Federal HST (or Gold Dot) is a Waste of Money? 9mm Federal HST VS 9mm Fiocchi Defense Dynamics
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 12 янв 2023
- I get the same comment a lot, that ALL 9mm ammo performs well, so buying Federal HST or Speer Gold Dot is a waste of money. I put that to the test by comparing Federal HST 124 gr 9mm against Fiocchi 124 gr 9mm. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.com/user?u=5828221
Спорт
Gold dot is one of those legend projectiles that you know you can always rely on. Theres been millions of rounds of it fired with almost zero failures that ive ever seen or heard of. Gold dot is a proven performer.
CCI primers are what's in them, and we know how good their ignition stuff is with the CCI rimfire ammo.
When I was working the gun counter, I asked LE what their duty round was, it was always Gold Dot or HST
PD's buy their ammo in bulk. Sometimes they get ammo in a deal when the dept buys guns for the entire force. Officers do not buy their own.@@timmartin6410
In how many actual shootings?
Aberdeen Proving Ground Ballistics Division engineers have stated that a minimum sample should be 20. Lucky Gunner Terminal ballistics testing is 5 per each round tested. That is a lot of ballistic gelatin, but it does provide a more representative sample.
Ehhhh, gold dot and hst are proven performers. Over priced, of course! Worth it, also yes.
I have found both real cheap though, even now you can get the Gold Dot LE for like $40 for 50 rounds depending on where you shop.
@@GunSam I recently purchased Gold Dot 9mm 124 grain +P for $35.00 online and Federal HST .40 180 grain for $26.67 a box on the same website.
When you only send the best for self defense. How much is your life worth?
@@SmokeandBurn1this is exactly my rationale
@@GunSam which gold dot would you prefer in a shield plus? I've always carried gold dot but never really thought about the different versions. I usually get the old school 9mm Speer gold dot.
I’m impressed by Fiocchi here. Held it’s own against HST which is what I consider the most consistent carry round. 👍🇺🇸
Yeah me too wasn't expecting it to do that good
The Fiocchi uses Hornady XTP projectiles which are a very proven and consistent JHP design. It's not a huge shocker. Conduct this test with the factory JHP's from Winchester or Remington and you will see the flaw with a lot of the "It's just as good" crowd.
@@Predalien195 Not all Fiocchi loaded hollow points are XTP's. As a matter of fact these don't really look like XTP's, but you will need the manufacturers number to be sure.
They seem to have rolled the XTP's into a Premium line called Hyperformance defense now, as opposed to the defense dynamic line.
@@Predalien195 The defense dynamics aren’t XTPs. Fiocchi makes them.
@@robertlemaster7525 You are correct the defense dynamics aren’t XTPs. They use XTPs in some of their ammo.
At the risk of raising my prices. I've carried the Fiocchi defense dynamics for almost 3 years. It does what is needed.
I’m an old guy so I can remember ammo form the 1970’s. The performance gap you are seeing is really amazing!
My FOP range was a testing ground for our PD in the 1980’s and “duty” ammo would not reliably expand fired down into 55gal drums of water!
Now it’s possible to get reliable bullets in budget ammo. That’s a win for everyone!
I carried the hst consistently for 5-6 years. My lgs always had them $30 per 50 box of 124gr. Eventually, they went up to $35, then quickly upt to $45. Now, I can't find them for less than $30-35 for a 20 box. On my last mag rotation, I decided to go with the Sig 124gr. At $25 a 50 box, I felt like it was 2017 again. Not the bullet I want, but fairly comparable from what I've seen and far better on the pocketbook.
Do you practice with the HST? Federal HST is my number one choice in all the calibers that I carry. I'm finding it online consistently at $26 to $35 dollars a box depending on the caliber. I recently purchased four boxes of the .40 180 grain at $26.67 a box. This stuff is too valuable to wasting at the range. I recently shot some Remington Golden Sabre non-bonded that I had in my inventory.
@@Gsmooth10455
Sounds like a classic Hirtenberger Buscadera Ticonda issue.
@@onpsxmember HAHA "I don't wanna shoot my Ticondas."
@@onpsxmember I don't want to shoot my Hirtenbergers either. 🤣😂😄
The Winchester White Box JHP's are the cheapest rounds I've found that work.. these fiocchi's in the video seem to work really good too.. I usually carry the HST's and Gold dots in 124 +p but those 2 are the cheapest I've found for like 50 cents a round.. if you can find those Sig elite performance for 50 cents a round I would go with those
You made up my mind. Ill take 3,000 rounds of the cheap stuff over 1,000 of HST . great video thumbs up!
