I know the settings are matched, but I wouldn't be surprised if there curves were a wee bit different here. The plugin sounds like it may be doing a bit more work. I can hear the phase shift a bit more on the plugin, while the HW sounds more relaxed. Undoubtably, analog handles this more graciously than digital most of the time. An interesting thing to do would be to analyze the curves of each in either plugin doctor or Bertrom curve analyzer; sounds to me like the plugin may not be calibrated exactly the same. Even if they were however (or if they in fast -are) I wouldn't be surprised if the analog wins. It usually does. An aside: These differences really stack up over a whole mix, and it unfortunately seems like one must have a bunch of analog hardware to benefit fully from that approach sonically. Short of that, mixbus is a great place to start with hardware - but for this reason, it has the insidious tendency to want to consume my entire budget and life lol. A room full of analog is completely unrealistic for most people, but its something to aspire to. Would love to see a shootout between a hardware/hybrid mix and a fully digital mix. I think here is where the hardware will absolutely kick ass
Thanks for watching! You are correct, analog really makes a difference across an entire mix as opposed to a single track or two. There is no benefit to buying these EQ's if that is the only hardware you have and plan to get. As I have also said many, many times on this channel, if you are just starting out with hardware start on the master bus. That is where you get the most bang for buck and the most noticeable difference
I didn't even know this plugin existed lol. I heard the exact same differences as you guys. Interesting that on a solo instrument or voice, depth isn't so much of a problem, but on drums it is. I'd guess there are more mics, more instruments in different places (the drum pieces), it builds up a spatial image and the plugins typically fail to deliver that sense of depth to it. And 1000% in agreement, EQ plugins get real close, but compressors are still way behind. Great vid as always, i'll also ask people to like and subscribe because its great content and it's the least anyone can do, just takes two clicks 😚
I’m looking forward to trying the 80b plugin, I have the HW to compare to. I’m pretty confident that I will much prefer the HW, because essentially all plugins sound the same to me. Doesn’t really matter what it’s emulating, they all sit in the same sized constrained frame. Happy to be wrong though as I was just about to buy more 80b, if this is so indistinguishable it doesn’t matter, then I’m in…it won’t be though :)
Hardware always wins. Wish you could make a six video with routing techniques and sound comparisons to the origin but I dont expect you to cop a ssl six just to do a video. Good work by the way.
Very interesting, thanks! Am obsessed with this EQ and was very keen to hear the comparison. Bear in mind that the plugin and hardware probably aren't really identical in this case though. There are posts on the forums from Alan Hyatt claiming that the 80b plugin was modelled on a console channel which is a little darker than the previous plugin modelled on the 80b rack unit. Then am I right in thinking that you used the 80b 500 series unit? I interpret your result as showing that it's pretty close and maybe as close as the difference in the modern reissue units vs the original console (though that itself is a tough one - e.g. has the console been serviced or not?). I have a Toft 80b EQ unit (the ATC 2 - same as the ATB desk EQ), and the plugin and hardware are close but not identical. I've been buying extra hardware channels, but am forced to admit that using the plugin on half the mix (which then goes into a non-Trident desk) is just as good 😀
@@MixingMusicAnalog ha- true. But Alan Hyatt runs the PMI group so he probably knows what they modelled (I doubt he's a complete liar, but he certainly speaks in marketing speak).
@@MixingMusicAnalog I found the difference in your test was much more obvious on the drum buss than on the acoustic guitar track. Interesting to note - I typically use my hardware on the drum buss, and use the plugins for other things, which I guess is consistent.
@@MixingMusicAnalog thank you so much for your reply. Short as possible: looking for a broadstroke vibe. I have the 542’s and g bus in my rack right now. Its between the maag eq2’s, 80b’s, and the audioscape epq’s in a side car (i have a few of their pieces) all very diff. 80b’s sound fun. Maags are rad. Love pultec vibes, but who knows. Any recommendations in either direction welcome. Big fan of the channel, btw. Cheers.
