor you lost money...big time. The worst load I ever hauled, I got paid $56.00 for the day and that was the only load I was able to complete that day because of how long it took to complete the load: and I never got the demurrage pay. What I want to know is how many hours each week that the higher ups and the owner of the company you work for put in for free? I already know the answer, but the point is, the owner values his time, but not the time of the people on the front line that he is using to make him money. Sadly this isn't limited to the auto industry, it has been the case for every company I have ever worked for, small or large. Sorry for your plight. Glad you got paid for this one.
I have now received so many comments on this video that I am struggling to keep up… This is new for me as I have never had a video this popular. Thank you so much to everybody for watching and commenting!
It is my goal on this channel to respond to every comment personally to the best of my abilities. If you take the time to comment on my channel, I will do my best to take the time to read it and respond to it. Thank you.
Your title hit a nerve , yes there is a real issue with techs leaving the trade , up here in Canada the issue is getting real bad . I work for GM in Oshawa and at our dealership is like a revolving door of techs , some dealerships are giving out incentives although since the pandemic most are just happy to be working . But the number one reason is money , its always money . When a plumber or an electrician get paid more then there are issues especially when you consider a tech spends on tools in comparison . The real problem in the automotive industry is there is too much overhead . For every dollar the tech brings into the shop has to pay the advisors , the call center , the cashiers . and the managers get their bonus , no wonder there is not enough for the techs which provide the labor and hours for every dollar brought in . Your vid also hit a nerve with me . Thankfully my 40 years is near done ..
@@waynesbutler7834 thank you very much for sharing!
You're doing a public service
@@cranberriesdoodle1450 I am just a random guy on the Internet… I do what I can. Thank you.
Master technician = electrical/computer specialist, mechanical specialist, plumbing specialist, heating and a/c specialist, noise and vibration specialist, materials/ chemicals specialist, research specialist and finally a customer affairs specialist( factory and retail)! Under paid specialist!!!!!
90% of repairs easy, last 10% percent complex. Under paid causes 20% failure in the 90%, and near 90% failure in the last 10%! And that is assuming 100% effective writers, who are more interested in selling a big repair! LOL!
Good luck!
I got out of the business almost 14 years ago. Don't miss it at all. Had to deal with stuff like this constantly. Once had an elderly couple bring a Crown Vic to the independent ship I was at after spending almost $2k at the dealership trying to fix an EGR flow code. I fixed it for $50 (probably 1/3 of what I should have charged) and they were mad at me for charging them because they'd already paid the dealership so much money. People are stupid, particularly when it comes to taking care of their cars.
Yep I have experienced that also. They don’t realize you’re rescuing them from their nightmare.
EGR systems are usually very easy to diagnose with some system knowledge, unfortunately that is the reality of the industry right now….the dealership techs were just guessing rather than diagnosing and it is a huge time suck for everybody involved.
Thanks.
Mechanics never except blame for anything. Liers always shift the blame to anybody or anything but themselves. 😮
@@Fred-xo3ku Seems to me you're the broken element, Fred...
I had the same experience years ago ( with a K car) They'd taken it to an Firestone store for poor running. They had been charged for a carb rebuild, plugs, wires, several modules to the tune of 500+. Firestone told them "It needs a computer module. Take it to the dealer and DEMAND they replace it for free> It's covered under the emissions warranty"
Brought it us demanding the "free" computer. The real problem was a worn out distributor shaft (scattering timing) This was a common problem back then. Customer threw a FIT! Raged at ME for trying to screw them over. It got really heated. I finally told them, "Look! Why aren't you mad at the shop that charged you 500 bucks and DIDN'T fix your car?
I'm the guy who's charging you 75 bucks and FIXING it!"
The same guy YELLS at everyone, no matter what.
My neighbor works privately on vehicles out of his garage. When I hear him screaming obscenities and throwing tools around I’m reminded that I made a great choice leaving the industry. I don’t miss the backbreaking work that doesn’t pay anything. I don’t miss seeing my boss roll up in a 100K$ super car every day while I couldn’t afford an apartment. I don’t miss snap on and Matco tool bills each week. Technicians deserve so much more praise and compensation for their skill set and devotion. Even retail or fast food seems like a more appealing career, and I would encourage any young men or women to stay out of this industry. It’s a good skill to learn and retain for yourself, but going to work for someone else is a waste of your time
Thanks for sharing! I've been there.
One of my big regrets in becoming a mechanic is me and my little brother both really enjoy all things mechanical, it was a hobby when we were kids, I went to tech school, he joined the Navy, when he got out he lived on my couch going to college for his mechanical engineering degree, we both still like mechanical stuff but its hard to get him to understand my job really has ruined the hobby, after 10 plus hours working on machines, the last thing I want to do is come home and work on some pile of junk in the evening.
@@scout2nut I totally understand that.
OMG! I've been out of the industry for many years but I still have a pile of receipts from Snappy, Matco and Cornwell.
OP good luck in dealing with people in the future.
kids,remember, YOU are the reason why your boss lives so much better than you do
After 41 years as a technician, I'm worn out with this type of problem. I once loved my career, now not so much.
I know how you feel. It gets really old dealing with this kind of thing every day. Hardest part about the whole job is just getting paid.
Thank you.
COULD YOU CHECK OUT THE POINTS AND CONDENSER WHILE YOU HAVE THE HOOD UP?????? WISH I COULD TURN BACK THE CLOCK......FJB AND THE RAT RINOS....THEY OWN THIS MESS!
45 yr career came to an end when covid hit us. Now I only do side jobs for fun and beer money. I absolutely refuse to take on any new business, especially anything that code reader wont get me to. Wont spend $$$ on equipment for modern car issues, no graphing diagnostic or the like.
I know how you feel. Been turning a wrench since I was 12, and just turned 40 this year. I got burned out working in dealers in my late 20's, and then burned out from working fleet maintenance a few years back. By the time we are done paying for our tools, and all the free hours we work, we make less than minimum wage. Hence why I'm a factory mechanic now.
Same here
I'm one of those BURNOUTS. But I missed the challenge of troubleshooting. So I started flipping Basket Cases.
You know, the car that wont run after "BUBBA" replaced his own (FILL IN THE BLANK)...
I usually bought the car/truck/motorcycle/boat at scrap value. That way, if I lost, I could always get scrap value for what I had.
This way, you work on them WHEN you want to, and STOP when you want to. NO PRESSURE. It was FUN to play with toys again.
'Cause remember : Working on cars is FUN, as long as you don't have to ! Just my $.02
I have heard about a lot of techs doing stuff like that and making good money.
Thank you for sharing.
I stumbled into one of these myself -- bought a used minivan at a dealership for too low of a price (great deal in my opinion). Everything seemed to work and run great during the test drive. A week later drove over some bumpy railroad tracks and the electrical system started acting crazy -- dash lights and electronics flickering and acting up real bad. Took me a little bit of time to find a wiring harness under the steering wheel area that was coming loose and the block not screwed together to keep it attached. Tightened all that up and the van gave me no trouble after that for the 5 years I owned it. Makes me think previous owner (and/or dealership) knew there was an electrical gremlin and they couldn't figure it out so sold it cheaply...
I'd much rather be doing this kind of work than working on customer cars. 2 problems I have though: no car trailer, and in NY its usually also rotted beyond repair if its a "good deal".
ACTUALLY a long-standing DREAM of mine, and a smart idea! Hell, look for the ones that really just need a good DETAIL job! They're out there, covered with green slime! 🙂
I learned a long time ago - if you don't charge enough money for the work, the customer doesn't respect you. No one discusses the cost with me. NO ONE. I determine the price, they pay it. Mind you I have a business built on a niche type of work that very few people do these days, and I charge accordingly. I quote the price up front. Don't like it, fine, go elsewhere. And there is no elsewhere. The flip side is I stand behind my work, without question, without argument. I will see the job to completion. But yes it's tough out there, and I'm going to hang it up soon. After all of us old guys leave the business people will finally understand the value of experience and skill gained over decades. But it will be too late - I'll have my feet up and taking it easy.