FMJ is fine also, killed millions of people in WW1,WW2,Korea,and Vietnam
@@sosuapimp8449 fmj is all i shoot. I have never shot at a person thankfully. I handload fmj for 12 cents a round up here in canada.
When it's this hard to tell the difference, for 1/3rd the price, Fiocchi did very well.
One of the most systematic approaches to reviews I've seen! Good quantitative data mixed with objective qualitative impressions/ discussion all presented in a very clear format.
About to go search your channel for hst vs critical defense, but if you haven't done it that would be an awesome one.
Definitely earned a subscription, keep it up!
HST and Gold Dot always perform excellent on bare gel/t-shirt, and decent to good through the denim in my testing depending on caliber, pressure rating, and barrel length. Can't say the same for some "cheaper" hollow points I have tested. Also the sealed primer and bullet are a good point, especially for something that is going to be living in your sweaty waistband...
I think for was it is being a budget friendly hollow point it definitely didn't do bad. The HST is probably more consistent if you were to test it multiple times over and I feel across multiple barrel length (3-4-5 inch's ) would perform better .
The biggest advantage the fiocchi has is it's price for getting over half a box more of ammo is a big one , I guess it all depends on your outlook , budget and other things
Do you wanna practice more with decent to good ammo or practice less with great amazing ammo if your wallets allows.
Personally I switch out my hollow points twice a year so running the HSTs aren't a huge deal for me and the peace of mind is worth the price .
Here are a couple things, 1st I've carried Speer Got Dot professional for years and haven't seen it fail yet. But it's like Ford and Chevy people are going to like what they like, 2nd Gun Sam, your test is your test. I've watched tons of ballistic test vids. Everyone has a different take on real-world tests. your tube is full of vids people can watch, so don't apologize or defend your test. 51.3k subscribers must enjoy your vids like I do so, carry on.
Thanks! I have heard other people in LE say that the Gold Dot 124+P expands reliably more often than HST 124+P in non barrier shootings. I have no way of confirming this, but my gut says it's probably true. Not having an actual jacket but rather a thick plating would be easier to expand. I would guess that HST is a bit better for true hard barrier penetration.
Would you guys say that perhaps Rem Golden Saber is a notch down from the likes of Gold Dot and HST?
I concur , however my department issues and or supplies HST 124gr both are great great rounds 🇺🇸
@Gun Sam _Revolver Aficionado_ Both are great , i however give the Nod to the HST i like the 124, 147gr 🇺🇸
Your testing being valid is a given, in that you consistently test with the same materials and procedure. Your videos are well done and informative.
Don’t change a thing….
Nice long distance shootin’ Tex !
Thanks for sharing and regards from new Washington.
Dude thank you sooo much for this test. I've been wondering about this exact comparison for a while now👍👍👍
Considering the price difference the less expensive ammunition did very well, those wound tracks looked very similar as was the penetration. Definitely good ammo for the money 👍
Well the Fiocchi uses Hornady XTP projectiles. It's a very proven and consistent JHP design no question. However, the XTP in the same battery of tests compared to HST following IWBA protocol as well as hard barrier performance is not as good. Good enough for most people but overall still not as consistent as the HST. It certainly is good ammo for the money and one of the main reasons I buy their ammo for quite a few guns.
Absolutely.
@@Predalien195 Fiocchi Defense Dynamics does not use the XTP bullet. Fiocchi Hyperformance line uses the XTP bullet for 9mm. Just FYI.
@@Predalien195those certainly are NOT xtp bullets. XTPs are conical rounds, i have some.
I love your no nonsense testing. I like “Everyman” type tests like this
Excellent shooting at that distance. Just subbed
Great testing!!
Great test and comparison Sam! My, my that Fiocchi does perform!
You mentioned that the higher end defensive loads have sealer factory-applied to the primer pockets and case mouths. This fact should not be underestimated. Over my many years of carry, I have inadvertently sent loaded speed strips and magazines (Speer Gold Dots, Remington Golder Saber and Federal HSTs) through the clothes washer and dryer in my pants pocket. It happens once or twice a year, no matter how hard I try to empty my pockets before my pants go in the wash... I always make it a point to shoot up the bullets in that washed speed strip, or shoot out that magazine within a week or so. If nothing else, it's my way of renewing my carry ammo periodically. Living in a hot summer climate, I also sometimes get a lot of green crud growing around the primers of my carry loads, just from constant contact with sweaty skin. This happens more so with revolvers for sure.