I didn't hear the same thing you guys did, what I'm noticing is something different, and I guess that's because I don't have the luxury of all that hardware around me. The best way I could describe it, is if you have two pure glasses of water and you drop a tea spoon of milk into one and compare. In a word, "CLARITY!" Noticable for all the examples you presented, but especially for the Vocals most strikingly, although it is subtle, I agree, but hey, I'm listening on RUclips, it must be more apparent right there in your studio. And if all those little subtleties add up, as they say, it's gonna make a big difference in the end right? I have never heard any comparisons where I couldn't hear a difference, maybe that's just me. And maybe that's just because of agonizing over the years over that 'something' that is always missing in the ITB realm where no hardware is present. So now, I'm seeking to do the opposite of the trend, and breaking into hardware, the little I can afford.
Thanks for checking out the video. We all hear things differently and that's great! If you heard somehitng different than what we hear in the video then that is completely valid. Our videos are here just to give you a point of data, in the end it does not matter what we think or like, its what YOU like.
Hey guys, just stumbled across your channel, have just subscribed. I’m a session sax player and smooth jazz artist and I wanna build my first 500 series front-end recording chain. What do you think of this for saxophone, AKG 414 B-ULS, SSL six mic pre, Trident 80b EQ, DBX560A compressor ?
The 80B 500 series is such a cheap gem. Love mine. Listening on my iPhone the difference is night and day. Hardware is way more in your face. Plugin is dull af.
@@MixingMusicAnalog The warmth and fullness on the snare in particular on the drums is what was most noticeable, but also the other things you guys mentioned like the clarity I noticed immediately before you even said it. On the acoustic guitars I couldn’t hear a difference on the phone at all. That’s as far as I got in the video. But try for yourself. I have a 14 Pro Max.
Hardware will always win, you cant beat actual electronics, they add something nice to the mix, the trident stuff is great, by the way, I have decided to tbuy the 16 channel ssl origin with a merging technologies hapi 16 channel setup in and out setup, and use ns10 monitors for monitoring recording and mastering , studio one for creating and recording tracks, which i use now anyway and pyramix by merging technologies for mastering , now you know what pyramix is, it is mainly used for recording in dsd resolution. for now i ordered a merging technologies anubis and will be using that for my setup and bye bye goes my antelope desktop interface. going absolute pro, i did a deep dive into merging products, though i already knew it was the top of top of the line, I called them and they said , that most manufacturers are having a hard time coming up with new products , because of the chip suppliers fires like kvm not being able to supply for a few years, that the technology you see now will not improve for a while because of these supply issues. even Ess is having a hard time supplying. but merging bought a truck load of chips and can manufacture for sometime and replace. the more i deep dive into merging technolgies stuff the more i want it, especially sincce neumann bought them out , but keept their staff and engineers. Here is a sample of neumanns new interface which is a rebranded anubis with just music mission and usb included. to give you an idea of what they sound like, the horus and hapi are no different. ruclips.net/video/GrxElK-HCEA/видео.html, ruclips.net/video/b9XfIrdUj_o/видео.html
@@MixingMusicAnalogthanks i am sure, i am have mixed on ssl before, but never had one for myself, i dont have enough space for a 32 channel, wish i did, but not using rack gear i have a server here with 500gb ram, and 2 i9 processors, that i built myself, yes i work in IT, and can use plugins for peocessing to no end and dont need hardware processors . I havent bought the origin yet, so i will need your services soon after i get my new interface the anubis, until i order the origin, there is a waiting list.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
I pulled the trigger on a pair of these for my 500 series rack thanks to your video, and they're absolutely killer. Thank you for the heads up.
Congrats and you're welcome :)
I know the settings are matched, but I wouldn't be surprised if there curves were a wee bit different here. The plugin sounds like it may be doing a bit more work. I can hear the phase shift a bit more on the plugin, while the HW sounds more relaxed. Undoubtably, analog handles this more graciously than digital most of the time. An interesting thing to do would be to analyze the curves of each in either plugin doctor or Bertrom curve analyzer; sounds to me like the plugin may not be calibrated exactly the same.
Even if they were however (or if they in fast -are) I wouldn't be surprised if the analog wins. It usually does.
An aside: These differences really stack up over a whole mix, and it unfortunately seems like one must have a bunch of analog hardware to benefit fully from that approach sonically. Short of that, mixbus is a great place to start with hardware - but for this reason, it has the insidious tendency to want to consume my entire budget and life lol. A room full of analog is completely unrealistic for most people, but its something to aspire to. Would love to see a shootout between a hardware/hybrid mix and a fully digital mix. I think here is where the hardware will absolutely kick ass
Thanks for watching! You are correct, analog really makes a difference across an entire mix as opposed to a single track or two. There is no benefit to buying these EQ's if that is the only hardware you have and plan to get.