Well said. Don’t forget to share some of your old tricks to anybody hungry to learn before you get out.
Thanks for commenting.
Best of luck to you. I hungit up after 53 years of wrenching and love retirement.
No they won't- they only understand that Henry Ford was sued under US law to ensure that corporations must always prioritize profits over employees. Put your boots back on and change some laws or we'll come and eat you.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist Arnold Schwarzenegger before he became famous as an actor started a brick laying company in Cali they billed themselves as a low cost alternative, business was not good. He rebranded as an exclusive European bricklaying company and charged above market, business boomed and he still has that company.
@@brucenorman8904 I like that mindset. Yes I believe in providing high level service and charging a fair rate for it.
Thanks again.
This is why it's so important to get a written work order. If you're verbally asked to programme a BCM and then they change their mind and say they said ECM you don't have a leg to stand on. Glad you stood your ground and got paid for their error.
That’s right. I included a pic in the video real quick showing where they crossed out BCM and hand wrote PCM.
Thanks.
It wasnt verbal it was written. Even so he should have checked to see what had been done before doing any work on the vehicle. That part of the mistake is all on him
@@holmes1956O
Don't be silly.
If you did that you would be treated with disdain by the writer and management team.
"Can't you read dummy?"
Do the work as written, write your comment at the end, emphasise that your work as instructed is completed and tested with no codes....and photograph the original works order with all that written on it BEFORE they try to hand write a "correction"....
Now who's the "dummy?
@@JohnSmith-yv6eq you are. I would be the guy to go to because I take the time to do the job right. Now if you are just joking around😛😛😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
What I’m curious about here is the fact that it started without the ECM being programmed and then wouldn’t start. What would cause that?
As a shop owner I deal with this stuff everyday. It’s always something like. “ you put wiper blades on now my check engine light is on! It wasn’t on before you worked on it” most people always want something for nothing.
Dead on, they have no clue how it works or why and it's always your fault. I have started videoing what I do and photos of the wrecked pieces of junk, they want me to work on( I do motorcycles and the garbage I see is staggering). From buggered up wiring for cool LED underlighting, which sets of security module and bike wont start to I rigged this so it works better etc.
Yes I’ve dealt with similar situations over the years. The customer is a shop owner whom I consider to be competent so I don’t think anybody was trying anything funny in that way. I believe it was just a miscommunication.
Thanks.
@@danwilliams5867 interesting to hear that motorcycles have workmanship issues like that.
Know as a sinsu customer, that is ever since you did.....
@@allanszast7579Everett Sincya has paid all of us a visit once or twice.
Fixed my problems 3 years ago by retiring. I started working on other peoples headaches back in 1976 and it has gotten progressively interesting since. A lot of people want something fixed for a little bit of nothing and that grew old very quickly for me because tools and talent does not come cheap anywhere. Time is money and I did not like arguing with people that think they know more than you do. When someone would say" you can do it cheaper! I double the Price"! The last few years I was into this I faced every excuse in the book until I hung it up! This is part why tech's are quitting this field of repair because a lot of folks want something for nothing... So I tell them to buy the books and tools and do it themselves! Even many dealers can't keep mechanics because of money! Nuff Said.
Yes I feel that every day. Customers don’t want to pay what it really takes. Employers don’t want to pay what it really takes.
In my experience shops are terrified to charge customers for legitimate repair work so they place the burden on the technician to make up for poor management.
Thank you for commenting.
I just tell them to go to X shop in X state that allegedly does it cheaper or pay me and have it fixed now.
I understand where you’re coming from people don’t realize the education and the skills and. Tool. ( electronics tools cost ) to work on these new vehicles not any Tom, Dick, or Harry can do it anymore in the back yard
@@stashoski2675 electronics tools cost is one time feed you can easily make back the your money you spent on it within the first few months it the programming that cost every time you used it because of the manufactured and there subscription cost, also shop rate ridiculously overrated that is why more and more people end up going somewhere else come on seriously a $150 hour most people don't even make that working all day.
It all started when today's crap cars came with a computer.
I was a technician for 30 years. I worked in an independent shop and worked on European, Asian, American and everything in between. Every day it was something different, and I had my share of accusations from customers. Everyone thinks mechanics are crooks, and the truth is we could easily be one. Cars are very complex now, and customers have no clue of how things work, or how things fail. Cars break every day, people. If they didn't, you wouldn't need technicians. Many times I replaced a bad injector or coil, or something else that what was also wrong with their car on top of the original complaint, with a good spare part I had laying around, and I did it for free just to keep them happy... I couldn't deal with it anymore and took a maintenance job at a factory. I couldn't be happier now. I know what I will be doing every day, and I don't have anybody treating me like I'm stupid or dishonest. The auto technician careers are fading fast, and I don't blame the techs one bit. Fix your own car, people, if you think it's so easy.
Thank you for sharing! I have done the exact same thing! I’ve fixed a customers vehicle with my own spare part just to not deal with the accusations.
I have even seen a fellow coworker break a part on a customers car accidentally… Simple mistake. Coworker pulls out his phone calls the local auto parts store and buys the part with his own money rather than get the shop to cover it.
My hero!
My "favorite" was when a customer would provide their own part, the work order would read "replace alternator" (or other component) and after I did, the car would be back a few days later as a comeback, still not working as intended, and now they expected me to diagnose the issue for free. Sorry, Nope.
Someone higher up on the food chain than myself (customer, service writer, or service manager) diagnosed this, and I was told to replace a part- so I did. If the alternator (or other component) was the problem or not, at that point, was no longer my concern- you asked for a component to be replaced, you got a component replaced. Whether or not that component fixes the problem or was the problem is between you and whomever diagnosed the vehicle.
I actually got fired multiple times for BS like this. They wouldn't actually word it that way, it would be more like "you're not being a team player" or something to that effect. I would usually come back with "if being on your team means I have to work for free, I'll find another team".
Well said… Yes, I have experienced those situations as well.
I also worked at that kind of shop for a short time….we were not compatible and they played games to try and control you.
They ended up firing me for not playing along, and when I called their bluff and had my stuff loaded up and gone in less than one hour, the boss had the writer call me and said it was all just a joke when I arrived in my driveway at home and then tried making me offers several times later and getting me back.
I honestly think it was all a game to try and make me beg for my job. I just said “Ok. I’m gonna go load up my stuff and when I come back you’re going to have my final paycheck ready” D-O-N-E Done.
Thanks for the comment.
My reply to some of these companies was, I didn’t get dressed up for nothing. PS I remember years ago customers used to come into the shop and want to borrow one of my tools, and I would say no problem. Give me your wallet and he said I’m not give me my wallet and I said I’m not giving you my tools. I don’t know you from Adam.
Your attitude is wrong. If someone brought me a part I would always ask who diagnosed the problem and made sure that there was a good chance the diagnosis was correct.
In any case your position is wrong if you did not confirm that your installation of the part resolved the problem.
"My toolbox has wheels for a reason"@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist
That's still coming out of his pocket when you are working book time.@@normansabel1850
I worked at a dealer for almost thirty years. And it never stops amazing me how the service writers never ever take responsibility for there screw ups.
Sounds like things have not changed much… Thank you for sharing!
Really? Cool
The one I always heard from service writers was "I'll make it up to you later".
@@petebrian2841
Yea, that plays like a broken record. I am still waiting for that to become reality. Lol
My favourite was a customer who complained that the fuel gauge didn't move on their newish car,
I asked the service adviser to seek clarification on what the customer meant,
To which he replied that the customer must be referring to the gauge not moving when they put fuel in..... instead of just calling the customer to clarify.
So I take note of the fuel gauge reading both before replacing the fuel sender unit, and after replacing it....
Surprise, surprise, surprise.......no change.....
Come to later find out that in the customers PREVIOUS car the fuel needle would drop when the car was switched off...........