Whether it be from sweat or from running through a washer/dryer cycle, I've never had a Good Dot, Golden Saber or HST that didn't fire off as expected. That means something to me. Not sure I could trust the Fiocchi to keep the moisture out long-term.
If carrying the Fiocchi or something similar, I would renew it not less than twice a year of daily carry. I would also watch for bullet creep, especially in a semiauto!
Another great comparison test! Excellent shooting at 75 yards, very impressive, thanks for the video Sam!
Thanks!
The Fiocchi did well. Sometimes the cheap stuff works well (WWB .40 180 grain, Remington HTP 125 grain .38/.357) and that's a good thing. I don't trust a load until I see it go through the MDF or meat target test. I've seen too many cheap rounds fail. I think the point of this is if you are going to bet your life on a round, might as well spend the money.
Thanks for a great video demonstration on the Fiocchi Ammo.
Good test and it doesn't really surprise me. Paul Harrell shows us all of the time that premium ammunition is generally better performing but only slightly. He usually uses 115gr Winchester white box and Remington green box JHPs to demonstrate that.
Thank you for an informative, well presented video with a good dose of common sense. Keep up the good work.
I think it’s perfect with ur MDF and that’s why we watch ur channel,cause of the Truth n Testing of calibers and thanks again for getting the S&W 389 EZ can’t wait to c more of them on it.!.!.!.
I think your mdf test is valid in that it at least shows a round through a different media. The only determining factor in sd ammo is penetration. It enters, decelerates and stops inside the target. A one shot stop is dependent on it. Expansion looks neat but that's the brakes on the projectile. In my view both rounds were nearly identical with nearly ideal penetration to stop a threat without killing the rest of the neighborhood. Great video!
Definitely an informative test. I really like that you use the fiber board in addition to the denim. To my knowledge, nobody else does that and I feel that it gives more of a realistic depiction of bullet performance.
Great test! I try to keep a healthy ammo stockpile. I have some of the Fiocchi 124 gr. If I’m going to pay high prices I’m going with Underwood extreme defender 🤠
Appreciate the comparison Brother, be safe and take care
Throwing so many rounds down range like you do really shows the value.
Another gr8 video and I’ve learned so much from u n can c you learning so new stuff at times 2!!! TY GunSam!!!
Did you c Paul H gave ya a shout out!!!!! That’s telling ya all u need to know on the job ur doin on videos .!.!.
Excellent tests.
Thank you !
Good info on the bullet puller. The semi auto ammo is meant to make one trip up the ramp.
Some of the cheaper ammo is made with the XTP bullet. I think this is a safe bet especially in +P.
Thanks for making this great video.
I'm a police officer down in Houston, and I carry the 124 plus p in the gold dots as a duty round. I love the HST as well though. Your videos are awesome! And they help guys like me figure out what we want to trust in our duty guns. Keep up the awesome work!
I will pray for you, Houston has turned into a little Chicago in the last 10 years and it isn't going to improve , it will just get worse , after living a hour South of Houston down Hwy.288 for the last 64 years it's a no go for me , I stop at Pearland / Beltway 8 !
I like the sig v crown bullets. You can buy them as components to reload too. God dots are great in 5.56 to reload too.
Great video. If you buy the 50rd packs of HST/Speer they are around $30-$40, and not a lot more expensive to the cheaper JHP. The 20rd boxes is where they really pump up the price. Though the bonding and sealing does help in many scenarios. The challenge with cheaper JHP is inconsistent performance with clothing and other barriers.
Those rounds haven’t been found at those prices for two years.
@@gsb5w291 If you keep an eye out for the LE boxes you can still get it. Just got some 45 ACP +P HST 230gr for $37 a 50rd box. The 9mm HST will be available soon. Prices are coming down.
@@abengelbrecht are you using ammoseek for best price online or go to your LGS?
@@gsb5w291 I usually just order from TargetSportsUSA using my prime membership - LGS typically do not carry the 50rd boxes of HST/Speer, etc
@@gsb5w291 Agree
Thanks for making these videos . We appreciate the effort it must take with your arthritis and fatigue.