As I have also said many, many times on this channel, if you are just starting out with hardware start on the master bus. That is where you get the most bang for buck and the most noticeable difference
I didn't even know this plugin existed lol.
I heard the exact same differences as you guys.
Interesting that on a solo instrument or voice, depth isn't so much of a problem, but on drums it is.
I'd guess there are more mics, more instruments in different places (the drum pieces), it builds up a spatial image and the plugins typically fail to deliver that sense of depth to it.
And 1000% in agreement, EQ plugins get real close, but compressors are still way behind.
Great vid as always,
i'll also ask people to like and subscribe because its great content and it's the least anyone can do, just takes two clicks 😚
Well, thank you very, very much my friend! I am glad you are enjoying the channel
Thanks!
Thank you very much!
I’m looking forward to trying the 80b plugin, I have the HW to compare to. I’m pretty confident that I will much prefer the HW, because essentially all plugins sound the same to me. Doesn’t really matter what it’s emulating, they all sit in the same sized constrained frame. Happy to be wrong though as I was just about to buy more 80b, if this is so indistinguishable it doesn’t matter, then I’m in…it won’t be though :)
You can demo the plugin, so check it out and see how you like it!
Hardware always wins. Wish you could make a six video with routing techniques and sound comparisons to the origin but I dont expect you to cop a ssl six just to do a video. Good work by the way.
I tired to get a BIG Six and SSL said NO! They don't like me for some reason....LOL
@@MixingMusicAnalog After you bought an Origin??? Thats wild!
The analog obsession TREQ plugin is an awesome trident plugin
Cool! Never tried it
@@MixingMusicAnalog would love to see a comparison
Thanks Dave!!!
You got it!
Very interesting, thanks! Am obsessed with this EQ and was very keen to hear the comparison. Bear in mind that the plugin and hardware probably aren't really identical in this case though. There are posts on the forums from Alan Hyatt claiming that the 80b plugin was modelled on a console channel which is a little darker than the previous plugin modelled on the 80b rack unit. Then am I right in thinking that you used the 80b 500 series unit? I interpret your result as showing that it's pretty close and maybe as close as the difference in the modern reissue units vs the original console (though that itself is a tough one - e.g. has the console been serviced or not?). I have a Toft 80b EQ unit (the ATC 2 - same as the ATB desk EQ), and the plugin and hardware are close but not identical. I've been buying extra hardware channels, but am forced to admit that using the plugin on half the mix (which then goes into a non-Trident desk) is just as good 😀
Thanks for the info.....btw, stop believing what you read on forums. 95% of the time they are inaccurate info. lol
@@MixingMusicAnalog ha- true. But Alan Hyatt runs the PMI group so he probably knows what they modelled (I doubt he's a complete liar, but he certainly speaks in marketing speak).
@@MixingMusicAnalog I found the difference in your test was much more obvious on the drum buss than on the acoustic guitar track. Interesting to note - I typically use my hardware on the drum buss, and use the plugins for other things, which I guess is consistent.
so we only pay x10 for lil bit depht?
No, you don't need to pay anything. If you don't feel it's worth the upgrade to hardware then stick with the plugin. It's that simple. :)
Question for folks here: Would these sound good on the master bus?
Sure they would, try it
@@MixingMusicAnalog thank you so much for your reply. Short as possible: looking for a broadstroke vibe. I have the 542’s and g bus in my rack right now. Its between the maag eq2’s, 80b’s, and the audioscape epq’s in a side car (i have a few of their pieces) all very diff. 80b’s sound fun. Maags are rad. Love pultec vibes, but who knows.
Any recommendations in either direction welcome. Big fan of the channel, btw. Cheers.
Dave, try a Trident A Range format 500 please. Its magic...