So since this DIFFERENT car wasn't doing that... it must have a fault.....
The only saving grace was that I could access the fuel sender unit (and top of the fuel tank) by taking out the back seat... instead of having to drop the entire fuel tank.
I'm retired now. But I always loved it when the customer says "it was fine before you worked on it"
Thanks for commenting.
Yes it is usually a big waste of time and the shop is terrified to charge for it.
I have a lot of family I've quit doing favors for over those exact words
Should of said if everything was fine then why is it here?
If I got one in that was High Mileage and needed a ton of work I would make sure to tell them that I AM NOT! Responsible for other things that can burn out or quit working because some of them were about the end of their usefulness. Many agreed with me and spared both of us a lot of headaches. I don't like to put up with Stupid crap.
So...."help me out here, I'm confused." (Colombo line) If it was "fine" before I worked on it, then why did you even bring it in?
Everybody knows what wrong but they bring it to you. Always charge for time. Good work.
Thank you!
When they want to argue with me about what's wrong I give them advice and a choice...If they like neither then Goodbye!
I have several similar stories through the 37 years as a technician(30 with Honda). Recently retired. It helps to have a service manager that values your work and will support your decisions. It also helps to have some communication skills sufficient to convey why you are not at fault and will not be proceeding until payment method is conveyed. Through the years, I developed the reputation of being very thorough, capable and confident but not a fast high volume tech. Naturally this means you get more weird problems dispatched but not the big service jobs that pay well. The weird ones can be satisfying but harder to pay the bills(especially under warranty) 😉 Fortunately, I had upper management that was able to keep my pay at a reasonable level by having me train. They saw the industry changing and fewer technicians applying for jobs. I spent the last ten years with an apprentice. They would train with me for a year at least before flat rating. I was paid for my labor and theirs. I trained nine techs in that time. Throughout my career, I came across many very good technicians held back by their own attitude or lack of confidence. My guess is you've seen something similar.
Thank you very much for sharing! Yes I’ve experienced similar. A good manager is amazing for shop production.
I had also always been thorough and slow….still am sometimes. The haste came with experience.
I have trained some apprentices in a similar pay situation… Honestly, some of the most fun I have ever had working in the shop… Renewed my passion for auto repair. I would love to eventually teach… May have possible teaching opportunities opening up at the local college soon.
Teaching was also partly the inspiration for this channel, I have literally spent my entire life gathering knowledge… To share knowledge and experience… To record what I have in my head before I am gone.
For all of the technical skills, peruse the comments and see how many can't even construct a simple sentence properly...
I am currently a GM tech in Canada . I get where you are coming from . I'm looking at getting out myself because it's gotten bad in the trade as well as I'm getting too old for this .
Thank you for the comment.
I believe things are changing fast as shops struggle to find and retain qualified help.
I'm only 30 , doing this for 10years, the last 2-3 years is just f ing hell.... they block you to do the job, you don't have access to shit, they make the software a pain in the ass just to f with the 3rd repair shops, made everything only accessible online... even a simple adaptation nowadays is a pain in the ass, than comes the cliens who want their cars to be done in 1 day, and for free, when you put in 2-3 days worth of time to find a problem , because you don't have the acces for anything anymore, and at the end you don't get paid what that work was worth, you always get way less than what you put in to find a problem, and these new cars, all have things like this, that looks like is a 10min job, and will become days and weeks because the entire system is made to be bad, and hard to repair. I still have 1-2 years and i';m done with this job for sure, people can cry in 5--6 years not having anyone to repair their car , and i will laught on the side. Repairing cars nowadays became ridiculous, even people who came to learn from me, the first thing i say, if you want a life and money, go and find another job that you want to do, repairing cars became a pain in the ass, there is a big problem with the equipment prices, the amount of things you need for simple things, the access for anything, making online everything, and the amount of things they put in cars just became a major problem, and let's not talk about the people, people want everything done in minutes... on cars that are made in a way for people who repair them to have a heart attack when they see them.
@@UmbraWeiss well said. I bet there are a lot of technicians that could say the exact same thing. I have experienced all of that.
My mom used to threaten me that if i didnt get good marks in school i would wind up a garbage man. I ended up a broke ass auto tech and now union garbage men earn $80 thousand a year and never touch a can.
I was told the same thing except it was a ditch digger. 3 years ago I quit being a master tech and started driving trucks. Making more money and less stress.
@bayoumike544 good for you. I had to retire early because my knees went out. I injured one on a job and the doctors did nothing for me. Later on after the cartlidge disappeared WCB told me it was my fault I didn't follow up. Now I am old and broke with no pension.
That is funny before I was done reading your comment I was going to say exactly that… “waste management specialists” make some dang good money and benefits these days.
Honestly, it is possible to make a good living in auto repair… It takes a significant personal investment of time and money compared to other jobs.
Thank you.
@@bayoumike544 ditch diggers make some good money these days.
@@smokeskull I know the feeling. Knees and hips shot and no pension. However I am making more money sitting in a truck with a/c but am out for a week at a time (18 wheeler)
That's one of the reasons i retired after 44 years in the trade as a GM tech. Front office thought they knew best. I had a few run ins when i would not use someone else's diagnosis and then crickets when there diagnosis was incorrect. Life in the country playing with my own toys is so good 😊 In saying that it can be so satisfying to fix someone's long-term problem and get thanked for it (Too rare unfortunately) cheers from Australia 🇦🇺
Thank you for sharing all the way from Australia!
7:47 38 years in the trade and I agree with every comment on here. I would love to get out of the trade.... My son followed in my footsteps (against my advice) 😢
Exactly. A dying word these days....thankyou.
I worked in a local shop for 4 years. The amount of money losing proposition jobs the owner agreed to undertake was astounding. And he was never in the workshop to do it.
I’ve been there. Thanks for sharing
I worked as an auto tech briefly about 25 years ago. I left because as the new guy I was getting all the work that paid 30 minutes for 45+ minutes of work while the long-time guys got all the gravy work that paid 3 hours for 2 hours of work or better. After about a year of essentially minimum wage work (where I had to buy expensive tools out-of-pocket) and seeing that it would be many years before my situation would noticeably improve I left for greener pastures and have no regrets!
Yes, that is very common… The older established techs would quit if the new guy gets all of the good desirable gravy work.
It is sad that every time I teach somebody something that I am good at and share knowledge and tips, it cost me and hurts me.
I experienced the same thing for many years… Working broke and buying expensive tools while waiting for it to start paying off.
It is finally paying off… All of the hours upon hours of free reading material that I invested the time and locked it away in my brain more so than the tools. I am not that old and my body is already starting to kill me from the physical work of auto repair… I am hoping to be able to keep up production using my brain when my body can no longer produce the hours.
Thanks for sharing.
What did you choose to do instead of you don’t mind me asking?
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist The physical side of auto mechanics is rarely even talked about. I took some auto tech classes & almost every teacher had noticeable scars with stories that they were lucky to survive from.
@@ag4allgood I think we all have some of those stories. I have lots of scars from jobs where I bled to meet and beat flat rate labor times. A couple good burn marks too lol.
Thanks.
IT TAKES YEARS TO GET GOOD YOUR BRIEF TIME SHOWS YOU GAVE UP ON WHAT TAKES A LIFE TIMEYOU JUST DONT WALK IN GREEN AND EXPECT GRAVY TRAIN THOSE GUYS DID THE TIME ENOUGH SAID.
I was in the flat rate game, off and on, for too many years. At one dealership I was in the shop 50-60 hours a week and got behind on my mortgage because the service writers had no problem giving work away.
I’m doing fleet maintenance now. Servicing and repairing filthy old work trucks isn’t fun but I get paid reasonably well. Only 4 years left until I can retire and I’ll be out
Yes, it gets really old having to work hard and dig deep to make up the difference when everybody is relaxed about giving away your time for free.
Glad to hear you are making it work.
Thank you for the comment.