Enjoy your video's and the time you take putting them together.
Very good video. You have probably learned this by now but here goes. If you need to pull a bullet that has all sealant or been loaded for years. Your flare die to just bump the bullet down just so it breaks the sealant. Then whack as normal
If you want to reload that bullet and want sealant again clear finger nail polish works and a bunch cheaper.
Thanks for the work and the time you put in it
Take care
I found some Fiocchi here at a local Atwood’s for 24.99$ picked up two boxes! I’ll carry it! Great video sir👍🏼🤠
Thank you. Appreciate the honest assessment.
Fine shooting Sam really liked the vid both seemed pretty close.
Sam you are correct about the real world scenario
As for example take a look at your coat--- I would not count on any hollow point opening through that coat and maybe not 90% of others .
That 148 grain wad cutter keeps on shining
Appreciate this video the difference is negligible i picked up these fiocchi today to practice with and they are laser accurate in my M&P so going to switch to them for good
Very interesting I wouldn’t mind seeing more of this kind of testing.
Very informative video. And you're a damn good shot👍
Thanks
Thanks for sharing your great informative video.
I sure don’t want you to shot at me at 75 yards that’s some awesome shooting . America needs more people pack n like you and me . Keep up the awesome work
Thank you SO MUCH for this video! I picked up some Defense Dynamics a while back, and have been wondering how it performed. Normally, I'm an HST guy myself, but this video made me feel better about the F-DD.
Any chance you could compare 45/230 Standard Defense Dynamics against 45/230 Standard HST? Would love to see that one also! Thanks! Great video!
Oh yeah...
This was a great video. Learned a lot.
I agree about the sealant and in particular the Nickel-plated brass is a must for me because I love smooth feeding, in fact it might be a bit obsessive but I "polish" my personal carry rounds to a perfect smoothed uniform shine and texture to ensure feed reliability. The little extra steps are worth your Life in my view.
Thought I was the only one who polishes his carry rounds. Lol.
@@dannyb9140OCD
I always appreciate your videos, the work you put in, and the solid info you provide. I'm a subscriber and happy to be one!
But man, I always cringe when I see guntube testers use a beautiful sharp knife point to dig bullets out of anything but gel. Ouch! 😖 Surely a cheap awl or screwdriver would do the trick.
Have only used Fiocchi as practice ammo. They have some good loads, with sometimes offball bullet weights (like a 142 gr LRN in 38 Spl). I can vouch for the 170 gr 40. It is truncated, almost a flat nose. Years ago ny former agency sent 2 guys to SWAT school. They were having problems with their Glop 22's. They blamed the ammo (shortly after this, the info about the Glop mag problems came to light). So the sgt gave me most of a case to get rid of it. My XD40 especially loved it, and my P229 shot it well also. That was when i really started to like the XD, had had it for a year or so and was breaking it in. I liked it so much it became my upstairs housegun, with a very compact Streamlight light which was exactly contoured to the gun, and a Pachmayr Grip Glove. Only reason I didn't make it my duty gun was i am a dyed in the wool Sig guy, i was well experienced with the 229, and I didn't feel like buying another holster and trying to find one which would accommodate the light. When i move to a free state i will get an XDM in 10mm😁
I have Buffalo Bore, Underwood and Hornady Critical Defense stacked on the shelf because I prefer to keep my 357 Mags loaded with the much cheaper Remington UMC semi jacketed hollow point rounds. I recall you saying it was a round that modern ammo still couldn't beat. From everything I have seen I agree completely. That said, I do agree with your very points concerning why you would still prefer the HST here. If the new stuff came in a semi jacketed hollow point round I might load with something different. I wish Buffalo Bore or someone make something like that.
Thanks for the hard work Sam, much appreciated. The top tier ammo gives advantages but not massive advantages. However every little advantage is more than worth it when your life is at steak.
stake
The big question is the $1.00 difference per round justifies the difference. I think it's negligible.
Yeah Sam did a GREAT job of selling a bunch of ammo for Fiocchi, even though his conclusion was that the HST was worth the Premium.
Another good video. Interesting comparison. Thanks for sharing. Do you think shooting thru water jugs to check for expansion is a valid test or just a waste of time and water? Take care.
That doesn't surprise me. A lot of times the more expensive/better ammo isn't much better, if at all. Good video.