I dont have access to one, sorry
I didn't hear the same thing you guys did, what I'm noticing is something different, and I guess that's because I don't have the luxury of all that hardware around me. The best way I could describe it, is if you have two pure glasses of water and you drop a tea spoon of milk into one and compare. In a word, "CLARITY!" Noticable for all the examples you presented, but especially for the Vocals most strikingly, although it is subtle, I agree, but hey, I'm listening on RUclips, it must be more apparent right there in your studio. And if all those little subtleties add up, as they say, it's gonna make a big difference in the end right? I have never heard any comparisons where I couldn't hear a difference, maybe that's just me. And maybe that's just because of agonizing over the years over that 'something' that is always missing in the ITB realm where no hardware is present. So now, I'm seeking to do the opposite of the trend, and breaking into hardware, the little I can afford.
Thanks for checking out the video. We all hear things differently and that's great! If you heard somehitng different than what we hear in the video then that is completely valid. Our videos are here just to give you a point of data, in the end it does not matter what we think or like, its what YOU like.
Hey guys, just stumbled across your channel, have just subscribed. I’m a session sax player and smooth jazz artist and I wanna build my first 500 series front-end recording chain. What do you think of this for saxophone, AKG 414 B-ULS, SSL six mic pre, Trident 80b EQ, DBX560A compressor ?
Welcome to the channel. Those are all great pieces of gear.
@@MixingMusicAnalog thank you! Would you describe the trident EQ as being more Neve or API-like?
not pretty close I can hear the difference like night and day
Cool, thanks!
Hi lads!
Big fan
I subscribe -Frenchie Smith
The Bubble, Austin TX
Thanks for being here and supporting the channel!
The 80B 500 series is such a cheap gem. Love mine. Listening on my iPhone the difference is night and day. Hardware is way more in your face. Plugin is dull af.
I find it interesting that anyone could hear the subtle differences on a phone. These two are pretty darn close in sound.
@@MixingMusicAnalog The warmth and fullness on the snare in particular on the drums is what was most noticeable, but also the other things you guys mentioned like the clarity I noticed immediately before you even said it. On the acoustic guitars I couldn’t hear a difference on the phone at all. That’s as far as I got in the video. But try for yourself. I have a 14 Pro Max.
Plug in is good but yah the hardware got a little bit more sizzle me thnks.
Fair enough!
COOL !!!! Hardware - BEST !!!
Thanks for watching!
Fine Fine, I subscribed now, ha
Well, its about time! LOL. Thanks for the sub. it really does help
Winner winner chicken dinner! Hardware all the way!!!!
Thank you for watching!
Didn’t like the plug-in as much. I scored a module when they were first released for like, $250. Can’t complain.
NICE!
Everytime hardware wins
Thus far that has been the case with every shoot we have done. Maybe one day I'll find a plugin that beats the hardware
Hardware will always win, you cant beat actual electronics, they add something nice to the mix, the trident stuff is great, by the way, I have decided to tbuy the 16 channel ssl origin with a merging technologies hapi 16 channel setup in and out setup, and use ns10 monitors for monitoring recording and mastering , studio one for creating and recording tracks, which i use now anyway and pyramix by merging technologies for mastering , now you know what pyramix is, it is mainly used for recording in dsd resolution. for now i ordered a merging technologies anubis and will be using that for my setup and bye bye goes my antelope desktop interface. going absolute pro, i did a deep dive into merging products, though i already knew it was the top of top of the line, I called them and they said , that most manufacturers are having a hard time coming up with new products , because of the chip suppliers fires like kvm not being able to supply for a few years, that the technology you see now will not improve for a while because of these supply issues. even Ess is having a hard time supplying. but merging bought a truck load of chips and can manufacture for sometime and replace. the more i deep dive into merging technolgies stuff the more i want it, especially sincce neumann bought them out , but keept their staff and engineers. Here is a sample of neumanns new interface which is a rebranded anubis with just music mission and usb included. to give you an idea of what they sound like, the horus and hapi are no different. ruclips.net/video/GrxElK-HCEA/видео.html, ruclips.net/video/b9XfIrdUj_o/видео.html
Congrats on the Origin 16. I am sure you will love it!
@@MixingMusicAnalogthanks i am sure, i am have mixed on ssl before, but never had one for myself, i dont have enough space for a 32 channel, wish i did, but not using rack gear i have a server here with 500gb ram, and 2 i9 processors, that i built myself, yes i work in IT, and can use plugins for peocessing to no end and dont need hardware processors . I havent bought the origin yet, so i will need your services soon after i get my new interface the anubis, until i order the origin, there is a waiting list.