I'm there with my service writers, and for over 3 years I've been trying to beat into their heads that we don't give labor away! Just because it took 15 minutes to write a customer up (as half assed as possible) doesn't mean that the mechanic will fix it so easily. I asked for a raise, but was told we're not making the money, meanwhile they service writers aren't wasting time to even look up job times. I'm just glad in less then two years I'm done. I'm retiring early and will set myself up to do some jobs on my own and of what I want to work on.
And they never stop wondering why they can’t bring in any revenue.
And that most of their productive techs leave for other jobs.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist
@@Oldbmwr100rs it’s why I gave up working at dealerships and went back into contract security. Didn’t want to change industries but I didn’t see any other way to get ahead. Security pays a consistent hourly rate for way less headaches. Spent 7 months trying to find a good paying dealership position ( know what a service advisor does btw). I had 15 interviews for dealership positions and I never got a call back. 7 months and 15 interviews. Went back to security work cause they actually did call me back
There once was a time when service writer's were knowledgeable now, last week they were a fill clerk just out of high school now they're writing tickets and your having to explain that the right side of the car is always the right side no mater where you are standing
After 40 years of being a technician I was fired for telling a service writer that I was not looking for keys on a miss tagged car which had happened many times before. The manager said that I had hurt all the writers feelings at one time or the other and had to go
The same old story. Anybody who speaks realism is let go while those who play along with the game are rewarded and coddled.
Thank you for sharing.
It sounds like I should be a service writer!
I get the feeling that service writers will be one of the jobs AI will replace once it gets up to speed. The people with manual labour skills will have AI as assistants to book jobs, find parts, repair manual specs etc. Those who can't do actual work, will get replaced.
@@Hunty49 that is funny. I think you are right… it would almost be a relief.
I worked as a mechanic for a municipality and had the Public Works director tell me essentially the same thing. He told me everybody was afraid of me, and that I'd hurt a lot of people's feelings. My reply to him was that he hired me to service and repair the cities vehicles, not as a social worker or psychiatrist to worry about other employees' "feelings". He and I did not get along very well.
Number 1 reason I retired from wrenching TECHNOLOGY HAS BECOME TO DAMN STUPID. I LOVE THE OLD MECHANICS RULE,
KISS RULE KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID. AS FOR THE ENGINEERS AND DESIGNERS, THEY DON'T HAVE TO WORK ON NEW POS'S.
Yes, today’s vehicles are not built with repair and service in mind it would seem.
Thank you.
For years as an Automotive mechanic aka technician this very event has happened to me sooo many times. I have always used three main (there's more I'm sure) statements that might help. 1)No ticket, no laundry! 1a) I do donate to charities when I want, not when I'm told to! For the involuntary free work. 2) Poor planning and diligence on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part! For the incorrect R/O line description entered.
Well said. Yes I’ve experienced being expected to work for free many times in many shops over the years.
Thanks.
I was a mechanic in the military, got out in 1969 and lasted 3 years working on flat rate.....until I couldnt pay rent and started working in Industry.....regular work, regular pay, retirement, health care etc. only worked on cars for fun and beer money after that....still working on my own, and friends vehicles in retirement.
Thanks for sharing. I find it hard to enjoy working on my own cars anymore friends and family, etc..
As an hourly telephone tech, I would sometimes get tickets where the problem described on the ticket was nothing related to what the customer was experiencing.
I learned quick to always doubt what was written and confirm with the individual that was having the problem before wasting a bunch of time "fixing" something that wasn't broken....
Sometimes I will intercept the customer and have a quick chat with them just to get a feel for the situation and gather vital information. Depends on the customer, because that can turn into a big time suck all by itself.
Thanks for sharing. That sounds like a fun job.
Yup, always verify the customer complaint.
On the other hand I had a water pump swapped on an Ecotec and they let the cam timing slip. It made the engine run poorly and vibrate. We retimed the cam chain and all was well. First shop still insists a vibrating dash is normal and that changing the cam timing would not cause vibration anyway. I think people on both sides can be right, sometimes simultaneously.
Yes sometimes it goes that way.
The other shop just didn’t want to take accountability and kicked the customer down the road which is the absolute worst thing to happen to a customer.
Thank you.
I was a tech for 46 years and a shop owner for 40 years of that and shut it down in April and took a job with the railroad. Glad to be out of the business. No qualified techs out there to hire, parts are hard to find now and overhead is now too high to make it profitable. Like working on my race stuff but will never go back to being a technician for a living. I’m done.
Thanks for sharing.
While I was never a tech, I wore many hats in a dealership environment for most of my career (parts counter/manager, IT guy, warranty admin). Made a change and went to the railroad 14 years ago......and never looked back. I feel for my brothers and sisters still in the game.
Used to be a German & GM drivability tech way back and the more I see of this 'techno-depend on the computer stuff today, I love my 1980 SR5 even more. 19 years and going.
And it’s cheap and easy to repair. Thanks for sharing.
I love it when you go into a dealership or independent shop and the service advisor is a girl in her 20s. Hire the most unqualified people to cut your payroll costs. Can bus is nothing but problematic, its a daisy chain and if its not a bad module and its a wiring problem GOOD LUCK ! New vehicles with less that 10k on the odometer at the dealerships for a month and still not repaired !
Men and women working as service advisors completely lack automotive knowledge so I wouldn’t really blame it on this or that. Yes usually they are hired at a minimum to be a people handler.
I kind of enjoy network diagnostics it is fairly easy to understand and is clean work.
I believe many dealerships are lacking skilled personnel, and also there have been significant parts delays across-the-board.
Thanks.
If the service advisor is generally a person with little mechanical skills then why is hiring a 20 y/o girl as a service advisor a problem? I would assume this position is more about communication and customer service. I don't work in the auto industry, just someone that DIYs my own cars, so maybe I misunderstand, but definitely open to being corrected.
@@donaldlee6760 The main reason why I started doing my own service was so called service advisors. Looked at the repair bill on my mom's car and they charged her for 6 quarts of oil on a 350 V8 ! When I was working and took my Honda in for service = car was 3 years old and air conditioner compressor went out. Spent 6 hours working on my car and called me up and the parts guy ordered the wrong part ! Sitting in the waiting room waiting for my car I see a tech drain the differential oil on another car and then lower it down like it was done, talked to the cute little girl and she was to scared to talk to the tech. I went out and told the dumb ass to do his job and he said thanks man ! Went to Les Swab for tires and drive home and they put the wrong size tire on one side of my vehicle and the correct size on the other !
Had some brake work done and start driving and the steering wheel was moving back and forth without me touching it so get out of the car and lug nuts were loose on both front tires. The average cost of car repairs today is $4500 bucks according to CNBC . SCREW SERVICE WRITERS AND GREASE MONKEY'S WHO CHARGE UP THE KAZOO AND RIP PEOPLE OFF ! I GUESS YOU BUY A NEW CAR EVERY 2 YEARS AND HAVE NEVER EXPERIENCED BEING SCREWED !
I get where you are coming from, but as a customer I have had my share of ineptitude and crooked service departments in the past. Dealerships nowadays seem to just throw my money and their parts at the problem till I trade it for another one.
Unfortunately, you are right… The problem is incompetent technicians that do not put any effort into diagnostics and just throw parts at a problem… Usually at the customers expense and a huge waste of time.
Thanks.
Yeah, I had a buddy who was Chrysler trained and employed. Their M.O. was just throw parts at it until the code goes away. He was notorious for doing shi**y trans rebuilds and whatnot, but he's still employed there.
@@notmyname3883 I worked with a guy that everything he touched came back… Literally for years after he left also they were still coming back. “But he’s sooo fast” I was told lol.
People would stay in the industry, if it paid.
It just doesn't pay anymore, as the house takes 80% of Labor cut.
You've got shop owners that want to run their business like a McDonald's, with similar overhead.
I2 stayed in the business too long, multiple decades and the only time my income was respectable was one Ike quit working for somebody else.