Great testing as always Gun Sam! Maybe do a cheap hollowpoint comparison like Win White Box and Rem UMC sometime? A while back Tools and Targets tested cheap Winchester WB and Remington UMC against each other in 9mm 115gr. in gel and chronoed them. He also tested 9mm Remington UMC alone in another video. In each it performed very well for an inexpensive HP ammo. Winchester WB did as well. I would love to see if your testing results would be similar to his for UMC and Win WB. I know you can buy Rem UMC in HP and in FMJs and many say they hit the same point of impact in their pistol. I haven't tested this myself but hope to sometime. Its good to know we have options for the frugal tight arse and the poor working man shooters. I keep both as well as my high $ nickel plated sealed big brand name ammo. But I shoot a lot more Rem UMC than anything in 9mm. I do like Atomic Ammunition and their nickel plated hollowpoint ammo in 380, they only offer +P and 147gr subsonic in 9mm tho.
That was some excellent shooting. What I will give to the HST is that with the sealant, it's going to resist sweat and stuff much better for people who just load up and never shoot it. The Fiocchi brand is not bad. I use it for practice ammo in 357 Magnum. The 142gr certainly lets you know you've launched something.
Thanks! I shot the 142 gr from a snub no ear protection before.
@@GunSam I'll bet you regretted that instantly. I once shot an old school 158gr LSWC UMC yellow box from my 6" Taurus and my hearing was instantly muffled for a while. The Fiocchi 142gr FMJ is loaded hotter than that.
@@Fudmottin I miss that Yellow box LSWC load. Shot a ton of that back in the early 90's
Right off the Fiocchi website "about us" page:
"Fiocchi was founded in 1876 in Lecco Italy and has been producing high quality ammunition ever since. In the 1950s, Fiocchi began importing ammunition into the United States and by the 1980s demand had grown and the decision was made to build a manufacturing facility in the US to help service the US market.
"In 1983 a site in Ozark, Missouri was chosen, right in the heart of America, and a facility was built on a former dairy farm. Since then we have continued to grow and expand, currently employing nearly 200 hardworking Americans to produce some of the highest quality shotshell and centerfire ammunition available. While the company still has roots in Italy and receive a portion of our products from our facility in Lecco, around 80% of Fiocchi brand products that are sold in the US market are loaded right here in Ozark or in our new facility near Little Rock, Arkansas.
"While we continue to grow, we remain true to both our Italian and American heritage and lineage and will continue to focus on quality craftsmanship, innovation, and unequaled customer service for many years to come."
-----------------------
Fiocchi also sponsors and provides ammo for Jerry Miculek's three-gun competition.
@@jimbienkowski7857 Me too. Cheap blasting ammo. Although cleaning the lead out of the bore was no fun.
I'm a fan of the 124 gr HST and that's what's in any of my 9x19s that aren't loaded with Federal 9 BPLE (old habits die hard, LOL). My Walther P99, for instance, has had a steady diet of HST and likes it.
In this test the Federal seemed to be a tiny bit more consistent with Fiocchi. The only surprise for me was that the Fiocchi was that consistent. I'm not knocking the brand, I use it in several guns (especially .25, .32, and such) and I find it to be good ammo, just maybe not quite up to Federal's quality. Of course it's significantly cheaper (usually) so you get lower cost with only slightly lower quality. I think I might consider Fiocchi as spare ammo -- something to stock up on when it's a lot cheaper than what's available or if HSTs aren't in stock.
Great shooting, BTW. The accidental double-tap was quite impressive with the center hit followed by the head shot. LOL ... I'll be most of your critics can't pull that off. :)
I believe that the ndf test is valid. Keep up the great videos.
always enjoy your videos! Yes, I am a HST guy!!
Much tighter group with the HST at 75 yards, however, I was impressed with the Fiocchi's performance. You're a fine shot, not many guys can hit at 75 yards as well as you did.
When someone says something like "I buy the cheapest ammo I can find", you already know they don't know what in the hell they're talking about. There is alot of science and testing that goes in to defense ammunition. The budget stuff goes bang and will get the job done, but keep in mind, your life is depending on the ammo. Spend the extra couple bucks
The duty ammo for my former PD is Federal Premium LE 147 grain HST for the issued weapon, the Glock 19.
Very impressed with your shooting at 75 yards! Nice!!