I went from $75,000 a year, to $165,000 a year and I work Less hours.
Something to think about.
You are right about that… The old fast food business model, but for cars.
One of these days. Thank you.
Started working on car’s in an old full service gas station in 1983, went off to a technical school to learn to be a mechanic in 1987 after my father an ex army mechanic taught me how to work on cars. In that time I had customers rip the station off for car batteries at $5 per battery, dropped out of the trade school that later became an accredited college over the funky monkey BS the school was pulling. And have since worked in another service station, where I saw a bunch of funny business going on by the owners son and customers. I still work on car’s, but refuse to do it for the general public or for an employer. The reason there is a shortage of mechanics is 4 fold, poor education, unethical employers, unethical customers and corrupt/incompetent mechanics. Only takes one bad mechanic, to cause a shop to develop a bad reputation that shuts a shop down.
Well said. Thanks for sharing.
That one bad mechanic in the shop can really ruin it for everybody else you are absolutely right….I’ve worked with “that guy”.
As a owner of a shop Jr's Auto these people have gotten me to the point that I want the bill paid in full before I begin work I'm tired of getting screwed and f*****the way I see it and dr. Bob agrees there's no reason to take half now and half later give me at all now up front!!!!💰💰💰💯🚩
Yes some people don’t see their car as a huge financial investment which requires upkeep and repairs from time to time.
Thanks for commenting.
got one better! Crook customer comes in, gets everything repaired correctly,pays with credit card,then declines payment because not satisfied with repairs! 🤥
so tech gets back flagged on his commission. for labor..
@@garyhutchinson7546I’ve seen that before
"Always ensure the customer signs a disclaimer absolving you of responsibility for any issues, as you didn't perform a car diagnosis."
Customer came to pick it up after paying and it wouldn’t start. So fingers were getting pointed and it was alluded that I should diagnose and fix it for free because it had of been my fault. Happens every day in the industry and employers would rather place the burden on the employee than take the loss.
I’ve experienced this at every shop I’ve ever worked for.
Thank you for commenting.
@rob1248996 yes I did, and it started and ran poorly.
@rob1248996 0:40 "engine started and ran terrible. It's a V8 engine and felt like it was running on four cylinders"
Sooooo you didn't watch the video?@rob1248996 Dude-man says he started it up and it sounded like dog water only running on four cylinders. But at that point, it still wasn't his problem because he was only supposed to "reprogram the PCM" as per the work order.
it's never their fault it's the Mechanic's ! same BS i went through, i am so happy that i am retired now the whole system just got worse and worse every year with the new technology. the fights for pays increased and the pays dropped
Yep. Happens every day in this industry.
Have to fight for every tenth of an hour.
Thank you for commenting.
Quit back in 2006 as dealer hr rate was $ 105.00 an hour, and only paid tech $18 an hour + fix other techs comebacks for free, after they got fired!!! @@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist
I got blamed for bending a clutch disc in a Camaro. It wasn't bent, and I knew it wasn't. Was chattering when it came in, and they wanted me to give it back in that condition (ostensibly to collect the bill). I refused, told them the customer would not take delivery with poor operation. I finally won out. pulled it apart and handed the disc to the service manager and said, show me the bent disc! It had 2 marcel plates stacked, so a thick spot in one section of the disc. Manufacturing defect.
And I bet they wiggled and squirmed on paying you for your time? That’s been my experience at least…it takes quite a bit of time to take the transmission out to prove your innocence.
Thanks for commenting.
I was the used car tech at a busy dealership and they blamed me for over looking a missing spare tire after the customer bought it. I had to educate them that there is no spare tire! Only a bottle of fix a flat and a factory compressor. Did I get an apology. NO
@@johnrpizzaguy very common unfortunately.
I recently bought some parts from a shop that i thought was also a mechanical workshop, when i commented that i thought he was a mechanic he said "I am but i have closed that side of the business because i got sick and tired of people blaming me for things that i didn't do, or pressuring me to do things for free whilst i had the vehicle in for repair, or just arguing about the price when they came to pick up there vehicle. So i just sell parts now, i make just as much money, i don't get stressed, and when it gets to 5pm i am out the door". Its a real shame as he did some work on my mums car years ago, and was so genuine and nice, its totally crap that people have burnt him out ...
People can be that way sometimes to the point a business owner no longer wants to deal with it.
Thanks for sharing.
People in other industries are saying "One reason people are quitting........."
Its not just the automotive industry.
Business has become so much more complicated and frustrating.
There are too many specifics to list.
However, if you take general issues in one industry, there will often be general similarities in another industry.
I think it is a culture of being way too comfortable giving away somebody else’s time to appease a customer at the lowest rate. Race to the bottom business model.
Thank you.
I'm a collision tech and I can relate. 20 years and I'm done dealing with customers . I Aldo take tons of photos for my protection.
Lol on the service and repair side of things when somebody comes in with a concern right after they left the body shop, the body shop is the first to get blamed.
Sometimes it’s true sometimes it’s not… But they are always the first to take the blame because they touched it last.
There have been times on diagnosis where I found a simple ground nut left, loose or some thing from a good body shop, and I explain to the customer it was just a simple mistake, and to not hold it against them too much.
On the flipside, I have also seen lots of bad body shops do some nasty work and cause some new problems.
Now days we have to take full walk around photos of the car inside and out to avoid being blamed for pre-existing damage. I can usually sniff out a customer who is hunting for a victim… I always take good notes also.
Thanks.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist yes I know all about bad body shops. Thankfully the last 3 over 15 years all have been the top shops in my state for quality . But I know of a song you can relate to. Hold on I'll link it in a Second
Its the same all over the world.. I was a multi brand master tech and a Automotive engineer, the blame game gets old quick as does the lack of trust. i have seen this problem from both sides of the fence and decided working on cars is better a hobby than a trade.
The lack of understanding of the motortrade is bad.
That’s the same old story. Sounds like you are the exact kind of highly skilled, talented individual that this industry needed and failed.
Thanks for sharing.
I feel your pain..GM Saab owner here..Never before have i purchased a car, then had to get a Tech 2 or any other diagnostic scanner to keep it running..A spare used ECU, then a laptop etc for security access so i can clone the ECU in the vehicle for when it eventually fails. .I think i spend more time looking out for warning lights on the dashboard than i do looking at the road..
It’s getting to be difficult to find the old Saab cartridges for the Tech 2 too.
The Saab version of the Tech 2 can be emulated via Tech2Win with a subscription and a J2534 device.
I remember working on Saabs in the independent repair world before they shut down and then overnight they became difficult to source parts and tools, etc. then nobody wanted to own them or work on them.
Thanks for the comment.
I’m in Hvac. A lock shop trued to switch all their techs from per hour pay to commission only 10-99 contractors. 23 out of 25 tech quit on the spot. The company went out of business 2 weeks later. The owner tryed blaming it on some increasing you profits summoner he went to. He know he was shifting all his liability’s onto his employees. And they where having none of that crap
Yep they know what they are doing. If the employee is paid by the hour… Suddenly the burden of management and production is on the shoulders of… Management.
I see that from time to time in the auto industry also… Boss comes back from the big seminar, put on by somebody who has never even spent a day in the trade and wants to make all sorts of big changes.
Totally out of touch… I blame that on ownership and management that does not come from the tradespeople that it manages.
Thank you.
If you're going to be 1099, you might as well just be self-employed or start your own HVAC business with a couple of other guys. All you're doing is taking all the liability while the boss gets rich.
I’m a medical Xray/Device Technition and I’m telling ya, it not just your industry! I’ve actually gotten the “he was in the building and now X does not work” get it all the time, blamed for things I had absolutely nothing to do with. It’s really bad especially with salesmen making impossible promises to make sales. I’m looking to get out of this Industry, I’m a burnout aswell.
Thank you for sharing!
I used to install A/V equipment for a local shop in the evenings and people would bring in stuff to be installed that wouldn't work and then either not want to pay or blame us for the non-working component. I eventually started having them pay to have the item bench tested upfront and then would take the testing fee off the install fee if I did the work.
That’s a good idea. Sounds like it would take care of the problem.
Thank you for sharing.
A shop recently helped me get a pulley off and on without charge, I got an oil change and a new cabin filter bought the tech a drink as a thanks.
Thank you for sharing!
Take your custom built, $5,000 gaming computer, bolt it to a commercial paint can shaker, wire the on switch such that when you start the computer it also starts the paint shaker as well. This is basically the environment that you have with all the electronics in a modern vehicle. It's bloody insane.
Thank you for the comment.
Working in a field dealing with the public sucks to begin with, and if you're in an industry in which the mfg's are constantly changing stuff to be less serviceable, but require more service, you cannot avoid frustration. I'm not a tech, I just work on my own stuff, and I cringe at the thought of working on a newer car when I have to buy one. Driving an '05 Taurus right now and plan to keep her alive for a long long time.
Yes it is hard to own a fancy modern car if you want to do your own work because you usually need to also own multiple special tools for common repairs. Every part and piece also seems to be expensive and fragile.
Keeping the 05 Taurus is a good plan. They are solid cars and they’re cheap/easy to keep on the road.
Thanks for commenting.
Not your fault...and refused to repair until paid. Proper thing to do! I rebuilt a carb for another shop. 2 months later it needed it again.Full of guck the first time...filled with guck again. I told them guck is not covered,when they picked it up the first time. Replace whats causing the guck! Ive been retired for a couple of years...now only work on race cars or teach high speed driving...best time of my life..:)
Yes it gets old as a flat rate technician to assume the burden of doing business over and over again unless you stand up.
Thanks for commenting.
I hate modern cars with their computerised operation! Give me the good ol' days of timing chains, carburettors, coils, distributors, condensers and sports aircleaners!
It’s hard to find anybody that can even work on that stuff anymore. It’s becoming a specialized market.
Thanks for commenting.
Miscommunication is happening in all industries, especially when sales people try to circumvent having the customers talk directly to the tech doing the work.
And there is a big disconnect between sales and service.
Thanks.
And this is why you don’t end someone else’s repair. Especially not for a flat rate with warranties.
Yes, a lot of self diagnosed repairs end up being a sad story in my experience.
Thanks.
If any customer has had an issue with having to sign a verification of work to be done by the shop, this is an explicit reason why....CYA. This will be a memory grabber if another scenario like this rolls in, glad you had a good handle on what the issue was.
Normally things go smoothly for this customer. I program for other shops fairly often. It was just a simple miscommunication, I wasn’t willing to take the blame and remedy the situation for free.
Thank you, everything worked out ok and all is well.
As a general rule. I ALWAYS check ecu relace when some one says "I had my mechanic replace the computer".
Same here. When I walked up to it I was told “the old module is on the seat” it wasn’t there.
This program was for a shop owner whom I consider competent so I didn’t question what he did. It was a simple miscommunication, it all worked out in the end.
Thanks.
Always dreamed of getting the your level ,
Thank you for talking us through your thought process , busted them and got paid ,
And did it with gentlemanly style ,
Congratulations on mad skills
Thank you very much!
I’m what your average technician should be, I just fake it till I make it. Jokes aside I learned everything I know from somebody else at some point over the years, I’ve also made plenty of costly mistakes which were good lessons.
So I’m trying to return the favor here on RUclips and share the knowledge and experience with anybody hungry to learn.
I was told when I first started buying tools, the better you get the less money you’ll make. There’s been plenty of instances where that’s held true
I’ve found it to be true… very true. Punished for having the answer, yet always have work in the slow times of the year.
Thank you for commenting.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist guys in the industry, know whats up thought. Cheers
I'll keep my 1980 Ford F-150 shortbed with an inline 6 cylinder until I'm dead . The simplicity of the vehicle makes it a keeper.
Agreed. Thanks for commenting.
Glad they didn't stick you with it. Getting people to take responsibility for their work is hard these days. Good to see there are still competent technicians out there.
Thanks for commenting.
This isn’t restricted to the motor industry, as an electrical inspector I often break things that I never touch 😮
Thank you for sharing.
The comments do not address the real issues. The absurd and unecessary compexity of modern vehicles. Because of emissions and economy dictates from government bureaucrats. A carburettor that is matched to a perticular engine is nearly as good as EFI with none of the peripheral sensors, computers and software. Why dont ECM's come already programmed for a particular vehicle? They self learn anyway, why do they need programming? None of the chips and relays that control lights, windows, wipers, door locks etc are necessary. Mechanical switches and window cranks work fine. My '57 vw has 3 switches: ignition, lights and wipers. Windows go up and down with a manually operated crank. Goes anywhere a new car does and gets nearly the same MPG.
True a well tuned carburetor can have excellent low emissions. The problem is that a carburetor cannot really self adjust the way fuel injected vehicle can when you are driving in mixed conditions, changing altitude, temperature, etc..
There are a few reasons the module needs to programmed….. back in the day when modules could be swapped between vehicles, they were a hot item to be stolen so making the module locked to the Vin number of the vehicle was a antitheft measure.
Also the module may be being built in such a way that it physically will fit into multiple vehicles… Some of the pins on the computer may be used or not used depending where it is installed. So we program the module to essentially tell it “you’re installed in a car equipped with a 4 cylinder, so don’t set codes for cylinders 5-8 because they don’t exist”.
In a lot of cases in the Volkswagen world, the module is actually pre-programmed, and simply requires “coding”…. The same thing is being accomplished, we are simply telling the module what it’s job is.
Thanks.
I was gas engine repair at a ford dealer replacing cam phasers and short blocks, day in and day out. Got tired of the grind, busting ass for insufficient pay. Got hired on with local utility, best move ever.
Thank you for sharing!
I'm so glad I drive a 35 year old car and do my own repairs.
Yep they’re still cheap and easy to fix at home for the most part.
Thanks.
I feel your pain! Been there, done that - never again. 👍👍👍
Thanks for the comment.
I was a tech for almost 30 years. Am so glad to be retired. Autos are nothing more than rolling computers these days. So much useless technology. I miss the good old days. I feel this guys pain.
Thank you for sharing!
Too many people involved with the repair process. Tech should always speak to customer. Always
Sometimes I will intercept the customer and talk to them real quick to feel out the situation, sometimes the customer concern is completely different then it was written. I make a point to go and visit with some of my best customers because it is a good working relationship we have built, and they trust me to take care of them as best as possible. I find that customers appreciate, brutal honesty when it comes to their car… Tell them everything that it needs and advise them.
Talking with customers can be time consuming, though… And a flat rate technician does not necessarily get paid to stand there and talk so it’s something that is best avoided.
Thank you.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist good way to be. I knew most of my customers names and watched their children grow. Trust is one of the biggest ways to improve business.
This always sucks when something like this happens. I'm not an auto tech, but I am a PC tech and the same thing happens. Customer always looks for someone else to blame when something goes wrong with their poorly maintained equipment and you are expected to foot the bill for it.
Thank you for sharing!
Asking a few questions, popping the hood and taking a look around before you start might’ve proved beneficial in this and will in future endeavors. Trust but verify.
You’re absolutely right. I didn’t question it because it came from another shop.
Thanks.
You're spot on. It took about 30 seconds to pop the hood to see the problem.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist That's called assuming. When we break down the word assume we find that when we do it we make an Ass of U and Me. I understand your frustration, but the fact is that you could have avoided this waste of time by not assuming. Mechanics should understand that the reason the vehicle was in the shop was because the owner didn't know how to fix it. The person writing up the order was probably just writing down what the customer told them.
@@richardlanders5300 so then for that 30 seconds of your unpaid time of checking that what they say is real, is in fact real. I get to charge an additional 1hour diagnostic and verification fee?