At a time when people are carrying 10 or 12 rounds of 9mm plus an extra mag of 10-12 rounds, it becomes expensive to test, practice with, and carry these premium hollow points. I love Winchester white box stuff because I can buy enough to test and carry for like $30, and it's probably enough to get the job done. Thanks for the test!!!
Same here
Don’t know if you get recent comment, Sam, but this is a reminder to me of how much you struggled with your health a year ago. So glad you were better now.
Keep up the great work !
Voice text… Please ignore grammar
Glad you pointed out the primer sealer. A lot of people know nothing about that. Federal and speer (owned by Federal) make great quality, reliable ammo. For depending on for you life, I'll spend the money. Practice with cheap stuff.
Thanks for the comparison of the two. What I got from this is that, cheaper doesn't mean bad. If I can get more rounds without losing performacne, I'm going with cheaper rounds. That's my 2 cents.
thanks for doing these tests, very impressed with Fiocchi, never carried but for 55 cents a round ill definitely stock up!
Hell yeah! That Non-XTP Fiocchi went toe to toe with the HST!!!
Nice shooting, strangler… I mean stranger. You put a bunch of those on target from a distance. Thanks for this video.
Another great video. Sam just curious, how accurate is the time sync between the 2 cameras? It seems consistent across your videos based on bullet velocity but I imagine it’d be hard to accurately synchronize the videos exactly
It's all done in editing. Basically I put the primary and secondary camera footage in the editor and I use my voice as a means to line it all up. Like "first lets try the 9mm" or whatever my first words are, I line them up manually until it sounds like one audio sound with zero echo then I mute the secondary camera's audio. After that, they are lined up. The only time I use the secondary camera's audio is when I show the gel block and talk about the penetration etc. Every other sound in my videos are from the primary camera mic including the sound of the steel.
I just picked up the M&P 2.0 10mm with the 4.6" barrel and tried the Nosler ASP 180 gr hollow point. It penetrated to the 4th jug but left the jacket and several lead fragments in the 3rd jug and more led in the 2nd jug. I'll be on the lookout for something with better structural integrity.
Surprised the Fiocchi did so well. They do make some decent range ammo, but some of their other stuff, particularly revolver ammo, seems pretty weak and occasionally has accuracy issues. But these rounds seem like a valid choice. Doesn't quite match the HST's, but not much does.
Yeah, they have some okay revolver ammo with the SJHP nose, I think 148 gr that is decent. But their regular JHP is a bit disappointing.
Rocky Mountain Reloading sells a 9mm general purpose hollow point at a very reasonable price, I use them at the range and have found them to feed well and be accurate. Is there any chance of testing these bullets for your viewers that reload. Comments and pictures in reviews show them performing and expanding well. Im not saying that I would use them in my carry gun, just curious.
in my simple water jug tests Winchester white box (wwb) hollow point ammo seemed to work just as well as the expensive brands.
If you get attacked by water jugs , I think you are just fine.
Lol, "just as good" yeah, sure it is. I'm a big fan of +p gold dots even though I haven't seen any for sale anywhere for years. I appreciate your work Sam Thank you.
For anyone who believes cheap hollow points are are just as good or better than HST projectiles I encourage you to spend just a few minutes reviewing testing done with comparisons to both. Ths HST will come out on top every single time in testing that replicates real world situations. Cheap hollow points are just that, cheap, and will under perform 9 times out of 10. The biggest obstacle that hollow point projectiles will ever encounter is clogging. It has plagued projectile engineers for decades. Federal is one of only a few companies that have been able to reduce the obstacle of clogging to the point it is barely an issue at all. A heavy clothing barrier test with calibrated gel will cause induce failure in almost every cheap round on the market. People (for the most part) dont run around unclothed so that is a huge factor that needs to be considered when saying cheap hollows are ok to trust you life with.
I have been carrrying Gold Dots for years. One of the best rounds out there IMO.
“Somehow I still hit it”
Nice shootin Tex
DANG... I wish us reloaders could by these HPs. Hornady and Speer are the only ones I found so far that sell the bullets. Both brands work awesome if loaded with the right powder.