@@scotttiller4660 I miss the old days when someone took pride in getting the job done and not worrying about if they get paid for an extra thirty seconds of time. You made a seven-minute video about people wasting your time... how much did you get paid for doing that?
I'm 60 and if I last 5 more yrs to retire Itll be a miracle. I was in a dealership but went to a small independent shop to do light duty work but the service writers do so much BS parking lot diag its borderline criminal because i do what they tell me but 70% of the time it's wrong so ill have to trll them if they want it fixed i need to diag it.. I also keep telling them to get more info on the service orders they seem not to care and just put...check car...for a hvac issue or something like that. Problem is they have the owner convinced they know it all....what bullshit we techs deal with is unbearable.
That’s terrible, I’ve dealt with that before too….it doesn’t last long before they chase away all the customers.
Thanks for sharing.
When the truck ran rough when you fixed it the first time you should of known something was wrong. The bad thing is that probably the customer was charged twice.
I recommended additional diagnostics at that point… The customer was only charged for the first programming.
Thanks.
i worked 25 years as an auto tech, mostly in new car dealerships. My opinion is that the flat rate system is the underlying problem in the industry it promotes fraud and encourages fast sloppy work. I got out in my mid 40s and have never regretted leaving.
Yes, I agree. The flat rate pay system is no longer compatible with the highly technological safety systems and electrical systems of today.
Thank you for commenting.
A few months ago I got out of the business. People were an issue time to time but incompetence was my biggest gripe. Someone somewhere did something and I was fixing their fuck up. Sometimes even being blamed for other people's fuck up.
I'm glad and doing better after I got out.
I have experienced similar situations. Thanks for sharing.
Great episode. It made me think as, I've been on both sides as a mechanic and as a customer. It really depends on who you are dealing with and who you are. You just got to know when to hold em and when to fold em. Knowing that the stakes are high and eventually something will go wrong is a good mind set. Ethical and competent people are a joy to work with. That's not what you get, sometimes. Desperate numbskulls are a nightmare. CYA. Cover your ass.
Thank you. Everything worked out ok in the end.
So glad I got out after 16 years. People want everything for free now and the dealers just give everything away for free under warranty. Good luck!
Working at the dealership….if it’s not free they’re not interested. Even if something is out of warranty, they squawk and cry until it gets covered under “goodwill” warranty literally at the technicians expense.
Thank you for commenting.
This is why it’s better to be on your own without the craziness of a service department/ service writer always on your case. You can’t have pride in your work without the proper information.
I would love to do that at some point.
Thank you for commenting.
Us consumers see the shortage as well.
Slipped a pad in one of my work vans. Pads and rotors were changed 42k ago on this van, paid the dealership to do it. I take it here because this van is never in my hands and this particular employee is known for ignoring obvious signs. I told the manager why i bring it to them for oil changes, so they can do the inspection and keep my van ready for work. Well they couldn't fit the van in for a week so i did the pads and rotors myself(used to work as a mechanic a lifetime ago). Upon removal i discover the caliper pin/bolts have never been greased since factory installation. Dust caps are full of exactly that, dust. So the caliper slides are completely frozen, needs new calipers as well. Then i noticed the passenger strut is toast, boot detached and leaking fluid. Asked my employee how long has the van been pulling?
He says for a while now and i told the dealership. Why didn't you tell me? Dealership does the tire rotations as well with the oil changes so how did they not notice the strut? I think they are just so understaffed that either they dont have time to fix identified problems at the time of discovery. Or they are so understaffed that inexperienced mechanics are forced to do jobs they haven't been properly trained to do.
I used to do all this myself but we are in the same boat, no time. Looks like i will be making time in the future because i cannot afford to have a van down for maintenance and then for dealing with improper maintenance. FYI, I paid one of our local shops to do struts and shocks. I just don't have the time or facilities for the struts. It seems we are understaffed in every field thanks to Joe and crew. FJB
Lasting 42k isn’t too bad for brakes on a work van. Caliper slide pins do get hot and dry out more often on work vans too, but yeah it’s likely they didn’t even clean and grease them.
For some reason in this industry the most important operation of doing oil changes, inspections, and other maintenance services are regarded very lowly and given to the lowest skilled and inexperienced “technician”…..usually right off the street with little to no training similar to a quick lube.
The opposite should be true… a car comes in for an oil change it should have skilled eyes doing a thorough inspection to recommend repair and upkeep because the customer isn’t even aware of problems until they become bad enough.
In reality “lubrication specialists” are incentivized with extra money to upsell filters and flushes so that’s all they end up caring about on top of not even knowing what they’re doing.
Thank you.
The food and hospitality industry is hurting in that same way also. It's so bad some places are forced to hire ppl with known drug habits and other issues. Or you can't fire shit workers because a shitty worker is better than no worker in many cases. It's unreal.
And now C19 stuff coming again making it all so much harder and ppl are going to quit and we're going to lose all the places that didn't close during the last lockdowns etc.
@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist I have 5 of these promaster 2500.
Typically they make it about 80k on front pads. Bought all of them new so we keep a maintenance log on all of them, that's the only reason I know this. It's crazy times for skilled trades. An over abundance of work and a lot of Americans don't want to work. Our government handed out a lot of money during covid which worsened thst issue. I wish we could get through to some of these people that college isn't the only path. You cannot learn my trade in a classroom, only the technical portions of it. But it won't make much sense without learning the application of that knowledge in the field. Skilled trades are a dying breed and one can make 6 figures easily if they are highly motivated. Best of luck out there my friend 👍
@@knuckledragger2412 brake life varies widely around here because we have a lot of hilly terrain outside of the cities.
If I can help it I’d like this channel to be a resource pool for anybody seeking knowledge and experience. I would like to give somebody the gift of learning a skilled trade to be able to better themselves. I have a lot of fun teaching any of the apprentices that are interested in learning which is rare.
worked as a bodyman almost 50 years and got so tired of dealing with idiots, so Im done
Thank you for sharing.
I went to college for automotive. I began my career and immediately became frustrated with the flat rate system. I left industry for a time and then returned as a shop owner. My guys get paid good money on straight time. And I could easily hire techs away from dealerships; however, even the dealerships are abandoning the flat rate system in order to keep technicians.
Glad to hear you’re making it work.
Thank you for commenting.
I hear you, that old adage ' The customer is always right' doesn't fly.
I've seen it time and time again, other existing faults now become new faults that we caused.
The industry is stuffed, mainly due to customers dishonesty and attitudes.
It happens. It was just a miscommunication here, it’s all been taken care of.
Thanks for the comment.
I had my BCM replaced at my Honda dealership for a 2017 Honda pilot. Paid $1.3k just to find out that wasn't the issue with my dash going crazy, lights, and car alarm going off. They wanted me to go back but they'll have to charge me for another diagnosis which is $150. I decided to trade it instead of wasting time and money. The car only had 53k miles.
I see that situation from time to time. The $150 diagnostic would have been a good investment to find out the actual problem and be done with it.
What you described is common though…. A customer may spend so much time and energy trying to get a certain vehicle fixed that they no longer enjoy the vehicle and would rather just get it out of their lives and that is ok too. Ultimately the goal is peace of mind with your transportation.
Thank you.
When I was a mechanic the same bs. Counter people making mistakes. Walked off from one shop for constantly having to fix things that was not on work order because customer said it wasn’t like that when they brought it in. Things not even related to the original job.
I have experienced similar. Thanks for sharing.
Not sure about your shop but our process for reprogramming a module always ends with checking DTCs. This is the exact reason why we don’t sign off on a WO without verifying the repair.
To be fair to you, we also would never accept “reprogram BCM” as the only information on a work order. We would also have the customer sign after verifying the correct information was on the ticket, prior to sending it back.
This seems like something a couple processes would solve very easily.
You are right there is a lot of room for improvement and some lessons to be learned here.
Normally I would do all of that… This customer was a shop owner whom I consider to be competent so I didn’t really question what he wanted… I must have gotten too comfortable with the process because I program for him from time to time and he always just says what he wants. Especially did not question it when the engine started and ran…. At that point, body functions were all working OK and my part was done.
Thanks.
Computers should not be in our vehicles it's a big scandal
Your mileage may vary.
Thanks for the comment.
I've read several comments here, what these guys forget is how many shops screwed over customers with inflated prices and recommending repairs that aren't need, not to mention the car not being ready on time. Most shops had the same level of respect as car dealerships. I dread hiring any type of contractor my experience has been most over charge and under perform. All that being said I agree many customers are as bad if not worse than the shops. I guess it's like everything else in today's world no one trusts anyone and always blames the other person for their problems.
I have worked with some fellow technicians that had very little personal accountability, and they had very little regard for the quality of work that they were out putting. Also the pay system incentivizes people to sell work that is not needed…. no personal integrity.
I am sure my colleagues agree that none of us like to work with that person in the shop… It brings the entire shop down with a damaged reputation.
The rest of us professionals take our job seriously… We advise the customer on their repair needs and do not sell unnecessary work. I’ve always been broke just like most of my customers, so I’ve already looked out for their best interests as much as I could.
Thanks for commenting.
I was getting hounded for a couple months about a lady that needed a washer fix that we sold her. I finally I had time to get to her. It happened to be her hot and cold were mixed up so I changed them on the washer started working fine. She then proceeded to tell me to change it back. Buyers remorse is a hell of a drug.
People are crazy lol.
Thanks for sharing.
I miss the days where you just needed a carb rebuild kit or something simple like that.
Now everything is so complicated you can't fix things yourself as easy.
True. It’s becoming hard to even change your own oil anymore without specialized tools.
Thanks for the comment.
The problem with the industry is you dont know who is bullshitting you and who isnt, i had my car in the shop and they try to tell me the cabin filter should be replaced, i laughed and said it’s a k&n filter it and it was just washed, so this just tells me they didnt even look at it just trying to sell you shit
That is possible yes. You have to find a shop that you trust and build a relationship with them.
Some cabin filters can be difficult to access and replace so not all shops will inspect them for free before trying to sell one....best practice is to check the service history before recommending the filter....if the customer has no idea when the last time it's been replaced, its usually way overdue....from that point on we've established service history for future recommendations without having to inspect it. It's expected to be replaced yearly or every 15,000miles - 30,000 miles.
Thanks.
Yup had done a rear brake repair on a Buick Riviera, customer came back stating has engine fumes in cabin after,,car was covered in snow at the windshield base and hood, still had check out for an exhaust leak and also the brake job for CYA,,,it happens but is so obvious when the car has winter issues. Keep the customer happy and build a trust relations,,they will be back if you are polite. If you are angry at the customer in front of other customers you made a bad situation worse so be the man and get free lunch from the service advisor and a good customer pay job from the tower to make up from the time lost instead of being a deva. ASE MASTER TECH. Thanks for making this video ! peace on earth and ocean
Yes you can usually tell the crazy customers trying to rip you off from the confused customer that doesn’t mean any real harm.
Thank you!
Hi guys yes me too I worked with engine development last 30 odd years electronics was my major, it's gotten insane how much time and equipment needed to work independently on car electronics, 57 years old
Every day is a grind ,sometimes it takes days
To work out a problem no information and schematics or coding information, it's dammed hard and no one cares ,very little money in it now what do we do??
Yes, I experience problems almost every day that are just not “in the book”.
Thank you for sharing.
@@DadsGarageDiagnosticSpecialist
Yes no worries, today I am 3 days in on a Peugeot 207 will it be pay day today? The customer is a lady
Who is sure she knows what the problem is, loose keys !!
I tried to explain can bus communication is nothing related to loose keys 😉
I worked in the forklift service industry for 21 years after 9 in the RAF and 11 in a coal mine (electrician). The best job ever ,with a company service truck that saved me commute expenses . Most of the guys were ex auto mechanics. Same story, low pay crap cars, frustrating procedures. Get into electric forklift work guys , you'll love it.
Thanks for sharing.
I wrenched for 30 years, once a lady blamed that after I changed her oil, her radio stopped working and demanded I replace it! Customers are never right!
I’ve had the same thing happen…. I turned the volume knob down when it came in the door and then turned the volume knob back up in front of her eyes. Convertible Mercedes… Nice older one.
Thanks for sharing.
Been a tech for over 40 years. Communication breakdown is almost as bad as unwarranted blame.
Truth.
Thanks for the comment.
Modern cars have too much electronic garbage on them. You don't need any of that crap. You need air, fuel, spark, and a clutch to connect to the transmission. You don't need electronics for any of it. You need a carb, spark plugs, headers... You don't need any of that other stuff. Mechanical fuel pumps were always fine until they wanted to charge you more money for electric ones. A car should be a car, not a robot. I've always changed my own oil, changed my own plugs, rebuilt my own carbs, changed my own clutch, changed my own gear oil... Kids today don't even know how to change a tire.
Sadly, you are correct… I see full grown men standing on the side of the road with their arms crossed looking like a B, having the tow truck driver put the spare tire on for them.
We have put ourselves in this situation… Consumers want all the bells and whistles while… also the emissions laws is what drives the need for computerized controls on engines.
Thanks.
I used to really enjoy doing whatever the service writer said after he diagnosed the problem. Then I would go up and tell him I did what he said, do you want me to fix it now? Pretty sure they didn't like me sometimes.
Been there. It always ends up getting twisted around on the technician.
Thanks for commenting.
I worked as a mechanic in the 80's and early 90's and this is been going on before cars went computerized. I used to get that all the time, lucky for me the shop owner didn't take no shit from anyone and he would tell them off. God I miss Sam he was the best, most honest and coolest boss.
Women were always the ones that pulled that crap.
Thank you for sharing!
After 30+ years as a GM dealership tech, I left to work on inner city transit bus's, mostly just maintenance. Hourly, no flat rate, much better pay, insurance and easier work. Retired now, but If I were still working, nothing could get me to go back working in a flat rate dealership ever again.
Thanks for sharing.
Woman's kid smokes a Lincoln SUV engine, someone pulled engine in a driveway and crushed the PCM pinout. They approched me to get it running from a pile of parts with used engine and PCM. They expected to pay $600. I would need $500 to pull it into the garage to cover fluids and filters with cushion for missing parts/ specialty hardware. They had no idea the PCM needed programmed.
I passed.
The person they took it to can't find a half shaft.
Yep I have seen that situation and the vehicle usually ends up being scrapped.
Thanks for sharing.
Been out of the technician game for 12 years. Best move I ever made. NOT worth it
Thanks for sharing.
This is endemic to techs in many different fields. People have no respect for the techs time but entitled to theirs.
Thanks for sharing.
Enjoyed watching your video.
I'm a truck driver and worked for over two years for a company that paid by the load. I know guys who are perfectly happy doing this, but I will never do it again.
We were supposed to get demurrage pay, but had to give one hour of wait time on the loading end and one hour of wait time on the unloading end....regardless of how long we waited, two, three, four hours on the front and/or on the back end, we never got demurrage pay.
So, if you hit a traffic jam, got a flat tire, there was bad weather, an accident, were delayed by the customer or the vendor you lost money...big time. The worst load I ever hauled, I got paid $56.00 for the day and that was the only load I was able to complete that day because of how long it took to complete the load: and I never got the demurrage pay.
What I want to know is how many hours each week that the higher ups and the owner of the company you work for put in for free? I already know the answer, but the point is, the owner values his time, but not the time of the people on the front line that he is using to make him money. Sadly this isn't limited to the auto industry, it has been the case for every company I have ever worked for, small or large.
Sorry for your plight. Glad you got paid for this one.
Thank you for sharing!
"You rotated my tires now my vehicle won't start." Yup, glad I'm in wildlife management these days.
I’ve heard that one lol. A lady came back accusing me of not rotating her tires because the hubcaps all still looked the same.
Thanks for commenting.