In 9mm I try try to stay with Gold Dot, HST, or Critical Duty, all preferably 124 grain +P. I don’t have any issues with 147, Rangers, or Golden Saber, just personal preference and experience. I was provided with some imported brand 124 grain HP a while back. I wasn’t sure how it would perform and the only thing I could find was a RUclips video in 2017 showing how it zipped through a couple gel blocks and maybe a water jug and the bullet was not recovered. Not using that stuff for anything more than training. Do you have to use premium ammo? Probably not. Should you do some due diligence - at least see how others have fared testing the more generic stuff? Yes. And remember there are things like Federal 9BP or Remington or Winchester HPs that are not cutting edge technology anymore but are still respectable quality and aren’t as expensive as the premium stuff. And of course shot placement always makes the difference if a steel plate rings and shudders or doesn’t.
Hey Sam, any chance you'll be testing the Dirty 30 any time soon?
So it turns out that Fiocchi was no Jokey! :)
Fiocchi is fine starter defensive ammo.
HST is great premium defensive ammo.
The great thing is with these two specifically, in all practical ways it all shot the same. Having a $30 box of target hollow points in the same power range and accuracy as your carry ammo (HST) is better than the $20 box of FMJ that is 100 FPS slower than the HST and can never really simulate the good ammo you carry.
Hey sam I was wondering if I could email you directly about an idea I have about a slight modification that I have made to some regular 115gr FMJ 9mm ammo that might cause it to tumble on impact which would cause a lot of damage, I just don't have the ability to test it out like you do, I could send you pics and probably even a video of how easy the modification is and could even maybe send you some modified ammo for testing and evaluation..........?
Can you elaborate more on hitting ammo with a hammer 100 times to get it out? I'm just curious please and thank you
FEDERAL HST ALL DAY EVERY DAY only buy 50 rd boxes of hst cheaper by round and you bet more for 50 boxes less lately good video btw 4inch is my edc g48mos
I have Fiocchi loaded in most of my 9mm pistols but the versions with the XTP bullets. I like the XTP bullets for penetration and accuracy but they have more moderate expansion compared to the HSTs and the proprietary JHP Fiocchi Dynamics you fired. Out of a carbine, the XTP's expansion benefits from the increased velocity. However, as self defense ammo, I like the Fiocchi Dynamics line but you can never go wrong with HST's or Gold Dots.
I always like to see ballistic comparisons. In the end, what is your life worth? HST for me. Very consistent over my firearms and conditions.
I recently purchased standard pressure 124 grain HST for $.85 a round.
Sam...that is some fine, fine shooting at 75 yards. HST is super accurate in your Smith.
This Fiocchi load is impressive.
Thanks. This particular M&P is pretty accurate with everything. What it is, is partially the trigger as it's hinged. With my revolver power crease style, the blade safeties always throw me off, the M&P hinged trigger allows me to shot however I feel like it with no problems.
Practice with the Fiocchi, but carry the HST in your defense pistols.
I've always been a fan of the HST's, but I think you just sold a lot of Fiocchi ammo with that test. Held its own pretty well I'd say.
Is the knife you used a Cold Steel Outdoorsman Lite? I've considered getting one of those many times. How do you like it?
Yeah. It's an okay knife for odd jobs, but it's never really very sharp and doesn't seem to hold an edge. Good for basically what I do with it, split 2x4's if need be.
@@GunSam cool. Thx for the reply. I watch almost all your vids👍👊
great video 👍
75yd shots impressive. 👌Availability leaves me with Hornady FTX. It seems to provide the most consistent expansion across calibers. But White Box Green Box and Blue box are mighty appealing…,
I typically use HST, Hydroshock and Gold Dot in that order in 9mm for the Family. For myself I started using Underwood +p+ 147 though.
I just tested HST and Gold Dot 9mm 124 GR.plus P.
I have only windage adj.
The HST we're high on target.and tight .The gold dots were right on with a little RS adj.
On the way back from the range I hit a running coyote at 20 yds and he rolled down. Either one is a great round.Bibdwd is good .I couldn't find any other bonded ammo brands to try.
But I've made my choice .
Gold Dot it is and easier for me to find and a little cheaper in the 50 count.
1220 fps and 410 fpe has to count for something.
If I remember your F ammo is XTP. THEY
are going bullets used them for 20 years.
I am a huge fan of the fiocchi defense rounds, however I do house the 147 gr, out of a 10.5 carbine. In my personal testing that has given the best home defense result.
In hand guns I use both gold dot, and hst, depending on the gun and which they shoot better. Used both in Law Enforcement and have had the desired result.